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Debates- Friday, 17th August, 2007
DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE FIRST SESSION OF THE TENTH ASSEMBLY
Friday, 17th August, 2007
The House met at 0900 hours
[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]
NATIONAL ANTHEM
PRAYER
________
BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
The Vice President (Mr R. Banda): Mr Speaker, I rise to give the House some idea of the Business it will consider next week.
On Tuesday, 21st August, 2007, the House will begin with Questions, if there will be any. This will be followed by presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. After that, the House will consider the Second Reading Stage of the National Constitutional Conference Bill, 2007. Thereafter, stages of any other Bills already presented to the House will be dealt with.
On Wednesday, 22nd August 2007, the Business of the House will begin with Questions, if there will be any. This will be followed by presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. Thereafter, the House will consider Private Members Motions, if there will be any. After that, the House will consider the Second Reading of the Fisheries (Amendment) Bill, 2007 and other stages of the Bills already presented.
Mr Speaker, it is my intention on this day to move a motion to suspend the relevant Standing Orders to enable the House to complete all Business on the Order Paper and all matters arising there from and thereafter, enable the House to adjourn sine die.
I thank you, Sir.
________
HIS HONOUR THE VICE-PRESIDENT’S QUESTION TIME
Mr Kapeya (Mpika Central): Mr Speaker, could His Honour the Vice President indicate when the Government will take positive measures to ensure that the railway workshops in Mpika and Kabwe are put in full production of tractor, locomotive and motor vehicle spare parts in order to avoid spare parts of poor quality popularly known as amagon’ga which have flooded the Zambian market.
The Vice-President (Mr R. Banda): Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to answer the question raised by the hon. Member for Mpika Central who is my cousin. The hon. Member would like to know when the Government will take positive steps to ensure that all equipment and the workshop at the railway siding in Mpika will be put in working condition and this includes railway wagons and vehicles.
Sir, this is an important question because, as the hon. Member knows, the workshop at Mpika was in the most impressive condition when it was set up. However, due to the difficulties that the company experienced in terms of business and recapitalisation, there has not been full use of the facilities. I would like to assure him that the Government is taking all the necessary measures to find money to resuscitate the workshop.
Mr Speaker, I would like to inform the House that discussions are going on with various friendly governments to see how we can put the workshop back to its original state.
Sir, as to the reference of equipment being gon’ga, perhaps, he would have to explain that word to hon. Members who do not know the language of the people on the streets. However, I can assure him that we intend to bring in the best equipment possible so that the workshop at Mpika can be operational. We want to ensure that all the equipment is in working condition and that the business will be sustainable.
I thank you, Sir.
Hon. Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Mwangala (Nalolo): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President whether the Government has plans of encouraging companies, Non-governmental Organisations (NGOs) and FDOs to extend their social responsibilities to rural areas.
Mr Speaker, communities in the rural parts of the country …
Mr Speaker: Order! You have already asked your question.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member for Nalolo wants to find out if the Government has any plans to ensure that people living in rural areas are supplied with adequate facilities and developmental plans.
I would like to assure him and I am sure he will agree with me that this Government – for a change instead of the other side (Opposition) pointing at this Government – but this Government here, is committed to all the people living in this country wherever they may be. The Government has put in place measures to ensure that educational facilities are increased through construction of new schools, repairing of old schools, repairing of health centres and all other requirements for uplifting the standards of living for the people in the rural areas.
Mr Speaker, as regards the NGOs, they are already there and they know that the Government is prepared to work with them as long as what they are doing is understood and in line with the policy of this Government which is totally committed to uplifting the lives of the people.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Katuka (Mwinilunga East): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President what measures Government has put in place to monitor the toys that are coming from China which are alleged to have some substance which is poisonous.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, with regard to the measures that the Government is taking on toys coming from China, I think the information on this question is that we have only learnt of it or heard about it from the newspapers and television with regard to the withdrawal of all toys from China in the United States of America. Our Government is naturally concerned with that and as soon as adequate information has been received with regard to these toys, the Government will be in a position to take appropriate measures.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwenzi): Mr Speaker, may I know from His Honour the Vice-President how long a small-scale farmer is supposed to wait from the date the Food Reserve Agency receives his or her maize.
Mr Speaker: Order! The question is defective, but I believe His Honour understands what that means.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, in reply to the hon. Member for Dundumwenzi regarding how long the farmer has to wait before he receives his payments for maize he has delivered. There is no specific answer for that. As soon as monies have reached various provinces and districts, the farmers will be paid.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Sikazwe (Chimbamilonga): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President, how the Government through the Communications Authority is attracting mobile providers like Celtel and MTN, as private companies, to go further in rural areas like in Chimbamilonga Constituency where their services are urgently needed to promote tourism on the Northern Circuit and Nsumbu National Park, in particular. How aggressive is ZAMTEL, through its subsidiary company, as a Government parastatal to implement the President’s repeated rural development policy even after the launch of ICT Policy with all the benefits?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Chimbamilonga for raising this question which I am sure concerns many of our people in rural areas. I would like to start by congratulating ourselves, as a Government, for having made it possible for the three major companies to operate in the field of communications in such a way that, today, any hon. Member here has a chance in one way or another of getting in touch with their constituency and, indeed, the public out there especially in urban areas. They can hear from their villages and their relatives what is happening there by the use of cell phones. This has been made possible by the open policy of this Government and, as I said, I wish to congratulate ourselves for that.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
The Vice-President: Now, the question is on what measures are being taken. May I take advantage of this question, Mr Speaker, to call upon Celtel, MTN and ZAMTEL, the three companies which have made revolutionary strides in our country in terms of communications, to keep in close touch with hon. Members of Parliament here, in particular this Member of Parliament who has shown his devotion to his people by asking this question here…
Laughter
The Vice-President …and I hope his call will be publicised. I hope one of these private companies will take advantage of that and move on to Nsumbu National Park and other parts of his constituency to ensure that they are also able to make calls from the networks which will be set up there. I can assure these companies that every part of this country deserves their attention and eventually they will be happy that they have invested in this, as the people of the Zambia become more affluent and wealthier to be able to use these cell phones.
I thank you once again, hon. Member.
Thank you, Sir.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
Ms Limata (Luampa): Mr Speaker, when will the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) complete the relief exercise in Western Province, in particular, Liuwa, Nalolo, Senanga and Luampa?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I wish to thank, once again, the hon. Member for Luampa for raising this question of relief maize. She and I are very aware of each other’s needs and we have discussed…
Hon. Opposition Member: Where?
The Vice-President: …Oh, do not be suspicious.
Laughter
The Vice-President: She is not my cousin for me to speak so freely. She is my mother.
Laughter
The Vice-President: We have discussed this problem and I can assure the hon. Member for Luampa and all hon. Members here that the Office of the Vice-President does not sleep over this issue. We are currently in very active discussions with the relevant ministries to ensure that funds are released so that we can move on to provide the necessary relief support to the rural and urban provinces, especially to Luampa where we have information that there are problems and relief maize is required or relief supplies are required as soon as possible.
I thank you, Sir.
Ms Chitika (Kawambwa): Mr Speaker, during the burial of the Kawambwa Boys Secondary School pupils who died in a tragic road accident in the Ntumbachushi area, the Government through the then Vice-President, Hon. Lupando Mwape, assured the people of Kawambwa that the Government was going to take care of the survivors as well as construct tomb stones on the graves of the boys. Sir, two years down the line, nothing has happened. I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President what the plans are.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for Kawambwa for reminding us of the tragic and sad accident that took place in that area. I wish to point out to this House that this Government did everything possible at the time of the accident and made sure that these children were taken to the hospitals because they were injured. I understand from my colleagues around that some of them were even taken overseas or taken out of the country for medical treatment. I have not been able to come across records where my predecessor made a commitment that the Government would proceed to look after these people.
Mr Speaker, I think it must be understood by hon. Members of Parliament that these things are happening all over the country at all times and it cannot be correct to expect that the Government, once they have expressed their condolences and given whatever initial support they have done, must also continue to look after these people for the rest of their lives.
I think it would be a difficult commitment to fulfill for the Government to provide even tombstones. Where do the families come in if their children have been involved in accidents and the Government provides tombstones? At what point is the Government expected not to help?
Sir, I would like to inform the hon. Member of Parliament that they have programmes in their constituencies for which funds have been provided in various ways. If they think that such activities fall under some of these projects, they should, therefore, be able to do so. However, I can assure this House that this Government is a caring Government and that it will always work together with hon. Members of Parliament to assist where possible when such accidents take place.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Sichimba (Isoka West): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out when the four schools which were blown off by the heavy rains, namely; Chaswata, Nazareth and Mweleka, will be rehabilitated since the data on the same was submitted through the Office of the District Commissioner to the Office of the Vice-President.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I believe, the Ministry of Education has adequate funds. I recall the hon. Minister of Education, Professor Lungwangwa, referring to funds that have been made available to them in order to repair such schools and to build new ones where they were completely destroyed. With regard to the particular four schools, I wish he had given me notice. I would have been able to give him an exact answer on what has been done.
However, I would like to advise the hon. Member for Isoka West that, as always, my office, together with my colleagues’, is available to him to discuss specific details of how we can solve this problem. If it falls within the ambit of the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU), we will do it. If it does not, we will work together with him to ensure that the appropriate line ministry provides assistance in this regard.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mooya (Moomba): Mr Speaker, I am a very worried soccer fan. I would like to find out His Honour the Vice-President’s position regarding the recruitment of a National Team Coach. It seems that there is confusion as well as division in the Football Association of Zambia (FAZ).
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member for Moomba knows very well that it makes the two of us. I am also a soccer fan like him. We have travelled many times together, and I was one the first Vice-President of FAZ many years ago.
Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!
The Vice-President: Like the majority of Zambians who love soccer, we are definitely dismayed about what appear to be disagreements within FAZ, and that such simple issues as the hiring of a coach can taken so long and made to appear so complicated.
Mr Speaker, may I disclose to this House, with your permission, that like you, I took the liberty to call the FAZ Executive, that is the President, Vice-President and appropriate officials from the Ministry of Sport, Youth and Child Development, into my office, about a month and half ago, to ask them when they intended to hire a coach. This is because all the other countries who are preparing for the forthcoming World Cup in South Africa have already sorted out the issue of a coach. All we hear in our country are different stories from different members of FAZ.
Sir, I would like to take advantage of this question to reiterate or ask the Football Association of Zambia to hear the voice of the representatives of the people of this country that we are concerned about this matter and we hope that they will resolve this problem in good time so that we qualify for the World Cup. What a shame it would be for Zambia if we failed to go next door to South Africa to participate in the forthcoming World Cup. That is my feeling, which is same as the hon. Member of Parliament for Moomba. We hope that they will hear what we have discussed this morning.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mwenya (Nkana): Mr Speaker, despite the flooding of cement on the market, its cost remains very high. Two days ago, in one of the newspapers, Chilanga Cement indicated that cement is supposed to cost K45,000 per pocket. Meanwhile, wherever you go, it is between K70,000 and K89,000. What is the problem or what is the Government doing to normalise the cost of cement because this will affect the performance of our Budget and the construction industry?
Hon. Members: Hear, hear!
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I had sincerely hoped that the disagreements about who should be listened to first would take a bit longer in order to shorten the agony of having to answer questions about which you were not warned.
Laughter
The Vice-President: Sir, I think that this only indicates that there is still not enough cement being produced in the country and that the demand for cement is very high. Therefore, what is happening on the market, which has got its own laws, as usual, is that people get hold of this cement from Chilanga Cement at K45,000 per pocket, and make sure that at the time others cannot get it, they sell it to them at K70,000 per pocket. I hope that with one or two new factories coming on, the price of cement will stabilise in order to assist the construction industry, which seems to be growing as a result of the good policies and management of our resources sourced by the Ministry of Finance and National Planning.
I would like to assure the hon. Member that the Government is very concerned about this, and that we are watching what happens to this pricing very carefully. However, I believe that very shortly, we will have enough cement for the price to remain at the factory price of K45,000 per pocket.
I thank you, Sir.{mospagebreak}
Mr Simama (Kalulushi): Mr Speaker, Zambia had recorded a surplus of 250 metric tonnes of maize, out of which the Government allowed the Food Reserve Agency (FRA) to export 200 metric tonnes and donated 10 metric tonnes to the World Food Programme, remaining with 40 metric tonnes. Is this enough to feed those adversely affected by the floods and other causes? What measures has the Government put in place in case we have droughts this year?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member for Kalulushi would like to find out what happens in case of a drought. Do we have enough resources? I am assuming that is the meaning of his question. I can assure the hon. Member that there is an adequate supply in the country to ensure that whatever happens, there will be enough food in the country. Production that is yet to come in and production from the last season shows us that there is enough maize and we should not worry about that particular problem.
With regard to the sale, I think that it is only prudent that the Food Reserve Agency should sell. Otherwise, they would reserve stocks which are in excess of our requirement.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Tembo (Nyimba): Mr Speaker, when will the Government complete the electrification of Chief Ndake’s Palace?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, we are discussing this matter with the hon. Member who has been very concerned about it. The other day, I had a chance to meet Chief Ndake who is a former Member of this House and I assured him that the Government would, as soon as possible, attend to the electrification of Nyimba and the palace in particular.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi): Mr Speaker, the President was in Malaysia a few weeks ago and I would like to find out whether he took some time to bargain for the Zambian who has been sentenced to death in Malaysia.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, the President was in Malaysia and I think that the country the hon. Member and my cousin across has in mind is Singapore. Unfortunately, the President was not in Singapore and, therefore, it was difficult for him to do what we all would have expected him to do, but …
Mr Mukanga: He should have passed through.
The Vice-President: No, he did not have to pass through there. I am sure the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, in its normal way, is handling this matter. I wish to assure this House that this Government is always concerned when any citizen of this country find him/herself in a situation as the one in which this particular young lady has found herself.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Chimbaka (Bahati): Mr Speaker, can His Honour the Vice-President state the position of the Government with regard to the deteriorating standards in the Railways Systems of Zambia, especially that the Southern Africa Development Community (SADC) is considering infrastructure development?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Bahati and wish to assure him that the appropriate ministry is handling that question.
I thank you, Sir.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, Hear!
Mr Speaker: The Chair did not see the red light.
Laughter
______________
QUESTIONS
MONEY RAISED BY ZCCM INVESTMENTS HOLDINGS PLC. FROM COBALT
850. Mr D. Mwila (Chipili) asked the Minister of Mines and Minerals Development:
(a) how much money was raised by ZCCM Investments Holdings Plc. from cobalt price participation fees from 2003 to 2005; and
(b) how the money at (a) above was spent.
The Deputy Minister of Mines and Minerals Development (Mr M. Mwale): Mr Speaker, a total of US$34,298,242 was raised by ZCCM Investments Holdings from cobalt price participation fees from 2003 to 2005 broken down as follows:
Year Amount in US$
2003 Nil
2004 2,989,516
2005 31,308,726
Total 34,298,242
With regard to part (b) of the question, the money formed part of the income received by ZCCM Investments Holdings which was used to make the following payments:
Item 2003 (US$) 2004 (US$) 2005 (US$)
Trust Fund (payment 1,083,771 3,702,967 2,697,434
towards terminal benefits
of mine workers who
either resign or are
retrenched)
House Refunds (sale of 205,557 144,861 341,212
houses to miners)
Cadastral surveys Nil 339,963 516,858
Legal expenses 327,032 198,661 841,044
Payment to Chimanga Changa Nil 3,459,717 Nil
(outstanding debt for
supplying mealie-meal
to ZCCM before
privatisation)
Environmental expenses not Nil 592,843 36,742
funded by loan
Mukuba Pension Fund Nil Nil 1,755,124
deficit
Operation costs (not 1,704,246 1,319,66 1,926,291
including personnel
Expenses)
Total 3,320,608 9,758,675 8,114,708
The balance of US$13,104,251 from US$34,298,242 which was raised as cobalt price participation fees from 2003 to 2005 was carried over to 2006.
Mr Speaker, the House may wish to know that since then, one of the major items of expenditure by ZCCM Investments Holdings Plc. has been associated with Maamba Collieries Limited. Maamba Collieries Limited has, to date, found it difficult to raise money to pay salaries to its workers. The ZCCM Investments Holdings Plc. has provided US$4.3 million to help in paying salaries and clearing other company liabilities.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister the percentage that the Government gets once cobalt is sold and if there are any plans to review this percentage, especially that cobalt is now at US$62,000 per tonne.
Mr Speaker: Have I not seen a question on this matter on the Order Paper? May I advise hon. Members not to anticipate questions that have been submitted for oral answer. In any case, I am not certain if the question he is asking is related to the question currently on the Floor.
Are you able to answer it hon. Minister?
The Minister of Mines and Minerals Development (Dr Mwansa): Mr Speaker, if I got the question correctly, the hon. Member wants to know when we are going to increase our participation in the pricing of cobalt because, according to him, the price is very high. I want to say that participation in pricing of cobalt depends on two factors. These are the price of cobalt and the agreements signed, in terms of how the computation should be done.
The price of cobalt has been fluctuating from 2003, when it was only US$8.40 to 2005 when it was US$12 a pound. Therefore, the price determines how much we should get, but what is also important is to know what the formula is regarding this participation. In the case of Konkola Copper Mines Plc (KCM), the price participation is computed at five per cent of the revenue from cobalt sold at a trigger price of US$7.50.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Speaker: My guidance was right however, the hon. Member for Chipili was also right to ask the follow-up question.
Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi): Mr Speaker, according to the hon. Minster, the Government has used about US$4.3 million on Maamba Collieries. I would like to know what the balance of the money was used for.
Dr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, ZCCM Investment Holdings is an investment wing of the Government and it has various expenses of its own. It has capital and current expenses as well as obligations to its workforce and that of Maamba Collieries. Those are some of the areas on which the money was spent.
I thank you, Sir.
Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Mr Speaker, considering the amounts of money that have been spent over the years that the hon. Deputy Minister read out, only US$4.3 million was used at Maamba Collieries and he said that there were investment commitments, which he has not talked about. Is he saying that all the revenue is only used on wages by this company? How are they using it for the benefit of Zambia?
Dr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, ZCCM Investment Holdings is a successor company of the Zambia Consolidated Copper Mines Ltd (ZCCM that had so many obligations some of which are still being met by ZCCM Investment Holdings. There were workers’ obligations that were left by ZCCM and are now a responsibility of ZCCM Investment Holdings.
There are also obligations arising from environmental liabilities that were also inherited from ZCCM as well as those arising from investment in the new companies such as the purchasing of shares in a green-field, which is Lumwana Copper Mines. About US$30 million was spent on purchasing shares in Lumwana Copper Mines that are now worth US$100 million. Therefore, the investment by ZCCM in Lumwana Copper Mines was a very good one.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Milupi (Luena): Mr Speaker, Zambian’s participation, by way of equity, in mining companies is through ZCCM Investment Holdings. When does the hon. Minister expect Zambia to start getting dividends from these companies instead of money that goes into ZCCM Investment Holdings being used solely for operational costs?
Mr Speaker: There is a question on this in the pipeline, but you can anticipate it.
Dr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, there is a question coming which is number 854, asked by Hon. Mwila. Maybe we should wait for that.
I thank you, Sir.{mospagebreak}
DISPOSAL OF DAMAGED AND FADED BANK NOTES
851. Mr Ntundu (Gwembe) asked the Minister of Finance and National Planning:
(a) how damaged and faded bank notes were disposed of by the Bank of Zambia;
(b) how transparent the exercise at (a) was; and
(c) how the Bank ensured that staff in the disposal section did not take some bank notes for their personal use.
The Deputy Minister of Finance and National Planning (Mr Shakafuswa): Mr Speaker, I wish to respond to the question raised by Hon. Ntundu as follows:
(a) the Bank of Zambia removes from circulation damaged and/or faded banknotes through a destruction process called briquetting. Once the Bank of Zambia has verified and categorisied banknotes as unfit (that is, being soiled, damaged or faded), such banknotes are then cancelled and thereafter briquetted or shredded.
The canceling of banknotes involves cutting-off sections of the notes by machine rendering them unusable. The banknotes are then set aside for total destruction through the briquetting process mentioned above. This process involves the shredding of the banknotes and the formation of briquettes in the form of bricks, the size of a small red brick. This enables easy transportation to the designated disposal site in accordance with the guidelines set by the Environmental Council of Zambia;
(b) Sir, the process of disposing of unfit banknotes is transparent in that it has several controls in place that are subject to audit. Some of these controls include the segregation of duty between authorisation of destruction, custody of unfit banknotes and verification of details pertaining to all the unfit and cancelled banknotes;
(c) in order to ensure that staff in the disposal section do not take some notes for their personal use, the Central Bank has put in place internal controls at every stage of the destruction process. Among the controls are the following:
(i) all the bank notes classified as unfit and removed from circulation are cancelled under the supervision of two officers.
(ii) all the cancelled bank notes are checked and verified before being packed, sealed and locked away;
(iii) there are always two destruction officers for dual control processes who perform the activities of ensuring the destruction of the cancelled bank notes;
(iv) at the end of every destruction or briquetting process, the briquetting machine will automatically generate an activity report; and
(v) the Internal Audit Department produces regular detailed reports on the destruction of bank notes.
Mr Speaker, I thank you.
Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, to make this exercise more transparent, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether there are any plans for the Government in the future to invite interested members of the public to witness the disposal of notes as is the case in some countries.
Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, we had that consideration before, but because we have adequate controls, we could not consider it further.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Imenda (Lukulu East): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning appreciates the fact that the printing of the notes was a bad job. That being the case, what remedial measures were put in place with regard to the breach of contract?
Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, the question the hon. Member is asking is not related to the question on the Floor. What we are talking about are notes that have been identified in circulation as damaged, which are removed. He is talking about the printing of polymer notes that were fading. This was also answered adequately in this House
In this instance, we are talking about notes that come into circulation at any time and that are regularly removed and destroyed so that they do not re-enter circulation.
I thank you, Sir.
KWACHA DENOMINATION IN CIRCULATION
852. Mr Ntundu asked the Minister of Finance and National Planning how much of the following Zambian Kwacha denominations were currently in circulation:
(i) K50,000;
(ii) K20,000
(iii) K10,000
(iv) K5,000;
(v) K1,000
(vi) K500;
(vii) K100;
(viii) K50; and
(ix) K20.
Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, by 30th April, 2007, the amounts of each denomination of the Zambian Kwacha in circulation were as follows:
(i) K50,000 K587.0 billion
(ii) K20,000 K383.0 billion
(iii) K10,000 K92.7 billion
(iv) K5,000 K43.9 billion
(v) K1,000 K19.9 billion
(vi) K500 K16.0 billion
(vii) K100 K6.4 billion
(viii) K50 K2.9 billion
(ix) K20 K0.7million
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether the Government has any plans to introduce a bigger denomination of the K100,000 note?
Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, at the moment, the Government has no plans to introduce K100,000 notes, as the denominations we are using are adequate.
I thank you, Sir.
Mrs Kapata (Mandevu): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister when the Government is going to withdraw the K20 note from the market that has no value?
Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, when you say K20, it is a value. There are services that will need change of a K20 note. Therefore, so we shall not withdraw it.
I thank you, Sir.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Milupi (Luena): Mr Speaker, countries like Mozambique removed three zeros from their currency to make cash more manageable. Do we have any plans to remove some zeros from our currency so that we can carry fewer notes when we go about our business?
Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, one of the paths on the back of the Zambian Government has been that we have had very good fiscal regulation of our economy. As it is, there are no plans for us to remove any zeros because we are within the SADC range of managing the economy. Since our economic indicators and the monitory policy are in place, we have no intentions to do so.
I thank you, Sir.
Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Mr Speaker, the figures that the hon. Deputy Minister was giving indicated that for K20,000 notes, we have in circulation K383 billion. When we come to K20 it is talking about only K0.7 million. This would show that this currency is not really being used. Does this not support the issue raised by the hon. Member of Parliament for Mandevu who said that this currency is irrelevant, taking into consideration its small percentage of what is in circulation now?
Mr Shakafuswa: Mr Speaker, our learned doctor would know that as the economy improves, even a small denomination currency will have value. Therefore, you will find a situation whereby you might need change of this denomination.
Mr Speaker, very soon, we might introduce tollgates where you have to pay a K20. Therefore, as already shown by this Government, the economy is improving and with the improved economic activities, we might introduce services that might need smaller denominations. So, we need the smaller denominations.
I thank you, Sir.
TERMINAL BENEFITS FOR LAID-OFF WORKERS AT MAAMBA COLLIERIES
853. Mr D. Mwila asked the Minister of Mines and Minerals Development:
(a) when terminal benefits would be paid to former employees of Maamba Collieries laid off in 2003;
(b) how many employees were laid off and how many had been paid their terminal benefits so far; and
(c) how much it would cost to pay all the affected workers.
Mr M. Mwale: Mr Speaker, the House may wish to know that there were no employees who were laid off by Maamba Collieries Ltd in 2003.
Based on the answer given to the question listed in (a), it therefore follows, that no terminal benefits would be paid out because there were no employees that were laid off in 2003.
Further, there will be no terminal benefits to be paid out because the company did not lay off any employees in 2003. However, the House may wish to know that attritions through normal retirement, natural waste and medical discharge take place. The benefits are paid by ZCCM-IH as and when the funds are available.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, I want to find out why Maamba Collieries has stopped paying the mentioned employees their monthly salaries when they have not been paid their benefits. By law, they are supposed to continue getting their salaries whilst waiting for the terminal benefits.
Dr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, before we respond to that, I want to appreciate the tremendous interest hon. Mwila continues to show in Maamba Collieries. Only last week we answered an urgent question on Maamba Collieries and this one is the fourth question on the same from him alone. We want to appreciate that.
I want to say that we are not aware that, in fact, Maamba is not paying workers who had been laid off but have not been paid their terminal benefits. If there is any specific number of workers, please let us know, and we can make a follow up on that one.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
REVENUE AND SHAREHOLDING IN ZCCM - IH
854. Mr D. Mwila asked the Minister of Mines and Minerals Development:
(a) how much dividend was declared to ZCCM Investment Holdings Plc by the following companies:
(i) Mopani Copper Mines Plc;
(ii) Konkola Copper Mines Plc;
(iii) Chambeshi Metals Plc;
(iv) Luanshya Copper Mines Ltd;
(v) Bwana Mkubwa Mining Ltd; and
(vi) Copperbelt Energy Corporation Plc;
(b) how the revenue at (a) above was spent;
(c) whether ZCCM Investment Holdings Plc had plans to review the shareholding structure in the companies at (a) above and, if so, when; and
(d) what the current financial status of ZCCM Investments Holdings Plc was.
Mr M. Mwale: Mr Speaker, a total of US$8,359,900 was declared by ZCCM-IH as dividend between 2004 and 2005 broken down as follows:
Company 2004 2005
(US$) (US$)
Copperbelt Energy Corporation 3,800,000 4,559,900
During the period under review, the five mining companies did not declare dividends to the Government because they did not make profits. It is only recently that mining companies started making profits following the increase in the copper prices on the world market.
Mr Speaker, revenue from both price participation and dividends is treated as income for ZCCM-IH and is pooled together. The money during the period in question, 2004 and 2005, was spent as in question 850, that is payments towards trust funds, house refunds, cadastral surveys, legal expenses, Mukuba Pension Fund and other liabilities carried over from ZCCM Ltd.
ZCCM – IH is working out proposals to review the shareholding structure in the companies mentioned earlier. The Government, being the majority shareholder of ZCCM – IH, will consider the proposals which will be submitted before the end of 2007.
ZCCM – IH’s audited accounts for 2004/5 have been published and show a profit of K133,888,000 largely due to the receipt of cobalt and copper price participation fees amounting to K147,529,000,000.
Audited accounts for 2005/6 and 2006/7 will be concluded and published before the end of September, 2007.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, looking at the companies mentioned, there is no chief accountant who is a Zambian. What mechanism has ZCCM-IH put in place to ensure that we get the correct amounts?
Dr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, declaration of dividends does not necessarily depend on having an indigenous accountant. ZCCM-Investment Holdings is a shareholder in these companies and also sits on the boards of all these companies and decisions of dividends are made in the board meetings.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Chongo (Mwense): Mr Speaker, part of the revenue that was realised by these companies was spent on capital projects just to try to hide the profits so that they run away from paying dividends. What is the ministry doing to correct that situation?
Dr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, my deputy answered this ably by saying that prior to 2004, many mining companies did not make any profits. The period before 2004 was characterised by two things, namely acquisition of machinery and rehabilitation of old equipment. Therefore, there was not much production during that period.
In some cases, the period was characterised by acquisition of new mines, as was the case with the KCM acquisition of Anglo-American Corporation assets.
The House may wish to know that since the period around June, 2007, KCM, in fact, declared a dividend of K2.4 million to the Government. This was the period after the period in the question which was 2004 to 2005. So, KCM declared a dividend this year, in 2007, and that is most welcome.
Mr Milupi (Luena): Mr Speaker, first of all, since there is Copperbelt Energy Corporation, I can declare interest. I am a shareholder and a board member of that company.
However, is ZCCM-Investment Holdings the right vehicle to hold Government shares in view of the fact that we now have sustained high prices and more mines coming on? When is the Government going to start getting dividends out of this company and pay those shares directly instead of paying through this vehicle?
Dr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, we have full confidence in ZCCM-IH as a vehicle for the Government’s participation in the mining industry and we have no intention of departing from that.
I thank you, Sir.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
CHIEFS’ PALACES IN GWEMBE
855. Mr Ntundu (Gwembe) asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing:
(a) when the Government would rehabilitate the chiefs’ palaces in Gwembe District, which are in a dilapidated state;
(b) when the chiefs’ retainers in Gwembe District would be provided with uniforms; and
(c) when the Government would revise upwards the salaries for the chiefs’ retainers.
The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr Kazonga): Mr Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that there is no provision in this year’s budget for the rehabilitation of chiefs’ palaces in Gwembe or any other district in Zambia.
Mr Speaker, following the approval, by Parliament, of the 2007 Budget, my ministry will procure retainers’ uniforms that will be provided to retainers in Gwembe and in some other districts where the uniforms have not been provided.
Sir, chiefs’ retainers are employees of the Government and each time civil servants’ salaries are increased, their salaries are also increased. This means that Chiefs’ Retainers will also receive 16 per cent salary increment effective 1st April, 2007.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, arising from the answer that has been given by the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing, is he confirming to this House that the chiefs’ palaces in Gwembe will never ever be rehabilitated?
Mr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, what I said in my response is that we have no provision in this year’s budget as a result of our not having a policy on chiefs’ issues. Therefore, as we have responded to similar questions in the past, this is the responsibility of subjects. Therefore, I would encourage the hon. Member of Parliament to talk to the subjects in Gwembe to assist in rehabilitating those palaces. Once we have finished our development of the policy for the chiefs, some of these issues will be tackled through that policy. Right now, we are still consulting. As you are aware, policy development is quite long. Once we have finished, I am sure some of these important aspects that have arisen from most of the questions here will be taken into consideration.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Dr Kalumba (Chienge): Mr Speaker, in view of the very significant role that chiefs play in our national system of governance, is it convenient for the Government to revisit the policy on chiefs’ palaces?
Mr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, we do recognise the role of our traditional leaders. In this case, the chiefs, especially in as far as development is concerned, are our partners in development. As such, as I indicated, we are in the process of developing the Chiefs Policy, which will capture their important role in the development of this nation. Once we have finalised, most of these aspects will be captured and their role will be reinforce and even improved upon. We just have to be a bit patient. Once Cabinet has approved the Chiefs Policy, later on, most of these things will be implemented to ensure that our traditional leaders are really looked after properly so that they can assist in developing our country.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
ZAMBIA POLICE BICYCLE FACILITY
856. Mr Ntundu asked the Minister of Home Affairs:
(a) how many police stations country-wide benefited from the Zambia Police bicycle facility;
(b) how the bicycles were allocated, station by station;
(c) whether the Government would pay for the maintenance of the bicycles;
(d) whether the Government had carried out an inspection to confirm the existence of the bicycles at police stations; and
(e) whether the facility was still available.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, in 2003, a total of 276 bicycles were allocated to police stations/posts country-wide. Subsequently, the number of stations/posts which benefited from the Zambia Police bicycle facility were eighty-one.
The allocation of the bicycles, station by station, as recorded by the Zambia Police Headquarters, is as follows:
(i) Lusaka Division (Province): Four bicycles were received and all were allocated to Shimabala Police Station.
(ii) Copperbelt Division (Province): Twenty-four bicycles were received and allocated as below:
Station/Post No. of Bicycles
Kitwe District 1
Kalulushi 1
Chati Police Post 1
Ndola District 1
Masala 1
Kansenshi 1
Chifubu 1
Kang’onga 1
Chingola Direct 1
Chililabombwe 1
Nchanga 1
Chiwempala 1
Chingola Central 1
Mufulira Central 1
Kamuchanga 1
Mokambo 1
Kansuswa 1
Butondo 1
Luanshya Central 1
Roan 1
Mpatamato 1
Masaiti 1
Mpongwe 1
(iii) Luapula Division (Province):
Station/Post No. of Bicycles
Victim Support Unit 12
Criminal Investigation Department (CID) 4
Chipili 13
Chifunabuli 13
(iv) Western Division (Province):
Station/Post No. of Bicycles
Senaga 4
Namushakende 1
Sefula 1
Lealui 1
Mabumbu 1
Kaoma 10
Mongu 3
Kalabo 2
Sikongo 11
Shang’ombo 4
Lukulu 6
Senanga 6
(v) Eastern Division (Province):
Station/Post No. of Bicycles
Petauke 10
Chipata 21
Katete 9
Lundazi 2
Sinda 8
Nyimba 1
(vi) Southern Division (Province):
Station/Post No. of Bicycles
Livingstone Police 5
Pemba Police 17
Gwembe Police 20
(vii) Northern Division (Province):
Station/Post No. of Bicycles
Mporokoso 1
Kasama 10
Mungwi 1
Mbala 10
Mpulungu 2
Nakonde 1
Isoka 1
Chinsali 1
Mpika 1
Luwingu 10
Central Division (Province)
Station/Post No. of Bicycles
Chisamba Post 4
Chisamba turn-off 1
Mobile Unit 1
Chipembi 1
Munamo farm Post 1
North-Western Division (Province)
Station/Post No. of Bicycles
Solwezi 1
Mwinilunga 1
Zambezi 1
Kabompo 1
Mufumbwe 1
Chavuma 1
Jimbe 1
Maheba 1
Mutanda 1
Kakolokolo 1
St. Dorothy 1
Chawama (post) 2
Mr Speaker, it should be noted that most Members of Parliament participated in the collection and distribution of bicycles at the time.
Mr Speaker, the Government pays for the maintenance of the bicycles through the respective Zambia Police Divisions.
Further, the Government has not carried an inspection to confirm the existence of the bicycles at police stations. However, each respective police division keeps an inventory of the number of bicycles they received, and how many of them are still running.
Mr Speaker, the bicycle facility has since been discontinued.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, this was a very good initiative by the police, but now, I am wondering why this exercise has been discontinued. I would also like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President whether, if there is no money for this facility, the Government is willing to give the bicycles to the police officers on loan so that they can execute their duties.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I think that this is definitely a good proposal by the hon. Member of Parliament for the Police Service, and I am sure that the Ministry of Home Affairs will consider it and be able to show in their next budget, if they can actually give these bicycles on loan to the policemen.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, I heard His Honour the Vice-President say that fifteen bicycles were given to Chipili. I would like to find out whether the Government has ever carried out an audit to check and ensure that the bicycles were used for the intended purpose.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, we did say that we have not conducted an audit, but perhaps the hon. Member of Parliament, through his counterpart at Chipili, can check and find out whether the bicycles were actually received, and come back to this House with specific information to tell us. It looks like he knows something about it.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Hon. Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}
GOVERNMENT MEASURES TO ERADICATE HUNGER IN CHIEF NABWALYA’S AREA
857. Mr Malama (Mfuwe) asked the Vice-President what measures the Government had taken to eradicate hunger in Chief Nabwalya’s area.
The Deputy Minister in the Vice-President’s Office (Ms Lundwe): Mr Speaker, the proposed reply to Question 857 is as follows: …
Mr Speaker: Order! Is that the reply or the proposed reply?
Ms Lundwe: It is the reply.
Laughter
Mr Lundwe: Mr Speaker, the proposed reply to the question …
Hon. Members: Aah!
Hon. Member: The reply.
Ms Lundwe: Oh sorry. The reply to the question asked by the hon. ...
Hon. Members: Hear, hear!
Hon. Member: Quality!
Ms Lundwe: Mr Speaker, a number of measures has been put in place by the Government to reduce hunger in Chief Nabwalya’s area. Some of these measures are specific and aim to reduce food insecurity while others are of a general nature with the aim of developing the area, and thereby help to reduce food insecurity.
Mr Speaker, among the direct and specific measures to reduce food insecurity are:
(a) provision of the Food Security Pack to vulnerable, but viable farmers in the years when funding has been adequate. This pack includes, agricultural inputs;
(b) established the Fertiliser Support Programme where fertiliser and maize seed are provided at subsidised prices. However, the demand in Chief Nabwalya’s area is low, as farmers there believe the soils there are rich enough and the major crop, sorghum, does not need fertilisers;
(c) promotion and supply of specific varieties of seed and cuttings of suitable varieties, including maize MMV 400, POOLS 6, GV 412,SC 403, and ZM 421. Sorghum, Kuyuma variety, cassava, Nalumino, Bangweulu and Kapumba sweet potato, Chingomva, Zambezi and Luangwa are drought tolerant crops;
(d) facilitated Micro-Bankers Trust to empower communities with Micro-Finance for production;
(e) established Public Welfare Assistance Scheme to vulnerable communities with some means of support, including food, clothing and school requirements for children; and
(f) the Government, through the Ministry of Agriculture and Co-operatives, has established a number of demonstration plots to promote drought tolerant crops.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr Malama: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President if the Government has plans to create community farms within the chiefdom, and protect them from wild animals that cause hunger to the people of Chief Nabwalya, and also, whether His Honour the Vice-President is aware that the people of Chief Nabwalya do not receive any fertiliser.
The Vice-President (Mr R. Banda): Mr Speaker, as far as I know, there are no such plans. However, that does not mean that those plans should not be made together with the hon. Member of Parliament from the constituency to the Government. With regard to fertiliser, I think that my colleague, who read the reply, pointed out that the reasons for not providing fertiliser support is that the soils are adequately fertile and do not require fertiliser.
I thank Mr Speaker.
Mr Chisala (Chilubi): Mr Speaker, could His Honour the Vice-President state the long term measures that he intends to put in place with a view to eradicating hunger, which has been looming for too long a period in the country.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member who asked if I have any plans to eradicate hunger. Of course, I have a great wish to eradicate hunger, but this wish is for us all as a Government. And because it is a new question, I would like him to be satisfied with the reply that I have given.
I thank you, Sir.
Ms Kapata (Mandevu): Mr Speaker, I would like to ask His Honour the Vice-President why the Government only gives relief food to rural constituencies, considering the fact that there is more hunger in the urban constituencies.
Ms Lundwe: Mr Speaker, I am sure the hon. Member of Parliament knows that relief is meant for the farmers who are vulnerable. Therefore, most vulnerable farmers are in rural areas, not in urban areas.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Kanyanyamina (Kanchibiya): Mr Speaker, it is a well known fact that this Government struggles hard to deliver services. Why can this Government not give solar fences like they have done to the animals in the North Luangwa to protect the people of Nabwalya’s crops and their lives?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I am not quite aware of any solar fences that have been provided to animals. However, it is important that we, as representatives of the people, understand that it is the duty of the Government to protect both the people and the animals. We should not always assume animals are not important to the people. These animals, which are in areas where many of us come from, provide resources through tourism, employment and in some cases, food for our people. Therefore, this way of addressing issues to do with animals and comparing them with human beings as if one is less important than the other is not good. It is the decision of human beings that there should be animal reserves for the purposes which I have just stated.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr Kapeya (Mpika Central): Mr Speaker, hunger in Nabwalya has persisted for some time now. We have been told by the hon. Minister that solar has been over used in the same area. What could be the permanent solution to this issue?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, there is no policy to ban fertiliser in any part of the country. It is the people in those areas who should indicate whether they require fertiliser or not. Therefore, if there is a need for fertiliser in your constituency or the area that the hon. Member is asking about, make a request for it. I am sure you it will be provided.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
WORK STOPPAGE AT LUANSHYA COPPER MINES IN MARCH, 2007
858. Mr D. Mwila (Chipili) asked the Minister Mines and Minerals Development:
(a) what led to the work stoppage at Luanshya Copper Mines in March, 2007; and
(b) how much money was lost during the work stoppage.
The Deputy Minister of Mines and Minerals Development (Mr M. Mwale): Mr Speaker, I would like to inform the House that Luanshya Copper Mines employees staged a work stoppage from 1st to 6th March, 2007 after they were briefed by the Mine Workers Union of Zambia (MUZ) on the progress made on the negotiations for the 2007 Collective Agreement. The employees were dissatisfied with the proposed offer of 20 per cent increase in basic salary and consequently, went on strike as they wanted a higher increment.
Mr Speaker, approximately US $1,500,000 was lost during the work stoppage.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, the work stoppage happened during the negotiations period. I would like to find out from the hon. Minister of Mines and Minerals Development whether there was any violation to the recognition of the agreement by any party to the agreement, union or management, because there are some employees who have been summarily dismissed.
Dr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, we are not aware that there was any violation. What we know is that following the work stoppage, workers went back to work because they agreed on 22 per cent salary increment and improved conditions of service.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
MITIGATION OF THE HUNGER SITUATION IN WESTERN PROVINCE
859. Mr Mwapela (Kalabo Central) asked the Vice-President what long-term measures were being taken to mitigate the hunger situation in the Western Province.
Ms Lundwe: Mr Speaker, I wish to inform the House that the Government has put both short-term and long-term measures to mitigate hunger and poverty among the farming communities, including those in the Western Province. Among the direct and specific measures the Government is implementing to reduce food insecurity are the following:
(a) the Fertiliser Support Programme – this involves the supply of agricultural inputs (fertiliser and maize seed at a subsidised rate or reduced prices). At the beginning of every agricultural season, since 2002, the Government, through the Ministry of Agriculture and Co-operatives (MACO), has been distributing subsidised fertiliser and maize seed, under the Fertiliser Support Programme, to small-scale farmers in all the districts of the Western Province;
(b) the Government, through the Ministry of Agriculture and Co-operatives, is supporting the production and marketing of cashew nuts in the Western Province through Cashew Nut Out-grower Schemes. This is aimed at increasing incomes of cashew nut growers to enable them access food;
(c) the Food Security Pack – this involves the distribution of agricultural inputs, through the Programme Against Malnutrition (PAM), namely; maize, millet and sorghum seeds to the vulnerable, but viable farmers;
(d) through the support of the European Union (EU), the Ministry of Agriculture and Co-operatives has started implementing a four-year project called, “Support to Agricultural Diversification and Food Security Project” in the Western and North-Western provinces. The project is aimed at improving food security i.e. reducing food shortages through agricultural diversification, improved extension services and increased incomes for small-scale farmers;
(e) the Micro-Bankers Trust to empower communities with micro-finance for production; and
(f) the Public Welfare Assistance Scheme to vulnerable communities with means of support, including food, clothing and school requirements for children.
In addition, the Government has put in place other measures including:
(i) Animal Disease Control through procurement and administration of vaccines on livestock in the districts that are prone to outbreaks of animal diseases;
(ii) Livestock Restocking in areas or districts where livestock has been depleted due to livestock diseases; and
(iii) Winter Crop Growing (Food Security Pack Programme) as a medium-term intervention to increase food production in areas that have access to wet lands.
Mr Speaker, furthermore, in the Fifth National Development Plan, the Government has placed priority on irrigation, conservation farming and encouragement of private sector participation in the development of cash crops industry such as cashew nuts as a long-term measure to enhancing food security, household incomes and agricultural productivity in general.
Mr Speaker, I thank you.
Mr Mwapela: Mr Speaker, point of correction Hon. Deputy Minister, I am Hon. Mwapela and not Hon. Ntundu.
Laughter
Mr Mwapela: Can His Honour the Vice-President tell this House when he is going to send food to the Western Province?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, this is an on-going programme, we are just trying to identify the exact places where we should take food. Very shortly, we should be taking food to the Western Province.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Sinyinda (Senanga): Mr Speaker, I was very excited early this year when the Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives announced that the Western and North-Western provinces were going to benefit from the fifteen million Euros for restocking. People in the Western Province depend on animals in for food production. When is this restocking beginning?
This Government has already announced and committed itself that fifteen million Euros has already been found to actually restock animals in the North-Western and Western provinces.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, it is true that there is really a problem of animal disease in the Western and North-Western provinces. We have been informed by our specialist that this problem is being attended to from the cause level.
In other words, they are trying to protect the animals in the two provinces from the diseases coming in through the borders. After that has been contained, the restocking programme will start. If we restock before this, the animals will get infected and we shall lose them again as was the case in Kaoma and one or two other districts.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Muntanga (Kalomo): Mr Speaker, arising from the answer given by the Vice-President the hunger situation in Kalabo is similar to that in Nabwalya’s area which indicates a very serious failure of the agriculture arrangement and extension. Could the Vice-President clarify whether the diversification of agriculture has failed since areas such as the Western Province that depended on cassava are now crying of hunger? Could we get clarification on whether or not diversification has failed?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I would not go as far as what the hon. Member by saying that diversification has failed. The hon. Member knows very well the main reason we are talking about hunger not only in the Western Province, but also in many parts of the country.
In this particular year, we have had climatic conditions which destroyed even what was a stabilising factor like winter crops etc. The crops that were grown on the river banks were all swept away by water as a result of the floods while min his province there was unexpected drought. Therefore, we should not conclude that the crop diversification has failed because there is a demand for food across the country. We all know that and we have been united in dealing with that programme.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Speaker: Order!
Business was suspended from 1045 hours until 1100 hours.
HOUSE IN COMMITTEE
[THE DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES in the
Chair]
THE ANTI-TERRORISM BILL, 2007
CLAUSE 1 – (Short title)
Mr Kakoma: On a point of order.
The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.
Mr Kakoma: Mr Chairperson, the Standing Orders of this House, Order No. 115 (1) requires that anybody making amendments to any Bill must give twenty-four hours notice. The Hon. Minister of Justice only gave his amendments at 1600 hours yesterday and has not yet clocked twenty-four hours.
Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Kakoma: Will this House be making a correct procedural process by considering amendments that have not yet clocked twenty-four hours? I need your serious ruling.
Mr Chizhyuka: Hear, hear!
The Deputy Chairperson: Let me seize this opportunity to read Standing Order No. 115 (1) which says:
‘Members desiring to have proposed amendments to Bills placed upon the Order Paper must hand them, fairly written and signed by them, to the Clerk or deliver them at his/her office not later than 14:30 hours on the day before that on which they are so to appear.’
So these amendments were delivered to the office of the Clerk yesterday at 13:30 hours, so it is in order.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}
Interruptions
Clause 1 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 2 – (Interpretation)
The Minister of Justice (Mr Kunda): Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 2,
(a) on page 6, after line 8 by the insertion of the following new definition:
“authorised officer” means-
(i) a police officer;
(ii) a customs officer;
(iii) an immigration officer;
(iv) an army officer;
(v) an intelligence officer;
(vi) an officer from the Drug Enforcement Commission; or
(vii) any person appointed as such in writing by the Minister; and
(b) on page 8
(i) after line 30 by the insertion immediately after clause (2) of the following new subclause:
(3) Any protest, demonstration or stoppage of work shall not be considered as a terrorist act if the act is not intended to result in any serious bodily harm to a person, damage to property, endanger a person’s life or create a risk to human health or public safety.; and
(ii) in line 31 by the renumbering of sub-clause (3) as sub-clause (4); and
(c) on page 9, in lines 8 and 15 by the renumbering of sub-clauses (4) and (5) as subclauses (5) and (6), respectively.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 2, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clauses 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13 and 14 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 15 – (Causing Damage to Public Place, Facility, etc.)
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 15, on page 12 in lines 30 and 33, by the deletion of the word “injury” and the substitution therefor of the word “harm”.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 15, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clauses 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22 and 23 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 24 – (Co-operation with Police)
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in
Clause 24, on page 17, after line 38
(a) by the insertion immediately after sub-clause (4) of the following new sub-clauses:
(5) A person shall not be subject to any liability for making a disclosure in accordance with this Act and no action, claim or demand shall be taken, made against or of, the person for making the disclosure.
(6) This section has effect despite any duty of secrecy or confidentiality or any other restriction on disclosure, whether or not imposed by any written law, applicable to a person.
(7) Any person who makes a disclosure in accordance with this Act –
(a) has a defence of absolute privilege in respect of the publication to the authorised officer of the disclosure in proceedings for defamation;
(b) on whom a provision of any written law, other than this Act, imposes a duty to maintain confidentiality with respect to any information disclosed is taken not to have committed an offence against that written law;
(c) who is subject to an obligation by way of oath, rule of law or practice to maintain confidentiality with respect to the disclosure, is taken not to have breached the oath, rule of law or practice or a law relevant to the oath, rule or practice; and
(d) is not liable to disciplinary action because of the disclosure.
(b) In clause 24, on page 17
(a) in the marginal note
by the deletion of the word “police” and the substitution therefor of the word “authorised officer”
(b) lines 16, 22 and 35
by the deletion of the words “a police” and the substitution therefor of the words “an authorised”.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 24, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 25 – (Property Tracking)
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 25, on page 18, lines 14, and 19 by the deletion of the words “a police” and the substitution therefor of the words “an authorised”.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 25, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clauses 26, 27, 28, and 29 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 30 – (Detention Orders)
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 30, on page 23, in the lines 1 and 2 by the deletion of the words “police” and the substitution therefor of the words “authorised”.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 30, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 31 – (Powers of Arrest)
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 31, on page 23, in lines 5, 10 and 24 by the deletion of the words “a police” and the substitution therefor of the words “an authorised”.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 31, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 32 – (Powers of Investigation)
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 32, on page 23, in line 37 by the deletion of the words “a police officer of or above the rank of inspector” and the substitution therefor of the words “an authorised officer”.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 32, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 33 – (Powers of Investigation in Cases of Urgency)
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 33
(a) on page 24
(i) in lines 15 to 16
by the deletion of the words “a police officer of or above the rank of inspector” and the substitution therefor of the words “an authorised officer”;
(ii) in lines 17, 19, 27, 30 and 34
by the deletion of the word “police” and the substitution therefor of the word “authorised”; and
(iii) in line 37
by the deletion of the words “A police officer” and the substitution therefore of the words “An authorised officer”.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 33, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 34 – (Power to Intercept Communication and Admissibility of Intercepted Communications)
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 34 on page 25
(a) in line 9
by the deletion of the words “a police” and the substitution therefor of the word “an authorised”;
(b) in line 13
by the deletion of the words “A police” and the substitution therefor of the word “An authorised”;
(c ) in line 23
by the deletion of the word “police” and the substitution therefor of the word “authorised”; and
(d) in line 33
by the deletion of the word “police” and the substitution therefor of the words “authorised officer”.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 34, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 35 – (Power to Gather Information)
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 35
(a) on page 26
(i) in line 8
by the deletion of the words “a police” and the substitution therefor of the word “an authorised”;
(ii) in line 12
by the deletion of the words “A police” and the substitution therefor of the word “An authorised”; and
(iii) in lines 24 and 34
by the deletion of the word “police” and the substitution therefor of the word “authorised”; and
(b) on page 28, in line 11
by the deletion of the word “police” and the substitution therefor of the word “authorised”.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 35, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clauses 36 and 37 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
CLAUSE 38 – (Disclosure of Information etc.)
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 38, on page 28, in line 23 by the deletion of the words “a police” and the substitution therefor of the words “an authorised”.
Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.
Clause 38, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Clauses 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49 and 50 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Schedules on pages 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44 and 45 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
SCHEDULE ON PAGE 46
Mr Kunda: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in the Third Schedule, on page 46 as follows:
(a) in lines 17, 20 and 25
by the insertion of a comma and the word “vehicle” after the word “ship”;
(b) in line 27
by the insertion of a comma and the word “vehicles” after the word “ship”;
(c) in lines 28, 29 and 30
by the insertion of a comma and the word “vehicle” after the word “ship”.
Amendment agreed to. Schedule on page 46 amended accordingly.
Schedule on page 46, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Schedule on pages 47, 48 and 49 ordered to stand part of the Bill.
Title agreed to.
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HOUSE RESUMED
[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]
The following Bill was reported to the House as having passed through Committee with amendment:
The Anti-Terrorism Bill, 2007.
Report Stage on Tuesday, 21st August, 2007.
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MOTION
ADJOURNMENT
The Vice-President (Mr R. Banda): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.
Question put and agreed to.
The House adjourned at 1122 hours until 1430 hours on Tuesday, 21st August 2007.