DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE SECOND SESSION OF THE TENTH ASSEMBLY

Thursday, 13th November, 2008

The House met at 1430 hours

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

__________

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWERS

HEALTH IMPACT OF COMMUNICATION TOWER MASTS ERECTED BY MOBILE PHONE PROVIDERS

Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi) asked the Minister of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources whether the communication tower masts erected by the mobile phone providers countrywide were not dangerous to people and the environment.

The Deputy Minister of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources (Mr Chilembo): Mr Speaker, this question has not only been raised here in Zambia, but also worldwide and should be taken seriously given the high number of people who use mobile phones. This concern has arisen due to the fact that the signal for the mobile phones and communication masts is transmitted in the form of a wave called radio frequency (RF) which is linked to possible health risks.

Mr Speaker, to date, no conclusive scientific studies have been carried out to ascertain any serious health impact associated with either mobile phones or the communication tower masts.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, I do not know if the hon. Minister is aware that in Western Europe, residents who live near tower masts buy window shields to protect themselves from the rays that are emitted from these masts. What is the Government doing to ensure that it protects its residents here in Zambia?

The Minister of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources (Mr Kaingu): Mr Speaker, the hon. Member must know that we are talking about the Third World where, to a certain extent, we have to compromise with technology …

Hon. Opposition Members: Ah!

Mr Kaingu: Yes.

… to be able to deliver the services to our people. It would be very expensive to ask everybody to buy the shields to protect themselves from the rays. . At the moment, there is really nothing we can do. In fact, as we go into the constituencies, we realise that the demand for communication is very high. This is like a question of making an omelet. A few eggs must be broken.

Laughter

Mr Kaingu: There is nothing we can do here, but provide the service to our people.

I thank you, Sir.

Interruptions

Mr Mwansa (Chifunabuli): Mr Speaker, it is very clear that the Government has not taken any measures to try and ameliorate the situation. Could the Government tell us what the plan is to ensure that, in future, there will be ways and means of protecting our people from the rays that are emitted from these masts?

Mr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, before any development is allowed to take place, an environmental impact assessment is taken and the same has been asked of those people who are providing the service. According to our findings, as we have given in our answer, there is no scientific proof that the radio frequencies are actually harmful to the people.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Mr Speaker, it would appear the hon. Minister is contradicting himself. In one breath he says there is nothing we can do because we need the services and, therefore, some eggs will have to be broken in other words, some people are going to suffer and probably get incurable diseases and die because we need the service. In the other breath, he says there is no evidence that there are any harmful effects. What is the actual position? Is the Government wiling to commission studies or engage our scientists to study the effects of these rays, especially on those who are living close to these towers?

Mr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, there is totally no contradiction in my answer. I was just trying to emphasise that there is no evidence whatsoever to show that …

Mr Kaingu paused.

Hon. Opposition Members: Go on, go on!

Mr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Lusaka Central for the rude interruption.

Hon. Opposition Members: Ahh!

Mr Kaingu: I would like to emphasise that there is no evidence, whatsoever, to show that the radio frequency rays from the cell phone or the tower are harmful.

I thank you, Mr Speaker

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

ZUMWANDA LOCAL COURT

402. Mr I. Banda (Lumezi) asked the Minister of Justice:

(a) when the court building at Zumwanda Local Court in Lumezi Parliamentary Constituency was destroyed;

(b) how many building structures for the Judiciary Department were still in existence at Zumwanda Local Court.

(c) whether court proceedings were undertaken in the absence of the court  buildings at Zumwanda; and

(d) when the new court buildings would be constructed at Zumwanda Local Court to facilitate the resumption of normal court proceedings.

The Minister of Justice (Mr Kunda, SC): Mr Speaker, the existing building at Zumwanda Local Court in Lumezi Parliamentary Constituency collapsed in February, 1998, after a heavy down pour.

Mr Speaker, there are two staff houses which need to be rehabilitated as they are in a bad state of repair and since the collapse of the court building, court proceedings are still held in the open or through other initiates.

Sir, new court buildings would be constructed at Zumwanda Local Court upon availability of funds for the purpose.

I thank you, Sir.

RETIREMENT BENEFITS FOR RETIRED CIVIL SERVANTS IN NALOLO PARLIAMENTARY CONSTITUENCY

404. Mr Mwangala (Nalolo) asked the Minister of Finance and National Planning:

(a) how many civil servants had not been paid their retirement benefits by the Public Service Pension Fund in Nalolo Parliamentary Constituency;

(b) when the civil servants at (a) above would be paid their retirement benefits; and

(c) whether there were any plans to decentralise the Public Service Pension Fund to minimise the hardships which retirees underwent in accessing their benefits.

The Deputy Minister of Finance and National Planning (Mr Shakafuswa): Mr Speaker, in response to part (a) of the question, I wish to inform this august House that it is not possible, at the moment, to give a number of retirees by constituency level or provincial level as the information is not available. However, the Public Service Pensions Fund still has a total of 528 retirees or beneficiaries who were not paid their terminal benefits by 2nd June, 2008.

The total cost of the benefits amounted to about K77.5 billion. It is also important to note that these retirees are, on the other hand, receiving monthly pensions from the Fund. In another development, this House may wish to note that by 29th May, 2008, a total of 161 retirees had not submitted their bank account details so that their benefits could be remitted into their accounts. These benefits amounted to about K19.64 billion.

With regard to part (b) of the question, I wish to state that the process of paying the retirees is continuous and the number of beneficiaries is cleared based on the availability of resources. Given that the Government is liquidating the bulk of the pension arrears in 2008, it is expected that the waiting list is going to shrink tremendously.

In response to part (c) of the question, I wish to inform the august House that the institution has embarked on the decentralisation programme of its operations, this is being done in stages. So far, the Fund has decentralised the payment of pension benefits through various commercial banks and post offices across the country. All payments are now being made electronically and pensioners or retirees and beneficiaries are able to access the money in their respective localities.

Further, by working together with the Zambia National Pensioners Association, some work processes have been decentralised and these include enquiries, document certification and submission. Plans are also under way to bring in Public Service Unions as part of its decentralisation effort. With the above efforts, it is expected that pensioners or retirees will receive better services from the Public Service Pension Fund.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

GREAT EAST ROAD ACCIDENTS

405. Mr Tembo (Nyimba) asked the Minister of Home Affairs:

(a) how many accidents occurred on the Great East Road in 2007; and

(b) how many people died and how many survived the accidents at (a) above.

The Deputy Minister of Home Affairs (Ms Njapau): Mr Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that 1,637 road traffic accidents occurred along the Great East Road in 2007.

In answer to part (b) of the questions, I would like to state that out of the number mentioned above, 124 people died while 552 survived.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister explain to this august House the real cause of the accidents that have been happening between Luangwa and Nyimba. What action has the Government taken against the driver and the owner of NPS Bus which was involved in a road accident on 14th June, 2008 where twenty passengers died on the spot?

The Minister of Home Affairs (Lieutenant-General Shikapwasha): Mr Speaker, I wish to state that, first and foremost, there are many causes of accidents. In some cases, drivers have been caught driving under the influence of alcohol while others have been exceeding the speed limits indicated. Others overload their buses.

The issue about the accident-in-question where twenty-nine people lost their lives is still under police investigation and prosecution will take place if any negligence was involved.

I thank you, Sir.

TAPING ELECTRICITY FROM KAPAMBA FALLS

406. Mr Malama (Mfuwe) asked the Minister of Energy and Water Development whether the Ministry had any plans to tap electricity from Kapamba Falls in Mfuwe Parliamentary Constituency.

The Deputy Minister of Energy and Water Development (Mr Sichilima): Mr Speaker, I would like to inform this august House that the Ministry has no immediate plans to construct a power station at Kapamba Falls to generate electricity. This is because the Ministry is yet to carry out detailed studies on the site.

I wish to state that the Ministry has embarked on a programme to undertake a countrywide study on hydro power potential. As part of the exercise, members of public institutions and companies with information of any site with hydro power potential are encouraged to contact the Ministry so that such sites can be documented and considered for further assessment. The exercise will involve:

(a) carrying out a countrywide survey on all rivers to identify suitable sites for hydro power development; and

(b) carrying out preliminary feasibility studies for each of the identified sites and documenting and publishing all the above information for use by the general public;

The exercise is aimed at:

(a) making available to potential investors information on possible mini or small hydro power sites;

(b) encouraging and supporting individual and private initiatives to construct small hydro power stations through information provision;

(c) encouraging socio-economic development in areas where there is hydro potential by providing electricity services; and

(d) supporting the short-term measures the Government has embarked on to mitigate the power deficit the country is facing, as small hydro power stations have a shorter lead time to develop compared to the larger ones.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Malama: Mr Speaker, the Germany Roman Catholic Church is willing to fund the project up to 50 per cent. I would like to find out whether the Government may help to fund the remaining 50 per cent of the project.

Mr Sichilima: Mr Speaker, I said that if there were any people with information that would help us develop the energy sector, they should come to the Ministry. As regards to the Germany Catholics, I wish to inform this august House that the Ministry is not aware about their offer at the moment. If we were, I could have said so. Therefore, I would like to encourage the hon. Member to come to the Ministry and provide us with more information about this offer.

I thank you, Sir.

ALLOCATION OF PLOTS IN UNSERVICED AREAS

407. Mr Imenda (Lukulu East) asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing why the Lusaka City Council and other local authorities allocated plots in areas such as Chazanga and Chalala before these areas were serviced with roads, water reticulation systems, power lines and sewer systems.

 

The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Dr Kazonga): Mr Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that local authorities do not allocate plots in areas such as Chazanga.

Mr Speaker, these areas started as unplanned settlements and local authorities move in only for the purpose of regularising them. It should also be noted that it is true that in some cases, councils offer plots in some places such as Chalala, where services such as roads, water reticulation systems and sewer systems have not been provided.

Mr Speaker, this is due to the amount of service charges applicants pay which is not enough to finance the provision of services alluded to in my first part of the response. For instance, the cost of paving a 1km road is approximately K1.2 billion while gravel road for the same distance would cost about K65 million.

Sir, if the total cost of providing these services were to be past on to the developer, very few people would have access to land. The Government is, however, encouraging and supporting councils to provide services to areas where plots have already been allocated to developers to mitigate the suffering of residents. To this effect, the Lusaka City Council has embarked on a programme to construct roads in Chalala.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Imenda: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister when they will have long-term plans to have permanent structures and not sub-standard arrangements where a city as big as Lusaka is just built in a manner which is not acceptable.

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, currently, the Government, through the local authorities, is working on Integrated Development Plans (IDPs) that will capture all the aspects of planning in our cities, municipalities and district councils. Once these are completed, we shall see an orderly manner in which development is going to take place in these councils. That is why, at the moment, we are also busy working on the legal framework so that once the Integrated Development Plans (IDPs) are in place, we should have appropriate legal framework. Currently, we are reviewing the legal framework that surrounds the planning process in the country.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kasongo (Bangweulu): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether it is a new Government policy that the Government will only provide roads, water and other services in areas where developers are able to pay service charges.

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, the Government, would rather encourage the local authorities who are our agents are able to provide these services. As indicated in my response, the amounts that developers pay as service charges are very low. This particular Government has recognised the importance of assisting those residents and that is why the Government, through the Ministry of Local Govenrment and Housing, is disbursing money to local authorities to assist them open up and improve those areas that are already in existence so that, at least, we have some improvement in the services that are supposed to be provided to our communities.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Zulu (Bwana Mkubwa): Mr Speaker, who is responsible for the servicing of these plots? I am asking this question because the Road Development Agency (RDA) are in charge of roads and water and sewerage utility companies are also in charge of water and sewerage. Therefore, who is responsible for servicing the residential areas? Is it the council, RDA or the utility companies?

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, in accordance with the functions stipulated in the Act, the local authorities are responsible for all those services, but to ensure that the power is not concentrated in them, these function have been given to the water utility companies to undertake on behalf of the local authorities. As indicated earlier on in this House, local authorities are still responsible for the roads that are within their vicinity, but they work together with the RDA and the water utility companies including any other utility companies that need to provide services in those areas. Therefore, overall, the local authorities are responsible for those services.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka): Sir, the hon. Minister has indicated that the service charge that is currently charged by the local authorities to the developers falls far short of the cost of providing the service. Has the Ministry considered changing the description of that service from service charge to something that is more appropriate?

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, presently, we shall still maintain the same concept of service charge. Since the amounts that are paid to the local authorities are not enough to go towards the service provision, that is why the Central Government is assisting by disbursing some money to the local authorities to assist in providing those services. Therefore, the concept of service charge will still be maintained for now.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mooya (Moomba): Mr Speaker, sometime back, the Greater City of Lusaka plan was not implemented. It was shot down. Is there any political will to implement the Integrated Development Plan (IDP) which the hon. Minister mentioned a few minutes ago?

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, I wish to assure the hon. Member that the Government is, indeed, committed to ensuring that these IDPs are implemented. In order to confirm this, I already indicated that the Government is currently reviewing the legislation on the planning process and all other issues that are related to town and country planning in this country. That is commitment number one. Secondly, every year, the Government assists local authorities with some funds to develop the plans and also start implementing some of the portions that can be implemented immediately. That is the commitment of the Government.

Mr Speaker, I do not think that it should go beyond financing and providing the necessary legal and policy frameworks for one to say that the Government is serious or committed. The Government is, indeed, committed and very serious to ensuring that these IDPs are implemented. As I have indicated, the planning process is being facilitated and financed by the Government. The legal framework to govern this planning process is also being worked on by this Government. All this is part of the commitment that this Government has.

I thank you, Sir.

ELECTRIFICATION OF RURAL AREAS

408. Mr Malama asked the Minister of Energy and Water Development:

(a) what criteria were used to select the order of the electrification of rural areas which should be electrified first; and

(b) whether there were any plans to construct dams in Mfuwe Parliamentary Constituency.

The Deputy Minister of Energy and Water Development (Mr Sichilima): Mr Speaker, in the past, the rural electrification projects were selected on the basis of applications received from the provinces and the order in which the applications were received. Other considerations included whether or not the costs of the projects had been established and the availability of funds. The issue of regional balance was also taken into account.

Mr Speaker, following the completion of the Rural Electrification Master Plan (REMP) in 2008, the selection criteria will now be dictated by the ranking given to particular rural growth centres in the Master Plan. The Master Plan has identified 1,217 rural growth centres that require electrification throughout the country. To electrify each of these centres, they have been grouped into 180 project packages, depending on the projected power demand and the method of electrification. The 180 project packages have been ranked in order of priority at the national and provincial levels. The parameters used for ranking are the Financial Internal Rate of Return (FIRR) and Economic Internal Rate of Return (EIRR) for each electrification method. The methods under consideration are extensions of the national transmission or distribution network, construction of mini-hydro where the potential exists, and installation of solar photovoltaic systems. Special consideration was given to biomass that has no power supply, at the moment, or are supplied from diesel generators.

Mr Speaker, it is our hope that the ranking given to the various rural growth centres will be respected in the allocation of financial resources for the period 2009 to 2030. Disturbing the rankings due to lack of resources will only prolong the timeframe within which every part or rural Zambia electrified.

Mr Speaker, there are no immediate plans to construct dams in Mfuwe Parliamentary Constituency. However, if requests are made, the Ministry may look into that matter.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Malama: Mr Speaker, it has been observed that the concentration of rural electrification and other Government projects are along the line of rail. When is this Government going to repent from giving first priority to areas along the line of rail?

Mr Sichilima: Mr Speaker, I wish the hon. Member had come with specific examples. However, through you, Sir, I wish to educate him that Mfuwe, which I know very well, lies in the Northern Province. I would like to remind him that there are projects taking place in Chiefs Nawa Itwika and Kafwimbi’s areas. Furthermore, most of the schools are electrified and most of the chiefs’ palaces are fitted with solar panels. Therefore, it is not true that we are concentrating on the areas along the line of rail.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Hamududu (Bweengwa); Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister of Energy and Water Development why the Ministry is lacking a master plan for dam construction like the other Ministries have done. The Ministries of Education and Health have plans to construct schools and clinics, respectively. Why is the Ministry of Energy and Water Development not taking the issue of dam construction seriously?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Minister of Energy and Water Development (Mr Konga): Mr Speaker, the fact of the matter is that there exists a plan, not only for rural electrification, but for dam construction in the country. If the hon. Member cared to confirm, he could have come to the Ministry and we would have made that plan available to him. If required, we can bring the plan to the House.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chazangwe (Choma): Mr Speaker, water, as we know, is not only for consumption, but for irrigation and producing hydro-electricity. Time and again, we have reminded this Government to put more effort in the construction of dams. However, I see that this Government has no plans to construct dams, which are required throughout this country. I am asking this Government to consider putting up more dams in the country for irrigation and for making hydro-electricity.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Next question.

Laughter

Mr Beene (Itezhi-Tezhi): Mr Speaker, according to the hon. Minister, the Rural Electrification Plan ended this year, but what measures has this Government put in place to ensure that those “half-left” projects are completed under the Rural Electrification Programme.

Mr Konga: Mr Speaker, we do not have “half-left” projects. We only have on-going projects.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Siliya: Ndiye chizungu.

Mr Konga: Mr Speaker, these projects only appear “half-left” to the hon. Member because they are on-going. On most of these projects, the constructors have mobilised on site and at the moment, we will undertake the programmes to complete the projects even in the coming year.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chisala (Chilubi): Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister state why the inertia is so high by the Rural Electrification Authority (REA) to complete the projects which were not completed between 2000 and 2003. The best example is that of the Chilubi Project.

Mr Konga: Mr Speaker, at the expense of repeating myself, these projects are on-going.

Mr Munaile: For how long?

Mr Konga: Mr Speaker, I would like hon. Members to appreciate that to construct a line does not take one day. Some of these lines are long and stand at about 100 kilometres. It involves clearing of the bush. Therefore, these projects require time. The other reason it might have appeared that there might have been delays is that while the projects might have been approved, the actual financing might not have been released and this could have contributed to the projects stalling. Therefore, we are appealing to hon. Members to bear with the Government. The projects might appear to be delaying because resources are not available.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.{mospagebreak}

UNCOMPLETED BUILDING STRUCTURES IN LUAMPA PARLIAMENTARY CONSTITUENCY

409. Ms Limata (Luampa) asked the Minister of Education when uncompleted building structures for the following schools in Luampa Parliamentary Constituency which had remained unattended to for a long time would be completed:

(a) Milumbwa Basic School;

(b) Chacha Basic school;

(b) Lui Basic School;

(c) Namasheshe Basic School;

(d) Mwandasengo Basic School;

(e) Kanyenze Basic School;

(f) Lenvu Basic School;

(g) Luampa High School; and

(h) Nakanyembe Basic School.

The Deputy Minister of Education (Mr Sinyinda): Mr Speaker, I would like to inform the House that the structures will be completed in phases. However, Luampa High School has this year been given K378 million. The district will include the needs of the rest of the schools into the subsequent infrastructure development plans.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr D. Mwila (Chipili): Mr Speaker, there are too many schools which have not been completed for three to four years. The incomplete schools are not only in Luampa, but also in areas such as Kasenengwa and Musanzala.

 Laughter

Mr D. Mwila:  Sir, does the Ministry have any intentions of compiling or checking on the schools so that they are completed once and for all?

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, I would like to remind my hon. Colleague that this Government is doing everything possible to complete the structures that were not completed. I am sure the hon. Member knows that this year alone, the Ministry of Education has released huge sums of money to complete structures.

 Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sinyinda: We intend to release more money for next year’s projects.

 I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chimbaka (Bahati): Mr Speaker, could my fellow educationist state what could be the reasons that have led to the failure to complete the projects he is talking about. Is it due to inadequate planning or under costing of the projects? What are the reasons?

The Minister of Education (Professor Lungwangwa): Mr Speaker, the reasons are simple. In the past, we had a project mode of operation such as Zambia Education Rehabilitation Project (ZERP), Zambia Sector Implementation Fund (ZAMSIF), Basic Education Sub-Sector Implementation Programme (BESSIP) and other projects. As the project mode implies, when the project comes to an end, some of the projects which were not completed remain uncompleted. However, as indicted in the response, we are capturing all those incomplete structures so that we complete them. This is very clear in our operational plan which we released this year and are going to continue releasing on an annual basis

I thank you, Mr Speaker

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo (Bangweulu): Mr Speaker, most of these failures could be attributed to mismanagement and the incompetence of managers at the provincial and district levels. What measures has the Ministry put in place to re-organise the managers at the provincial and district levels and assist them become more responsible to the aspiration of the people at the local level.

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, we have clearly identified that problem. To this effect, we are embarking on a capacity building programme for other education managers. We have National In-Service Training College (NISTCOL) which is our in-service training programme which will soon embark on management training and exposing skills management to our education managers who implement various programmes at the local level. In addition to that, we give them vehicles, which we have done already so that they are able to monitor projects at the community level in their districts.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Imenda (Lukulu East): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the Minister when the Ministry of Education is going to come up with a comprehensive plan in line with the already existing plans.

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, I am not quite sure whether we have a comprehensive plan in place relating to infrastructure development which captures new schools to be constructed, additional classrooms to be constructed, rehabilitation of infrastructure, including mud structures and rehabilitation of the desks. Therefore, the current infrastructure operational plan is comprehensive enough and covers different aspects of our operations.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Beene (Itezhi-tezhi): Mr Speaker, may I find out from the hon. Minister of Education the timeframe in which he will complete the structures which have been lying incomplete for the past ten years because this Government has got enough money in the reserves, uptoUS$1.5 billion.

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, the simple answer is that these are on-going projects and the hon. Member is requested to earnestly work with the District Education Board Secretaries (DEBS) so that all these incomplete structures which are still there in his constituency are identified and put in various operational plans that are developed annually.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

DEMARCATION OF PART OF CHIEF MUKUNGULE’S AREA INTO A FARMING BLOCK

410. Mr Malama (Mfuwe) asked the Minister of Agriculture and Co-operative whether there were any plans to demarcate part of Chief Mukungule’s area into a farming block.

The Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives (Mr Mulonga): Mr Speaker, I would like to inform the House that there are plans to demarcate part of Chief Mukungule’s Chiefdom into a farming block. However, in Kanchibiya Parliamentary Constituency in Mpika, there exists Manshya Farming Block in Mpepo Chiefdom. This farming block has been adopted as part of the Farming Block Development Programme under the Commercialisation of Agricultural Lands.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Malama: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that such plans can help reduce poverty in rural areas through encouraging people especially those in Chief Mukungule’s Chiefdom to own land?

The Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives (Mr Kapita): Mr Speaker I would like to thank the hon. Member for that very important question.

Sir, the Government is well aware of the need to make more land available for increased agricultural production. In terms of farming blocks, the policy for now is to have, at least, one farming block in every province. At a later stage, when we have put up all the nine farming blocks, that is, one farming block in each province, definitely, we are going to increase the number of farming blocks. That is the plan.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

REHABILITATION OF KAIMBONYE AND LUWEREZI (EMUSA) DAMS

411. Mr C. K. B. Banda, SC. (Chasefu) asked the Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives when Kaimbonye and Luwerezi (Emusa) Dams in Chasefu Parliamentary Constituency would be rehabilitated.

Mr Mulonga: Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Agriculture and Co-operatives has no plans to rehabilitate Kaimbonye and Luwerezi (Emusa) dams in Chasefu Parliamentary Constituency as it does not have the mandate to do so. These dams are under the jurisdiction of the Department of Water Affairs in the Ministry of Energy and Water Development (MEWD).

The communities served by Kaimbonye and Luwerezi (Emusa) dams should, therefore, contact the Ministry of Energy and Water Development (MEWD) to establish the current situation regarding the rehabilitation of these two dams.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

INTENDED BENEFITS FROM THE MINERAL EXPLORATIONS AND MINING ACTIVITIES

412. Mr Katuka (Mwinilunga East) asked the Vice-President:

(a) what deliberate measures the Government had taken to ensure that the mineral explorations and mining activities taking place in the North-Western Province benefit the indigenous local communities in the Province; and

(b) how the vulnerable local groups, including small-scale farmers, women and children and the handicapped would benefit from the mining activities at (a) above.

The Deputy Minister in the Vice-President’s Office (Mr Malwa): Mr Speaker, the House may wish to know that under the Mines and Minerals Development Act of 2008, an application for a prospecting licence includes the following items which are intended to benefit the local communities:

(a) local business development plan; and

(b) employment and training plan for citizens and those recruited from the local communities. Training is inevitable.

Further, Sir, under the Mining Licence Plan of 2008 the application includes a plan for the development of local businesses, which must outline how the investor intends to promote local businesses as follows:

(i) the participation of Zambian entrepreneurs in procurement and supply of business opportunities;

(ii) the setting up by Zambian entrepreneurs of import substitution, repair and maintenance of businesses locally;

(iii) partnership between Zambian entrepreneurs and foreign suppliers, and local contractors;

(iv) skills development to enable the Zambian entrepreneurs to attain quality standards in contract of works and supply.

Mr Speaker, all the above measures are aimed at ensuring that the local communities benefit from the mining activities, in addition to the rates that the mining companies will pay to the local authorities.

Sir, the local groups, including small-scale farmers, women, children and the handicapped will greatly benefit from the employment and business opportunities which will be brought to the local community by the mining companies opened in the North-Western Province such as Lumwana and Kansanshi.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Katuka: Mr Speaker, may I find out from the hon. Deputy Minister out of the conditions stipulated in the Mines and Minerals Act he has outlined, and since the mines have been around for a long time now, which ones have been met by the mining companies?

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Malwa: Mr Speaker, I will give an example of Lumwana Mine which has constructed a number of housing units for the workers. These local workers will be given a chance to purchase these houses, just to mention a few. Kansanshi Mine has also constructed a golf course and other social corporate activities …

Laughter

Mr Malwa: … that will be taking place in these mining areas.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Interruptions

Mr D. Mwila (Chipili): Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister in the Office of the Vice-President has informed this House that the houses will be sold to the miners, I do not know whether that decision has been made because the houses he is talking about have not been completed. Can he indicate the truth?

Mr Malwa: Mr Speaker, personally, I had a meeting with the Managing Director of Lumwana Mine and he told me that over a hundred houses have been built. Construction of these houses is still on-going. Once these houses are completed, firstly they will be occupied then later sold.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka): Mr Speaker, if I heard the hon. Deputy Minister right, he indicated that part of the benefits to the local communities are that the mine has built a golf course where affluent people play that game. Can he confirm also that these mines have established academies for golf for indigenous communities because my understanding is that golf is a game for affluent people?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Minister of Defence (Mr Mpombo): Mr Speaker, we are saying that these mining companies have corporate responsibilities to support the communities in which they operate. At the local level, they have built schools and supported various traditional incentives in the areas. However, when you talk about golf, there are management teams that come there, and they have provided the golfing facilities as one of those amenities which are important.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kakoma (Zambezi West): Mr Speaker, one of the conditions for granting these licences as outlined by the hon. Deputy Minister is that the local people are supposed to benefit in terms of employment. Can the hon. Minister explain why we have a situation in the North Western Province at Lumwana and Kasanshi where the majority of the employees are not local people, including top management. As we explained yesterday out of twelve, only three are Zambian managers. Can he explain how that is benefiting the local people?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mpombo: Mr Speaker, I would like to stress the tenets of One Zambia, One Nation. These are national resources and every Zambian should have unfettered access to these resources.

Laughter

Mr Mpombo: In terms of employment, we are talking about various categories of employment. We are talking about skilled labour which cannot be readily available in Kabompo East or Kabompo West. In such situations, the mines will have every right to source that kind of requirement elsewhere. With regard to the management, it would be wise to point out that this is a new mine and a lot of money has been pored into these projects. The shareholders have to ensure that as they embed this project, it is on course because they are spending their own money and have to ensure that the right people are employed at the right time.

 I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

MINES IN NANGOMA

413. Mr Hamusonde (Nangoma) asked the Minister of Mines and Minerals Development:

(a) how many mines were in Nangoma Parliamentary Constituency;

(b) what type of minerals were produced by the mines at (a) above; and

(c) whether the Government benefitted from these mines.

The Deputy Minister of Mines and Minerals Development (Mr M. Mwale): Mr Speaker, the House may wish to know that there are two mines in Nangoma Parliamentary Constituency, namely; Namatombwa Mine owned and operated by Maamba Collieries Limited and Dunrobin and Malala Mines owned by Luiri Gold.

Mr Speaker, Namatombwa Mine produces magnetite for Maamba Collieries Limited while Dunrobin and Matala Mines are currently not operational because Luiri Gold is still carrying out exploration works to determine the grade and size of the gold reserves.

Mr Speaker, Namatombwa Mine which has ten workers is current in meeting all obligations to Government in payment of area charges. The company did not pay corporate tax in 2007 because it was under care and maintenance and was only taken over by Zambia Consolidated Copper Mines-Investment Holdings (ZCCM-IH) in 2007 as part of Maamba Collieries Limited. Production at the mine is expected to begin as soon as ZCCM-IH finds a strategic equity partner for Maamba Collieries Limited. Dunrobin and Matala Mines which have twenty-five workers are also current in the payment of area charges. Since production has not yet commenced at the mines, there was no income and, therefore, no company tax was paid.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu (Gweembe): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out why they have allowed this company that they have given a prospecting licence to, to go ahead with mining in Nangoma.

The Minister of Mines and Minerals Development (Dr Mwansa): Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for that follow-up question. The Luiri Gold Mine has a mining license which was issued to them in 2003 and expires in 2013. They have not commenced mining yet because they are still exploring to define more deposits because the current deposits are not sufficient for commercial exploitation. We expect that by the end of 2009, they will have put up all the infrastructure required for them to start mining.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kambwili (Roan): Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister of Mines and Minerals Development indicated in his response that one of the mines in Nangoma is not operational because ZCCM-IH has not found a strategic partner for Maamba Collieries Limited. I would like the hon. Minister to confirm whether, indeed, Maamba Collieries Limited is not operational as a result of the failure by the contractor miner who was engaged and paid by ZCCM-IH, but has failed to mobilise.

Dr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, the mine that is held by Maamba Collieries Limited is called Namatombwa. This is a mine which was producing magnetite used for separation of coal and the only reason it is not producing is that the Maamba Mine itself has operational problems and currently is engaged in finding a strategic partner that should revive the mine along with Maamba Collieries Limited. I am happy to repo that out of the eleven companies that showed interest in partnering with Maamba Collieries Limited, three have been found to be viable and have been requested to produce both technical and financial proposals for the Maamba Mine to start negotiating with them.

Mr Speaker, we do expect that the whole process should end within three months from the beginning of November.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr L. J. Mulenga (Kwacha): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has not explained whether the Government benefits from these mines. What I would like to ask the hon. Minister is that when the license is issued, how long should we wait before the Government begins to benefit from what has been exploited? I would also like to find out what they have been exploiting, why they are still exploiting and why they have not left if it is not viable.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, at the time of exploration, the mining companies pay what is called area charges calculated in accordance with the size of the area where they are doing the exploration works. When they begin operating and making profits, then they pay all the taxes that are due to the Government. We have said that at this stage, Luiri Gold is not yet producing anything and, therefore, they cannot pay charges out of unmade profits but they are current in terms of area charges that are due to the Government. Therefore, they are not in breach of any regulations because they are current in terms of area charges and when production begins, hopefully, towards the end of 2009, the employees should be able to pay Pay-As-You-Earn (PAYE) and the Government will benefit from there and the mining company will start paying corporate and all the taxes that will be due.

I thank you, Sir.

REHABILITATION OF STREET CHILDREN COUNTRYWIDE

414. Mr C. Mulenga (Chinsali) asked the Minister of Sport, Youth and Child Development:

(a) how many street children were sent for rehabilitation at the youth centres countrywide from 2002 to 2007; and

(b) how many street children in the youth centres got pregnant during the above period. 

The Deputy Minister of Sport, Youth and Child Development (Ms Cifire): Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Sport, Youth and Child Development has sixteen youth resource centres countrywide. The training at the sixteen youth resource centres targets young Zambians who are not able to get into colleges due to bad results or not being able to go to universities.

Additionally, my Ministry has been implementing the street children rehabilitation and reintegration programme from 2004 to date. This programme targets vulnerable young people aged fifteen to twenty-five years who have made the streets a place of livelihood. This programme is being implemented in the youth skills training centres at Chiwoko and Kitwe Zambia National Service (ZNS) Camps in Eastern and Copperbelt Provinces respectively.

The first intake of vulnerable children to be sent to the two youth skills training centres was in December, 2004 and all of them were male divided as follows:

 Centre No. of children

(i) Chiwoko ZNS Youth Skills Training Centre  150
(ii) Kitwe ZNS Youth Skills Training Centre  130

Those who successfully completed the training programme in August to September, 2006 were 204 in total as follows:

 Centre No. of graduates

(i) Chiwoko ZNS Youth Skills Training Centre  92
(ii) Kitwe ZNS Youth Skills Training Centre  112

Upon graduating from the two ZNS youth skills centres, the graduates were attached to the countrywide youth resource centres under the Ministry to enable them gain practical experience for a period of six months.

The recruitment of the second intake of vulnerable young people started in January, 2007 and these were sent to the two ZNS skill centres in March, 2007. A total of 120 girls were sent to Kitwe and 430 boys were sent to Chiwoko. Some recruits left the centres due to various reasons. Kitwe ZNS Youth Centre ended up with ninety girls and Chiwoko ZNS Youth Centre ended up with 388 boys. The reasons, as indicated earlier, were personal because most of them were not used to a home environment and, hence found it strange.

Mr Speaker, none of the female trainees got pregnant while they were in training. This was because of the recruitment process which involved testing the girls for pregnancy at the centres of recruitment in the provinces where they came from and also as they arrived at ZNS Centre for girls which was in Kitwe. It was at the recruitment time …

Mr Munaile interjected.

Ms Cifire: Iwe, ichongo, ai. …that ten girls were found pregnant and these were referred back to the provinces so that they could be given alternative assistance.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: The Chair has often guided that you debate or interject at your own peril when an ordinary Member or a Minister is speaking.

Does the hon. Member for Chinsali wish to ask a follow up question?

Mr C. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. Minister for the adequate answer that she has given, …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr C. Mulenga: … but I just would like to find out what measures the Government is doing to ensure that when these children graduate, they are helped by the Government so that they are not underutilised in society.

The Minister of Sport, Youth and Child Development (Mr Namulambe): Mr Speaker, we have provided the young people with start-up capital and some of them are employed by the people who have found value in them. Therefore, we are taking care of them and the programme has so far succeeded.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Musokotwane (Katombola): Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Education has a re-entry policy for girls who get pregnant. I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether this policy will be extended to the ZNS Youth Skills Training Camps, especially that the numbers are already very low for girls and very high for the boys.

Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, yes, in the first place, these people have gone back to their relatives and if they show indication that they would like to go back for re-training, they are free to do so because, as a Ministry, we are trying to review the programmes so as to also accommodate the vulnerable people, who are in the homes of parents, but cannot manage to go into colleges.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, it has been observed that the number of street children has started swelling up in the streets of Lusaka and Copperbelt provinces. May I learn from the hon. Minister what plans he has put in place to curb this unpleasant scenario.

Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, I think I will consider him having a consultative meeting with the Members of Parliament from these urban towns, who are mostly Patriotic Front (PF), to find out what is causing these problems.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

Mr L. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, could the Minister give us a definite date when that will be done?

Laughter

Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, depending on the calendar of the sitting of Parliament and other issues, we shall find the time available for that.

I thank you, Sir.

DESTRUCTION OF CROPS IN SINJEMBELA PARLIAMENTARY CONSTITUENCY

415. Mr Mwangala asked the Minister of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources:

(a) what measures had been taken to prevent the destruction of crops in Sinjembela Parliamentary Constituency by the annual migration of elephants from neighbouring Botswana; and
 
(b) whether there were any plans to compensate or support the people whose crops were annually destroyed by the elephants at (a) above.

The Minister of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources (Ms V. Tembo): Mr Speaker, the Zambia Wildlife Authority field officers have been scaring elephants away from crops by shooting in the air. This process is called blasting. Where elephants persist in destroying crops even after blasting, field officers are granted authority to kill an elephant by shooting.

In addition, under the Kavango-Zambezi Transfrontier Area (KAZA), an integrated development plan that will guide development and settlements in the area and will, therefore, help in reducing crop destruction by elephants as elephants corridors will be avoided has been developed.

Mr Speaker, currently, there are no plans to compensate or support the people whose crops are annually destroyed by the elephants. People may apply for support from the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit through the local authorities.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwangala: Mr Speaker, apart from foreign elephants destroying crops in Sinjembela Constituency, is the hon. Minister aware that lions are now harassing the people of Sioma, Kalongola and Sinjembela districts? What measures is the Government putting in place to prevent the destruction of human beings and their domestic animals?

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: I hear so many answers …

Laughter

Mr Speaker: … and one of them is “eat them”, …

Laughter

Mr Speaker: … but I am sure the hon. Minister of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources has a better answer than that.

Laughter

The Minister of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources (Mr Kaingu): Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. Member for that question and, in fact, that is information that he is supplying us. Now that we know that there are lions that are attacking people, we will ask our police team …

Hon. Member: ZAWA.

Mr Kaingu: Yes, police officers from the Zambia Wildlife Authority (ZAWA) to look into the issue.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Interruptions

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, I think the hon. Member for Nalolo wanted to find out what plans the Government has put in place to compensate people whose crops are destroyed by wild animals. However, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what mechanisms are in place to monitor the situation in these areas because it seems that despite our poor people not being compensated for the crops destroyed, cases are only addressed when reported. Who is doing the monitoring? Is it the Government or the people themselves? What is the role of the Government in ensuring that these crops are protected? The people in these areas are poor.

Laughter

Mr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, we have stated in our earlier response that we have an integrated development plan that will guide the communities on where to grow their crops. We will not encourage them to grow their crops in the corridors for elephants.

I thank you, Sir.

___________ {mospagebreak}

MOTION

COMMITTEE ON INFORMATION AND BROADCASTING SERVICES

Major Chizhyuka (Namwala): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that this House do adopt the Report of the Committee on Information and Broadcasting Services, for the Second Session of the Tenth National Assembly, laid on the Table of the House on 28th October, 2008.

Mr Speaker: Is the Motion seconded?

Reverend Nyirongo: Mr Speaker, I beg to second the Motion.

Major Chizhyuka: Sir, in accordance with their terms of reference, your Committee considered the topical issue, “the governance and role of community radio stations in the promotion of community aspirations and national programmes”.

Background to the objectives of the study

Sir, under the Ministry of Information and Broadcasting Services, in the Information and Media Policy of 1996, one of the Government’s policies and goals is:

 “to achieve countrywide coverage, by radio and television, by the year 2005, including the provision of community radio stations.”

Further, the Government, in the action-taken report on the Committee’s report for 2007 says:

“Currently, the Government requires that the programming for community radio stations reflects the immediate environment of the communities they serve. The Independent Broadcasting Authority Act also requires that the station reflects the culture and identity of the people it serves and that it promotes cultural diversity.”

In specific terms, your Committee delved into the following:

(i) the conceptions of community – how does the radio station view the community?

(ii) the nature and management structure of the community radio station;

(iii) the establishment and/or workforce of the station;

(iv) funding and sustainability of the radio station;

(v) staff recruitment, training and retention policy of the station;

(vi) programming and languages used;

(vii) the place for civic education and social marketing campaigns such as the Ant-corruption and HIV/AIDS in the programme quota;

(viii) the radius of coverage and reasons for such radius;

(ix) accessibility and participation of the community of the radio station; and

(x) licensing procedures and relationship of the station with the Government (Legal Framework).

Mr Speaker, in order to assist them in their inquiry, your Committee interacted with thirteen institutions. Apart from requesting these stakeholders who included chief executives of public institutions to make both written and oral submissions, your Committee undertook tours to nine selected community radio stations which were not invited to appear before them at Parliament. These were in the Western, Southern, Central, Luapula and Northern Provinces.

Sir, it is my hope that hon. Members have had an opportunity to read the report. I will, therefore, only highlight a few salient details.

The nature and management structure of community radio stations.

Sir, whereas many community radio stations have management boards which give policy direction to management, almost all stations run by church organisations do not have management boards. A director, who is appointed by the spiritual overseer, runs the stations. Even where there is a semblance of a board, it is restricted to the clergy without representation from the local community.

Your Committee, therefore, are of the view that in order to effectively service community radio stations, premised on the fundamental principle, transparent and accountability, all religious institutions, be they churches, synagogues or mosques, operating community radio stations must by law be persuaded to create advisory boards which will comprise a harmonious balance of both the clergy and the lay persons from amongst the community radio.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

(ii) Funding and Sustainability

Major Chizhyuka: As regards funding and sustainability, your Committee note that most community radio stations are set up with funds from non-governmental organisations who only provide initial funding and, in some cases, infrastructure, but never get back to see how these stations are operating in their localities.

In view of this and in order to save the community radio stations, some community radio stations have resorted to charging fees for services which would otherwise be rendering the service free of charge. This, in turn, has created a lot of animosity between community and commercial radio stations.

Commercial radio stations are of the view that allowing community radio stations to engage in commercial activities has deprived them of the business they were meant to conduct to survive. They contend that community radio stations can afford to charge very low rates and still survive because they do not have huge overheads, considering that they are not expected to pay tax. This undercuts commercial radios as advertisers would rather go to community radio stations since they cover the same clientele.

In view of the forgoing, your Committee recommended that in order to improve funding and sustainability, community radio stations should be funded by the Government. The Media Fund which the Ministry has been talking about does not seem to be making any impact in this regard. As a matter of fact, very few individuals and organisations know about the existence and the modalities of accessing it. When community radio stations are properly funded, there will be no need for them to engage in commercial activities, and therefore, there will be no conflict of interest with the commercial radio stations.

(iii) Programme and Languages

Mr Speaker, your Committee are happy to report that except in a few cases, the programming falls within the prescribed range of 20 per cent English and 80 per cent local language quota. It is understandable for institutional radios such as the University of Zambia Radio and Hone FM not to broadcast in local languages, but it is certainly not acceptable for stations such as Radio Mano in Kasama which claims to be a community radio to devote 80 per cent of its programming to English.

Hon. Member: What about Sky?

Major Chizhyuka: Sky is not a community radio station.

Apart from the local languages versus English matrix, there is also the sidelining of certain local languages in some places such as Mongu, Western Province, and Mansa in Luapula Province where a dominant local language such as Mbunda and Ushi respectively are not used. Radio Maranatha in Kabwe has a similar problem, though it stems from the cosmopolitan nature of the community. Here, 84 per cent of the programming is in English and only 16 per cent is shared between Bemba, Lenje and Tonga. Your Committee were told that the radio had found it difficult to identify the main local language.

Your Committee, therefore, recommended that in keeping with the Independent Broadcasting Authority (IBA), which requires that: “A station reflects the culture and identity of the people it serves and that it promotes cultural diversity”, all community radio stations should be encouraged if not compelled to use local languages and content as much as possible.

(iv) Radius of Coverage and Reason for it.

Regarding the radius of coverage and reasons for it, your Committee learnt that there is controversy surrounding the definition and understanding of the term “community”, which has, in turn, affected the area of coverage sought by the radio stations and one granted by the Ministry of Information and Broadcasting Services. Whereas the Ministry has restricted the radius to a physical location between 100 kilometres and 150 kilometres, community radio stations want to understand radius in terms of interest or language. Owing to this, many community radio stations would, given a chance, want to cover more areas.

Mr Speaker, your Committee recommend that instead of expanding their radius of coverage, community radio stations should, in fact, be advised to shrink their coverage for effective service delivery. Radio Chikuni in Monze, which has refused to expand the radius of coverage, in spite of so many requests from the surrounding communities should be used as a model community radio station. Due to the small area of coverage, Radio Chikuni has known and ministered to the community in a very effective manner. The station has been effective in keeping track of, and supporting vulnerable children and those infected with HIV/AIDS. They have sponsored and monitored the progress of orphans and vulnerable children up to secondary education.

(v) Licensing Procedures and Relationship with the Government and Traditional Authorities

Pertaining to licensing procedures and the relationship with the Government and Traditional leaders, your Committee are of the view that the dual licensing procedure has not just made the process cumbersome, but also inhibitive. Your Committee learnt that apart from the K2,000,000.00 payable to the Ministry of Information and Broadcasting Services, applicants have to pay an additional of K2,500,000.00 to the Communications Authority of Zambia every year.

Mr Speaker, in order to save costs and time, and also to remove suspicion, your Committee recommend that the Independent Broadcasting Authority, whose responsibility it is to use licences as a one-stop centre should be operationalised with immediate effect.

Mr Speaker, as regards the relationship with the Government and traditional leaders, your Committee found that many community radio stations do not have problems. There is, however, one particular radio station, Radio Lyambai in Mongu that needs to be rescued from interference both from the Government and traditional authorities. This station is caught up in a serious power crossfire between the Barotse Royal Establishment (BRE) on one side and the Government on the other. Both sides accuse the radio station of being used by individuals and organisations bent on discrediting these establishments. The BRE, however, seems to yield more power and influence than the provincial administration and this has resulted in some cases of the station being caught up in a spider’s web.

The provincial administration should be encouraged to take its appropriate role in the administration of the province and be helped to see the station as allies in development rather than enemies. In other words, the provincial administration should view Lyambai Community Radio Station as a yawning interface between the Government and the community, using the station as a medium to promulgate the Government programmes and initiatives.

Mr Speaker, may I conclude by thanking you for your valuable guidance and counsel during the session. May I also take this opportunity to thank my colleagues who served on Your Committee with due diligence and hard work as we rode some of the worst roads of our country.

In addition, I wish to express your Committee’s gratitude to all the witnesses and stake holders who made both oral and written submissions before Your Committee and for hosting them during the local tours.

Lastly, Sir, allow me to thank the Office of the Clerk of the National Assembly and her staff for the services rendered to your Committee during the session.

Mr Speaker, I beg to move.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: Quality!

Mr Speaker: Does the seconder wish to speak now or later?

Rev. Nyirongo: Now, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker, in seconding this Motion so ably moved by the Chairperson, allow me to buttress a few points of great concern to your Committee as they considered the governance and role of community radio stations in the promotion of community aspirations and national programmes.

Mr Speaker, I will be very brief since the Chairperson’s speech was quite elaborate. Concerning the conception of the term “community”, your Committee heard that community radio stations view the community as not only their audience, but rather the very reason and purpose for their existence. As such, all planning and programming has the community as the beneficiary.

However, your Committee also learnt that grey areas surrounding the definition of the term “community” exists and this ranges from a group of people using the same language, a group of people living in a defined geographical location to a group of people sharing the same interests. It is apparent from what your Committee heard that the definition of the term “community” by the Government is the one defined by a geographical location and that this is the one which has been used in determining the area and radius of coverage granted to community radio stations.

Mr Speaker, it is the view of your Committee that the Government, in consultation with stakeholders, should redefine the term “community” in order to avoid varied interpretations and applications.

As concerns the staff recruitment, training and retention policy of community radio stations, your Committee were informed that most community radio stations do not have a clear cut policy regarding staff recruitment, training and retention. This is because they have no capacity to retain even those they train since they are easily taken by commercial or even the national broadcaster that is able to pay more and offer better conditions of service. The staff turnover is consequently very high.

This has led to community radio stations relying so heavily on volunteers who, in most cases, have very rudimentary training or general knowledge of matters for broadcasting. This has resulted in community radio stations failing to adhere to media and broadcasting ethics, hence the falling standards in community radio broadcasting.

Mr Speaker, your Committee, therefore, recommend that community radio stations use volunteers who have some knowledge of broadcasting. The Zambia Institute of Mass Communication Education Trust (ZAMCOM) and other media houses should be called upon to help in this regard.

Regarding the place for civic education, social marketing and HIV/ AIDS in the programming quota, your Committee were informed that a considerable amount of airtime is devoted to civic education and HIV/AIDS programmes. Specific examples of the community radio stations involvement in such matters are the voter education during elections, the keep Zambia Clean and Healthy Campaign, Violence …

Mr Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1615 hours until 1630 hours.

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Rev Nyirongo: Mr Speaker, your Committee were informed that a considerable amount of airtime is devoted to civic education programmes and HIV/AIDS. Specific examples of the community radio stations involvement in such matters are the voter education during elections, the Keep Zambia Clean and Healthy Campaign, Violence Against Women and Children, Child Health Week and Learning at Taonga Market to name, but a few.

Mr Speaker, instances were cited when community radio stations have exposed scandals, thereby alerting both the police and the public to the vice of corruption. It is also the use of community radio that has brought to the fore defilement cases in places such as Mazabuka.

Your Committee learnt with sadness, however, that most Government leaders in rural communities have failed or refused to appear at community radio stations to articulate Government policies. This is either because they feel inadequate to speak on radio or they have branded community radio stations anti-Government.

Your Committee, further, heard that the most turbulent times for community radio stations are in the run-up to elections. In view of the foregoing, your Committee recommend that the Government impress upon their officials in communities where radios exist to take full advantage of their radios and use them to propagate Government programmes and answer to people’s concerns instead of seeing them as enemies of their progress.

Regarding accessibility and participation by the community, your Committee were informed that many community radio stations have their doors open to the community both in the literal and metaphorical sense. Literally, members by virtue of the radios’ location are free to walk into the station to submit their announcements, advertisement, programming proposals and news stories. 

Metaphorically members of the community are at liberty to suggest improvements in the stations’ programming by mail, telephone or even by proxy.

Most community radios have established listener groups which are supposed to fill in official feedback forms that are sent back to the stations for consideration. In some cases, suggestion boxes have been mounted to afford the community an opportunity to participate in the operations of the station.

Mr Speaker, this is a commendable effort and community radio stations need to be encouraged to keep up the good work.

In conclusion, I wish to extend my thanks to the Chairperson of your Committee for the able manner in which he presided over the meetings. Let me also thank the members of your Committee and all the witnesses for their input and able manner in which they conducted themselves. Most of all, I would like to thank you for having considered all of us in composing your Committee on Information and Broadcasting Services. It was really an interesting group.

Mr Speaker, I beg to second.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu (Gwembe): Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to contribute on this Motion. I am sorry I have to drink water before I start my contribution because I have a cough.

Mr Ntundu drunk some water.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, I will be very brief because I only have one or two issues to debate. The first issue is about your Committee’s recommendation or appreciation of Radio Marathona …

Hon. Members: Maranatha!

Laughter

Mr Ntundu: … Maranatha or whatever you call it in Kabwe.

Sir, this radio station has been commended by your Committee for the manner in which it disseminated information, especially for being non-partisan. I, therefore, commend the radio station on that note.

Mr Speaker, the other issue that I would like to talk about is the issue which has been highlighted on Page 27 of your Committee’s report concerning the reintroduction of the Freedom of Information Bill which I feel is very important. I am sure my colleagues on the other side of the House will agree with me that the information that we received during the previous campaign compels us to ensure that this Bill comes to the House so that the media can be regulated.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear! Hammer now!

Mr Ntundu: Sir, it is important that this Bill is brought to this House. I stand here, as a very disappointed Member of Parliament who has been reading from some sections of the media that took the role of campaign managers for certain political parties.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kambwili: ZNBC!

Hon. Government Members: The Post!

Mr Ntundu: Just wait! Do not comment because I do not need any paper to win an election in Gwembe.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, I am a disappointed Member of Parliament because we believe that journalism has ethics, but the previous information that we were receiving from the media made us doubt whether there was professionalism in the journalism fraternity in Zambia. Do we need to send journalists back to school to learn the ethics of journalism for them to report correctly and effectively and not to report lies or untruthful information?

Sir, I do not even need to beat about the bush. One of the media that I am talking about is The Post Newspaper.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear! Hammer!

Mr Ntundu: I can lay thirty papers on the Table of the House …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: … to show that what I am saying is truthful and I am doing so without fear or favour.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: I would like to refer to a meeting that was held in Monze by one political party. Some paper reported about this meeting and alleged that some person had invaded the Southern Province and yet this was a total lie and misinformation.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: Therefore, the MMD, as a Government, must be strong because they have been given the mandate to rule this country by the people. You must be strong!

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: You must not be a weak Government. Mr Mugabe is strong in Zimbabwe because he is powerful. He is strong and not weak! We cannot allow certain sections of the media to go from “earth to sky” without them being prosecuted for inciting violence.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: That is unacceptable! If you, members of the MMD, are carrying skeletons on your backs and you fear to investigate and charge some of these people, we shall sort them out for you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Order!

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order!

Laughter

Mr Speaker: This is not a House for sorting out anybody.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: No threats are allowed. You may debate, but decently.

Laughter

Mr Ntundu: I am trying to help the MMD, as a Government. This is the only country in the whole world, where the media will insult the Government, including the Head of State, and call it corrupt, stupid, and stinking, but no action is taken and instead you are smiling and watching. What is your role, as a Government? We shall not help you to manage this country with such kind of attitudes from some sections of the media, especially The Post. The Post is a stinking paper! It is useless!

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order!

Laughter

Mr Speaker: That is unparliamentary! You shall withdraw that word.

Laughter

Mr Ntundu: I withdraw the word “stinking” …

Hon. Members: And substitute it with …

Mr Ntundu: … and replace it …

Interruptions

Mr Ntundu: … with unprofessional reporting.

Hon. Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: We would like the Government to bring this Bill quickly. If need be, bring it this sitting so that we can pass it.

Hon. Government Members: No!

Mr D. Mwila: I will not be there.

Mr Ntundu: The House will pass it. If you want, you can abscond and the Bill will pass without you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, further, …

Interruptions

Mr Ntundu: You must not miss the point. I am making the point of the importance of bringing the Freedom of Information Bill to this House. That is what I am talking about. If you had a deal with The Post, that is your own business.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: If you paid them, you have lost out!

Hon. Members: Tell them!

Mr Ntundu: I am sure that your campaign manager must be sick now and in bed …

Laughter

Mr Ntundu: … because he did not achieve anything.

Interruptions

Mr Ntundu: In fact, I did not mention any political party, “So you are the one who paid The Post?”

Laughter

Hon. Opposition Members: Time!

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, I still have plenty of time. Do not worry.

Mr Speaker, furthermore, for the first time, I would also like to commend the Zambia Daily Mail and the Times of Zambia for the job well done, especially for the information that they gave to the Zambian people during the just-ended Presidential Campaign.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: Sir, I also would like to commend the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) for a job well done during the same period.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, I want to mention that from now on,…

Interruptions

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, I think I need your protection.

Laughter

Mr Ntundu: Sir, I want to emphasise that from today , if we shall tolerate such kind of reporting and if it continues to incite violence, the Government must arrest the people concerned.  

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, in fact, for your own information, some of these editors have got a bad side of life. They marry people’s wives. We have information .

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order! You shall withdraw that remark.

Laughter

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, I withdraw the statement.

Hon. Government Members: Continue!

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, some hon. Members are forcing me to say these things because they believe that the one man who heads the paper is decent and has morals and yet he is immoral. He is indecent and corrupt.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Order! Let me guide you. Whichever man you are talking about, hon. Member for Gwembe, is not in this House and he cannot defend himself. Leave him alone. Debate the report of my Committee.

Interruptions

Hon. Government Members: Hammer!

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, I thank you for your guidance.

 I would like to emphasise that the MMD Government must be strong. We must not let the media spoil or put the Government in ridicule. I am not looking for a job from the MMD Government ...

Interruptions

Mr Ntundu: … and I do not need it. I am speaking the truth and the only truth. Even at the back of your minds, you know that what I am saying is true.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: Sir, if you have skeletons that you fear will be written in The Post Newspaper, that is your own problem. What I am saying is that the Government must be strong to regulate and to ensure that Zambians are protected. We do not want violence.

Mr Speaker, lastly,…

Hon. Government Members: Continue!

Mr Ntundu: Sir, I am very happy that at this point, everybody is quiet listening to me.

Laughter

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, lastly, I would like to encourage the Government to bring the Information Bill to this House so that it is passed.

Mr Speaker, I thank you

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe (Matero): Mr Speaker, I would like to start by thanking the Chair for ably moving the Motion on Information and Broadcasting. I would like to start by saying that while the community radio stations have a mandate to increase access to airwaves, it still falls short. I would like to thank the community radio stations because they are supplementing the Government’s work. They are trying to carter for the people in their communities. I think these community radio stations need a lot of help. We should help them, maybe, by ensuring that the Government makes some advertisements on their waves so that they can make a some money and improve their services.

Mr Speaker, one point I would like to talk about is that there is a need for training for the people in the community radio stations. While we appreciate that they do not make a lot of money, it is important that they train their people. Why do I say so? It is good to speak English or to speak any other language, but that does not make you a professional. As a result, we have seen a lot of mistakes in their reporting. Sometimes, they report something that is just a speculation and it agitates the country. Sometimes, they do it unknowingly because they do not have adequate training. The Government must make sure that we have a body that will regulate the community radio stations. I agree with Hon. Ntundu on this point.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: Mr Speaker, the reports that come out of the papers, sometimes fall short of professionalism.

Mr Hamududu: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: Sir, it is a shame for a paper to report something in the paper one day only to have somebody refute ever having said it the following day. What are we hoping to achieve? We only have one Zambia …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: … and we have to protect it. We are not going to sit down in the name of the party or organisation seeing to it that the people who are there advance their own selfish interests to destroy this country.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: Sir, I am sure we have seen newspapers before. We have seen how newspapers are reporting. I am disappointed that we have The Post Newspaper in here. Why should people react when they are not The Post Newspaper?

Laughter

Hon. Government Members: Nsanda!

Mr Nsanda: There is no The Post Newspaper here!

Mrs Sinyangwe: Sir, we are hon. Members of Parliament in here.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: Mr Speaker, I think if I stand up and debate and people do not agree, it is up to them to take notes, stand up and ...

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: … counter what I say. While we are Parliamentarians, we are supposed to be professional. We are not supposed to be acting like people at the markets.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Mrs Sinyangwe: Mr Speaker, I speak as I see it because God gave me brains. I do not work on some else’s brains. I have seen that it is wrong. When people start dying in this country because of bad reporting, even the children of the people who are saying, “Hear, hear” will die. We are trying to say that we need all the papers and the community radio stations, but they should be guided. Someone may be reported to have said something one day and the following day, the person refutes what was reported. I would like to say that journalists must be journalists first. Before you become a Zambian, an editor at ZNBC or The Post Newspaper, you are a journalist first and you must do what is right first.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: Sir, as human beings, we support other people, but when we are doing a job for the nation, we must do what is right.

Interruptions

Mrs Sinyangwe: Mr Speaker, let me speak. I do not know why people are worried. We should not start worrying in this House. I am debating and no one has been stopped from debating. After I have stopped debating my debated has ended, somebody can ably stand up, debate and bring their points forward.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: Sir, we must see to it that we have ethics in every institution and in every profession. People must have their professional ethics that must be followed, unless we are saying we have thrown the country out to the winds. People admire this country. Why do they admire it? It is because we have been peaceful. We have had politicians in the past and we will continue to have them. We can have dissenting views, but that does not mean that we should fight or insult each other. We must talk in a normal manner.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: That is what we are asking for. There are people who are known for insulting and shouting at other people.

Dr Scott turned and looked at Mrs Sinyangwe

Hon. Dr Guy Scott, I am talking in a normal manner.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! The hon. Member will address the Chair. Please, ignore the hecklers.

Laughter

Mrs Sinyangwe: Mr Speaker, I thank you very much for your guidance.

Mr Speaker, the community radio stations should also have programming initiated by the communities. The community radio stations cover communities. They have issues that they are supposed to address about their communities. I think that they should be given time to sit down with the communities and look at some of those issues. I would like to hear communities in the Northern Province talking about issues that concern them. However, what is happening is that we are mooting their agenda.

Mr Speaker, I would also like to address the community radio stations that depend on volunteers. I am appealing to them to employ people to work in radio stations because they are sensitive organisations. When you engage someone as a volunteer, you cannot control them because you are not paying them. You need to train and pay these people. We are talking about freedom, which goes with responsibilities. You cannot just say you have freedom because where your freedom ends, another person’s freedom starts. Therefore, we cannot afford to let things go without controlling them.

Mr Speaker, finally, I would like to say that people have given this country a Government. I would like to reiterate Hon. Ntundu’s remarks. The Government must protect its people. Otherwise you do not know why you are there.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: We are not going to go to bed not sure whether there will be a war the next day. There are laws that should be followed and we have to follow them. It does not matter who is in Government. I am speaking as a responsible citizen.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: Mr Speaker, whether other people come into Government or not, laws must be followed because if you want to be respected, you must respect others.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: If you want people to respect you, you must also respect the Government of the day. Whether I want them there or not, the people of Zambia have put them there. We must help them and do what is right to serve Mother Zambia.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sinyangwe: We have only one country, Zambia. God does not make countries anymore. Therefore, let us protect it from people who are writing wrong things.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala (Chilubi): Mr Speaker, firstly, I would like to pay tribute to your Committee and, indeed, the Chairman for the able and intelligent manner in which he has presented the report to this august House.

Mr Speaker, Zambians in rural areas, of late, can be described as having been robbed of their right to access the electronic media, particularly, the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC). I say so because in the remote areas of this country, it is a rare occasion for people to listen to the main newscast after 18:00 hours. The best example is the constituency where I come from, Chilubi.

Mr Speaker, it happened that this year, between April and August, the people of Chilubi Parliamentary Constituency were not able to access ZNBC. The only radio station they could get news from was Radio Christian Voice. In this regard, I am making an earnest appeal to the hon. Minister of Information and Broadcasting to see to it that Zambians are accorded an opportunity to enjoy their privilege of listening to their radio station.

Mr Speaker, in addition, it would be paramount for the hon. Minister of Information and Broadcasting to ensure that television coverage is extended to all rural parts of this country. We are not going to tolerate situations whereby certain quarters in this country are marginalised and others favoured. I believe to the best of my knowledge that the cake of this country is supposed to be shared equally.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, furthermore, I would like to talk about manpower at some radio stations, particularly, ZNBC.

Mr Speaker, to some extent, people are not able to access news on ZNBC simply because, at times, our colleagues do not have qualified staff.

Hon. Members: Aah!

Mr Chisala: It would be important, therefore, for ZNBC and other radio stations to employ people with the required qualifications so that the problems being faced, which they have lamentably failed to curb, can be brought under control.

Mr Speaker, I would now like to talk about the running of community radio stations in this country. While I appreciate the gesture by the MMD Government to introduce community radio stations, it is important to note that some radio stations, sooner than later, will not be operational simply because they cannot manage to look for funds. This is the more reason why it is imperative for the Government, with effect from January next year, to extend a hand to these private radio stations so that people in rural areas do not go to the trouble of looking for money to run these radio stations. As it is, our people are living in abject poverty. They cannot afford to look for money to pay for these radio stations, which are run countrywide.

Mr Speaker, furthermore, I would like to emphasise my point that it is not right for our Government to lead the people by asking them to look for their own resources and yet, some of these people even fail to have two meals per day while others go on empty bellies for two days. These are some of the issues which the Government of the day is supposed to address.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, let me now talk about the issue of threats. In my view, it is a crime for anybody, regardless of their political positions or the position they have in Government, to issue threats from time to time to the people that run these community radio stations. It is very unhealthy. These are some of the situations that we cannot allow to continue prevailing in this country.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, from time to time, we have heard hon. Ministers, of course, it is not every hon. Minister, issue threats to community radio station operators. I hope those who are not guilty of this offence will not be offended by statement.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, hon. Ministers have been issuing statements trying to threaten people in private-owned stations that their radio stations were going to be closed down. This is not acceptable. These are the people who had allowed freedom of expression. Therefore, these continuous threats by the hon. Minister of Information and Broadcasting Services being showered on the private radio station owners should be brought to an end. It is high time we did away with some of the things which are not relevant and that could plunge this country into trouble.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, we cannot allow this country and some leaders to go to the extent of making negative and provocative statements. This is unpalatable, unacceptable and retrogressive. Above all, it is inhuman.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, let me now talk about the coverage that we experienced in the just-ended presidential by-election.

Sir, Zambia is a democratic country. Therefore, I do believe to the best of my knowledge that when you are living in a democratic state such as Zambia, people are supposed to be accorded equal opportunity because we believe that we are taxpayers. Why were some candidates favoured, twenty minutes on TV?

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, this situation should be brought to an end.
Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! There are too many running commentaries. I would like to the hon. Member who is debating. May the House listen with me?

May the hon. Member continue, please

Hon. PF Members: Hammer! Hammer!

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, I am condemning the manner in which ZNBC carried out it adverts on the just-ended presidential by-elections.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Sir, we cannot allow that because we are all taxpayers.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, what used to happen is something which can be described as unjust, unacceptable, inhuman and above all, retrogressive.

 Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Therefore, I am of the idea that since I do not want certain people in this country to be treated as second-class citizens, it is imperative that we are all accorded the same opportunity. We are not going to allow this practice to be a trouble shooting issue. Furthermore, I just would like to call upon the hon. Minister of Information and Broadcasting Services to see to it that the issues that I have brought to him and the attention of this august House will help him to blow a wind of change on his face.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Milupi (Luena): Mr Speaker, first of all, I would like to thank the Chairman of the Committee and also the seconder of this Motion. I shall be very brief in my contribution to this Motion.

Mr Speaker, the press is often referred to as the fourth estate after the Executive, Legislature Judiciary. It is an important component of the governance of any nation. Therefore, it is only proper that we as citizens expect fair treatment from the press.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Milupi: Mr Speaker, when an honourable person has done something wrong he/she will sit down and reflect on what she/he has done and be remorseful,

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Milupi: Mr Speaker, I say this because the just-ended presidential by-elections, perhaps, was the worst coverage that some of the press exhibited.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Milupi: Mr Speaker, how possible is it that first of all before, we come to ZNBC, and I have no problem discussing anybody, ...

It is right and proper for a media house to have a position. As we know, the print media can have a position which is called an editorial position in which they can favour even a political party and I have no problem only if this position is reflected in their editorial comment. How possible is it that you can have a newspaper whose comment day after day is against one particular candidate; all its letters to the editor are against one candidate; all its jokes are against one candidate and all its satirical writings are against one particular candidate?

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Milupi: Mr Speaker, I speak as an honest human being and I think that was quite disgraceful.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Milupi: The paper went to the extent of doctoring pictures where even armatures like ourselves could see that this particular picture in the paper was a cut and paste.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Milupi: Several pictures were combined to display a certain position. I think this does not augur well with this nation country. Members of the press should seriously reflect that we, as citizens, require is unfettered information so that when we see that information, we can make up our mind as to which side we support.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Mr Milupi: Mr Speaker, let me also refer to the other side of the media, the community stations which have been referred to in the Committee’s report.

Sir, community radio stations are a breath of fresh air. They provide a very useful service to our communities in various parts of this country. Let us also recognise the difficulties under which they operate. Some of them have already been referred to such as the lack of resources, using volunteers who are not paid and so on. Let us give them support, but in doing so, let us recognise the problems that they operate under.

Sir, one of the issues that have brought difficulties is that of live phone-in programmes because the operators have no control over what the people calling in say. Sometimes the comments have been injurious to the subjects that have been portrayed. Every citizen of this country is entitled to protection and dignity under the law. Even if the Committee condemned certain sections, I would have loved to see a situation where there would have been much more balance.

The situation referred to by the Chairperson in his comments about Radio Lyambai and the Batroste Royal Establishment (BRE), in particular, arises from live phone-in programmes over which they have no control. However, anyone who feels injured can go live on radio and vent out their frustrations, sometimes in a very insulting manner. Even as we seek to be fair to a radio station, Mr Speaker, I think it is right that we are also fair to the people who are insulted and, therefore, come up with solutions that will help those radio stations so that they have a fairer coverage.

In the Western World or in the civilised world, you cannot say certain things on a radio station without making yourself liable to litigation.

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Milupi: In the case that the Chairperson referred to, if we had those sort of laws in place, the particular radio station we are seeking to protect would have gone under because of litigation.

With those few remarks, Mr Speaker, as I promised that I would be very brief, I would like to thank you.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Minister of Southern Province (Mr Munkombwe): Mr Speaker, I wish to thank you for affording me this opportunity to comment on this reasonably presented report by the Chairperson of this Committee, who made references to community radio stations.

Sir, I agree with what the hon. Member of Parliament for Liuwa …

Hon. Members: Luena!

Mr Milupi: It is Luena!

Mr Munkombwe: … for Luena said, especially when he referred to some of the comments made by some commercial radio stations that use unqualified reporters, untrained people who cannot reject or accept certain commentaries, particularly those directed at individuals.

Sir, a newspaper can make itself irrelevant by the way it reports.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: There are decent people in this country who cannot stand reading a particular newspaper which contains insults of an individual. They throw it away.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: In that way, that paper makes itself irrelevant.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: I believe that we have decent topics to write about. In this particular case, I would like to praise the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) for the manner in which they presented …

Hon. Opposition Members: Aah!

Mr Kambwili: Question!

Mr Munkombwe: Some people are saying “question”, but when ZNBC reported facts about so and so who did something during his time, they did not complained. Likewise, when the results from the presidential by-elections were overwhelmingly in their favour, they said there was no rigging.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: Immediately the votes started tilting the other way, there was some cry of rigging.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: And yet, nobody in this country has ever come up with a way in which votes are rigged. Everybody is busy chasing after someone like we chase kabwalalas.

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: And the kabwalala you are chasing will be also shouting “kabwalala uyo!”

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: And so, everybody is busy chasing somebody.

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: Therefore, we have no evidence.

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: We have no evidence, Mr Speaker.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order!

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order in the House!

Mr Munkombwe: Thank you, Sir. We have no evidence in this country that people who are being ridiculed …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Before the hon. Minister goes any further, there were certain vernacular expressions which he is required to interpret.

Mr Munkombwe: Oh yes, sorry.

Mr Munkombwe still standing up.

Hon. Opposition Members: Sit down!

Interruptions

Hon. Governments Members: Go ahead!

Mr Munkombwe: If a thief is running away from people who are chasing him, he will continue shouting “thief” whilst pointing at another person.

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: And yet, that same person shouting “thief” is the thief himself.

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: In this country, we have had a Government-controlled media …

Mr Malama: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Hon. Government Members: Aah, iwe!

Mr V. Mwale: Nkala pansi!

Mr Malama: Mr Speaker, I rise on a very serious point of order. Is the hon. Member who is debating …

Hon. Members: So well!

Mr Malama: … in order to continue debating in that manner and yet he was one of the first Deputy Ministers in this country to admit that Patriotic Front was winnin?

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

Mr Malama: I need your serious ruling, Mr Speaker.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: The hon. Deputy Minister may continue.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: The kabwalala called me kabwalala, and yet I am not a kabwalala, but the kabwalala was running away.

Laughter

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, this section of the press completely destroyed the little support which the other people had.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: People lost sympathy for that paper and eventually the sponsors of that particular paper were also dissuaded from supporting the paper.

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, we want this country to be run properly. ZNBC, the Zambia Daily Mail and the Times …

Mr Kambwili: You benefited from ZNBC!

Mr Munkombwe: Yes! You have a school in your area and you are benefiting. And if you have a road or clinic in your areas you are also benefiting. Those are politics of benefits of which I am proud to preach about.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Those people who are thieves and greedy cannot agree that this time around, there was no struggle. There is nothing to liberate you from whatever. This time around, we want clinics and schools in our areas. Therefore, those who report about activities, whether it be activities from the Opposition or not, must report decently.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: I know that we have very decent people around, particularly those Members of Parliament who come from somewhere this way. They are very decent people.

Laughter

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: And yet they belong to the Opposition.

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: There is nobody who is sarcastic. These people do agree whenever there are things to agree about and oppose whenever there is need to do so.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: That is why I operate freely. They even advise me when I go offside.

Laughter

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: And I also direct them to go in a certain way.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: That is what politics is about.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: If you are going to shout at everybody who says something you do not want to hear, then you are not worth being a Member of Parliament …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: … because you are not ready to listen.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Can we show decency, please? Mr Speaker, whatever we do in life, whether we are farmers or are in Parliament, we must show some form of decency. Today, you can be in Government and tomorrow in the Opposition. And so, if you behave in a certain way like some people did, for example, like a recent incident we had in Choma where one of the so-called presidents of a party slapped a person at a supermarket, and yet he purports to be a president of a country ...

Hon. Opposition Members: Aah!

Mr Munkombwe: … it is extremely unpalatable, extremely inexcusable if there was any better word that I would use, I would use it, save to say that was a foolish action by that particular person.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order! Order!

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order! That word is not palatable!

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: I am sorry, Mr Speaker. Sir, my own view, is that, please, if we want to get into government by any miracle, can we be attractive?

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: If you behave like a gorilla even at a funeral you want to show that you are there and you are uncontrollable, is that not disgraceful?

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: Please, I would like to say …

Mr Kambwili: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, I rise on a very serious point of order. Is the hon. Member on the Floor in order to run away from the report and start debating the election period rumours? I expect the hon. Minister to debate the report. I need your serious ruling.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member for Roan has difficulties following the manner of debate by the hon. Deputy Minister for Southern Province. He prefers that the hon. Deputy Minister for Southern Province should does not debate those issues related to elections, but only those related to the report of my Committee.

The hon. Deputy Minister is still on the Floor and he may address the matter of why he justifies the manner in which he is debating.

May he continue, please?

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, the presidential press coverage were well covered by the Mover of the Motion. He also involved community and commercial radio stations and it is on that basis that I am attempting to debate that we need decent reporting and that nobody cannot be hurt by decent reporting. If you are reported correctly, it does not matter what you say, whether it is for or against, you are decently reported or covered.

Mr Speaker, the coverage by ZNBC and Television Zambia were perfect.

Hon. PF Members: No!

Mr Munkombwe: If you have lost, that is not my problem.

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, I would like to say that some of the people who stood as presidential candidates, Brigadier-General Miyanda was very magnanimous in accepting the results and the brilliant young man, Hakainde Hichilema, also openly, unashamedly accepted the results while the others are trying to cause problems in the country. We will deal with you.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Order! This report appears to be quite attractive and as such the whole House wants to debate it. By just looking, I see twenty-five hon. Members of Parliament wishing to debate this report. I would like to call on those hon. Members who wish to debate to listen very carefully. You may realise that the point you want to make has already been covered by another hon. Debater.

So it looks as if there is a repetition now, but let us hear from the hon. Member for Sinda if there is no repetition in his debate.

Mr Ngoma (Sinda): Mr Speaker, I run the risk of probably saying some of the things which my colleagues have said, knowing that this Motion is, indeed, very sensitive. I do support fully that we do adopt the Report on the Committee of Information and Broadcasting.

Mr Speaker, indeed, the media is the fourth estate in all the states of the world and its independence and freedom should be guarded jealously. In this regard, I wish to commend the Zambian people for having conducted an election which was violent free. However, in line with reporting and information, since the return to democracy in 1990, and having seen what is obtaining on the ground, it is clear to most of the Zambian people that we saw the worst media sensation in this country.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ngoma: Mr Speaker, that has to be checked if this country has to progress. If this country has to develop, we need the media just as we need the leadership. The media needs to be protected just as the citizens of this country need to be protected.

Mr Speaker, Hon. Ntundu talked about the Media Bills to brought to the House. I was one of the proponents of the Independent Broadcasting Authority, the Zambia National Broadcasting Act and we are now calling for the introduction of the Freedom of Information Bill. I was of the view that the Bill should be passed as it is, but looking at what is obtaining in the country, we need protection and so we need some regulation of some kind.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ngoma: Mr Speaker, when we say we need regulation, we do not mean to be draconian, but we just need things to be done in an orderly manner so that at the end of the day, we all benefit.

We, in the East, say, “Chaona munzako chapita, mawa chilli paiwe”. That is to say, something that has befallen your friend, especially that which is negative is past, tomorrow it may be on you. Maybe because I am sitting on the other side of the bench, I see certain media as being biased, but tomorrow when I am on the other side, I might want to commend that type of reporting. What I am saying is that we need fair coverage. In that regard, talking about the media and information, I want to commend the leadership which has come out publicly to say that, we do not need to be violent, following the presidential elections.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ngoma: Mr Speaker, in this regard, I would like to commend Brigadier-General Miyanda of the Heritage Party who was magnanimous in accepting defeat and called for peace in this country. I commend that. I also would like to commend Mr Hakainde Hichilema for being magnanimous in accepting the results. I would also like to commend the public pronouncement by PF that we should be peaceful.

Interruptions

Mr Ngoma: It is important that we are peaceful and that those calls for peace are not just in the press or are publicly pronounced, but also promoted even in dark corners. Therefore, whoever is calling for peace, even in privacy, they should call for peace and not pull strings down.

Mr Speaker, Rwanda is what it is today because in 1994, we had a terrible genocide and close to a million people were butchered. When President Habyarimana’s plane was shattered, what followed was that the media was used to bring about untold anarchy and a lot of killings and so even in this country, following the presidential by-elections, the media as the fourth estate will need to help us to preserve peace.

We are all Zambians at the end of the day, as somebody debated. If this peace is not guarded jealously, it is our own children who will be killed. We only know of one country and that is Zambia. There is no other country we can go to. Therefore, the media, that is, both the private and public needs to help us. They will need to help us preserve this peace, not create imaginary tension. It is very dangerous because at the end of the day, we might regret as the consequences of violence would be too ghastly for us to contemplate as a country.

Mr Speaker, it is important as we debating this Bill for the Government to take a serious look at issues to do with ZNBC, the Zambia Daily Mail and Times of Zambia. We need to remunerate these persons who work at these places handsomely. We normally complain of sensational reporting, probably because the men and women at those institutions are not looked after very well. It is the duty of any the Government because for any Government to develop, they need to be told the truth. That truth should not only come from the private media, but also from the public media. For them, principles such as, remember, you cannot bite the finger that feeds you are very dangerous. Therefore, let us create a good environment for the journalists at the public media houses.

With those few words, I thank you, Sir.

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member for Lusaka Central.

Members: Hear, hear!

PF Members: Hammer!

Interruptions

Dr Scott: Mr Speaker, I would like to start by assuring you that you still have work to do in this House with some Opposition on your left hand side. In fact, I would say there are about twenty-two people whom I can definitely count as Opposition.

PF Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Scott: We are all aware the function of Opposition, …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! The hon. Member for Lusaka Central please, continue.

Dr Scott: … of course, is not to embrace the Government and kiss it on the various parts of its anatomy …

PF Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Scott: … or to necessarily help it …

Hon. Government Members: White British!

Mr Muyanda: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Muyanda: Mr Speaker, I enjoy to listen to wisdom. I arise on a very serious point of order. Is this hon. Member of Parliament …

Laughter

Mr Muyanda: … for Lusaka Central in order to say that there are only twenty-two Members of Opposition and continue insulting that we are supporting the Government ….

Hon. Government Members: Kissing.

Mr Muyanda: … kissing Government?

Interruptions

Mr Muyanda: That word is unparliamentary and not only has he said and unparliamentary word, is he in order to insult our intelligence and legitimacy of being in this House? Mr Speaker, I need your serious ruling.

Mr Speaker: My serious ruling on that point of order which has been raised by the hon. Member for Sinazongwe is that the hon. Member for Lusaka Central is actually expressing his opinion, …

Mr Kambwili: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: … to which he is entitled in this House.

He may continue.

PF Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Scott: Mr Speaker, the wall of bulwark who pained the one, thank God you cannot bribe or twist the upright British journalist. However, seeing what money can do …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! Some of you may not be interested in listening to hon. Member for Lusaka Central, but I am. I want to listen to him.

He may continue.

Dr Scott: I said thank God you cannot bribe or twist the upright British journalists, but seeing what money can do and bribe, there was no occasion to. In other words, journalists are a very independent-minded and troublesome profession.

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

Dr Scott: You cannot expect journalists to be lining up and not to reveal things which you do not agree with because they have been bribed. There is an adage, of course, about people living in glass houses. My father founded the Mail and it has been my disappointment for many decades now.

Hon. Government Members: Where?

Dr Scott: In 1962.

Hon. Government Members: Where?

Dr Scott: In Lusaka in 1962.

Laughter

Interruptions

Dr Scott: It was in the same office, Mr Speaker, it is still in. It was started as an indigenous prone weekly Central African Post, was suppressed by the Federal Government and no …

Hon. Government Member interjected.

Dr Scott: Yes, by the colonialists for supporting African self determination.

Hon. Government Members: Sit down.

Dr Scott: … and majority rule. Do not question if … Mr Speaker, it amazes me some of us know the history of this country …

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

Dr Scott: … and others are mocking it as if they can dream it up themselves. Now, the question of throwing stones in glass houses or grass houses perhaps, I hope the hon. Minister is going to address this debate because the relevant hon. Ministers have not responded to any of the issues brought up the previous three Committee reports that we have had. It is as if they are tired from sleeping in graveyards or whatever they have been doing this evening, …

Laughter

Dr Scott: … waiting for some new dispensation to overtake the present one.

Laughter

Dr Scott: I do hope the hon. Minister will address the question of how the State media which is outrageously selected and is essentially a media of propaganda is also going to be regulated under the Freedom of International Act, so that we can all have truthful reporting newspapers or violence instigating newspapers. As he well knows and many others who have travelled, Members of this House know, you cannot stop newspapers from behaving in a rather independent way. That is why there are so many newspapers and so much competition between newspapers. They are something like twenty daily titles in the United Kingdom alone and you choose the ones which tend to have the bias which you yourself have, which have the view of the world which you yourself have.

PF Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Scott: More newspapers and not more control of newspapers is what this country needs. If you have seven, eight or nine equally selling independent newspapers, we would not even notice that one was supporting this party and the other was supporting another party. We would leave the ones you wanted to leave …

PF Members: … and it is their freedom to publish and your freedom to read or not to read.

PF Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Scott: I think with those few words, Mr Speaker, I just think that I need to introduce a word into the Parliament vocabulary. I wonder whether you will admit it. Mr Speaker, that word is “gon’ga”. Do you accept that word, Mr Speaker?

Mr Speaker: No!

Laughter

Dr Scott: With that forbidden word, I close my debate.

Mr Speaker: No, I will not accept it.

The Minister of Gender and Women in Development (Ms Mulasikwanda): Mr Speaker, I thank you …

Interruptions

Ms Mulasikwanda: … for according me this opportunity to contribute to the Report of the Committee on Information and Broadcasting Services which has been tabled by the very able Chairman of the Committee.

May I begin by congratulating the Committee for the report which is very clear and articulate. Zambia is an oasis of peace. This is not debatable because many people turn to Zambia to learn how our founding fathers have managed to keep this peace. Today, I would like to speak about the peace in this country because it should not be lost through the selfishness and greed of those who want to get power from the ruling party.

Mr Speaker, as a Christian, I believe that the peace that we enjoy in this country is not ordinary, but God-given and, therefore, we should not lose it. However, if we become careless by allowing certain quarters of the media to portray that some political parties are more formidable than others, it may lead to instability. There is a need for us to go back to the drawing board and start re-planning how best we can train our journalists on reporting these issues.

The hon. Members who have spoken before me have already articulated these issues on the media and I rise to support the introduction of a Bill on the regulation of the media. A Bill must be brought to this House so that the media can be regulated for us to become responsible people. Zambia is a liberated State with forty-four years after the time we were in the White man’s shackles, which we broke and managed to attain independence and the Government is now in the hands of the Black man.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Mulasikwanda: Therefore, it would be shameful today for the people of Zambia to allow foreign attitudes, which our founding fathers fought against, and bring instability in our country.

Interruptions

Dr Scott: On a point of order, Sir.

Ms Mulasikwanda: Even as we speak …

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Dr Scott: Mr Speaker, I just want to raise a brief point of order on whether the hon. Member speaking is in order to say that she has just said …

Hon. Members: It is “she”.

Dr Scott: I said, “she”. Is she in order to say what she has just said about foreign influences given the importance of foreign media advisors and image builders in the campaign in which she has just participated?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: The hon. Minister may continue.

Ms Mulasikwanda: Mr Speaker, I am not going to respond to what the hon. Member for Lusaka Central has said.

As I was saying, it is not correct for Zambians to adopt attitudes that may bring instability in the country. I speak like this because, just like I said before, I am a woman and a mother and know that if there is any instability in this country for no apparent reason, my children, grandchildren and I will all be affected.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Mulasikwanda: The men who are in the forefront of bringing this instability, may perhaps have other homes to run to. I have only one country that I know as home, which is Zambia and, therefore, as a woman, I need to speak to the nation that never to allow people to incite instability.

Mr Speaker, I have heard other hon. Members of this House speaking about the elections. I would like to point out that it is wrong for a political party to campaign through a newspaper.

Hon. PF Members: Aah!

Ms Mulasikwanda: When we went on the ground, I was shocked to learn that there was no such thing as other political parties having “swallowed” the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) in the Western Province. Perhaps, people had gone to attend rallies of other political parties just to see the people in these parties. In the Western Province in particular, we all know that we are brought up under that type of – what can I say?

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Mulasikwanda: … – decency, whereby, if a political party goes to visit a palace and starts commanding the indunas and king of Barotseland, then there would be a problem. If the people of Barotseland do not vote for a certain party, there is no need to blame the ruling party of having rigged an election.

Mr Speaker: Order!

Ms Mulasikwanda: It is a great shame.

Mr Speaker: Order! There is no such part of Zambia known as Barotseland. May you address it through the official name of the province.

Ms Mulasikwanda: Mr Speaker, I thank you for your guidance, I meant the Western Province. In the Western Province, there is an attitude that other people cannot change because of the decent manner in which we are brought up. Whether other people bring different customs into the Western Province, we shall never change. We shall remain with our decency and when other people come to us in a manner that threatens our decency, we tend to react towards them and they should know that.

Mr Speaker, this afternoon, I only wanted to support the Committee’s report and encourage the House to come up with a Bill to regulate journalists and the media at large so that Zambia shall remain stable.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga (Kalomo): Mr Speaker, I wish to actually support the Committee’s report. What has transpired here today is a clear indication of what bad reporting can bring. Sitting here and listening to the various debates and running commentaries, it can be seen that because of the press, we could easily end up having fights in the House.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: It is this indication of what has happened here that could lead to the public also start fighting. It is not a joke. I come from a party that did not have a special newspaper supporting it. When we look at what was happening, this report has brought out issues that people were bottled with. Even the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) did not do their work properly. When it came to paying, I think ZNBC received money from all political parties, but even news was used for campaigns by a certain political party.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: Only news about one political party was aired on ZNBC. However, when other media houses supported certain political parties, those supported by the public media would get annoyed. This is why we are calling on the press to be neutral and let the people decide the party to vote for without influence from the media.

Both the Times of Zambia and the Zambia Daily Mail have tried to be biased. However, we understand that a newspaper that collects monthly taxpayers’ money should not be biased. Talking about the private media, although we know that they have their own choices, we can only appeal to them to desist from making certain statements that can put this country on fire. That is all we are talking about and it is these things that we support.

Mr Speaker, let me refer to the report on the Chairman’s statement that they have realised that the community radio stations should be supported by Government funding. I think this is important. Certain community radio stations may not manage to operate without assistance. The Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) receives money from anyone who buys a television even though they may not be watching ZNBC. They could be watching Muvi Television or Digital Satellite Television (DS tv). However, the mere fact that we made a law here to allow ZNBC to charge every Zambian K3,000.00 for buying a television, in my view, means that money should be shared with all other television service providers because we use their stations. From thereon, this particular report has brought in issues that will need consideration.

Mr Speaker, from the way we are debating, it clearly shows that our country could be put on fire. I do not want to state that you have lost or won. We, in UPND, are neutral hon. Members, but we have been attacked in the crossfire that “your eyes are becoming MMD or the MMD will say, you have become PF”. Depending on the subject, all we are saying is that the Chairperson has brought out issues that are important.

Therefore, in supporting the report, we have to indicate that it is important that the press takes responsibility for the betterment of our country. We do not need this in-fighting while others are commenting, thinking they are more clever than others. Instead you must think: What is it that has happened, why is it that we are about to go to blows, why is it that in Kitwe they are talking about riots now and what is it that has happened? All these have come about because of these things we are talking about.

Mr Speaker, the other day, it was alleged that we, in UPND, were more divided than ever before. They do not realise that even other groupings have choices and it is those choices which are putting this country into problems. Therefore, the only point we can emphasise, as we support your report, is to try as much as possible to bring sanity to reporting. Also while people welcome the Freedom of Information Bill, I did not expect that people would be excited about this Bill. In anger, you will make a very wrong law.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: For now, you will be excited because you are annoyed that a certain paper did not support you and also that some people did not support you. Your law will not be a meaningful law. You will try to enact a law that will work against you.

In this regard, I appeal to all hon. Members of Parliament that this report only brings out issues and that we should not hasten to enact a law that may be to our advantage because we are hurt. In this House, we had laws that ended up being opposite of what we intended them to do. I think as Legislators, we should be above all these petty issues and be able to bring the relevant issues together and support the report.

Mr Speaker, I support the report.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikota (Livingstone): Mr Speaker, I stand to support this Motion and I thank both the mover and seconder for the able manner in which they presented the Motion.

Mr Speaker, it is well-known fact that I am a friend and a defender of the press. All my debates in this House have always been along those lines. I am also the person who attempted to introduce the Freedom of Information Bill because I felt very strongly about the subject.

I must say that inspite of everything that has gone on in the past couple of weeks, I am still a very strong believer in the freedom of the press, and a strong defender ofthe freedom of the press.

However, I do recognise that those of us who strongly believed in the freedom of the press are going to have a very difficult time in defending the press …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikota: … because of the manner in which the press has behaved. In this very House, I put forward arguments that the press was responsible enough to be able to regulate itself. I was able to fend off very vigorous arguments from various quarters because there were no ready examples that those who had an opposite view could put forward. I can foresee that the next time that this debate comes, they will have a lot of ammunition and I will be on the defensive. I do not know whether I will be able to adequately defend because there is so much ammunition against.

Laughter

Mr Sikota: Mr Speaker, whereas I agree with the debate of the hon. Member for Kalomo that we should not make laws in haste because we are emotional, it is, however, a fact that we cannot run away from that laws usually are made to deal with situations that arise and problems that people see.

Interruptions

Mr Sikota: Therefore, with what has been happening, it would be wishful thinking to think that there will not be a spirited attempt to introduce legislation that would regulate the press.

It is only hoped by me that between now and that time, the press itself will seriously reflect upon what it is doing, upon the kind of situation they are presenting for us who so much want to defend them and see that we need their assistance in terms of behaving in a responsible manner.

Mr Speaker, we need to soberly reflect on what the role of the press is. Whether private or public, the media’s effect is the same. Both Government and private media need to act responsibly. I am not in this debate to play a blame game and I do not think that is what we need at this particular time. We need sober reflection on what the consequences of certain types of reporting are.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Mr Sikota: The learned hon. Minister of Justice will, no doubt, support me in the submission I am about to make with regard to the happenings in Rwanda and the tribunals which were held regarding the Rwanda genocide. The hon. Member for Sinda touched on it and rightly stated that the media played a very large role in the genocide of more than 800,000 people …

Hon. Member: Shame!

Mr Sikota: …in a space of less than a 100 days. That was more than 8,000 people being massacred per day.

Mr Hamududu: Ahh!

Mr Sikota: That calls for us to have sober reflection. Is that what we require to happen in Zambia? Where more than 8,000 people per day get massacred? Where little babies are thrown into pit latrines and people headed into churches where petrol is then splashed all over them and lit into a blaze? Where people are massacred with pangas, axes and hoes?

Hon. UPND Members: Chawama!

Hon. PF Member: Mapatizya! Mwalilaba? Do not throw stones.

Mr Sikota: Those are the things we need to soberly reflect on even as we sit in this House. Currently, there are more than twenty-five journalists who have been convicted by the Rwanda International Tribunal. That shows you the kind of effect that they had because that is a large number. They have been convicted for various terms ranging from fifteen years to life because of the gravity of what they had done.

Hon. MMD Member: Arrest them!

Mr V Mwale: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikota: It is not only people from the press, but priests …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mulyata: Father Bwalya!

Mr Sikota: … have been convicted in the Rwanda genocide as being some of the lead causes for that terrible and dark part of our history in Africa.

Mr V. Mwale: Father Bwalya!

Mr Speaker: Order!

Hon. MMD Member: Bwalya!

Mr Kambwili: Nabalandakale order, iwe! You are celebrating over that?

Mr Sikota: Mr Speaker, it is sad that at this particular time, some people seem to believe that it is permissible to go on radio to incite people into violence.

Hon. MMD Members: Shame!

Mr Sikota: There is a priest in Rwanda by the name of Atanaze Seromba from the Catholic Church.

Hon. Members: Oh!

Mr Sikota: Father Atanaze Seromba went on radio …

Hon. MMD Member: Q FM!

Mr Sikota: … and told people to rise up and get violent. He was arrested. Nobody said that it was wrong to arrest him. In fact, he was not tried by just a simple court. He was tried by an international tribunal. This priest who went on radio inciting violence was tried, given all the opportunity to defend himself, but was convicted and sentenced to fifteen years imprisonment for his acts.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikota: As we speak, he is still in prison because of those irresponsible acts.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, Quality!

Mr Speaker: Order!

Mr Sikota: When we are talking of the press, we must keep these very live and real examples in our minds, for if we were to ignore them, there is no reason we cannot be visited by similar calamity in our own country.

Mr Kambwili: Mulaponta, imwe!

Mr Sikota: It is not, like I said, about a blame game. I am not going to point any fingers in any direction. I am just going to ask for each one of us the media, the editors, the priests, the citizens, the politicians, the leaders and everybody to really search our consciences. We must ensure that what happened in Rwanda does not come to visit us.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikota: Mr Speaker, I would like to sit down with just this last word. There was an issue of what the function of the Opposition was that was brought up. What it should be is a matter of opinion. For some, their opinion is that it must always be to oppose. For others, and I am of that school, the Opposition must be responsible, loyal and able to give guidance and alternative ideas to the Government.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikota: Anything other than that would be …

Mr V Mwale: Treason!

Mr Sikota: … to behave like those priests and journalists in Rwanda.

Hon. MMD and UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikota: With those few words, Mr Speaker, I thank you..

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

The Minister of Information and Broadcasting Services (Mr Mulongoti): Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me an opportunity to debate the Committee report on Information and Broadcasting Services.

Mr Speaker, I am in a celebrating mood for two reasons. Firstly, as a Christian, I am very expectant of Christmas …

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: … and also, very recently, we have had some victory which we celebrated very quietly …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mulongoti: This does not imply that we are not happy about it, but that we are being magnanimous to allow those in mourning to also have a peaceful time.

Hon Members: Hear, hear!

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: Mr Speaker, I was accused of threatening the press by the hon. Member of Parliament for Chilubi. I am a friend of the press. Any journalist worth his or her salt in this country has access to me 24 hours. I talk to all of them and they have a friend in me.

However, when I remind them that we all share the responsibility for them to report factually and for me to answer truthfully, it does not imply that I am threatening them because responsibility is for both of us. If some hon. Members would like to believe that freedom is unlimited, they would realise that even the Constitution provides for positive discrimination. That is why you are recognised as a man or a woman. It is not that you are being discriminated against. Therefore, to be told that within the confines of your freedoms, you must be responsible enough to recognise that other people also have their rights, does not imply threats.

Mr Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1815 hours until 1830 hours.

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Mulongoti: Mr Speaker, I thank you, once again, for giving me the opportunity to wide up debate on this Motion.

Sir, the hon. Member of Parliament for Gwembe referred to our Government as being a weak Government, but I would like to state that we are just running a civilised Government.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mulongoti: The responsibility of the Government is to protect its citizens and not harm them. When citizens go wrong, the Government tries everything possible to correct them. However, there comes a time when the State defends itself against a citizen who wants to destabilise the peace of a country.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mulongoti: It does not matter where you are. Whether you are in the First or Second World, the bigger good, which is the protection of the country, is always taken into consideration. We are all stakeholders in this country and we have a lot to protect. Those who have nothing to protect must be fair to us by allowing us to leave our lives peacefully.

Laughter

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mulongoti: I watched the American Elections and said to myself that it was a crying shame that I find myself on the same planet and in the same century with Barack Obama. Barack Obama depicted a picture of one from outer space.

Mr Speaker, we had our elections a few days earlier than the Elections in the United States of America. What did we see? We expected the conduct of Mr McCain …

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: … who graciously addressed his supporters and said, “I congratulate Senator Obama.” What has been difficult in our situation?

Hon. Government Members: PF!

Mr Mulongoti: Is it the ability to accept that in any competition there must be a winner and a loser? Why should we continue to protest every time election results are announced? I think the issue of adding a premium to leadership is beginning to loom big in our minds. Unless we can begin to add value to leadership, we might continue having these problems.

Hon. Government Members: That is a point!

Mr Mulongoti: This is because democracy is about competition. When you compete, you are submitting to the rules of the game. You cannot turn around and begin to accuse your opponent, who won, of dishonesty.

Mr Speaker, watching the counting of the votes of this last election in Zambia gave us hope. To the extent that they were happy to see the results in their favour, were we equally worried …

Hon. Government Members: Yes!

Mr Mulongoti: … that our tenure was coming to an end. More so for me, as a Nominated Member of Parliament, …

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: … because I was going to lose everything.

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: Therefore, for me, it was not just about the results, it was also about my future. That is why when we were campaigning, when others were saying, “Please God allow us to win,” I said, “God we must win.”

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Leave God out of this!

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: No wonder my candidate won. It is because I pleaded with God very honestly.

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: Therefore, I feel very sad that my happiness wanted to be disturbed by people who wanted me to be on the streets. I heard them on the rallies say, “We shall sort him out.” I can assure them that we are a civilised Government and we have no wish for vengeance. We would like to provide all the security for the citizens and even the media must be assured that we have their interests at heart, but they must also begin to show the that they too take the interests of others at heart.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mulongoti: This is because what you do to others …

Mr Munaile: Do unto others what you would like them to do unto you.

Mr Mulongoti: … is what should be done to you. You cannot take your total freedom and give no freedom to others because then it is a negation of the principle of fair play.

I followed the debate made by the hon. Member for Chilubi very carefully. I had a bit of a problem understanding what he was saying because of the mother tongue interference.

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: I was unable to grasp some of the words because there was this pronouncement of words and letters which made it difficult for me to understand. However, my dear brother, I would like to assure you that, as hon. Minister of Information and Broadcasting Services, I will buy you the freedom of the press, but in a responsible manner.

I have been on both sides. I have been in the Opposition before and I have been in Government. Therefore, you expect me to do much better or probably much better than you because you were a civil servant before, …

Hon Government Members: District Commissioner!

Mr Mulongoti: … but I was a politician. Yes, he was a District Commissioner before. Therefore, hon. Member, be rest assured that if there is anything that you would like us to do together, I am available to you. There is no single hon. Member of Parliament who has been to my office with an issue that he wanted resolved and was denied an audience. We have accorded you the urgency deserving of your problems and have shared your problems and resolved those that we could, but what we have not done is promise you that in ninety days, we will do this and that.

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: We have always told you, realistically, that within this period, it could be possible because if we said ninety days, we would be cheating.

Hon. Members, I feel sad that, on a daily basis, we read about people saying that there is a lot of tension in this country.

Hon. Members: Where?

Mr Mulongoti: Please, give the people of Zambia a break. Help them to prepare for their Christmas. Help them to congratulate themselves for having made decisions that were in line with what they wanted this country to be. It must also be remembered that when they were voting, all of us had God on our side. In the end, God goes beyond your campaign. He goes for hearts too. This is because God knows that if he gave this country to this gentleman, …

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: … who is threatening to fire this one and that one, there would be chaos. Therefore, let me give this one who is showing hope that he can look after the people of Zambia.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mulongoti: Mr Speaker, if you remember, when Moses was leading the children of Israel, he was shown the land. This is what happened that last night when they were showing voting results on television. They showed our competitors in the land of …

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: Sir, those of us who waited patiently were told that land was intended was for us.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mulongoti: Mr Speaker, that day, I was lying in hospital and I was planning how to move out of hospital after losing the elections. Fortunately, I was shown the land of Canaan and I even asked to be discharged.

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: Mr Speaker, I am saying all these things for the hon. Members to forget about all the tension.

Mr Nsanda: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

Interruptions

Mr Mulongoti: Sir, we are the leaders of this country and we must lead by example. We must sow happiness in the minds of the people. If, in this House, we show that we are so divided to a point where even a greeting is a problem, what are the people outside going to say?

Mr Mulongoti: Hon. Members, we share a collective responsibility and therefore, whatever happens to this country, we will be judged collectively.

Mr Sichilima: Hear, hear!

Mr Mulongoti: Mr Speaker, as a man who was Campaign Manager for MMD, I would like to say that we have been very modest and have acknowledged the fact that we are only competitors and not enemies.

Mr Mabenga’s phone rang and he walked out.

Interruptions

Mr Mulongoti: Sir, at the end of the day, the one who got God’s favour took the day. Therefore, I would like to congratulate you for the spirited campaign. Whatever results it produced, accept them from now. In 2011, we will be ready to compete with you as competitors and not as enemies. Please, take away the bitterness. Hon. Nsanda, you are my brother-in-law, but you even stopped greeting me.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order! The hon. Minister will address the Chair.

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: Mr Speaker, I was only reminding the hon. Member of Parliament who ordinarily would be hugging me, but ever since the result came out, he has not greeted me.

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: Mr Speaker, eminent speakers in this House have already alluded to the problems of Rwanda and others. These are not joking, but serious matters. Let us look at them seriously because at the end of the day, we have only one Zambia. Those who have other countries to go to, please, do us a favour, considering the fact that we treasure this country and we want it to develop. We will as much as possible give the media the freedom they deserve and help the community radio stations to be effective. At the same time, we will not allow them to allow irresponsible characters, if that is the right way I can express it, to be on air. What are they going to talk about? These are problems. When we say they should control the people who speak on those radio stations, it does not mean we are threatening them. All we are saying is that they should exercise maximum control so that the information that is given to the community is useful and not intended to generate hatred and bitterness in that community. 
 
Mr Speaker, we know that the people who work in these stations are human beings and have their own interests and allegiances to political parties, but at the end of the day, they must be mindful of the fact that there is a question of responsibility to that community. I was told that in the Eastern Province, on election day, a radio station was still campaigning for a certain political party. Those are the things we do not allow. When we stop them from doing such, they say we are threatening them. The hon. Member for Chilubi, I can tell you the problems we have. Some of these journalists are quite young and need to be assisted and controlled so that they grow up to be responsible leaders for the future. Therefore, do not think that we are trying to ignore the press. The press has got responsibility to us as well as a to the country.

Mr Speaker, with those few words, I would like to congratulate the Chairman, Major Chizhyuka for not referring to anything indigenous for once.

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Laughter

Major Chizhyuka: Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to sum up the various submissions from the hon. Members of Parliament. As I was coming from lunch, I was praying that this Motion be different from the others and I am glad that my prayer has been answered.

Mr Speaker, you can see from the chauvinistic exuberance …

Laughter

Major Chizhyuka: … that has been portrayed at Manda Hill this afternoon. I also would like to thank all the hon. Members who have made their submissions and all those who uttered very kind words to me and my colleague who seconded the Motion. I would also like to thank in particular, Hon. Sikota, who has given us a moment of reflection with some of the sobering details associated with one country in Africa.

 I also would like to thank the hon. Mr Speaker in particular, for allowing one of the longest debates I have known for the past two years I have been in Parliament. I am putting the debate in context and would like to inform the hon. Minister that we have understood the concerns of the House and urge the Government to reflect on this matter and take favourable consideration.

With those few words, I thank you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Question put and agreed to.{mospagebreak}

REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON ENERGY, ENVIRONMENT AND TOURISM

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do adopt the Report of the Committee on Energy, Environment and Tourism for the Second Session of the Tenth National Assembly laid on the Table of the House on 3rd November, 2008.

Mr Speaker: Is the Motion seconded?

Mr Simama (Kalulushi):  Mr Speaker, I beg to second the Motion.

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, in keeping with the terms of reference overseeing the functions of the Ministry responsible for Energy, Environment and Tourism, the following were the issues under discussion by your Committee for the year:

(i) investment in power generation infrastructure; and

(ii) conservation and exploitation of Zambia’s water resources.

Mr Speaker, your Committee also considered the Action-Taken Report on the Committee’s report for 2007 and undertook tours to various locations based on the topical issues under consideration.

Sir, as regards investment in the power generation infrastructure, your Committee were informed that Zambia’s electricity generation, transmission and distribution system is more than four decades old and has, in the past, lacked desirable levels of maintenance and investment.

Mr Speaker, this lack of maintenance of aging infrastructure has led to the energy deficit that the country is currently experiencing. Your Committee were further informed that as far back as the year 1997, the Government had identified the need to develop new power stations. Eleven years today, there has been no progress made on the construction of new generation capacity.

Your Committee are of the opinion that this shows poor planning and lack of foresight on the part of the Government. Your Committee also hope that as the Government arm responsible for the power sector, the Ministry of Energy and Water Development had created an Office for Promoting Private Power Investment or OPPI. The office promotes and co-ordinates investments in the sector. Your Committee welcome this effort and strongly urge the Government to ensure that this office puts much more consented effort in finding investors to development new generation capacity before the current electricity crisis in the country generates further.

Mr Speaker, your Committee were informed that as part of the power rehabilitation project being undertaken by the Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (ZESCO) Limited, the country’s power stations are undergoing rehabilitation and up rating to increase the total installed capacity and improve the efficiency of supply to customers.

Sir, although this is a welcome initiative by this Government, your Committee wish to remind the Government that this is a temporary solution, particularly, in the light of the fact that the Zambian economy is growing at a rapid pace in all sectors, especially in the mining sector. This can only mean that there will continue to be a rising demand for electricity in the country. Allow me, therefore, to reiterate that the only permanent solution is the development of new generation capacity in the country.

Mr Speaker, allow me to briefly address the subject of conservation and exploitation of Zambia’s water resources. It is worth noting that despite being a landlocked country, Zambia is endowed with sufficient water resources with about 20 per cent of its surface area covered by water bodies in form of lakes, swamps, rivers and streams. These water resources are used for all kind of economic activities, including hydro-power generation, agriculture, industry and tourism. However, your Committee note, regrettably, that uncoordinated development, some of which are not environmentally friendly, have resulted in the destruction of these water resources.

Sir, your Committee observe that one of the difficulties being experienced is the multiplicity of laws governing the country’s water resources. Mr Speaker, there appears to be a lack of a comprehensive interface and coordination of these pieces of legislation. Your Committee, therefore, strongly urge the Government to ensure that there is a proper integrated policy and legislative approach to ensure that the country’s water can be used to contribute more effectively to the economic development of the nation in an ecologically friendly manner.

Sir, as part of their tour, your Committee visited a number of waterfalls in the northern part of Zambia and were informed that the National Heritage and Conservation Commission was charged with the responsibility of conserving and managing Zambia’s natural heritage sites, including waterfalls. Your Committee wish to pay tribute to the Commission for the effort that is being put into the management of these waterfalls and into ensuring that the country’s waterfalls are properly preserved.

Mr Speaker, your Committee, while noting the abundance of waterfalls in the country, wish to register their disappointment at the failure on the part of the Government to take full advantage of these waterfalls in terms of their tourism and hydro-electric power potential. Allow me, therefore, on behalf of your Committee, to throw the challenge once more to the Government to find ways and means of realising the full economic potential of these and other natural resources that the country is endowed with.

Mr Speaker, your Committee wish to express their gratitude to the Office of the Clerk of the National Assembly for the advice and services rendered to them throughout their deliberations.

Your Committee is indebted to all witness who appeared before them for the co-operation in providing the necessary memoranda and briefs.

Sir, I wish also, on behalf of the Committee, to express our sincere gratitude to you, for appointing us to serve on this very important Committee. Your Committee have no doubt in their minds that the observations and recommendations contained in this report will go a long way in improving the energy, environment and tourism sectors while ensuring a healthy environment in Zambia.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker: Does the seconder wish to speak now or later?

Mr Simama: Now, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker, in seconding the Motion to adopt the Report of the Committee on Energy, Environment and Tourism for the Second Session of he Tenth National Assembly laid on the Table of the House on 3rd November, 2008, allow me to first thank the Chairperson for having ably moved the Motion.

Mr Speaker, the Chairperson has already pointed out the silent issues that caught the attention of your Committee during their deliberations. Therefore, I will only touch on some of them.

Your Committee heard that certain measures had been put in place under ZESCO’s Power Rehabilitation Project as a means of demand side management, that is, to balance demand and supply of electricity. One such measure was load shedding.

Mr Speaker, your Committee wish to pay tribute to the people of Zambia for the patience that they have exhibited during the past few months that the load-shedding exercise has been going on. Your Committee are aware of the fact that this exercise has been a major inconvenience to both individual households and industries. They, therefore, urge the Government to ensure that rehabilitation and upgrading works under the power rehabilitation project are completed in the shortest possible period of time so as to put to an end this disruptive exercise.

Sir, your Committee were informed that alternative energy resources such as coal and solar power can be used to enhance power security in the country. However, although these alternative resources are increasingly being used, they remain insignificant in terms of their contribution to the total national energy supply because efforts to harness these resources have been minimal. Your Committee, therefore, urge the Government to find ways of effectively tapping into other sources of energy.

Sir, on the conservation and exploitation of Zambia’s water resources, your Committee wish to register that the importance of water to national economic development cannot be over emphasised. To this effect, your Committee strongly urge the Government to urgently set up a national database of where all the country’s water resource, particularly waterfalls, are located as a way of ensuring systematic exploitation of these resources.

Mr Speaker, furthermore, your Committee urge the Government to carryout a review of entrance fees to all the waterfalls to let them reflect economic rates so that they can contribute more towards the National Treasury.

At this point, allow me on behalf of your Committee to extend gratitude to the National Heritage Conservation Commission and ZESCO Limited who released their officers to accompany your Committee on their tours. The presence of these officers went a long way in assisting your Committee to understand the issues they were deliberating. Sir, it is gratifying for your Committee to note the efforts that are being put into the management of the country’s water resources by the National Heritage Conservation Commission and implore the Government to continue supporting the work of the Commission.

Finally, I wish to pay tribute to your Committee for the manner in which they conducted their deliberations. Your Committee observed the views of all the witnesses who appeared before them. They did so in the spirit and manner that helped them make recommendations which are, in their view, in the best interest of the people of Zambia.

Mr Speaker, I beg to second.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Hamududu (Bweengwa): Mr Speaker, I rise to support the Motion on the Floor.

Sir, the problem that we are facing in Zambia today and in the region of the shortage of power supply should not be taken in a reactionary manner. We need to be very sober because from your report, we have been told that this is an old problem of lack of investment in the infrastructure to produce power that has developed over four decades.

Therefore, I get disturbed when I see people becoming reactionary and insulting people that someone has failed them when they know that the capacity of power generation has reached its peak. Zambians must understand that we have reached the peak because we did not re-invest in power generation. Therefore, you cannot start accusing someone who started yesterday of this being his problem. No! We know where the problem came from. Therefore, as Zambians, we must sit down and look at the genesis of the problem of shortage of power supply. This problem is not only in Zambia. It is in South Africa as well as in Botswana, but they are taking the same measures. As for those who are not exposed, they should not cheat Zambians that the problem of load shedding was brought by someone who came in yesterday.

Hon. Government Members:  Hear, hear!

Mr Hamududu: Mr Speaker, the late President found this problem. I want to be a Zambian with a big heart, a Zambian who understands issues and puts the country first and …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Hamududu: … does not talk about trivial matters.

Sir, the genesis of our problem that we have has been well articulated by the Chairperson of this Committee. It has been stipulated that the successful Governments have not re-invested in the capacity to generate power. It is not, therefore, Hon. Konga or Mr Sisala to blame. They found these problems. What we need to do now is sit together, as Zambians, and chart the way forward. Therefore, we want to ask this Government to provide us the will to address this problem. I do not want to belong to a group of reactionaries. I would like to build this country for my children to be happy tomorrow.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!  

Mr Hamududu: Mr Speaker, as we sit in this House, we should commit enough money for re-investment and maintenance of the infrastructure to generate enough power. At the moment, someone who is logical will understand the issue of load shedding cannot stop overnight. I therefore, tell my children that this problem will be here for a little while, but we must address it squarely. If we become reactionary and the Government also starts dancing to reactionary forces, we will end up busting the capacity that is there. Produce the power that the current infrastructure can produce. Do not listen to reactionary forces. Otherwise, you will blow up the little infrastructure which is there. What we need now is to expand power generation.

Sir, this Government must define a clear work plan of how much money is needed over what time period so that our people are clear regarding when we will get out of this problem. We do not want the Government to join other people and become reactionary by giving us short-term measures. You should tell us that the problem and how big it is and how much money we need and how long it will take to solve it. That is how the Government must behave.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Hamududu: Mr Speaker, actually, many people have complained that ZESCO has been abused by successful Governments and the big wage bill in ZESCO was created by some people who are shouting on ant hills today.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Sir, ZESCO must be restructured to reduce the wage bill to acceptable levels. I think we all know what percentage of revenue must go to the wage bill. This problem is old problem and was created by some people who were in Cabinet and did not resign when things were wrong.

Laughter

Mr Hamududu: Mr Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to advise this Government that to clean up themselves so that tomorrow, they are not blamed for not doing something. As for me, I will not look at a party, but at individuals who sat in Cabinet and did make plans to re-invest in power generation. I will not mention parties, but individuals because a party is just a name, just like a name of a TV.

Laughter

Mr Hamududu: Mr Speaker, individuals must be held accountable because they are the ones who have put us in problems.

 Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Hamududu: I would like to urge this Government and its hon. Ministers to do the right thing for once. Otherwise, we will judge you tomorrow…

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Hamududu: … and judge you harshly. Do not make the mistakes of your predecessors in the MMD who never re-invested in power generation. Yet, today, they can stand and start confusing a few people who are illiterate. Yes, there are some who are illiterate in my constituency.

Laughter

Mr Hamududu: I explained to them very well that this is why I had a high standout in the country. And, of course, I gave my president the highest vote because my people understand. I explained to them very clearly how we landed where we are. I did not tell them an easy route out of our problem. That is why they believe in me.

Mr Speaker, I would like to warn this Government, through this Motion, to do the right thing in Cabinet by designing a serious work plan.

Hon. Government Member interjected.

Mr Hamududu: I do not need your job. I can go back to the old job I had before. I am a comfortable person.

Laughter

Mr Hamududu: I am just advising you as a Zambian. I will remain UPND and will not move out from here, but I am advising you, as a Zambian, because what you do now will affect our children in future.

With these few words, Mr Speaker, I wish to end by saying that, please, be proactive and not reactive. Leave the reactionary elements with the media to continue their reaction, but keep on course with the right solutions for our country.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Mulenga (Kwacha): Mr Speaker, thank you for according me this opportunity to also add my voice to this Motion.

In supporting the Motion, there are very few items that I would like to bring about. First of all, Mr Speaker, we all appreciate the importance of energy. Had it not been for energy, all of us would not be here.

Hon. Member: Mmm!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Had it not been for energy, there would be no production in the country.

Hon. Members: Mmm!

Laughter

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Had it not been for energy, there would be nothing running in this nation. Our great nation would have suffered greatly. In fact, we would have been living in jungles.

Laughter

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Sir, energy is critical for the economic development of the nation. As we have heard from the mover and seconder of the Motion, who have lamentably indicated that, for the last four decades, there has been no planning in terms of how we address the energy sector. I agree with them. I agree with them, but disagree on the principle that there were people who were responsible for managing this sector. What were they doing? What must we do, as a country, to those people whose responsibility it was to plan and see that we needed future expansion? What do we do with them? We must ask ourselves.

As the previous debater indicated, we have to be focused. In other words, we must look into the future. The future economy is growing. Who were there and did not plan to see that we were going to have so many sectors? There was going to be Kansanshi and Lumwana Mines. Who are these people who did not plan for these developments?

Interruptions

Mr Muntanga: Fire the hon. Ministers!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: We need to understand that those who did not plan must be taken to book.

Laughter

Mr Muntanga: Arrest them!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: This is because the future of this nation is dependant on high levels of investment into this nation. If we do not develop the energy capacity, how then do we expect to eradicate poverty? How do we expect to increase the employment levels? How do we expect to have good schools? How then do we expect good health? How do we expect that everything that we have all dreamt about as a nation shall be achieved?

Mr Speaker, energy is very critical and key to our economy. And there must be serious planning on what must be done. If no one is doing anything, why are we keeping them in jobs?

Sir, we must understand one thing. If I am cultivating one hectare and I know that I am going cultivate two hectares next year, I must start planning now. If I do not plan, how am I going to achieve to cultivate two hectares? How are we going to develop the capacities of our nationals? At the end of the day, one thing must be understood that this nation does not belong to one person. This nation belongs to all its nationals. Therefore, all nationals look up to the leadership and that leadership shall be there to plan on their behalf. That is why we give jobs to the Executive. The Executive are in a position to manage, for example, Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (ZESCO) and put in management that will do the job correctly. If the job is not being done, fire the board of directors.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Before the board of directors are fired, you also fire whoever is running those utilities.

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: At the end of the day, Zambia is going round in circles. It is like going in circles and we do not need a country that goes in circles. If a country is going in circles, then we are not taking the country forward.

Mr Speaker, recently, we have been told that there are oil fields where my friend Hon. Charles Kakoma comes from. There is copper everywhere, but what amount of energy do we need? Are we going to facilitate the supply of energy to this development if today we are load shedding?

Mr Speaker, I would like to speak on behalf of the people I represent in Kwacha. Kwacha, as the name sounds, means money.

Laughter

Mr L. J. Mulenga: And money is very critical to the development of the nation.

Hon. Opposition Members: Shame!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: If there is no money, there will be no development.

The people who have spoken before me have lamented strongly that ZESCO is making losses. Mr Speaker, from a business point of view, how do you expect a company to reinvest if it is making losses?

Mr Munaile: Never!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: I think this is what we must all ask ourselves. How? ZESCO is just a parastatal company owned by the Government. And the Government has no obligation to set aside money for reinvestment. ZESCO must be able to generate funds on its own to reinvest into the business and increase the capacity of generation and transmission.

Sir, much as we agree that there must be grants that have been given and given from time immemorial. What has happened to those grants? My biggest observation is that it is not reinvestment that is the problem, but prudent management of national resources …

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: … and responsible people to manage those resources. If the resources are properly managed, the nation would go a long way in making developing.

Sir, it is regrettable to note that in this nation all parastatal companies do not reinvest. It is regrettable. Every company must reinvest. In other words, when they are doing their budgetary system, they must also look at reinvestment. Regrettably, it would appear that a lot of resources in these companies tend to go into salaries. This is very bad because the core objective of running those companies is compromised. ZESCO is a huge company which has a lot of assets.

Mr Speaker, I do not understand why ZESCO, for instance, cannot use its assets to borrow and re-invest into the company. I do not understand and it makes my heart bleed because how do you grow a company? You grow a company by using the existing assets and then re-investing. This practice of looking up to the Government is incorrect. ZESCO must look at its internal assets and see how they develop themselves. Apart from that, when we look to the Government which is in short supply of social money, the available money must go to the social sector and then we all lump the Government with responsibility to fund ZESCO for power generation. This is incorrect. We are breeding something that is incorrect in the nation. People must begin to understand that when you are given a responsibility, you must create wealth for that responsibility. If you are unable to create wealth for the responsibility you have been endowed with, why waste time and say it is not my problem because it has been there for more than fifteen years?

Mr Speaker, when you accept a position, you should accept the responsibility that goes with it.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr L J Mulenga: In other words, if you marry a woman with children, you are also getting the responsibility of those children. You cannot one day cry and say, “no, I found them there” when you knew about them.

Laughter

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, the point that I am trying to make is that, once and for all in this nation, people must learn to take responsibility. We do not want people to take responsibility and not take liabilities, they must take both. Otherwise we are not doing anything and we are not going to achieve anything. We will sit in this House for so many years to come and will be talking about the same things, but nothing will happen and this is very serious.

Mr Speaker, as leaders, we must become more focussed and begin to look more into the future than our pockets.

Hon. Members: More money in your pockets.

Mr L. J. Mulenga: We must begin to look more into the future than at ourselves.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, I would like to indicate one thing that ZESCO, a company which is charged with the responsibility of supplying energy to the country, has been very unfair to the consumers, especially during the time of load shedding. I will give you an example of people who are on fixed charge and if they pay K200,000, it is just that whether they had electricity or no electricity. Where is the fairness if I may ask? Sir, because of load shedding and what has been tabulated in newspapers and radios, they will switch you off when you least expect and when you have your electrical appliances on and then you lose them, ZESCO will just tell you things that you do not even understand. And then litigation is too lengthy a process.

Mr Speaker, is this the country that we want to have. We would like a country that is smooth. Zambia is small in terms of population. You sent me to Mauritius which is a small country, has no waterfalls like we have here, but there is no load shedding. Why should we have load shedding here? There is somebody who is not doing something correctly here or there is information flow that is incorrect and if it is incorrect who is that person behind this? We must catch that person.

Laughter

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, with those remarks, I thank you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Beene (Itezhi-tezhi): Mr Speaker, I thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to contribute to the debate on this very important Motion.

I stand to support the Motion and would like to thank the mover and seconder of the Motion. Mr Speaker, the issue of power or energy is a very important component of development and the future of this country. The economic avenues of this country are leading to the mines, the opening of Lumwana and the other mines up there.

Mr Speaker, I also would like to agree with the previous speakers who have talked about the problem of planning. They talked about who did not do the planning. It is unfortunate that the Chiluba regime at one time just concentrated on privatising everything, including those huge investments. Maybe, one could just go there and see where those power stations are and the job which was done by those who planned those things, to see that if people can entertain to auction or sell a power station, it is total insanity.

Laughter

Mr Beene: Mr Speaker, we are going to condemn this or that, but what we are looking forward to, as Zambians, is for the New Administration which is here to make a change because people need energy.

Mr Speaker, I would like to mention that, – May His Soul Rest In Peace, on this one I mean the soul of the late President Mwanawasa who gave a speech here about the energy sector and that they were going to improve energy in the country by building power stations and looking at the Kafue Lower and Itezhi-Tezhi. I would like to say that the previous Administration was not serious. I am saying so because I come from Itezhi-Tezhi where the power station is supposed to be built. That infrastructure was built in 1978 when the water filled up. But now there has just been cosmetic talk in this House about the same. The road to Itezhi-Tezhi has turned into a bush path and you are talking about putting up a power station there.

Mr Speaker, this morning the hon. Minister was saying Zambians should show this Government where there are waterfalls so that the Government can erect power stations there. Now if where there is infrastructure and you are failing to make a road, who are you telling that you are going to improve the energy situation in this country? We need to be serious.

Mr Speaker, this country has a lot of resources and I would like to tell the hon. Minister of Energy and Water Resources the alternative soureces of power. This country has a lot of engineers and so on, but we are not making use of them. All the hon. Minister can do is change the board and leave the management there unchecked and the morale of ZESCO workers at the lowest point. Sir, we have to change.

Mr Speaker, this country has big fields of sugar at Nakambala Estates. Sir, after producing this sugar, the ash can be used to produce electricity. These technologies are available and I am sure the engineers can agree with me, but we have done nothing, meanwhile we are giving licences for mines which need power. Where is our seriousness, Sir?

Mr Speaker, in the Northern Province, there is uranium and what we are planning here is to pass laws which will talk about bombs. That uranium can be used for nuclear energy and that is what we are supposed to be thinking about in this era. All we can do is be proud that we have reserves in the bank. Why are you keeping those reserves when people have blackouts in their homes day and night? I would like to say that the onus is on this New Administration of His Excellency Mr Rupia Bwezani Banda to make a difference because Zambians want a change. There is bureaucracy found at ZESCO which has caused people to lose the equipment such as television sets and anything you can mention in homes. It is very difficult for anybody to have their equipment replaced by ZESCO and the hon. Minister will agree with me on that. It will take you three years until you forget. That is the reality of today’s life.

Mr Speaker, we had hoped that maybe, through the Congo DR, those big rivers would give us, through the Southern Power Pool, more power in this country, but now there is war there, what are we doing about it.

You have told us about the Kafue lower, but nothing is happening there. The cost of constructing the Itezhi-Tezhi power station is only about US$200 million. You are keeping about US$1.4 million in the bank and waiting for India to come here to help us when we have enough money to do a power station. All they are doing is drill in rocks wasting time when the Head of State made a statement in the country that we have to sort out the power problem.

Mr Speaker, the situation is extremely serious. We are looking forward to this new Administration making ZESCO management produce even the cash flow which it has. That company may even be on the verge of collapsing. This is a fact. All what has been done there is create maybe ten unions and because this Government may be the last Administration, it was bending too much to the international funders on benchmarks for the World Bank, trading off the Government debts to start swapping. You are not paying money to ZESCO. You are all to be blamed for the failure of that company. That is just a fact.

Major Chizhyuka: It has been there for seven years.

Mr Beene: Mr Speaker, I am mentioning this and I will give you credit where it is due and will not give you credit where you have been destroying.

Mr Speaker, the infrastructure which we have there, which was erected by the Yugoslavians, the Kafue Gorge, is very old. When the Kariba North Bank was constructed, a section was left for expansion and has completely been left unattended to all this time. The Chiluba Administration was just lining up all infrastructure for sale, which is extremely unfortunate.

I only wish to thank you that, at least, the up rating programme you are doing makes sense, but for the new power stations, hon. Minister, can we do something? Those reserves you are keeping, we passed a law here in Parliament for the mines to increase money in terms of tax. Why are you keeping that money in that special account? Bring it here to Parliament for approval of expenditure so that you can build power stations. Why are you keeping it? And you are proud to go on TV to announce that we have reserves, for what?

Mr Speaker, with these words, I thank you.

Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Minister of Energy and Water Development (Mr Konga): Thank you, Mr Speaker, for giving me this opportunity to comment on the report on the Committee on Energy, Environment and Tourism. First of all, I would like to express my gratitude to the Chairman of the Committee for ably moving this Motion and also to the seconder who seconded the Motion professionally.

Mr Speaker, the report of the Committee on Energy, Environment and Tourism is very well written. I would like to make some comments on some of the issues that have been raised by Members in the House. First of all, I thank everybody for the comments that they have made and I would like to state that it is good that hon. Members of the House have appreciated the role that energy plays in the economy and not only the economy, but in our domestic lives as well. It is for this reason, as has been highlighted, this Government saw the necessity, despite the four decades in which there was no rehabilitation of the plant and equipment, to embark on rehabilitation of the power infrastructure at both the generating and transmission plants at a cost of more than US$400 million. This, of course, has brought about a lot of inconvenience to members of the public and sections of the economy.

However, Mr Speaker, you will agree with me and I am sure most Members of the House will agree with me that sometimes, it is important to swallow that bitter pill before we can get well. This Government, much as there was inconvenience for the customers and the economy at large, had taken thes measures to rehabilitate plants at Kafue Gorge and Kariba North which has resulted in over 450 mega watts not being available on the system and thereby resulting in what is called load shedding.

I can assure the House, Mr Speaker, that this measure is just temporary. Come early 2009, this will be a thing of the past. This Government expects to complete the rehabilitation of the plant at both the Kafue Gorge and Kariba North Bank in the first quarter of the year 2009, so as to restore as well as increase power supply from what it now is to close to 2,000 mega watts. I am glad to agree with what most of the Members have said that there is a lot of growth in this economy. Thanks to the good policies of this Government. There is a lot of confidence in investment, not only in mining, but also in agriculture, manufacturing and tourism. We still anticipate an increase in demand for energy despite the rehabilitation. To this effect, the Government has instituted measures to invest in new generation. Of course, before you can put up a power plant, you have to embark on what one of the hon. Members mentioned which the Government has embarked on at the Kafue Gorge Lower to increase and produce over 750 mega watts of power. We think this is going to reasonably contribute to the energy deficit that this country is currently facing. Of course, this investment in hydro-power generation does not result in immediate power being available to consumers.

You are aware, Mr Speaker, and hon. Members of the House are aware that to put up a power station involves a lot of works which take a lot of time, normally two to three years. By the time the plant is set up, another two to three years will have elapsed such that we are talking abut a period of six to seven years before you can put up a power station of the size of the Kafue Gorge. At the moment, the Government has engaged the International Finance Company of the World Bank to be the transaction advisers in the construction of a US $2 billion Kafue Gorge Hydro-Power Project.

The site that one of the hon. Members has mentioned at the Kariba North Bank extension is also being developed. I am proud to inform the House that we actually have the contractor on site at the Kariba North Bank extension and the works have actually started. Once the project has been completed, at a cost of US$350 million, we expect to get an additional 360 mega watts on the main stream. However, as I have said, the works have just started and will take a bit of time, but we hope to have this project completed by 2012.

One hon. Member mentioned Itezhi-tezhi and I would like to say that it is not true that nothing is happening there. We have a lot of work going on at Itezhi-tezhi. The Government has embarked on a project that is going to cost about US$20 million. There are a few challenges with financing. As you are aware, most of these projects are capital intensive and as such, the Government may not be able to realise the investment on its own. Therefore, we sometimes seek partnerships with co-operating partners. Tata Power Corporation was one of the partners that wanted to partner with the Zambia Electricity Supply Corporations (ZESCO) and there are some issues involving finances because some of the finances were coming from a foreign country whose issues I think are being resolved. I can assure the hon. Members that the project at Itezhi-tezhi will also quickly be completed.

In order to ensure that we have more hydro-power, the Government is not only looking at these big power stations. As we have repeatedly said in the House, we do have many other sites throughout the country where we can have hydro-power generation. However, we would like to encourage the private sector to also come on board. Therefore, I would like to urge the hon. Members of the House to come forth and put up joint ventures with the Government if they are not able to do put them up on their own so that we can develop the hydro-power potential that is in the country. For instance, at Chavuma Falls there is potential for 15 mega watts as well as Chikata Falls on the Kabompo River and the Kabompo Gorge where there is potential for 34 mega watts.

As the Government, we would like to empower the citizenry. We would not want these projects just undertaken by the Government or foreign firms. Therefore, we would like the Zambian citizenry to also participate, not only in public offerings, but also borrow money to set up power stations. I would like to encourage hon. Members of the House that such investments, because of the need for energy which will never end. It is a very good form of investment because there will always be positive returns.

One of the issues that one of the hon. Members mentioned was that of tariffs. This is one of the reasons that I think has hindered previous investment in the sector. As we speak now, the tariffs that are obtaining are really not cost reflective. As you know, every person who goes into business would like to see a return on their investment. However, sadly, what is obtaining in the country is that the local utility company, ZESCO, is charging sub-economic tariffs. This, in a way, has discouraged investment in the sector. To overcome this, ZESCO has made an application to the Energy Regulation Board for an upward tariff adjustment which I hope hon. Members of the House will support and encourage their electorates to embrace. This is so because if we do not have cost-reflective tariffs, there will be no investment in the sector and the challenges that we are facing in the sector such as inadequate energy will not be addressed. Therefore, I would like to encourage hon. Members of the House when they go to their electorates to sensitise them on the advantages of paying cost-reflective tariffs.

Mr Speaker, I would like to also inform the House that in order to mitigate some of the challenges, especially in the Northern and Luapula Provinces, the Government intends to put aside a sum of US$25 million for rehabilitating and upgrading the power stations which are at Musonda Falls in Luapula as well as Chishimba Falls and Luswase in the Northern Province. With this investment, we intend to increase the generation from these power plants and make available more energy as well as stabilise the voltages as the distances of connecting to places such as Mbala and Mbala South are quite long.

Mr Sichilima: Hear, hear! Fwebawinine bwino.

Mr Konga: Mr Speaker, I would, therefore, like to reiterate my great appreciation to your Committee, especially the Chairman and Vice-Chairman, for ably moving the Motion.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, I thank you for allowing me to wind up the debate on the Motion. I would like to thank the hon. Members who have contributed so positively, but will not be able to mention them by name for I recognise that time is not with us. However, in Tonga we normally say, “igwampa masimpe buya chotuli gwano.” Now the hon. Minister …

Laughter

Hon. Members: Meaning?

Mr Nkombo: … has said that – it means that the only reason we are here is to really tell the truth. To me, the hon. Minister has said a few alarming things such as that he is appealing to hon. Members to find joint ventures to put up power stations. I think that, with due respect to this thought, he knows that this is a pipedream. The Government that got its mandate in 2001 has run the affairs of this country for the last seven years and one day, they will wake up and find that their term has ended and have run this country for ten years. Posterity normally judges us …

Mr Speaker: Order! Wind up debate on your Motion.

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, in winding up, I would like to emphasis that posterity normally judges with the manner in which we work things. The Kafue Gorge Lower is a matter of urgency for this country to come out of this malaise and it would not be wise for us to make this House a talking shop.

Mr Speaker: Order!

The hon. Minister will follow up with the Action-Taken Report. Could you, please, wind up the debate.

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, in winding up, I would like the hon. Minister, if he will be there after tomorrow’s reshuffles, to take these matters very seriously.

I thank you, very much, Sir.

Laughter

Question put and agreed to.

REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON AGRICULTURE AND LANDS

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, I beg to move that this House do adopt the Report of the Committee on Agriculture and Lands for the Second Session of the Tenth National Assembly laid on the Table of the House on the 21st October, 2008.

Mr Speaker: Is the Motion seconded?

Mrs Mwamba (Lukashya): Mr Speaker, I beg to second.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, your Committee are guided by the terms of reference as set out in the National Assembly Standing Orders.

Sir, going by their terms of reference, your Committee considered one topical issue and its action-taken report on the Committee’s report for 2007. They also undertook local tours of selected areas of the Southern Province and a foreign tour to Botswana. It is my expectation that hon. Members have taken time to read the report. Therefore, in my speech, I will just highlight the key issues from your Committee’s deliberations.

Mr Speaker, after independence in 1964, all aspects of disease control were handled by the Government through the Department of Veterinary and Tsetse Control Services. This entailed provision of the following:

(i) Veterinary Assistants;

(ii) Communal Dip Tanks;

(iii) Routine Vaccinations for scheduled diseases;

(iv) Maintenance of Cordon Lines; and

(v) Monitoring of animal movements from one area to another, to mention but a few.

Sir, in the mid-1990s, the provision of the above mentioned services was privatised, resulting in the breakdown of the entire system of animal disease control mechanisms. Since then, the country has been experiencing unprecedented outbreaks of cattle diseases such as Corridor disease, East Coast Fever, Contagious Bovine Pleuro-pneumonia (CBPP), Foot and Mouth disease, Anthrax, Trypanosomiasis, Blackleg and Heart water.

Mr Speaker, the persistent cattle disease outbreaks have led to a severe reduction of the cattle population. In 1998 for example, the cattle population was about 2.9 million, which number was depleted to 2.4 million by 2004.

Sir, allow me now to highlight some of the factors that have led to these incessant outbreaks of cattle diseases:

(i) there are no cattle vaccines produced locally. Those that are imported are not very specific to the agents that predispose the local diseases;

(ii) more than 40 per cent of the veterinary camps are not manned by veterinary assistants. It, therefore, becomes very difficult, firstly to detect the presence of the disease and to treat such a disease with such low staffing levels. In addition, there is continued violation and inadequate policing of animal movement bands leading to the spread of the disease;

(iii) the lack of local abattoirs means ineffective disease traceability mechanism and also increased disease transmission by encouraging transportation of live animals to markets;

(iv) the non-function of the Veterinary Surgery Board, which is supposed to oversee and regulate the operations of veterinarians, means that the approach to disease control has been prone to abuse through …

Mr Speaker: Order!

(Debate adjourned)

___________

The House adjourned at 1956 hours until 0900 hours on Friday, 14th November, 2008.

 

 

 

 

 

WRITTEN REPLY TO QUESTION

REPAIR WORKS ON THE MUTANDA/MWINILUNGA ROAD

403. Mr Katuka (Mwinilunga East) asked the Minister of Works and Supply:

(a) when the repair works on the Mutanda/Mwinilunga Road would be completed;

(b) how much money had so far been spent on the road; and

(c) when a contractor to work on the portion of the road, which was not part of the on-going contract, would be engaged.

The Minister of Works and Supply (Mr Simbao): Mr Speaker, the periodic maintenance of the 89 km Solwezi-Mutanda-Mwinilunga (Lumwana 1st Gate) Road is substantially complete and the project was handed over to the client (Road Development Agency) on 11th November, 2008. The project has now gone into a six months defects liability period.

The amount of money as at 12th November, 2008 (spent on the periodic maintenance of the project road) is K38,457,376,444.04. The total contract amount was earlier estimated at K47,000,000,000.00 (to complete all the works).

The maintenance of the remaining section of the road between Lumwana and Mwinilunga has been awarded to Messrs Roads and Pavings, at a contract amount of K67,271,561,723.70. The contractor started to mobilise personnel and equipment to the site on 11th July, 2008 and has so far re-surfaced 15 km of the 191 km stretch.

I thank you, Sir.