Wednesday, 30th September, 2009

The House met at 1430 hours

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

___________

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

REHABILITATION AND CONSTRUCTION OF INFRASTRUCTURE IN KAMFINSA CONSTITUENCY

56. Mr Nyirenda (Kamfinsa) asked the Minister of Works and Supply when the Ministry will rehabilitate and construct the following infrastructure in Kamfinsa Parliamentary Constituency:

(a) Presidential Guest House; and

(b) bridge on Presidential-Matete Road.

The Deputy Minister of Works and Supply (Mr Ndalamei): Mr Speaker, the Kitwe Presidential Guest House was last renovated in 2002 at a cost of K2,102,689,441.38. Although the house was ready for occupation, it was never used. This resulted in deterioration and theft of some of the installed fittings and fabric.

In the quest to encourage the President to use the guest house, the ministry took the late President Levy Patrick Mwanawasa, SC, may his soul rest in peace, to the guest house to appreciate the beauty of the house. In 2008, the ministry allocated K100 million towards the restoration of the house to its original state and increase security by constructing a palisade round it. This was not achieved because the funds were not released.

Mr Speaker, in this year’s Budget, there is no budgetary allocation for the rehabilitation works at the house. However, the ministry has included a sum of K2,150,000,000 in the 2010 Budget for improvements to the main house and the workers’ compound. The construction of the bridge on the Presidential-Matete Road has been planned for inclusion in the 2011 Annual Work Plan for the Road Development Agency (RDA) by the city council.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nyirenda: Mr Speaker, is the ministry aware that the building is a white elephant and the orchard is all gone because of lack of care?

Mr Ndalamei: Mr Speaker, we are aware. That is why we have put K2,150,000,000 in next year’s Budget for the repair and maintenance of the house.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mooya (Moomba): Mr Speaker, I would like to know whether we need the house since it is rarely used.

Mr Ndalamei: Mr Speaker, yes we need it.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

Mr Chisanga (Mkushi South): Mr Speaker, I would like to know whether it is economical to allocate K2,150,000,000 for the repair and maintenance of the house?

Mr Ndalamei: Mr Speaker, it is economical because that is a house which the President should use when he is on the Copperbelt and so we need to maintain it.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

(Power went off at 14:36:08 for a second)

Mr Speaker: Order!

Let us continue. My microphone is one.

Mrs Musokotwane (Katombola): Mr Speaker, the reason the house is deteriorating is that it is not being used, but the Government is saying we need the house. What is being done to ensure that the President uses that house so that it does not go to waste and we do not waste this kind of money for repair and maintenance.

Mr Ndalamei: Mr Speaker, we hope that when the President is on the Copperbelt next, he will use the house.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out what security has been put there after investing K2 billion. Further, when the pilfering took place, was anybody brought to book and what punishment did they get?

Mr Ndalamei: Mr Speaker, we did not catch the culprits, but now we are planning to put a palisade around the house for security.

Laughter

Mr Hamududu (Bweengwa): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister why it was found fit to allocate that money for a guest house that is not being used when there are many competing needs on infrastructure development in this country. Where are our priorities as a Government?

The Minister of Education (Ms Siliya) on behalf of the Minister of Works and Supply (Mr Mulongoti): Mr Speaker, the house we are talking about is not an ordinary one because even its construction took into consideration the fact that it was almost an extension of State House. It is a Presidential Guest House. The construction entailed that the roof was made of copper. It has some historical and monumental value to the nation because this is the house which our First President, Dr Kaunda, used when he was on the Copperbelt. Obviously, every President has personal preferences and over the years, the house has not been used. It is of value to the nation because it is not an ordinary house. That is why, as a Government, we are committed to ensuring that the house is maintained and appropriate security is provided.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kambwili (Roan): Mr Speaker, in view of the fact that the former and current Presidents have not used that house, are you considering turning it into a national monument and handing it over to the Department of National Museums?

Ms Siliya: Mr Speaker, at this point, our priority is to bring back the house to a good condition. This is why we want to make sure that all the things that were stolen are replaced and that the roof is worked on, particularly where some of the copper plates were removed.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Beene (Itezhi-tezhi): Mr Speaker, on average, nearly all provinces have Presidential guest houses which have been abandoned in the same manner. What plans does the Government have for all those structures dotted around the country?

Ms Siliya: Mr Speaker, it is our intention to ensure that we maintain Presidential guest houses which are used at different times for various reasons, sometimes even by visiting Presidents. It is our intention to make sure that we maintain Presidential guest houses around the country.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Zulu (Bwana Mkubwa): Mr Speaker, I just want to find out from the hon. Minister when rehabilitation works will be completed because they have been going on for sometime. When is the house going to be ready for occupation?

Ms Siliya: Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister gave an adequate answer that we are proposing a budgetary provision for next year so that we can actually maintain the house and work on the problems that are obtaining.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Habeenzu (Chikankata): Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister, in his answer, stated that K2 billion had been allocated to this same house. I would like to know who approved the K2 billion?

Ms Siliya: Mr Speaker, these are proposals we were talking about in the ministry, but obviously, the Government’s budget preparations are always in mid-term cycle; the three year projections. So in our three-year projections, we proposed the sum of K2.1 billion. When it comes to Parliament in 2010, we hope the hon. Members will support it so that we can maintain this house.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member for Ndola Central, is he still interested?

Mr Mushili (Ndola): Yes, I am interested.

Laughter

Mr Mushili: Mr Speaker, …

Mr Kambwili: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, I rise on a very serious point of order. Is the hon. Deputy Minister in the Ministry of Works and Supply in order to disclose that K2.1 billion  was provided for in the coming budget. Is he in order to disclose figures in a budget that has not been presented to this House? I need your serious ruling.

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member for Roan has raised a point of order which has previously been ruled upon in this House. Do not presume matters that are not yet before this House. It is not proper for the Executive to assume that what they have put in their proposals will be the final figure that will be approved by this House. So it is not in order. However, the record will not be expunged.

The Hon. Member was asking a follow-up question.

Mr Mushili: Mr Speaker, my question was related to the point of order that has just been raised by the hon. Member of Parliament for Roan.

CONSTRUCTION OF SCHOOLS IN CHIPILI CONSTITUENCY

57. Mr D. Mwila (Chipili) asked the Minister of education:

(i) when the structures under construction at the following schools would be completed:

(a) Chipili High;
(b) Chinshinki Basic;
(c) Kaoma Makasa Basic; and 
(d) Moba Basic;

(ii) why the Government has taken long to complete the structures at the schools above;

(a) why the above projects were abandoned at one time; and

(b) when the projects last received funding.

The Deputy Minister of Education (Mr Sinyinda): Mr Speaker, the listed schools, which are in Mwense District, will be considered for completion when funds are made available after the district has prioritised the projects.

Mr Speaker, the construction of the schools started during the Basic Education Sub-Sector Investment Programme (BESSIP) period. However, when the project came to an end, the ministry started funding the schools for completion in the subsequent budgets. Due to inadequate budget allocation, the projects could not be completed.

Mr Speaker, the projects could not be completed within the timeframe because the source of funding, which was called BESSIP, came to an end.

Mr Speaker, the projects last received funding in 2005. However, the funds were still inadequate to complete the project.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, it is on record that the Ministry of Education assured me that funds will be allocated for these projects in 2009. I would like find out from the hon. Minister why this has changed and why the money has not been allocated?

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, I must assure the hon. Member that it was just because the budget did not allow for this, this year, but we are still determined that as funds are made available, these schools will be rehabilitated. I would like, maybe, to share with this House that for Chipili High School, we are making every effort to liaise with the proprietor of this school, the Anglican Church, so that we can complete it.

I thank you, Sir.

REHABILITATIOIN OF SOLWEZI AIRPORT

58. Mr Katuka (Mwinilunga East) asked the Minister of Communications and Transport;

(i) when the rehabilitation of the Solwezi Airport would commence;

(ii) how long the rehabilitation works were expected to take; and

(iii) how much money was expected to be spent on these rehabilitation works.

The Deputy Minister of Communications and Transport (Mr Mubika): Mr Speaker, the rehabilitation of Solwezi Airport will commence after the award of the contract for the construction of the Solwezi Airport Runway in February, 2010, as contained in the design consultant’s inception report.

Mr Speaker, rehabilitation works for the Solwezi Airport Runway project will take twenty-six months.

Mr Speaker, the design consultant has not yet established the engineer’s estimate for the rehabilitation project as the quantum is still being worked out.

I thank you, Sir.

NUMBER OF PEOPLE KILLED BETWEEN MONGU AND KAOMA FROM 2006 TO 2009

59. Ms Limata (Luampa) asked the Minister of Home Affairs:

(i) how many people were killed by criminals between Mongu and Kaoma from 2006 to 2009; and

(ii) how many people have been arrested in connection with these crimes in the same period.

The Minister of Home Affairs (Mr Mangani): Mr Speaker, I wish to inform the House that two Finance Bank officers were killed by criminals along the Kaoma/Mongu Road on 29th July, 2009 at Namasheshe area, 20 kilometres west of Kaoma Boma.

Mr Speaker, three people have been arrested, including two civilians and a soldier while the other soldier is on the run. Meanwhile, investigations by police are still on going to find the soldier who is on the run.

I thank you, Sir.

CONSTRUCTION WORKS AT CHAMUSEBE SCHOOL IN CHASEFU

60. Mr C. K. Banda, SC. (Chasefu) asked the Minister of Education when a classroom block and teachers’ houses would be built at Chamusebe School in Chasefu Parliamentary Constituency.

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, the ministry has no immediate plans to construct a classroom block and teacher’s houses at Chamusebe School. However, when funds are made available, the school will be considered for these works.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr C. K. B. Banda, SC.: Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister tell the people of Chasefu Constituency whether the reason for not prioritising works at this school can be attributed to the ministry’s failure to visit the school whose buildings are in a deplorable condition and have been in that state for the last twenty years.

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, the ministry is aware of the problems at this school because apart from the hon. Minister and I visiting projects in various provinces, our officers on the ground are aware of what is obtaining in various districts. We are aware that the school in question is dilapidated. I would like to inform the hon. Member that last year, more than K1 billion was spent on various projects in Lundazi District. We have already released about K400 million to various projects in the same district this year and more funds will be released. We would like to assure him that when money is made available, we will definitely rehabilitate that school.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Chazangwe (Choma Central): Mr Speaker, it seems funds are not available, and yet we need these schools. Why can the Government not revert to the system whereby parents in an area are asked to provide materials such as building sand and crushed stones and then the Government can provide the rest of the building materials and funds?

Ms Siliya: Mr Speaker, as a ministry, we realise that we are quite challenged in terms of providing school infrastructure everywhere in the country. Even with the limited resources, we think we still need to improve the provision of educational infrastructure. We need to look in areas where the school infrastructure is totally dilapidated and try and respond to some immediate and challenging problems, in particular, areas such as Lundazi, while responding to national needs.

In the long-term, it is obvious that the Government alone will not be able to meet all the educational needs in this country. This is why we liberalised the sector to ensure that we work with the private sector in the provision of education. I think that many Zambians must respond to this challenge and see education as an opportunity for economic empowerment and work with the Government in providing the extra educational infrastructure that is required in the nation.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Chisala (Chilubi): Mr Speaker, it is a well-known fact that hon. Members of Parliament are people’s representatives who understand the areas they represent very well. In this connection, I would like to learn from the hon. Minister whether it is not possible for the ministry to find a stage at which the hon. Members of Parliament can be involved in the planning process so that these problems of housing and classroom infrastructure can be lessened.

Ms Siliya: Mr Speaker, our planning in the Ministry of Education begins at the district level where we have the district education boards which are inclusive of various representatives in districts. Since the hon. Member of Parliament’s constituency is in a district, we would encourage him to engage with various Government officers at that level, including the District Education Board Secretary (DEBS) because information moves from the DEBS’ office to the provincial centre and finally, the headquarters.

We have had some cases whereby funds are available, but because the project was not initiated at the district level, it is rather difficult for us at the headquarters to guess some of the particular needs of the project. I agree with the hon. Member that as hon. Members of Parliament, we have to take an interest in what is happening at the district level and liaise with the district education board in particular, to ensure that in areas where there is dire need for particular items, we initiate projects there.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

IRRIGATION DAMS IN LUAMPA

61. Ms Limata asked the Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives whether there were any plans to construct irrigation dams in Luampa Parliamentary Constituency in the following areas:

(a) Muliwa;

(b) Namando;

(c) Luampa Central;

(d) Nyambi;

(e) Nkenga; and

(f) Lui.

The Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives (Mr Kalenga): Mr Speaker, there are no plans to construct irrigation dams in any of the above-mentioned areas. The ministry responds to demands for assistance by the beneficiaries to construct irrigation dams. Farmers are, therefore, encouraged to approach the nearest camp extension officers and the District Agricultural Co-ordinating Office (DACO) for technical advice on this issue.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Ms Limata: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister when the Government is going to support the people in Luampa who are engaged in agriculture, as this is a rural constituency.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kalenga: Mr Speaker, as I indicated, these programmes are demand driven. So I would advise the hon. Member to go and encourage the farmers in her constituency to go to the DACO in the area so that this issue is included in the district’s work plan.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Musokotwane: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister says that these projects are demand driven. The farmers in Luampa have sent their representative here to talk on their behalf. What does the hon. Minister mean when he says the people in Luampa should demand for these projects when they have already done so by asking their representative in this House to speak on their behalf?

The Minister of Agriculture and Cooperatives (Dr Chituwo): Mr Speaker, it is unfortunate that, perhaps, our answer is not understood. In this House we have all advocated for decentralisation. However, the hon. Member of Parliament for Luampa has come here to give us an overall demand. My advice is that if she discusses the issue with her councilors and the DACO, which has technical expertise, she should make her request specific. The headquarters will not provide the technical advice that she would require to have dams put in those areas. That is the linkage we are talking about.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwansa (Chifunabuli): Mr Speaker, I notice a pattern developing whereby hon. Members of Parliament are referred to the district. When hon. Ministers do that, they should realise that we spend a number of days on parliamentary work, therefore, it is not …

Mr Speaker: Order!

What is your question?

Mr Mwansa: In light of the knowledge that hon. Ministers have, would they not give answers to the requests that are being made through the questions which are asked by the hon. Members of Parliament here?

Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, we have given an honest answer regarding the procedure that should be used when making a request. We are advising hon. Members of Parliament on how best to get these services. So if the hon. Member of Parliament does not want to go to his constituency to start the process of making a request, then we have a problem understanding each other.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, I would like to ask the hon. Minister on how he understands the question that has been asked. Is it necessary for the constituency to have these dams, if it is necessary, what are you going to do?

Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, most rural constituencies need dams, therefore, to work with the resources we have, it is important that we plan for the areas that are in great need. Therefore, it is necessary for the Members of Parliament, as has been suggested, to work closely with the DACOs so that they can provide that expert advice. We need specifics in order to help our people properly.

I thank you, Sir.

HOUSES CONSTRUCTED AT MULAKUPIKWA COLLEGE IN CHINSALI CONSTITUENCY

62. Mr C. Mulenga (Chinsali) asked the Minister of Education:

(a) how many houses had been constructed at the Mulakupikwa College in Chinsali Parliamentary Constituency as of 30th June, 2009;

(b) how much money had been spent on the project to-date; and

(c) when the construction of the college was expected to be completed and commissioned.

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, Mulakupikwa College in Chinsali was initially under the Ministry of Home Affairs and was transferred to the Ministry of Education in 2004. The college was incomplete and extensively vandalised by the local community. This raised the cost to complete the project. Since the project required a huge capital investment, the ministry decided to complete the project in phases. The first phase in 2005 and 2006 saw the completion of fifteen staff houses. Therefore, there are only fifteen staff houses were completed at Mulakupikwa by 30th June, 2009.

The total cost spent to complete phase 1 was K1,279,060,176.68. Works at the college were expected to be completed by 2010, but due to inadequate funds, the ministry is in the process of revisiting the schedule of activities in accordance with the availability of funds expected in the Sixth National Development Plan.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr C. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, having taken over twenty years for this Government to work on this project, I would like to find out the measures the Government has put in place to ensure that there is security at the project which is still vulnerable to vandalism?

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, I am sure if the hon. Member knew his history, he would recall that this project did not start during my Government’s tenure. It started during the First Republic, but I would like to assure him that we are doing everything possible to ensure that this project is completed. We will definitely complete it. At the moment, money will be released to start the second phase of the project.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwenya (Nkana): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister the problem they have with fixing timeframes and abiding to the timeframe for completing projects?

Ms Siliya: Mr Speaker, according to our projections, we expect to complete the project by 2015 …

Hon. Opposition Members: Aah!

Ms Siliya: … because the cost of implementing the project has gone up. Between 2010 and 2015, in the first two years, we want to concentrate on the designing and construction of the administration blocks, fifteen lecture rooms, library, ten staff houses and of course the power, water and sanitation infrastructure. Thereafter, we will go ahead and complete the other infrastructure. Our expected projection for the completion of works is 2015.

I thank you, Sir.{mospagebreak}

CONSTRUCTION OF IRRIGATION DAMS IN RURAL CONSTITUENCIES

63. Mr Hamusonde (Nangoma) asked the Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives whether there were any plans to increase the number of irrigation dams in each rural constituency countrywide.

Mr Kalenga: Mr Speaker, there are plans to increase the number of irrigation dams nationwide and specifically in rural areas. However, the construction of irrigation dams is dependent on the demand and availability of resources.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Beene: Mr Speaker, on average, in all the rural constituencies, DACOs have information about where dams are supposed to be constructed, including Luampa. When is the Government going to fulfill its obligations under this arrangement?

Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, it would appear that the hon. Member for Itezhi-tezhi did not understand our explanation. Therefore, I will emphasise our answer. These needs are countrywide. The need for dams for irrigation facilities is countrywide, particularly in rural areas. This, therefore, calls for rationalisation of the resources that we have. In order to do that, we have to use the experts available on the ground. Any layperson can stand up and say we need a dam here and there, but to what use will it be put? This is why it is important for the communities to come together as they make the request so that they know, from the beginning, that the facility is truly theirs and that they have to put it to good use.

Mr Speaker, we have put up dams in certain areas, but they have not been used for agricultural purposes because the community does not have a sense of ownership.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, it has been discovered that a number of districts in the Northern Province and in particular, Chilubi, Luwingu, Kaputa and Mporokoso just to mention a few, have no such dams. Can the hon. Minister outline the procedure that is used in the construction of dams?

Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, because of the vastness of our country, hon. Members get concerned about their constituencies, but are unaware of facilities elsewhere.

Mr Speaker, there are many irrigation schemes in the country and some have been completed. The fact that Chilubi has no such facility does not mean that we have none in the Northern Province. We have the following irrigation schemes countrywide:

(i) Chineke Irrigation Scheme in Mbala, Northern Province; 
(ii) Lukulu East in Kasama, Northern Province;
(iii) Ikelenge in the North-Western Province;
(iv) Ndobi in the Southern Province;
(v) Kalengwa in the Southern Province;
(vi) Mwandi in the Western Province;
(vii) Bunga in Luapula Province;
(viii)  Mubendechibwe Mumpulu in Luapula Province;
(ix) Mulumbi at Milenge in Luapula Province;
(x) Mulilwa in Mansa, Luapula Province; and
(xi) Ncheleke in Chipata, Eastern Province.

Sir, progress is made through our National Irrigation Plan. We will soon have 700 hectares under irrigation for small-scale farmers not to depend entirely on rain-fed crops. In fact, there are already 70,000 hectares of potential irrigational land that we plan to put under these schemes.

In addition, Mr Speaker, the emphasis on small-holder farmers is justifiable but, at the same time, we are mindful of the fact that to develop the agriculture sector, we need commercial farmers. The House may also wish to know that plans are underway to have four large irrigation schemes that will include commercial and small-holder farmers in the Copperbelt, Central and Southern provinces.

Thank you, Sir.

Dr Scott (Lusaka Central): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has given a list of recent or on-going irrigation schemes, neglecting to point out that there are many longer-established irrigation schemes that are defunct mostly by reason of local politics, lack of clear authority as to who is in charge, allegations of theft and so on and so forth. I could give a list just as long as his. Now, what is his solution to the problem of human organisation in small-scale irrigation schemes that is a problem and challenge worldwide?

Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member for Lusaka Central was once Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives and he left these problems.

Laughter

Mr Kambwili: Question!

Dr Chituwo: We are determined that we should not repeat his history.

Hon. Opposition Members: Aah!

Dr Chituwo: This is why we discussed, with Hon. Scott, that ownership is the very key. We have been trying to emphasise that there is no point in taking dams or weirs to people who have not demanded and seen the need for them. What we are doing is going back to the completed projects, getting people on board and assisting them in the choice of irrigation equipment so that they start using these facilities.

Thank you, Sir.

VALUE OF LUANSHYA COPPER MINE

64. Mr Kambwili (Roan) asked the Minister of Mines and Minerals Development:

(a) what the actual value of Luanshya Copper Mine (LCM) was;

(b) why the Government sold LCM for US$50 million when the conveyor belt alone from Baluba to the smelter cost US$8.5 million about thirty years ago; and

(c) why the Government did not publish the details of the other three (3) bids for the purchase of LCM.

The Deputy Minister of Mines and Minerals Development (Mr Nkhata): Mr Speaker, the value of a company is determined by valuation of its assets and liabilities. In the case of LCM, the owner did not publish the valuation at the point of sale. The actual value of the company should be taken as the price the seller accepted following negotiations with the buyer.

As regards part (b) of the question, the Government did not sell LCM because it did not own the company. The transaction was for the 85 per cent shares owned by Enya to the private buyer.

On part (c) of the question, all the bids were publicly announced at a rally by the President. Every tender has a confidential undertaking.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, the President announced in Luanshya that China was the best bidder. Why where the details of the other three bidders not published so that the public could judge whether this was done transparently?

The Minister of Mines and Minerals Development (Mr M. B. Mwale): Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Roan for his follow-up question. I am surprised that the hon. Member continues to dwell upon a matter which has been concluded. He should now congratulate this Government that his constituency has jobs.

Mr Kambwili: Question!

Mr M. B. Mwale: Mr Speaker, I would like to inform this House that there is a confidential undertaking with any bid. In any case, what the hon. Member should be interested in is the development of Mulyashi Mine and not the taking over of Baluba Mine.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr D. Mwila indicated to ask a question.

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member for Chipili, I was indicating that you do not stand vertically, but should lean a little.

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has not indicated the purchase price of the mine. What was the cost of 85 per cent shares sold?  Secondly, what has happened to the debt which was incurred by the previous company? Has that been cleared or not?

Mr M. B. Mwale: Mr Speaker, the fact that the owner of the mine accepted the US$50 million …

Mr Kambwili: Question!

Mr M. B. Mwale: … shows that it was an acceptable figure. You can continue questioning, but you have to come out and declare your interest. At the moment, I would like to inform the hon. Member for Chipili that the US$50 million was settled by the owner of the mine.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kambwili: Question!

Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Mr Speaker, from the hon. Minister’s answer, it would appear this mine was not owned by the Government, but by the private company which sold the mine. Would the hon. Minister state that the questions that are being asked are supposed to be directed to the owner of the mine who sold it rather than the Government?

Laughter

Mr M. B. Mwale: Yes, Mr Speaker.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

Mr Kambwili: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: On whom are you raising the point of order?

Laughter

Mr Speaker: On him (pointing at Mr M. B. Mwale)? He is no longer on the Floor.

Laughter

CONSTRUCTION OF SHANG’OMBO HOSPITAL

65. Mr Mwapela (Kalabo Central) asked the Minister of Health when construction of Shang’ombo Hospital would be completed.

The Deputy Minister of Health (Mr Akakandelwa): Mr Speaker, the construction of Shang’ombo Hospital was suspended in 2007 when the contract with Tomorrow Investments/Emsworth  Joint Venture was terminated. The Ministry of Health advertised the tenders for the completion of the remaining phase 3 works at Shang’ombo District Hospital. However, the contract could not be awarded, as the contractor, Tomorrow Investments, has taken the matter to court for determination.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Kambwili: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, I rise on a very serious point of order. Is the hon. Minister of Mines and Minerals Development in order to state that the question I asked should have been directed to LCM when, in actual fact, the negotiating team for the sale of the mine, which included the permanent secretaries in three ministries and one hon. Minister, was appointed by the President?

Is he in order to insinuate that we should direct our questions to people who are not part of this House?

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member for Roan has raised a point of order on a question that was asked by the hon. Member for Luapula, apparently correcting the impression that this question ought not to have been asked in this House. In answer, the hon. Minister agreed with the question by the hon. Member for Luapula.

I will not go back to the hon. Minister of Mines and Minerals Development because he has finished dealing with this question.

I, however, wish to guide the hon. Member for Roan, if he wants to pursue this matter, to wait for the opportunity that may fall in his lap when the portfolio of the Minister of Mines and Minerals Development will be on the Floor of this House at an appropriate time.  Follow that up and then he will consider giving you the answer.

Mr Mwapela: Mr Speaker, can the hon. Minister explain why the Government keeps allocating money to Shang’ombo Hospital when the matter is in court? In 2008, K4 billion was allocated, while in 2009, K3 billion was allocated to the same hospital. Where is that money going?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Akakandelwa: Mr Speaker, the allocation to Shang’ombo Hospital is a demonstration of the willingness of the Government to finish the project. However, the contractor has taken the matter to court and, therefore, our hands are tied.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mooya: Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister confirm that one of the reasons it has taken long to complete the construction of the hospital is the wrong design that was made at the beginning by the Ministry of Health who are not conversant with the design?

Mr Akakandelwa: Mr Speaker, I cannot confirm that.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Habeenzu: Mr Speaker, I am a little worried about the answer that the hon. Minister has given when he was asked about where the money allocated to Shang’ombo Hospital goes. Could he clearly state where the money goes?

Mr Akakandelwa:  Mr Speaker, if the Vote is for infrastructure and we have other competing needs, it is only appropriate that the money is used on other infrastructure.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Phiri: Question!

Mr Lubinda (Kabwata): Mr Speaker, I am sure that the hon. Minister anticipated follow-up questions to this very important question. He has now stated that because there are competing needs for infrastructure development, money meant for this hospital was diverted to other areas of need. Could he indicate only one hospital that received a part of the K4 billion that was allocated to Shang’ombo Hospital in the budget of 2009?

Mr Akakandelwa: Mr Speaker, I may not have that information at my finger tips. However, if the hon. Member wants those answers, he can come to my office and I will walk him through.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Opposition Members: No, give the answer here!

Mr Mwansa (Chifunabuli): Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister saying that when money is allocated to a project by this House, his Government diverts it to any other competing project at will?

Mr Kambwili: Say yes!

Mr Akakandelwa: Mr Speaker, I can confirm that there is money sitting in an account under Shang’ombo Hospital which we cannot employ now because of the court case.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, can the hon. Minister explain to this House why the Ministry of Health has not followed the advice of the Office of the Attorney-General to settle this matter out of court?

Mr Akakandelwa: Mr Speaker, I think the hon. Member was not listening when I said that the matter is in court. That means we await determination by the court.

I thank you, Sir.

STRIKES BY MEDICAL PERSONNEL

66. Mr Sejani (Mapatizya) asked the Minister of Health what steps the Government had taken to avert nation-wide strikes by nurses and other medical personnel such as occurred in 2009.

Mr Akakandelwa: Mr Speaker, I wish to inform the House that the following steps have been taken:

(i)  the Government has constituted a team of Government and public service union officials to review and advise on how to address the issues of housing, rural and remote hardship allowances which are a major source of concern by public service workers;

(ii)  the Ministry of Health has also constituted a Joint Labour Management Committee for the sector to address administrative issues affecting health workers and propose solutions for addressing workers’ grievances. The setting up of the Joint Labour Management Committee at the Ministry of Health is intended to address issues as they arise and not wait for the collective bargaining period. The Joint Labour Management Committee includes management at the Ministry of Health and Public Service Unions representing health personnel; and

(iii)  the provision of the Industrial Labour Relations Act Cap. 269 Section 107 which classifies health personnel as essential service workers and requires that they complete Essential Service Certificates. According to this law, essential service workers are not permitted to participate in a strike or go-slow as a means of addressing their grievances. To this effect, the Government, in 2009, issued a Cabinet Circular No. 9 of 2009, reminding all controlling officers to ensure that employees classified as essential workers complete the Essential Service Certificate.

In compliance with this directive and the provisions of the Laws of Zambia, the Ministry of Health has embarked on a process of ensuring that all health personnel are educated on the provisions of the Law and complete the Essential Service Certificate. This process is being  undertaken together with the unions in the sector.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Sejani: Mr Speaker, at the height of the strikes, the response from the Government was that it could not meet the workers demands because of the scarcity of resources. If that is the problem, how then, does the constitution of the committee, which is going to gobble more of these scarce resources, going to ameliorate the situation?

Mr Akakandelwa: Mr Speaker, the constitution of this committee is meant to bring to the fore the realities of what is affecting this economy. Making a demand is one thing and meeting it is another. It is at such forums that these issues are discussed and amicable solutions found.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mrs Phiri (Munali): Mr Speaker, one of the reasons our health workers go on strike, in this country, is shortage of manpower. In last year’s Budget, about K25 billion was allocated to the Ministry of Health for recruiting about 1,900 health workers. When the President was giving his speech, he said that the Government only managed to recruit about 300 health workers. Can the hon. Minister tell us where the money that was allocated for recruiting health workers has gone?

Mr Speaker: The Acting Minister of Health.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order!

The hon. Minister Health.

Laughter

The Minister of Lands (Mr Daka) (on behalf of the Minister of Health) (Mr Simbao): Mr Speaker, that is a very important question, but I would like to state that a provision or an allocation in the budget does not mean that money has been disbursed. That money has not been disbursed. Whatever money has been disbursed has been made available by the Treasury.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Mwamba (Lukashya): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister of Health what timeframe has been given to the Joint Committee in which to make recommendations and when the Government will implement them.

Mr Daka: Mr Speaker, we must do first things first. It is important for the committee to complete the work that they have been given and then we will have to ensure that the committee forwards the recommendations before the next budget.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Simuusa (Nchanga): Mr Speaker, the last strike by health workers and doctors traumatised this nation. The solution being proposed by the Government is not in line with the demands made by the health workers. Can the hon. Minister assure this nation that there will not be another strike because the Government has not addressed the demands made by the health workers?

Mr Daka: Mr Speaker, the strike was, indeed, traumatising and, I think, that is the right word. However, I would like to urge hon. Members of this House to stop inciting workers because …

Interruptions

Mr Daka: … the repercussions to the nation are serious. This fight is not only for the Ministry of Health or the people in Government alone, but also involves every Zambian. Sir, even hon. Members of Parliament have been talking about their needs.

Interruptions

Mr Daka: Therefore, it is important that when we make demands, they are tailored according to the material we have.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, According to the Industrial and Labour Relations Act Cap. 269, under the bargaining process, negotiations are supposed to be completed three months before the expiry of the current collective agreement. I would like to find out from the hon. Minister when he intends to start negotiations to avert the nationwide strike.

Mr Daka: Mr Speaker, I think that is why this committee has been set up and the hon. Minister of Labour is doing everything possible to ensure that these negotiations are completed as soon as possible.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Dr Kalumba (Chienge): Mr Speaker, can the hon. Minister confirm a well-known view that in spite of the very determined interest by the Ministry of Health to recruit medical personnel, there is a growing bureaucracy at the Cabinet Office that is delaying the recruitment of medical personnel.

Mr Daka: Mr Speaker, I am not aware of that red tape, but I recognise that the Government and ministry are working on that situation.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, one of the reasons teachers and nurses went back to work was that an assurance was made by the Government that their housing allowances would be sorted out and paid by August. It is now September and that has not been done. What has happened to that assurance?

Mr Daka: Mr Speaker, committees have been formed in various ministries to look at conditions and bargaining issues of various workers. We should not jump to the end of the tail, but start with the head.

I thank you, Sir{mospagebreak}

POLICE POST AT LUBWE MISSION IN CHIFUNABULI

67. Mr Mwansa asked the Minister of Home Affairs when a police post would be constructed at Lubwe Mission in Chifunabuli Parliamentary Constituency.

Mr Mangani: Mr Speaker, all constituencies are in dire need of police posts, but due to limited resources allocated for construction of police infrastructure, all 150 constituencies cannot benefit at the same time. Consequently, the construction of police posts and housing units is done in phases. The House may wish to know that the construction of police posts depends on the following factors:

(i) availability of funds;

(ii) the population of the area;

(iii) distance from the main police station; and

(iv) economic activities in the area.

Mr Speaker, during this fiscal year, the ministry will not start construction of new projects, but will continue working on the on-going projects. The area hon. Member of Parliament may consider mobilising his constituency and use part of the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) to build a police post and provide accommodation for police officers at Lubwe Mission which, indeed, deserves a police post.

Owing to the interest in this matter, most hon. Members of Parliament have been requesting for special designs for police posts. I, therefore, want to indicate that as a ministry, we have come up with a special design for the police posts. All those who would like to build police posts are free to come and get these designs in order to construct police posts in their respective constituencies.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, can the hon. Minister assure the House that if the local communities build the police posts, his ministry will provide the officers to move in immediately.

Mr Mangani: Mr Speaker, if the communities have shown commitment, indeed, we too have to show our commitment by giving them police officers. Therefore, I can take that issue as our undertaking.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Phiri: Mr Speaker, I know of several police posts which have been built using CDF such as the one in Munali Constituency. Therefore, could the hon. Minister tell us when he is going to recruit police officers to man that station?

Mr Mangani: Mr Speaker, I want to thank the hon. Member of Parliament for constructing that police post in her constituency. Indeed, as you know, the recruitment exercise for police officers started this year. We have 1,500 police officers under training and I hope that when they graduate, we will provide the station with police officers.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mushili (Ndola Central): Mr Speaker, non-availability of funds is a constraint in carrying out projects. In this regard, is the Government reconsidering the re-introduction of the windfall tax?

Interruptions

Mr Mangani: Mr Speaker, I wish to ask the hon. Member to direct that question to the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister said that one of the factors that the Government looks at when allocating police posts is the population of a particular area. Why does it use the population rather than the crime rate as is the case in Chifunabuli?

Mr Mangani: Mr Speaker, it is generally anticipated that when the population is high, naturally, the crime rate will be high. Therefore, that is why we consider the population as well.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Musokotwane: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out whether the plan for the police post goes with the bill of quantities because as a community in the rural areas, we will not know what to buy and how much we can spend on the items needed.

Mr Mangani: Mr Speaker, it may be difficult to standardise the bill of quantities for all police posts in the country because materials such as bricks, in certain constituencies, may be cheaper whereas in a constituency such as Lusaka, they may be very costly. We can only give you the cost of materials such as roofing sheets and others.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Lubinda (Kabwata): Mr Speaker, similar to the situation in Munali, there is a beautiful office in Lusaka South called Kamulanga, which was handed over to the police for them to use as a police post. Rather than using it for patrols, the police are using it for their accommodation while working in a constituency outside Kabwata. Given the answer that the hon. Minister gave in response to the question by the hon. Member for Munali that after the 1,500 recruits have been trained, only then will officers be sent to Chifunabuli. Could he indicate to me when the police officers will be sent to Kabwata and how long it will take before they are sent to Chifunabuli which is on the list?

Mr Mangani: Mr Speaker, I think when I was giving the answer to the question, I indicated that when we are constructing the police posts, let us also consider the housing for officers. If we have a police post and the officers have no accommodation, then we have a situation like the one we are talking about where instead of officers using a building as a police post, they are compelled to use it as accommodation. Therefore, as hon. Members of Parliament and as a community, I want to appeal that as you ask for officers, you should also try and organise accommodation for them. I know it is our responsibility, as a ministry, but I wish we had all the resources to build houses. Now, that we are asking the community to also help us provide accommodation for the officers. This way, we will gladly give you the officers.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

EXPLORATION OF MINERALS IN LUAPULA PROVINCE

68. Dr Chishya (Pambashe) asked the Minister of Mines and Minerals Development:

(a) whether the Government had any programmes to begin exploitation of mineral deposits, particularly copper, in Luapula Province and, if so, when the programmes would begin, and

(b) whether any sites had so far been identified for exploitation purposes and what sites these were.

Mr Nkhata: Mr Speaker, there are companies already exploring for minerals in Luapula Province. Once the existence of commercial deposits is proven, it is expected that mine development will commence.

Sir, there are thirty-five sites where exploration and mining activities are undertaken and these are as follows:

Location Number of Prospecting Number of Mining  Total
  Licences   Licences
Mansa  12    9   21
Mwense 3    2   5
Chienge 5    4   9
Total  20    15   35

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Chongo (Mwense): Mr Speaker, since most investors are looking for areas that already have information and are not willing to go and open up the areas that do not, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what his ministry and the Government are doing to ensure that the information in regard to the existence of these minerals is obtained.

Mr M. B. Mwale: Mr Speaker, it is easier for any investor to commence mining operations when detailed geological work has already been carried out. However, the point that has to be understood about Luapula is that no detailed geological work had been carried out previously. 

Mr Speaker, for the benefit of the hon. Member, I would like to give an example of Lumwana Mine which was opened not too long ago. There has been detailed geological information known for over thirty years. This is why it was easy to start operations in Lumwana. In the case of Luapula, any investor has to start afresh in acquiring detailed geological information to ascertain the size of deposits, grades and the commercial viability of the deposits.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Chimbaka (Bahati): Mr Speaker, can the hon. Minister tell the people of Luapula Province and this House when the Government will engage geologists to have the detailed geological survey carried out so that mining development could take place in Luapula the same way it has in the North-Western and Western provinces.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr M. B. Mwale: Mr Speaker, I would like to confirm that it is the Government’s desire to see to it that we have new mines, particularly large-scale mines, brought on board in Luapula. What should be understood is the fact that the Government has only the capacity to carry out geological mapping and not detailed geological work.

Mr Speaker, what has been done, so far, even on the Copperbelt and North-Western provinces, is that the investors, themselves, carried out the detailed work to know the size and grades of the ore body.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mrs Phiri: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister mentioned that mining operations had already started in some parts of Luapula Province. I would like to find out from him whether the outcry we had from one of our chiefs in Luapula has been taken care of. We have seen situations where, in some provinces where there are Game Management Areas (GMAs), the people and chiefs are benefiting and their living standards are improving. Has the problem which Chief Puta had been sorted out?

Mr M. B. Mwale: Mr Speaker, I would like to confirm that Central African Mining has, now, been given a large-scale operating licence.

I thank you, Sir.

 Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, licences for the purpose of exploration were given to these companies five years ago. What is the position of the Government because nothing has been done with regard to commencing mining operations?

Mr M. B. Mwale: Mr Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to inform the House that development of a mine entails carrying out a lot of geological work. What I mean is that we have to carry out diamond drilling in order to know the size and extent of mineralisation of the deposits and the grades thereof so that we can go ahead and invest in mine development.

Mr Speaker, exploration is not a simple task. It takes about five, six or even thirteen years before we can start developing a mine.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Dr Kalumba (Chienge): Mr Speaker, since it is known that it takes time to complete exploration, can the honourable and very hardworking Minister of Mines and Minerals Development, I must admit, confirm whether there are some safeguard clauses in the agreements for exploration that allow the Government to have access to the technical data that is being generated by the exploration companies such as Anvil, that have been carrying out works in the Luapula Province.

Mr M. B. Mwale: Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Chienge for his generous words.

Sir, the Act that we have in place now takes into account the fact that any company that is carrying out geological works has to deposit the information with the Geological Survey Department.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mushili: Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister earlier stated that there are some companies that were given mining licences before the detailed exploration work was done. I would like to find out how some companies in Luapula Province were issued with the mining licences before they provided reports of detailed geological exploration.

Mr M. B. Mwale: Mr Speaker, I would like to inform the hon. Member that it is easier to carry out geological work when mineralisation is outcropping. In the case of what is happening in the Luapula Province, there are some outcrops of manganese. This means that they are exposed and the small-scale operators have to do very little work for them to start exploiting the manganese.

I thank you, Sir.
DMI-ST EUGENE UNIVERSITY

69. Mr C. K. B. Banda, SC. asked the Minister of Education:

(a) when the DMI-ST Eugene University was opened;

(b) why the university was opened when it did not have modern water flushing toilets; and

(c) when the construction of modern water flushing toilets at the university would be completed.

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, DMI-ST Eugene University was opened on 14th November, 2007, with thirty-seven students. At the time the university was opening, it had four waterborne toilets for female and two waterborne toilets for male students, plus five urinals. The six toilet facilities plus five urinals were adequate for the thirty-seven students at the time.

Mr Speaker, in October, 2008, the university constructed an ablution block consisting of ten toilet pans. The current arrangement is that female students have ten waterborne toilets while the male students have six waterborne toilets plus five urinals. These facilities are serving 157 students and are adequate for the number of students. However, the institution has acquired a piece of land in Chibombo for its expansion where new infrastructure for the university will be constructed in line with the Ministry of Education standards.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr C. K. B. Banda, SC.: Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister of Education confirm that, in fact, construction of water borne toilets started last year after this hon. Member brought  it to the attention of the ministry.

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. Member for his concern. Having said that, I would like to completely disagree with him, because there were toilets except that the toilets were the old type called squat pans.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Laughter

Mrs Masebo (Chongwe): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what the Government’s policy is on sanitation issues and construction of either schools or, indeed, universities. Is there a policy on how many toilets a school should have in relation to the number of students?

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, yes, there is a policy. We would not want to see a situation where a school is constructed without sanitation and water. Apart from that, there are many more conditions that we demand are met. This is the reason, from time-to-time, our standards officers go round to inspect and when we find a school wanting, we close it.

 I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Hamududu (Bweengwa):  Mr Speaker, why is the Government allowing such universities with poor facilities to offer degree programmes? This is compromising the quality of degrees offered in this country.

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, we do not allow any university that does not meet the standards to open. This university has met the minimum requirements. That is why it is operating.

 I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Machungwa:  Mr Speaker, what are the minimum criteria that the institutions are expected to meet because it looks like someone can set up a kantemba and call it a university? What minimum criteria are the institutions expected to meet?

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, I just wanted to assure this House that the toilets at this university cater for 157 students. There are ten toilets for female students and six toilets for male students. Therefore, that is adequate enough to cater for the students.

 I thank you, Mr Speaker.

PROVISION OF PRE-SCHOOL EDUCATION BY GOVERNMENT

70. Mr Chazangwe asked the Minister of Education whether there were any plans for the ministry to provide pre-school or early childhood care and development education which, currently, was provided mainly by private schools.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

The House must pay attention.

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, I wish to inform the House that the Ministry of Education has prepared a Draft Policy on Early Childhood Care, Development and Education (ECCDE) and will ensure that it is finalised. Once completed, the policy will provide guidance, curriculum framework, training of teachers and facilitate the production of materials and equipment in conjunction with other stakeholders.

Finally, the policy will, also, clearly stipulate the role that the Ministry of Education will play in the provision of Early Childhood Education.

 I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Chazangwe: Mr Speaker, the importance of provision of early childhood care cannot be over emphasised. I would like to find out why the whole ministry has left this very important component in the Ministry of Education in the hands of the private sector which does not actually care.

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. Member because I know that he is concerned about the plight of the young ones. Like we have already mentioned in our answer, we are still working on a policy. We appreciate the fact that we, as a Ministry of Education, must play an active role in as far as early childhood care and education is concerned.

 I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister tell this House whether there are any colleges of education currently offering a Diploma Course in Pre-School Teaching.

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, as we stated earlier, we are still working on the policy to cater for such courses. When we have finished, that will be catered for.

 I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Chimbaka: I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what the Ministry of Education is doing to regulate the provision of formal education in pre-schools and early childhood centres where informal education is supposed to be provided.

Mr Sinyinda: Mr Speaker, like we have already stated in our reply, we are still working on the policy. The reason behind the formulation of this policy is to regulate the provision of early childhood education.

 I thank you, Mr Speaker.

______

BILLS

FIRST READING

THE SUPREME COURT AND HIGH COURT (NUMBER OF JUDGES) (Amendment) BILL, 2009

The Minister of Defence (Dr Mwansa): Mr Speaker, I beg to present a Bill entitled the Supreme and High Court (Number of Judges) (Amendment) Bill, 2009. The object of the Bill is to amend the Supreme Court and High Court (Number of Judges) Act so as to:

(a) empower the President to determine the number of Judges in the 
Judicature; and;

(b) provide for matters connected with or incidental to the foregoing.

 

Mr Speaker: The Bill stands referred to the Committee on Legal Affairs, Governance, Human Rights and Gender Matters.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

The Committee is required to submit its report on the Bill to the House by Tuesday, 20th October, 2009. Hon. Members who wish to make submissions or amendments to the Bill are free to do so within the programme of work of the Committee.

_______

MOTION

MOTION OF THANKS

(Debate resumed)

Mr Mwanza (Solwezi West): Mr Speaker, I would like to thank you for giving me this opportunity to contribute to a very lively debate on the President’s Speech.

Sir, from the onset, I would like to declare that I will be very brief in my contribution.

Laughter

Mr Mwanza: Firstly, I will deal with the obituary.

Mr Speaker, you will recall that in the last sitting, we lost two hon. Members of Parliament, namely Hon. Hamir, Member of Parliament for Chitambo and Hon. Ben Tetamashimba, Member of Parliament for Solwezi Central. As you know, I am also a Member of Parliament from Solwezi District. Hon. Tetamashimba was a vibrant politician …

Mr Kambwili: Question!

Mr Mwanza: … that this country has ever seen.

Hon. Opposition Members: Aah!

Laughter

Mr Mwanza: Sir, I wish to place on record the fact that Hon. Tetamashimba’s contribution to Solwezi District and also this Parliament was enormous. We will greatly miss him. For those of us from Solwezi District, we have lost a colleague, relative, friend and area Member of Parliament.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, in the same vein, I would also like to commend the MMD Party for a successful election in Chitambo Constituency.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: This resulted in the election of the hon. Member of Parliament, Mr Solomon Musonda.

Mr Magande: Doctor!

Mr Mwanza: As Deputy Chief Whip, Hon. Musonda, I would like to welcome you to the National Assembly …

Mrs Masebo: Hear, hear! Quality!

Mr Mwanza: … and, please, feel welcome.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: With regard to the motion on the Floor, from the outset, I wish to adopt some debates of the hon. Members of Parliament as my own. These include the debate by Hon. V. J. Mwaanga, the Chief Whip on Friday.

Hon. Opposition Member: Your boss!

Mr Mwanza: My boss, indeed. I think everybody here recognises the role he has played and contributions he has made to this country. He is one of the few Zambians who have ably served all the four Presidents. This is not an easy task.

Sir, I also wish to adopt some aspects of Hon. Dr Machungwa’s debate as my own, particularly as it relates to the leadership development in our nation, Zambia.

Mr Kambwili: Question!

Mr Mwanza: Further, I wish to adopt the debate by Dr Chishya who, in my view, showed magnanimity in terms of defending the achievements made by the MMD Government, New Deal Administration, over the years.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: I also wish to adopt the debate by my colleague, Hon. Chimbaka, Member of Parliament for Bahati, Luapula Province, as my own. He also showed magnanimity in his debate …

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: … when he discussed issues that affect our lovely country, Zambia.

In addition, Mr Speaker, I would be failing in my duties if I did not acknowledge and support the debate by the National Secretary for my party, Hon. Dr Kalumba …

Mr Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1615 hours until 1630 hours.{mospagebreak}

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Speaker: I direct the Whips to do their job.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, from the outset, I wish to state that I am very disappointed that when somebody is on the Floor and is discussing matters related to an obituary, there are running commentaries pertaining to “Question” and “Question” from certain hon. Members of Parliament. This is unacceptable. When somebody dies, we must all show that we are sorrowful because this person lived with us. He was our friend and our relative. However, as for me, Mr Speaker, I speak as a Member of Parliament who shared a constituency with the late Ben. Obviously, and therefore, such interjections are not necessary.

Sir, I further wish to commend the mover and seconder of the motion, namely Hon. Mwapela and Hon. Marjory Mwape, in the manner in which they articulated the issues that were contained in the President’s Speech.

Mr Speaker, I now wish to dwell, for a little while, on the President’s Speech. I wish to state that the President’s Speech was very inspiring to all of us.

Hon. Opposition Members: No!

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: It was also thought provoking.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: He provoked a lot of thought as he was delivering the speech and articulating on serious issues. The speech was futuristic, with a clear roadmap on how the economy of this country was going to improve.

Mr Speaker, the President touched on many areas related to economic development, such as agriculture, mines, tourism and so on and so forth. I was also impressed with what he said regarding unity. Unity is very important for our nation to develop. I wish, in this vein, to pay tribute to our founding father, Dr Kenneth Kaunda, who led this country to freedom …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: … by uniting all the seventy-three tribes of Zambia into one nation and today, we are very proud to say, “One Zambia, One Nation.” Our President is emulating what Dr Kaunda did. You have seen that Dr Kaunda and Dr Chiluba were able to walk arm in arm at the Kusefya Pangwe’na Traditional Ceremony. This, Mr Speaker, is unprecedented and has never happened before.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: With that in mind, even I, as Deputy Chief Whip, when I am thanking hon. Members of the Opposition for debating wisely, I mean exactly that, especially for those hon. Members who do not debate along party lines. That is what this country wants. We must move in one direction.

Mr Speaker, I would also like to take the words spoken by the President regarding the media regulation as my very own.

Interruptions

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, my Government has given notice to the media fraternity asking them to immediately show signs of regulating itself and that, if it does not, my Government is going to do it for them.

Hon. PF Members: Question!

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, I am aware that lawyers who are very responsible citizens of this country are regulated and they operate under the Law Association of Zambia. The accountants are regulated and they operate under the Zambia Institute of Chartered Accountants (ZICA). The human resource practitioners have regulated themselves and they operate under an Act of Parliament. The non-governmental organisations (NGOs) were regulated by this House only three weeks ago. Marketers also have laws in place that regulate them. The professional marketers have regulated themselves and they are operating under an Act of Parliament and so who are the media not to do this? Why should the media be an exception when they call themselves professionals? I support my Government on the issue that the media should be regulated.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, allow me to rebut some concerns that were raised by some of the hon. Members of the Opposition. I have a lot of respect for my brother there, Hon. Sejani, because first of all, he is an MMD founding father whether you like it or not. Secondly, he is my former hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing and thirdly, during his time, he contributed to the development of the Local Government Policy and I thank him for that.

Mr Speaker, he should not come here and say that we are suffering from poverty of leadership in the MMD because he contributed to our achievements. After all, my brother there was one of the leaders in the MMD and so he is one of us. I can leave it to his conscience and that of the House to judge whether poverty of leadership does exist in the MMD.

Hon. Government Members: No!

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, I would like to say that the infamous packet which you call ‘pact’ is …

Laughter

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, the infamous packet of cigarettes from Cuba will not work and will not bring a Government in place.

Laughter

Mr Mwanza: It will not form a Government and …

Mr Kambwili: What nonsense?

Mr Mwanza: … not bring development to our country. That is why it is called a packet or pocket of lies.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, we have had many pacts in this country which have not worked and, therefore, do not philosophise on the Floor of the House …

Mr Beene: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Beene: Mr Speaker, I do not intend to disrupt the contribution of the hon. Deputy Chief Whip who is debating very well. Is he in order to refer to your left as being a packet of cigarettes from Fidel Castro? I need your serious ruling on this matter.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member for Solwezi West who has referred to a certain group in the House as a packet of cigarettes from Cuba is being challenged through a point of order by the hon. Member for Itezhi-tezhi.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: May you continue either by justifying that cigars from Cuba are not the best in the world.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: If you are referring to cigarettes from Cuba, which ones are they which are not good?

You may continue, please.

Laughter

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, I was actually making reference to the cigars from Cuba and as we all know, they are the best cigarettes. So in their so-called packet, they could be the best and I have no problem with that, but I would like to advise them not to be flamboyant about the so-called packet.

Mr Speaker, I would like to mention that the people of North-Western Province have a lot of respect for the MMD Government because under it, the province has achieved a lot which it did not achieve in the last two Governments. In my view, in the North/-Western Province, the MMD is there to stay. Packet or no packet, …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Interruptions 

Mr Mwanza: … it will not be removed from power. Therefore, let us ensure that we establish this relationship of working together as hon. Members. We have to respect the fact that on this side of the House, there are seasoned politicians and leaders who have done extremely well.

Mr Speaker, even on the other side, there are some seasoned leaders and this is very clear to all. We must, therefore, know that when we are here in the midst of professors, doctors and whatever profession, every one is making a significant contribution to the leadership of our country. Poverty of leadership does not exist.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, I promised that I was going to be brief and with those few remarks, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to speak.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

The Provincial Minister for Northern Province (Mr Chinyanta): Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to also contribute to this very important motion which is on the Floor. I would also like to thank our President for giving us a very good speech that has given direction and guidance to those of us who are in Government and at the same time, the nation and our friends on the other side.

Mr Speaker, I must start by commending the President for his speech and the Government for changing the budget cycle. For a long time, this country has strived to bring development to its people and for us Zambians who have lived most of our lives in this country, we have seen some of the hurdles that we have been facing to ensure that we bring development to our people. This bold decision that the Government has made to change the budget cycle is a clear indication that we are ready to ensure that we remove some of the bottlenecks that have affected our drive to bring development.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chinyanta: It takes a serious and bold Government to make decisions involving the changing of cycles. My appeal to all the hon. Members of this House and the country at large is that we should support this process. We should not to be negative towards it. Let us smoothen before we start operationalising it.

Mr Speaker, I would also like to thank the President for being honest by explaining to the people of Zambia the impact of the global economic crisis. He reminded us, as Zambians, where we have come from, where we are and where we are going. These are clear indicators of the vision which the Government has in place for our people. Indeed, as a Government, we have seen some of the solutions that we have put in place to ensure that the impact of the economic crisis is lessened. For example, we have seen that in the mining sector, the Government has made strides to correct the situation in light of the global economic crisis.

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Chinyanta: My interest as Minister for Northern Province is to look at two sectors, agriculture and tourism. Despite the fact that the crisis affected even these two sectors I have mentioned, the Northern Province faired very well in terms of agriculture.

Mr Kambwili: Ema Minister aya.

Mr Chinyanta: I need to indicate that we have actually recorded a bumper harvest in the Northern Province and, as a province, we came fourth in maize production.

Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Chinyanta: In bean production and finger millet, we are first.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chinyanta: These are clear indicators that as a Government, our policies in the agricultural sector are actually working and the people are overcoming the challenges that they are facing despite the global economic crisis. Therefore, my appeal to our people that side is to ensure that they tell the Government which areas it should improve on. We should produce more for the sake of development.

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Chinyanta: Mr Speaker, at the moment, fertiliser is in all the districts and maize marketing is also going smoothly in my province. These are also indicators that the prospects of our economy are actually very bright.

Mr Speaker, I was in the Northern Province a few days ago and found that we have already received another K500 million to ensure that our farmers can sell their maize to the Government.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chinyanta: Mr Speaker, I am still on the agricultural sector. A number of people have debated on the issue of crop levies. I look at this problem from a different angle because most people who have debated on the Floor of the House have only talked about how it has affected the council, but we have to look at the other players in this field. We have to look at the traders who are going to buy this grain out there. We also have to look at the farmers. As Minister of Northern Province, I received a petition from farmers from Mbala. I was given the petition even before the announcement was made by the President. The farmers were complaining about how the levies were affecting them and how they were even failing to do business properly.

So when we debate such issues on the Floor, let us look at things from both sides. It is true that the councils have lost their revenue. I would want to urge the councils to diversify and find other ways of filling this gap.
 
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kambwili: Question!

Mr Sing’ombe: Uyo wena ufi.

Interruptions

Mr Chinyanta: They can look at other levies that they are not charging and they can also consider maybe increasing some of the levies they are charging so that they fill the gaps that have been created by expunging the crop levies.

Hon. Government Member: Wisdom.

Mr Chinyanta: Mr Speaker, if you went to Soweto Market this time to talk to the traders there, you will find that they have received this news with happiness. As a Government, we have to make decisions that cut across different category of people. So let us just be sober minded on this and address the issue the way it is supposed to be looked at.

Mr Speaker, on the issue of tourism in the Northern Province, we are excited with the development that is taking place in the Northern Circuit and Luapula. I am very happy that the President actually talked about it. Just last week, His Honour the Vice-President launched the tourism week in the Northern Province. From the way the people have received this, you can tell that they are ready to ensure that the country’s tourism base shifts to our province. One of the things we are trying to do as a province is ensure that we look at ways of enticing local tourists to come and visit the province. That is the target that we are trying to meet in the Northern Circuit. We want to invite local tourists to come and see some of the natural resources that we have there. We should not just be negative as regards to some of the efforts that the Government is making to improve tourism. The infrastructure that we are trying to put up in those areas is really meant to benefit us Zambians. We want people to be able to easily take their families to Kasaba Bay. It is not only the Europeans who are supposed to come there.

Hon. Government Members: Yes.

Mr Chinyanta: Mr Speaker, I am happy that we are making efforts to level the field in the Northern Province. Airports are being looked at and very soon we are going to have a hotel as a way of encouraging tourists to come there.

Mr Speaker, we are also looking at how we can upgrade power stations such as Munzuwa. We are looking at entering into a private-public-partnership (PPP) agreement. The people from the private sector need to participate in the project, including Zambians themselves. We want Zambians to own hydro stations so that our economy can develop.

Mr Speaker, let me now talk about livestock and fisheries. I was very happy that the President talked about it in his speech because as a province, we also want to be among the provinces that call themselves cattle-rearing provinces. We have put things in place there to ensure that we also start rearing cattle. I am happy that as a Government, we have already rehabilitated the Mbesuma Ranch so that we can rear quality cattle. There are a lot of signs which indicate that the policies of the Government are actually being received very well by our people.

Mr Speaker, the programme of fast tracking farm blocks is welcome. For a long time, we have been talking about the Luena Farm Block in Luapula without any serious development there. We would like to see that farm block become fully operational so that it can serve our people very well. The Government is focussed on developing the agriculture sector.

Mr Speaker, let me also talk about land. The President talked about land especially with regard to the border areas. The Northern Province shares borders with many countries such as Malawi, Tanzania and the Democratic Republic of Congo. There are big challenges in those border areas such as disease control, bird flu and cross-border crimes. There are people who cross from the other side just to come and commit crime here in Zambia. Karavinas are also found in the border areas.

Mr Speaker, let me talk about the issue of smuggling which has made us lose a lot of revenue. The President, in his speech, talked about demarcating these lands. I am very happy, as hon. Minister from that area, because it is a clear indication that it may help us solve some of the problems we have there. There are encroachments in Nakonde south whereby it is very difficult to tell where the border is because the beacons have been removed. We cannot even trace the side where Zambians live and the side for Tanzanians. The Government is trying to sort out the problems at borders. This excited me because this is an issue of land. After all, when we demarcate the borders properly, we are going to have good neighbours who are going to live with us in peace.

Sir, let me also talk about co-operation. Time has come for all Zambians not to look at each other as enemies. In fact, we should look at each other as partners who can work together. As hon. Minister for Northern Province, I want to work with everybody, but if some hon. Members of Parliament do not want to co-operate with the Government, problems will arise because we will not be able to sit down together to sort out most of the problems we are facing.

Sir, it is sad that some of our friends still do not want to appreciate that we are here to help them. We should not insult each other and be negative towards what the other side says or does. Time and again, we have invited our friends on your left side to come to our offices. When they come to our offices, we are going to sit down and look at what is on the table.

Hon. Malama yesterday lamented seriously about the sad situation in Chief Nabwalya’s area. I visited the area and travelled on the road e talked about. That is the way it is supposed to be. As regards the Mpika/Nabwalya Road that he was talking about, the Government knows that this road is dilapidated because of the poor workmanship of the contractors who were awarded the project. All we need is to sit down and see how we can solve the problem. It is not that the Government has not given any help to the area he was talking about.

Sir, K590 billion has been allocated for the roads in the Northern Province. The challenge I have always put to our friends is that when we talk of roads in the Northern Province, we should not single out certain roads. We should look at the bigger picture. We must look at what the Government is doing in these areas. People have been saying that the Mansa/Luwingu Road has taken ten years or so to complete. We know that, but they should ask why this road has taken all these years to rehabilitate. These are the issues we need to sit down together and discuss.

Hon. Government Members: Wisdom!

Mr Chinyanta: If we use the K590 billion to work on the roads in the province, those that have not been to Kasama lately will see the difference. The roads are being worked on and so is the drainage. These are things which indicate that we can work together. I am, therefore, appealing to the hon. Members on your left that we should sit down and work out what we can do together.

Interruptions

Mr Chinyanta: Sir, on the same issue of co-operation, I would also like to talk about some of our chiefs. There are fifty chiefs in the Northern Province. Most of them appreciate what the Government is doing for them …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chinyanta: … but a few, of course, are negative on anything that we try to do for them. This does not augur well. On the Floor of this House, there was a comment to the effect that one chief was complaining about the vehicles that we gave to the chiefs.  It was said that these vehicles are just on rocks. That is not the way things are supposed to be done because logic tells us that when the Government gives out these vehicles, they are like personal-to-holder vehicles. They are given to chiefs for them to use and look after. If a chief starts carrying passengers at a fee, uses the vehicle to conduct business and it is not serviced and breaks down, can the Government be blamed for that, of course not? These are issues which are very basic because one just needs to use logic and then we can come together and discuss.

Sir, chiefs have also talked about deforestation. I agree that this is a problem because in Chinsali, we are also facing a similar problem. We, however, look at chiefs as partners in development. We have to discuss with them issues of development. In the past, chiefs had authority to order the people in villages not to burn grass or cut down trees anyhow. I come from Luapula and chiefs there always told people when to start fishing. Even people who catch caterpillars had to wait for chiefs to indicate when people should go out to get caterpillars. That is the authority which chiefs should have. Therefore, chiefs should not just make wild statements because that is very discouraging as we need to work together with them. They need to come to us what they need on the ground. That way, we will be able to help them.

Sir, I am trying to put forward the issue of co-operation with the Government. Of course there are a lot of challenges. In certain places, we have not done very well, but we need to work together so that we look at the weaknesses in this speech and address them. We are in Government offices to ensure that we help our people.

Sir, I want to thank you most sincerely for allowing me to speak.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Major Chizhyuka (Namwala): Mr Speaker, I am very grateful for giving me the opportunity to stand here today and add the voice of the humble people of Namwala to the motion moved by the hon. Member for Kalabo Central that the thanks of this historical sitting, for the very first time since independence, be recorded for the exposition of public policy contained in His Excellency, Rupiah Bwezani Banda’s Address to the official opening of the Fourth Session of the Tenth National Assembly on Friday, 18th September, 2009. I wish to express my support for the motion.

I start by adding my voice to those of hon. Members of Parliament who have paid condolences for two of our colleagues who have since passed on, namely Hon. Benny Tetamashimba and Hon. Hamir.

Mr Speaker, I want to state, without fear or favour, that, indeed, Hon. Benny Tetamashimba was a prolific politician. People may say what they like, but Benny set himself targets and achieved them. We all come to the National Assembly of Zambia and aspire to represent our people and each one of us, in our individual capacity, set targets for ourselves. Hon. Benny Tetamashimba was the Secretary General of the United Party for National Development (UPND). At the time he was secretary general, the UPND thrived. If anyone asks us, the true-green UPND members, they will be told that no other secretary general has matched Hon. Benny Tetamashimba.

Mr Speaker, I got to know Hon. Benny Tetamashimba at the time I sat at a public podium at the UPND Convention at the Garden House Hotel. He called me from the crowd. I did not hold any specific position in UPND at the time. He called, “Major, come.” I was a little nervous because I did not know what the secretary general of this giant party wanted. I walked over to the front where he was and he told me, “You sit next to me,” and I did so. Then, Hon. Benny Tetamashimba asked me what I saw. I said that I saw the entire convention. He then said, “Yes, you are seeing power. The fact that you are seated on a public platform, this is power, and now because it is me that has called you here, Major, I want to tell you that nobody will remove you from here. So, enjoy the power while it lasts.”

That was Benny Teta and how he joked. He set himself a target and said that he was going to move the whole North-Western Province to the UPND. In Solwezi, he formed the first UPND council. Later, almost the entire North-Western Province became UPND. That was Benny Tetamashimba and his colleagues. When he moved out of the UPND to join the MMD, you saw what happened to the vacuum that was left in the North-Western Province.

Mr Speaker, none other than His Excellency President Rupiah Bwezani Banda, said that Benny Tetamashimba was one of the people who wanted him to stand for Presidency. That was Ben’s agenda; to get Mr Rupiah Bwezani Banda the Presidency. Now, ask me, did he achieve it? That was Benny Tetamashimba. Call him what you like, but he achieved the things that he wanted for himself.

I was unable to mourn my friend Benny because I was in the High Court representing the downtrodden people. May the souls of Hon. Benny Tetamashimba and Hon. Hamir rest in eternal peace.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Major Chizhyuka: Mr Speaker, I realise that I have gone on too long in eulogising. So I will skip a lot of what I wanted to say.

I hope that I will tie myself to addressing the key components of the President’s Speech and try and leave one-and-half minute to talk about the pact between the UPND and PF. As you know, yesterday, some people called from across the Floor that Major Chizhyuka was not in support of the pact. I wish to make some remarks on that matter.

Mrs Musokotwane: Tell them!

Major Chizhyuka: Mr Speaker, Hon. Hachipuka’s and Hon. Hamududu’s constituencies, including Namwala are like a yoke. They form a “Y”. The critical question that our people ask us all the time is that associated with: Are we, as the people of Mbabala, Bweengwa and Namwala constituencies really part of this country, Zambia?

Mr Speaker, if you read a book by your predecessor, Hon. Robinson Mwaakwe Nabulyato, from Namwala, African Realities, at page 41, you will understand that in 1952, during the struggle for the independence of this country, monies to forge that struggle came principally from two main areas. The Mambwe and Namwanga contributed £800, and from a collector in Mbabala Constituency in the Southern Province, Mr Edward Nyanga, they contributed £3,000. In 1963, the people of Mbabala Constituency also contributed cattle that was sold in order to bring the First Republican Constitution from Lancaster House.

However, since independence, we have lived in what we call muluhuko; in dust roads. When I first came to Parliament, I said, “Vernon Mwaanga, what are you going to tell the people of Macha when you retire from politics since you have been in politics since independence, and yet the main route; the Choma/Namwala Road has not been tarred?”

You may be aware that at the second Shimunenga Ceremony, I stated, in Namwala, that if the Choma/Namwala Road was not tarred, there was no need for me to come back to Parliament. People should not re-elect me. I made that statement and it has been picked by the newspapers and everybody who dared to read, read it. However, we put a lot of pressure through the hon. Ministers responsible for Works and Supply and the finances of this country and, indeed, His Excellency Levy Patrick Mwanawasa, SC. May that son of Namwala, whose father passed away in Namwala and was buried in Chisamba, rest in eternal peace.

He directed Hon. Simbao and Hon. Magande in the presence of Hon. Hamududu of Bweengwa and myself, that he wanted the Choma/Namwala Road to be completed and tarred in two years. I am the custodian of the contract.

Hon. Munkombwe was Provincial Chairman at the time and was there and he said, “Let it be stated that this demand has been made on this day that the Choma/Namwala, Monze/Nico Road will be tarred”.

I am pleased, on behalf of the people of Choma, Mbabala, Bweengwa, Monze and Namwala, that the Government of His Excellency Rupiah Bwezani Banda has lived up to and kept the legacy …

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Major Chizhyuka: … of His Excellency Levy Patrick Mwanawasa, SC and is tarring the road. I want you to understand that I am a landslide winner. You may say all sorts of things, but I have won the Namwala Parliamentary Constituency seat with a landslide victory,  never recorded ever since 1964. That is me.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Major Chizhyuka: Let us give praise where it is due. That is how the Ila people are and we have no apologies to make for that. How do you call yourself a Member of Parliament when your main supply route, the Choma/Namwala Road cannot be tarred and then you tell your people that I want a re-election?

Mr Speaker, on behalf of the people of Namwala who gave me the highest vote ever since independence, I want to say thank you.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Major Chizhyuka: Mr Speaker, there are issues in this speech associated with agriculture, but I want to state two specific issues. First and foremost, it is an item associated with the Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia as a component of agricultural development for our country.

Mr Speaker, on 15th September, your Committee, chaired by Hon. Muntanga, visited the Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia to inspect the extent of use of the K5 billion given by the Government to rehabilitate the D-Compound plant in Kafue. The rehabilitation was done in good faith and completed to the satisfaction of the Chairman of the Committee on Agriculture and Lands. Thereafter, the Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia went back to the Government to secure a contract for the production of all the fertiliser necessary for the Fertiliser Support Programme (FSP) for our country. This, Sir, which I will lay on the Table, is the contract that was signed.

Mr Speaker, no sooner was it signed than it was cancelled, and yet before that, a bank led by a foreigner wrote, advising the Government in Paragraph 4 that, “We understand that there is a risk in delayed disbursement of the down payments under FSP due to lack of funding from third parties. We urge the Government to ensure that this down payment is made timely because failure to receive the down payment by the end of this week will result in NCZ being unable to source the raw materials on time”.

Mr Speaker, NCZ, a creation of this Government, has had its contract cancelled in preference for fertiliser imported by other people. The question I ask myself is what we want. We created NCZ for a win-win situation. The fertiliser that is produced from there will make it possible for the small-scale farmer to grow more food and, therefore, enhance household food security. In addition, it also creates employment so that the Government can collect more taxes which, in turn, will be used to develop the country. This Government has decided to get fertiliser from abroad, creating employment from wherever the fertiliser is coming, at the expense of our people. I hope that the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives, who is in the House, will rethink his position because then why was K5 billion provided for the rehabilitation of the plant if the fertiliser from there was not wanted? What kind of planning is that?

With regard to the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries, I would like to leave that to the next budget speech. However, I would like to say something about the accusations that were made about my not being a member of the pact.

Laughter

Major Chizhyuka: Mr Speaker, as I have stated already, I am a true greeny of the United Party for National Development (UPND). I want to state that, at the moment, the pact to, which I belong by virtue of being a member of UPND, is like Chilingalinga. This means it is like a snake with two heads.

Laughter

Major Chizhyuka: With  head on either side.

Laughter

Major Chizhyuka: We shall continue to belong to this pact which has two heads …

Laughter

Major Chizhyuka: … until we know the real identity of the heads so that we know the snake and also the type and characteristics of the snake. At that point, we shall have to make a decision.

Laughter

Major Chizhyuka: I want to tell you that it is the wish of the people of a part of Zambia which used to be called North-Western Rhodesia that they also have a chance to provide leadership for the country called Zambia.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Major Chizhyuka: We have seen the leadership of this country move from the Northern, Luapula, Copperbelt and Eastern provinces. We cannot, as long as we present the current crop of leadership in the areas that we control, be the ones to struggle to take the next leadership of this country to an area which has not yet ruled, if Zambia is a unitary country.

Mr Speaker, with these few remarks, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Teta.

The Minister of Communications and Transport (Professor Lungwangwa): Mr Speaker, I thank you for the opportunity to add my voice of thanks to His Excellency the President’s Speech.

Mr Speaker, allow me to pay my deepest condolences to the families of our departed colleagues, Hon. Tetamashimba and Hon. Hamir. Hon. Tetamashimba, that beautiful Kaonde name which means cutting across boundaries and, indeed, he lived up to that expectation. May his soul and that of Hon. Hamir Rest, rest in eternal peace.

Mr Speaker, allow me, also, to congratulate Hon. Molobeka and Hon. Kapeya on climbing the ladder of the brightest and best by acquiring university degrees. Hon. Members, I am sure you know by now that a university degree is not easy to get. It requires a lot of dedication and hard work in the development of a clear analytical mind and this is what differentiates those who have been in and those who have not been in the corridors of the academia. To the two hon. Members, I say congratulations.

Mr Speaker, those with clear analytical minds will acknowledge that the speech delivered to this august House by His Excellency the President, Mr Rupiah Bwezani Banda, exemplifies the qualities of outstanding leadership. To understand this speech clearly, we should place it in the context of the global economic crisis whose force cannot be avoided.

In the face of the global economic crisis, the speech has set out the broad goals, direction and strategies the Government is taking to address it. Those who have analysed the speech very closely will agree that it has clearly outlined the Government’s actions necessary to address the global economic crisis as it affects our country. The actions that the Government is taking to address it and as outlined in the President’s Speech are:

(i) stimulating the economy through direct Government action and by encouraging private investment, the President has made reference to the Multi-Facility Economic Zones, tax incentives and development of new legal frameworks to support this Government action,

(ii) making the Government more effective by reducing red tape in service delivery. Streamlining the licensing procedures is, of course, one of the examples of the steps the Government is taking;

(ii) developing the country through new investment in infrastructure such as roads, airports, railways and the power house of development, namely the information communication technology.

Hon. Chizhyuka is right by acknowledging the developments that the Government is making in this direction;

(iv) securing more energy for the country by developing our rich energy resources. The speech has made reference to new sources of energy being developed under public-private partnerships;

(v) redirecting key sectors such as agriculture, mining and tourism into effective production. Farm blocks, the Livingstone and the Northern Tourism Circuits, new mining areas and minerals, small and big mining projects have been made reference to in the speech;

(vi) broadening the participation of more citizens in production through measures such as FSP which will enable more people to participate in farming. Clearly, as a Government, we stand on a higher conscience when more of our people are able to access FSP;

(vii) diversifying crop production, controlling livestock diseases and streamlining crop marketing and the speech has made reference to that;

(viii)  protecting the stability of the financial system. Despite the global economic crisis, no bank in our country has closed. This is a sign of what the Government action is;

(ix) the Government is acting to ensure access to credit for businesses through the Citizens’ Economic Empowerment Commission;

(x) acting to support industries in difficulties and protecting the families that depend on them for jobs. The Albidon Mine, Luanshya Copper Mines and the Zambia Telecommunications Company (Zamtel) are cases in point; 

(xi) creating more opportunities for all citizens in education, health and skills training; and

(xii) protecting the vulnerable, unemployed women, youth and low-income families hit the hardest by the global economic crisis. 

Mr Speaker, these are the twelve imperatives which the Government has taken and is taking to get our country out of the global economic crisis.

Mr Speaker, these actions being taken by the Government are injecting immediate economic stimulus while promoting long-term growth. The actions are protecting the jobs of the workers while redirecting the economy to create more jobs and wealth.

Mr Speaker, in the face of economic uncertainty, the Government has come up with clear and focused policies and plans and this is what the speech has highlighted to a great extent.

Mr Speaker, it is very clear from the President’s Speech that the Government is doing what is necessary to stimulate the economy and create an investment environment that will guarantee future prosperity for all our people.

Mr Speaker, the President has, in fact, gone further to implore all of us to work together. Indeed, in these uncertain times when the world is threatened by a struggling economy, it is imperative that we work together, stand by one another and that we strive for greater solidarity and patriotism to the motherland.

The speech has made a passionate appeal to this House to stand as one in the face of greater difficulties. From the speech, the President has told us that Zambians expect their elected representatives to dedicate their efforts to ensure that the country emerges stronger from this economic crisis. While it is true that the present crisis is new, the imperative of concerted action is the challenge we are called upon as leaders to address.

Mr Speaker, the President has indicated that what should sustain us, as a nation, is the strength of character through peace, unity and determination.

Mr Speaker, it is clear from the speech that the leadership of His Excellency, Mr Rupiah Bwezani Banda, will certainly take Zambia out of the global economic crisis.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Prof. Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, all citizens and the business community in this great country are assured that under the leadership of the President, their future is guaranteed. We shall emerge out of the economic crisis stronger than before.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 Prof. Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, it is very clear from this speech that our Republican President, Mr Rupiah Bwezani Banda, has demonstrated one of the basic tenets of good leadership, mainly, that a leader should have the ability to see beyond the present.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Prof. Lungwangwa: The President is seeing beyond the current problems of the global economic crisis by providing solutions to the problems that beset the country. Very clearly, he is driving this nation into prosperity by overcoming the hurdles of today.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr C. Mulenga (Chinsali): I thank you Mr Speaker for giving me time to debate the motion on the Floor of the House.

Sir, many people have described this speech in different ways. While others have called it hollow and others flat, I think that one’s interpretation of this speech depends on how it affects his or her constituency.

Mr Speaker, as hon. Member of Parliament for Chinsali, I am calling this speech a blank cheque issued to the people of my constituency without commitment. Why do I say so? It is not long when the Republican President, His Excellency the President, Rupiah Bwezani Banda, came to this House in January, this year, and talked about how we were going to have money to rehabilitate or construct the Mulakupikwa College meant for science and technology. To date, nothing has happened and no one talks about it. It was only talked about today when I brought a Question to this House over the matter. The answer that was given does not even give hope that anything will happen at Mulakupikwa College. The reason I am calling this speech a blank cheque is that what was promised, has not been fulfilled.

Mr Speaker, this speech is similar to the speech which was presented to this House in January this year.

It appears the MMD Government does not appreciate the importance of schools for science and technology.

Mr Speaker, when I listened to the debate by the young parliamentarians on the Floor of this House on Monday, their emphasis was on science and technology. From their expressions, I noticed that they were yearning to develop their minds through science and technology, but serious schools for science and technology in this country are lacking.

Sir, there are complaints and comparisons that in the 1960s, Zambia’s Gross Domestic Product (GDP) and that of North Korea and South Korea were on a par. Today, we are nowhere near them because our colleagues are making all kinds of things such as cellular phones, radios, television and vehicles. We are forgetting that the world has become sophisticated in terms of technology. This is the reason our colleagues have advanced so much.

Mr Speaker, the kind of education that we are offering our children, we will notice, is still the old syllabus of Mulenga and Jelita, Kalaba and Seka. What kind of cell phone can be made out of this education of Kalaba and Seka?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr C. Mulenga: This is why I am saying that we are very behind in terms of education.

Mr Speaker, the other blank cheque that was issued to the people of this country and Chinsali, in particular is that of agriculture.

Mr Speaker, the President gave a directive to the Food Reserve Agency (FRA) to purchase all the crops in the rural areas. I stood on the Floor of this House, confidently, and reminded my colleagues that the amount of money allocated to FRA would not be adequate to purchase all the crops that include rice, cassava, groundnuts and maize. I stated here that the K1 billion allocated to FRA for logistics and purchase of crops was not enough.

Sir, I have been vindicated. What happened was that FRA could not even manage to buy the targeted 110 metric tonnes from the K1 billion allocation. I saw a panic situation from the Government which asked FRA to borrow money from the banks, forgetting that this would be an expensive venture. It costs money to borrow money. Now that FRA has borrowed money from the banks, who is going to cushion the interest? Who is going to pay for that interest because banks want to make a profit on what they have given out?

Mr Speaker, this will affect the next crop marketing season because the maize that FRA is buying, today, and that this Government is boasting about, is under collateral from the banks where money was borrowed. By the next crop marketing season, FRA will not have money to buy the maize. Therefore, I urge the Government to look at these issues with the seriousness they deserve.

Mr Speaker, the other blank cheque that was issued was FSP. I will leave the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives out of this mess. The hon. Minister tried to intervene in the issue of suppliers of fertiliser to the Government under FSP, but the problem has been the Office of the Public Procurement Authority. A lot of things are happening in that office.

Mr Speaker, twelve companies bid to supply fertiliser under FSP. These companies are as follows:

 (i) Profert Zambia Limited;
 (ii) Export Trading Company Limited;
(iii) Sable Transport Limited;
(iv) Zambezi Fertiliser (Z) Limited;
  (iv) Zhong Geo Agric Machinery Limited;
  (v) Casitex Zambia Limited;
(vi) Zambian Fertiliser Limited;
  (vii) Zolenakie Trading Limited;
  (viii) Bridgeway Commodities;
  (ix) Greenbelt Fertiliser Limited;
  (x) Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia;
  (xi) and Mea Limited.

Mr Speaker, out of the companies listed above, the most expensive bidders were Miyombo Investment and Omnia Fertiliser. The cheapest were Export Trading Company and Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia Limited. To my surprise, Miyombo Investment and Omnia Fertiliser, the most expensive companies, were picked.

Mr Sing’ombe: Impukunya matobo.

Laughter

Mr C. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, something somewhere went wrong.

In the process, the Government will, this year, lose about US$1.1 million because of picking the most expensive bidders. I would like to urge my colleagues to be alert with what is happening in some of these offices.

Mr Speaker, I also want to talk about the issue of roads. The President was boasting that the rehabilitation works on roads countrywide was going on very well. The road between Serenje and Nakonde is very important. This is an international road which brings a lot of revenue to this country, but you will realise that there is no road to talk about. The state of the road is so bad that a lot of accidents occur and people lose their lives everyday.

Mr Speaker, I heard somebody talking about providing K7 billion to what is being termed as holding maintenance. This means that no maintenance works can be carried out on that road at the moment. The K7 billion should just be used to patch up this stretch. If this is not done, it will not be fair to the motorists, as accidents will continue occurring on this road because the state of the road is quite bad.

Mr Speaker, I know that when the President comes back, he will be preparing to go to Kasama to drum up support for his MMD candidate. Therefore, I would like to ask him to use this road so that he can see what we are talking about.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr C. Mulenga: When he uses the road, let him go and ask the people of Kasama why they should vote for his candidate when they are so neglected compared to what is obtaining in other parts of the country.

Mr Chinyanta: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Chinyanta: Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me an opportunity to raise a point of order. Is the hon. Member of Parliament for Chinsali, who is debating in this manner, in order to say that we have neglected Kasama Constituency when just two weeks ago, he was on television thanking this Government for having built a very good road in Chinsali. Is he in order to mislead the nation and this House, when we have just delayed a little in probably giving him what he wants?

I seek your serious ruling on that matter, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker: Order!

The hon. Deputy Minister for Northern Province is challenging the debate by the hon. Member for Chinsali, essentially that the hon. Member for Chinsali is not being balanced in his debate. Therefore, it is the wish of the hon. Deputy Minister that the hon. Member for Chinsali should also say good things about the roads and other developments in the Northern Province.

In this regard, my ruling is that the hon. Member for Chinsali is free to debate. He may say things which are not pleasing to the Government and others which may be pleasing to it. However, it is the duty of the Executive to set the record straight. I have known certain hon. Members of Parliament who debate deliberately and carelessly to annoy this side (right).

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Maybe, that is what the hon. Member for Chinsali is doing at the moment.

He may he continue, please.

Laughter

Mr C. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, thank you for that guidance.

Sir, in fact, that point of order reminds me that this so- called able Government has sent earth-moving equipment to my constituency to work on the roads. I thank this Government for that, but surprisingly, they have sent that equipment without fuel.

Laughter

Mr C. Mulenga: Sir, I do not understand how those machines are going to operate. Yesterday, I talked to the Permanent Secretary for Northern Province. He said that he received K2 billion to be distributed to all the constituencies in the Northern Province and we have twelve districts in that province. For those of you who do not know, the Northern Province is the largest province in this country and is very far from the administration set up which is in Lusaka. We all know that this province receives a lot of rains. Therefore, we expect more soil erosion and damage to the roads. People were very happy to see the equipment, but unfortunately, there is no fuel. In Chinsali, we were supposed to receive K150 million for fuel. The message I received was that most of this money had gone into paying of allowances to the operators of the machines. Therefore, how do you expect me to start thanking the Government with their poor management and planning?

Hon. Opposition Members:  Hear, hear!

Mr C. Mulenga: Sir, I cannot thank the Government for that. I appeal to the hon. Minister for Northern Province to intervene in this matter. We need fuel so that we can work on the roads that we have promised the people of Chinsali. We promised them that we were going to do that this year and the machines are already there. I am, therefore, appealing to the hon. Minister to take note of what I have just stated and ensure that fuel is taken to Chinsali before the machines move to Isoka.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

The Deputy Minister of Defence (Dr Kazonga): Mr Speaker, thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to make a contribution to the debate on the motion on the Floor of this House. My debate will capture two important concepts. After scruitinising the President’s Speech to this Parliament, I came up with two words that capture a number of issues that were raised therein. These two issues are optimism and realism.

Mr Speaker, political leadership needs to combine realism and optimism. In whatever we do and say, I wish to state that the President’s Speech clearly blended the two concepts. There were issues of realism to look at the realities on the ground and that was blended with giving people hope through optimism. Where no one believes in a better future, despair is a logical trait and people in despair almost never change anything, hence the need for all the people in the country to also follow that vision.

Mr Speaker, from the historical point of view, great movements for social change always begin with statements of optimism. The shared belief in a better future is the strongest view that is available to all of us in creating a better Zambia.

Mr Speaker, let me demonstrate these two concepts and I will start with realism.

Mr Mubika: Lecture them!

Dr Kazonga: Sir, in the President’s Speech, there are issues that have tackled the concept of realism. The first one is that the President stated, correctly, that there will be construction of new schools to increase enrolment and reduce the distances to the nearest school. By the end of the year, the Government will have completed construction of 2,543 schools. That clearly demonstrates realities on the ground. All over the country, be it in a district or province, there is this powerful programme known as infrastructure development in the Ministry of Education.  Any person from any district will, at least, be able to confirm to you that something is happening in their area. It is all about confirming realities on the ground.

Mr Speaker, the infrastructure support programme under the Ministry of Education, which His Excellency the President referred to, has captured equity. My former lecturer, seated in front of me, always refers to vertical and horizontal equity.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kazonga: He has been talking about vertical and horizontal equity. This programme properly demonstrates the whole concept of equity in the distribution of development in the country.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, on the issue of agricultural extension services, the President indicated that 476 motor cycles were bought this year to improve mobility of extension staff. This is another item of reality. He further stated that the Government recognises the high cost of infrastructure and to this effect, the Government wishes to encourage private sector participation in infrastructure development. This is another reality. The President further indicated that he invited the private sector to join in the development of the Mbala/Nakonde, Senanga/Sesheke and Kasempa/Mumbwa roads.

Mr Speaker, as we may recall, after passing the Bill on the Public-Private Partnership, it is now a reality that the Government alone cannot tackle all these issues or the challenges that we are facing. Therefore, the issue of the Public-Private Partnership is, indeed, a reality which all of us have to appreciate.

Mr Speaker, according to page 45 of the speech by the President, the Government is investing in infrastructure development and provision of medical equipment. This year, construction of fifteen hospitals in various districts is in progress. This is a reality and not an imagination. This is what is happening currently. On page 49, the President said that construction of health posts was in progress and ten out of eighteen planned health posts were already under construction. This requires rich leadership and not as somebody referred to it with a very negative term.

Mr Speaker, I would now like to talk about optimism as demonstrated in the speech. The President correctly indicated the re-designing of bridges on the Mongu/Kalabo Road in readiness for commencement of works next year. This gives hope to the people of Zambia for next year. This is optimism.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kazonga: On health, the President indicated that the construction for the second phase of the Cancer Diseases Hospital in Lusaka is scheduled to commence before the end of this year. This is also hope for the Zambians.

Hon. Government Member: It has already started.

Dr Kazonga: I am told that the second phase of the construction of the hospital has already started. That is another positive that I am talking about and it will continue giving hope for the future.

Mr Speaker, on education, the President was aware that there are many institutions that are coming up to respond to the policy of the Government on private participation in the provision of education and training. This brings another challenge to our standards. The President also indicated that currently, finalisation of a national qualifications and accreditation framework is being worked on.

Mr Speaker, I would like to say a few things about this national qualifications and accreditation framework. It is, indeed, a good thing. We have several universities that are coming up and offering all kinds of programmes. Therefore, there is a need to clarify which qualification means what. We need to have a progression from the minimum qualification all the way to PhD. This, however, can only be done through an organised arrangement of qualifications which enables us to compare vertically and horizontally. For instance, if they are diplomas, you can compare at the level of diplomas. You can also compare the progression from diploma to first degree, Masters to PhD. This is, indeed, the right move in the right direction because it is going to ensure that our education and training system responds to our needs as a country.

Mr Speaker, as for some more elements of optimism, the President indicated that he was concerned about these unplanned activities that we have been seeing. It is clear that the process of planning needs to be orderly. The President indicated his wish to have orderly development in this country. This will assist in the future, as we develop, to have an orderly and organised process. In this case, it is my considered view that the planning process, as we look at it from the strategic and district development plans, ensures that all the developments in the country are as planned. This will also indirectly assist in reducing unplanned settlements.

Mr Speaker, the President also indicated the review of the Town and Country Planning Act, Cap. 283 of the laws of Zambia. This will assist in bringing order in land use planning and also balancing development and the quality of the environment. The original development plans will take into consideration a range of issues, including housing, transportation, the environment, recreation facilities and public utilities. This will also provide a forum for local Government authorities to engage in discussions on a variety of issues that affect them.

Mr Speaker, the Government would like to see a situation where there is greater district to district and province to province co-operation so as to encourage better land use  and planning in a more orderly and integrated manner. It will also help to promote the efficient use of resources.

Mr Speaker, for all this to be achieved, we need each other. We carefully listen to the positive criticisms that come from your left hand side and we consider each proposal that is given to us. We listen, particularly when it is done in a manner that is attractive. However, when a confrontational stance is taken; you will find that even our ears will be closed. We listen and digest what is proposed and I am convinced that if we work together, we can make a difference in this country by addressing all the challenges that our people are facing.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa (Chifunabuli): Mr Speaker, I would like to thank you for giving me the opportunity to join the voices that have spoken about this matter before the House; the motion moved by the hon. Member for Kalabo Central, that is the exposition of public policy contained in the President’s Speech.

Sir, allow me to convey my condolences to the families of the hon. Members who have left us, Hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing, Mr Tetamashimba and Hon. Hamir. May their souls rest in peace.

Mr Speaker, I have sat and listened to the debates in the House and I have been saying to myself, “If I was given the opportunity to look at the history of my country and God in His mercy asked me the time I would prefer to live in, I would begin by looking at the colonial period and what happened then, but, I would certainly would not stop there. I would come to the time the United National Independence Party (UNIP) and the African National Congress (ANC) formed a pact and moved this country forward. In spite of that beauty, I would still not stop there. I would come to the time of the Movement for Multi-Party Democracy (MMD), the period in which I was the party’s National Legal Secretary. In spite of the advances we made in that period, I would still not stop there. I would come to the time of the third term and look at the great challenges that we placed on our party in order to ensure that the Constitution was not mutilated. Despite that achievement, I would not stop there. I would come to this time in our country and I will turn to the Lord and say, please, let me live in this era”.

Sir, I know that we live in a time of great talk, and I mean great talk. There are a lot of words and a lot of languages, but worst of all, I would listen to the insults that are scattered all over our country by those of us who call ourselves leaders. Despite the gloom, I will still say, this is the right time to live in because, as some great authors said before, “The great preacher, the darkest hour is just before dawn”.

 Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Sir, in spite of all this, this is a defining moment for our country. It is a period in which we should look into ourselves as individuals and ask not what the country will do for us, but what we, as individual, will do for our country. We should move away from the imagination that a single group in our country hold the destiny of our country. Each one of us must contribute to this country if this country has to move forward.

 Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Sir, I refuse to imagine that we can leave the development of our country to any group of people. That is irresponsible and unpatriotic. Each one of us must add to the development of our country and see to it that whatever effort we can make and whatever intellectual ability we have, we must exert ourselves to make our country better.

 Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Therefore, as we sit here as leaders of this country, the burden that we carry, is the burden of the poor.

 Major Chizhyuka: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: It is also the burden of the challenge in our society. It is the trouble that we see everywhere we walk. No one should be proud or take advantage of poor people to make political mileage or capital because it is an insult to our own integrity as a people. We should be saddened by the fact that we are unable, in this day and age, to send all our children to school. The challenge that we should be facing, together with those who are in Government, is how we can change the status quo.

Sir, looking at the speech of the His Excellency the President, I have heard so many words spoken; some for and others against.

Sir, for me, a statement made by the Head of State, no matter which political party that head of State belongs to, gives me the opportunity to look at what that individual views as the challenges and burdens that he carries with him day and night in relation to this country.

 Hon. Government Members:  Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: It does not matter whether I agree with him or not, but I will really look at what he has to say and if I have to criticise, it has to be on the basis that I have seen what he has said, understood what he said and if I do not agree with him, at that point, I would beg to differ.

Sir, as a way of life, I will never criticise someone without giving an alternative. When I criticise, it is because I think there is a better way of doing things.

 Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Sir, I refuse to join the multitudes who make capital out of dire needs. I refuse to be part of any group of individuals who sacrifice the integrity of my country and the rights of my people; poor and rich, for the good of only political gain.

 Hon. Major Chizhyuka: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Sir, this country has failed to move forward, particularly because we politicise every single issue.

 Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: When we will grow out of this?

Mr Speaker, I hear somebody ranting in the back that I like money. That is a language of poverty.

 Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: I challenge anyone here who does not want to get his salary. As a principle in my life, I never get money that I have not worked for. Therefore, when I work for it, I get it.

Sir, someone also talked about the National Constitutional Conference (NCC) and they were shouting about NCC. I stood on the Floor of this House and gave six reasons I disagreed with my party about not going to the NCC.

 Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa:  If somebody wants me to repeat them, I would do so because it is still true that failure to be part and parcel of a mood that is in the country to look at the Constitution that governs us, is failure to responsibly handle a crisis in the country.

 Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: The Constitution of this country is paramount to the development of this country and a leader must know and accept the fact that whether you like it or not, when things move, put your voice to it. Whether it is a voice of dissent or assent, let people know where you stand in a moment of crisis.

Mr V. Mwale: Ndiye maloya aya!

Mr Mwansa: Sir, Dr Martin Luther King Junior said, and I quote:

“The hottest place in hell is reserved for those who, in a moment or in minutes of crisis, maintain their neutrality.”

Sir, I refuse to remain silent when people are deciding the destiny of my country.

 Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: I also refuse to remain silent when the children that I bore will have to live under a Constitution which came into being at a time I lived and I had an opportunity to say something and remained silent.

 Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa:  Therefore, if someone wants to know why I am there, these are the reasons. I therefore, want to put this challenge to all those who think I have made a mistake. The question is that when this Constitution comes into being, are you going to refuse to subscribe to the tenets that will be contained in that Constitution? Are you going to refuse to go to an election under that Constitution? If you do, I have only one suggestion for you and that is that you do not belong to democracy.

Sir, we have a country in which the majority of our people …

Business was suspended from 1815 hours until 1830 hours.{mospagebreak}

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, when business was suspended, I was just asking if there will be any person who will not follow the Constitution once it is made. My humble submission is that all of us will become subservient to the superior law of the land once it is enacted. It was my feeling that if I had an opportunity to contribute to such a document, I would never miss it.

Lieutenant-General Shikapwasha: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, I will be very brief because of time constraints.

Firstly, as a country, we have gone into a relentless fight against corruption.

Hon. Member: Well spoken.

Mr Mwansa: It is important to bear in mind that the fight against corruption must be relentless, focussed, strategic and objective. We need to do that if we are to achieve the intended goal.

Sir, the fight against corruption is not meant to impress anybody, either an outsider or insider. The fight against corruption is meant to rid our country of corruption because it is bad for Zambia.

Ms Siliya: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Corruption will not help us develop. Therefore, the question we must ask ourselves as we relentlessly fight corruption is: “Where do we turn to ensure that the fight against corruptions is sustained?” The answer is, “Firstly, we must turn to the law of the land”.

Dr Mwansa: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Otherwise, we will end up making the fight against corruption hang on individuals, thus undermining the very thing that we want to sustain. Only the law is impartial in its approach against corruption.

Dr Mwansa: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: We should make sure, as we put the laws in place, that they will ensure our country is corruption free.

Mr Speaker, we do not only turn to the law, but also to the institutions of justice. In our country, the system of justice that we have espoused for ourselves is what we call inquisitorial. There are three great players in this system. There is a judge, the defence and prosecution. The prosecutor will make the accusation about someone being corrupt.

Mr Mwenya: On behalf of the people.

Mr Mwansa: On behalf of the people of this country.

Mr Mwenya: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Once that is done, that person who is given the responsibility of ensuring that we do not have corruption in the country will take witnesses before the court of law and argue the case. Our law is such that the person accused must be given a chance to defend himself or herself.

Mr Chimbaka: Hear, hear!

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: It is very important to bear these tenets in mind if we are to understand the system we have put in place.

Dr Chishya: Not Kangaroo court!

Mr Mwansa: The person who is accused is, by law, innocent until proven guilty.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Obviously, that person will have to give evidence and also call witnesses.

Ms Siliya: Hear, hear!

Mr Chimbaka: Eba lawyer aba!

Laughter

Mr Mwansa: Sir, at the end of it all, it reposes only in the hands of the judiciary to determine whether the accused is either guilty or not.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: We must be very clear about these things or else we will undermine the tenets of democracy.

Mr Mwenya: Balimishita!

Mr Mwansa: I have no intention of talking about the guiltiness or innocence of anybody. I want to plead with all of us, as Zambians, to bear in mind that when we undermine the orderly way of doing things in our country, then we are undermining ourselves. We must only question those things that are ruling the country

Mr Mwenya: Mwaliliko!

Mr Mwansa: We must be sure that they are doing the right thing.

Mr Mwenya: Chiluba ali mipeleko!

Mr Mwansa: Only those who are myopic in thought would want it otherwise.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Laughter

Mr V. Mwale: Myopic ku corner uko!

Mr Mwansa: What lessons have we learnt so far in the fight against corruption?

Interruptions

Mr Mwansa: Sir, we have prosecuted high profile cases. In my opinion, there are very good lessons we have learnt. First of all, no one in our country is above the law.

Mr Chimbaka: Good!

Mr Mwansa: That lesson has been learnt. This is something we must treasure as a country and be proud of the fact that we can take anyone to court and be sure that the justice system will prosecute that individual - either acquit or convict that individual. That is what we should be proud of.

Dr Katema: Right of appeal!

Mr Mwansa: The only person who has the right to tell who is innocent or guilty is the Judge.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Whether we like it or not, that is the way the system works. If we want changes to that system, then let us bring them here in Parliament. I will be with you.

Ms Lundwe: Not chilingalingas!

Mr Kasongo: We have no alternative!

Laughter

Mr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, I also wish to say that if we begin to apply the law selectively, we will undermine the legal process of our country. That is my worry about the way the setup was in the fight against corruption. I hope that we will find it in our hearts to ensure that in future, the fight against corruption is objective, blind to individuals and ensures that only the guilty go to prison. Those who are acquitted must be taken back into society and accepted.

Hon. Member: Exactly!

Mr Mwansa: That is how the system should be.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwenya: Right to appeal!

Mr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, let me conclude on this point. The President said this, on pages 78 to 79:

“More than ever before, we need to work together for a common purpose. As a Government, we commit ourselves to working with all stakeholders. Once more, I wish to pay tribute to all Zambians for upholding peace and stability in our nation. I urge all of us to individually and collectively commit ourselves to working towards the prosperous future.”

Sir, the only question I have is: Are we ready for these words? Is this country ready to listen to what the President said? If we have a prosperous future, I suggest that we begin by trusting ourselves as Zambians.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: We should begin to have pride in ourselves.

Hon. Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: The calamity of this country is that we completely have no pride. Anybody who comes into this country is a hero except a Zambian. If a Zambian owns anything, he is a thief. If a foreigner owns something, he has got it rightly. What is wrong with our psychology?

Interruptions

Mr Chimbaka: Bupina we mwaume we!

Mr Mwansa: I plead with all of us, especially as leaders, to begin to work on our people to change the mindset of this nation. We have a colonial mentality which we must get rid of if we are to move forward.

Ms Lundwe: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Time is betraying me, but I want to conclude by saying that this country belongs to each and every one of us. We must work towards its sustainability because there is no other country God has given us apart from this one.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: We must work for it and make sure no one takes it away from us.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

The Minister for Luapula Province (Dr Kawimbe): Mr Speaker, allow me to join all the hon. Members of this august House who have spoken before me in paying special tribute to our recently departed hon. Members for their contributions to our country and its people. May their souls rest in eternal peace.

Mr Speaker, let me also take this opportunity to congratulate the new hon. Member of Parliament for Chitambo Constituency, Dr Solomon Musonda, on his victory. In the same breath, allow me to congratulate all the hon. Members from MMD who worked tirelessly to make Hon. Dr Solomon Musonda’s journey from Chitambo to Manda Hill easy. To all of them I say, a job well done.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Hon. Member: Sichilima!

Dr Kawimbe: Mr Speaker, allow me to quote the second paragraph of page 78 of the President’s Speech:

“Mr Speaker, the nation expects us, as representatives of the people, to work across party lines for the good of the nation”.

Mr Speaker, the President’s wise advice reminds me of a popular prayer known as the serenity prayer which runs as follows, and I quote:

“Lord, grant us the serenity to accept the things we cannot change and the courage to change the things that we can and the wisdom to know the difference.”

Mr Speaker, in some areas of our lives, the Almighty God has given us the power to choose. We have a choice as to what Church to belong to. We have a choice on which school to go to or send our children. We have a choice as to which political party to belong to. We have a choice as to where we would like to live, whether it is in Kabwata or Avondale or whether it is in Mansa or Kalabo.

Mr Speaker, in certain areas of our lives, however, the Almighty God has already made the choices for us. God chose our parents for us; we had no choice of who were going to be our parents. God chose the tribe for us, we have had no choice of the tribe we belong to. God chose the country of birth for us; we had no choice of what country we would be born in.

Mr Speaker, Hon. Muntanga, who is not in the House at the moment, did not choose to be Tonga, but he was born Tonga. Hon. Sichilima did not choose to be Mambwe, but he was born Mambwe. I did not choose to be Zambian, neither did hon. Regina Musokotwane choose to be a Zambian, but we were born Zambians.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kawimbe: Even democratic choices may not be to our personal liking. The majority of the people of Roan Constituency chose Hon. Kambwili, who is not in the House at the moment, as their hon. Member of Parliament. We must have the serenity to accept this as a fact we cannot change. Similarly, we must have the serenity to accept the fact that the majority of the people of Zambia chose Mr Rupiah Bwezani Banda as the fourth President of the Republic of Zambia.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kawimbe: Mr Speaker, unless you are running your own business, you do not choose who you are going to work with. When I was appointed Provincial Minister for Luapula Province, I did not choose my driver, I was just informed that Mr X was going to be my driver, my secretary was going to be Madam Y and Madam Z was going to be my office orderly.

Mr Speaker, I would like to remind the hon. Members on your left that the people of Zambia do not particularly care about which political party builds their school, all they care about is the building of the school. The people of Zambia do not particularly care about which contractor sinks their borehole.

All they really care about is that they have easily accessible clean water. Fortunately, we do not have to be personal friends to construct roads and bridges for our people. We do not have to be personal friends to be able to build schools and clinics for our people. The bottom line that we often tend to forget is that, as hon. Members of Parliament, we are paid as employees of the taxpayers of Zambia. The work we are doing for the people of Zambia is not charity. Let us, therefore, earn our keep by working for the people of Zambia conscientiously and diligently.

Mr Speaker, the reason we exist, as Members of Parliament, is that of the most ordinary of our fellow citizens; the common man and woman. Let us just imagine, for once, what would happen if God decided to remove all his people from Zambia. There would be no need for Members of Parliament, Ministers and Deputy Ministers and Parliament itself. The only department of Government for which a need may still exist in Zambia, without people, would be the Zambia Wildlife Authority (ZAWA). This is why we must resolve that the welfare of the common man and woman will be our priority because it is because of him or her that we exist as a Parliament.

Mr Speaker, at times, as hon. Members of this august House, we lack the wisdom to know the difference between campaign politics and politics of development.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kawimbe: Just as we have a dry season and rainy season, there are two seasons in politics, namely the season of campaign politics and the season of politics of development. Campaign politics begin when the Electoral Commission of Zambia announces the days for accepting nomination papers, as well as the date when the votes will be cast. Once those votes are counted and the winners declared, that is the end of campaign politics and the beginning of the politics of development.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 Dr Kawimbe: Mr Speaker, we all have a duty to support and encourage our elected leaders during their term of office. The reason we must support our elected leaders is that irrespective of our political party affiliation, our development goals are the same.

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Dr Kawimbe: We all want more and better schools, more and better jobs, good roads, improved health care, cheaper and more abundant food, peace and security, law and order, clean and abundant water and so on and so forth. Come 2011, the season of campaign politics will return and then we shall all have the right to criticise the performance of our elected leaders and tell them that they have failed to deliver in spite of all our support, or praise them for a job well done and reward them by re-electing them back into office.

Mr Speaker, with the exception of hon. Members of Parliament who do not wish to re-contest their seats, come 2011, our re-election chances will be determined by the legacy that we will have built over the life of this Parliament. I would like the hon. Members on your left to have the serenity to accept the fact that if they allow the hon. Members on your right to fail in the performance of their Government duties, come 2011, members of their own political parties, who are outside this august House, will say to them that they have failed to deliver and they should give way to a new generation of leaders.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kawimbe: Therefore, Mr Speaker, even out of sheer self interest, the hon. Members on your left have to work with their counterparts on your right to reduce hunger, poverty, disease, unnecessary debt and ignorance among our long-suffering people. The question that we must also be asking ourselves is what legacy we have built during our term of office so far.

Mr Speaker, since I am not qualified to talk about Hon. Muntanga’s legacy, who is not in the House, I would like to talk about President Rupiah Bwezani Banda’s legacy in Luapula Province, since he took up office as Republican President ten months ago.

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Dr Kawimbe: Mr Speaker, I shall begin with inter-provincial roads. There are three major inter-provincial roads that link the Luapula Province to the rest of the country and these are, namely the Pedicle Road which connects the Luapula Province to the rest of the country through the Copperbelt Province.

The second is the Tuta Road which links Luapula Province to the rest of the country through the Central Province and the Mansa/Luwingu/Kasama Road which joins Luapula Province to the Northern Province.

Mr Speaker, when President Banda took over as our Head of State, the Pedicle Road was in a deplorable state. The travelling public used to take two to three hours during the dry season and up to five hours during the rainy season on this 70 km stretch. The Pedicle Road was so bad that commercial vehicles such as buses, trucks and tankers stopped using it and would rather take the Tuta Road which is longer. Using the recently acquired earth-moving equipment from China, the provincial administration has rehabilitated the Pedicle Road at a cost of K341 million.

Mr Speaker, this is in sharp contrast to the K3.7 billion paid to the last contractor who rehabilitated the Pedicle Road. The hon. Members of this august House who have travelled through the Pedicle Road recently, will confirm that the travelling time from Chembe to Mokambo is now forty-five minutes to one hour. Commercial vehicles are, again, using the Pedicle Road to and from the Luapula Province as it is shorter. This is President Rupiah Bwezani Banda’s legacy.

Hon. Government Members: hear, hear!

Dr Kawimbe: Mr Speaker, when President Banda took office last year in November, the 320 km Tuta Road that links Luapula Province to the rest of the country through the Central Province was so heavily potholed that the travelling time was four to five hours. I am happy to report that at a cost of K150 billion, the Tuta Road is being resurfaced. About 80 per cent of the potholes have been filled and the remaining 20 per cent will be history before the onset of the rains. The Serenje/Mansa stretch is now a comfortable three-hour journey.

Mr Speaker, the Mansa/Luwingu Road is the third major inter-provincial road. It connects Luapula to the Northern Province. The Mansa/ Luwingu Road is probably the worst road in the Luapula Province. On this road, pedestrians walk faster than motor vehicles can drive. People in Chipili Constituency, whom Hon. Davies Mwila represents, are basically cut off from the rest of the province and the country. I am happy to report that 12 km have already been rehabilitated. More importantly, the Ministry of Works and Supply, through the Road Development Agency (RDA), is in the process of releasing K300 million to ensure that Chipili Constituency and beyond is reconnected back to the rest of the province and country before the onset of the rains. This is yet another legacy of President Banda.

Mr Speaker, let me now turn my attention to the road network within the Luapula Province; the intra-provincial road network. The 260 km Mansa/Kashikishi Road is the major trunk road of the province. The Mansa/Kashikishi, Tuta and Chembe/Mansa roads are the biggest road infrastructure investment that our Government has put in the Luapula Province since independence. Unfortunately, when President Banda took office, the Mansa/Kashikishi Road was heavily potholed with what somebody dubbed as “commercial potholes” due to their large size. Using a contractor to rehabilitate this stretch of the road would have cost the Zambian taxpayer over K2 billion.

I am, however, happy to report that using our staff and provincial administration’s earth-moving equipment, we have buried all the potholes with a mixture of cement and gravel and a final cover of cumber which is the tarmark premise. This has been done at a cost of K450 million. The travelling time on the Mansa/Kashikishi road used to be four to five hours, but this has now been reduced to a comfortable three hours. This is yet another feather in President Banda’s hat.

Mr Speaker, the feeder roads have not been forgotten by President Banda. Funds have just been released to all the districts in our province. A total of K710 million has been disbursed.

Mr Speaker, small-scale farmers in the Luapula Province are all smiles because all the maize that they had supplied has been paid for in full and there is money waiting to buy more crops from small-scale farmers. By 17th September, 2009, a total of K14.7 billion had been disbursed to the various districts.

Mr Speaker, the people of Luapula are grateful for the creation of the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries. His Excellency the President has authorised a delegation to travel to Malawi to learn from the experiences of our brothers and sisters there who, a few years ago, saw their fish stocks in Lake Malawi depleted.

Mr Speaker, today, Malawi is exporting US$20 million worth of fish every year to Europe after restocking Lake Malawi. At the moment, fourteen boats and boat engines have arrived in Mansa for deployment on Lake Mweru for the sustainable management of our fish resources. The purchase of these boats and engines has been made possible with the help of the Government of Finland.

In Luapula Province, we have taken our hearts off as we salute the efforts of President Banda for supporting this important industry.

Mr Speaker, President Banda has not forgotten the importance of involving local communities in the co-management of our fishery resources. Seventy-four village management committees have been formed and gazetted. The amended Fisheries Act has given the powers of arrest to the village management committee members as well as 50 per cent of the revenue from the fish licensing fees. This programme will be extended to Lake Bangweulu in due course.

Mr Speaker, the people of Luapula are overjoyed over the Samfya and Milenge district hospitals which are under construction. The people are also very grateful to President Banda for the four new high schools under construction, in Milenge, Chiengi, Musonda Falls and Lukwesa.

It is against this background that the people of Luapula Province showered His Excellency the President, Mr Rupiah Bwezani Banda, with gifts that included eight cows, forty-two sheep and goats when he graced the Mutomboko Ceremony earlier this year.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr. Kawimbe: Mr Speaker, to conclude, allow me to echo the words of His Excellency the President, Mr Rupiah Bwezani Banda, that the nation expects us, as representatives of the people, to work across party lines for the good of the nation. Let the serenity prayer be our daily prayer that the Lord may grant us serenity to accept the things we cannot change, the courage to change the things that we can and the wisdom to know the difference.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

__________

MOTION

ADJOURNMENT

The Minister of Defence (Dr Mwansa): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

Question put and agreed to.

__________

The House adjourned at 1858 hours until 1430 hours on Thursday, 1st October, 2009.