Debates - Thursday, 5th March, 2015

Printer Friendly and PDF

DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE FOURTH SESSION OF THE ELEVENTH ASSEMBLY

Thursday, 5th March, 2015 

The House met at 1430 hours

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

______________

ANNOUNCEMENTS BY MR SPEAKER

INTERNATIONAL WOMEN’S DAY

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members, as you may be aware, Zambia will join the rest of the international community in commemorating the International Women’s Day which falls on Sunday, 8th March, 2015. For this year, the International Women’s Day will be commemorated under the theme:

“Gender is my Agenda: Make it Happen.”

On Sunday, 8th March, 2015, all female hon. Members of Parliament and selected male hon. Members of Parliament and staff will represent the National Assembly in a march past which will end at the Heroes Stadium as part of activities to celebrate the International Women’s Day. The marchers will assemble at Muleya Basic School grounds, opposite the Emmasdale Police Station, at 0730 hours.

I wish to encourage all hon. Members on this day to support our womenfolk in the nation in all ways possible.

I thank you.

COMMONWEALTH DAY

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members, the Commonwealth Parliamentary Association (CPA) Zambia branch will join the rest of the Commonwealth countries in commemorating the Commonwealth Day on Monday, 9th March, 2015.

The Zambia branch has, therefore, lined up activities involving youths drawn from the ten provinces of Zambia which will focus on activities which are linked to the capacity and contribution of the young people in fostering sustainable development and democracy. These include an open youth forum at which participants will discuss the establishment of a national youth parliament, in line with the theme for this year’s Commonwealth Day, which is: 

“A Young Commonwealth.”

Activities to commemorate the Commonwealth Day will continue on Tuesday, 10th March, 2015.  On this day, the invited youths from the ten provinces of Zambia will debate on issues pertaining to reproductive health. This event has been co-sponsored by the National Assembly of Zambia and International Pregnancy Advisory Services (IPAS). 

I, therefore, wish to invite all hon. Members of Parliament, as CPA branch members, to attend the Commemoration of the Commonwealth Day on Monday, 9th March, 2015 at 0840 hours in the Auditorium at Parliament Buildings and the event on Tuesday, 10th March, 2015 at 0900 hours in the Parliamentary Chamber.

I wish to urge all hon. Members to render support to these important events in the CPA calendar.

I thank you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

_____________

MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

MOBILE COMMUNICATION SERVICES IN UN-SERVED AND UNDERSERVED AREAS

The Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication (Mr Mukanga): Mr Speaker, I thank you for according me an opportunity to brief the august House and nation at large on the extension of mobile communication services in un-served and underserved areas.

Sir, the mandate of my ministry and its agencies in the information and communication technologies (ICT) sector is to build a people-centred, inclusive and development-oriented information and knowledge society where everyone can create, access, utilise and share information and knowledge. The realisation of this mandate will enable individuals, communities and the people of Zambia not only to contribute to national development, but also to an improvement in the quality of life.

Sir, because our rural areas have continued to be sparsely populated, they have not been considered as a viable business case by the mobile network operators. This perception has contributed to the widening digital gap between rural and urban areas.

Mr Speaker, in order to bridge this digital gap, the Patriotic Front (PF) Government, in 2012, embarked on a programme to construct global system mobile (GSM) communication towers in areas that have remained unserved or underserved since the inception of the GSM communication services in Zambia. This project is being financed through the Universal Access and Service Fund administered by the Zambia Information and Communication Technology Authority (ZICTA). Under Phase I, the Government plans to construct and install a total of 169 communication towers across all the ten provinces as follows:

    Province           No. of Towers

    Eastern     23
    Lusaka    2
    Muchinga     12
    Northern     19
    Copperbelt     11
    Luapula     19
    Central     21
    Southern    21
    Western    15
    North-Western    26

Mr Speaker, due to the high demand for mobile communication services, thirty-five additional towers were included, resulting in a total of 204 communication towers which will be constructed under this phase. The location of these towers was informed by a survey conducted by a team of experts comprising of representatives from various institutions. To operationalise the Communication Tower Project, the Government engaged Huawei Technologies (Z) Limited in May, 2013 to construct 169 towers with a completion date of 17th October, 2014. The contract sum for Phase I was K72 million. 

Sir, I wish to inform this august House that as at 28th February, 2015, the construction of 200 towers had been completed. Out of these, 152 towers are functional and on air. Twenty-one are awaiting connection to the Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (ZESCO) power grid while the construction of four communication towers is still ongoing. 

However, Sir, I wish to mention that the ministry has received reports that about twenty-seven towers that were previously on air have ceased to be functional. According to the reports obtained from ZICTA, some of the towers have either developed technical faults, in some cases due to vandalism, and/or theft of materials from the sites such as solar panels and cables. Let me take this opportunity to inform the House that the Government has initiated measures aimed at addressing these faults that have been identified.

Mr Speaker, allow me to urge the distinguished hon. Members of this House to support this noble project by encouraging their constituents to guard this investment jealously. As a ministry, we are confident that after completion of Phase I, the country will attain 84 per cent mobile geographical coverage up from 78.74 as at December, 2012.

Mr Speaker, the ministry is also aware that some areas are experiencing signal coverage problems. Let me also mention that the Government’s intention was to construct commercial towers with a radius of 40 km. This would have implied constructing very few towers, given the limited resource envelope. Given the high demand from the traditional leadership and the general public for mobile services and taking into consideration the available resources, the Government opted to scale down the heights of towers and the technical specification to facilitate wider coverage with towers having a range of 5 km radius. 

Sir, the reduction in height has come with its challenges of limited coverage and this is what is being experienced in selected areas. According to our experts, towers located at higher altitude offer a higher chance of better signal coverage. For this reason, it is not uncommon to locate towers at higher grounds such as mountains or hills. 

Mr Speaker, I want to assure this House that the Government is doing everything possible to ensure that this challenge is addressed in the quickest possible time. We will also ensure that those areas that are being affected by limited coverage under Phase I are revisited in Phase II where the Government will install higher towers with better coverage. In so doing, the Government will re-locate the towers in those areas to other locations to optimise the utilisation of the equipment.

Mr Speaker, having experienced some challenges under Phase I, the Government will, under Phase II, revise the technical specifications to ensure that wider coverage and constant connectivity is achieved. 

Further, I must mention that during the surveys for Phase II, the technical team shall ensure that the most optimal locations are cited for the erection of towers in order to attain the best possible coverage. Sir, with the completion of Phase II, which is expected to be concluded by December, 2016, I am confident that the country will attain 100 per cent geographical coverage.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members are now free to ask questions on points of clarification on the ministerial statement given by the hon. Minister.

Mr Mbewe (Chadiza): Mr Speaker, communication towers are built on land which belongs to other people such as fields, clinics, palaces and schools. When these towers are erected, the owners of the land are told that they would be paid some money monthly. However, no rentals are paid for most towers around the country and in Chadiza in particular. Who is supposed to pay the rentals for the towers? Is it the Government or the network service provider?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, all the towers across the country are erected by network service providers except the ones I just talked about. Therefore, network providers are supposed to pay rent for the towers that they have erected. As for the ones erected by ZICTA, it has to make its own arrangements. However, on the specific question of Chadiza, we will make a follow up and address the issue.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Dr Musokotwane: Mr Speaker, I heard the hon. Minister say that when Phase II is completed, coverage will rise from 78 per cent of the Zambian geographical space to more than 80 per cent or something like that. 

Mr Speaker, the Western Province has less than 30 per cent coverage, at least, by 2011. I am sure that if it has risen, it cannot be more than 40 per cent. Therefore, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister why the Government saw it fit to stop the erection of towers in areas where work had already started in the province with the least coverage and take the towers to areas which had more coverage. What is the hon. Minister’s response to the discriminatory way the people in the Western Province are treated?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, this Government does not discriminate. When it comes to the execution of projects, our President, His Excellency Mr Edgar Chagwa Lungu wants us to provide equitable development to all parts of the country. Even when it comes to towers, we are providing them on that basis. 

Mr Speaker, initially, there were towers that were erected that were not part of the 169. However, we wanted to co-ordinate the development so that we harmonise issues. For that reason, for the 169 towers, we looked at chiefdoms and the Western Province had few. However, we are now going to cover the entire country with the 270 towers. Therefore, the hon. Member has no cause to worry as his area will be properly and fully covered.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mutati (Lunte): Mr Speaker, as the Government expands the coverage through the erection of towers, we, the consumers, are not seeing the benefit in terms of the reduction of the cost of air time. What is the Government doing about that?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, if the Government did not use the Universal Access Project to erect those 204 towers I talked about, the cost of air time would have shot up. The Government decided to provide money for the construction of towers because if it was the mobile phone service providers who had done that, they would have increased the cost of airtime. That is why we have decided to meet the mobile phone service providers half way by constructing the towers. We will continue to discuss this with them so that we can see how best we can have further reduction in the price of air time. We need air time in order for us to have better business opportunities, and to ensure that our cost of doing business goes down.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Miyutu (Kalabo Central): Mr Speaker, the erection of communication towers in Kalabo deserves to be commended. However, is the hon. Minister aware that the people who were employed in Kalabo by the contractor who erected the towers have not been paid their dues?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, when we rolled out this project, a contract for constructing the towers was signed between Huawei and the Government. The people and the contractor should resolve the matter which Hon. Miyutu referred to. However, if they fail, the Government will come in and see how best the matter can be handled.

I thank you, Sir. 

Prof. Lungwangwa (Nalikwanda): Mr Speaker, narrowing the digital divide between the urban and rural areas is an International Telecommunication Union (ITU) agreed principle, and governments, are expected to mobilise resources, through their various telecommunication authorities, to do that. How well is the Zambia Information and Communication Technology Authority (ZICTA) doing mobilising resources in order for us to meet the objectives of the principle to which I have already referred?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, I think that ZICTA is doing all it can to raise funds for the construction of towers. Without that mobilisation of funds, the 169 towers we are talking about would not have been constructed. Even the rolling out of Phase II of the project would not be there. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Speaker, I would like to commend the Zambia Information and Communication Technology Authority (ZICTA) and the Government for making it possible for Mitete to have a communication tower. However, apart from the Zambia Telecommunications Company Limited (ZAMTEL), no other mobile phone service provider is available in Mitete. We were told that Airtel and the MTN would put their antennas on the communication tower in Mitete. Further, the talk time cards in Mitete are being sold at exorbitant prices. What is the hon. Minister doing about that? When are we going to see the other mobile phone service providers come to Mitete? We were told that the communication tower set up by the Government would house the antennas for all the three mobile phone service providers. 

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, I choose to reserve the liberty to answer one question. I will only answer one part of the question. All the mobile phone service providers are at liberty to use the towers which we put up. Airtel and the MTN can put their units there. For the service providers, it must make business sense for them to put up facilities in a particular area. If they feel that they will not make money in a particular area, they will not go there. However, we have been encouraging the mobile phone service providers to do their very best in terms of service to our people. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Mtolo (Chipata Central): Mr Speaker, sometime last year, the hon. Minister asked hon. Members of Parliament to give a list of places where they would like to have these communication towers erected, and that was done. For Chipata, I gave three areas that need communication towers. Can the hon. Minister indicate why none of these three areas I submitted on that list have been given a tower? I was expecting the hon. Minister to come to the House with a list of the areas which will be covered in the next phase. Is the list which was put together with the support of the hon. Members going to be followed?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, we requested hon. Members of Parliament to give an indication as to which areas were not being served, and they did. When hon. Members give us an indication of which areas need the communication towers, we take our technical people there so that they can do the actual mapping to see whether the sites are appropriate. After the hon. Members gave us their lists, the technical people did the mapping and discovered that some of the sites were not appropriate. In addition to that, under Phase I, we could not put up the communication towers in some sites that hon. Members identified due to the limited resource envelope. We hope to cover more areas when we the roll out Phase II. When we finish the procurement process, we will come and show the hon. Members which direction we will be taking. We are aiming for 100 per cent coverage.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Speaker, is Dundumwezi Constituency going to benefit from Phase II? I ask this because Dundumwezi is the only constituency in the Southern Province with only one tower that covers only a 2 km radius. 

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, Dundumwezi is in Zambia, and our plan is to have 100 per cent coverage in our country. Definitely, Dundumwezi will be covered under Phase II.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Lufuma (Kabompo West): Mr Speaker, the cost of mobile communications facilities in Zambia is very high when compared to other countries in the region. The efficiency also leaves much to be desired. Does the Government have plans to assist the Zambian people by introducing a fourth provider so that the efficiency and cost of mobile communications is lowered?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, allowing a fourth mobile service provider onto the market is no guarantee that there will be reduction in the cost of communication. The Government is doing all it can to ensure that Cabinet discusses the issue and makes a decision. Once this is done, there will be a possibility of having more than four mobile service providers so that competition can be enhanced in the country. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Brig-Gen Dr Chituwo (Mumbwa): Mr Speaker, whereas there is this desire to contain the cost of mobile communication, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what the Zambia Information Communications Technology Authority (ZICTA), in partnership with the ministry, is doing to maximise the utilisation of information and communication technologies (ICTs) so that the benefits are much more widespread. 

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, because the Government is concerned with the cost of communication, it has been looking at various options of how to manage not only towers, but also optic fibres and related infrastructure to ensure that the cost of communication is reduced for the effective development of the country because we believe that the use of ICTs can develop a country faster. We want to utilise ICTs properly through projects such as the Smart Zambia Project, e-learning and e-governance. With such utilisation, we will see a turn-around of development in the country. Time has come for us to move away from the physical use of paper. We need to start using electronic media even when buying things because e-commerce is easy. Even Parliament is supposed to be electronic and paperless. This is where we want to be so that we change the way we operate today and do it at a cheaper cost.

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

Mr Ndalamei (Sikongo): Mr Speaker, a tower which is supposed to be connected to the Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (ZESCO) was erected at Sikongo Boma with the full knowledge that Sikongo is not connected to the national grid. 

Mr Mbewe: Sure?

Mr Ndalamei: Sir, when is the Government going to supply solar panels so that this tower can start functioning?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, for the towers with which we have had challenges with regard to connectivity to the national grid, we are providing solar panels so that it is easy for the towers to function. I did not know anything about the tower in Sikongo. I will look into the matter and make sure that it becomes operational. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Muchima (Ikeleng’i): Mr Speaker, I would like to commend the staff at Zambia Information Communications Technology Authority (ZICTA) for they know what they are doing.  There is, however, a gap between the authority and the Government. 

Hon. Minister, …

Mr Mbewe interjected.

Mr Muchima: My brother, indeed.

Laughter 

Mr Muchima: Sir, the Movement for Multiparty Democracy (MMD) put up a lot of towers in rural areas, including Ikeleng’i. I do not believe that the towers in my area have been vandalised. To date, they are not connected to the national electricity grid despite the Patriotic Front (PF) having been in power for over three years. What is the Government doing to connect the towers to the electricity grid because we want to communicate efficiently?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, this is not a new question, so, I will answer it. The Movement for Multiparty Democracy (MMD) did what it did in twenty years. Everybody knows that the Patriotic Front (PF) Government, in just three years, has done a lot which everyone can see. I am talking about towers, roads and many other developments. All the hon. Members are enjoying the fruits of the PF being in power.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Livune: Question!

Mr Mukanga: Sir, the 204 communication towers we are talking about were erected in one year. So, how can you question what the PF Government has done? What the PF has done is change the landscape of not only doing business, but also of communication. Today, we are communicating better than we did during the MMD’s twenty years.

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

Mr Mweetwa (Choma Central): Mr Speaker, I …

Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir. 

Mr Speaker: Not at this juncture. 

Hon. Member for Choma Central, you may proceed. 

Mr Mweetwa: Mr Speaker, I would like to take advantage of the ministerial statement by the hon. Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication and the answers thereof to find out what the Government’s policy or position is in respect of chiefs who are receiving what I will call ground rates, for lack of a better term, in chiefdoms where these towers have been erected. Apparently, they are utilising the funds alone as chiefs whereas their subjects keep wondering why they are enjoying these ground rates alone instead of directing them to communal usage such as uplifting the standards of school infrastructure and clinics. What is the position of the Government over this matter?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, we erected these towers in chiefdoms. The money is not supposed to go to one individual. We are aware of what Hon. Mweetwa has said, but do not want to embarrass our chiefs because they are respectable people. When it comes to negotiations, the chiefs do not talk about their personal interests. The chiefs are expected to look at the interests of their subjects when dealing with any matter. We are not aware of any chief who wants to be keeping money which is supposed to benefit the subjects in his or her pocket. If the hon. Member knows any chiefs who are doing that, he is free to inform us so that we investigate the matter. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Laughter 

Mr Speaker: He is from the African Parliamentarians’ Network against Corruption (APNAC)

Laughter 

Mr Konga (Chavuma): Mr Speaker, while it is appreciated that the Government has increased the number of towers being constructed throughout the country, much leaves to be desired with regard to some services which are being provided by the service providers. The internet services from most of the service providers are alright, but the quality of service for voice calls leaves much to be desired. What can the Government do to ensure that the service providers improve that part of their service?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, the Government is also concerned with regard to what is happening in relation to the quality of voice data. We need to ensure that we have the best uninterrupted service so that our people are able to communicate easily. We have been talking to the mobile service providers with the hope of coming up with ways of improving the voice data service. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Livune (Katombola): Mr Speaker, as the hon. Minister attempts to tell us when they will connect the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) towers, can he also tell us what they will do with the limited radius that is covered by the current towers that they have erected. The radius that is covered is about 3 to 5 km. Is the ministry doing anything to extend the radius being covered by some towers? 

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, there are no MMD towers. All the towers belong to us as the Government.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mukanga: They belong to us. We have inherited all the towers and if there are problems, it is us who should address them. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mukanga: Sir, all the towers which are problematic will be worked on. We will also improve the coverage of some towers. That is why I said that when rolling out Phase II, we will make sure we put up the best towers. That decision will entail that some of the towers which will be found in a particular radius will have to be relocated so that we utilise them fully.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Mulomba (Magoye): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister, in his answer to the question raised by the hon. Member for Choma Central, gave Hon. Mweetwa an assignment to find out which chiefs are misusing the money which is paid to them by the mobile phone service providers for hosting the towers. Should the money be spent on community projects or is it for the chiefs’ personal use? What is the position of the Government on this matter? 

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, the money that is being collected by the chiefs is meant for the chiefdoms. The chiefdoms should decide how to utilise the money.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Pande (Kasempa): Mr Speaker, before I ask my question, I would like to bring to the attention of the hon. Minister that Senior Chief Kasempa’s area was left out when Phase I was being implemented. I hope that he will be on a priority list when the implementation of Phase II begins. 

Sir, my question is related to the one which was asked by Hon. Muchima.

Mr Muchima: Hear, hear!

Mr Pande: Sir, when are they going to connect the towers, like the one in Mwinilunga, to the electricity grid so that they become operational?

Mr Muchima: Hear, hear! Good.

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, for the towers that were erected in Mwinilunga, we will send our engineers to check what is stopping them from being connected to the electricity grid. Once the assessment is completed, we will make a decision as to what to do next. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwanza (Solwezi West): Mr Speaker, I received a message from one of the headmasters in Solwezi West Parliamentary Constituency complaining that since the erection of the towers at Musere Basic School, none of the service providers has been paying rent to them. They are wondering where the rent money goes. Can the hon. Minister tell us where the rent money goes so that we can close this matter once and for all. 

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, I will find out where the rentals go. The hon. Member of Parliament would have taken it upon himself to resolve that issue. I will see what we can do to resolve it on his behalf. 

I thank you, Sir. 

__________

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER 

PROHIBITED IMMIGRANTS 

373.    Mr I. Banda (Lumezi) asked the Minister of Home Affairs:

(a)    how many prohibited immigrants and suspects were being held in Zambian Prisons as of December, 2014;

(b)    how many prohibited immigrants were held for more than six months; and 

(c)    when the suspects who were involved in hacking their opponents with machetes along the Kenneth Kaunda International Airport Road which led to the death of one person, on 7th November, 2013, would be taken to court to answer to the criminal offence charges.

The Minister of Home Affairs (Mr Mwila): There was a total of 241 immigrants and suspects held in Zambian prisons as of December, 2014. Currently, there are 241 prohibited immigrants. There were a total of 361 prohibited immigrants, who were held for more than six months, as of December, 2014. 

Sir, on 7th November, 2013, police arrested some suspects in connection with the death of one person along the Kenneth Kaunda International Airport Road. The suspects were released after the two postmortems which were conducted revealed that the victim had died of natural causes.

Hon. Opposition Members: Ah!

Mr Mwila: The case has since been closed.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr I. Banda: Mr Speaker, I would like to ask the hon. Minister …

Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised. 

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I would have raised this point of order contemporaneously, but due to your ruling that you would not allow me to raise it at that particular time, I would like to raise this issue now.

Sir, as a Member of Parliament who has been in this House for more than thirteen years, I am concerned with the statements which have been coming from my colleagues on your right pertaining to the time the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) was in power. 

Mr Speaker, this afternoon, the hon. Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication indicated that the MMD failed the people in the past and should not be claiming any credit for the development which is currently taking place because it is no longer in Government. We are all aware that there are two hon. Members from the MMD in the Cabinet of the Patriotic Front (PF) Government. There are also some hon. Members from the MMD who are Deputy Ministers in the PF Government.

Interruptions 

Mr Speaker: Order! 

Please, continue hon. Member.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, is it not unfortunate for those in the PF Government to be apportion blame to the MMD for the problems which this country is facing when they are actually ruling together? The MMD/PF Alliance is still in existence. Whenever the MMD is being blamed, hon. Members of Parliament such as Hon. Dr Kaingu look down.

Laughter

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, Hon. Mwale is so excited that he is now part of them. Are the PF hon. Members in order to continue abusing the alliance members when they are ruling together? 

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Well! The hon. Minister was in order in the sense that he was referring to the party in Government as opposed to individuals. I have said before that there are a lot of movements in our politics.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: It is very difficult to trace them. 

Laughter

Mr Speaker: I think that the movements are ongoing. The hon. Minister was referring to the party in Government as opposed to the individuals. If we individualise this discussion, you will not see the heads or tails of the Zambian politics. Our politics are very fluxy. 

Mr I. Banda: Mr Speaker, I note that we have a lot of immigrants in our prisons. What is the Government doing to decongest the prisons? Why is the Government not fast tracking the cases involving immigrants so that they are transported back to their countries of origin?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the Government has plans to construct the holding rooms where the illegal immigrants will be detained. We are avoiding the situation whereby the Zambians and foreigners are detained in the same cells. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwiimbu (Monze Central): Mr Speaker, when answering part (c) of Question 373, the hon. Minister indicated to us in this House and to the nation at large that the late Mr Simwelu died of natural causes. It is general knowledge that, that individual was hacked to death by party cadres. What happened was captured and aired on the television. I want the hon. Minister to categorically confirm that Mr Simwelu died as a result of that unfortunate incident and was even nursed by the relatives.  

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Monze Central is a lawyer who should not conclude matters in the manner which he has. Two postmortems were conducted. The first one was conducted by a Government institution. Another doctor had to be engaged to conduct another postmortem after the family of the deceased complained about the findings which were contained in the first report. The second report revealed that the deceased died as a result of natural causes. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Shakafuswa (Katuba): Mr Speaker, with your indulgence, may I know if some of these illegal immigrants who are in prison are from Burundi and that they ran away from their country due to genocide. What is happening is that the Burundian authorities are working together with our immigration authorities to have those who could have been involved in the genocide arrested before they enter Zambia which is a safe haven.

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the information we have is that most of the prohibited immigrants are Zimbabweans, Congolese and the Masai.

I thank you, Sir.

Ms Lubezhi (Namwala): Mr Speaker, I am one of those who watched that clip of the person who was killed, and whose postmortem report said that he died out of natural causes. Were there any charges which were pressed on the people who assaulted the deceased?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Namwala is not a lawyer. There was no complainant who came forward as regards the deceased having been assaulted. That is how the case ended.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has indicated that the deceased was assaulted. Why did the State not take up that case?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, I have indicated that there were two postmortems that were carried out. Both postmortems revealed the same results. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Konga (Chavuma): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that the Government is constructing holding cells to separate the inmates, that is, the foreign and local ones. Why does the Government take long to repatriate the foreign convicts to their countries of origin?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, when these prohibited immigrants are arrested, they go through court processes. It is those processes which delay the repatriation process. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Miyanda (Mapatizya): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has made it clear that two postmortems were carried out. How independent was the doctor who did the second postmortem? Who recommended the doctor? Was it the Government or the family of the deceased?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, after the family complained that the first doctor was biased, it engaged a private doctor to conduct another postmortem.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Lufuma (Kabompo West): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister, in his response to the supplementary question posed by the hon. Member for Namwala, categorically said that the victim was assaulted and died. Is he aware that the Laws of Zambia stipulate that if somebody is assaulted and dies within a year, that is considered as murder?

Interruptions

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, I want to repeat what I said. On 7th November, 2013, police arrested some suspects in connection with the death of one person along the Kenneth Kaunda International Airport Road. The suspects were released after the two postmortems which were conducted revealed that the victim died of natural causes. I also want to state that all of us that are here, whether on the left or right, must not incite our cadres to get involved in violent activities …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwila: … because those found wanting will be brought to book by the police. So, let us educate our cadres to refrain from violent activities.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

MINIMUM WAGE

374. Mr Chipungu (Rufunsa) asked the Minister of Labour and Social Security:

(a)    whether there were any employers that continued paying general workers wages that were below the prescribed minimum wage as of October, 2014;

(b)    what action was taken against such employers; and

(c)    what measures had been taken to ensure that all employers comply with the law on minimum wage.

The Deputy Minister of Labour and Social Security (Ms Kansembe): Mr Speaker, the labour inspections which were carried out by my ministry revealed that most employers are in compliance with the application of the minimum wage requirements. Some employers in small and medium-scale enterprises in the informal sector have normally cited inability to pay and sustain the minimum wage.

Sir, employers that are non-compliant are advised in writing to pay in accordance with the minimum wage and are given a time frame within which to comply.

Mr Speaker, the ministry has employed fifty-eight labour officers during 2013 and 2014 in addition to the fifty-two officers that were employed before. This is for the purposes of inspections to ensure that all employers comply with the law on the minimum wage. The ministry has also increased awareness regarding the labour laws, before including the minimum wage through radio, television and other media networks.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Chipungu: Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. Deputy Minister for the answer and, in the same vein congratulate her as well as my other neighbour, Hon. Ng’onga, on bouncing back.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chipungu: Sir, some workers who work in hardware shops which are mostly owned by foreigners still get very little money. Last time I went to one of these shops, some workers told me that they are suffering because they get peanuts. Therefore, I would like to find out whether the ministry ever sends inspectors to those shops.

Ms Kansembe: Mr Speaker, we have inspectors that go round to check on the working conditions in shops, especially those in the trading area of Kamwala and the Town Centre. If there are employers who still do not comply with the law, we encourage workers to approach our offices so that we can advise such employers to comply with the law on the minimum wage.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Livune (Katombola): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister how insulated the officers are from being corrupted as they conduct their work, considering that most shop owners do not want to pay their workers the required minimum wage.

Ms Kansembe: Mr Speaker, our officers do not even need to be corrupted by the employers because, in some cases most, of them pretend that they do not have the capacity to pay their workers the required minimum wage. Further, as a precaution, we do not send the same officers to the same employers every time.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Miyanda: Mr Speaker, I am happy to hear that there are inspectors that go round town. Are there any inspectors who are sent countrywide, especially to farms that are owned by white farmers in order to find out how much the farm workers get paid?

Ms Kansembe: Mr Speaker, we send our inspectors countrywide to different industries to conduct these inspections. If there are specific issues that the hon. Member knows concerning farm workers not getting paid the minimum wage, he is free to come to our offices to give us a report and we will address them.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Masebo (Chongwe): Mr Speaker, will the hon. Minister of Labour and Social Security be kind enough to help us understand this issue of the minimum wage as it relates to farm workers? Are they covered?

Ms Kansembe: Mr Speaker, all the industries are covered.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mbewe (Chadiza): Mr Speaker, are those who do not comply with the law on the minimum wage taken to court?

Ms Kansembe: Mr Speaker, as I said earlier on, we dialogue with those that have been found wanting and encourage them to comply with the labour laws. At the moment, the compliance levels are between 80 to 90 per cent.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

DEGAZETTING LAND IN CHIBWE NATONAL FOREST RESERVE

375. Mr Musonda (Kapiri Mposhi) asked the Minister of Lands, Natural Resources and Environmental Protection:

(a)    whether the Government had any plans to degazette and demarcate land for the establishment of a community market at the Zambia After Six in Chibwe National Forest Reserve along the Great North Road in Kapiri Mposhi District; and

(b)    if so, when the degazetting and demarcation of the land would commence.

The Deputy Minister of Lands, Natural Resources and Environmental Protection (Mrs Kawandami): Mr Speaker, the Government has no plans of degazetting and excising part of the Chibwe National Forest Reserve at Zambia After Six along the Great North Road in Kapiri Mposhi District for either the establishment of a community market or any other purpose. Since the Government has no such intentions, there is no time frame as to when the process of degazetting and excising part of Chibwe Forest Reserve will commence.

I thank you, Mr Speaker. 

Mr Musonda: Mr Speaker, since there are no plans to degazette the area in question, what plans does the Government have for the people who have settled in the forest reserve?

Mrs Kawandami: Mr Speaker, I want to tell Hon. Musonda that forest reserves are gazetted for either the protection of the ecosystem or production purposes. It is, therefore, illegal for any person to encroach or squat in any gazetted forest. The Government is actually encouraging the occupants of forest reserves to move to other areas where they can easily settle. 

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Namulambe (Mpongwe): Mr Speaker, there are certain times when all the trees are cut and nothing remains in a forest reserve. In a case where there is consideration to degazette such an area, who should administer the land? Is it the council or Ministry of Lands, Natural Resources and Environmental Protection?

Mrs Kawandami: Mr Speaker, it is a well-known fact that all the land in this country belongs to the Government and the chiefs are just caretakers.

Hon. Opposition Members: No!

Mrs Kawandami: Yes, the Government has full authority over land.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! 

Hon. Members, we do not proceed in that fashion.

Mrs Kawandami: Sir, the Government owns all the land throughout the country. Chiefs just recommend to the Ministry of Lands, Natural Resources and Environmental Protection on what should be done to a given piece of land. In other words, chiefs are just custodians. That is the prevailing situation.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mutale (Kwacha): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister …

Mr Namulambe: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, I asked the hon. Deputy Minister to tell us who is responsible for the allocation of land. Is it the council or Ministry of Lands, Natural Resources and Environmental Protection? I did not mention chiefs. So, is the hon. Deputy Minister in order not to categorically state who between the two institutions should give land? I seek your serious ruling.

Mrs Kawandami rose.

Mr Speaker: Pause, hon. Deputy Minister. I have to rule first.

Laughter 

Mr Speaker: My ruling is that as you continue responding, hon. Deputy Minister, please clarify the issue which has been raised by the hon. Member for Mpongwe.

Mr Mutale: Mr Speaker, currently, there is a lot of indiscriminate charcoal burning in forest reserves. Is the ministry aware that this is happening? We drive back and forth on that road on many occasions. If the ministry is aware, what action is being taken to protect trees in forest reserves?

The Minister of Agriculture and Livestock (Mr Lubinda)(on behalf of the Minister of Lands, Natural Resources and Environmental Protection (Ms Ngimbu): Sir, the Government is aware of the rampant charcoal burning in this forest and is very concerned about the welfare of the citizens who are squatting in that forest. The squatters sought a court injunction against the Ministry of Lands, Natural Resources and Environmental Protection when we attempted to remove them from the forest. That matter is currently before the courts of law. I would not like to go any further than just saying we are concerned and hoping that the issue can be addressed as soon as possible. 

Sir, with regard to the question raised by Hon. Namulambe on who is responsible for administering land if a forest is degazetted, the mandate of administration of land in Zambia is vested in the Ministry of Lands, Natural Resources and Environmental Protection. Councils only make recommendations to this ministry. 

Sir, I would like to emphasise that it is not the desire of the Government to degazette a forest simply because the bushes and trees in the forest have been cut. What we ought to be doing, as a matter of fact, is put resources together and encourage communities to plant trees because we cannot allow our country to reach the verge of becoming a desert because of the rampant cutting down of trees.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, I would like to take advantage of the answer given by the hon. Minister that we should encourage our communities to look for resources for reforestation. Why is it that the ministry has not found it prudent to urgently address the problem of deforestation with the money collected from ground rates and the processing of titles so that this country does not become a desert? 

Mr Speaker, as the House is aware, I come from Katuba, which is the source of most water bodies in Lusaka, including the Chongwe and Mwembeshi rivers. However, due to deforestation, Lusaka is becoming dry. Does the Government not find this an urgent issue that should be addressed to avoid a catastrophe whereby Lusaka will become waterless very soon? The reports that the ministry has show that Lusaka is running out of water.

Mr Lubinda: Sir, I am sure that the hon. Member for Katuba, like all hon. Members of Parliament, will remember that the Ministry of Lands, Natural Resources and Environmental Protection, on an annual basis, has invited us to go and collect tree nurseries to go and plant. This ministry has been working very hard, propagating seedlings. When I say that we should partner with the community, I am not saying that the Government is going to do this alone and hon. Members should not take part. We are encouraging communities to participate in the programmes that the Government is putting in place. 

Mr Speaker, I recall that even the hon. Member of Parliament for Katuba at one stage, when he invited me to his place, showed me the private initiatives he is taking to afforest his area. That is the kind of encouragement we want to give to everybody so that everyone is involved in the reforestation programme. So, we are not leaving it only to the communities. We want to partner with the communities.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, I want to take advantage of the answer that was given by the hon. Deputy Minister on something concerning chiefs. What is the difference between customary and State land?

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, the nomenclature alone must be clear that State land is land that belongs directly to the State. The Government can do whatever it wishes with State land without asking or consulting anyone. Customary land is the one which is administered through our traditional leaders. The State cannot handle issues to do with customary land without consulting the traditional leaders. That is the distinction.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Hon. Opposition Members: Zayelo!

Laughter

CONSTRUCTION OF POLICE STATIONS AND POSTS IN MAGOYE

376. Mr Mulomba (Magoye) asked the Minister of Home Affairs when the Government would construct the following facilities in Magoye Parliamentary Constituency:

(a)    a police station at Magoye Township; and

(b)    police posts in the following wards:

 (i)    Itebe;

(ii)    Kalama;

 (iii)    Nkonkola;

(iv)    Chivune; and

 (v)    Munenga

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the Government, through the Zambia Police Force, has plans to construct a police post in Magoye Township in 2016.

Sir, the Government has no immediate plans to construct police posts in Itebe, Kalama, Nkonkola, Chivuna and Munenga. However, the Government will consider the construction of police posts in the same areas once funds are available for such projects. Currently, these areas are being policed by Mazabuka Police Station.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mulomba: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that the people of Magoye are currently living in fear due to the lack of police facilities in the area? To underscore this point, I wish to state that three cases of murder have been recorded within the month of February, in the area. It is unfortunate that the hon. Minister has said that the Government has no immediate plans to put up police facilities in the areas I mentioned in part (b) of the question except a police station in Magoye Township in 2016. In this case, what immediate measures is the ministry going to put in place to ensure that people in the areas I have mentioned do not live in fear?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Magoye is aware that we have a community police post in Magoye. Apart from that, we have another community police post in Chivuna. Once we buy vehicles, we will be able to give one vehicle to the Magoye Police Post to enhance police patrols.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that the police post at Magoye has no transport? If he is aware, …

Interruptions

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Speaker, can I rephrase my question?

Laughter

Mr Speaker: You can rephrase it.

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has stated that there are no immediate plans to construct police posts at Itebe, Kalama, Nkonkola, Chivuna and Munenga because of the lack of resources. Can the ministry support the hon. Member with staff if he decided to use part of the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) to build police stations?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: We will accept that new question.

Laughter

Mr Hamududu: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, I wish to urge the hon. Members of Parliament who plan to construct police posts using the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) not to forget including the accommodation for police officers in their plans. The lack of accommodation for police officers has been the biggest challenge we have faced with regard to commissioning police posts which are constructed by communities using the CDF.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Antonio (Kaoma Central): Mr Speaker, the community police posts that the hon. Minister is talking about usually have one police officer. Is he contemplating sending more officers considering that the manpower is not enough to cater for the highly populated areas? 

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, I indicated just this week that we intend to recruit police officers this year. Once we conclude the recruitment exercise, we will be able to deploy some of the officers to the areas in need.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Livune: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has given comfort to the people of Magoye that he will send a vehicle there. Is he able to indicate how soon the vehicle will be made available?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Home Affairs intends to buy 400 vehicles. The procurement of the 400 vehicles will be done in phases. In Phase I, we want to buy 100 vehicles. Once we buy the 100 vehicles, we will be able to distribute them to the different police posts.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Konga: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that hon. Members of Parliament can use the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) to construct police posts in their constituencies. Will the Ministry of Home Affairs provide a standard design for the police posts or can hon. Members of Parliament use any design to construct them?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the Permanent Secretary in the Ministry of Home Affairs will write to all hon. Members of Parliament over the same issue. We will have a standard design.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

CONSTRUCTION OF CLASSROOM BLOCKS IN CHITAMBO

377. Mr Mushili Malama (Chitambo) asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education:

(a)    when the construction of 1x3 classroom blocks under the 2010 Ministry of Education Infrastructure Development Plan at the following primary schools in Chitambo Parliamentary Constituency would commence:

(i)    Fisonge;

(ii)    Mukando; and

(iii)    Kafinda; and

(b)    when Ventilated Improved Pit (VIP) latrines and staff houses would be constructed at Kafinda and Yoram Mwenye primary schools.

The Deputy Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Mr Mabumba): Mr Speaker, in 2010, funds to implement the infrastructure development plan were not released. However, in 2014, the funds released were for Mukando Primary School at which one staff house worth K110,000, one double Ventilated (VIP) latrine worth K25,000, and one single VIP latrine worth K20,000 were constructed.

  Mr Speaker, the construction of 1x3 classroom blocks at Fisonge, Mukando and Kafinda primary schools has been earmarked to be included in the infrastructure development plans for 2015 and 2016.

Mr Speaker, the construction of VIP latrines and staff houses at Kafinda and Yoram Mwenye primary schools will be included in the 2015 and 2016 infrastructure development plans.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Mushili Malama: Mr Speaker, what guarantee can I give the people of Chitambo that, this time around, this project will be implemented?

The Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Dr Kaingu): Mr Speaker, I thought that Hon. Mwiimbu would look this way.

Mr Shakafuswa: But you are looking down.

Laughter

Dr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, allow me to assure the progressive hon. Member of Parliament for Chitambo that this Government, through its party manifesto …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kaingu: … would like to improve infrastructure in schools. Therefore, I wish to assure the progressive hon. Member for Chitambo …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kaingu: … that within this year, we will attend to his problems.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for coming with a progressive answer. He said that the Government, through the party manifesto, intends to improve infrastructure in all the schools. Let me take advantage of that and find out whether that improvement of infrastructure in schools, includes structures which have been affected by disasters. For example, in Katuba, roofs for three classroom blocks at Kalala Primary School were blown off and at Mbosha Primary School, roofs for three classroom blocks were blown off. For about a year, children have not been going to these schools. This shows that the improvement of infrastructure in schools has not really been progressive. I want to find out when the improvement of infrastructure in these schools is going to progress so that these kids can start going to these schools.

Dr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Katuba is showing signs of being progressive …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kaingu: … and that he wants to work with the Government.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kaingu: Sir, I urge him not to wait until the hon. Member of Parliament for Chitambo asks a question for him to tell the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education that he has a problem in his constituency. I would like the progressive hon. Member for Katuba to come to our office and engage us. For sure, this Government, through its manifesto, …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kaingu: … is going to attend to his problems.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. Minister who is encouraging us to be very progressive. I would like to ask a very progressive question. I would like to find out from him, which particular party manifesto he is going to use to ensure that all the progressive ideas are implemented.

Dr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, if there is one document that the hon. Member of Parliament for Monze Central would not want to see, I am sure it is the Patriotic Front (PF) Manifesto.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kaingu: Sir, therefore, even if I had to refer to that manifesto page by page, it would not help him because he does not like that piece of writing. However, I want him to know that this Government, through the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education, has put aside money for infrastructure development in schools. I do not know whether that money will cover the schools in Monze. I will wait for the hon. Member of Parliament for Monze Central to file in a question so that he can be given a specific answer.

I thank you, Sir. 

COLLECTION OF LEVIES AND FEES FOR BILLBOARDS

378.  Mr Musonda asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing which bodies were mandated to collect levies and fees for the billboards that are erected along the roads within the council planning boundaries.

The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr N. Banda): Mr Speaker, the local authorities or the councils, are mandated by the Local Government Act and the Town and Country Planning Act to collect levies on billboards erected along the roads falling within the confines of the council planning boundaries. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, as I rise to ask this question, I would like you to take judicial notice of a report that has appeared in today’s Daily Nation newspaper, pertaining to the unfortunate occurrences at the Intercity Bus Station, where council employees are being battered, and humiliated by Patriotic Front (PF) party cadres, who are stopping them from collecting the fees and levies. These cadres are also asking council workers give them whatever levies they collect. Arising from that sad scenario, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing what measures the ministry has put in place to ensure that there is no latent hindrance pertaining to the collection of levies and fees by council employees whether they are in connection with billboards or at bus stations and markets. There is a lot of concern. Council employees are living in fear and are failing to perform their functions. 

Mr N. Banda: Mr Speaker, the question that the hon. Member has asked is new question. As a ministry, we have not interrogated what he has read in the newspaper. The question we are looking at is based on the billboards within the council boundaries.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, the Public Roads Act states that the Road Development Agency (RDA) is supposed to collect some fees from the billboards which are erected. Where does the authority of the council stop and where does the authority of the RDA start concerning this issue?

Mr N. Banda: Mr Speaker, we are not privy to the authority that the Road Development Agency (RDA) is using currently. The ministry has engaged the RDA in order to harmonise this situation. 

I thank you, Sir. 

CONSTRUCTION OF AGRICULTURAL EXTENSION AND VETERINARY OFFICERS’HOUSES IN MAGOYE

379. Mr Mulomba asked the Minister of Agriculture and Livestock when the Government would construct staff houses for agricultural extension and veterinary officers in Hanjalika and Mwanachingwala chiefdoms in Magoye Parliamentary Constituency. 

The Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Livestock (Mr Monde): Mr Speaker, the Government allocated funds amounting to K300,000 in the 2014 Budget under Mazabuka District for the construction of a camp house in Konkola Camp in Chief Hanjalika’s area. The tendering process has since been completed and a contract has been awarded to a contractor who is currently awaiting financing. As for Mwanachingwala Chiefdom, the construction of a camp house will be considered in 2016. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

Mr Mulomba: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Deputy Minister whether he is aware that in Magoye Constituency the mainstay of the economy is livestock farming and crop production. In the absence of these staff houses, how does he suppose we will undertake agricultural programmes? 
Mr Monde: Mr Speaker, in 2012, the Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock rehabilitated about eighty houses. I must add that there are eight camps and twenty-two agricultural camps in this district which we have been trying to rehabilitate. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Hamusonde (Nangoma): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether he is aware that houses in areas such as Nangoma are needed. Is the ministry considering building them in all the constituencies?

Mr Monde: Mr Speaker, we are aware of the need to ensure that we provide accommodation for all our camp officers. This is a countrywide programme. However, at the moment, I do not have the details for all the constituencies. 

I thank you. 

Mr Konga: Mr Speaker, the Government has provided houses for agricultural extension officers in Chavuma. Lamentably, there are no staff to live in the houses and so they are vacant. When will the ministry provide staff to live in the houses which the Government has built?

Mr Monde: Mr Speaker, we need to find out exactly what is happening in Chavuma so that we can provide the right answer. I think that the general outcry is that there is no accommodation and where there is accommodation we should be able to provide staff. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, in most rural areas, there are houses that belong to Tobacco Board of Zambia (TBZ) which are being vandalised because there are no people living there. Does the Government have plans to accommodate members of staff from the Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock in those houses? 

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, first of all, let me urge all Members of Parliament who have concerns about housing for their agricultural camp and veterinary officers to make an effort to speak to any hon. Minister in the ministry so that we can find ways of sorting out their problems.

Sir, if they, …

Mr Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1615 hours until 1630 hours.  

[THE DEPUTY CHAIPERSON OF COMMITTEES in the Chair]

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, the Tobacco Board of Zambia (TBZ) is an institution that is up and running. It is the one that owns the facilities that the hon. Member for Chadiza asked about. 

Sir, I would like to implore all the hon. Members of Parliament who are aware of agricultural facilities that are not being utilised to, please, bring that information to our attention because we cannot afford to allow our camp and extension officers to rent properties when there is Government property that is lying idly. So, I would like to urge Hon. Mbewe to kindly furnish us with details so that we follow up the matter. 

Sir, since TBZ is up and running. For us to use its properties, we will have to engage it. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

CONSTRUCTION OF MUFUMBWE DISTRICT HOSPITAL

380. Mr Pande (Kasempa) asked the Minister of Health:

(a)    what had caused the delay in completing the construction of Mufumbwe District Hospital; and

(b)    when the project would be completed.

The Deputy Minister of Health (Dr Chilufya): Mr Speaker, the construction of Mufumbwe District Hospital is, to a large extent, complete except for the walkways. The delay in the completion of the walkways has been due to the delayed disbursement of funds from the Ministry of Finance. 

Procurement of materials for the walkways has commenced and construction is due to begin later this month and is expected to be completed by June. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

RURAL HARDSHIP ALLOWANCE

381. Mr Musonda asked the Vice-President:

(a)    what criterion was used to determine the eligibility for payment of rural hardship allowance to civil servants;

(b)    which category of workers under the Ministry of Community Development, Mother and Child Health in Kapiri Mposhi were entitled to rural hardship allowance; and

(c)    whether the allowance was currently being paid to the eligible workers in Kapiri Mposhi and, if not, why.

The Minister in the Vice-President’s Office (Mr Bwalya): Mr Speaker, before I render the response from Her Honour the Vice-President, allow me to congratulate His Excellency Dr …

Laughter 

Mr Muntanga: Dr who?

Mr Bwalya: … Mr Edgar Chagwa Lungu on his election as Republican President and also congratulate Her Honour the Vice-President on her appointment as Vice-President of the Republic of Zambia. 

Sir, the criterion used to determine the eligibility for payment of the rural hardship allowance to civil servants is outlined in the Public Service Management Division Circular No. B2 of 2008 as follows:

(a)    a rural station that is deprived of any five or more of the following or where accessibility to these facilities exceeds distances from the work station indicated as follows:

(i)    banking facilities: 20 km;

(ii)    all weather accessible roads and public transport: 15 km;

(iii)    telecommunication facilities: 20 km;

(iv)    accessibility to licensed outlets to buy basic items and services: 10 km’

(v)    health facilities: 10 km;

(vi)    police facilities: 10 km;

(vii)    primary or basic school: 5 km;

(viii)    clean and safe waster: 0.5 km;

(ix)    electricity: nil;

(x)    television and radio signals: nil;

(xi)    post office or postal services: 20 km;

(xii)    library facilities or resource centres: 20 km; and

(xiii)    filling station: 50 km.

Sir, if any or all of the above facilities are missing, then a district is classified as rural and subsequently qualifies for rural hardship status and payment of rural hardship allowances as well.

(b)    a remote station that is deprived of the following facilities or where accessibility to such facilities exceeds the under listed distances:

(i)    banking facilities: 50 km;

(ii)    transport and all weather accessible roads: 50 km;

(iii)    licensed outlets for basic items and services: 40 km; and 

(iv)    areas difficult to access due to water and sandy topography.

Mr Speaker, the criterion was determined following a mapping exercise jointly conducted by the Government of the Republic of Zambia and the Public Service unions of all Government institutions for the purpose of classifying all workers’ stations as urban, rural or remote using the Global Positioning System (GPS) to produce information on location of stations in relation to the above definitions. 

Sir, all civil servants under the Ministry of Community Development, Mother and Child Health in stations classified as rural or remote, as per the criterion in (a) above, under Kapiri Mposhi District, qualify for the rural or remote hardship allowances. The allowances are paid to all civil servants in stations classified as rural or remote. Hardship allowance commences immediately an officer is placed on the payroll as the classification of stations has already been configured in the Payroll Management and Establishment Control (PMEC) System.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Musonda: Mr Speaker, in Kapiri Mposhi, notwithstanding the answer given, we still have people who are not being paid the rural hardship allowance. When is the Government going to ensure that these people start enjoying that allowance?

Mr Bwalya: Mr Speaker, like I said, this particular formula is already embedded in the payroll system. The individual cases that are obtaining in Kapiri Mposhi should be forwarded to the Ministry of Community Development, Mother and Child Health so that it can address them. 

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Musokotwane (Liuwa): Mr Speaker, I listened carefully as the criteria for remoteness which partly hinges on the distance between the working station and where services are found was being outlined. Can the Government consider the possibility of including a third criterion which relates to very remote areas rather than just remoteness?

Mr Muntanga: Very remote.

Dr Musokotwane: Very remote.

Mr Muntanga: Like Liuwa.

Dr Musokotwane: Sir, the reason I am saying this is that 40 or 50 km from social services in a place like Lusaka rural or anywhere else cannot be compared to 50 km in a place like Liuwa and many other places in the Western Province from the same services. There is more effort required to cover 50 km in Liuwa. Buses and Hilux pickups do not go to Liuwa because they would break down. As a result, you find that we have no teachers in Liuwa because they are scared to work there. Can the Government consider the possibility of establishing a third criteria called ‘very, very remote’ for places like Liuwa?

Mr Bwalya: Mr Speaker, there is a further classification as regards the distances which are being talked about by the questioner.

Sir, the further clarification is that, in category (a), a rural station which is between 30 and 70 km from the nearest district centre qualifies for the rural hardship allowance. There is also what is called category (b), which focuses on a rural station which is between 25 and 70 km from the nearest district centre. Then there is category (c), which focuses on a rural station which is between 20 and 70 km from the nearest district centre. Finally, there is category (d), a rural station which is between 0 and 15 km from the nearest district centre.

Mr Speaker, Hon. Dr Musokotwane’s concerns are more or less captured within the parameters which I have outlined.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, in view of the fact that there are some who are entitled, but have not been receiving the hardship allowance, can they now turn to the Vice-President’s Office for help in sorting out the matter because they have been dealing with their respective ministries without any success? I know that the problem is not only found in Kapiri Mposhi as I have quite a number of civil servants in Kasempa experiencing the same thing. What advice can the hon. Deputy Minister give to the people who are facing the problem? 

The Deputy Minister in the Vice-President’s Office (Mr Kampyongo): Mr Speaker, I think my colleague has indicated the criterion which is used to determine the eligibility of civil servants to get rural hardship allowance. The criterion was designed by the Government and unions. Some of the problems which officers face in getting the rural hardship allowance are as a result of in moving from one station to another.

Sir, my colleague also went further to indicate that Payroll Management Establishment Control (PMEC) is an automated system. When a person moves from one station to another, the system should be able to capture the new pay point. The unions and the Government should work together to ensure that all the civil servants are properly captured by the system. Those who have not been getting their allowance will be paid in arrears once they are properly captured by the system.   

I thank you, Sir.
Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, I take it that the officers that went round using the Global Positioning System (GPS) to place the co-ordinates made some mistakes. If they simply used the criterion of the distance, they could have handled the matter better. For instance, I have in mind one area in Mpongwe which is about 60 km from the Boma, where there is a bank and a filling station. The civil servants there are not eligible to receive the rural hardship allowance. That being the case, is it possible that the Government could revisit this matter by looking at the physical distances from the Boma as opposed to the wrong co-ordinates that the officers used, which have led to a lot of people who are entitled to the allowance not receiving it?

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Speaker, my colleague did give a very comprehensive response. Apart from the Global Positioning System (GPS), he also went further to indicate the categories in which the rural areas fall. For the sake of the hon. Member, I will repeat what my colleague said. He said that the rural areas are categorised in categories (a), (b), (c) up to (d). Category (a) is a rural station which is between 30 km and 50 km away from the nearest district. Category (d) is between 0 to 15 km away from the nearest distance. These are some of the factors which are taken into account when we are feeding data into our system. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Muntanga (Kalomo Central): Mr Speaker, how can the unions help civil servants, when they are transferred from one station to another, to start getting their rural hardship allowance? 

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Speaker, when a person moves to a station which is in a different category, the system should be updated so that the person is paid according to his/her entitlement. 

I thank you, Sir.

Prof. Lungwangwa (Nalikwanda): Mr Speaker, this issue has been on the drawing board for a long time. Those who were hon. Members of Parliament in the last sessions will recall that we debated it here in 2007 with respect to the Ministry of Education. What I would like to find out from the Office of Her Honour the Vice-President is whether her office has gone a step further to see the impact of these allowances on the willingness of civil servants to go and serve in the rural areas, the motivation to stay in there and generally, the impact on our staff who are serving in the rural areas as a result of these allowances being paid to them. Has a step been taken in that direction so that we know the impact of these allowances on our human resource serving in the rural areas?

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Speaker, I would like to take the question by the hon. Member for Nalikwanda as probably a positive suggestion. Indeed, we need to look at the impact of the allowance on sectors such as education and health. We have got a huge number of people that are serving in the remote areas in the two sectors. After three months of being in a rural area and being paid rural hardship allowance, we still hear of teachers wanting to move from the remote areas. However, we still need to take into account the fact that some want to move as a result of their getting married. We need to holistically look at these matters, working in collaboration with the sector ministries that have got a huge number of civil servants that go to these remote areas. We should take Hon. Prof. Lungwangwa’s submission as a suggestion which needs to be analysed in depth.

I thank you, Sir.

CONSTRUCTION OF PALACE FOR PARAMOUNT CHIEF GAWA UNDI

382. Mr Phiri (Mkaika) asked the Minister of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs when construction of the palace for Paramount Chief Gawa Undi in Katete District would commence.

The Deputy Minister of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs (Mr Kufuna): Mr Speaker, the funds for the construction of Paramount Chief Gawa Undi’s Palace have already been sent to the Provincial Administration in Eastern Province. The Provincial Administration in the Eastern Province is now evaluating the bids for the awarding the contract. The contractor is expected to move on site as soon as the contract has been awarded.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, we are aware that a number of palaces for the chiefs have been constructed in various areas, which I feel, is a good thing that the Government has done. What criteria does the Government use to construct chiefs’ houses? 

Mr Kufuna: Mr Speaker, the Patriotic Front (PF) Government is going to construct palaces for all the 288 chiefs. The chiefs’ houses are in categories. We have the Paramount Chiefs, the senior chiefs and the ordinary chiefs. I wish to assure the House that we are going to build houses for all the chiefs.  

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chipungu: Mr Speaker, I know that our tradition or culture requires that if a chief dies, the one who takes over shifts to another palace. I would like to find out whether the ministry intends to review some policies with regard to certain traditions in this country? 

The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Minister of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs, if you wish, you may give a bonus answer since the question under consideration was when construction of the palace for Paramount Chief Undi would commence.

The Minister of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs (Dr Katema): Mr Speaker, we do not have a bonus answer. All I can say is that we shall continue to dialogue with Their Royal Highnesses to ensure that all their concerns are addressed as we continue building them palaces.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Dr Kalila (Lukulu East): Mr Speaker, since mention has been made of the different types of chiefs we have in the country, I would like to find out the criterion which is used to determine the palaces which should be constructed first.
Dr Katema: Mr Speaker, consensus is reached within the different provinces regarding which palaces will be constructed first.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr I. Banda: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister stated that money has already been sent to the Provincial Administration in the Eastern Province for the construction of the palace for Paramount Chief Gawa Undi in Katete District. What is delaying the tender procedures and how much will this project cost?

Dr Katema: Mr Speaker, there are procedures which are associated with the issuance of contracts. We advertise and give time for contractors to respond. When the contactors respond to the advert, we open the bids and evaluate them. Those are processes which take time.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mooya (Moomba): Mr Speaker, can the hon. Minister give estimates of how much money is budgeted for the construction of the palaces for the different chiefs.

Dr Katema: Mr Speaker, although the question by Hon. Mooya is not related to the main question, I can still try to answer it. For the lower chiefs in terms of rank, the money budgeted for the construction of their places is K600,000 and K900,000 for the Paramount Chiefs.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mtolo (Chipata Central): Sir, since we are talking about housing for our chiefs, I would like to find out whether within the budget of this important ministry, there is money that has been allocated for the construction of arenas for traditional ceremonies because when we attend these ceremonies, we hardly see anything because of the type of arenas which exist. 

The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Minister of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs, if you have a bonus answer, you may give it.

Dr Katema: Mr Speaker, I do not have it.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Laughter

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I would like to remind the hon. Minister of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs that when this particular portfolio was under the Ministry of Local Government and Housing, they came to this House and made a pronouncement that each traditional ceremony arena would be provided with K100 million at that time, and that all the arenas would be constructed within two years from that date of that pronouncement. If he is not aware of that, can he make a commitment to go and verify this report that I am giving him since it was made as a pronouncement?
Dr Katema: Mr Speaker, if the hon. Member of Parliament wants to know about arenas, he could ably file in a question which we will research on and then provide him with an answer.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

ROADBLOCKS AND CHECKPOINTS

383. Mr Mpundu (Nchelenge) asked the Minister of Home Affairs:

(a)    why there were too many roadblocks and checkpoints in Zambia; and

(b)    how Zambia compares with other countries in the Southern African Development Community (SADC) region with regard to road traffic controls.

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, there are a number of roadblocks and checkpoints in Zambia which are necessitated by different security and safety needs. There are two types of police roadblocks that are used by the Zambia Police Force in its quest to ensure road safety. There are security roadblocks which are permanent in nature and may consist of different stakeholders who include the Zambia Police Force, Drug Enforcement Commission, local councils, Zambia Revenue Authority, immigration authorities and Zambia Wildlife Authority. These checkpoints are strategically located at places such as near border posts, bridges and at all exits and entry points to towns and provinces. These roadblocks are important because they enhance security in the country.

Sir, the second type of roadblocks are traffic checkpoints which are not permanent and do not have specific locations. These roadblocks can be mounted at any strategic point and their duration varies from thirty minutes to one hour. This type of checkpoint is important because it increases compliance in terms of road safety by motorists as well as enforces the adherence to road traffic regulations.

Mr Speaker, there is no comparative study that has been undertaken to compare Zambia with other countries in the Southern African Development Community (SADC) region with regard to road traffic controls.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, about two weeks, my dear colleague, the hon. Minister of Home Affairs, lamented the too many roadblocks on our roads. He then directed the police to reduce the number of roadblocks. I am also aware that when my colleague was on the Opposition side, he together with us complained that most of these roadblocks are automated teller machines (ATMs) for the police.

Laughter

Mr Mwiimbu: Sir, even Hon. Kambwili was of the same view. At that time, we all agreed that something needed to be done about the roadblocks. Is it prudent to have so many roadblocks in the country? For example, from here to Kafue, on any given day, you may find more than ten roadblocks. The police officers on these roadblocks ask for the same type of information from motorists. As result of this, the travel time from Kafue to Lusaka becomes more than two hours. The same scenario is on the road from Lusaka to Kabwe. Instead of taking one hour thirty minutes normal time and considering that there is congestion on the road, you find there are, at times, more than fifteen roadblocks on this particular road to the extent that the time line between Lusaka and Kabwe will be more than four hours. Is it prudent for these roadblocks to be mounted by the police for a specific purpose of collecting money from the motorists? The money is never accounted for …

The Deputy Chairperson: I think the question has been heard.

Mr Mwiimbu: … as Government revenue.

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, as a Government, we are also concerned that there are too many roadblocks. I will give you an example. At Kabangwe, there is a security checkpoint. Between Kabangwe and Chisamba, there are four traffic roadblocks. I have instructed the Zambia Police Force to reduce the number of roadblocks. Some are not necessary.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Hamusonde: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister mentioned two types of roadblocks. Some roadblocks operate 24 hours. Even in the night time, they will ask for the blue book and driving licence. They also check if your indicators are working. Those who are found wanting keep on paying the police even at night. Is that how a traffic roadblock should be like?

Laughter 

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, there is no blue book. There are white books now.

Laughter

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the roadblocks the hon. Member of Parliament for Nangoma is talking about are security checkpoints, which are 24 hours. So, they can ask for a white book or a driving licence. It is a requirement by law.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Muntanga (Kalomo Central): Mr Speaker, hon. Minister, now that you aware that these roadblocks are becoming a bother, not to use extreme words, would it not be better to advise these police officers not cause congestion unnecessarily. This is one country I have seen police officers causing congestion. If you go to a place where people are busy like in Tanzania, you will find the police officers busy clearing congestion. They want you to move fast. In Zambia, the police delay the movement of traffic. Here, near Manda Hill, there is usually one police officer purportedly wanting to clear traffic because he thinks the robots are not fast enough. Just before Northmead, there is another roadblock causing congestion. On the other side, there is one officer with a speed trap so that all these vehicles that are just starting to run must move at 30 km/hour. If you move at about 65 km/hour, he says you are too fast and starts to talk to you on the road. Why should this be so, hon. Minister? You know, we do not have enough roads now. All over town, hon. Minister, you will find congestion which is usually caused by police officers. Sometimes, they hide and all of a sudden, spring up from the bush.

Laughter 

Mr Muntanga: Why? The other day, I nearly ran over a police officer who sprung up from nowhere and asked me to stop moving. Why do they hide? When he saw that it was me, he asked me to continue moving. 

Laughter 

The Deputy Chairperson: What is the question, hon. Member?

Mr Muntanga: The question is: As a new hon. Minister, is he able to stop this type of behaviour by the police? 

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, we have issued an instruction to the police that unnecessary roadblocks must be discontinued. They are inconveniencing motorists. We are monitoring the situation. I will give you an example of what is happening on the road between Ndola and Kitwe. The police have reduced the number of roadblocks on that road. We only still have a problem on the road between Kitwe and Chingola. Dealing with this matter will not be an easy task. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, I was happy with the answer that was read by the hon. Minister regarding the security roadblocks. My concern is that at night, the police officers at the said roadblocks are not security cautious. When you reach the roadblocks, the police officers simply flash their torches asking you to pass. Whether you have stolen the vehicle or not, they do not know. What measures is the ministry putting in place to ensure that security is preserved for those people who may have lost vehicles because at the time when they are trying to trace the thief, he/she has already passed the checkpoint?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the police officers at the different checkpoints normally communicate. If the police start stopping people’s vehicles unnecessarily at night, everybody will start complaining. However, I have taken note of the concern by the hon. Member.

Thank you, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson gave the Floor to Dr Kalila.

Dr Kalila: Mr Speaker, my question was plagiarised by Hon. Mwiimbu.

Mr Lufuma: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has indicated that most of the roadblocks are nothing, but automated teller machine (ATMs) for police officers. That being the case, is the Government considering introducing a ticketing system so that this rampant corruption is stopped and then, the unnecessary roadblocks are also reduced?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, I never mentioned anything about the automated teller machines (ATMs). At the moment, we do not have the intention of introducing the ticketing system.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. Minister for assuring us that his ministry is doing something about the unnecessary roadblocks in order to reduce on the wastage of time.  

Sir, I would like the hon. Minister to state whether or not traffic police are authorised to confiscate drivers’ licences at checkpoints. On Chachacha Road, which is in the central business district of Lusaka, a lady traffic police officer stopped me and said to me ‘Tumone licence.’ So, I said, ‘I beg your pardon?’ She said, ‘Tumone licence.’

The Deputy Chairperson: Meaning?

Mr Nkombo: I said ‘I beg your Pardon?’ All I picked was licence. I produced my licence and  held it firmly. 

Mr Nkombo produced his licence and demonstrated.

Mr Nkombo: Sir, she wanted to take it from me and I held on to it. So, we started fighting for my licence. She went to her boss and reported that I had refused to give her my licence. When the boss came, he just saluted and said that I could go. I engaged the boss and asked him what it was all about. The constable woman said she wanted to keep my licence because my reverse light was not working. 

Sir, there is a department at the Road Traffic and Safety Agency (RTSA), which gives a validation on road fitness or worthiness of any vehicle. Is this issue of grabbing drivers’ licences an act of no confidence in those that give the validation certificate because clearly, it is possible that an indicator can stop working even as you are driving without your knowing it? 

Sir, are the police allowed to confiscate drivers’ licences? If they are not, this country should know today so that no driver is abused by having to give their security document to a police officer. As you can see, hon. Minister, it looks like an Automated Teller Machine (ATM) card. It is normally used to draw cash from those whose vehicles may be defective …

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: … outside of the Government’s receipting …

The Deputy Chairperson: The question has been asked.

Mr Nkombo: … system.

Laughter

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the police are not allowed to confiscate licences from motorists. If a motorist has been charged for over speeding, the vehicle has a number plate that can be recorded. If one has a complaint, he or she can complain to higher authorities that will take up the matter. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, I would like to start by commending traffic officers that are found at the Levy Park/Dedan Kimathi Junction, especially at pick hours where they help to decongest the traffic.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, can the police replicate what they do at the Dedan Kimathi/Levy Park Junction at Manda Hill, on Kafue Road and other areas that get congested during pick hours because it is very good? They place one policeman at the junction of Dedan Kimathi/ Levy Park, another one at the traffic lights opposite Evelyn Hone College and another policeman at the next road to ensure the smooth flow of traffic. Can this be done for other congested roads?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, since those officers are doing a good job, we have taken note of your suggestion.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr I. Banda: Mr Speaker, let me commend the hon. Minister for putting on record a statement against unnecessary road blocks immediately he took up his position. What will the hon. Minister do if the police do not heed his warning and continue with the unnecessary road blocks?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, I would like to inform this House that we are in charge.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwila: Sir, once an instruction is given, it has to be followed.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Hamududu (Bweengwa): Mr Speaker, I was at one time coming from Monze with an escort driver following me. He was stopped and police wanted money right there and then. I told them that I did not move with money. Today, we do not move with money because we swipe.  They said that in that case, I could not move. I told the officer to drive and follow me, if he wanted, to Lusaka. 

Sir, many countries have done away with the idea of paying at the roadblocks. They give you a ticket and you go and pay somewhere else. This is how you fight corruption. Are there any moves to transition to tickets so that these guys are not incentivised by the cash that we pay there and then?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, when police officers mount a roadblock, they are supposed to have receipts. If you are charged, you have to pay whatever  …

Interruptions 

Mr Mwila:  Sir, they should not engage me like that.

 Mr Speaker, if a motorist is charged, he is supposed to pay a penalty. If you have any grievance, you can report to higher authorities. We do not want to have police officers who are corrupt.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

CBPP IN WESTERN PROVINCE

384. Mr Miyutu (Kalabo Central) asked the Minister of Agriculture and Livestock:

(a)    when the first case of contagious bovine pleuropneunonia (CBPP) was diagnosed in the Western Province;

(b)    what measures had been taken to eradicate the disease in the province, especially in Kalabo District;

(c)    what conditions promoted the spread of the disease; and 

(d)    whether it was possible to completely eradicate the CBPP in the province and, if so, what had to be done.

The Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Livestock (Mr Ng’onga): Mr Speaker, there have been three major outbreaks of contagious bovine pleuropneunonia (CBPP) in the Western Province. The first case was diagnosed in 1915, the second was in 1969 and the third case was reported in 2001.

Mr Speaker, the measures that have been taken to eradicate CBPP in the Western Province include:

(a)    restriction of cattle movement within the province;

(b)    mass vaccination of cattle are conducted annually to protect them against the disease;

(c)    active search of the disease through cell surveillance that is conducted annually;

(d)    conducting abattoir surveillance in order to identify sources of infected heads; and

(e)    slaughter of infected heads in order to ensure that the infection is eliminated.

Mr Speaker, conditions that promote the spread of the disease are those that encourage interaction of diseased cattle with susceptible ones, such as:

(a)    uncontrolled movement of diseased cattle from one area to another;

(b)    mixing of infected cattle with susceptible ones at feeding and watering points; and 

(c)    cultural practices such as lobola, where cattle is moved from one relative to another without veterinary supervision.

Mr Speaker, it is possible to completely eradicate the CBPP in the Western Province, but in order to achieve this, a number of measures should be undertaken. These measures would include:

(a)    rehabilitation of the cordon;

(b)    employment of cordon guards, and construction of appropriate infrastructure;

(c)    curtailing the illegal movement of cattle by increasing the number of staff on the ground who would be able to conduct thorough surveillance exercises;

(d)    implementing a cattle identification system that will ensure that all cattle is identifiable to the owner and the community;

(e)    increasing the supervisory role of the Department of Veterinary Services at the abattoirs in the province for quick identification of the disease and prompt action;

(f)    dedicating resources to comprehensively identifying infected heads through tests and the removal of all heads that are positively identified; and 

(g)    enhancement of joint efforts with neighboring countries bordering the Western Province.

I thank you, Sir. 

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

That is a good example of a good and appropriate response to questions. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Miyutu: Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. Minister for that elaborate response. There were three occurrences of the contagious bovine pleuropneumonia (CBPP) diseases, that is, in 1915, 1969, and 2001. The current occurrence of the disease has lasted much longer. Hon. Minister, can the Government prioritise disease eradication, especially the CBPP, which has affected many heads of cattle in the Western Province, and has caused much poverty and suffering. Can the Government reserve some few coins to eradicate this disease so that it can be forgotten.

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, I do not think that the hon. Deputy Minister, in his response, indicated the duration of the outbreaks. He talked about when they occurred, but did not say which one took longer than the other. I do not think that it will be correct to say that the current outbreak has lasted longer than the previous outbreaks. Having said that, let me assure my honourable Colleague and Brother, that the Patriotic Front (PF) Government is determined to eradicate all kinds of livestock diseases. The contagious bovine pleuropneumonia (CBPP) is a disease of particular interest to this Government because many livestock farmers in the Western Province are selling off their livestock at almost give-away prices because of this disease. We would like to take measures to ensure that we eradicate the disease. Like the hon. Deputy Minister said, for now, we have contained the disease within the Western Province, and I would like to inform the House that the prevalence rate right now is at 1 per cent. The challenge we have is that this disease has a tendency of pupating. Therefore, if we allow animals to move from the Western Province to other areas, we run the risk of transferring the disease to those areas. Beyond that, I would like to assure Hon. Miyutu and the people of the Western Province that we are in the process of mobilising resources to re-establish the cordon line so that we do not allow fresh infections of the cattle that we are watching very carefully. Soon, the ministry responsible for livestock will instruct veterinary officers to go and conduct another survey to establish the exact zones where this disease is occurring.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Hamusonde: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether this disease is only found in Africa or it is in Europe as well. If does break out in Europe, what have they done to combat it?

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, the disease was eradicated in the United States of America (USA) in 1889. It was eradicated in Europe in 1896, and it was eradicated in Australia in 1974. The methods they used to eradicate it are exactly the same ones that we are applying in Zambia. There is no difference whatsoever. We are using the exact same methods, save for the fact that in these countries I have mentioned, they eradicated the animals whenever they saw an outbreak of the disease. They slaughtered all the animals at once. In Botswana, when there was an outbreak, all the animals in that country where the outbreak occurred were slaughtered. Unfortunately, we do not have the luxury of money to do that ourselves, and I do not think that it would be fair at this stage, when there is a prevalence rate of only 1 per cent, to slaughter all the animals in the Western Province. What we would like to do is to keep watch over the livestock in the Western Province and ensure that those that are infected are slaughtered, and those that are not infected are kept.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Kapeya (Mpika Central): Mr Speaker, in his answer, the hon. Minister said that the Government is determined to eradicate cattle diseases countrywide. Three weeks ago, the Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock announced the outbreak of lumpy skin disease (LSD) in Muchinga Province, especially in Mpika District. What is the current situation with regard to the disease in that area?

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, before answering that question, let me thank you most sincerely for commending us for the elaborate answer we gave, and I would like to maintain that standard. I hope I will continue giving elaborate answers in this House. I would like to appeal to Hon. Kapeya to kindly spend a little time to put his question on paper and present it to you, Mr Speaker, for onward delivery to us so that we can give him an answer that will require him to commend us again.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Ndalamei (Sikongo): Mr Speaker, in the case an outbreak of a disease is detected in a farmer’s kraal, will the hon. Minister consider the option of slaughtering the animals and compensating that farmer, instead of allowing the farmer to move the animals to Mongu or Zambeef and spread the disease to other animals?

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, in the answer that the hon. Deputy Minister read, one of the measures of avoiding cross contamination or infection of animals is the restricted movement of animals in the province. Therefore, if the hon. Member for Sikongo is witnessing animals moving from Sikongo to Mongu without veterinary supervision, he should report it because it is not allowed. We do not want to transmit the disease from one part of the province to another. 

Mr Speaker, as regards compensation, unlike African Swine Fever in pigs, the CBPP in cattle is not transmitted to humans. Those animals that are infected are slaughtered in abattoirs. Therefore, there is no intervention that the Government can make to compensate farmers whose cattle ends up in butcheries anyway. We think that this is regular practice. Our only worry is that these animals are not ready to be slaughtered. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

Mr Miyanda: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what the incubation period and mortality rate of the disease are.  

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, the CBPP is a highly contagious pneumonia which causes pleurisy. Cattle get infected by inhaling droplets from other infected cattle. This disease can also be transmitted at placental level to the foetus.

Sir, the symptoms of this disease …

Laughter 

Mr Lubinda: I am doing something I thought I could not do yesterday.  

Laughter 

The Deputy Chairperson: We appreciate. 

Mr Lubinda: I am using this House as a lecture room. I am very happy to lecture. 

Sir, the symptoms include fever, which may rise up to 41.5 °C.  The disease is also associated with anorexia and difficulties in breathing. For the sake of my dear brother, anorexia is a loss of appetite.  

Mr Shakafuswa: On a point of order, Sir. 

Laughter 

Mr Lubinda: In a hot climate such as ours, Sir, the infected animal tends to stand alone in the shed with an extended neck and lowered head (demonstrating) …

Laughter 

Mr Lubinda: … the way some people in this House lower their heads when they are not happy. Next time, I will bring a projector to the House so that I can show pictures of the symptoms of the diseases.  

Laughter 

Lubinda: Mr Speaker, the incubation period is between one and three weeks. This disease, unlike its sister disease, denkete, which kills animals suddenly, has a very high mortality rate. Within three to four weeks of infection, the animal dies. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for trying hard so hard to answer all the questions. I think that I will run a class for him when we adjourn so that he can pronounce certain words correctly. 

Laughter 

Mr Muntanga: Hon. Minister, you stated that there have been three outbreaks of the disease which we are talking about. We had managed to control the disease by 1973. The other outbreak was due to the fact that animals were moving from Angola where the disease is endemic. 

Mr Shakafuswa: Meaning?

Mr Muntanga:  Sir, it means that it is rife there. That is why we tried to put in place a cordon line. 

 Mr Speaker, after several fights, it was felt that perhaps the best way was to engage our neighbours in controlling the disease by vaccination in order to minimise the problem. What have we done so far to ensure that the vaccinations we administer in Zambia are also administered in Angola so that we do not spend too much money on containing the disease? 

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, we are engaging our sister country, Angola, on the CBPP in the same way we are engaging Botswana and Namibia on the control of tsetse flies. 

Sir, with regard to the offer by Hon. Muntanga to take me through a lecture, let me just remind him that while he was studying livestock management, I was studying agriculture business management and the lecturers I have at the moment on this matter are very highly qualified veterinary doctors with years of experience. Hon. Muntanga and I need lecturers from the same doctors.  

I thank you, Sir. 

Laughter 

The Deputy Chairperson: Anyway, lecturers come in all shapes and sizes. 

Hon. Member for Mpongwe, you may ask your question. 

Laughter 

Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, I want to thank the hon. Minister for coming to the House well researched. 

Mr Speaker, in one of the answers that he gave, he stated that there is no effect on human beings when they eat meat from a diseased animal. My cousin here (pointing at Hon. Ndalamei) has been complaining of pneumonia. I am worried because this contagious bovine pleuropneumonia (CBPP) is associated with pneumonia. 

Laughter 

Mr Namulambe: Sir, has there been any research done to determine whether there is a gradual effect on human beings who eat meat from cattle which has the CBPP?

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, I mentioned some years. One of the years I mentioned was 1899, not 1999. This disease has been known to mankind for a long time. For us to come to the conclusion that it cannot be transmitted to human beings, it is because of this wealth of knowledge and long history. Therefore, I want to assure Hon. Namulambe that he should enjoy the beef that comes from the Western Province because he does not run any risk of contracting pneumonia. If there is anybody who is suffering from pneumonia, I would like to appeal to Hon. Namulambe to quickly escort that person to the clinic. 

I thank you, Sr. 

Laughter 

ESTABLISHMENT OF INDUSTRIAL CLUSTERS IN LUNDAZI

385. Mr I. Banda asked the Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry:

(a)    how many industrial clusters had been established in Lundazi District, constituency by constituency; and

(b)    when the Government would facilitate the setting up of industries to undertake the following in the district:

(i)    gemstone processing;

(ii)    rice processing and packaging;

(iii)    oil extraction from cotton seed, soya beans and groundnuts; and

(iv)    marketing of the processed products above.

Mr Lubinda (on behalf of The Minster of Commerce, Trade and Industry (Mrs Mwanakatwe): Mr Speaker, the Government is yet to establish industrial clusters in Lundazi. In the medium term, the Government has prioritised the establishment of value chain projects across the country. It is those value chain projects that will lead to the establishment of industrial clusters. 

Sir, in Lundazi, the Government, through the Citizens Economic Empowerment Fund (CEEC), has supported seventeen value chain based cluster projects. Information on the Value Chain Project is currently only disaggregated up to district level. However, records for the disbursement of funds to these projects will also be prepared up to constituency level in the future.

Mr Speaker, the Government, through the CEEC, approved funding and funded fifteen projects in gemstone production, processing and marketing at a value of K437.3 million (unrebased) in 2004. The commission also approved and funded two projects valued at K55,150 million (unrebased) in areas of input supply and the provision of spray services in the cotton industry. The Government’s priority in Lundazi District is support to the cotton and gemstone value chains.

Sir, with regard to the question of rice and oil, the Government is promoting the private sector to invest in these value chains in Lundazi and across the country. The Government will, however, continue to expand the scope and number of projects to be supported under the value chain projects as more resources are made available to the empowerment fund. 

Sir, further, it is not the intention of the Government to set up marketing mechanisms or industries for cotton, rice, beans and groundnuts, or any other commodity for that matter, because we believe that the private sector is better placed to play the role of marketing. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr I. Banda: Mr Speaker, how much did the seventeen groups that received money from the Citizens Economic Empowerment Fund (CEEC) get in total? 

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, that requires a very quick computation. I mentioned two figures. One figure was K437.3 million (unrebased), which went to the gemstone production value chain, and the other was K55, 150 million (unrebased) which went to the supply of inputs and spray services for the cotton industry. I am sure that my dear brother can easily add the two figures

I thank you, Sir. 

PURCHASE OF PROVISIONS FOR THE ZANIS OFFICE IN KATETE

386.    Mr Phiri asked the Minister of Information and Broadcasting when the following would be provided to the Zambia News and Information Services Office in Katete District:

(a)    a motor vehicle;

(b)    video cameras; and 

(c)    office equipment. 

The Deputy Minister of Information and Broadcasting (Mr Tembo): The Katete Office has a motor vehicle which was involved in a road accident three years ago. The vehicle has since been repaired by the provincial administration. The District Information Officer (DIO) for Katete collected the vehicle in February, 2015. The car is a Nissan Double Cab Hard Body, Registration Number GRZ 945 BV.

Sir, the ministry procured some cameras towards the end of 2014, and Katete is one of the districts which were earmarked to benefit. An orientation was conducted by the Zambia News and Information Services (ZANIS) Provincial Office in Chipata on 4th February, 2014, to teach the DIOs how to use those cameras effectively. The DIOs, including the one for Katete, collected the cameras after the orientation.
Mr Speaker, Katete has the basic communication equipment that includes a computer, public address equipment and internet service. However, the ministry is working towards giving the district an additional new computer and additional public address equipment as soon as funds are available.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Phiri: Mr Speaker, thank you for the vehicle which you said you repaired. I will see it when I go back to the constituency. When will another computer be given to the ZANIS Office in Katete?

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, the Government has already budgeted for that. We are waiting for the procurement procedures to be completed. Once they are completed, we will provide the computer to the ZANIS Office in Katete District.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister said that they are going to give an additional public address system and computer to the ZANIS Office in Katete. Is the ministry considering the districts without anything before they give additional equipment to places which already have?

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, everything is in place. We intend to equip all districts, including the new ones in the country.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Hamududu (Bweengwa): Mr Speaker, resources are limited. Does hon. Minister not think that they have too many Government news institutions? There is the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC), Zambia News and Information Services (ZANIS), Zambia Daily Mail and the Times of Zambia that sometimes repeat stories …

Mr Shakafuswa: and Zambia Watchdog.

Mr Hamududu: … which is tantamount to wastage. Does the hon. Minister not think that the Government should reduce the number of outlets …

Hon. UPND Member: … and the Daily Nation now.

Mr Hamududu: … so that it can save money and have an efficient ZANIS? For example, the Zambia Daily Mail and Times of Zambia can be merged. By the way, the two institutions owe money to some statutory bodies. What is the ministry doing to downsize and live within the means which it is given by Parliament? 

The Deputy Chairperson: The question was restricted to Katete District. However, if the hon. Minister of Information and Broadcasting has a bonus answer, he is at liberty to provide it.
The Minister of Information and Broadcasting (Mr Kambwili): Mr Speaker, certainly, we are not thinking of merging the Times of Zambia and Zambia Daily Mail. To the contrary, if money allows, we can even open up more media institutions.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, the problem with this country is that propaganda is now at its highest peak. Propaganda is capable of bringing the nation down. If people are informed through responsible press, then they can make informed decisions. Therefore, I do not think it would be reasonable for us to start closing up some media institutions when there is much propaganda in the country.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwila: Hear, hear!

Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, I commend the hon. Minister for actually saying that he would want the nation to be informed properly by opening a lot of media outlets. Can he, in the same vein, assure the nation that the information, which will be given, will be of a balanced nature and not whereby the party in power feels it is bamba zonke, is only there …

The Deputy Chairperson: What does that mean? 

Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, it means, “know it all.” The public media should not just be used to tell people only about what the party in power is doing. In a democracy like Zambia, everyone has to be given equal opportunities to be heard. Can the hon. Minister confirm that we shall move in that direction?

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, the problem with my friend is that he is not able to differentiate between party and Government functionaries. If I issue a statement as the hon. Minister of Information and Broadcasting, it has nothing to do with the Patriotic Front (PF). It is a Government programme.

Mr Mwila: Hear, hear!

Mr Kambwili: Sir, the State-owned newspapers are there to propagate the Government programmes first. When Mr Chama issues a statement on behalf of the PF as a party, that is totally a different affair. I am sure that most of the statements in these newspapers have to do with hon. Government Ministers and Government functionaries.

I thank you, Sir. 
_________
MOTION

ADJOURNMENT

The Vice-President (Mrs Wina): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

Question put and agreed to.

_________

The House adjourned at 1757 hours until 0900 on Friday, 6th March, 2015.