Debates- Tuesday, 25th November, 2008

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DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE SECOND SESSION OF THE TENTH ASSEMBLY

Tuesday, 25th November, 2008

The House met at 1430 hours

[MADAM DEPUTY SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

____________

MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

RESOLUTIONS OF THE SADC AND THE INTERNATIONAL CONFERENCE FOR THE GREAT LAKES REGION ON ZIMBABWE AND THE CONGO DR

The Minister of Foreign Affairs (Mr Pande): Madam Speaker, as the House is aware, Zambia attended the Southern African Development Community (SADC) Extra-Ordinary Summit in Johannesburg, South Africa on 9th November, 2008, which was convened to review the political and security situation in Zimbabwe, following the failure by the Zimbabwe African National Union-Patriotic Front (ZANU-PF) and the two Movement for Democratic Change (MDC) political parties to form a national unity government in Zimbabwe after they had signed a power-sharing agreement on 15th September, 2008.

Madam Speaker, Zambia also participated in the International Conference for the Great Lakes Region Summit (IC-GLR) held in Nairobi, Kenya on 7th November, 2008, which looked at the outbreak of fighting in the Eastern Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) between the Government troops and the rebel National Congress for the Defence of the People (CNDP) forces led by General Laurent Nkundabatware.

The SADC Extra-Ordinary Summit which considered the prevailing situations in the two countries recognised and adopted the decisions taken by the Nairobi Summit of the IC-GLR on 9th November, 2008, concerning the situation in the DRC.

The Nairobi Summit of the IC-GLR, called for an immediate stop of hostilities by all armed men and militia groups in North Kivu and the establishment of humanitarian corridors throughout the area to address the humanitarian crisis and tragedy. The Summit also called for the immediate implementation of the Nairobi Communiqué, the Goma Agreement, which required that parties resort to dialogue rather than conflict to resolve their differences and protocols for sustainable peace and political stability, in addition to the strengthening of the mandate of the UN peacekeeping forces in the DRC. The agreement also required the provision of additional resources, including military equipment and personnel by the UN Secretary-General to enable the Mission address the volatile situation in the DRC adequately.

Madam Speaker, I would like to note that both the SADC and the IC-GLR Summits agreed that should the situation worsen and necessitate regional intervention, both SADC and the IC-GLR would send peacemaking troops to the Kivu provinces of the DRC. The SADC, however, in addition, decided that it would offer military assistance to the DRC by initially dispatching military advisers who would assist in monitoring the situation and training of the Congolese Government forces while both organisations called for continued support to efforts by the UN and other humanitarian agencies so as to provide support to the victims of military violence until the human tragedy is stopped.

It was further resolved that the Troika of the SADC Organ on Politics, Defence and Security should immediately embark on creating a structure for liaison with the mediation process established by the Nairobi Summit of the IC-GLR and the UN Secretary-General which is headed by former Nigerian President, Olusegun Obasanjo and assisted by the former Tanzanian President, Benjamin Mkapa, to negotiate for peace in the DRC. In this regard, consultations are underway by SADC to appoint a liaison person to be attached to the Obasanjo team.

Madam Speaker, the SADC Extra Ordinary Summit primarily met to resolve the impasse over the question of which party should control the Ministry of Home Affairs. However, during the Summit, MDC had also raised the following issues:

1. the establishment of a National Security Council;
2. Constitutional Amendment No. 19 of 2008;
3. the alleged unilateral alteration of the 11th October, 2008 Power-Sharing Agreement by ZANU-PF; and
4. the alleged unfair treatment of MDC leaders by ZANU-PF.

Madam Speaker, with regard to the control of the Ministry of Home Affairs, the Summit recommended co-management of the ministry. The summit will review this arrangement after six months. The Extra-Ordinary Summit resolved that the formation of a unity power-sharing Government should take precedence over the resolution of all other contentious matters affecting the political and security situation in Zimbabwe. This was to try and urgently steer the country out of the current political impasse and especially economic malaise which are negatively affecting the people. The summit took this decision after the parties had considered and rejected the other option of rotational control of the same ministry.

The summit also reiterated that member states resolve to continue to work together and to render support to the process of finding sustainable solutions to matters of misunderstanding or disagreement that may arise between the main stakeholders to the political and economic situation in Zimbabwe.

At the moment, the parties have since resumed dialogue aimed at resolving the contentious issues relating to power sharing both in Zimbabwe and South Africa.

Madam Speaker, I wish to conclude by informing the House that as a Member State of both the SADC and the IC-GLR, and as a neighbour sharing common boundaries with both Zimbabwe and the DRC, Zambia is naturally concerned with the situations in the two countries and remains committed to the resolutions passed by the two regional organisations which are aimed at establishing sustainable peace, security and development in the two countries and the region as a whole.

In this regard, I wish to reiterate Zambia’s support to all efforts by the SADC and the IC-GLR aimed at restoring peace and security to our two sister countries of Zimbabwe and DRC. Zambia will, therefore, do its utmost in giving effect to the decisions passed by the two regional organisations as Zambia is part and parcel of these decisions.

I thank you, Madam.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Deputy Speaker: Hon. Members are now free to ask questions on points of clarification on the ministerial statement given by the hon. Minister.

Mr Sejani (Mapatizya): Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from this Government whether it subscribes to the new phenomenon which is emerging on the African continent, where losers of elections whether they are in Government or Opposition stir up trouble just to create a Government of national unity. This is a fake democracy. Do they subscribe to that phenomenon?

UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Pande: Madam Speaker, although this question does not directly relate to what I have said, in a way, it does in that the situation in Zimbabwe is coming as a result of that. As Zambians, we should learn from these situations as we make some decisions and look at some issues. This arose as a result of not having an absolute winner. According to their Constitution, the President is supposed to win by a 51 per cent majority, but this was not in the Constitution of Zimbabwe previously. The 51 per cent majority was not achieved. As a result, to them, the way the people voted indicated that they wanted a Government of national unity. In short, my advice is that these are learning curves for the Zambian politicians and the people. Regarding the question whether we subscribe to this phenomenon, we do not.

Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chongo (Mwense): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister alluded to the fact that the Southern African Development Community (SADC) is considering sending a team to help advise and train DRC national security forces. Would fighting together with the DRC Government not be misunderstood by the other factions as SADC taking sides?

Mr Pande: Madam Speaker, what we should realise is that in DRC, there is a legitimate Government which was elected by the people. Those others who are fighting are not in Government. They are being referred to as rebels and Zambia and SADC do not support rebels at all.

I thank you, Madam.

Laughter

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that Zambia is represented on both the IC-GLR and obviously, we know that we are members of SADC. As a follow up to Hon. Sejani’s question, can the hon. Minister confirm that they actually do subscribe to sitting around the table with General Laurent Nkundabatware, who he has just described as a rebel, because I know General Obasanjo, the Ambassador to the Great Lakes Region, has been quoted on both the local and international media as having said that there is a need to sit down and discuss with this rebel.

Mr Pande: Madam Speaker, there is a problem which the region wants to resolve. In my statement, I indicated that we would rather have a solution, through dialogue, even if he is a rebel, because we need peace in that part of Africa. Therefore, we have to speak to them so that peace is restored and the people in DRC can live a normal life.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Madam Speaker, hon. Minister, it is common knowledge that Laurent Nkundabatware is fighting a proxy war for one or two neighbouring countries because they are even able to defeat the Congolese army when they are supposed to be a rag-tag army. What is this region and the Government of Zambia doing to try to dissuade the two countries that are waging this war, through their proxy, Mr Nkundabatware, from doing so in order to stop the war?

Mr Pande: Madam Speaker, there are allegations of some other countries being involved and it is one of the issues that the former President of Nigeria, Mr Obasanjo, is looking into or investigating. The issue will be investigated and if it is proved, necessary measures will be put in place.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr L. J. Ngoma (Sinda): Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs, why African Governments and Zambia in particular, leave these rebels to go to the extremes of almost decimating a lot of populations by killing a lot of innocent lives without them moving in forcefully, militarily, before the situation gets out of hand, as opposed to sitting down with these rebels, the criminals who have no respect for human life.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Pande: Madam Speaker, going by what the hon. Member is suggesting, it can have double effects in that these people are in areas where there are innocent citizens, people who are not in the military. If you want to hound him in that manner, the casualties might not only be the rebels, but also the innocent citizens. Therefore, this has to be tackled carefully. That is why initially, the peace keepers are there and when it is seems to fail as it has in this case, we enhance the military personnel to go into the region.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Dr Chishimba (Kasama Central): In as far as the running of the Ministry of Home Affairs is concerned in Zimbabwe, who do you, as a Zambia Government, think is acting ultravires the provisions of the agreement between the parties and what is the Government of the Republic of Zambia doing in terms of advising that particular party to respect the provisions of the agreement regarding who runs the Ministry of Home Affairs?

Mr Pande: Madam Speaker, the bottom line in Zimbabwe is to create a Government of national unity. In other words, it must be a win-win situation for both parties. For Zambia, it stands by what it agreed with the rest of the members of the SADC and it cannot have an isolated or individual position regardless of whatever position it might have.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

_______

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

NUMBER OF TARRED ROADS REHABILITATED ON THE COPPERBELT

451. Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi) asked the Minister of Works and Supply:

(a) how many tarred roads were rehabilitated on the Copperbelt in 2006 and 2007, district by district; and

(b) how much was spent on the rehabilitation of each of the roads above.

The Deputy Minister of Works and Supply (Mr Ndalamei): Madam Speaker, …

Laughter

Mr Ndalamei: … the ministry rehabilitated roads in all the seven districts on the Copperbelt. We have a detailed answer which I will lay on the Table.

Mr Ndalamei laid the paper on the Table.

As regards part (b) of the question, the amounts spent on the rehabilitation of the above mentioned roads, district by district, are given as follows:

 District Contract amount (ZMK)

(i) Chililabombwe 4,043,419,905.25

(ii) Chingola 7,019,768,872.00

(iii) Mufulira 5,324,250,587.34

(iv) Luanshya 6,382,184,228.09

(v) Kalulushi 4,794,663,004.00

(vi) Kitwe 4,188,393,387.01

(vii) Ndola 7,723,776,364.00

The tender requested bidders to submit a lump sum for all the roads in each district and not road by road. The contractors are being paid as a percentage of the total length of all the roads in each district against the length completed.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mukanga: Madam Speaker, I would like to find out why the Government did not involve major mining companies on the Copperbelt to fully rehabilitate all the roads in the province.

The Minister of Works and Supply (Mr Mulongoti): Madam Speaker, surely the hon. Member of Parliament knows that the core business of the mining companies is to mine minerals and attending to infrastructure is the Government’s responsibility. If it is possible to involve them, we do so, but I think it was the responsibility of the Government to undertake these projects.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chanda (Kankoyo): Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister when the Government will be serious enough to rehabilitate the Sabina-Mufulira Road, which is a hazard to motorists.

Mr Mulongoti: Madam Speaker, this is a serious Government …

Interruptions

Mr Mulongoti: … and we take every road rehabilitation project very seriously. Therefore, I do not think it would be fair to place more value on one road and ignore the cries of the many other hon. Members of Parliament. However, the Sabina-Mufulira Road, like any other road, will be attended to in time.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mwenya (Nkana): Madam Speaker, in Kitwe there is no single road worth calling a road because of the state that the roads are in.

Interruptions

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

Mr Mwenya: I would like to find out from the hon. Minister of Works and Supply why Kitwe has been neglected and yet it is one of the areas where a lot of trucks pass through to go to the North-Western Province and the Democratic Republic of Congo. Where is the problem in rehabilitating the roads in Kitwe?

Mr Mulongoti: Madam Speaker, I do not know whether it is the definition of the term “road” which is difficult to understand.

Laughter

Mr Mulongoti: Like many other hon. Members, I too have been to Kitwe and motoring there is quite pleasant expect for a few township roads which require attention. Therefore, for the hon. Member to exaggerate in such a manner is not only unfair to the Government, but also to himself because he is the area hon. Member of Parliament. I see him deriving a lot of pleasure from driving around Kitwe and therefore, it is extremely unfair for him to say there is no motorable road there.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Msichili (Kabushi): Madam Speaker, it has been mentioned that an amount of K7.7 billion was spent on road rehabilitation in Ndola. For the past two years, I have not seen the rehabilitation of any major road. Therefore, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister on which road in particular the K7.7 billion was spent.

Mr D. Mwila: Hear, hear!

Mr Mulongoti: Madam Speaker, I do not know whether the hon. Member is saying those things seriously …

Mr D. Mwila: Just answer him.

Mr Mulongoti: … because Ndola, as you may recall, had suffered a lot of dilapidation, but today, it is very pleasant. There are so many roads that have been worked on and I have a list of roads here for Ndola, if he would want me to read them out. There is the Livingstone Road, Kalewa Road, Makoli Avenue, Chiwempala Road, Boundary Road, Matero Road, Vitanda Street, Macha Road and Lowenthal Street. I, therefore, do hope that the next time he is in Ndola, he will find time to look around and see for himself what we have done.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nyirenda (Kamfinsa): Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what will happen to the roads that have been abandoned in most parts of Kamfinsa Constituency which are is in a very bad state.

Mr Mulongoti: Madam Speaker, we do not abandon roads. What happens is that if a contractor is not performing well, we revisit the contract to see whether we can improve either the performance of the contractor or find another contractor. Therefore, no road has been abandoned and I hope the hon. Member can come to our offices and see what we are doing in respect of the roads in his constituency.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Dr Katema (Chingola): Madam Speaker, we heard from the hon. Minister that rehabilitation of roads in Chingola gobbled over K7 billion and we know that this K7 billion was supposed to be for accelerated urban roads rehabilitation. I would like to find out why the Government does not expend money on rehabilitation of trunk roads which are used by vehicles going to all the districts rather than expending K7 billion on rehabilitation of township roads in Chingola.

Interruptions

The Deputy Speaker: Order! The hon. Minister may answer if he has taken note of the point.

Mr Mulongoti: Madam Speaker, for the first time I have an hon. Member who is complaining that we attended to roads in his constituency as opposed to roads going to other constituencies.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Laughter

Mrs Banda (Chililabombwe): I would like to find out from the hon. Minister when the Chingola/Kitwe Road will be widened as per promise. We are experiencing a lot of accidents. I would, therefore, like to find out when this will be done.

Mr Mulongoti: Madam Speaker, we are seriously looking in to that particular part of the Copperbelt under the Public-Private Partnership. In fact, we intend to move beyond Chingola into Kasumbalesa. Therefore, I can assure you that we are a very serious Government.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Simuusa (Nchanga): The hon. Minister mentioned that contracts have been cancelled. In fact, one contractor in my constituency, Tana Construction, had his contract cancelled in 2007. This year, there has been no allocation for any road to be rehabilitated by any contractor because of procedures. Could I find out from the hon. Minister why it takes so long for us to get the contractors on the ground?

Mr Mulongoti: Madam Speaker, the contractor was working on a joint venture with the Government and whatever difficulties that were encountered had to be addressed before we could reallocate the contract to somebody else. We would like to ensure that the next contractor who comes on site does not repeat the mistakes that were made by the other contractor. We can assure you that in the planning that is being made, we will take his problems into account.

I thank you, Madam.{mospagebreak}

PHARMACY AND POISONS BOARD MEMBERSHIP

452. Mr Ntundu (Gwembe) asked the Minister of Health:

(a) what the membership of the Pharmacy and Poisons Board was; and

(b) what the conditions of service for the Board members were.

The Minister of Health (Mr Simbao): Madam Speaker, the Pharmacy and Poisons Act, 1941 was repealed with the enactment of the Pharmaceutical Act (No. 14) of 2004. In this regard, the Pharmacy and Poisons Board ceased its operations henceforth.

The Pharmaceutical Act provides for the constitution of the Pharmaceutical Regulation Authority (PRA) Board whose composition is as follows:

(i) Pharmaceutical Society of Zambia;
(ii) Medical Council of Zambia;
(iii) Department of Pharmacy, University of Zambia;
(iv) Pharmaceutical Manufacturers, 
(v) General Nursing Council;
(vi) Ministry of Health;
(vii) Traditional Healers Association of Zambia;
(viii) Ministry of Agriculture and Co-operatives;
(ix) Ministry of Local Government and Housing;
(x) Veterinary Association of Zambia;
(xi) Environmental Council of Zambia;
(xii) Office of the Attorney General, Ministry of Justice;
(xiii) One person appointed by the hon. Minister of Health;
(xiv) Consumer Association of Zambia;
(xv) Medical Association of Zambia; and
(xvi) School of Veterinary Medicine of the University of Zambia.

The board members are nominated by the organisations or institutions which they represent and appointed by the hon. Minister.

As regards (b), the board members of the PRA are engaged on a part-time basis and, in accordance with the provisions of the Act, are paid such allowances as may be determined from time to time. Currently, the sitting allowance for the board members is K500,000.00 for the Chairman and K450,000.00 for the other members.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Ntundu: Madam Speaker, the so-called PRA Board that has replaced the Pharmacy and Poisons Board is so ineffective. Therefore, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister why the Government is not ensuring that this board is effective and the board members are paid their sitting allowances.

Mr Simbao: Madam Speaker, I have not understood anything the hon. Member has said regarding the board being ineffective because to the contrary, the board is effective.

I thank you, Madam.

LUSAKA CITY COUNCIL LAND

453. Mr Ntundu asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing:

(a) when Lusaka City Council reclaimed the 300 metres of land on both sides of the Kafue Road between the Kafue Roundabout and Chawama Turn- off for the development of commercial activities;

(b) who the beneficiaries of the reclaimed land were;

(c) how much was raised from the sale of the reclaimed land and how the money was utilised by the Council; and

(d) how many deeds had so far been issued to the beneficiaries of the land at (a) above.

The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Dr Puma): Madam Speaker, I wish to inform this august House as follows:

Lusaka City Council has not yet fully reclaimed the 300 metres of land on both sides of the Kafue Roundabout and Chawama Compound Turn-off.

Madam Speaker, the last time my ministry, Lusaka City Council and the stakeholders had a meeting, it was discovered that some of the plots along Kafue Road which were supposed to be reclaimed had been allocated without proper procedures. This led to the suspension of some staff in my ministry. Currently, the Anti-Corruption Commission and Drug Enforcement Commission are investigating the matter.

In view of the above, I am unable to answer the question in detail until the investigative agencies have concluded their investigations.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Mooya (Moomba): The hon. Minister has admitted that there is no total reclaiming of the land, but looking on both sides, it looks as if it is only 100 metres instead of 300 metres that has been reclaimed. Is it true that it is only 100 metres that has been reclaimed on both sides?

The Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr Tetamashimba): Madam Speaker, we have informed this august House that because our agencies are investigating all issues relating to the said land, including the one the hon. Member has spoken about, it will not be in our interest to give the full details he has requested.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Ntundu: Madam Speaker, going by the answer that the hon. Minister has given that the land is not fully claimed, could I find out from him when the council will fully reclaim this land. Also, can the hon. Minister assure this House that this land will be allocated to Zambians unlike what you are doing now, allocating land to non-Zambians?

Mr Tetamashimba: Thank you very much, Madam Speaker, for the supplementary question from the originator of this question. I would like to assure the hon. Member of Parliament that this Government is about transparency. All the plots along that stretch will be advertised in the newspapers and Zambians who have the capacity to put up infrastructure will be given first priority.

I thank you very much, Madam.

CATTLE RESTOCKING EXERCISE SINCE 2001, PROVINCE BY PROVINCE

454. Mr Imenda (Lukulu East) asked the Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives what progress the Government had made with regard to the cattle restocking exercise since 2001, province by province.

The Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives (Mr Mulonga): Madam Speaker, since 2001, only two provinces, namely; the Southern and Central provinces have benefited from the cattle restocking exercise. The Cattle Restocking Programme was originally undertaken, following the reduction in the cattle population due to the corridor disease in the Southern Province. The restocking project was extended to the Central Province in 2007 where K500 million was disbursed and 252 cattle were bought and distributed to forty-two small-scale farmer groups by December, 2007.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Imenda: Madam Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that the Western Province has the highest number of animals? Is he also aware that this province had the highest number of cattle that died from diseases? How come we have been left out since 2001?

The Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives (Mr Machila): Madam Speaker, the short answer to the hon. Member’s question is yes, we are aware that the Western Province has the highest number of cattle in the country and the omission as he would like to put it, is not, in fact, an omission. We are in the process of working out modalities on how we should address all these issues.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Kakoma (Zambezi West): Madam Speaker, may I find out from the newly appointed hon. Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives …

Laughter

Mr Kakoma: … when he is going to extend the cattle restocking exercise to the North-Western Province.

Mr Machila: Madam Speaker, the issue of restocking will be addressed as and when we have been able to get on top of the issue with regards to cattle diseases. There is no point in restocking simply for the cattle to, again, be infected.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mwiimbu (Monze): Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives whether his ministry has managed to recover the K1.5 billion that was meant for cattle restocking in the Southern Province.

Mr Machila: Madam Speaker, in the Southern Province, a total of K3,491,437,501 has been spent on the Cattle Restocking Programme from inception to date and with that, a total of 3,394 cattle were distributed. I would, therefore, be obliged to receive more specifics from the hon. Member regarding …

Madam Speaker: Order!

Mr Machila: … the K1.5 billion he is referring to.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Madam Speaker, would the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives, who is responsible for livestock, consider, instead of just restocking in those areas where cattle was depleted due to disease, opening up new areas and giving cattle to the other parts of Zambia …

Laughter

Dr Machungwa: … where we have had no cattle so that we can improve on food production for the entire country?

Interruptions

Mr Machila: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for raising that question. The question that he has raised is valid in that it is something that can be considered, but cannot be considered to the exclusion of the historical reasons there are no livestock in those particular areas. However, it is open for consideration.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Hachipuka (Mbabala): Madam Speaker, I, being a member of the Public Accounts Committee, recalls that in the Audit Report of 2005 and 2006, it was reported and adopted in this House that K1.5 billion which was meant for cattle restocking was misappropriated by the administration in Livingstone. Has this money now been recovered and additional cattle purchased?

Mr Machila: Madam Speaker, I would be misleading the House if I gave a categorical affirmative answer because, to my knowledge, this issue raised is still under scrutiny.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Imasiku (Liuwa): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister said that he is still working out modalities of restocking. Is he aware that the situation in the Western Province is critical and if so when is he likely to put the modality into effect?

Mr Machila: Madam Speaker, we are aware that the situation is critical, but, again, I could not say categorically within which timeframe this will be done at the moment.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr C. Mulenga (Chinsali): Madam Speaker, what progress has the Government made in restocking and reviving the Mbesuma Ranch in the Chinsali District?

Mr Machila: Madam Speaker, work on the issue of the Mbesuma Ranch is still in progress as we speak.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

CONSTRUCTION OF LUKULU HIGH SCHOOL

455. Mr Imenda asked the Minister of Education when construction of the proposed Lukulu Boarding High School would be commenced.

Interruptions

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

The Deputy Minister of Education (Mr Sinyinda): Madam Speaker, the contractor is already on site and construction has since commenced.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

BASIC SCHOOLS IN SHIWANG’ANDU PARLIAMENTARY CONSTITUENCY

456. Mr C. Mulenga (on behalf of Major Chibamba (Shiwang’andu) asked the Minister of Education:

(a) when staff houses at the following basic schools in Shiwang’andu Parliamentary Constituency were last rehabilitated:

(i) Mukwikile;
(ii) Kalikiti;
(iii) Mwika;
(iv) Kalonga;
(v) Mutitima;
(vi) Kantimba; and
(vii) Lwanya; and

(b) whether the ministry had any plans to alleviate the plight of the teachers at the schools at (a) above and, if so, what plans these were.

Mr Sinyinda: Madam Speaker, the above mentioned schools have never been rehabilitated. The ministry will rehabilitate Lwanya this year, 2008, and the rest of the schools will be budgeted for in 2009.

With regard to part (b) of the question, the ministry plans to alleviate the plight of the teachers at (a) above with the construction of new houses which have already been drawn in the 2009 Budget.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr C Mulenga: Madam Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether the Government is aware that some of these schools are as old as forty years and, together with the houses, have not been rehabilitated? How does the Government expect teachers to perform well when they come from ramshackle houses and teach in ramshackle classrooms?

Mr Sinyinda: Madam Speaker, I am sure the hon. Member remembers that this year alone, the Ministry of Education, through this working Government, has released not less than K1 billion to each and every district in the country to rehabilitate and construct teacher’s houses and classrooms.

I would like to assure him that this is an ongoing programme. This Government will always endeavor to improve the quality of education by building more classrooms and more teachers’ houses.

I thank you, Madam.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

FOREST INVENTORY, MANAGEMENT AND TRANSPORTATION FOR THE FORESTRY DEPARTMENT

457. Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi) asked the Minister of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources:

 (a) when the last forest inventory for the country was undertaken;

 (b) when the last forest management programme was done;

(c) whether adequate transport was provided for regular forest inspections countrywide.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Minister of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources (Mr Mwangala): Madam Speaker, the Ministry, in collaboration with other line ministries, …

Interruptions

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

Mr Mwangala: … has just completed an integrated land use assessment which provides a general overview of forest resources and other land use in Zambia. For individual forestry inventories in forest reserves and customary land, inventories have been through various programmes such as Provincial Forestry Action Programmes (Copperbelt, Central, Luapula and Southern Provinces), Forestry Resources Management Programmes (Luapula and Northwestern Provinces) and Biomass Assessment.

Hon. Members: Hammer!

Mr Mwangala: Madam Speaker, the Ministry has continued to find ways of sustainably managing forestry resources. Forest inventories and forest management plans which were centrally done by the Ministry, through the Department of Forestry, are now done through participatory programmes such as the Provincial Forestry Action Programmes (Copperbelt, Central, Luapula and Southern Provinces), and Biomass assessments. This process builds stewardship principles in the local communities.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwangala: Madam Speaker, the provision of adequate transport for regular forest inspections countrywide is a challenge that we have always acknowledged. Most offices across the country are not adequately provided with transport due to limited resources. However, the House may wish to note that the Ministry started prcuring vehicles for field activities. All provincial offices now have vehicles and we have started catering for the district offices.

I thank you, Madam.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order! We saw the encouragement to the hon. Minister. The Chair, however, asks the House to now listen to him.

Mr Mukanga: Madam Speaker, I would like to find out how the ministry expects the Forestry Department to carry out inspections and protect the watersheds when they do not have transport currently?

The Minister of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources (Ms Namugala): Madam Speaker, the able hon. Deputy Minister was very clear in the response.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Namugala: He indicated that the Ministry has started the process of procuring vehicles and that each provincial administration has already been allocated a motor vehicle.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Simama (Kalulushi): Madam Speaker, although the hon. Minister has not indicated when the last inventory was carried out, I would like to find out from her how the Forestry Department identifies the threats to forests and relate them to conflicts on soil issues, taking into account the climate change?

Interruptions

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

Ms Namugala: Madam Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister indicated that the Ministry of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources, in collaboration with other stakeholders, initiated an integrated land use assessment. This was started in 2005 and ended in 2007.

Madam Speaker, at the moment, I would like to report to this House that the information is almost complete and will be made available to the public by next year.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Mwansa (Chifunabuli): Madam Speaker, seeing that the Ministry has carried out the Forest Management Programme and taking into account the fact that under the mines and Minerals Act, the destruction of forests by the mining companies in their respective areas does not warrant re-planting of the trees, what measures is the Government taking to ensure that those who destroy our local forests are also made to replant them so that our trees are not depleted?

Ms Namugala: Madam Speaker, the ministry, in collaboration with other ministries, is carrying out a sensitisation campaign to create awareness not only for the mining companies, but also communities for them to appreciate the value of forestry.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Muntanga (Kalomo): Madam Speaker, with the very able hon. Deputy Minister and the new hon. Minister in the ministry, may I know what the Government intends to do to protect the forest reserve in Ndola, which was primarily set for indigenous varieties of trees, but whose trees are now being cut down without any protection at all.

Ms Namugala: Madam Speaker, about 9 per cent of Zambia’s land area is forest reserves. Realising the need to preserve and protect these reserves, the Ministry has undertaken a process of reactivating the 1999 Forestry Act. Through this reactivation, we hope to re-establish the position of forestry guards. You will recall that in the olden days, we used to have people we called bakapenda mabula …

Hon. Members: Hear, Hear!

Ms Namugala: … or forestry guards. It is the intention of the Government to reintroduce this position so that we can have them patrol the reserves.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muteteka (Chisamba): Madam Speaker, the absence of the Forestry Department in most parts of this country has allowed people to encroach on forest reserves to an extent that some forests have been covered by illegal settlers.

Madam Deputy Speaker: Ask your question!

Mr Muteteka: Further, some chiefs have played a role in settling the people in reserved areas due to the high demand of land. What plans has the ministry put in place to ensure that encroachment comes to an end and how does it intend to resettle those who have already encroached?

Ms Namugala: Madam Speaker, through the awareness campaigns that I have referred to, the Government, through the ministry, intends to cultivate community responsibility so that communities can appreciate the value and provide better stewardship for the forests.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Madam Speaker, could the hon. Minister inform this august House how far the ministry has gone in setting up a Forestry Commission or has that idea now been abandoned?

Ms Namugala: Madam Speaker, the Forestry Act of 1999 that I have referred to provided for the establishment of a Forestry Commission. It has now been realised that we can achieve the same objectives with a strengthened Forestry Department. This is what we intend to do, as a Government. We intend to strengthen the Forestry Department so that we provide for what was intended under the commission.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

UNION LEADERS

458. Mr D. Mwila (Chipili) asked the Minister of Labour and Social Security:

(a) what measures the Government had taken to ensure that the conditions of service for full-time trade union leaders in the following unions were monitored:

(i) Zambia National Union of Teachers;
(ii) Civil Servants and Allied Workers Union of Zambia;
(iii) Zambia Revenue Authority Workers Union;
(iv) Public Service Workers Union of Zambia; and
(v) National Energy Sector and Allied Workers Union;

(b) what criteria was used by the unions above to come up with the current conditions of service; and

(c) whether the monthly incomes of the union leaders correspond with their monthly expenditure and, if not, what measures the Government had taken to normalise the situation.

The Minister of Labour and Social Security (Mr Liato): Madam Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that the Government monitors the conditions of service for full-time trade union leaders through their annual financial reports that are sent to the ministry as required under Section 21 of the Industrial and Labour Relations Act, Cap 269 of the Laws of Zambia through the Office of the Labour Commissioner.

With regard to part (b) of the question, I wish to inform the House that most of these unions have committees which come up with the formation of conditions of service for their full time leaders. For example, the Civil Servants and Allied Workers Union of Zambia have an approved budget framework that has expenditure ceilings for each line of expenditure.

In response to part (c) of the question, I wish to state that the ministry has not received any reports from any aggrieved union member that their trade union leaders are spending more than their monthly incomes.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

CONDITIONS OF SERVICE FOR DRUG ENFORCEMENT COMMISSION OFFICERS

459. Mr D. Mwila asked the Minister of Home Affairs:

(a) when the Government would improve the conditions of service for investigation officers at the Drug Enforcement Commission (DEC);

(b) how many senior officers at DEC have reached statutory retirement age and were serving on contract; and

(c) when the Government would discontinue this arrangement in order to allow young officers ascend in the institutional hierarchy.

The Deputy Minister of Home Affairs (Mr Bonshe): Madam Speaker, I wish to state that:

(a) the Ministry of Home Affairs has submitted recommendations to improve conditions of service for investigations officers and is awaiting feedback from the relevant authorities;

(b) there are no officers at DEC who have reached statutory retirement age and are serving on contract; and

(c) since there are no officers on contract, this question does not apply.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr D. Mwila: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister is aware that the workers at DEC are not represented by any union. Could he give the exact time when these conditions of service will be improved.

The Minister of Home Affairs (Dr Mwansa): Madam Speaker, certainly, we realise that the officers at DEC are not represented by any union. In relation to the other part of the supplementary question, as already indicated by the hon. Deputy Minister, we have submitted proposals to increase conditions of service for the officers concerned to Cabinet Office, the institution that is in charge of conditions of service and salaries for people in the Civil Service. Our challenge is to ensure that we endeavour to seek early conclusion of this matter so that our officers can have some relief.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

NATIONAL PENSION SCHEME AUTHORITY

460. Mr Ntundu (Gwembe) asked the Minister of Finance and National Planning:

(a) how much money the National Pension Scheme Authority (NAPSA) had paid out in retirement claims from January, 2002 to date;

(b) how much money had not been paid to the members who reached the retirement age in the period above;

(c) who the bankers of NAPSA were; and

(d) how much interest NAPSA had earned from the money it had in commercial banks from January, 2002 to date.

The Deputy Minister of Finance and National Planning (Ms Kapwepwe): Madam Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that the National Pension Scheme Authority (NAPSA) has paid K77, 930,507,000 in retirement claims from January, 2002 to date.

Madam Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that 2,150 claims of members who reached retirement age from January, 2002 to date are being processed. The amount not paid is indeterminable at this stage and will only be known when the computations are completed.

Madam Speaker, by June, 2008, the NAPSA bankers were as follows:

(a) Stanbic Bank Zambia Limited;

(b) Barclays Bank Zambia Limited;

(c) Zambia National Commercial Bank Plc; and

(d) City Bank Zambia Limited.

Madam, I wish to inform this House that the National Pension Scheme Authority (NAPSA) received interest amounting to K708,371,032,000 from 2002 to date from the commercial banks and Bank of Zambia (BOZ) on the deposits with these banks.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: Madam Speaker, arising from the answer that has been given by the new hon. Deputy Minister whom I did not expect …

The Deputy Speaker: Order! Ask the question.

Mr Ntundu: … to answer this question, I would like to find out why NAPSA takes too long to pay the beneficiaries if they can accumulate so much interest.

The Minister of Finance and National Planning (Dr Musokotwane): Madam Speaker, NAPSA pays the benefits as and when funds are available.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr D. Mwila: Madam Speaker, there is an investment policy at NAPSA and I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether NAPSA allows investing money in lotto jackpots.

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, the investment guidelines for NAPSA were developed by the board and the Investment Committee of the institution. The approval of the investment that he has referred to, the lottery, is in line with the investment guidelines that were approved by the board.

I thank you, Madam.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga (Kalomo): Madam Speaker, could the hon. Minister be very categorical in his answers. The question was why there were delays in paying beneficiaries. NAPSA is the custodian of pensioners’ money, but how can they say they can pay only when money is available? This means that they cannot pay and can only give the usual Government answer of “when money is available”. I just would like to know why they delay in paying this money.

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, I have already responded to the question that has been raised and I have no further remarks to make on the question.

I thank you, Madam.

Interruptions

Mr Ntundu: Where is Magande?

Major-Chizhyuka (Namwala): Madam Speaker, given the answer that has just been given by the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, I would like to ask him to get out of the Civil Service cocoon now that he is an hon. Minister. We want to know why there is a time lag in paying pensioners when the National Pension Scheme Authority is a custodian of pensioners’ moneys.

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, I would like to assure the hon. Member that I have come out of the Civil Service cocoon …

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Dr Musokotwane: … and that I am a well established politician just like himself.

Laughter

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, regarding the delays in paying pensioners, we have to take into account that, in fact, NAPSA is not the only institution in Zambia that delays payments. There are several others and the reason for this is to improve the historical factors that contribute to the situation that we find ourselves in today. These are issues that are being worked on and we hope that they can be resolved in the near future.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kakoma (Zambezi West): Madam Speaker, can the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning explain why he thinks NAPSA has no money to pay pensioners and yet at the same time, NAPSA has money which is readily available to make investments even in speculative investments such as lotteries?

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, if we were to follow the logic of the hon. Member of Parliament, we would extend that to so many other situations. We know that there are so many people who are not paid arrears and so forth. Should all the money that is available be made to pay the arrears and leave the situation such that there is no investment for the future? The answer is that we have to balance these things. You pay what you can, but, at the same time, you have to remember that there is somebody who is going to retire four, five or ten years from now and unless we make that investment, when you come to that time, you are even going to be in deeper trouble.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

I think that the House is not getting the answers very clearly. I would like to ask the hon. Minister to come back to this House and give specific answers to NAPSA so as to give the House the right picture.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Imasiku entered the Assembly Chamber.

Interruptions

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

_______{mospagebreak}

MOTION

FIRST REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON GOVERNMENT ASSURANCES

Mr Chongo (Mwense): Madam Speaker, I beg to move that this House do adopt the First Report of the Committee on Government Assurances for the Second Session of the Tenth National Assembly, laid on the Table of the House on 20th November, 2008.

Madam Deputy Speaker: Is the Motion seconded?

Mr L. J. Ngoma (Sinda): Yes, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chongo: Madam Speaker, the terms of reference for your Committee are in line with your Committee’s mandate, which is not confined to any specific ministry, as it is one of those General Purposes Committees. In view of this mandate, your Committee requested detailed memorandum from fifteen ministries as covered in the Report.

Madam Speaker, you will notice that your Committee, this year, has produced two Reports. This is historical, Madam, as it is the first time that your Committee on Government Assurances has produced two Reports. Your Committee resolved to come up with two Reports this year for the following reasons:

(i) to reduce on the traditional big volume of the Report on Government Assurances. It has been documented that people are generally interested in reading reports which are brief and to the point. This year, we resolved to do this; and

(ii) to enable ministries and relevant Government institutions to determine the rate at which to act on the new and outstanding assurances. It is important to note that all assurances need to be given due urgency and the seriousness they deserve in the implementation plan.

Madam Speaker, allow me to briefly comment on a few pertinent assurances under the following ministries:

 Ministry of Home Affairs

Madam Speaker, on 6th February, 2006, the hon. Deputy Minister of Home Affairs assured the House that corruption among traffic officers would be reduced or done away with, through sensitisation seminars sponsored by the Anti-Corruption Commission (ACC). Furthermore, he reported that a course was to be undertaken at Lilayi Police Training College by traffic officers, besides organising an in-house mechanism of monitoring corruption, spearheaded by the Police Public Complaints Authority. This was pursued vigorously by the ministry. Your Committee applaud the ministry for the good effort in the right direction, as people, particularly motorists, used to complain of undue harassment and exaggerated traffic offences in order for the officers to get bribes.

Madam, your Committee observe that adequate measures have been put in place to curb or reduce corruption among traffic officers and officers in other units of the Zambia Police Service. This is commendable and, in that perspective, your Committee resolve to close this matter forthwith.

Madam Speaker, if the country wants to fight the ever increasing crime levels, there is a need for an increased cadre of well trained and qualified police officers. I believe it was in that perspective that the hon. Minister of Home Affairs made the following assurances on 13th November, 2007, and I quote:

“Mr Speaker, my ministry will not be able to recruit this year because our strategic plans have just been approved and it can be implemented in 2008. Staring next year, we will recruit to meet the capacity of 27,000 police officers by the year 2011.”.

Madam Speaker, your Committee observe, with disappointment, that the recruitment of 1,500 applicants, who have been selected to replace wastage, has not yet taken off. Your Committee wish to urge the Government to quickly release the funds in the budget meant for the recruitment exercise. We, as a matter of urgency, need to reach the capacity of 27,000 police officers by 2011, if crime has to be combated fiercely.

 Ministry of Education

Madam Speaker, on 9th February, 2006, the hon. Minister of Education assured the House as follows:

“Mr Speaker, according to the Fifth National Development Plan, we shall absorb all the teachers who will be graduating”.
Madam Speaker, your Committee observe that the ministry is actually absorbing most of the teachers who are graduating from colleges and universities. This is commendable. It is, in fact, gratifying to your Committee to observe that between 2007 and 2008, the ministry recruited 10,300 teachers. In 2008, the ministry advertised for the recruitment of 5,000 teachers to address the shortfall at basic and high school levels. The recruitment of teachers took place. Currently, the ministry is in the process of recruiting teachers to fill up the gaps of those who did not take up the appointments. Your Committee, Madam, implore the Government to keep up the spirit and the trend, as this is a morale booster for teachers who are being trained.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

 Ministry of Health

Madam Speaker, on 23rd March, 2006, the hon. Minister of Health made the following assurance on the Floor of the House:

“Mr Speaker, yes, Zambia has actually begun to engage some countries that are receiving some of our health workers, in particular, the British Government”.

Madam Speaker, your Committee heard that in January, 2007, the Ministry of Health, led by the Permanent Secretary, undertook a visit to the United Kingdom (UK). The purpose of the visit was to hold discussions with the British National Health Services, the Tropical Health and Education Trust and the Crown Agents of UK to dialogue with their counterparts in the UK so that the British Government may contribute to Zambia’s public health sector.

Madam Speaker, we are happy to report to this august House that the British Government’s response to this plight was positive in that respect. Your Committee observe that the British Government is trying hard to pay back in kind to the Zambian Government by sending their health personnel experts, either for research work or to train health workers on a voluntary basis. In view of this, Madam, your Committee wish to urge the Government to ensure that the brain drain from our vulnerable health sector is reduced at all costs. Possibly, the Government should give good and extra incentives to our health workers particularly, those in rural areas as a way of retaining them.

Madam Speaker, further, on 13th July, 2007, the hon. Deputy Minster of Health assured the House as follows:

“Mr Speaker, the Government will also Chainama Hills College Hospital into a fully fledged second level provincial hospital to deal with all referrals from the four districts namely:

(i) Lusaka;

(ii) Luangwa;

(iii) Chongwe; and

(iv) Kafue”.

Madam Speaker, your Committee heard that the Government had secured support from the Chinese Government to finance and provide technical assistance with regards to the construction of the hospital. Your Committee observe that, indeed, two technical teams from China were sent to undertake feasibility studies and conduct the surveys to finalise the design drawings for the hospital. However, the actual works leading to the expansion of Chainama Hills College into a second level provincial hospital have not yet commenced. Because of this, your Committee wish to urge the Government to embark on the actual construction of the hospital as soon as this will certainly decongest the University Teaching Hospital.

Madam Speaker, in conclusion, I believe that hon. Members have read the contents of the Report of your Committee. My earnest appeal to the Government is to consider the recommendations contained in the Report seriously. It is one thing to promise and another to be seen doing what you promised. It is always honourable and virtuous to match one’s words with action.

Madam Speaker, with these few words, I beg to move.

Madam Deputy Speaker: Does the seconder wish to speak now or later?

Mr L. J. Ngoma: Madam Speaker, now.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker, in seconding the first Report of the Committee which was ably moved by the Chairperson, allow me to comment on some assurances which I feel need urgent and serious attention. I shall endeavour to be brief.

Gender-in-Development Division (GIDD)

Madam Speaker, on 14th February, 2006, His Honour the Vice-President assured this august House as follows:

“The Government has, in fact, embarked on a comprehensive and consultative process with major stakeholders such as Women in the Law Development Association and UNICEF as co-operating partners to come up with a Bill on gender violence which will further address any discriminating practices based on sex and gender.”

Madam Speaker, gender violence has been a serious issue for centuries now. Other centuries have managed to control it by adhering strictly to their laws and the promotion to human rights. However, here in Zambia, to date, we are still getting information that Gender-in-Development Division (DGIDD) is still initiating consultation with the Ministry of Justice on how best to develop the legislation on gender-based violence. It had to take the whole lot of our former and late President, His Excellency Dr Levy Patrick Mwanawasa, SC. to issue directives to the Ministry of Justice to start the process of consultations on the development of legislation on gender-based violence. The Government should be serious with such critical matters as day in day and out, we hear of wives being battered, innocent children being given inhuman treatment, beatings particularly by some step parents and so forth. Sometimes, we hear of husbands being clobbered by their strong wives. Some and such other violence lead to both reported and unreported deaths. It is in view of the foregoing, Madam, that your Committee wish to urge the Government to expedite the formulation of law on gender violence. This will go a long way in averting the ever increasing incidences of gender violence in all its ugly forms.

Madam Speaker, to day, we are celebrating sixteen days of gender activism. There is no better time for the Government to move than now. As opposed to speeches being given at the Freedom Statue or at the Mulungushi International Conference Centre by our leaders, it is time they moved and legislated.

Ministry of Local Government and Housing

Mr Speaker, time and again, we hear of high ranking Government officials, hon. Ministers and their hon. Deputies talking about decentralisation. This means devolving of functions of the Central Government to local authorities for the sake of effectiveness and efficiency in doing Government business at the province or district level.

On 30th November, 2007, Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing assured the House as follows:

“Mr Speaker, it is important that we decentralise some of the functions to the local authorities and the communities so that they can undertake such jobs as supervising the contractors in an effective manner.”

Madam Speaker, we know that there are benefits of devolving the functions of the Central Government to local authorities. The benefits are immense since the Government’s way of conducting business is made easier and accessible by all people even those in remote areas such as Shang’ombo in the Western Province, Vubwi, in the Eastern Province, Muyombe in the Northern Province and Matanda in the Luapula Province.

For one reason or the other, to date, the Decentralisation Implementation Plan which is the road map in the implementation of the National Decentralisation Implementation Policy has not yet been approved by the Cabinet and has continued to gather dust. Is this not a worrying situation, Madam Speaker? Your Committee wish to urge the Government to quickly approve the National Decentralisation Implementation Policy so that an effective, transparent and accountable system of Government is put in place at the district or community level.

Madam, I can go on and on talking about other assurances which need Government’s attention and are of great benefit to the country, but due to brevity of time, I leave it to the Government to read the Committee’s Report critically and carefully and deliver to the people of Zambia what has been assured.

The people of Zambia are watching and are expecting you, as a Government, to perform as per your promise. If you let them down, you know the consequences. Elections are coming in 2011. Never say that you were not told. Take this as free and timely advice. You have been put into office based on promises which need to be honoured and respected for the country to move forward. Take this seriously.

Madam, Speaker, I beg to second.

Hon. Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Msichili (Kabushi): Firstly, I would like to thank the mover and the seconder of this Motion for ably coming up with this beautiful Report.

Madam Speaker, under the Standing Orders of this House, this Committee is mandated to scrutinise the assurances and the undertaking made by the Government, hon. Ministers and their hon. Deputy Ministers on the Floor of this House with the objective of ensuring that these are implemented.

Madam Speaker, as the Chairman stated, this Report, is, indeed, very big and because of that, your Committee had to split it into two. You can see that there are many assurances which are being made on the Floor of this House, and yet only a few assurances are addressed.

Coming back to the Report, I would like to talk about the assurance that was made by the hon. Minister of Education on 17th March, 2006 on the “Verification of standards in schools with poor results”. The hon. Minister said:

“Mr Speaker, a number of schools have recorded a poor result pass rate in the 2005 Grade 12 Examination. The schools will be visited by officers to investigate the cause of poor results and to assist them to improve in their performance and this is particularly so in two provinces.”

These two provinces, the North-Western and Northern, recorded poor results of less than 50 per cent.

Madam, the Government, therefore, constituted a team of standards officers to verify and they went round these schools. Before these people were deployed into the field, the Government was aware of the problems that these schools were facing. The findings from these officers were lack of qualified teachers in high schools where in certain instances senior classes were being taught by teachers with diplomas. Prior to these officers going into the field, they knew what the inadequacies were. Therefore, in coming up with these findings, the Government is not being truthful because it already knows what the problems are in these schools.

For example, when teachers are posted to various schools, they are assured of accommodation, that wherever they go, accommodation will be provided. For this reason, I would like to also look at another assurance that was made by the hon. Minister and I quote:

“Mr Speaker, it is Government policy to provide quality and decent accommodation to both teachers serving in the urban and rural districts”.

The Government has done very little to address this assurance. Ever since this assurance was made, no single house has been built. This assurance was made in 2007. We have leakages in examinations because teachers are not being motivated.

For example, if a qualified teacher is recruited by the Government and is sent to a rural place where there is no accommodation, that teacher will rent a place in the compounds, mixing with the villagers. As if lack of accommodation were not enough, this teacher will go for several months without a salary as she/he will not have been put on a payroll for several months. What do you expect from such a teacher? This is why there are so many examination leakages. Pupils and teachers now connive. For example, this year, there were over 130 examination leakages …

Mr Sichilima: On a point of order!

Madam Deputy Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Sichilima: Thank you, Madam …

Madam Deputy Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1615 hours until 1630 hours.

[THE DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON in the Chair]

Mr Sichilima: Mr Speaker, when business was suspended I rose to make a very serious point of order. Last week, I rose on a similar point of order and the ruling was made by you, Mr Speaker. The ruling is as follows:

“…. Therefore, hon. Members do not debate matters that are for this House outside the House or vice versa. Do not debate things out there and transport them to this House. For whatever reason you may be doing so, it is still improper, unprocedural and dangerous.”

Sir, is it in order for the hon. Member of Parliament for Munali, …

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Sichilima: … Hon. Mumbi, to follow the lies of the president of her party and go publicly on Muvi Television and say that Members of Parliament get a lot of money without even explaining where she is getting that money from?

Furthermore, she purported ignorance of the voting procedure that happened in this House. And the Chair, Mr Speaker, suspended the proceedings of this House in order to guide us for almost forty-five minutes, according to my estimation, on how to vote on the Motion that was to be introduced on the Floor by His Honour the Vice-President. However, the hon. Member went on television and said she did not know the procedure, thereby trivialising and misleading the people out there as I referred to in my earlier point of order.

You guided us to take the debates and the business of the House seriously if people are to respect us. Following what the hon. Member of Parliament, Hon. Mumbi Phiri did, I need your serious ruling.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Members, the point of order raised by the Deputy Minister in the Office of the Vice President is, indeed, very pertinent. Let me repeat that “I” refers to the Speaker of the National Assembly. What I ruled last time is valid up to now and the ruling is unquestionable. However, on a technicality, I now have a problem in that I was not privy to what was said on Muvi Television as pointed out by the hon. Deputy Minister.

In view of that problem and technicality, I refer the matter to the Committee on Privileges for further study.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Chairperson: The hon. Member for Kabushi may continue, please.

Mr Msichili: Mr Speaker, before the point of order was raised, I was talking about accommodation for new entrants. Sir, when new entrants are posted to various stations, they are not given houses to live in and this de-motivates them. This is why I was saying that, for several months, new entrants have not received a salary, hence the many cases of teachers and pupils involved in examination leakages.

Interruptions

The Deputy Chairperson: Order! Let us listen.

Mr Msichili: Mr Speaker, this year alone, it has been reported that there have been about 120 examination malpractices. This figure is on the upswing and this is why we need to find a lasting solution to this problem. We can only find a lasting solution with the help of the unions who must come in through their members to see how best we can address this issue. At the moment, teachers are found in these malpractices because there are no stiffer laws that can stop them from doing such things.

Mr Speaker, as Parliament, we must come up with stiffer laws for would-be offenders.

 I must also talk about the reports that we receive that even priests are mentioned in the examination leakages.

Mr Munaile: From which church?

Mr Msichili: Mr Speaker, it is very worrying because these are the people in whom we had a lot of confidence. If priests can be involved in such malpractices, …

Interruptions

Mr Msichili: … it is very worrying.

Hon. Member: Catholic priests!

Mr Msichili: Mr Speaker, it was reported in the paper that three priests were involved.

Mr Munaile: From which church?

Mr Msichili: Mr Speaker, this is why I am saying that it is very worrying. Sir, for a long time, these churches which used to run schools, used to produce very good results. Supervision from the Government was minimal because we had all the trust in those schools. We started facing problems of pupils graduating from schools with very high marks, but failing in higher learning institutions such as the university. We used to wonder what the reason was for the quick exit of these pupils from higher learning institutions. We can conclude that maybe this has been going on for a long time.

Mr Speaker, we are now urging the Government to intensify the supervision in all schools, regardless of whether they are run by the Church, Government or privately owned.

Mr Speaker, I now move to an assurance made by the hon. Minister of Labour and Social Services and this was database on employment skills in Zambia. This is a very good concept, but there are a few questions which must be asked such as what format there is on this database; how they came up with this database; how many sectors were covered in this database and how easy it is for the people in this database to be accessed if, for instance, we want to get a qualified person from this database. This will help people who are looking for particular skills to trace them quickly. But, Sir, I doubt if we will be able to get anybody because even for those people in the database, we may not even have contact numbers for them and so we would like the Government to look into this matter again.

In conclusion, I wish to emphasise that it is important for the Government to consult the local community on projects they wish to embark on. I will make reference to this thing we have in Ndola called the Indian Economic Zone. This thing has come to Ndola, but we just saw it on television. We would have appreciated the hon. Minister in charge to consult. Some of these programmes would work well if you consulted the locals because as Member of Parliament for Ndola, I was surprised to hear that very soon, we would have this zone in our area. We expected the hon. Minister in charge to give us a brief even before going into it because that way, it would have been easier for us to work with the would-be investors and the people who are coming.

Mr Speaker, sometimes, we get resistance from the people because they are not informed. We are advising the Government that in future, when coming up with such programmes, the people should be consulted because that way, you will have an easy passage in most areas.

I thank you, Sir.{mospagebreak}

Mr Mooya (Moomba): Mr Speaker, I stand to discuss one or two issues in the Report. Mr Speaker, I would like to make a comment on the Chembe Bridge which has been renamed the Levy Patrick Mwanawasa Bridge. Here I must commend the former Minister of Works and Supply, Hon. Simbao, for having done what Napoleon could not have done.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mooya: This has been going on for a long time, even during the Federal days, this project was on the drawing board. Sir, we know how important this link is to the Luapula and Northern Province. I am happy that I belong to this era in which we have successfully completed the bridge. I think we have Zambian consultants who supervise the construction of the bridge.

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Mooya: Well done former Minister of Works and Supply.

Hon. Government Member: Quality.

Mr Mooya: Let me now come to the Draft Procurement Bill which was passed here some few months ago. To me really, the answer to the problems in the construction sector lies in the Draft Procurement Bill. How I wish this could have come much earlier, maybe when the MMD came into power in 1991 because then, we would have developed the country a lot. To me, this is the answer to the shoddy work, corruption and all the ills you mentioned in the construction sector. The answer is here and I hope this Act will come into force by the end of December so that come 2009, we start afresh with seriousness.

With these few words, Mr Speaker, I would like to thank you.

Mr Sikazwe (Chimbamilonga): Thank you, Mr Speaker, I stand to support the Report and I will go straight to page 14 to thank the Permanent Secretary of Ministry of Energy and Water Development, who came to submit something that I have been talking about. To me, this has been a constraint because whenever the hon. Minister stood on the Floor of this House he did not mention that …

Mr Msichili: On a point of order, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.

Mr Msichili: Mr Speaker, sorry to disturb the debate, is he in order to debate a wrong Report because there are two reports which we are debating in this House. We have a blue report and a pink report, now he is debating the second Report. Is he in order to debate the second Report which will be tabled tomorrow?

Laughter

The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Member for Chimbamilonga, if you are debating the contents of the second Report, then you are definitely out of order.

Laughter

The Deputy Chairperson: We are considering the first Report. With that clarification, I will call on the hon. Deputy Minister of Education.

Laughter

The Deputy Minister of Education (Mr Sinyinda): Thank you, Mr Speaker, I stand to support the Report and at the same time, show that this Government is committed to delivery of quality education in this country. We realise that without some projects that we should undertake, we will not deliver quality education. However, this Government, through the Ministry of Education, is committed to the delivery of quality education through infrastructure development.

Mr Speaker, you remember that at the beginning of this year, this Government released a lot of money to all the districts in the country to ensure that classrooms and teachers’ houses are built, rehabilitated and maintained. I would like to ensure this august House that we always endeavour to have conducive learning atmosphere by, again, recruiting a lot of teachers. This year, as you may know, we have recruited more than 6,000 teachers and next year, I would like to assure this House that we will recruit more teachers so that our children can have teachers who will deliver quality education to them. At the same time, we will endeavour to make sure that we provide learning and teaching materials in our schools. As you know, at the moment, we do not have enough books, but it is this Government’s policy to ensure that very shortly, we have a book between two children. This is what we are committed to doing.

Mr Speaker, I would like also to assure this House that before the end of this year, we will review the curriculum that is there in the schools. At the moment, we are not satisfied that the curriculum may not be relevant to the development of this country and I would like to commend the Zambians who are calling upon us to make sure that we provide a curriculum that will be relevant to the education and development of this country. We know that this country is set to be a needy income country by 2030. Therefore, it is only through educating our young people that we can do that. I would like to call upon all the stakeholders, particularly the Members of this House to come and be members and participants of the curriculum review. It is through this that we can even talk about the leakages that are going on and see how we can actually eliminate them in our schools.

As you may know, Mr Speaker, it is not only the teachers and the pupils that are involved in the issue of leakages. Unfortunately, I must say that even …

Hon. Member: Priests!

Laughter

Mr Sinyinda: … not only priests as such, but also members of our society are involved. I am aware that there are some parents who go to the extent of trying to buy papers for their children. Therefore, I call upon all of us to attend this review so that we can actually strengthen the delivery of quality education in our country.

Mr Speaker, I would also like to assure you that with all these activities that we are undertaking, the other issue that we do is the monitoring of activities that we have in our schools. For example, we have our education centres officers, who go round just to make sure that our teachers teach and our pupils learn. For example, in the North-Western and Western provinces, we, as a ministry, this year, made sure that the standards officers go there repeatedly so that our teachers can be seen to teach and our pupils can be seen to learn. We realise that when the teachers are not teaching and our pupils are not learning, both of them might be tempted at the end of the year to be involved in examination malpractices. Therefore, I call upon the Zambian society, Parents Teachers Associations and communities to ensure that we encourage the teachers to make sure that they teach. We should also encourage our children to learn because I know that when they learn what they have been taught, they will be ready to write examinations.

All I wanted to say, Mr Speaker, is that this Government is committed to the delivery of quality education and will endeavour to make sure that our teachers have a conducive teaching atmosphere and our children have a good learning atmosphere.

With these words, I must say thank you, Mr Speaker.

The Minister of Gender and Women in Development (Ms Sayifwanda): Mr Speaker, …

Hon. Member interjected.

Ms Sayifwanda: Yes, it is gender.

Mr Speaker, I would like to commend the Committee that came up with this Report and wish to respond to a few issues that concern gender. Firstly, let me thank the female Parliamentarians who attended the launch of the 16 Days of Activism Against Gender-Based Violence today. However, I am surprised that our male colleagues did not also participate and hope that next year, they will be in the forefront in organising this event.

Interjections

Ms Sayifwanda: Mr Speaker, the enactment of a Bill on gender-based violence is a very sensitive and emotional issue which requires comprehensive consultations amongst stakeholders. It is true that assurances have been made on the Floor of this House. However, nothing has changed so far. On the other hand, I am happy to inform this august House that today, in His Excellency’s speech, the President has directed the hon. Minister of Justice and the hon. Minister of Gender and Women in Development to make sure that they quicken the process. In accordance with that directive, I am saying that things are going to move forward.

Having said that, I would like to inform the House that a draft Bill was sent to the Ministry of Justice. Furthermore, the hon. Ministers of Justice and Gender and Women in Development thought it wise to engage the Zambia Law Development Commission. Consequently, the Zambia Law Development Commission came up with a road map which was approved by the two hon. Ministers. The commission has, so far, been to some provinces for further consultation. As I already mentioned, this Bill is very emotional and sensitive and therefore, cannot just take a few days for us to bring to Parliament. It has to undergo a lengthy process. I am also happy to inform this august House that the commission has already done its work and there is only one or two provinces to consult remaining. Any time from now, and in accordance with the President’s directive, the commission will be passing its recommendations to the Ministry of Justice and, in turn, that Bill will definitely be brought to this House. This House will be informed at an appropriate time when everything is already in place.

Mr Speaker, I also wanted to confirm to this House the Bill has reached an advanced stage and soon it will be brought to this august House for approval. It is not only women and children or rather girls who are suffering from gender-based violence, but also men are experiencing the same. I hope every hon. Member is going to support the Bill.

Mr Speaker, with these few words, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Chairperson: I put the question …Oh! I beg your pardon, the Chair was too fast. Can the mover wind-up debate.

Interruptions

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Mr Chongo: Mr Speaker, I wish that the speed exhibited by the Chair were the same speed at which the Government would address the problems and commitments that it has indicated it will sort out. I would like to thank the seconder, Hon. Ngoma, for a good job in seconding this Motion. I also thank Hon. Msichili for his concerns about teachers and, of course, the standards in school. I would like to thank Hon. Mooya for the concerns about the labour matters database and, of course, I also wish to thank Hon. Sikazwe, although he could not debate fully. It only shows that he itches to ensure that the commitments that the Government indicates are fulfilled. I also would like to thank the hon. Deputy Minister of Education, together with his counterpart, the hon. Minister Gender and Women in Development for their concerns. I just hope the Government is going to move swiftly to deliver its promises.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Chairperson: Now is the proper time.

Laughter

Question put and agreed to.

ADJOURNMENT

The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

Question put and agreed to.

___________

The House adjourned at 1702 hours until 1430 hours on Wednesday, 26th November, 2008.