DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE SECOND SESSION OF THE TENTH ASSEMBLY  

Friday, 21st November, 2008

The House met at 0900 hours

[MADAM DEPUTY SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

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BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE

The Vice-President (Mr Kunda, SC): Madam Speaker, I rise to give the House some idea of the business it will consider next week.

On Tuesday, 25th November, 2008, the business of the House will begin with Questions, if there will be any. This will be followed by presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. Thereafter, the House will consider a Motion to adopt the first Report of the Committee on Government Assurances.

On Wednesday, 26th November, 2008, the business of the House will begin with Questions, if there will be any. This will be followed by presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. After that, the House will consider Private Members’ Motions, if there will be any. Then the House will consider one Motion to adopt the second Report of the Committee on Government Assurances.

On Thursday, 27th November, 2008, the business of the House will begin with Questions, if there will be any. This will be followed by presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. Thereafter, the House will consider a Motion to adopt the Report of the Public Accounts Committee on the Report of the Auditor-General on the Accounts for the Financial Year 2006.

Madam Speaker, on Friday, 28th November, 2008, the business of the House will begin with Vice-President’s Question Time. This will be followed by Questions for Oral Answer, if there will be any. Then there will be presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. Thereafter, the House will consider a motion to adopt the Report of the Public Accounts Committee on the Accounts of Parastatal Bodies for the Financial Year 2006. After this, any other business that will be outstanding will be dealt with by the House.

Madam, it is my intention on this day, all things being equal, to move a Motion to suspend the relevant Standing Orders to enable the House complete all business on the Order Paper and adjourn sine die.

Thank you, Madam.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

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HIS HONOUR THE VICE-PRESIDENT’S QUESTION TIME

Ms Limata (Luampa): Madam Speaker, the issue of defilement in Zambia is becoming worse. What is the Vice-President or the Government doing about this? Are they going to bring another law so that the people committing such offences must be …

Major Chizhyuka: Castrated!

Ms Limata: Yes! Thank you!

Laughter

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, that is a very important question. Indeed, we have to protect our children from defilers. As a Government, we have put in place stiffer penalties to deal with this particular problem. In the amendments which we brought to this august House in 2005, we provided very stiff penalties. In some cases, the minimum is as much as twenty years imprisonment with hard labour.

However, if you have been following what has been happening, the courts have risen to the challenge and are imposing sentences of this nature. Those found guilty of defilement, in some cases, are getting as much as fifteen to twenty-five years. Therefore, the law is adequate, but, at the same time, we should go further and try to sensitise our people. The Victim Support Unit is there so that these cases are brought to the fore and they can be dealt with. I should say the law is adequate.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mwenya (Nkana): Madam Speaker, in April, this year, we passed the Mines and Minerals Act. In that Act, there is Section 136 which is very clear on benefit sharing and we are aware that a substantial amount of money has been collected. Could the Vice-President indicate to the House when he intends to implement Section 136.                            

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, that Act which the hon. Member is referring to is already in force. The Ministry of Finance and National Planning, which is responsible for handling these finances, will look into that matter. Some of the money collected will be dealt with in accordance with the provisions of the Act as well as the Budget. This is because we have stated that some of this money will be put in special accounts. The Act is very clear on how special funds are supposed to be dealt with.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Muntanga (Kalomo): Madam Speaker, what hope can be given to the 8,000 people that were evicted from Sichifuro Game Management Area? At the moment, they have been bundled at a camp called Katanda. Since this is the rainy season and the people’s homes and everything else they relied on have been destroyed, what hope can be given to them?

Mr Sing’ombe: Hear, hear!

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I understand that some traditional leaders were involved in that problem. Nevertheless, as an hon. Member of Parliament, you should learn to bring some of these things to our attention. Of course, this is the Vice-President’s Question Time and it is a forum at which you can raise issues like that.  I have taken note of the matter and you should provide further details so that I can look into it.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Mwamba (Lukashya): Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President what measures the Government is considering taking to insulate Zambia against the global down turn of the economy which is likely to affect our economy through a lower demand for our exports.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, the global financial crisis is of concern to the whole world. In Europe, countries are intervening in the financial markets to save financial institutions. Zambia has not been spared. The global financial crisis has had an impact on Zambia. For example, the copper prices have gone down. We also anticipate having lower foreign exchange earnings. This is of concern to us.

Madam Speaker, as you have seen, the Zambian Kwacha has become turbulent. It is not stable. We have seen upswings in the value of the Kwacha. Regarding what we are doing as a Government, I have directed the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to issue a Ministerial Statement next week so that we can discuss in detail matters to do with the global financial crisis.

Madam Speaker, today, I was listening to the British Broadcasting Corporation (BBC) and Cable News Network (CNN). Because of the decreasing demand for commodities, the price of oil, for example, has gone below US$50 per barrel. These are some of the effects of the global financial crisis. However, as I said, let us wait until next week. The hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning has already prepared a statement which will be discussed in this august House.

I thank you, Madam.

Mrs Phiri (Munali): Madam Speaker, Zambia is a signatory to most of the protocols in the world. I want to refer specifically to the Southern African Development Community (SADC) Protocol on Gender. I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President how he feels as Leader of Government Business in the House about having less representation of women in Cabinet. What is your personal view, Sir?

The Vice President: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for that question. I know that of late the hon. Member has become an activist.

Laughter

The Vice President: Madam Speaker, the protocols which we sign, especially the protocol on gender, are very important to the Government, and we have risen to the challenge in implementing that particular protocol. It is not only Cabinet that we should be talking about, but various decision-making positions. We have tried, as much as possible, to implement that particular protocol, but appointments should also be made on merit. You agree with me on that one, do you not?

Madam Speaker, merit should be considered. Further, more women should participate, for example, in politics so that they can compete and be elected. However, as regards positions in Cabinet, you know very well that that is the prerogative of the President. We also look at who is available.

Hon. Opposition Members: They are there!

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

The Vice President: Madam Speaker, we have made these appointments taking into account all those factors and the protocol.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Mooya (Moomba): Madam Speaker, it seems we are now quiet on the Zimbabwean crisis when in the past we were not. What is our stance now?

The Vice President: Madam Speaker, Zimbabwe is our neighbour and what happens there is of concern not only to Zambia, but to the entire SADC Region. Recently, there was a SADC summit in South Africa at which we were represented by the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs. Therefore, this problem is being tackled through the auspices of SADC. We have encouraged the people of Zimbabwe to resolve their problem and to constitute a Government. That particular issue is being sorted out within the auspices of SADC and the resolutions are public knowledge. That is Zambia’s position.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Sichamba (Isoka West): Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President whether the Government has any plans to repeal the Statutory Instrument issued by the Ministry of Local Government and Housing which increased the charge for a retail trading licence from K100,000 to K500,000. This is because most small-scale traders are failing to pay this amount.
The Vice President: Madam Speaker, licences differ according to the amounts. If the concern is the amount, that particular Statutory Instrument issued by the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing is still in force and we have no intention of repealing it. However, representations can always be made.

I thank you, Madam.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kambwili (Roan): Madam Speaker, in view of the falling prices of copper and our mines being threatened with closure, in the event that the copper price continues to nosedive, what is this Government going to do to prevent the closure of the mining industries.

The Vice President: Madam Speaker, as I said earlier, the issue of the impact of falling copper prices on the Zambian economy is a matter which we will discuss next week through a ministerial statement which will be issued. However, as a Government, we are concerned about the trends in the copper prices because that will mean less receipt of foreign exchange.

I thank you, Madam.

Major Chizhyuka (Namwala): Madam Speaker, given the figures that the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives gave in his ministerial statement yesterday at which the price of mealie meal in some areas of this country has gone as high as K70,000 per 25kg bag and also given the Government’s intention to import 100,000 metric tonnes of maize to cater for the period between March and April next year, could His Honour the Vice-President advise how much maize we exported to Zimbabwe early this year and at what price. In addition, at what price are we going to import the 100,000 metric tonnes of maize? Does this comparative study reflect prudent economic management by this Government?

The Vice President: Madam Speaker, yesterday a ministerial statement was given on the issue and that question concerning figures should have been asked then. I do not have the figures to give, but as regards the price of mealie meal, we are concerned. There is also the issue of the price at which we are going to buy the maize.

Madam Speaker, as the hon. Minister indicated yesterday, we are looking for non-genetically modified (GMO) maize and the price will be a question of supply and demand. The price at which we will buy the maize is something we cannot determine in advance. Further, due to exchange rate fluctuations, it is not possible for me to foretell the kind of price we are going to have. However, it is the intention of the Government to continue to review and to import maize which we can get so that we cushion the price because we know that this is affecting our people adversely.

I thank you, Madam. 

Mr Mbewe (Chadiza): Madam Speaker, we have heard about resettlement areas. What is the purpose of these resettlement areas and where are they situated?

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, thank you for asking me that very broad question. I will take my time to explain what resettlement schemes are all about.

The Government has a programme of settling retirees, retrenchees and people who lose their jobs. We also have street-kids whom we are retraining through various Zambia National Service (ZNS) programmes.

 Resettlement schemes have been established under the Vice-President’s office in all the nine provinces. The purpose of this is to give land to retirees. Land has been demarcated and is being given out to those who desire to use it for agriculture. Once land has been identified and demarcated, the Ministry of Lands is approached to issue title deeds. Therefore, resettlement areas are areas where our retrenchees may settle.

Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr C. B. K. Banda, SC (Chasefu): Madam Speaker, in view of the take over of Zambia National Commercial Bank (ZANACO) by RABO Bank and the subsequent offering of shares to the public, which was done recently, may His Honour the Vice-President tell the House the current shareholding by RABO Bank in ZANACO and whether this shareholding is in compliance with the provisions of the Banking and Financial Services Act.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, that is a very simple question.

Laughter

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, the shareholding of RABO Bank in ZANACO is 49 per cent. The Banking and Financial Services Act requires that a shareholder should hold at most 25 per cent in a bank. However, if you have read the Act, you will know that there is an exception to that rule. If a financial institution is listed on a recognised stock exchange, it can hold more than 25 per cent. Therefore, the holding of RABO Bank in ZANACO is perfectly lawful and in order.

Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Scott (Lusaka Central): Madam Speaker, is the Government considering taking measures to provide traditional leaders with better technical advice on the management and utilisation of resources. At the movement, they seem to make so many mistakes because they absolutely lack expertise.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, under the various laws that we have enacted in this august House, there is a requirement to consult chiefs. Our traditional rulers have a role to play in the utilisation of land in Zambia. Indeed, because the various areas fall under their jurisdiction, they have to be consulted and sometimes they have to take into consideration the interests of their subjects, the nation and the public as regards to the utilisation of land. Therefore, your suggestion that there should be training through various institutions is worth considering.

Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka): Madam Speaker, I would like to ask His Honour the Vice-President a question that is directly linked to his office. Your Honour, last year we suffered a catastrophe as a country arising from the above normal rainfall in the country, particularly in Southern Province. The effect of this above normal rainfall was devastating, especially in Mazabuka, Namwala, Bweengwa and Livingstone districts, just to mention a few.

UPND Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo: Sir, I would like to know from you the detailed levels of preparedness if we suffer a similar calamity this year. Has your office considered depositing relief kits such as tents and food at the district disaster management office?

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, indeed, the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) falls under my office and I have received a comprehensive brief on the situation regarding floods for last year and even anticipated floods for this year. We are already preparing. We are still continuing to address some of the devastation caused by the catastrophes we suffered last year. That is part of our on-going programme. I have a list of areas where we are still addressing issues of infrastructure. We are monitoring what is happening and have information on the possible areas where we may have floods. We have had forecasts and are continuing to monitor the situation and the rains are already here. We hope we will be able to rise to the challenge if there is any catastrophe.

Thank you, Madam Speaker.
Mr V. Mwale (Chipangali): Madam Speaker, I want to ask His Honour the Vice-President when the Government intends to update the laws which deal with the protection of intellectual property rights so as to make them investor friendly.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, the suggestion that copyright laws are not investor friendly may be out of place. The Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry, under whose jurisdiction that particular subject falls, is constantly reviewing the laws to make them attractive to investors. However, we have a comprehensive Act of Parliament on copyright. If the Act needs review and the hon. Member of Parliament has some specific areas which he wishes to propose amendments to, he can make the proposals to the Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry. However, like I said, we already have a comprehensive legal framework which meets international standards and is adequate for the time being. However, the laws can always be reviewed.

I thank you, Madam.

Ms Kapata (Mandevu): Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour, the Vice-President what mechanism the Government has put in place to avoid sending money back to the Treasury, as was the case last year when K900 billion was returned.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, there are various mechanisms we have put in place and the hon. Member knows this. For example, in the last session, we passed a new Public Procurement Act which will make it possible for us to expedite issues of procurement. Issues of procurement have been responsible for some of the delays which we have experienced in implementing projects and this, in turn, has lead to money being sent back to the Treasury.

Furthermore, we have proposed, through the constitution review process, that we should change the budget cycle so that the Budget can run from January to December. We would like to ensure that, every year, there is prudent implementation of the Budget and money is utilised in full for the intended purpose.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa (Chifunabuli): Madam Speaker, the year has almost come to an end and there are constituencies up to now that have not received the Constituency Development Fund (CDF). Could His Honour, the Vice-President, assure this House that all constituencies will receive the fund for this year.

The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I think the hon. Member knows that we should account for resources. CDF must be properly accounted for by the councils which receive the funds before they can receive the next allocation. I am, therefore, encouraging and appealing to all councils and hon. Members, who are councillors in their respective councils, to ensure that returns for the utilisation of CDF are submitted timely so that the pending amounts can be released.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chisala stood up and then sat down.

Madam Deputy Speaker: The hon. Member for …

Laughter

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QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

CONSTRUCTION OF BUS STATIONS
446. Mr Kasongo (Bangweulu) asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing:

(a) what plans the ministry had to ensure that local authorities constructed proper passenger bus stations in all the district centres in Zambia;

(b) what role the National Construction Council was envisaged to play in the implementation of the plans at (a) above; and
(c) how much was estimated to be spent on the above projects.

The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Dr Puma): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister recognises both the potential of markets and bus stations and the need to have appropriately designed structures. To this effect, my ministry floated out a tender to engage a consultant to provide standard designs for markets and bus stations for use by the local authorities. The tender has since been approved and the contract for the project has been signed. The consultant will provide standard market and bus station designs for use by different local authorities throughout the country.

The overall objective of the project is the improvement of the quality of the trading areas and bus stations within the local authorities. The specific project purpose is to provide improved and rationalised markets and bus stations with structures conforming to set standards.

Madam Speaker, the intention of the ministry is to:

(i) provide local authorities with standard designs for the construction of markets, shops, stalls and market sheds;

(ii) provide local authorities with standard designs for the construction of bus stations;

(iii) encourage consumers and traders to trade in designated public places as against setting up illegal stalls and shops all over residential areas;

(iv) encourage bus operators and the travelling public to use designated and approved bus stations and bring about sanity in the passenger transport system.

Madam Speaker, the National Council for Construction (NCC) is expected to carry out its mandate in the construction industry by promoting and building the capacity of the Zambian construction industry while my ministry will ensure that all the construction firms that will take part in the construction of the structures are registered with the NCC.

The cost of constructing the bus stations will only be determined once the consultancy services have been completed. Further, the cost will also depend on the needs of each local authority in relation to the type and number of bus stations to be provided.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kasongo: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for that excellent response. However, I would like to find out whether the time frame for when the consultant is likely to present a report to the ministry has been determined so that action can be taken as quickly as possible.

Dr Puma: Madam Speaker, as stated in the response, the tender has already been approved and the contract has been signed. Therefore, the process has already started and the hon. Member will be informed on the way forward.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mooya (Moomba): Madam Speaker, what is the reason for choosing standard designs?

Dr Puma: Madam Speaker, the current situation where each council comes up with its own design is not good. For example, in some districts, funds have been released for markets, but sheds have been constructed instead. As a result, people are refusing to use these places. Therefore, the ministry has found it prudent to come up with a standard design that will be acceptable all over the country.

I thank you, Madam Speaker,

Mr Nsanda (Chimwemwe): Madam Speaker, I seek clarification from the hon. Minister on the law compelling all bus operators to use one designated bus station. What has happened to this law because BABA Bus Company and other companies owned by people of Indian origin have been given a separate bus station? What does the Fair Trading Act say about one operator being given a whole bus station to operate alone while thousands of other bus operators operate in one bus station? How much are you getting in kickbacks from them?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr Tetamashimba): Madam Speaker, first and foremost, as hon. Members of Parliament, when we are in this august House being heard throughout the country, it is not correct to make insinuations about corruption without proof that there was corruption involved in whatever action or decision was made. For instance, the insinuations that have come from the hon. Member of Parliament, who, of course, should have declared interest because the issue of bus stations is an issue that he, himself, has been using even in campaigns and so on. I can assure you, hon. Member, that there was no corruption involved. Decisions were made by the ministry to allow people who they felt needed bigger bus stops for their use to have them.

However, as a transporter and bus operator, if you believe that there is something that was not done correctly, my office is more than open for you to come and have a discussion so that we can see how best we can do things.

I thank you, Madam

Mr C. K. Banda, SC: Madam Speaker, the financial muscle of most district councils is different in the sense that some have the capacity to raise funds for projects while others do not. Will these plans take this into account?

Mr Tetamashimba: Madam Speaker, I do agree that most councils have no capacity to construct buildings or houses and so on. A decision was made ten years ago, by the hon. Minister, to retire anybody who had more than 22 or 23 years of service. Therefore, most of the monies in the councils ended up being paid out to those retirees. What we have decided to do is to give capacity to the councils, which will include things like putting up markets. This is the reason we want one design which we can ensure can be constructed for the markets.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr L. J. Mulenga (Kwacha): Madam Speaker, …

Mr Malwa: On a point of order, Madam!

Madam Deputy Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Malwa: Madam Speaker, I rarely rise on points of order. Is it in order for the hon. Member of Parliament for Lusaka Central, (Dr Scott) to be reading the Post Newspaper in the House when the Standing Orders are very clear that we should not bring any papers that do not relate to this House into the House? I need your very serious ruling, Madam.

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!
Unfortunately, the Chair cannot see the Post Newspaper and, therefore, cannot rule on what has not been seen. However, it is a rule of this House that we do not read any material that is not associated to the work of the House while we are in session.

The hon. Member for Kwacha may continue.

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Madam Speaker, I think what is cardinal is the question asked by Hon. Kasongo (Bangweulu) on what plans the ministry has to ensure that the local authorities construct bus stations in the district centres of Zambia. The answer that has been given by the minister is insufficient. We would like to have a time-frame regarding its abilities, capacity and economic abilities rather than a fair view answer.

Mr Tetamashimba: Madam Speaker, the local authorities are responsible for markets and bus stations. As a ministry, we have asked the councils to find places where they can put up good bus stations. Even in Solwezi where the previous speaker operates this was done. However, the putting up of the bus stations, including the making of the plans, should come from the local authority. As a ministry, we only supplement if the council cannot manage to put up a good bus station.

I thank you, Madam.

PAYMENT OF TEACHERS WHO RETIRED FROM 2005-2007

447. Mr Kasongo asked the Minister of Education:

(a) whether there was a time-frame in which the Government would complete paying retirement packages to the teachers who retired between 2005 and 2007; and

(b) when the retired teachers at (a) above would vacate the Government houses they currently occupied.

The Deputy Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry (Mr Sinyinda)(on behalf of the Minister of Education (Professor Lungwangwa): Madam Speaker, the Government is committed to paying retirement packages to teachers who have retired. However, the delay in liquidating all the outstanding retirement benefits is due to inadequate resources.

Retired teachers occupying Government houses will vacate the houses after receiving their repatriation payment.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Kasongo: Madam Speaker is it not possible for the hon. Minister of Education to put pressure on his counterpart, the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning so that the plight of retirees can be addressed once and for all.

The Minister of Education (Professor Lungwangwa): Madam Speaker, point taken.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr D. Mwila (Chipili): Madam Speaker, it usually takes the Government two to three years to pay retired teachers due to insufficient funds. I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether these teachers are paid on a new package which is agreed upon after three years or on the old package.

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, the entitlement of retired personnel is communicated to them at the point of retirement and that is what they are paid.

I thank you, Madam.
Mr Chazangwe (Choma): Madam Speaker, since the present system of paying teachers when they retire has failed lamentably and many of them die before they receive their packages, are there any plans to pay teachers, for instance, in two phases; the first and the last phase?

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, it would be very interesting if the hon. Member could come to my office so that we can discuss his proposal in greater detail because it is not very clear. I think it is a ghost in the mind of the hon. Member. I would request that he comes to my office so that the ghost in his mind is cleared.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chisala (Chilubi): Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister if there are any plans to decentralise the paying system. This is because currently, our retired teachers face a lot of difficulties shuttling between their homes and Lusaka.

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, there is some degree of decentralisation in the payment of retirees. For example, the repatriation fee and other benefits are paid at the point of work while the pension is paid by the Public Service Pension Fund (PSPF).

I thank you, Madam.

Dr Kalumba (Chienge): Madam Speaker, knowing as he does – and I know he is a very knowledgeable hon. Minister – that these payment systems for teachers, whether for retirement, settling-in or hardship allowances are problematic, what reform measures is he contemplating to improve the payment system?

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, it is not a question of reform measures, but of the availability of resources. Once resources are available, the current system of payment is sufficient to ensure that teachers get their benefits on time.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi): Madam Speaker, I would like to find out why the ministry cannot alleviate the suffering of retired teachers by keeping them on the payroll until the resources to pay them off are available.

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, I do not think it would be prudent to go that way. We are aware of what is happening at the University of Zambia (UNZA) which has that kind of system and the problems the institution is facing. It is not prudent that with over 70,000 personnel we should add a further financial strain on the meagre available resources.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

TEACHERS IN THE NORTH-WESTERN PROVINCE

448.  Mr Katuka (Mwinilunga East) asked the Minister of Education:

(a) how many teachers were currently teaching in Government schools in the North-Western Province; and

 (b) how many of the teachers at (a) above received the following allowances:
  (i) housing allowance; and

  (ii) rural hardship allowance.

Mr Sinyinda: Madam Speaker, there are 4,478 teachers teaching currently in Government schools in the North-Western Province.
    
                             Males           Females        Total

High Schools         470                   222                692

Basic Schools      2203                 1583             3786      

Total                                                                   4478

Madam Speaker, with effect from June 2008, all the teachers are being paid their housing allowance with their salaries.

Lastly, those who receive rural hardship allowance are 2,338.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Katuka: Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what deliberate measures  the Government has put in place to counter the poor results that are recorded, year in, and year out, in the North-Western Province.

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, when presenting the examination results for the past two years, we indicated the performance levels in the various provinces and the problems that were recorded in the North-Western Province, especially with regard to the poor performance of the pupils in the exams. We indicated the measures that were being taken to alleviate that problem in different areas. For example, an in-depth study of what is going on in the province and, on the basis of the data, the interventions that have to be taken.

Madam Speaker, indeed, we have taken measures like the deployment of teachers to the province so that we can enhance the teaching force there and reduce on the pupil teacher ratios, which are currently quite unbalanced. We have also paid attention to the provision of educational materials and monitoring and supervision of the teaching process in the province and taken various other measures to ensure that the quality of education in the province is enhanced.

In addition, we are currently implementing the infrastructure development plan which will make more classrooms available, thereby, reducing over-crowding in certain areas.
 All these, Madam Speaker, are measures that we have taken to address the problem in the province that the hon. Member has raised.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Kakoma (Zambezi West): Madam Speaker, following a ministerial statement that the hon. Minister of Education gave last year, hon. Members of Parliament from the North-Western Province complained that the number of teachers allocated to the province was inadequate. The hon. Minister promised that he was going to allocate more teachers to the province to alleviate the problem, but, to date, this has not been done. I would like to find out when he is going to allocate more teachers to North-Western Province to alleviate the shortage of teachers because, in some cases, only one or two teachers man a whole school.

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, as I indicated, our deployment criteria pays a lot of attention to the rural areas. If I had the information on how many teachers have gone to the North-Western Province here with me, you would see an appreciable increase in the number. We pay particular attention to the rural areas because we are aware of the current teacher shortage in those areas. The information is available and we can avail it to the hon. Member from our offices.

I thank you, Madam.
Mr Katuka: Madam Speaker, my worry for the North-Western Province is the ratio of the population vis-à-vis the industrial activities taking place there. Is there a thought for positive discrimination in the training of teachers in the North-Western Province so that for the next five consecutive years, we train in North-Western Province local North-Westerners so that we do not only reduce the failure rate in the schools in the province, but also enhance the culture of the people of the province.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, we are managing a united nation through our motto, ‘One Zambia One Nation’. As such, we do not look at our training programmes in a parochial regionalism context.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, a teacher should be able to serve in any part of this country. This is the patriotism that all of us, as Zambians, must demonstrate. I am sure when the hon. Member was in the army, he was ready to defend mother Zambia in any corner of the country. This is what we expect of our teaching profession. All the teachers should be able to serve this country anywhere, at anytime, all the time. As such, when we look at the regional needs, we look at the constraints of performance variations and then see how best we can put interventions in that problem area. We do that by deploying teachers who may come from any part of the country because this is very important for national development. We are here to build a nation and, therefore, must do what is right for the benefit of this country and the generations to come.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

INDUSTRIAL ACCIDENTS FROM 2006-2007

450. Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi) asked the Minister of Labour and Social Security:

(a) how many industrial accidents took place in Zambia from 2006 to 2007;

(b) how many factories were inspected for safety requirements in the period above;

(c) how many factory inspectors were in Zambia during the same period; and

(d) which factories were closed for failure to comply with the required standards.

The Minister of Labour and Social Security (Mr Liato): Madam Speaker, a total of seventy-five occupational accidents were reported during the period 2006 and 2007. In the year 2006, forty-four accidents occurred while in 2007 only thirty-one were reported;

 During the period 2006 and 2007, the Ministry of Labour and Social Security inspected 536 factories, eighty-three construction sites, 1,943 lifting machinery and 1017 pressure vessels;

Madam, during the period under review, a total of twenty-one inspectors were available and distributed as follows:

Town                   No. of Inspectors

Lusaka                           14
Ndola                              03
Kitwe                              03
Livingstone                     01

This is out of an establishment of twenty-four.

A total of twenty-one factories were closed for failure to comply with the requirements of the Factories Act, Cap. 441 of the Laws of Zambia and the list of the companies is as follows:

Factory Location Reason for Closure

Rahmat, Lusaka - Poor ventilation and poor hygiene

Cosab Bakery, Lusaka - Poor ventilation and poor hygiene

Mbala Breweries, Kasama - Operating without boiler certificate

Western Breweries, Livingstone - Operating without boiler certificate

Nakambala Breweries, Mazabuka - Operating without boiler certificate

Mbala Breweries, Mbala - Operating without boiler certificate

Chipata Breweries, Petauke - Operating without boiler certificate

Construction Site for Protea Hotel Livingstone Lack of personal protective clothing and equipment

Livingstone Dairies Livingstone Electrical hazards and lack of sanitary conveniences

Bidvest Laundry Livingstone Lack of personal l protective clothing and equipment

Cinderella Manufacturing of Synthetic Hair Lusaka Poor ventilation and lack of emergency exits

Tombwe Tobacco Processing Lusaka Lack of personal protective clothing and equipment

Sofia Bakery Lusaka Unsafe electrical cables to the dough warmer machine

Fine Steel Industries Kabwe No personal protective clothing and equipment

ZSIC Mpendwa House-lift Ndola Poor ventilation, unsafe machinery, poor hygiene

Inland Investment Folk lift truck Ndola Folk lift track suspended due to faulty hand brake

Chisteel Zambia Limited Lusaka No cover on vee belts, poor ventilation, inadequate sanitary conveniences, lack of personal protective clothing and shoes for workers

Katanga Breweries Lusaka Non-registration of the factory and operating without a boiler certificate

Makali Bakery Livingstone Poor hygiene, lack of protective clothing

Supersonic International Zambia Limited Livingstone lack of protective clothing, lack of fire extinguisher

Bwana Mkubwa Breweries  Mansa Poor house- keeping, operating without boiler certificate and in bad state

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mukanga: Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister how many of the companies that were closed have since complied with the requirements and have now been reopened.

Mr Liato: Mr Speaker, that question needs getting back to specifics on how many of the closed companies have been reopened. The question should have been asked earlier and we would have provided an answer.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Kasongo: Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister when his ministry intends to review the safety policy in order to bring it in line with what is happening in the world.

Mr Liato: Madam Speaker, we have sufficient occupational and safety regulations to take care of the situation here at home. The Factories Act, Cap. 441 of the Laws of Zambia has stipulated all the requirements of safety and health regulations at places of work. As a ministry, we have tried to ensure that we enforce what our law has provided. There is nothing that the world is offering elsewhere that we are not offering in our laws. I would be more than happy if the hon. Member could show us the deficiencies in our law in comparison to the safety and occupational regulations elsewhere because what we have is sufficient. I think it is just a matter of enforcing the law which the ministry has embarked on vigorously in the recent past.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Madam Speaker, in view of the fact that we now have investors whose philosophy and approach to safety issues may be at variance with what our Government expects and what was practised in the past, especially by the parastatal companies, could the ministry consider looking at our laws so that we are able to protect our people more effectively.

Mr Liato: Madam Speaker, investors who intend to invest in Zambia have to comply with the existing legal requirements. If there are any shortcomings in our law that hon. Members know of, they are welcome to make any suggestions so that we deal with them. As far as this Government is concerned, the law is sufficient to ensure that any investor coming to Zambia complies with the requirements of our Factories Act and, hence, provides a safe working environment for our people. That is the position at the moment.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Major Chizhyuka (Namwala): Madam Speaker, there is a general complaint regarding the salaries being paid by some investors who have come into the country. I have in mind salaries as low as K150,000 or K200,000 per month paid to workers on road construction projects. Is the hon. Minister aware about this quagmire our people are facing?

Mr Liato: Madam Speaker, due to our economy opening up and attracting a lot of investment, obviously we shall have so many kinds of investors coming in. Some of them will pay sufficient wages and others will comply with the minimum requirements in terms of the minimum payments as per our law. Others will fall short of these requirements. Our responsibility, as a ministry, is to ensure that we are able to stand on our feet and inspect various places so that we can bring those who do not follow the requirements of the law and those who may wish to pay meagre wages to our people to book.

Madam Speaker, I also want to take this opportunity to say that because of the magnitude of what is required to be done, it is prudent for other people to bring to our attention, as a ministry, where these short-comings are taking place so that they can be addressed.

I thank you, Madam.

COURT SESSIONS HELD UNDER TREES IN SOLWEZI WEST

449. Mr Katuka (Mwinilunga East) asked the Minister of Justice:

(a) how many local courts held court sessions under trees in Solwezi West Parliamentary Constituency from 2004 to 2006; and

(b) what corrective measures the Government had taken to address the anomaly at (a) above.

The Deputy Minister of Justice (Mr Chilembo): Madam Speaker, we are not aware of any local courts that held court sessions under trees in Solwezi West Parliamentary Constituency from 2004 to 2006. However, we are aware that a number of local court buildings countrywide require rehabilitation or reconstruction.

Madam, the Government, through budgetary allocations, is addressing the issue of the rebuilding and reconstruction of court buildings countrywide.

I thank you, Madam.

__________{mospagebreak}

MOTIONS

REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON ESTIMATES

Mr Imenda (Lukulu East): Madam Speaker, I beg to move that this House do adopt the Report of the Committee on Estimates for the Second Session of the Tenth National Assembly laid on the Table of the House on 14th November, 2008.

Madam Deputy Speaker: Is the Motion seconded?

Mr L. J. Mulenga (Kwacha): Yes, Madam Speaker.

Mr Imenda: Madam Speaker, during the session, your Committee considered the budgetary performance in terms of both revenue and expenditure of two ministries, namely, the Ministry of Energy and Water Development and the Ministry of Home Affairs.

Madam, your Committee, further undertook a mid-term review of the implementation of the new mining sector fiscal regime and undertook local and foreign tours. In addition, your Committee considered the Action Taken Report on their Report for 2007.

Madam Speaker, allow me, now, to highlight a few of the pertinent observations that your Committee made during their deliberations and tours, as well as their recommendations on these matters.

Your Committee found that the non-tax revenue performance of the Ministry of Energy and Water Development and the Ministry of Home Affairs during the period under review were positive and above average. Your Committee were informed that this could largely be attributed to the reintroduction of appropriation-in-aid which proved to be an incentive for the revenue collecting agencies and the improved budgetary allocation that allowed for the procurement of logistical items such as vehicles, which, in turn, boosted the revenue generating capacities of the revenue collecting institutions.

However, there was still potential for the two institutions to collect more and positively contribute to non-tax-revenues. The institutions could, for instance, invest in training staff involved in revenue collection, procure modern equipment and revise the fees or levies payable under current legislation.

Madam, as regards budgetary releases, your Committee learnt that in 2006 and 2007, the Treasury could not release the budgeted amounts in full to the two ministries because it experienced revenue shortfalls due to the appreciation of the Kwacha which negatively impacted on domestic revenues and the donor component of the Budget. For the year 2007, substantial resources were also withheld, especially in the third and last quarters, due to the limited absorption capacity problems of most ministries, provinces and other spending agencies. Under-funding on account of this problem affected programmes of a capital nature.

Your Committee were alarmed to note that in the midst of high poverty levels in Zambia and critical needs of millions of Zambians that beg immediate Government intervention, during the period under review, some ministries requested for funds when they were not in a position to expend them. As a result, these ministries ended up accumulating huge bank balances, thereby depriving other institutions of resources. Where institutions had huge cash bank balances, the Ministry of Finance and National Planning could not release more resources as this reflected absorption capacity problems.

Madam Speaker, one of the major issues of concern to your Committee is poor revenue collection, which appears to be a permanent feature in the Government’s financial operations, particularly, with regard to non-tax revenues. Your Committee note that non-tax revenue collection is still ranked very lowly in terms of priority by the concerned ministries, resulting in low incomes and subsequent failure to implement Government programmes.

Not surprisingly, Madam, untimely release of funding, and, indeed, inadequate funding, especially for infrastructure development, is a common phenomenon in the public sector. This negatively affects the implementation of programmes as stated earlier. In addition, your Committee observe that funding for capital projects is often released late in the year, making it difficult for key projects to be undertaken, especially, in view of the fact that accounts have to be closed at the end of each financial year.

Madam Speaker, the issue of low budget ceilings given to the departments at the time of budgeting is of concern as it results in inadequate funding for their activities. In addition, your Committee note that the Government has continued to finance a significant portion of public expenditures through supplementary and excess funding which, though recognised by the constitution, points to poor forecasting of revenues and tends to compromise the role of Parliament in the budgeting process.

Madam Speaker, lack of qualified human resources is another factor that negatively impacts on budgetary performance. The two ministries whose performance your Committee scrutinised this year faced serious problems of inadequately qualified personnel to effectively undertake projects and efficiently manage resources released to them.

Madam Speaker, your Committee, noting the introduction in the 2008 Budget of a new mining sector fiscal regime aimed at maximising the Government’s revenue from the mining industry, while also retaining the competitiveness of the industry, undertook a mid-term review of the new fiscal regime in order to appreciate the challenges, if any, being faced in its implementation.

During this exercise, your Committee learnt that the mining companies had complied with the payment and submission of returns for mineral royalty and company income tax. However, while all the mining companies had submitted windfall tax returns, only two companies, out of eleven had complied with the payment of windfall taxes. Some of the defaulting companies had requested for an extension of payment period. Nevertheless, all the companies that did not pay were treated as defaulters and the income tax provisions regarding recoveries of tax will apply. The companies that did not pay windfall tax cited cash-flow difficulties arising from high production costs as the major problem. The high costs were being driven by, among others, high fuel and commodity prices, and had increased their unit cost to levels close to or above the windfall tax trigger prices. Consequently, the companies had a cash-flow problem.

Madam Speaker, at the time, the windfall Tax trigger prices were designed in the new tax regime, the unit costs were much lower than the current costs and the system was designed on the belief that the trigger points would be reached over a period of about three years. However, world copper prices had risen very fast. Therefore, all the mining companies found themselves faced with windfall tax obligations averaging around 75 per cent.

Madam Speaker, in view of the changed circumstances, the mining companies had made representations to the Government requesting a review of the windfall tax. The matter was being examined to ensure that the implementation of the windfall tax did not undermine the viability of the companies given the changed circumstances. After analysing the matter, the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, in accordance with the provisions of the Income Tax Act, deferred the collection of windfall tax above 25 per cent rate. Let me stress that your Committee were assured that the tax has not been written off and at the end of the income tax charge year, reconciliation would be done to ascertain the companies’ total tax liability.

Madam, your Committee are happy to note that the Government’s determination to ensure that the mining sector contributes equitably to the revenue of the republic has not waned and that the Government stands ready to defend itself against any litigation, should it arise. In this vein, they wish to emphasise that the mining tax regime is law and that all persons operating within the jurisdiction of the Zambian legal system are subject to it. Therefore, while your Committee welcome and encourage the Government’s efforts at negotiations with the mining sector, they wish to reiterate that whatever the resolutions of the dialogue, these should be implemented in a prospective and not retrospective manner. Notwithstanding this, your Committee strongly urge the Government to communicate openly and as frequently as possible with the mining companies as well as other stakeholders such as workers’ representatives over this issue so as to develop a sustainable tax regime for the sector.

Madam Speaker, as regards the utilisation of the additional mining revenue, your Committee were happy to note that the additional revenues that had been collected so far, had not yet been utilised because the Government was examining the most appropriate way to utilise the revenues. Your Committee were assured that the decision on how these resources would be utilised would be presented to Parliament for approval in line with the budget process.

Madam Speaker, in their continuing quest to contribute to the improved non-tax revenue collection and better understand the budgeting and planning process, your Committee, as part of their programme of work for 2008, toured non-tax revenue collection facilities under the portfolio of the Ministry of Home Affairs, particularly, the Zambia Police and the Immigration Department. Your Committee also undertook a foreign tour to Mauritius. Let me briefly highlight the major areas of concern to your Committee, particularly, arising from their local tours.

Madam Speaker, your Committee are alarmed at the low level of funding to the Immigration Department. Your Committee note that the Immigration Department is severely under-resourced.  Additionally, they note that despite exhibiting the capacity to collect large amounts of non-tax revenue, the Immigration Department has not been favourably considered in terms of funding by the Ministry of Finance and National Planning. For example, your Committee find it incomprehensible that the regional immigration offices are expected to run the operations of their regions on meagre monthly grants such as only K5 million for the Eastern Province. Your Committee strongly stress that this should be reconsidered and adequate allocations should be made for all the operating units in order to facilitate their smooth operations.

Madam Speaker, your Committee wish to note, with displeasure, that officers at a number of border posts are still expected to use personal finances to meet the transport costs for official duties such as border patrols and banking of Government revenues. This practice appears to be widespread and was strongly condemned by your previous Committee in the report for 2007 following similar visits to revenue collecting institutions in other ministries. Despite assurances from the Government in the Action-Taken Report on their Report for 2007 that this was no longer the case, your Committee regret to report that the practice is alive. This is unacceptable and your Committee condemn it in the strongest terms. They strongly urge the Government to take immediate steps to provide these officers not only with reliable transport, but  also vehicles which are suitable for the terrain in which the officers are based so that officers can operate effectively.

Madam Speaker, your Committee sympathise with some of the immigration officers in outlying border areas who are unable to adhere to the financial regulations which require that Government revenue should be banked within twenty four hours of collection. For example, at Mwami, Chanida, Kazungula, Shang’ombo, Kalabo and Sikongo, it is practically impossible to do this because of the long distances to the nearest banking facilities in view of lack of transport at these stations. Your Committee also implore the Government to urgently address the problem of banking of revenues collected in foreign currency as well as the exchange rates applied by commercial banks when remitting such revenues to the Bank of Zambia (BOZ) to ensure that exchange losses are minimised.

Madam Speaker, the House may wish to note that there is a general shortage of staff in the immigration department. Your Committee particularly note that some border posts are manned by a single immigration officer as they found in Shang’ombo, Kalabo and Sikongo. This is unacceptable and a danger to national security. Your Committee condemn this arrangement in the strongest terms. They note that it also means that there is no effective revenue collecting mechanism at many of the border posts as illegal entry into the country is rampant.

They further note that a Cabinet decision to allow the department to recruit new staff has not been acted upon by the Ministry of Finance and National Planning for the past three years. Your Committee wish to emphasise that they do not expect the Ministry of Finance and National Planning to be a stumbling block in the implementation of important and urgent Government programmes such as this on. They implore the Office of the Vice-President to seriously look into the issues and expeditiously resolve this matter.

 Your Committee note the inconsistency in conditions of service relating to security institutions under the Ministry of Home Affairs and other security agencies. In this regard, they particularly note that the recent Government decision with regard to payment of rentals for immigration, Drug Enforcement Commission (DEC) and police officers goes against the policy of providing free housing for officers serving in the security agencies. They call for an immediate review of the decision with a view to addressing the inconsistency.

Related to this, the definition of a rural area should be urgently revisited so that all officers operating in the rural areas are entitled to rural hardship allowance. The theory that only a station located 33 km or more away from a district headquarters is in a rural area is misleading and should be discarded forthwith. The definition of a rural area should be based on the realities of the situation at hand.

Madam Speaker, finally, let me address the sad situation relating to accommodation both office and residential for officers in the Ministry of Home Affairs.

Madam, your Committee note that the offices occupied by immigration and police officers in the border areas leave much to be desired. Office accommodation is totally inadequate and poorly ventilated to say the least while residential accommodation for these officers is either non-existent or in a very poor and deplorable state which, in some cases, even poses danger to human life as the houses are in danger of collapsing at any time. Your Committee particularly wish to draw the Government’s attention to the houses occupied by immigration officers at Kazungula, Shang’ombo and Chanida border posts. In this regard, they strongly urge the Government to embank on a countrywide rehabilitation exercise of immigration and police offices and residences.
Madam Speaker, having highlighted a few of the challenges your Committee found facing the offices in the performance of their duties, may I call upon hon. Members of this House to find time to peruse your report for more details.

Madam Speaker, with these few words, may I implore the House to adopt your Committee’s report.

Madam Speaker, I beg to move.

 Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: Order! Does the seconder wish to speak now or later?

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Madam Speaker, now.

 Madam Speaker, in seconding the Motion, may I begin by paying tribute to the Chairperson of your Committee on Estimates and the mover of this Motion for steering the proceedings of your Committee throughout this session and for moving this Motion in such an eloquent manner.

Madam Speaker, I must state that I will try to maximise the allocated time because of the importance of the budgetary process.

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order! The hon. Member is reading and not making a speech off the cuff. Can the hon. Member read the speech.

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Madam Speaker, I will try to maximise the allocated time because of the importance of keeping and maintaining our budgetary process in our great country which is endowed with enormous natural resources.

Madam, with regard to the report itself, allow me to highlight a few critical issues which I strongly feel the House needs to take particular note of.

Madam Speaker, parliamentary work involves people’s representations, views and perceptions regarding the concerned ministries. If the people’s wishes are not taken into account or implemented, then the use of taxpayers’ resources becomes worthless.

Madam Speaker, your Committee are worried about the capacity of Zambia Revenue Authority (ZRA) to deal with the special challenges of taxation in the mining sector, especially with regard to ascertaining the accuracy of income declarations by the mining companies. We are somewhat assured by information that ZRA is enhancing its information and communication technology system used in auditing the mining companies. In addition, a new unit has been established within the authority to deal specifically with tax issues pertaining to the mines.

Additionally, your Committee are happy to learn about the staff recruitment and training exercise embarked on by ZRA in the area of mining taxation. Your Committee wish to strongly reiterate that the Government must assist ZRA in its efforts to meet and deal with the challenges posed by the new mining sector tax regime, particularly the windfall tax.

Madam Speaker, as regards the utilisation of the additional mining revenues, your Committee is happy to note that the additional revenues that have been collected so far have not been utilised as the Government is examining the most appropriate way to utilise them without triggering adverse macro-economic effects, including what is popularly known as ‘Dutch Disease’.

Currently, these revenues are being held in a special account at the Bank of Zambia (BOZ).

Hon. Members: Hammer!

Laughter

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Your Committee …

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1045 hours until 1100 hours.

[MADAM DEPUTY SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Madam Speaker, when business was suspended I was saying that currently, the revenues are being held in an account at the Bank of Zambia. Your Committee has been assured that the decision on how these resources will be utilised will be subject to debate in this House in line with the budgetary process.

Madam Speaker, most of the hon. Members of Parliament assembled here could have opted to remain in their respective jobs or careers, but out of their love for Zambia, they opted to come and serve the Zambian people in this House.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Therefore, I pray that any Government of the day takes the observations and recommendations that your Committees make in this House seriously and ensures that they are timely and speedily taken care of. A repeat of observations and recommendations, year in, and year out, is not in line with democratic principles and parliamentary values as envisaged by multiparty politics.

Madam Speaker, carrying out developmental programmes in select areas will disadvantage a lot of Zambians who are amongst our brothers and sisters. People’s failure to see development in their areas, results in voter apathy, which is a worrying situation and not good for the governance and development of our country.

Madam Speaker, development must be for all. Therefore, revenue must be distributed equitably, regardless of race, political, cultural or regional factors. This is for the betterment of our great nation. After all, we have only one Republican President,?

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Madam Speaker, we only have one country to develop. In the absence of that, all of us must go back home and start doing what we were doing.

Madam Speaker, I pray and trust that, through democratic norms and values, the Government will consider presenting revenue arising from the tax regime to Parliament on a quarterly basis. This is for purposes of transparency.

Madam Speaker, let me now briefly highlight some of the major challenges facing various Government institutions in the execution of their respective mandates. These include lack of or inadequate transport facilities, low budget ceilings, inadequate funding, late release of operational and capital funding and lack of qualified human resource.

Madam Speaker, failure by these ministries to execute their functions is reflected in their poor budgetary performance and poor service delivery to the citizenry.

The people in the Executive are elected by the people and, therefore, budgetary allocations must be to all and not some. The high levels of poverty that the country continues to grapple with have affected, in particular the two ministries whose performance your Committee scrutinised during the year under review, that is, the Ministry of Energy and Water Development and the Ministry of Home Affairs. In addition, the two ministries face serious problems of insufficient qualified personnel to effectively undertake projects and efficiently manage the resources released to them.

Madam Speaker, in many cases, Government ministries do not even have qualified accounting staff to handle revenues collected. In such cases, it is doubtful that any revenues collected will be properly accounted for. This situation is worrying and calls for urgent redress by this Government.

Madam Speaker, your Committee are particularly alarmed at the low level of funding being given to the Immigration Department, which is severely under-resourced. Additionally, they note that despite exhibiting the capacity to collect large amounts of non-tax revenue, the Immigration Department has not been favourably considered in terms of funding by the Ministry of Finance and National Planning. For example, your Committee find it incomprehensible that the regional immigration officer for the Eastern Region is expected to run the operations of the entire Eastern Province on a monthly grant of K5,000,000, which was mentioned by the mover of the Motion.

Madam Speaker, your Committee strongly stress that this should be reconsidered and adequate allocations made for the operating units in order to facilitate the smooth operation of these units. They implore the Ministry of Finance and National Planning to increasingly finance operational units and reduce funding to administrative units such as ministry headquarters. Low funding to tax collection agencies is a recipe for corruption which the Government is fighting with vigour for the betterment of the Zambian people.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr L.  J.  Mulenga: Madam Speaker, with these few highlights …

Laughter

Mr L.  J. Mulenga: … may I implore the House to support your Committee’s report.

Hon. Members: Continue!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Madam Speaker, finally, in writing this report, I went to the Parliamentary Library and researched on the observations and recommendations that have been given by your previous Committees. I found them to be almost the same, but nothing has happened.

Madam Speaker, we use taxpayers’ money to run these Committees and, therefore, I implore the Executive to take the recommendations made by the Committee seriously.

With these few observations, I thank you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Madam Speaker, I intend to be very brief.

 First of all, I wish to commend the Committee for the report they have presented to the House which has been delivered with a lot of gusto. Therefore, I hope the Government is listening.

Madam Speaker, I want to comment on two issues that have been brought up in the report. The one that is very fresh is contained on page 28 of the report and has been adequately emphasised by both the mover and seconder. This is the issue of poor funding to the Immigration Department. If we go back in history, Government revenues used to be collected by a Government department known as the Department of Income Tax. Somewhere in 1993 after the reintroduction of multi-partyism in the country, the Government, under the then hon. Minister of Finance, Mr Emmanuel Kasonde, resolved to set up a new unit which would be autonomous. That is how the Zambia Revenue Authority was set up. Those of us who were there when that decision was made were vindicated in that ZRA did much better than the Income Tax Department and more revenues were being collected.

Madam Speaker, there are some revenue collecting units that have remained within various ministries and the Immigration Department is one of them. I happened to serve as Minister of Home Affairs at one time. It was saddening to note that when we went to border points, we found that the conditions offered to ZRA officers and Immigration Department officers were so different. It was a shame. It was not just a matter of salaries, even the offices. If you went to some of the low lying areas where temperatures are hot, the ZRA office would be air-conditioned. When you went round the corner to the Immigration Office you would be sweating and your shirt would be sticking to you because it is so humid, and yet, it is the same Government. When you went to their houses, you would find that those occupied by ZRA officers were electrified while the ones occupied by Immigration officers had no electricity. We kept discussing within the Government that this must change. Certainly, slow steps were being taken, but I am afraid to note that this has continued to be the case.

I would like to urge the new hon. Minister of Home Affairs, who has served as Minister of Home Affairs before and was Permanent Secretary in the ministry when I was Minister, to work very closely with the new hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning so that this anomaly can be redressed.

Madam Speaker, when we introduced ZRA, we wanted to encourage the officers to work hard. Therefore, we gave them more favourable conditions of service and better wages. At least, we should do something to encourage these people. In case the House is not aware, the Department of Immigration does collect quite a bit of money and if people have nothing to eat at home and they are handling large amounts of money, surely it is an impetus for them to engage in undesirable activities. I think something ought to be done. I would like to implore the two hon. Ministers to work closely so that these issues can be addressed.

Madam Speaker, the report at Item E on page 29 is talking of certain conditions that were available to security officers having been withdrawn, particularly in the Ministry of Home Affairs. In this regard, the Committee noted the Government’s recent decision to stop paying rentals for officers serving under the Immigration Department, Drug Enforcement Commission and Police Service while the other security wings continue to enjoy these conditions. This is becoming risky. These are issues that must be addressed otherwise we will be undermining the security of our country. While I am not taking anything away from the other security wings like the army and intelligence service, it is the police which always has to grapple with matters of internal security. Criminals are always there and the deaths of police officers are increasing. Surely, we can do something to try to motivate and encourage these people. I would like to, again, appeal to Government to relook this particular issue.

The last point I want to make, Madam Speaker, is the one presented on page 9 of the report; revenues collected on account of the new tax regime. The report gives the amount of K242.5 billion as having been collected because of the new royalty tax, windfall tax and company tax. The Government decided that in order to utilise these funds effectively, it was going to put them in some account until next year. Some people were sent to Botswana and Norway to study how such additional revenues are utilised. In the case of Norway and Botswana they are both doing very well. What excuse are you going to give us when the week before, the hon. Minister of Health was saying, on the Floor of this House, that because we do not have resources, cleaners are being employed to man the rural health centres in my constituency. This money is sitting idle just because we want to see how it is going to be used, meanwhile people are dying. Is that why the Government is in office? It is unacceptable. We have the resources. If we are very comfortable here in Lusaka, others are not that comfortable. I do not accept this situation where we are sitting on money and thinking about how we are going to utilise it when children and others are dying in various parts of the country because we have no resources. It is unacceptable. Therefore, I would like to urge the Government and hon. Ministers that instead of sitting and going on endless study tours to study how we are going to utilise those resources, hire some clinical officers and teachers for me and give me some desks because pupils are sitting on the floor. If you do that, then we shall see a change in the voting patterns.

Madam Speaker, each time my colleague, the hon. Minister of Education, speaks very authoritative and confidently about teachers being sent to schools and schools being built, and yet there is nothing on the ground. There will be no change. Maybe I should not blame him because the money is sitting here in an account while we want to avoid the ‘Dutch disease’ whatever that is. Perhaps, the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning can tell us. If I go and tell the people in my constituency that we cannot have a clinical officer because the Government is afraid of the Dutch disease and that money is sitting somewhere in an account while the Government decides how to use it, they will not understand. That is not acceptable. Therefore, I would like to urge the Government to use the resources that we have to serve the needs of the people. The purpose of Government is to ameliorate the conditions our people find themselves in and improve their lot.

There is no way a father can say, “I have money sitting in the House, but I am thinking of what to do with it,” when his children are starving and cannot go to school because they have not eaten anything.

Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kakoma (|Zambezi West): I thank you, Madam Speaker, for giving me this opportunity to contribute to the debate on this Motion. I would like to pick up from where Hon. Dr Machungwa has left on the new mining tax regime. I will be very brief.

Madam Speaker, it is ironical that for many years when Zambia was not benefiting from the mines in terms of tax revenue, the mining companies did not think that it was costly to operate in Zambia. The production costs appear to have been acceptable and the mining companies were reaping profits from Zambia and did not see any problem. In addition, the copper prices were going up. Last year, we decided that Zambia needed to get something from its wealth and, ironically, the copper prices are going down.

Hon. Opposition Member: Imagine.

Mr Kakoma: All of a sudden labour costs are going up in Zambia and the mining companies are complaining. However, as hon. Members of Parliament, we are receiving a lot of complaints from our constituents who are employed in the mining sector that their incomes are very low. It is, therefore, a wonder where the rising costs for the mining sector are coming from.

Madam Speaker, just this week, the oil prices on the world market dropped to around US$50 per barrel from nearly US$150 per barrel a few months ago. One would, therefore, expect that this would help the mining companies to reduce their production costs. The hon. Minister of Energy and Water Development reduced the fuel prices a few months ago and has promised a further reduction in fuel prices. One would, therefore, begin to wonder why the mining companies are complaining that production costs are going up. On the average, and I might be mistaken, world production costs are less than US$100 per unit. It is surprising how, in the Zambian case, the production costs are more than the world average. Where are these costs coming from?

Madam Speaker, the law that we passed in Parliament last year was very clear. In fact, it was this year that we passed the law. We told the Government to collect mineral revenue from the mines. We also sent the Government to collect windfall tax. We did not mandate this Government to start negotiating with the mining companies again. We did not mandate this Government to defer windfall tax. We mandated it to collect the windfall tax. Why is the Government now engaged in fresh negotiations with the mining companies? Why has the Government now decided to defer windfall tax that is collectable from the mining companies?

Madam Speaker, as poor Zambians, even when we have difficulties such as failing to buy food, meeting funeral expenses, payment of medical and educational bills, we still pay tax. We do not go to ZRA and say that our budget is tight and, therefore, could we be given a deferment. Why has this Government found it prudent to negotiate with the big mining companies that have been making profits all these years when we, the poor Zambians, have no option to defer our Pay As You Earn? We are not given any opportunity to do that. Whether one has money or not or other obligations, he or she has to pay tax. Therefore, why should the mining companies claim that they have cash flow problems and, therefore, defer the payment of windfall tax? Why is the Government even listening to them? Who gave it the mandate?
Hon. MMD Members: Parliament.

Mr Kakoma: Madam Speaker, I would like to urge this Government to do what it is mandated to do. It has to ensure that ZRA collects the windfall tax which is due.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Hon. Opposition Member: That is the law.

Mr Kakoma: That is the law that we passed in this Parliament. We did not give the Government a mandate to start negotiating, but passed a law to repeal the Mines and Minerals Act. We also passed a law to do away with the development agreements. Why is the Government going behind the scenes to introduce something similar to the development agreements and why is it afraid of legal action from the mining companies? Even if there is legal action, Parliament gave the go-ahead. Let them go to court and we will meet them there. That is the mandate that we gave the Government.

Madam Speaker, I also want to say that I am bit surprised that this Government has started thinking of creating a stabilisation fund from the mineral revenue. The country has been crying for development and a lot of projects have not been carried out because this Government said that it did not have money. However, Parliament said that there was more money that we could get in terms of tax from the mines and we passed a law so that the Government could collect the money and use it for development. However, the Government has now decided that the money that it is collecting will be put in a stabilisation fund.

Madam Speaker, when you put money in a stabilisation fund, you do not actually have immediate need for it. All you want is to use it to fire-fight any destabilisation in the economy. However, that is not the purpose for which we wanted this money. We wanted this money so that it could contribute to the immediate development of this country and help solve the pressing needs that we are currently facing.

Madam Speaker, instead of creating a stabilisation fund, this Government should have created an investment fund. That money should go into an investment fund so that we invest it to create wealth for this country. We should not put it in a stabilisation fund where it will lie idle at the Bank of Zambia. Who is interested in boasting about so many billions of international reserves when the people are suffering? We do not want to start boasting about international reserves.

Madam Speaker, if the fear is that this money will be too much if poured into the economy which can lead to inflation or destabilisation of exchange rates and other macro-economic indicators, the economic solution is very simple and Dr Musokotwane knows. As the new hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning he is aware of the solution and that is what he used to teach students at the University of Zambia (UNZA) when he was a lecturer there. When you have excess money in the economy, you invest it in productive activities to create more wealth and increase production and there will be no inflation. That is what he used to teach at UNZA and I believe he still believes in that. Therefore, he should use his new position in Government to utilise that money for productive purposes. It does not make sense that when the people of Zambezi are denied a bridge along the Zambezi River, because the Government does not have enough money, at the same time, we have billions of Kwacha sitting at the Bank of Zambia waiting for destabilisation cases. It does not make sense that at a time when people have no fertiliser or seed, we should have billions of Kwacha at the Bank of Zambia waiting to be used on stabilisation cases. In any case, the exchange rate for the dollar has already been destabilised and inflation is going up. However, we are not using that money to stabilise them, but are waiting for next year. Why keep money meant to stabilise the economy? Do not wait for next year because by then the situation will be beyond control.

Madam Speaker, I would like to seriously urge this Government to put that money in an investment fund and create an investment account and not the destabilisation account.

Lastly, I would like to inform the new hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning that, in the past, hon. Members of Parliament have complained about lack of involvement in the budgeting process despite being assured that all Members of Parliament would be involved in the process. To date, as we sit here, none of us has been involved in the budgeting process. As I speak, you have already started preparing the Budget, but as Members of Parliament, we do not know what you are preparing. You want to surprise us, in January, with the Budget so that we start opposing it on the Floor of the House, which is unecessary.

You may keep a few items to yourselves, maybe, the revenue measures, but we have to agree on basic things like capital expenditure. You do not need to hide that. If you are going to reserve K50 billion for the Mutanda/Chavuma Road, tell us so that we agree as Members of Parliament that this money is needed for this road. What is the secret about that?

Madam Speaker, I would like, once again, to appeal to the new hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning and his Deputy Minister, who is not even taking notes when we are debating and giving her very useful points, to take that point very seriously.

Madam Speaker, with those few remarks, I thank you.

Mr Chazangwe: Hear, hear! Wahanjika chilombe!

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwenzi): Madam Speaker, I thank you for giving me an opportunity to add my voice to the debate on this report.

Madam Speaker, I also want to register that a lot of revenue is being lost due to inadequate funding to most of the departments. Some of these departments are the Department of Immigration and the Passport Department. In most cases, when people who want to get passports go to the passport office, they do not find any application forms there. This is so disappointing because this is an avenue through which the Government is supposed to collect revenue, and yet the forms are not available.

The Department of Immigration, year in, and year out, has been asking for transport to enable them visit most areas which are not accessible without transport. An example is Southern Province whose provincial headquarters is in Livingstone. From Mazabuka, there is no single vehicle servicing all the towns up to Livingstone. Right now, we are told that Kalomo Immigration Department is threatened with closure. Meanwhile we have a lot of work, for instance, in Mapatizya where these officers are supposed to go and monitor the activities at Mapatizya Mine and collect revenue. However, due to insufficient funding, they are unable to do that.

Madam Speaker, accommodation for the staff in this department is pathetic. Most of the officers who are supposed to be decently accommodated share houses which are not even worth being called accommodation. In most cases, officers have to pay for their own accommodation from their meagre salaries. All this demotivates the officers who are supposed to collect revenue for this Government and help it budget properly.

Madam Speaker, if this department is properly funded, it can raise a lot of money. However, from the way we are dealing with this department, I do not think much is going to be collected.

Madam Speaker, with these few words, I urge the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to sit down and look at how this department can be assisted to collect enough revenue.

I would also like to congratulate the former hon. Minister of Home Affairs who tried to modernise this department with the computers that were put in place. I am sure he is able to note that there is a very big difference in revenue collection between the period before the department was computerised and after its computerisation.

I thank you, Sir.

The Minister of Finance and National Planning (Dr Musokotwane): Madam Speaker, this being the first time for me to make a contribution in this House, let me take this opportunity to thank you for the welcome. I trust and hope that my presence and that of all those who are coming here for the first time will add value to the business of this House.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, I wish to thank the Committee for the observations and recommendations contained in the Report of the Committee on Estimates for the Second Session of the Tenth National Assembly, appointed on the 25th January, 2008.

In their report, a number of observations and recommendations have been made which include the following:

(a) the need to enhance the capacity of the ministries of Energy and Water Development as well as Mines and Minerals Development in the following areas:

(i) revenue collection; and

(ii) programme implementation, with particular emphasis on poverty reduction and wealth creation and procurement procedures.

My initial comments on the above are that this recommendation is applicable to all other ministries, provinces and spending agencies.

Madam, it is the intention of this Government to enhance capacity in the implementation of Government programmes if our development objectives are to be met. Some measures, such as the presentation and passing of the Public Procurement Bill, have already been taken by the Government as a way of enhancing capacity in ministries.

Let me now address myself to the mid-term review of the implementation of the new mining sector tax regime.

Madam Speaker, the Government has taken note of the observations and recommendations with regard to this matter. Since this measure was just implemented last April, we continue to monitor its implementation. At an appropriate time, the Government will present a progress report on the implementation of the new mine tax regime.

Madam Speaker, let me, at this point, address myself to the points that were raised so eloquently by the hon. Member for Luapula, who is an old colleague of mine from the university, and the hon. Member of Parliament for Zambezi West who did not indicate that, in fact, I was his teacher.

Laughter

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, the issue was that of the revenue that is said to be locked up and is not being utilised. The idea is not to take away the money from the Zambian public. The idea is rather much simpler and goes back about 7,000 years ago in the story that we all remember when somebody said there would be a good harvest for seven years and famine for another seven.  Now, if you go into your garden today and harvest twenty bags and then consume them all in two months, what happens in the third and fourth months? The result will be hunger.

Madam Speaker, that money is very safe. Now that the taxes on copper and other taxes are coming down, we can comfortably go back, like Joseph did 7,000 years ago, and say, ‘bring that money so that we utilise it.’ That is the idea of that fund in simple terms.

Madam Speaker, let me now address the issue of local tours by the Committee aimed at contributing to the improved non-tax revenue collection.  With regard to non-tax revenue collected, the Government has noted the contents of the report and is determined to make further improvements to revenue collection. The Government has, currently, a programme to improve infrastructure in border areas apart from the provision of equipment and transport. All these measures are meant to improve revenue collection, particularly the non-tax revenue.

Madam Speaker, the amount of time available for implementing the Budget, which has resulted, in certain cases, in low absorptive capacity, has also been referred to in the report. This issue, as you will recall, was raised already because our Constitution currently limits us to the current practice that we are indicating.

I have passed this matter on to His Honour the Vice-President to make consultations and see whether, in fact, the issue of the implementation time of the Budget, which currently is about nine months, cannot be isolated from the rest of the constitution review process so that this august House can deal with it so that, in future, we have twelve months to implement the Budget.

Hon. Member: Hear, hear!

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, a number of other issues raised, including the disparity in the conditions of service between ZRA and the Immigration Department, which we have taken note of, will be taken up from where the hon. Member of Parliament for Luapula left so that we can see whether we can make progress this time.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Imenda: Madam Speaker, I would like to thank the contributors who eloquently contributed to the debate, especially Hon. Dr Machungwa who touched on very important issues relating to the utilisation of funds and as touched by the Minister of Finance and National Planning. Hon. Dr Machungwa touched a very important point of the disparities in salaries, housing conditions and offices. I would love the hon. Minister to take note of that as he tries to scrutinise the disparities that are quite shameful when you see what is on the ground.

In his advice …

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order! The mover winds up debate and does not summarises. Wind up the debate.

Mr Imenda: Madam Speaker, I would like to thank all the people who debated this Motion.

I thank you, Madam.

Question put and agreed to.{mospagebreak}

REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON COMMUNICATIONS, TRANSPORT, WORKS AND SUPPLLY

Mr Syakalima (Siavonga): Madam Speaker, I beg to move that this House do adopt the Report of the Committee on Communications, Transport, Works and Supply, for the Second Session of the Tenth National Assembly, laid on the Table of the House on 13th November, 2008.

Madam Deputy Speaker: Is the Motion seconded?

Mr Muteteka (Chisamba): I beg to second, Madam.

Mr Syakalima: Madam Speaker, in keeping with their terms of reference as set out in the Standing Orders, your Committee transacted the following business:

(a) detailed study on the policy on planning and maintenance of township roads;

(b) detailed study of the policy on phone service provision vis-à-vis the international gateway;

(c) consideration of matters arising from local tours; and

(d) consideration of the Action Taken Report on the Committee’s report for 2007.

Madam in presenting this report, I assume that the hon. Members have had an opportunity to acquaint themselves with the contents of your Committee’s report. I will, therefore, only highlight a few issues that caught the attention of your Committee.

Madam, your Committee recognised that the road network within our townships has deteriorated over the years and is in a state of disrepair. Your Committee are disappointed that since independence, emphasis has been put on the construction of new roads to the disadvantage of the development and maintenance plans for existing ones.

Your Committee sadly note that this situation has resulted in the deterioration of the road network to levels where total reconstruction is required to put them back to acceptable standards.

Madam Speaker, your Committee note that under the Public Roads Act No. 12 of 2002, local authorities are responsible for the construction and maintenance of township roads. However, this is subject to the direction of the Road Development Agency (RDA). This entails that the RDA plans, programmes, coordinates and directs the maintenance and, through the National Road Fund Agency (NRFA), mobilises resources for the construction and maintenance of roads. Therefore, in spite of the local authorities having been appointed as road authorities, the RDA continues to directly undertake road projects, a situation which has created inefficiencies and has resulted in local authorities failing to take up ownership of the road works taking place within areas of their jurisdiction.

Madam, your Committee sadly note that although local authorities have been appointed as road authorities, they do not have the capacity to handle road works in their areas of jurisdiction. Your Committee are further saddened that the budgetary allocation for road maintenance is not sufficient considering the magnitude of the intervention required. Your Committee, therefore, strongly urge the Government, as a matter of urgency, to come up with measures that will enhance the capacity of local authorities in order for them to effectively execute their new role as road authorities.

Madam Speaker, your Committee also urge the Government to work out a master plan that will institute massive investment in township roads. To this effect, the Government should mobilise sufficient resources to make sure that these roads are tarred and not just gravelled. Your Committee is also of the view that this will greatly reduce the cost of rehabilitating the existing roads.

Madam your Committee further note that the deterioration of urban roads has been escalated by lack of proper drainage systems. Drainage facilities are designed to protect the roads against an accumulation of excess moisture by eliminating water from the surface in the quickest possible time. Your Committee, therefore, urge the Government to work on the drainage systems of all the township roads to increase their lifespan.

Madam Speaker, Your Committee further recommend that there should be a deliberate policy by the Government to ensure that all the money collected through the Road Fund and Fuel Levy is channelled through the RDA to the road works so intended. This will lead to an improvement in the management of the rehabilitation and maintenance of the road network.

Madam, let me now comment on the liberalisation of the international gateway. Your Committee note that the Government’s policy is to maintain only one international gateway, which is currently being operated by the Zambia Telecommunications Company (ZAMTEL). This facility is seen as a life blood for Zamtel and enables the company meet social obligations on behalf of the Government, so to say.

Your Committee sadly note that although the international gateway is housed within ZAMTEL, the company is currently experiencing financial and operational difficulties. Your Committee further note that ZAMTEL, in its current form, is insolvent and, therefore, needs to be restructured, repositioned and recapitalised to avoid the danger of disrupting telecommunication services in the country.

Madam Speaker, your Committee are of the view that the international gateway should be liberalised in real terms to allow for competition in the sector. The security concerns expressed mostly by the Government are quite unfounded. In fact, the introduction of privately run international gateway would serve as a backup in the event that the international gateway at ZAMTEL broke down. This would reinforce the existing security measures.

Madam, your Committee further observe that restricting access to the international gateway has resulted in poor quality service and payment of high tariffs by consumers for international voice services. Your Committee are of the view that the continued restriction of access to the international gateway, promotes unauthorised practices in accessing the international voice service, leading to reduced usage of the international gateway. This reduces the volume of outgoing international calls through the international gateway which, ultimately, in a negative way, affects the revenue of the gate way operator, in this case, the Government.

Your Committee sadly note that the current licence fee of US$12 million is too prohibitive and has acted as a barrier to entry into the sector of other competitors. Your Committee were informed that Zambia charged the highest fees in Africa. Examples abound in your Committee’s report.

Madam Speaker, during their tour of telecommunication infrastructure, your Committee observed that the private phone service providers are better equipped to handle the international gateway than the Government owned ZAMTEL. Your Committee, therefore, urge the Government, through the Ministry of Communications and Transport, to expeditiously work on the revision of the international gateway licence fee to reflect the value placed on the international gateway under current market conditions.

Madam, allow me to end by saying that case studies conducted in some countries have revealed that there is a lot to be gained by the liberalisation of the international gateway. It is clear that Zambia stands to gain economically from liberalising the sector. It has the potential of bringing down rates, increasing the telecommunications market size and the growth of the economy, all of which will have positive results on the national Treasury. The international gateway should be liberalised in a manner that will maximise the benefits to the country and its people.

In conclusion, let me thank the various chief executives and permanent secretaries for providing the required information and the Office of the Clerk of the National Assembly for the advice rendered during the deliberations.

Finally your Committee wish to put on record their indebtedness to you, Madam Speaker, for appointing them to your Committee.

Madam Speaker, I beg to move.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Deputy Speaker: Does the seconder wish to speak now or later?

Mr Muteteka : Now, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, I beg to second the Motion for the House to adopt the Report of the Committee on Communications, Transport, Works and Supply for the Second Session of the Tenth National Assembly.

Madam, the mover of this Motion has ably highlighted the many issues contained in your Committee’s report for 2008. I will, therefore, only comment on a few issues that came before your Committee.

Madam Speaker, let me start by adding my voice to the displeasure expressed by the mover of the Motion on the rehabilitation of the road network in the country. Your Committee are concerned at the slow pace at which road rehabilitation and maintenance works are being carried out. One example that caught the attention of your Committee is the rehabilitation of the Zimba-Livingstone Road.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muteteka: Madam Speaker, your Committee feel that the Government should have worked on this road expeditiously before leaving it to deteriorate to the levels it did. This road is a very important road for the economy of the country and deserved urgent attention.

Madam, your Committee, therefore, wish to implore the Government to expedite road repairs instead of waiting for the roads to disintegrate to the worst levels, thereby increasing the cost of repairs.

Madam Speaker, let me now comment on the issue of erring contractors who produce shoddy works. Your Committee urge the Government to not only blacklist the contractors, but also punish the clients who fail to supervise the said works.

Your Committee wish to implore the Government to blacklist the engineers, architects, surveyors and all those involved in the execution of these contracts who are equally to blame for the shoddy works.

Madam, I wish to conclude by paying tribute to your Committee for the manner in which they conducted their deliberations and the mover of this Motion for the able and fair manner in which he chaired your Committee’s meetings. I, therefore, urge this House to support the Motion.

Madam Speaker, I beg to second.

Mr Kasongo (Bangweulu): Madam Speaker, first of all, allow me to pay tribute to the mover and the seconder of the Motion and all the members of your Committee.

Madam Speaker, transport in any form is close to the heart of Zambians, be it public, air or water transport. However, I would like to put emphasis on water transport.

Madam, those of us who come from the lake areas depend 100 per cent on water transport for movement in order to see our brothers across the river. Even when it comes to transporting materials from the mainland to the island and swamps, we depend on water transport.

Madam Speaker, it is in this context that I would like to commend the hon. Minister of Communications and Transport for indicating to your Committee that the ministry is in the process of procuring five dredging machines to assist the people in Luapula Province clear the channel. This is a commendable approach, hon. Minister, and I hope that your vision will be translated into action within the shortest possible time. I commend you highly. We depend on the channel for transportation purposes, be it transportation of human beings or equipment.

Madam, for you to build a school or conduct inspections to see how economic activities in the swamps are taking place, you depend on water transport.

Major Chizhyuka: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Madam, in the process of procuring the dredging equipment, we would like to request the Government to consider procuring small boats for Bangweulu Water Transport to ferry our people across the lake and back. I am aware that you may wish to open the window of opportunity where, for example, the private sector may pursue the same window of opportunity, but, in the interim, it is important for your Government to procure small boats. I can assure you that that would be a source of income for Bangweulu Water Transport.

Madam, I have mentioned several times on the Floor of the House that the Ministry of Finance and National Planning was kind enough to release K1 billion in 2005 to procure these boats for Bangweulu Water Transport. We do not know what happened to that money. Please conduct investigations and find out what happened because the story that has been going round is that they have been sending a lot of professionals to India to find out the most suitable mode of transport that can be procured from that end. These have been the stories for three years now.

Madam Speaker, I would like to urge the hon. Minister to find out what is really on the ground. In my view, three years is long enough for your officials to take action. If, for example, we discover that that money has been stolen and that they were giving lame excuses simply because one of the officers may have misappropriated the funds, I expect you to take action as quickly as possible. You must move into that arena with a lot of emphasis on the same. This is a challenge that I am giving you so that we are up-dated on the same matter. I know that you are a performer and you will take action as quickly as possible.

Madam, apart from that, I would like you to look at the status of our post offices. Most of our post offices were constructed during the colonial period. Therefore, it is important for you to collect a lot of information on the status of post offices. You may discover that a number of them were constructed to attend to a smaller population. Now that the population has grown, this could be another source of income on your part. The more post offices you construct, even when you embark upon an expansion programme so that you have more clients who will be paying for the same facility, the more revenue you will generate from this facility.

Madam Speaker, I now turn to the Ministry of Works and Supply. Unfortunately, my colleague is not in the House, but I am aware that he is being represented by His Honour the Vice-President. First of all, let me commend the immediate past hon. Minister of Works and Supply, who did extremely well in this direction. We have seen a lot of achievements in terms of the road network such as feeder roads and so on. I would like to wish him well in his new assignment as hon. Minister of Health. I have no doubt that even the replacement is more focused. I know Hon. Mulongoti as a performer and I am aware that he will be able to take action on a number of proposed roads so that a lot of our people will be able to transport their goods and services from one place to another without difficulty.

Madam Speaker, if you are talking about development anywhere in the world, you cannot ignore the importance of the road network. It is cardinal. A number of our feeder roads are impassable as of now. It is important for the hon. Minister to move into that area with a lot of determination. Let him do more and we expect him to follow the footsteps of the immediate past hon. Minister by undertaking physical tours, province by province and district by district, to see what is on the ground.

Madam, I am aware that the departed late President of the Republic of Zambia, Dr Levy Mwanawasa, was kind enough to give instructions to the Zambian people, through the Ministry of Works and Supply, to construct Chembe Bridge. We commend him highly for that. However, I would like to correct the wrong impression that has been created by a lot of people that the two former administrations did not pay maximum attention to that project. That is not true. That is an international project. The moment you want to put up a bridge between two countries, there should be an undertaking from both sides that both countries will be committed to the project, which is what happened, in fact, during the Kaunda administration and the Chiluba administration. The other administration was reluctant to attend to the same, but, all the same, we appreciate the fact that the current administration, through our departed soul, decided to give us our wealth. It is an international project, but with more emphasis on the people of Luapula. We commend him highly. We are hoping that that the project will not become a white elephant. We want to see a lot of businesses opening up. We will see a lot of investment taking place in Luapula Province. 
Madam, I would like to invite all Zambians who would like to invest in Luapula Province to do so because the time of difficulty is a thing of the past. I would like to use the same opportunity to invite all hon. Ministers, hon. Members of Parliament and Zambians out there to come and invest in Luapula Province. We have abundant resources such as water. Let us put up a lot of lodges and other infrastructure in that area. Those who will establish businesses will be using the same road.

Madam, I would like to talk about the toll gate which the hon. Minister mentioned. I would like to emphasise that we are investing a lot of money in the maintenance of our roads and this has been a drain on the Treasury. We always spend a lot of money maintaining almost the same roads. Each time we prepare a Budget, there will be an allocation to maintain the Lusaka/Kabwe Road or Lusaka/Livingstone Road, and yet the wear and tear of these roads is caused by heavy vehicles coming into country. The money that we collect from all these vehicles is minimal. Therefore, it is time for us to construct a toll gate so that we generate a lot of money which we can use to maintain the roads. This will be a relief on the Treasury. There will be no need to budget for the same roads every year because there will be some money put in a separate account for the purposes of maintaining these roads.  

Madam Speaker, I would like to come to the issue of feeder roads. I think that it is important for the hon. Minister to ensure that all the feeder roads which have been constructed are graded. At the same time, they should now begin putting in place measures to tar them because most of them become impassable during the rainy season. It is important for the hon. Minister to begin thinking about tarring all the feeder roads. Where certain roads cannot be tarred simply because the distance is not long enough, they can think of gravelling them. This will assist our people move their goods from one place to another without difficulty.

Madam Speaker, it is important to recognise one thing when one is hon. Minister of Works and Supply. The demands on his part are very high and we expect him to be very practical. I personally believe in hon. Ministers who are practical and I have no doubt in my mind that Hon. Mulongoti will be like that. Unfortunately, he is not here. He is no longer the Chief Government Spokesperson. He is now an hon. Minister with a portfolio which is close to the people. We expect him to talk less and work more.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Madam Speaker, I thank you for allowing me to add my voice to this very important Motion. Allow me to begin by thanking the mover and the seconder for ably moving this Motion on the Report of the Committee on Communication, Transport and Works and Supply. Madam, I will be very brief.

Madam Speaker, I would like to start by addressing myself to the issue of inter-city roads, with specific reference to the Kafue/Mazabuka and Zimba/Livingstone roads. The mover of the Motion, indicated in his report that these roads actually require more Government attention than they are currently receiving. I would like to go further and indicate that, in the last year, there has been no road that has recorded as many car accidents as the Kafue/Mazabuka Road. This has been mainly due to two reasons.

Madam Speaker, one of the reasons, in my view, is the state of the road. There is never a time when two days pass without a fatal, non-fatal or close-shave accident being recorded. Madam, we were informed by the then hon. Minister of Works and Supply that K10 billion had been allocated to mend this road. A company called Raubex Construction had been given the task to mend the potholes on this road.

Madam Speaker, Raubex Construction, a renown company, was awarded this contract after very lengthy tender procedures. As a result of the passage of time, once this money was released to them, the road had deteriorated much more. As the mover of the report  had indicated, there has generally been no maintenance of these roads, to a level where, the actual state of the roads require complete rehabilitation and not just mending of potholes. 

Madam, we have also been told that to repair 1 Kilometre of a tarred road requires about K1 billion. It is sad to note that if we were to join the potholes between Kafue junction and Mazabuka, I doubt if they would make 1 Kilometre. However, we know that the Government has spent K10 billion to repair this road. The contractor has claimed that because of the passage of time in the completion of tender procedures, it has been very difficult to work on these roads. The then hon. Minister of Works and Supply, who I have visited many a time, actually conceded to the fact that the tender procedure delays are a major hindrance to Government performing their duties more diligently. When will the Government streamline these tender procedures so that when a contractor quotes, there is minimum time spent on selection so that the scope of work does not change between the time they apply and the time they are awarded the contract? The general public tends to think that the contractors are shoddy when, as a matter of fact, they are not, and the shortcoming is squarely on the Government tender procedure.

Madam Speaker, I would like to make an appeal to the Government,  to try, as quickly as possible, to streamline the tender procedures so that once a contract is awarded to a contractor, work starts immediately and they do not become overrun by the increase in the scope of work.

Madam Speaker, the road between Kafue and Mazabuka has seen a lot of people lose their lives. If you go to Mazabuka, today, and visit the police station, you will be surprised to see that it has started looking like an insurance company’s motor vehicle garage, that is, where vehicles that have been written off are taken. This is as a result of the frequency of accidents that happen between these two towns. This is unacceptable.

Madam, in Botswana, as long as you can prove that the road damaged your car when you hit into a pothole, the road authority takes responsibility. You can actually go and make a claim from the road authority which will reimburse or indemnify you by buying you a new tyre.

Madam Speaker, we have seen these potholes every year, for the last fifteen years. They reappear in the same place during the rainy season. Is there no way that the Government can sort out these perennial potholes or craters once and for all so that they start looking at other roads that have not seen tarmac?

Madam, as the mover indicated, I would like to inform this house, especially those that are not so well travelled in the Southern Province, that in Chikankata, during the time of the then hon. Member of Parliament for that constituency, Hon Joshua Lumina, may his soul rest in peace, a project was started to tar the Chikankata Road. It began from the hospital going towards the main national grid have been neglected for the last thirteen years or so. It is incumbent upon the Government to take up some of the projects that other administrations embarked on so that we can have something to show when they either retire or are kicked out of office in the next election.

 Madam, it is unacceptable to drive from the main Great North Road to Chikankata on a terrible non-maintained road only to enter 12 km later a road which was done more than fifteen years ago and is still in good condition. I implore the hon. Minister of Works and Supply to, please, look into that road because this is an economic road. There are many farmers in Chikankata Parliamentary Constituency who would like to bring their produce to the market, but because of the adverse condition of this road, it becomes very difficult.

Madam Speaker, I would like to address myself to the issue of township roads. The mover indicated that there is little or no maintenance of township roads with regard to the drainage system and road names. I want to take Lusaka as an example.

 In this day and age, we have been challenged by a lot of crime, especially in Lusaka. Many of our roads have had their name signs either uprooted or razed altogether. Therefore, if a crime happens and somebody sends an SOS to the police, it becomes difficult to guide the police on exactly where to start from in their investigations.

Madam Speaker, most of our roads, including the new roads, do not have road names. This is a matter that the Government needs to look at critically. I think that we have sufficient names in our vocabulary to name roads. This is not a mammoth task.

Madam Speaker, we have a company that had the initiative to produce a book entitled Street Wise. That was a private initiative. I am, therefore, urging the Government to engage these individuals to help them facilitate the naming of roads, especially in high density areas such as Chibolya, Kanyama and Mandevu. There is absolute need for our roads to be named so that it becomes easier to for people to locate addresses and, most importantly, for the police to be able to combat crime which is increasing in this country.

Madam Speaker, with these few words, I beg to support the report and I thank you.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo (Chongwe): Madam, Speaker, I would like to thank you for giving me this opportunity to speak on this very important report. Maybe, I will take it as my maiden speech as a back-bencher.

 Laughter

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, I want to begin by commending the Chairperson of the Committee and the seconder for a job well done.

Madam, I am particularly interested in the planning and maintenance of township roads in Zambia. I will, therefore, take this as a function under the Ministry of Works and Supply. It is a pity that the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing and his two deputies are not here.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Fire them!

Mrs Masebo: However, I hope they are listening to the debate somewhere on the radio.

Madam Speaker, the issue of township roads gives us, in the Government, a very bad name because most township roads are in a deplorable condition.

Madam Speaker, the biggest problem is what the Committee has alluded to in its report. I am very happy with the way the Committee did its work because they have highlighted the real issues that are preventing local authorities and the Government from doing as we should in road maintenance, especially with regard to township roads.

 Madam Speaker, the Roads Act is very clear. It gives local authorities the mandate over urban roads. However, there seems to be some confusion somewhere or what we call the bambazonke problem, which means somebody trying to do a job which they are not supposed to do. In the process, they have weakened the Act and caused the local authorities not to work.

Madam Speaker, I hope that the two hon. Ministers, the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing  and the hon. Minister of Works and Supply are going to look at this issue critically as soon as possible because it has been an outstanding  problem that has not been resolved because of the RDA officials.

Madam Speaker, the problem, as the report has alluded to, is that the planning for township roads is supposed to be the function of the local authorities that have been appointed by the hon. Minister of Works and Supply. However, even when councils have been appointed as road authorities, they are not able to carry out this function because the RDA wants to do it for them.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: As a result, most township roads have not been worked on in the last three or four years.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: Therefore, I would like to appeal to the hon. Ministers of Works and Supply and Local Government and Housing to look at this problem seriously. Otherwise, we shall continue, year in and year out, having the same problem and when we have elections, we will continue to hear people saying that the roads in the townships are bad. It is not true that the councils do not have the capacity.

In fact, what is happening in the Ministry of Works and Supply is that RDA is poaching engineers from councils because it has better salary structures. This is the same Government. Therefore, you cannot have one Government department weakening another. It does not work like that.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: I think the report has ably brought out the problem. The problem is that there is a conflict of roles. Even when the Act is very clear, people are deliberately ignoring it, misinterpreting the Act and making the councils become weak.

As a Government, we are talking about decentralisation. This is the policy which we have adopted. We cannot, in the same vein, take away the little capacity councils have and put it in another institution at the expense of another Government department.

Mrs Phiri: Hear, hear! Tell them Sylvia! Quality!

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, one of the recommendations of your Committee is that there is need for more resources to be allocated to township roads. While the principle may be right, it is not very factual. In fact, when you look at the Budget for 2007, an adequate allocation was made to township roads by the National Road Fund Agency. Seventy per cent of the Budget was intended for urban roads and I am happy that the report has captured this. When you analyse the 70 per cent of the resources that have been released for urban roads, you find that 50 per cent of that money went to the wrong roads, that is, main roads and trunk roads. You will find that only 6 per cent of the 70 per cent went to urban roads and only 14 per cent went to feeder roads. The reason is simple. It is because both feeder roads and township roads are supposed to fall under the councils, but trunk and main roads are under RDA. Obviously, RDA are very good with regard to main and trunk roads, but not townships road.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker, in this report, it says:

“Your Committee heard that Government policy on roads was to have a well maintained road network, township roads inclusive. This has been vested in the road agencies and road authorities created under the Road Reforms. All aspects in connection with township roads from planning to maintenance were with the road agencies, local authorities included.”

This is where they make a mistake. It must be straightforward. Township and trunk roads are the responsibility of road authorities that have been appointed by the hon. Minister of Works and Supply.

Mrs Phiri: Tell them!

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: The trunk and main roads are the responsibility of RDA, which is also under the Ministry of Works and Supply.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!
Mrs Masebo: RDA is under the Ministry of Works and Supply. However, the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing and other ministers are also members of the Road Maintenance Initiative.

Mrs Phiri: Babazoonke!

Mrs Masebo: However, there is a deliberate problem hon. Minister. Please, look at this issue very critically.

Madam Speaker, I have noted that, in the whole report, each time your Committee talked about township roads, they would say, “RDA and local authorities.”  I suppose they were just take whatever they were told because there is nothing like that.

Madam, the hon. Minister of Lands can, for example, delegate the function of allocating plots to the communities to the local authorities. At no time will you see the hon. Minister of Lands going to the councils to create confusion. The hon. Minister of Lands gives guidelines to the local authority and the local authority, as an agent of the Ministry of Lands, does that job on behalf of the Ministry of Lands. In this case, the road authorities are carrying out functions on behalf of the Ministry of Works and Supply and not on behalf of RDA.

Mrs Phiri: Tell them!

Mrs Masebo: There is this deliberate arrangement because people want to be giving contracts from Lusaka and the councils cannot supervise them because they are far away. In any case, RDA cannot be everywhere. Only the Ministry of Local Government and Housing, under its councils, is everywhere.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: The other point, hon. Minister, you must also look at on this score is the issue of poaching workers from the councils. I think this must be stopped. One of your functions, as the Ministry of Works and Supply, is to build capacity in councils. Instead of transferring workers from your place to the small babies, you are taking from the babies and then turning around and saying, “They have no capacity.”

Interruptions

Mrs Masebo: Now, what …

Dr Machungwa: On a point of order.

Madam Deputy Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Dr Machungwa: Madam Speaker, I rise on a point of order on the hon. Member of Parliament for Chongwe who is debating very well. Is she in order to say that people cannot move to greener pastures by saying the hon. Minister has to stop that? Is she in order not to recommend that the councils improve their conditions of service so that they match those of RDA so that it is not necessary for people to be poached? Is she in order to say, “stop this poaching,” without really addressing the main problem which is the disparity in conditions of service, which, as long as they persist, people will continue to move for greener pastures? Is she in order, Madam?

Interruptions

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!
Do not debate so much from your seats. The rule is that when an hon. Member is on the Floor it is for others to listen and not to debate or make running commentaries. It makes it very difficult for those of us who want to follow the debate because we cannot listen to five people at the same time.

The hon. Member who is on the Floor will take that point of order into consideration as she continues with her debate.

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, I will take that into consideration. However, I am talking about a Government department that has set salaries for both government departments, in this case, the council and RDA. The Ministry of Works and Supply can even appoint a member of the private sector as a road authority according to the Act. However, in this case, the hon. Minister was magnanimous enough to understand and appreciate the role of the councils and also take into account the decentralisation policy.

Madam Speaker, here they are talking about the RDA being responsible for planning. How can RDA be responsible for planning township roads when the councils are responsible for town planning? They are the ones who …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: … decide that they are going to put up Kabwata Estates. As they build Kabwata Estates, they even decide how many roads and banks they are going to have there. Therefore, at what point does one say, as has been indicated here, that they are responsible for planning these roads. That is a misdirection and my advice to the hon. Minister is that either he reviews the Road Transport Act so that this deliberate misunderstanding is removed or he puts his foot down, working with the various ministries concerned, to bring this circus to an end.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: This has been going on for the last two to three years. As a result, in the constituencies we have gone backwards when it comes to road maintenance in towns.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: Most of the local authorities in Zambia, today, have no programmes to talk about when it comes to the maintenance of roads. Kitwe, Lusaka and Ndola city councils knew how to do these things. This was a routine, but now it is more like a ceremony. You create a ceremony where you have to come to Lusaka and say you want to do Kabwata/Libala Road and then you start waiting for six hours, and yet you have come from a far-flung place. How are the people from Shangombo going to come here?

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, I just wanted to add my voice to this issue of township and feeder roads. I am appealing to the two hon. Ministers to sit down and ensure that this matter is resolved because this has been an outstanding issue and the officials concerned have been playing hide and seek.

I thank you, Madam.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Syakalima: Madam Speaker, it seems to me that the House is in agreement with regard to this report.

I thank you, Madam.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order! Ministers are supposed to indicate to speak.

Question put and agreed to.

REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION, SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY

(Debate Resumed)

The Minister of Education (Professor Lungwangwa): Thank you, Madam Speaker. In responding to the Committee’s report yesterday, I did put the report in various categories for ease of understanding. I would like to assure the Committee that, as a ministry, we are addressing a number of the issues that were raised in the report and I will just highlight a few.

First of all, I want to point out that this Government has deep commitment to improving the education system in our country. His Excellency the President has made it very clear that education is a top priority for this Government.

Madam Speaker, in the area of university education, a number of efforts are being made, at the moment, to address the legal framework. In this case, we are broadening the legal framework of higher education to look at not just the University Act, but the Higher Education Act itself, which will take into account the developments in higher education in our country where private universities and other colleges are coming on the scene to provide higher education in our country.

Madam, a number of efforts are being made to audit the operations of the universities. For example, this year, we did contract, through the assistance of the Commonwealth, experts to look at UNZA and the Copperbelt University (CBU) and audit their operations so that they are able to operate and accept the levels of quality in their management and academic programmes.

Madam Speaker, a number of efforts are being made to address the indebtedness of the universities and we have put in place short, medium and long-term strategies for addressing the indebtedness of the universities. We are concerned about the stability of the universities and their efficient and effective operation.

Madam Speaker, it is very clear that education is the key to poverty alleviation and as one writer once pointed out, ‘poverty belongs to those who are not creative,’ and education is …

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: …a major catalyst for creativity.

Madam Speaker, the universities, as the saying goes, are the microcosm of the future society. In the university we expect all students and members of staff to engage in analytical work, conceptual and critical thinking in the development of the professional know-how in ethical dispositions to cultivate tolerance, co-existence and other virtues as well as in skills acquisition, especially in the knowledge acquisition, processing and application. We expect our universities to develop citizens that are both national and international, especially in the globalising world. To this effect, therefore, the universities must be oases of tranquillity where teaching, research and the promotion of scholarship and expert service ought to be taking place. Universities must, indeed, play their role as agents of development in our country, especially in the fulfilment of Vision 2030, wealth creation and employment generation. In this regard, the Government is very concerned about stabilising the university and ensuring that there are no disturbances in the operations of the university.

I take note of the observation of the Committee that there has been political interference in the operations of our universities. This political interference has come from certain political areas or individuals who think that because the university is located in their constituency, it should become a battlefield for political contest.

Hon. Government Members: Shame!

Professor Lungwangwa: These are the politicians who have gone round sleeping in the corridors of the universities, micro-managing the universities …

Hon. Government Members: Shame!

Professor Lungwangwa: … and inciting the students.

Hon. Government Members: Shame!

Professor Lungwangwa: This kind of behaviour must stop.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: Our universities must be oases of tranquility. Our universities must play their role in teaching, research and expert service development. Those that do not understand how a university operates should not go into these institutions and disturb their operations. We have received reports of certain politicians going round and even inspecting whether a bulb is working or not.

Laughter

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, that is totally unacceptable.

 We are doing a lot to ensure that our universities are 21st century universities. We are putting in place infrastructure and strategies to ensure that our universities are researching, our staff are engaged in scholarships and all these efforts must be appreciated. Those small politicians moving around …

Laughter

Professor Lungwangwa: … inciting students must stop.

Mrs Phiri: On a point of order, Madam.

Professor Lungwangwa: Madam Speaker, we are in full cognisance of the current examination difficulties that are going on, especially the leakages. As a ministry, we are very concerned about the integrity of our examination process and measures are going to be taken to address this issue.

There is nothing wrong with Mulungushi University being a public-private partnership institution. The cost of infrastructure development there is estimated at US$35 million and so far the Government has been able to get a partner, Konkola Copper Mines Plc (KCM), that is going to put in US$17.5 million. We feel that this is the new paradigm in university development. We must pursue different ways of organising and developing universities so that, as a country, we are able to turn Zambia into a centre of excellence in education and technology training. This is extremely important

Madam Speaker, we shall continue supporting private universities in line with public-private partnership in the development of higher education so that we can create opportunities for our people to acquire various types of skills which can enable them to effectively participate in the development of our country.

Madam Speaker, we are equally going to put in place measures which will ensure that our public universities have the resources that will enable them to operate at the highest level of university operations.

 With these few comments, we acknowledge the comments raised in your report and their importance in university education.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka): Madam Speaker, I would like to thank all the contributors to this report. I believe that the issues it has raised have been well taken note of by the Executive.

I thank you, Madam.

Interruptions

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

Question put and agreed to.

ADJOURNMENT

The Vice-President (Mr Kunda, SC): Madam Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

Question put and agreed to.

____________

The House adjourned at 1255 hours until 1430 hours on Tuesday, 25th November, 2008.

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