DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE FOURTH SESSION OF THE TENTH ASSEMBLY

Friday, 16th October, 2009

The House met at 0900 hours

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

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BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice (Mr Kunda, SC.): Mr Speaker, I rise to give some idea of the Business the House will consider next week.

On Tuesday, 20th October, 2009, the Business of the House will commence with Questions, if there will be any. This will be followed by Presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. The House will then consider the Second Reading Stage of the Supreme Court and High Court Number of Judges (Amendment) Bill, (N.A.B. 28, 2009). Thereafter, the House will continue with general policy debate on the Motion of Supply on the Estimates of Revenue and Expenditure for 2010.

Sir, on Wednesday, 21st October, 2009, the Business of the House will begin with Questions, if there will be any. This will be followed by Presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. Thereafter, the House will consider Private Members’ Motions, if there will be any. The House will then continue with the debate on the Motion of Supply.

On Thursday, 22nd October, 2009, the Business of the House will start with Questions, if there will be any. This will be followed by Presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. Thereafter, the House will continue with the debate on the Motion of Supply.

Mr Speaker, on Friday, 23rd October, 2009 the Business of the House will begin with His Honour the Vice-President’s Question Time. This will then be followed by Questions for Oral Answer, if there will be any. This will be followed by Presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. Thereafter, the House will continue with the debate on the Motion of Supply.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Dr Katema: Nga swearing in?

Mr Speaker: Before we proceed with the Business of the House on the Order Paper, I would like to know why the Cabinet Benches are empty.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chota: They are mourning!

Dr Katema: Chililo!

Mr Speaker: Unless my eyesight is failing me, but I do not think it does, all I see are three or four Cabinet Ministers. Where are the rest?

Hon. Opposition Members: They are mourning, Sir!

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Alright, there are two more there and that makes it five, but the Cabinet is more than five. Where are Members of the Cabinet?

Interjections

Mr Muntanga: Vice-President, where are you?

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order!

Where are the Cabinet Ministers?

Without pre-empting, this is what may happen if the Cabinet is drawn outside the House. That is what you would see. The Cabinet will not be answerable to this House when that happens. Now, the Cabinet is collectively answerable to this House. Where are the rest of the Cabinet Members? The deputies are also missing.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Unless the House knows, this is a transition period …

Mr Malama: They did not know!

Mr D. Mwila: Kuya bebele!

Mr Speaker: … when everybody must be here.

Mr Konga entered the Assembly Chamber.

Mr Speaker: Now, we have one additional Member of the Cabinet who has just arrived at 0906 hours.

Ms Cifire entered the Assembly Chamber.

Mr Speaker: A deputy is walking in still at 0906 hours …

Laughter

Mr Mufalali entered the Assembly Chamber.

Hon. Opposition Members: Another Deputy.

Mr Speaker: … and so on and so forth.

Laughter

Mr Malama: Long live the Chair!

Mr Speaker: There is an Act of Parliament, that is the Ministerial and Parliamentary Code of Conduct Act which clearly says the Business of this House takes precedence over everything else when the House is meeting. It was passed by this House.

The older Members will further recall that by arrangement between the Legislature and Executive, it was agreed that this House, except on Fridays, will be meeting only in the afternoons from Tuesday to Thursday to enable Members of the Cabinet conduct business in the office in the mornings, but that does not seem to work at the moment.

I call on His Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Justice, who is Leader of Government Business in the House, to sort this matter out.

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HIS HONOUR THE VICE-PRESIDENT’S QUESTION TIME

Mr Mwiimbu (Monze): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Justice the current policy pertaining to issues of celebrations in the event that an individual, organisation or personality is victorious or is celebrating a marriage. I am referring to instances where the Zambia National Team wins a game. Will it be an offence for members of the public to honk because they have won a football match? Will it now be an offence for those who are in a marriage procession not to honk because they are celebrating that particular marriage? Would it also be an offence to honk because the UPND/PF Pact has won the Kasama By-elections?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker …

Mr Chota: Four zero!

Mr Speaker: Order!

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, honking, from the way we understand it, to disrupt traffic on the road, is a very serious offence because it can lead to accidents.

Mr D. Mwila: Question!

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Therefore, the police will not allow the type of honking which is malicious and intended to disrupt traffic on the roads.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: We will not allow anarchy …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: … in this country and, therefore, the police, in interpreting the law, will take into account the motives behind those who may be honking.

Mr Lubinda: We shall honk today.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: That is all I can say about this.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

A question which was put has been answered.

Mr Milupi (Luena): Mr Speaker, I would like to know what has happened to the petition to the President on account of the people of Sichifulo. A promise was made that this was going to be looked into. In view of the fact that the rains are upon us, would His Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Education inform this House what the situation is. When are we going to have a final answer with regard to the problem of Sichifulo?

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, I can confirm that we are reacting to that situation and emergency measures have been put in place, taking into account the interests of our people. We are looking into the issues of resettlement of these people, but a comprehensive statement will be issued in due course on what our findings are. The measures we are taking are to ensure that the people’s interests are taken into account and that they are properly settled in their own country, Zambia.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Scott (Lusaka Central): Mr Speaker, to follow up on an earlier question, are the people currently blowing their car horns in a certain town in the north of Zambia in celebration of the walloping that was delivered in an election yesterday committing an offence? If so, have you ordered the authorities to arrest them?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Lubinda: Ni vimasilu!

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, people are entitled to celebrate …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Vice President and Minister of Justice: … for retaining their old seat.

Interruptions

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: They can celebrate, but what we know is that under the chilingalinga arrangement, the head which was working in Kasama has carried the day. The other head was working in Kasiya ward in Livingstone and so they are working separately.

Interruptions

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: One head is working in the Southern Province while the other is working in a different direction so there is no pact, as such, to talk about …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

I cannot hear what His Honour the Vice-President is saying. If you do not want to ask questions, remain quiet in your seats. If you ask a question and the answer is given, listen to the answer because, at least, I would like to listen to that answer. This is not a tavern, but the National Assembly of the Republic of Zambia which is an honourable House. I am sorry that the clock has been stopped because in a case such as this one, it is the House itself consuming the time and not the presiding officer.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, if honking, like I said, is done in accordance with the law, it is allowed, but where it is done in a criminal manner, the police will move in.

Laughter

Mrs Musokotwane (Katombola): Mr Speaker, the Southern Province has one senior chief. What is the Government doing to inform the other chiefs who are referring to themselves as senior chiefs and those whom the Government is calling senior chiefs that they are not senior chiefs and that there is only one senior chief, Mweemba, if the Government did not know.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, on the recognition of chiefs, there are proper legal documents issued and that is the basis on which we should proceed as to who is a senior chief and who is just an ordinary chief. The President recognises those who are supposed to be senior chiefs and this has some historical background. We know those who are senior chiefs and the policy has not changed.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Chisanga (Mkushi South): Mr Speaker, now that this working Government has worked on the road in the Nansanga Farming Block, including the construction of dams and electrifying the place, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President when the farming block will be opened to the public.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, on this side of the House, we talk about developmental issues and it is encouraging that our hon. Members of Parliament are asking such questions.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, the Nansanga Farming Block is in the budget so that as we embark on diversification, we can boost food production. We need to put up bridges and we have budgeted for this, as the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning announced. As soon as all the necessary infrastructure has been put up and the place is ready, it will be demarcated and allocations will be done so that we can increase food production. We are a working Government and this is clear from the budget and President’s Speech. We are on the ground making roads, dams and bridges.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Mr Speaker, most civil societies, non-governmental organisations (NGOs) and political parties are registered under Chapter 119 of the Societies Act of the Laws of Zambia. Let me quote that before I ask my question. Section 13(1) states as follows:

“The Minister may, in his discretion, cancel, at any time, the registration of any society if he is satisfied that it is expedient to do so on grounds that the interest of peace, welfare or good order will, in his opinion, be likely to suffer prejudice by reason of the continued registration of such society”.

In view of that quotation, what is the Government doing about civil society organisations that want to engage in illegal and unconstitutional acts such as honking and other ...

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Dr Machungwa: … illegal activities with the sole purpose of imposing their will on constitutional office holders …

Mr Sejani: Nothing!

Dr Machungwa: … such as the Director of Public Prosecutions (DPP)? What is the Government planning to do about that?

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sejani: Nothing!

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: I notice that the hon. Member for Mapatizya is now behaving like the Vice-President from the way he keeps saying, “nothing, nothing”. I wonder when he became such.

Laughter

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, Hon. Machungwa is a former Minister of Home Affairs and he has given critical information to the nation on what is provided for in the law. Indeed, as a Government, we are not sitting idly, but are investigating activities which may endanger the security of the State and that law is still in effect. The NGO Bill has not been operationalised yet, but that law is still in effect.

Mr Speaker, those who may be promoting illegal protests should know that such activities lead to the occurrence of undesirable things. People may lose property and lives may be lost. So hon. Members, if you are linked to such serious crime, it will change the whole of your life there and then, because you will start appearing in court perpetually and the consequences are very serious. There are times when some of the NGOs or political party leaders incite others to demonstrate while they remain in the comfort of their houses and vehicles. Those who are duped into joining these demonstrations are the ones, at the end of the day, who will be arrested and face the consequences of their actions.

Hon. Government Member: Mumbi Phiri.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: At the end of the day, they will develop high blood pressure when they are arrested.

Laughter

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, let us avoid anarchy in this country. Therefore, all NGOs and political parties, which are engaging in, illegal activities that are treasonable,  …

Interruptions

The Vice-President: … must know that the law is still in effect and that they will be dealt with accordingly by the police.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya (Mpika Central): Mr Speaker, it is a well-known fact to all of us in Zambia, including our friends outside Zambia, that soccer is our number one sport. However, for the past seventeen years, the standards of soccer have been on the down turn, despite the Government pumping in billions of kwacha. What is the Government’s position regarding the administration of the sport?

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, that is a very important question. I know that when the Zambian team wins a game, people feel good. I was at a football match recently and we were so humiliated when we lost. It was a very unpleasant atmosphere. Football is very important to this nation. Having played football before, …

Laughter

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: … I know how important the sport is and how it boosts the morale of the nation. To address the declining football standards, there is a need for us to go back to the drawing board so that we can look holistically at how we are going to improve the standards of the sport.

I remember the days when we used to have three national teams. We used to have teams A, B and C, which all could rise to the occasion, depending on the circumstances. So it is up to the Football Association of Zambia and National Sports Council of Zambia, Ministry of Sport, Youth and Child Development and the Government to start looking at ways and means of reclaiming our lost football glory.

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Speaker, most of us in this House are Members of the National Constitution Conference (NCC). As we place a law that will help us govern this country, we are agreed at the NCC that traditional chiefs should not participate in active politics.

I would like find out from the Vice-President and Minister of Justice when this Government will stop manipulating traditional chiefs each time there are political campaigns, as the case has been in the recent by-elections in Kasama and Livingstone, where two known chiefs were actively campaigning for the MMD. To their surprise, their subjects refused to follow the chiefs’ campaigns.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, chiefs enjoy their constitutional right to freedom of expression and of course, they can give views on a political issue. In fact, they have the House of Chiefs where they discuss national issues. Some of them make statements supporting the Opposition which we have read about. Others even campaign for the Opposition.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, what is important is that they should not participate in active politics. Participating in active politics is a totally different thing from merely giving a viewpoint on a matter of public interest. Chiefs can give their viewpoints on matters of public interest because it is within their constitutional rights to do so.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Kapata (Mandevu): Mr Speaker, for once, I think let me draw His Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Justice’s attention to another question. I just want to find out what the Government’s package for small-scale miners is compared to the one we have in agriculture for fertiliser support. What do you have for small-scale miners?

The Vice President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, under the Mines and Minerals and the Zambia Development Agency Acts, there are some incentives which are available to small-scale miners and they can also apply for empowerment funds under the Citizen’s Economic Empowerment Fund. We have provided all these initiatives so that we can support growing businesses, including small-scale mining which is very important for this country. If you look at the Mines and Minerals Act, there are certain licences just reserved for Zambians.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chanda (Kankoyo): Sir, every year, this country experiences cholera outbreaks. I would like to find out what preparations have been made this year to avert a nationwide outbreak of this disease.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, every year, we have contingence plans to deal with matters of that nature. We have running programmes such as the Keep Zambia Clean and Healthy Campaign which is very much alive. I would like to encourage hon. Members of Parliament to participate in programmes such as this one in their constituencies. We have vehicles in all the constituencies which can be used to attend to matters of this nature through the district councils and various structures under the Ministry of Health. This is the time to prepare ourselves in the event that we get a cholera outbreak.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr C. K. B. Banda, SC. (Chasefu): Mr Speaker, the people of Lundazi District, particularly those of Chasefu, whom I am privileged to represent, and those from Chama south and north, are anxious to have a shorter route opened between Chama, Lundazi and Chinsali in the Northern Province through Matumbo. To this effect, a road, on the Chama side, has already been graded up to the Luangwa Bridge.

I would like to know when this seemingly hardworking Government will construct a bridge across the Luangwa River at Matumbo to link Chama to the Northern Province thereby giving the people we represent the shortest route to the Copperbelt.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, all I can say is that I am grateful for that information which I have taken note of. Indeed, from what the hon. Member has said, that is a very important route, which we should look into, if we are to open up the country to development.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member for …

Reverend Sampa-Bredt: Chawama.

Mr Speaker: … Dundumwezi.

Laughter

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Speaker, in view of the answer His Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Justice gave on the issue of the people of Sichifulo, could he confirm to this House that the people of Chief Kaingu have also been displaced and that they will be given an alternative place for them to settle in.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, each case is looked at on its own merits. There are certain areas which we have to protect such as forests and game management areas so that we do not disturb the ecological balance in those areas as well as wildlife. In fact, the resettlement programme falls under the Office of the Vice-President and therefore, when we are putting together a resettlement programme, we take into account various factors.

The case, which the hon. Member is talking about, can only be looked at within the provided legal framework and the factors, which I have talked about, so that we do not contribute to global warming by destroying our forests and wildlife. Destroying our forests and wildlife is also going to affect tourism because those are the resources which we depend on for this sector to thrive. So resettlements must only be started in accordance with the law and taking into account all these factors.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President what measures the Government has effected to ensure that those who leave the Civil Service do not continue to hold on to the Government’s property such as vehicles. I would like to give an example of a former member of staff in the Office of the Vice-President who is still driving a Government vehicle despite having been suspended a few years ago.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, if the hon. Member can give me the full details, I can look into the matter properly other than him just making allegations. We have to investigate the case so that we establish the facts and circumstances under which that situation is happening and, of course, whether what the hon. Member is saying is true or not.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Ngoma (Sinda): Mr Speaker, in Katete District, there are farmers who have not been paid their money by the Food Reserve Agency (FRA). The maize was bought from them as late as June. When is the Government going to ensure that these farmers are paid by FRA so they can prepare adequately for the next farming season?

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, what I know is that FRA has been quite efficient. It has been paying for the maize which it has been purchasing. Therefore, if there are shortcomings in the performance of FRA, as in this particular case, we should be informed so that our farmers in Katete can also benefit from some of our sound policies in terms of buying produce after the bumper harvest which we achieved in the last farming season. God willing and with a good climate, we may achieve another good harvest next season because we have put in place a very good fertiliser and seed support programme.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Ntundu (Gwembe): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President how much money the Government has authorised controlling officers to release to districts for the road equipment that has been procured.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, we budgeted for K2 billion per province. That money is supposed to be handled by the controlling officers at the provincial level so that all districts benefit equitably. Of course, we realise that the K2 billion is not enough because there is need to pay allowances, purchase fuel and so on and so forth. This is why we are proposing to increase that sum in the next National Budget so that we can grade the feeder roads throughout all our provinces.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Colonel Chanda (Kanyama): Mr Speaker, I would like to learn from His Honour the Vice-President the Government’s policy on the three months maternity leave vis-à-vis the current HIV/AIDS infection rate in the country and taking into account the six months mandatory breastfeeding period. Is the Government considering extending the three months maternity leave to six months for breastfeeding mothers?

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, under the current law, it is three months which is provided for maternity leave and there are no plans, at the moment, to change it to six months.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Reverend Sampa-Bredt (Chawama): Mr Speaker, during the rainy season, most people in my constituency …

The Vice-President’s Question Time ran out.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: I appreciate that spirited effort.

___________

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

CONSTRUCTION OF HOUSES FOR POLICE OFFICERS IN CHILILABOMBWE

136. Mrs Banda (Chililabombwe) asked the Minister of Home Affairs:

(a) when more houses would be built for police officers in Chililabombwe Parliamentary Constituency;

(b) when the Chililabombwe Main Police Station would be rehabilitated; and

(c) when a prison would be built in Chililabombwe.

The Deputy Minister of Home Affairs (Mr Phiri): Mr Speaker, under the Poverty Reduction Programme (PRP), the Government has embarked on constructing housing units for police officers. Currently, the first phase of the project is underway whereby most housing units have been completed while some are nearing completion. The houses are in the following towns:

 Town  No. of Houses

Kasama   60
Chipata  92
Livingstone  68
Ndola    280

The Ministry of Home Affairs is cognisant of the fact that most police infrastructure such as police stations, are in a state of disrepair. As such, the ministry has embarked on giving this infrastructure a facelift. However, due to budgetary constraints and other competing needs, the rehabilitation works are undertaken in phases as and when funds are made available.  In addition, the ministry is in the process of developing an infrastructure development action plan aimed at systematically rehabilitating and constructing police infrastructure.

Mr Speaker, I remain hopeful that the Chililabombwe Police Station will definitely benefit from such rehabilitation programmes in ensuing phases.

The Ministry of Home Affairs has plans to upgrade and build new prisons countrywide. At the moment, Chililabombwe District is still using facilities at the Chingola Prisons which are inadequate. In the near future, Chililabombwe will be considered for a new prison.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Banda: Mr Speaker, does the hon. Minister know that the relatives of those remanded in Chingola find it very difficult to visit their relatives because of the distance?

Mr Phiri: Mr Speaker, we are aware and mindful of the fact that in the near future, as indicated, Chililabombwe will have a new prison.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister conceded that most of the infrastructure in police stations is in a state of disrepair. In the Southern Province, he mentioned that in Livingstone, sixty-eight houses are under construction. Also, in the Southern Province, the Southern Water and Sewerage Company has, for two months, shut water supply to all police camps. What is this Government doing to ensure that water supply is restored, considering that within a week, we are going to be in the rainy season and we will then be under threat by epidemics such as cholera, dysentery and typhoid?

Mr Phiri: Mr Speaker, we have engaged water utility companies just like we have engaged companies such as the Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (ZESCO). I want to assure you that we are liquidating the debt. We have committed ourselves to paying the outstanding debt. I can confirm to you that, very shortly, the water utility companies will be reconnecting water supply to the affected police stations.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Msichili (Kabushi): Mr Speaker, we appreciate that the Government is building new houses, however, I would like to know the programmes the Government has implemented to ensure that they maintain the old housing units. I have in mind police houses in Mongu which are in a very bad state.

Mr Phiri: Mr Speaker, as I indicated in my answer, we have, indeed, a challenge that most of the police infrastructure is dilapidated. However, while looking at the dilapidated infrastructure, we are also constructing police houses. We have put aside some money in next year’s Budget for the rehabilitation programme as well as constructing new police houses.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Lubinda (Kabwata): Mr Speaker, while addressing the Superior Officers’ Gala on 12th January, 2008, the late President Levy Patrick Mwanawasa, SC, promised the Zambian people that he would put in place a police buildings’ brigade to ensure that the construction of police accommodation, prisons and the rehabilitation of staff facilities were conducted speedily and without having to rely on contractors. Would the hon. Minister update this House on the establishment of that brigade and kindly inform this House why the water and sewerage reticulation system at the very important Chilenje Police Station has not been attended to even after many pleas from the hon. Member of Parliament to his ministry?

Mr Phiri: Mr Speaker, we are putting together a police buildings’ brigade which should be looking at the rehabilitation and construction of police houses. We realise that it is very important for us as opposed to just depending on contractors. We must have a team that should be looking at issues of rehabilitation within the Police Service. For instance, the Zambia National Service (ZNS) has a brigade which is doing quite well. We want to replicate that in the Police Service. I can confirm to you that before long, particularly in the next budget, we should confirm to you that it is in place.

With regard to the second question on Chilenje, this is a matter that is receiving very active attention and, before long, we will come back to you. The problem, obviously, has been that of financing, but it is a matter we are fully aware of and it is receiving active attention.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwenya (Nkana): Mr Speaker, noting that the hon. Minister of Home Affairs has opened up the question with regard to the construction of police house in all areas, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister when they intend to construct houses for police officers in Kitwe, especially that most of the officers in these police camps are now squatting in what used to be toilets in the Kitwe Central and Mindolo Police camps where there are no toilets and water.

Mr Phiri: Mr Speaker, clearly, our answer has indicated that we are constructing police houses in phases. The good thing, which must be appreciated, is that this year alone, we have constructed a number of houses for police officers. This has not happened in a long time. In the 2010 Budget, K39 to K40 billion has been allocated for the programme of constructing houses for the police. I cannot confirm that we will go to Kitwe to construct houses, but that the programme of constructing houses for the police will continue and will be extended to other areas.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Phiri (Munali): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what is going to happen to some houses that were constructed but have not been completed. I have in mind houses in the Chelstone Police Camp where police officers live. Have you abandoned this programme in preference to the new houses? People are living under bad conditions because the construction of the houses has not yet been completed.

Mr Phiri: Mr Speaker, I have personally gone there and I agree with you. We will be looking at that programme next year. We cannot afford to neglect the Chelstone Police Camp.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Musokotwane (Katombola): Mr Speaker, the ministry budgets for electricity and water bills as well as rentals every month. Why do they wait until the bills have accumulated to millions of kwacha and then panic to look for money to pay bills and rentals when this can be done monthly? What happens with the money that is budgeted for?

Mr Phiri: Mr Speaker, if you look at the 2009 Budget, we separated utilities. Previously, we did not. The problem has now been resolved and we will allocate money on an activity-based budget. I do not see any reason we should fail to pay bills when we will have allocated specific amounts to the utilities. Previously, the budgeting was a little skewed, but we have now resolved that problem. In the meantime, we are grappling with dismantling the existing debt.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Katema (Chingola): Mr Speaker, I did not hear the hon. Minister mentioning any time frame apart from the intention to only build the facilities. Are there any plans for this in the Fifth National Development Plan?

Mr Phiri: Mr Speaker, I talked about the phased approach and given the limited resources, it would be very difficult for me to categorically say, on the Floor of this House, when we are moving into Chililabombwe. What should give us hope, though, is that we have a programme of constructing police houses as well as prisons.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Kapata (Mandevu): Mr Speaker, speaking from experience, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether it is the ministry’s policy to keep the cells, especially those at the Lusaka Central Police Station, …

Interruptions

Mrs Kapata: …very dirty with faecal matter, considering that people who occupy the cells have not yet been convicted. They will be subjected to such deplorable conditions.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice (Mr Kunda, SC.): Mr Speaker, Zambia is a member of the Human Rights Council of the United Nations and so we should look after facilities such as cells so that when anybody is arrested, regardless of his or her status, at least, they are not subjected to inhuman treatment. We should continue to look after police cells well by keeping them clean. That is why money should be provided for the Zambia Police, Prisons Service and reformatories.

Thank you, Sir.

Mr Chanda (Kankoyo): Mr Speaker, I recognise the fact that the Government is struggling to build houses in police camps. I would like to find out what the Government has done at the Butondo Police Station which had two or three houses damaged by the mining operations?

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Mr Speaker, I think the hon. Member can put that as a new question so that we give a well-informed answer about Butondo Police Station.

Thank you, Sir.

CONSTRUCTION OF TEACHERS’ HOUSES IN KAWAMBWA

137. Mrs Chitika-Molobeka (Kawambwa) asked the Minister of Education when the Government would construct teachers’ houses at the following schools in Kawambwa Parliamentary Constituency:

(i) Tea Estate Basic;

(ii) Tea Estate High;

(iii) Shikalaba Basic;

(iv) Lusambo Basic; and

(v) Ntulo Basic.

The Minister of Communications and Transport (Professor Lungwangwa) on behalf of The Minister of Education (Ms Siliya) : Mr Speaker, there are no immediate plans to construct teachers’ houses at the stated schools in Kawambwa Parliamentary Constituency. However, the Government has planned to build four teachers’ houses at a cost of K428.6 million at the following schools:

(i) Kawambwa Central Basic, one house;

(ii) Chisembe Basic, one house; and

(iii) Bulendo Basic, two houses.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Chitika-Molobeka: Mr Speaker, teachers are critical and the morale of teachers in Kawambwa, at the moment, is very low. How does the hon. Minister expect the teachers to be sympathetic with the Government when they are living in deplorable conditions?

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, the Government is very concerned about the conditions under which teachers work. As such, a lot of attention is given by providing incentives such as accommodation so that teachers are motivated to be in the schools they are operating from. It is in this regard that we have embarked upon the programme to construct teachers’ houses as evidenced by what is in the operational plan for 2009 where 280 teachers’ houses are currently constructed countrywide.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Simuusa (Nchanga): Mr Speaker, after the four houses have been built in Kawambwa and according to the plan he has, what, in terms of percentage, will be the remaining houses that have to be built for all of us to be satisfied as a nation?

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, clearly, if the hon. Member would like a more comprehensive statistical analysis of the teacher housing requirement, he can do that by giving us a question and we will be able to compile, statistically, the teacher housing requirement and the shortfall that is in place at the moment. However, I do not have the statistics at the moment with me here.

I thank you, Sir.

MOTION

BUDGET 2010

(Debate resumed)

Mr Muntanga (Kalomo): Mr Speaker, it took time for me to debate the motion moved by the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning because I was trying hard to understand it. It was not until yesterday, when my friend, the hon. Member for Mapatizya, got me excited when he told me that he was very happy because it was his birthday, that I also got happy and decided to move my birthday forward to today.

Laughter

Mr Muntanga: I have also asked all our United Party for National Development/ Patriotic Front (UPND/PF) Pact members to move their birthdays forward …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: … so that we are not encumbered with birthdays as we move into Solwezi.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga:  Mr Speaker, I listened to the hon. Minister complain about my moving out of the Chamber during the presentation of the budget when I needed to know that he had increased the budget to farmers. However, he did not know that I moved out because I felt disgusted that the budget had not even met 10 per cent of the budget, which is the threshold of the Southern African Development Community (SADC) Agreement, to which this Government is a signatory.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, even though the hon. Minister said he had increased the budget by K40 billion, the sector has only got 6.8 per cent of the total budget which is 0.5 per cent lower than last year. Therefore, compared to last year, he has actually lowered the budget for the agriculture sector.

Mr Speaker, one of my brothers from one of the constituencies in the Western Province said that I was happy to see the cover of the Budget Speech. Indeed, I looked at the cover and was happy to see a picture showing a Centre Pivot for irrigation. I thought that I would find, inside the Budget Speech, something about irrigation. Alas, there was nothing. I wondered what sort of irrigation the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning was depicting on the cover, where he had copied it from and if this irrigation had come from the pocket.

Mr Speaker, we have talked about irrigation to support small-scale farmers, but nothing has come up. Once again, I have noticed that despite the hon. Minister mentioning support to small-scale farmers, I have not seen one thing that substantiates this.

Mr Speaker, with that background, I really wondered what I was going to say as I stood on the Floor of this House. However, because it is my birthday, I do not need to attack the Government. I must be happy, especially with what has happened in Kasama. We should all be happy.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Mr Muntanga:  Therefore, I realised that what I needed to do was advise the Government as we are in this boat together. We have to survive. These people driving this boat might …

Hon. Government Member: Which boat?

Mr Muntanga: Oh!

They do not like the term “boat”. In that case, we are in this ship together. In vernacular we call it “bwato”.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: In that light, both the hon. Ministers of Agriculture and Co-operatives and Livestock and Fisheries Development, respectively are good friends of mine.

Sir, we have reduced the budget to the Fertiliser Support Programme (FSP) by K5 billion and, therefore, there is no need to further reduce the land to be supported to half a hectare instead of one.

Mr Speaker, the original plan of this programme was to support farmers with one hectare, but now the Government has decided to support them with half hectares. What are we doing? Surely, we should not treat farmers like small children who can be appeased with small sweets. How do you reduce the allocation to K430 billion when farmers are complaining that they need more funding and say that since all the farmers want to be supported, they have to share by taking support for half a hectare each instead of one? 

The policy of mass production was partly enforced by the United National Independence Party (UNIP), but it never made any person rise to middle class income. It did not. On the contrary, it restricted people to being peasant farmers. This Government is known to say that it wants to raise the whole country to middle class income, but how can it do this?

Mr Speaker, since we are in this together, I suggest that we raise the household scheme from K10 billion to K100 billion to cater for all the small-scale farmers. We should raise this money through the co-operative movement and allow it to be a revolving fund. The farmers will gladly borrow than be subjected to support for half a hectare. We do not have an agriculture financing institution, but we can do it with these funds through the co-operative federation. We can support farmers that way.

My genuine advice to the Government is that we need to do the correct thing. We do not need to be pushed every time and only take corrective action afterwards. I had a lengthy discussion with the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives over this matter. I believe he will take note that it is important that we understand this.

Mr Speaker, we have, again, budgeted K100 billion for the Food Reserve Agency (FRA) like we did in the last budget. However, this year, we have borrowed an extra K300 billion to give to FRA, which means that we needed K400 billion in the first place. Why should we only make certain decisions when we have problems?

Mr Speaker, I know that the resource envelope that my friend talked about, yesterday, needs to be improved. However, when the situation is such that our power is threatened, money is found. For example, when miners were not paid and there were threats at the Luanshya Mine, money was found. 

Mr Speaker, when America realised that its power was threatened as many companies and banks were going under and people would lose their jobs, it was compelled to find money to bail out the banks and companies.

Mr Speaker, if people went on the streets, tomorrow, and honked because they needed their Government to do something, money would be found. That is why I am saying that the willpower to find the money must be there.

Mr Speaker, I know the farmers are not organised well enough to rise and come up with real threats of overthrowing or upsetting governance. As such, it is the easiest and endangered group of people.

My appeal, therefore, for once, is that let us come up with a budget that will help the farmers. It is shocking that farmers are suffering because they cannot find a market for their maize and, as a result, they stand by the roadside to sell it. People are, really, suffering to find a market for their maize.
 
Mr Speaker, yes, FRA has been paid, but I know that some farmers, who sold their maize to FRA in Kalomo, two weeks ago, have not been paid. I have just been told, today, that they are still waiting for their money.

I am saying that the budget for FRA should be increased. The reason we face problems is that we do not plan in advance on how much food reserves we need and for how long. Hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, we need to plan to stock maize for a period of between three or six months as this will help us to budget properly. It is very expensive to hoard maize.

Mr Speaker, let me comment on the issue of livestock. Indeed, the creation of the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development was a good idea, but I would like to appeal to the hon. Minister that, since we are sailing together in this boat, he has to understand that the creation of disease free zones in the Central and Lusaka provinces is not achievable in the short-term as it is a long-term and expensive project.

In any case, we have failed to maintain a simple single cordon line, which runs from the Southern Province to Mwinilunga, and this particular disease free zone needs a lot of wire for fencing. Firstly, the wire that secludes the disease free zone has to be cleared before placing the yellow fence that acts as the seemingly protective buffer zone. Thereafter, there is a need to have a third line which is a red zone that is a diseased area. However, we do not have the funds and manpower to achieve this and, like I said, we cannot even manage a mere single cordon line.

Mr Speaker, I would like to make a proposal and I hope that the Government will consider it. Let us look outside the resource envelope and look at expenses from another perspective by considering what is known as commodity-based trade. This kind of trade looks at individual farms in specific areas. For example, not the whole of the Southern Province was affected by the foot and mouth disease as some areas where free of it. Therefore, the duty of the farmer in areas that were not diseased would be to fence them off.

I will give you an example of the Alex Hill Farm in Kalomo. The owner of this farm has fenced the whole area his farm occupies and put foot paths at every entry point. He has also applied all the rules that are required to maintain a disease free area on that farm. With those applications, beef can be exported from that particular farm.

Therefore, given that scenario, it is possible to export beef from any farm in the country as long as the farmers are given regulations to adhere to. As such, the money that has been provided in the budget would be enough to pay veterinary officers to enforce laws and carry out inspections to ensure that regulations are applied. This way, the Government would not need to take up the task of fencing as this would be done by individual farmers. Perhaps, what could be done to encourage fencing is to sell fencing material at a cheaper price to farmers.

Mr Mwiimbu: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: If the hon. Minister insists on going ahead with the creation of disease free zones in the Central Province, he will not succeed because, as I said, this is a long- term and very expensive venture. Commodity-based trade is internationally acceptable and taking it up would aid disease control.

We have been talking about the low production of agricultural product because the seed supply to farmers is not on course. The maize that is supposed to be planted is given to the farmers in January. How can seed be planted in January when the rainy season has already begun? For example, at the moment, in October, farmers need the seed to start planting, but it has not yet been delivered to the provinces. How will farmers start planting? As a result, the small-scale farmers will be forced to use recycled seed whose production is very low. Therefore, we urge the Government to support every single farmer.

Mr Speaker, having said so much on agriculture, I hope that the K1.6 billion that has been reserved for outstanding road works will be used for that purpose because we need those roads to be completed.

The 19 per cent which has been provided in the budget for education is more than the 15 per cent SADC Protocol requirement. As such, we would like to see that all schools benefit from that provision. I listened carefully when the Government said that it was concerned about the teachers’ houses, but I also want it to be concerned about the teachers who are not accommodated. The housing allowance for teachers must be paid on time. There is no need for teachers to complain about something that is too obvious. The teachers must be paid their housing allowance on time and I can see that the hon. Minister agrees with me. Teachers have been complaining about not being paid their housing allowance in areas such as Kanchele and Chifusa, in my constituency.

Sir, even the teachers in towns who have not been accommodated are not being paid their housing allowances. The Government appreciates the fact that there is a problem.

The hon. Minister of Home Affairs talked about building accommodation for police officers. Please, come to Kalomo and see the state of houses for police officers. I came here with …

Interruptions

Mr Muntanga: I do not plead.

Mr Speaker, I asked Hon. Shikapwasha, when he was hon. Minister of Home Affairs, to release K70 million for the rehabilitation of the sewage system at the Kalomo Police Station, but nothing was done. Faecal matter is seen all over the place. This is why I find it difficult to praise you, hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, because although it is not your job to see to it that certain things are done, your friends who should support you, fail you. I would like to praise you, but I have difficulty doing that because if I did and met the people who have not been paid for selling maize to the Government and those who are sleeping on empty stomachs, they would kill me as they would wonder why I would praise people who are making them suffer.

Mr Speaker, at the moment, I know that, in this House, we have coined a lot of words such as chilingalinga which when it bites, the wound cannot be healed at all. We have also coined words like kachihunya, the insect which eats up itself. Now, I have realised that there are so many bachihunyas in the House.

Laughter

Mr Muntanga: I urge those who are eating themselves not to do so because they will die slow and painful deaths. My fellow leaders, let us listen because if you do not, you will end up having election results such as the one in Kasama, Livingstone and Itezhi-tezhi.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: In fact, I would like to ask all members of the Pact, from now onwards, as director of mobilisation, to stop talking about the Pact. Just let the results speak for you.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: We want to work with our friends in the Executive who want to be praised. We are going to praise them and we will continue doing so. However, we do not want to praise them in a satirical manner, but truthfully. We appreciate what is being done, but we urge them to do more.

Laughter

Mr Muntanga: We do not want what happened in Mwinilunga, where the Ruling Party lost miserably, to happen again. This is because it is near the border and they will claim that we have brought in Angolans to vote for us. We are asking the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning and his friends to look elsewhere and save money. I have a passion for agriculture, but we will save money if we forego this disease control zone and look at commodity-based trade. That way, we will manage and save a lot of money. That is honest and free advice.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Minister of Justice (Mr Chilembo): Mr Speaker, I wish to congratulate Hon. Dr Musokotwane, Minister of Finance and National Planning, on a well-delivered Budget Speech to this House. The Speech was delivered in style. The message in his address is clear and to the point. It reinforces and is harmonious with the President’s Address which was delivered to this House.

Mr Speaker, I wish to join Hon. Dr Musokotwane in paying tribute to the late Mr John Mupanga Mwanakatwe, SC., who was, indeed, a distinguished Mayor and an hon. Minister of Finance. I am proud to have worked under him as a student while at the Law Practice Institute now known as the Zambia Institute of Advanced Legal Education (ZIALE). I wish to note that the following lawyers also passed through his hands:

(i) Dr Patrick Matibini, SC;

(ii) Mr Mathew Chisunka, Secretary of the Bank of Zambia;

(iii) The Attorney-General, Mr Mumba Malila;

(iv) Mr Justice Nigel Kaonde Mutuna; and

(v) Our own Vice-President and Minister of Justice, Mr George Kunda, SC., MP.

Mr Speaker, the list has, of course, not been exhausted. You may observe that he produced quality lawyers. Indeed, his contributions to Zambia are immeasurable. I wish to share with you one great lesson that he taught me. He taught me that even for what you think you know, before you give your professional opinion, countercheck your views with authorities in the library. In short, you should research. This message is true today for all of us. Let us research as we debate and we will add more value to this House. May I simply say, may his soul rest in eternal peace.

Mr Speaker, this budget is a master piece. This is why I agree with those who say that it has been difficult for us to stand up and dismantle it. Those who have spoken, at times, could not go to the substance, but discuss matters which are irrelevant. I wish there was a clause in the Standing Orders that would allow us to proceed and pass such budgets. For now, I know the rules would still want us to debate.

Mr Speaker, in giving a fair analysis of the 2010 Budget Speech by Hon. Dr Musokotwane, it should be appreciated that we coming from a background of the world economic melt down. I congratulate the MMD Government on taking appropriate steps to address the crisis. I would like to note that the reverse trend is in progress. As the hon. Minister demonstrated in his Budget Speech, without putting proper measures in place, Zambia would have been worse off.

Mr Speaker, quality leadership cannot be better exhibited than in such times. Yes, this working Government has done it and the 2010 Budget is not only giving hope, but also guaranteeing a better tomorrow for all our people.

Mr Speaker, the Government, even in the face of the world economic crisis, has reclaimed a number of jobs that were lost. Some jobs were reclaimed at the Luanshya Copper Mine. I know Hon. Nkombo thought that the 1,000 jobs that were retained were not sufficient, but I must say that there must be a beginning. You cannot run before you stand. We are standing up and we have taken 1,000 steps. That is an achievement. Some of our colleagues would like us to fail for political purposes. When you do that, it is our own people who suffer. Therefore, I wish to borrow Hon. Dr Musokotwane’s statement on page 3 of his speech when he said:

“I am, therefore, very concerned that our detractors do not seem to appreciate the gravity of failing to secure mining jobs. Through the statements they make, I suspect the mining industry and the whole economy would have been in ruins today if it were them who were in Government.”

Sir, I think it is their job to ruin.

Laughter

Mr Chilembo: We may forgive them.

Sir, from his speech, I also noted that more jobs have been created following the signing of the Memorandum of Understanding between the Government of Zambia and the Man Ferrostaal for US$400 million. This project will involve cultivating and refinement of Jartropha in the Northern Province. This has nothing to do with politics. These are developmental projects.

Mr Speaker, in property development, the investment of US$200 million in residential and commercial property development at the levy junction is yet another opportunity to create more jobs for the people.

Sir, let us all, as a people, match together because when hunger strikes, it affects all of us. As those people who lose jobs in such times are our relatives, hard times should bring us together more than ever before. Politics cannot substitute this ideal for unity. 

Mr Speaker, I wish to turn to tourism. The hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, in his speech, stated that growth in this sector is projected to be 15 per cent in 2010 compared to an estimated contraction of the same magnitude in 2009. I am delighted to note that the K50.7 billion in the 2009 Budget towards the infrastructure project in the Northern Province was fully released. In the 2010 Budget, K95 billion has been allocated towards the development of the Northern Circuit and, of course, there are other budgetary allocations to promote tourism in the Northern sector. Let those who look at the world through dark glasses in search of political glory remove their glasses for a change and wear clearer ones, maybe mine, so that they can clearly see what this Government is doing.

Sir, let us learn not to politicise everything. Those who create an impression that Zambia is about to collapse, are enemies of the people because when you speak negatively about this country, the sector which suffers most is the tourism sector as you scare away the would-be tourists. We should realise that the greatest asset this country has had since independence is peace and tranquility. That is our major asset and when we attack peace and tranquility by whatever activities, including honking, we are not attracting tourists. We are simply scaring them away. Therefore, we should stop this.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chilembo: Mr Speaker, I therefore, urge hon. Members of Parliament to preach peace, love and unity. That way, we will not derail the good intentions that are in the budget.

Mr Speaker, the Government should be encouraged to fight corruption. Let us not downplay the efforts it is making to ensure that corruption is fought to the bitter end. I commend the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning for clearly condemning the mismanagement of funds at the Ministry of Health.

Mr Speaker, the Government is as much of a victim in this scourge as our general populace. I am, therefore, delighted that the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning has increased the allocations to the Office of the Auditor-General and the Anti-Corruption Commission. This move is in line with the National Anti-Corruption Policy, which advocates for strengthening such institutions that not only fight corruption, but also prevent its occurrence.

Mr Speaker, the creation of a Finance Intelligence Unit is a most welcome move. Funding of these institutions should not be looked at as a waste of money as the money saved can go a long way in servicing the other sectors of the economy.

Mr Speaker, I wish to take this opportunity to share with the House and the nation that since its inception, the Task Force on Corruption has performed its mandate well.  However, the House may wish to know that most of the cases which the Task Force on Corruption has been prosecuting have been concluded, with only a few pending trial or appeal in higher courts.

Mr Speaker, I wish to inform the House that the Task Force on Corruption will be disbanded. The Cabinet will soon meet to determine the future of the Task Force on Corruption in view of the adoption of the National Anti-Corruption Policy. The Government hopes to build and raise capacity and expertise in the Anti-Corruption Commission so that it can effectively deal with corruption and sophisticated financial crimes.

Mr Speaker, eventually, all cases initiated by the Task Force on Corruption will be fused into the Anti-Corruption Commission. Furthermore, the legal framework on the fight against corruption will be reviewed and formed in line with the National Anti-Corruption Policy.

Mr Speaker, as Ministry of Justice, we are delighted that K37.7 billion in this year’s Budget will go towards the construction of court houses in all the nine provinces. We estimate that this amount will build, at least, sixty court houses. I believe that hon. Members of this august House will support this provision as, time and again, we have been receiving questions relating to the demand for local courts in various constituencies. This sum is colossal compared to the 2009 Budget allocation of about K1 billion, which could only build three court houses.

Mr Speaker, we realise that this might not be colossal in terms of what the hon. Members expect. However, this is, indeed, the beginning and will be ongoing. Once approved, I am sure we will reach a point where we will satisfy the demands being made from time to time. We appreciate that access to justice for all can only be meaningfully attained with the provision of such infrastructure. It is for this reason that the programme of constructing court houses will be ongoing.

Mr Speaker, as I indicated in my debate in support of the speech delivered by His Excellency the President, Mr Rupiah Bwezani Banda, a new constitution is coming. Those who hoped that the process would fail should wake up from their slumber because a further K50 billion in the 2010 Budget to the Constitution-making process has been allocated. This confirms that with such funds made available, there can be no reverse gear. Only a greater momentum can be gained. This Government is, indeed, committed to the ideal of creating a democratic society for all. The Constitution-making process is one of those routes. All the people who believe in democratic ideals are expected to actively participate in this process.

Mr Speaker, I further wish to congratulate the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning on increasing CDF from K600 million to K650 million. I know that there is a cry for an increment of K1 billion.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chilembo: Mr Speaker, there is, however, a need to seriously review the performance so far in various constituencies. A mere leap to K1 billion may just lead to other problems. Sometimes hon. Members of Parliament are very busy and these funds are left in the hands of other people. To closely monitor these funds might be a very big challenge. Therefore, if we simply increase it to K1 billion without a critical analysis of the performance, it might not be a very good idea. I would suggest that we try to meet and review and share our various experiences in our constituencies to see how we have performed, and if there are areas where we can improve, especially on the issue of accountability, we should do so. These are public funds. I know that when some of our colleagues get this money, they want to behave as if it is from their pockets. Let us remind our people …

Hon. Government Member: Those on the left.

Mr Chilembo: … that this is the Government’s money and that, as hon. Members, whether from the Ruling Party or Opposition, we are mere agents. Let us also remind them that the people responsible for giving us this money are the Ruling Party, MMD.

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Chilembo: These are the painful facts we should accept.

Mr Speaker, I wish to thank all the hon. Members of Parliament in advance for supporting the 2010 Budget. I thank the hon. Members for agreeing to pass this very good budget. In passing the budget, they are confirming their leadership roles. Being Members of the Legislature, they are, indeed, part of the legislative wing of the Government. I would like them to know that we appreciate them. The fact that they are not in the Executive does not make them lesser leaders. They only reduce themselves to that realm when they think that they are pulling down the MMD leadership, and yet in actual fact, they pass laws and budgets and work together with the Ruling Party. When they leave the House, they want to paint the picture that they are not part of this process. We are in this together.

It will not help to try and pull down the MMD Government. As I have already stated, you are part of the Government. Today is your day to decide how you conduct yourselves. You may choose to be with the people by supporting this budget and acknowledge the good things that we are doing or you can choose to be an enemy of the people by speaking negatively and turning a blind eye to what is being done.

Hon. Opposition Members: Question!

Mr Chilembo: I wish to thank you because I can see that you have chosen to be on the side of the people. May God bless you.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Mulenga (Kwacha): Mr Speaker, thank you for giving me this opportunity to debate the Budget Speech.

Mr Speaker, right from the outset, I would like to indicate that the budget presented to this House is a national budget. It is a budget that does not belong to any political party, but the people of Zambia.

 Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: This budget is an outline and yardstick of what we the people of Zambia think of ourselves in the next one year. It is, therefore, very important that when we are looking at the budget, we critically rethink of ourselves. Is this the best that we can provide, are there areas of improvement or what is it that we can do?

Mr Speaker, like other speakers have said before, when we are looking at the budget, let us not just focus on the expenditure part of it. We must also look at the revenue part. In fact, it is the revenue that really holds the whole budget. We would like to have many programmes provided for, but as long as we cannot find the money for this, all what we discussed is just a dream.

Mr Speaker, I will begin refocusing myself on the revenue side because that is an area that needs serious thinking among ourselves. We have complained about the many projects in our constituencies and various districts that have not been developed, but we have never sat down to look at the revenue base.

Mr Speaker, I want to give an example of the tax revenue. A big chunk of financing is from pay-as-you-earn (PAYE). You will understand that in this country, there are only 400 to 500 employees contributing to this budget. If this is the only number that is sustaining the budget out of a population of 12 to 13 million, is this fair? How can the Executive be more innovative to increase the revenue base? 

We have been complaining that the standard of education has gone down. How is it going to be improved? These are questions we must ask ourselves.

Sir, when you look at the corporate tax, it does not seem to be significantly supporting our revenue base. The reason is simple. It is because we have many corporate entities that have employed very good accountants and tax planning is the order of the day. This reminds me of how the wind fall tax that many of my colleagues have alluded to just passed our noses, and yet it could have helped to build a lot of roads and infrastructure that we have been crying for.

Sir, I have been trying to find out, on the Floor of this House, from the Hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, what happened to the windfall tax that we collected in 2008. We were told that the money was at the Bank of Zambia. I have been trying to search in the Yellow Book for last year and this year, but I cannot see how this money has been introduced and where this money will be utilised. The questions that we ask are not meant to belittle the Government, but trying to find out what happened and where this money is.

There were special accounts for this money. Certain mining companies did not want to pay. Instead they wanted this money put in a special account so that after litigation, they would know what to do with the money. What has happened? No one has explained this. The Budget Speech is not clear on what has happened to that money. We need that money. It has to be appropriated by this House. Until we know where that money is, we will not stop talking about it.

Mr Speaker, this year …

Business was suspended from 1045 hours until 1100 hours.   {mospagebreak} 

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, before business was suspended, I was talking about how corporate tax does not seem to contribute effectively to national revenue. I indicated to this House the common practice in any given company that tax planning becomes the essence of the day because they would like to reduce, as much as possible, what to contribute. They will look at the weaknesses and loopholes that are within the tax regime where they can try and reduce. For instance, the capitalisation and so on and so forth where they will get 100 per cent capital allowance.

Mr Speaker, this it why you would find that company tax does not seem to be increasing even when we are told that the economy is performing well. This leaves a lot of desire to rethink on how this is done. Where we have avenues where we can increase tax, let us not be lukewarm. We should collect that money so that even when we begin to talk about projects, we know that this is where the money is.

Sir, in the absence of that, we will sit here, talk and debate, but it will not amount to anything without seriously looking at the resource envelope. It is the resource envelope that determines what we are going to achieve at the end of the day.

Mr Speaker, the theme of this year’s Budget Speech is “Enhancing Growth through Competitiveness and Diversification.” It is a very good theme, but how serious are we about it. That is the most important thing. It is very nice to come up with a very good theme, but it is another thing to achieve, realise and actualise that which we have set.

Last year, it was the same theme. How much have we realised, how much have we diversified and how competitive have we become? This is the question that we need to ask ourselves because in the absence of that, we are playing to the gallery and we will not achieve anything.

Sir, when a national budget is achieved, it is not a plus to the ruling Government or the Opposition, but a plus to the whole nation. After all, why do we aspire to be leaders? We aspire to be leaders to develop the nation so that even when we die, there shall be a legacy that will follow us as people who attempted to do something and, therefore, will be a foundation people will pick up from.

There should be no competition on ideas on what we want to achieve. There should be no competition on where we want to take development. There should be no competition on how resources must be distributed. After all, what do we all aim for? We are aiming to make this nation a better place than we found it.

Mr Bwalya: Yes!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: What should be embedded in our hearts is to leave this nation better than we found it.

Mr Bwalya: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Mulenga: Now, if we evaluate ourselves, are we leaving this nation better than we found it or we are destroying it? We need to be cautious about that.

Mr Speaker, we have been told that we need to develop in agriculture, tourism, and manufacturing. What serious efforts is the Government putting in place to enhance these developments? It is the Government’s policy statements that will propel us towards this diversification of the economy.

Sir, a lot of corporate bodies spend time listening to the budget. They spend time listening to what hon. Ministers are able to indicate to the nation. It is on that premise that we are able to develop their development agenda. It is on that premise that they are able to expand in their industries.

However, if we want to create more employment and do not seem to formulate policies that are encouraging to would-be investors, how then do we encourage them to come in? Much as we want to encourage them, we must also be mindful that we have a duty to develop this nation. This nation cannot be developed by a foreigner. This nation cannot be developed by any other person apart from a Zambian. If a Zambian is not involved in development, it is very difficult to get sustainable revenue. Otherwise, we will get to a point where if the policies of the day are unfavourable, the would-be investors will tell us, “If you do this, we will pull out”. If they pull out, it means our revenue base also comes down.

Mr Speaker, it was only last year, in 2008, when we introduced the windfall tax. What happened? The investors came to the Zambian Government and said, “Look, if you continue with this, we are going to pull out.” What did we do? We passed a law here to remove it. Why, and yet the windfall tax was based on a price that triggers it. If the price of copper had gone down, surely, no one was going to pay anything, but the price had gone up.

Mr Speaker, we need that money. I am begging this Government to increase the revenue base. If we do not, the problems and challenges that befall you, as a Ruling Party, are enormous and you will not be able to solve them.

Sir, in my constituency, Kwacha, that bears the symbol of our national currency, we have a bridge called Musichani, though it is not a bridge yet, which has been on the programme for a very long time. For twenty-five years, we have been talking about this bridge. Every year, funds are allocated for feasibility studies. I wonder whether even that so-called feasibility study fund ever gets allocated because we do not see anything on the ground. Surely, the hon. Minister of Works and Supply understands how many lives we lose in the Kafue River.

Mr Speaker, this is my third year in this Parliament, but sometimes I ask myself whether when we programme and include programmes in our budget, we mean it or it is just to show that this is what we want to do.

Sir, this leads me to another point. Why do we come up with the budget? Earlier, I indicated that it is a yardstick to see what we intend to do. Do we do that which we have put on paper? That is critical. It is one thing to come up with a budget, but it is another thing to implement it.

Mr Speaker, this brings me to another point. What is the connection between the political power and the Civil Service? At the end of the day, it is the civil servants who are going to implement the budget. Have we relooked at how effective our Civil Service is in terms of budget implementation? What difficulties do we encounter when we begin to implement the budget? How are we addressing them? If we do not come to a point where we address how the implementation is being done, I am afraid, we will sit here and talk, but nothing will ever happen.

Therefore, it is my appeal to the Leader of Government Business in the House to ensure that there is a relook at how programmes are implemented and how we should increase the revenue base so that even when we begin to talk about what projects must be implemented, I must be able to come to you and say “Here is the money”. I am pointing out to you that windfall tax is something that we have messed up and I wish the Government could relook at that. That is my humble cry.

With those few remarks, Mr Speaker, I wish to rest my case.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo (Bangweulu): Mr Speaker, I wish to thank you for giving me this opportunity to debate the Budget Address which was ably presented by the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning.

Sir, let me begin by commending the hon. Minister and the entire Government of the day for the able manner in which they have managed the economic crisis. We are aware that countries all over the world have been affected by this crisis. From the very beginning, we did not know the direction that we were going to take for us to survive as a country. However, because we have competent politicians in positions, we have been able to survive. Therefore, my hope is that we continue to survive the same crisis and ultimately begin to prosper. This is what is happening in America, Britain, Germany and all over the world. Zambia cannot be an exception. We commend you highly hon. Members of the Cabinet. Continue managing the affairs of this country in the same able manner like you have been doing.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Nevertheless, you should also be made aware that if you do not remain focussed in your endeavour to move Zambia from the economic crisis to prosperity, there will be a lot of hurdles that you may face, but it is important for you to remain focussed because whatever happens in any country, anywhere, there will be prophets of doom. In our country, we will continue to have prophets of doom. Whether the performance is exceptionally good or not, there will be a lot of people who will always be fault finders.

Hon. Minister, you are aware that from the time you presented your first budget, the first request that we made as Parliamentarians was for you to influence the entire Cabinet, including the Head of State, to increase CDF.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: You responded positively.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Alas! Some people have not seen that they can use CDF as an instrument to develop their constituencies and also raise the standard of living of our people.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear

Mr Kasongo: Mr Speaker, we use different spectacles to see how the national cake is shared. I think the Government must be given credit on that score.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Our wish was that if CDF was increased from K400 million to K600 million, we were going to develop our country as quickly as possible. The response was spontaneous and overwhelming.

When it comes to the sharing of the national cake, the Government must be given credit for that.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Our wish that CDF was increased from K400 million to K600 million so that we could develop our country as quickly as possible. The response was spontaneous and overwhelming. If we audit our individual constituencies, especially Bangweulu where we have been able to utilise it to the fullest, we have been able to raise the standard of living for the people.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: We have rehabilitated a number of schools and constructed a number of feeder roads. All the community schools which were grass thatched are all now looking beautiful because of CDF.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Feeder roads have been worked on and the people now have easy access to their farms. They are able to transport their produce to the markets easily.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Mr Speaker, this is what development is all about. Now, my word of advice to the entire Cabinet through the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning is that it should remain focused because its role is to develop the country for all of us and not for a few individuals.

There are people who do not record appreciation even in a small way because they are born like that.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Mr Speaker, as a Zambian and black person, I believe in saying, “thank you”. Even when your neighbour wakes up and says, “Good morning”, you have to reciprocate the following day. If that greeting becomes one sided, the person will also change because he or she will take it that, maybe, this person thinks that I am lower than him or her in terms of status. Traditionally, we are supposed to say, “thank you” when something good is done for us and I am saying my thank you to the Government of the day for having developed Bangweulu Constituency through CDF and other activities.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Mr Speaker, we never had a hospital in Bangweulu Constituency. I kept lamenting on the Floor of this august House that people of my constituency were travelling long distances from Samfya to take their sick to Mansa, or even Lubwe and that we needed a district hospital. The response from the Government has been overwhelming.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Construction of the hospital is near completion. This is what development is all about and we have to show our appreciation.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Being in the Opposition does not mean that you cannot even say “thank you” because whether you like it or not, we are all one.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: We just differ in opinion. You can have your own opinion and so on and so forth, but at the end of the day, when the cake that has been shared by the Government reaches your constituency in a small way or in a big way, you have to learn to show appreciation.

Hon. Members: Sejani!

Laughter

Mr Kasongo: Secondly, to the Government of the day, I would like to implore it to honour this document. The presentation that was made by the Government through the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning in this House, as other hon. Members have said, is a national one. This is our budget. It is not for other people. In other words, we have to ensure that we intensify our actions to raise a lot of revenue from within because we cannot trust a neighbour. First of all you have to trust yourself, your children and your wife. You cannot depend on other people to come and develop your country and so let us own this budget. We must be proud enough to be able to raise the revenue required for us to implement the programmes contained in the budget. That is our role.

Mr Speaker, priority must be given to revenue collection. All ministries must be commercial entities capable of generating revenue. The role of every Permanent Secretary should not only be to know how much money the Ministry of Finance and National Planning is going to give the ministry, but also focus on how much money the ministry will contribute to the Treasury. That should be their priority. Even, Hon. Ministers, even if they are political heads of ministries, they must make sure that revenue collection is intensified. I have said several times in this House that all ministries have the potential to generate revenue which can assist the Government in its work.

For instance, the Ministry of Information and Broadcasting Services has a marketing department. We see a lot of advertisements on a daily basis in the public media, but the question is, where does the money go? The Ministry of Energy and Water Development is capable of collecting a lot of revenue through a number of institutions, but this money is not seen. The Government has to find out what happens to the money that it collects. The Government must find out how much money is being collected on a daily basis in all the ministries.

Mr Speaker, a Permanent Secretary with a sound mind should not leave his or her office without knowing how much money the ministry has generated per day. That is their role.  To the Ministry of Local Government and Housing, I have told them before that the land between Mungwi Road and Mumbwa West should be reserved for industrial development. If you give that piece of land to those who want to put up houses, then those with the ability to create jobs for our people will have no land to use. If you reserve that land for industrial development purposes, it means that all the big investors will be able to invest in that area and ultimately the country will be generating a lot of revenue. The same money is going to be utilised to implement the programmes that are going to be contained in future budgets.

Mr Speaker, I would like to appeal to the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing to intervene as quickly as possible in the allocation of the land in question. They should not allow individual developers who are putting up houses in that area because there is little income generation in such ventures and no job creation. Leave that land to investors. Unfortunately, the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing is not in the House, but I am happy that the Government is listening. I am requesting that the land in question be left for industrial development.

Hon. Member: Lubinda listen!

Mr Kasongo: If you are getting a lot of pressure from cadres from political parties, take action as quickly as possible. That land has the potential to generate revenue for our country. That land should be reserved for local and foreign investors.

Some little voices have been heard somewhere saying that the Chinese are not the best investors and that they should not be allowed to invest in this country. Mr Speaker, as far as I am concerned, Zambia is a non-aligned country and that is the policy that we have advanced to the outside world, unless people have forgotten about it. To forget, as a politician, is a sin in my view. Zambia is a non-aligned country and those who would like to develop our country, whether they come from the east or west, are welcome because we have an open door policy.             
  So why are you worried when the Chinese are given the opportunity to develop our country? For me, as a product of Bangweulu Constituency, I rate the Chinese highly for one thing. In one of the provinces in Zambia, they managed to construct the longest bridge in Zambia.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasongo: Mr Speaker, the Serenje/Samfya Road has been stable for over twenty years. The road only begun to develop potholes two years ago. Imagine, twenty years down the line there was not a single pothole, and yet you want to stand up and insult the Chinese.

Hon. Opposition Member interjected.

Laughter

Mr Kasongo: Let us look at what they have done for our country.

Hon. Government Members: Ema MPs aya.

Mr Kasongo: They have brought a lot of investment which has created job opportunities for our people. Even some of our colleagues who have been saying some bad words about the Chinese are aware that the people in their constituencies have benefited a lot from the Chinese investment in the mines.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Interruptions

Mr Kasongo: The Chinese have also invested in roads. Some of the people who insult the Chinese are the same ones who claim to the people in their constituencies that they are the ones who invited the Chinese investors and that they have helped create jobs. Let us be realistic.

Mr Speaker, I am happy that your timely advice has been digested by quite a good number of people, some of whom are even exporting goods to China. There are a lot of good industries in China. I was privileged to go to China with the hon. Member for Parliament for Sinazongwe. We saw Zambians …

Mr Mukanga: Mulelya fya ma Chinese mulelya.

Mr Kasongo: … who were putting up industries in China. There is a province in China that is dominated by blacks, including Zambians. So why should we be hostile to the same people who are accommodating our own nationals? Why should we seem to be hostile to the same Chinese who are creating job opportunities for our own people? We need to show them some appreciation. If we want to get rid of loafers, we need to keep this window of opportunity which some Chinese investors are using to come and assist us develop and create job opportunities for our people. We have to say, “thank you” and not stand to condemn. No!

Mr Mukanga: Not prisoners, no.

Mr Kasongo: I can only imagine what type of investors we could have in Zambia if, at one time or another, the Zambians could allow their party president to be in State House.

Interruptions

Mr Kasongo: God forbid!

Laughter

Mr Kasongo: Mr Speaker, in ending my speech, let me emphasise one point. This is that in spite of our political and opinion differences, when it comes to the budget address, we should know that we are talking about the development of our country. We have to make sure that we remain united as a nation. A lot of people from different countries have praised us for the unity that we enjoy. We are seen as one family all the time. That is why we cannot allow little ranting voices to create commotion in our country. We have to stand up and say, “If you want to create commotion in our own country, please, know that you were not born a leader”. We have to do that.

Mr Speaker, I want to urge the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to ensure that pledges from donors are honoured. Those that fail to honour their commitment must be asked why they failed to do so within a short time. If certain donors fail to honour their commitments, simply come back to the National Assembly to inform the House on the development. If you want to make adjustments to the budget because the donors have failed to honour their obligations, we are going to support you. It is as simple as that. Do not even waste your time.

Mr Speaker, such a situation happened in Uganda. President Museveni simply invited the same donors to a meeting and told them that they had made a lot of pledges to his county’s budget which, afterwards, they failed to honour. He told them to let him know whether they were not going to meet their pledges so that the budget could be changed. The donors started panicking because they were aware that whether they liked it or not, he would also assist them by creating jobs for their nationals. So the donors should not take us for granted. We are a sovereign country which should stand up to them. We should tell them that if they have failed to honour their obligation, they should let us know so that we can adjust the budget accordingly. This is our budget and we have to be proud of it. If they do not honour their commitments, well and good. We cannot force them. Let us adjust our budget according to the cake that is available.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikazwe (Chimbamilonga): Mr Speaker, thank you for giving me an opportunity to contribute to the debate on the Budget Speech presented by the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, Dr Musokotwane, who is a doctor in Economics.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikazwe: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning came with the same theme as the previous one, which is “Enhancing Growth through Competitiveness and Diversification.” People have been talking about competition either in elections or business and the Government is trying to tell us the level of competition they want by bringing investments to our constituencies.

Mr Speaker this morning, I would rather dwell much on the competitiveness of our economy. Firstly, let me congratulate the Zambia Postal Services Corporation (Zampost) for claiming its position as a real public company which has managed to beat the performance of Western Union in terms of the swift cash transfer product. Though more can still be done, I would like to state that Zampost has done very well with the swift cash transfer initiative. 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikazwe: Mr Speaker, however, Zambia is a big country with seventy-two districts that all need the services of Zampost. The biggest problem is in Kaputa. I want to ask the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, as he will be allocating money, to expand the activities of Zampost to consider reopening the Kaputa Post Office so that the swift cash transfer product can help us transfer money to our children and other relatives in the district.

Mr D. Mwila: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikazwe: People cannot send money to their relatives in Kaputa using the swift cash initiative because the post office there is not operational. Had it not been for the National Savings and Credit Bank (Natsave), we could have been facing a lot of problems sending money to relatives and workers in the district. Reopening Zampost in that area will help the Government, as the civil servants will be happy to work in Kaputa because they will be able to receive and send money to their relatives and implement other programmes that require the services of Zampost.

I propose that the Mansa Post Office, which has been temporarily closed, should also be reopened. It was taken over by the Red Cross during the refugee’s influx in 1996 when there was turmoil in the Democratic Republic of Congo. This is a very serious appeal, I am making to the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning as well as the Ministry of Transport and Communications which will be applying for the money for the expansion of Zampost services to Kaputa. This will show how Zampost is able to stand competition and how public companies are able to serve the people.

Mr Speaker, I will now move to the Rural Road Unit (RRU). I also thank the RRU of Luapula Province for cutting costs because it wants to be competitive. It reduced the cost price of rehabilitating the road between Mukambo and Chembe by almost K3.2 billion. it K300 million has been spent on this road when the contractor was paid K3.8 billion every year in the past. This is a very good job which has been done by the Provincial Administration of Luapula …

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikazwe: … through RRU.

This is the competitiveness we want from the Government’s spending agents and departments so as to prove that there is no need for contractors to carry out works on behalf of ministries. This must be encouraged because it will help reduce the burden on the Government of looking for funds for the National Budget.

The Ministry of Works and Supply must do its best in procuring more road maintenance equipment so that the cost of doing business with some contractors comes down, thereby getting rid of some unnecessary expenses the Government has been incurring.

Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning for allocating more than K5 billion to RRU in the Northern Province. However, I would like to propose something to the hon. Minister.  It is not right for our province, which has twelve districts, to be given the same allocation as Lusaka Province which has four districts. It should be taken into account that the Northern Province is in the rural part of Zambia and, therefore, should be given a bigger allocation. The same applies to the North-Western Province which was also given K5 billion just like the Copperbelt Province which is in the urban part of the country. Such kind of distribution of wealth is not fair.

The Provincial Roads Department in Lusaka will do a good job because each district will be allocated K1.2 billion compared to the Northern Province where RRU will be spending K300 million per district. No meaningful road works can be done with K300 million. The hon. Ministers of Finance and National Planning and Works and Supply must review the disbursement of these funds. They should consider the size and location of provinces when making allocations for road maintenance. This way, we will be able to effectively use the money allocated to road maintenance.

Last year, the Northern Province was only given K2 billion for road maintenance.  It should also be noted that other provinces such as Lusaka even have the Urban Accelerated Roads Programme. Simple calculations show that only districts such as Kafue, Feira and part of Chongwe, which are rural, might have benefited from this programme. Despite the Northern Province having been given K2 billion, there are twelve districts in the province. Provinces such as the North-Western have eight or nine districts. I am sure hon. Ministers know that in the Central Province, the long distances are from Kabwe to Serenje and Kabwe to Mumbwa.

I think the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning should take into consideration what I have proposed today. The Ministry of Works and Supply should also see the sense in what I am trying to put forward so that there will be correct allocation of funds. Lusaka, which has only four districts and is in the urban part of the country, was given K40 billion under the Accelerated Urban Roads Project. The K2 billion allocated to Lusaka under the Provincial Roads Department is not necessary because there is already K40 billion that has been given to the Road Development Agency (RDA) which will be used to work on most roads in the province.

So I would like to emphasise that the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning should review the allocation of funds for road maintenance, taking into account the location and distance between towns. This is an oversight which we should address.  I think the ministries of Works and Supply and Finance and National Planning should consider what I have proposed to this House.

Mr Speaker, I thank RDA for coming to the aid of the people of Kaputa District in both Chimbamilonga and Kaputa constituencies. The construction of Mukubo Bridge was procrastinated for five years under the Office of the Vice-President. However, construction of this bridge has been completed after the intervention of RDA. I think even my predecessor complained on the Floor of this House about the delay in completing this project. Tomorrow Investments was given this project and it did what it thought was right.  I am, therefore, thanking the Ministry of Works and Supply for completing this project. RDA has also given Chimbamilonga river crossings which have been completed by Sable Contractors. The Ministry of Agriculture and Co-operatives will benefit greatly from these two river crossings because we have a lot of farmers in the constituency.

Mr Speaker, I am happy that a lot has been spoken about diversification, but I would like to make a proposal to the hon. Ministers of Finance and National Planning and Works and Supply.  The D37 and the Kasama/Mporokoso/Kaputa roads are not feeder roads but district roads. This is also the case with the Masaiti/Mpongwe Road.

Mr Munaile: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikazwe: All of these roads are in the same category. These roads have even been paved and tarred because of the economic activities which are taking place the areas. After thorough research, RDA and the Ministry of Works and Supply discovered that these roads had grade B and C gravel. After touring these roads, the former hon. Minister of Works and Supply discovered that there was as much traffic on these roads as in Lusaka.

Interruptions

 Mr Sikazwe: Mr Speaker, we can go together with the people murmuring to the Luwingu Turn-off and start counting the vehicles passing through that place. They would prove that we are receiving more than 200 to 300 vehicles per month. At the time these roads were being designed there were just about forty vehicles going to Kaputa. What I am testifying before the House is what is obtaining on the ground today.

Mr Mubika: Hammer!

Mr Sikazwe: As people of Kaputa and Chimbamilonga, we are saying that the grade A gravel must not be there. Tarring of the roads in rural areas will promote tourism. The whole of the Mbala Road must be rehabilitated. We will be receiving a lot of tourists in Kaputa in the next two years as the Rural Electrification Authority (REA) will electrify the area and everything is changing.

I would like to invite hon. Members, as they will be going through their constituency offices, to come and see the rural constituency office we have built in Chimbamilonga so that they see how the people are fairing.

Mr Munaile: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikazwe: Mr Speaker, I am especially inviting hon. Members of the Executive. I am aware that the hon. Ministers of Finance and National Planning and Lands have already been there and they saw what people were doing in this area. The people of Kaputa have now changed. Kaputa will now be the backbone of Zambia’s economy.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikazwe: Mr Speaker, we are now even growing a lot of rice. The people of Kaputa will not go to the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) to beg for relief food because we have moved from fishing to farming. We are also growing cassava, maize and many other crops. Kaputa is now the food basket of the Northern Province.  We should, therefore, not politicise everything. We want to diversify the economy and show competitiveness.

Mr Munaile: Konkanyapo.

Mr Sikazwe: I would like to concentrate on competitiveness in my debate. REA should be competitive like the Zambia Revenue Authority (ZRA) and participate in all kinds of ventures. We have heard that it has been allocated K70 billion and it should, therefore, be seen to be working in constituencies. The points where the ZRA collects tax can be identified. In Nsumbu, the people coming from Tanzania even pay to ZRA. REA should, therefore, take a leaf from ZRA.

Mr Speaker, I would like the hon. Ministers of Finance and National Planning and Energy and Water Development to review the operations of REA. It is not doing anything and is just wasting the Government’s resources. There is a problem of electricity from Kaputa to Chienge. Money is only paid to the Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (Zesco) because there is no competition in the energy sector. Zesco has the monopoly in connecting power to Kaputa. There is still no electricity in the area and we are spending a lot of money using diesel generators. The hon. Minister of Energy and Water Development is aware of this, as the Government is spending a lot of money subsidising the operations of the generators. We do not want that.

The company must make a profit out of the people of Kaputa because we can afford to pay for electricity. REA must look for competent contractors that can compete and prove to Zesco that they can operate in rural areas. They should not be as sleepy as they were yesterday. We want them to promote the energy sector by moving from hydro to solar and from solar to geothermal and wind energy.

Laughter

Mr Sikazwe: Mr Speaker, my friend, the hon. Deputy Minister of Energy and Water Development, attended a geothermal workshop. It is the responsibility of the Executive to push REA and show them that this is a reality. You can try it so that we see if it cannot succeed in Zambia.

REA is not even grabbing projects from Zesco. Zesco has been holding on to projects and I have mentioned this before on the Floor of this House. Today, because of lack of competitiveness, nobody is moving the country forward. We want REA to show the hon. Minister that they have moved from point A to B. That is what we are talking about. You can electrify Kaputa District. We can upgrade the Musonda and Chishimba Falls. We do not want to rely on Pensulo. We want to remove the monopoly of Zesco so that we do not rely on it. Let it remain for Lusaka that considers it very important while we rely on the REA programmes.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Mr Sikazwe: Mr Speaker, in justice there is also competitiveness. Let me talk about justice in my area. I heard His Honour the Vice-President trying to accommodate my constituency by saying that it was going to be considered for a local court. That is a very good answer and His Honour the Vice-President’s office has been very kind to my constituency. However, the problem is that the people at the provincial level are failing to show competitiveness to prove that even at the provincial level, local courts are there to be competed for just as the case is at the district level. Somebody must aspire to be in the Provincial Local Court Office.

People have to compete with each other, then governance will not be realised. We want to compete to show that one can move from the district level. You have to compete to be promoted. A local government officer can be elevated to the position of chief administrator. What we want, through the Office of the Vice-President, is that the office of the Provincial Local Courts Officer, either in Luapula or Northern Province, should be active and take the burden of His Honour the Vice-President’s Office when they release money for the construction of court houses. I was told to look for a site through the Vice-President’s Office, but the Provincial Local Courts Officer still says he has never received funding. This, to me, is trying to bring conflict between the office of the hon. Minister and the Provincial Local Courts Office.

Mr Speaker, we want to move the country forward even in terms of justice. We want to move from the under- the - tree type of justice to permanent structures. People may accuse the Government of not performing, but I want to assure is Honour the Vice-President and his team that people are seeing what you are doing. As we continue to deliver to the people, they will come nearer to us. We are there and it is an obligation of the Government to make sure that we serve the people regardless of whether they are controversial or not. They will, sometimes, make positive criticism to us as the Government in office.

Mr Speaker, the Executive is doing a good job and they should not listen to us complaining as communities. They have to see that their ministries are doing the work and following their mission statements. They have to show their vision to the country so that people see that the Government is there for them. Like I said, people will withstand the suffering of today because they are expecting a terrific tomorrow. The people of Zambia are seeing schools and courts being built. They are also seeing magistrates being employed. Some members of Parliament are not telling the people while others are telling them that all these things you see are from the Government. No money comes from a Member of Parliament to develop the constituency. Therefore, people must appreciate that Government programmes must be fulfilled even by the hon. Members of Parliament on your left, who are part of the system of governance because money is coming from this Government.

Mr Speaker, I want to re-emphasise that we must let the spending agencies come to the people through practical implementation of projects which are on the ground and not where they just listen to good English and having seminars. We want infrastructure to be built.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member for Chimbamilonga is an example of a back bencher speaking forcefully for those who have elected him. I know most of you do that, but that is a very good example.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr D. Mwila (Chipili): Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to contribute to the debate on this year’s Budget Speech.

Mr Speaker, I have always said that as back benchers, we are here to advise the Government by telling them the truth. Those who are singing MMD songs everyday are not helping our colleagues there. We are here because there are problems out there. If we had no problems we were not going to be here.

Mr Speaker, I want to put the record straight on the Chinese.

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

Mr D. Mwila: We do not hate the Chinese, but we hate what they do. Under the Statutory Instrument on the minimum wage, a guard or workman is supposed to be paid K268,000. When the Chinese come here, they pay workers an amount below this figure. When we tell our Government that the Chinese must follow the laws of this country, the Government says that we hate them.

Mr Speaker, it is on the Floor of this House where the hon. Minister of Sport, Youth and Child Development informed this House that the Chinese who are constructing the Ndola Stadium brought more than 250 Chinese workers and have only employed 192 of our people. Therefore, you have to make comparisons on whether they are doing the right thing or not. If we advise them, it becomes a crime.

Mr Speaker, for those who do not watch television, the hon. Deputy Minister of Labour and Social Security is on record as having gone to inspect one of the Chinese companies. The Chinese was arrogant and wanted to fight the hon. Minister, Hon. Kachimba. It is on record.

Mr Speaker, we will respect the Chinese when they start respecting our laws and we, as Members of Parliament, have to protect our people.

Mr Speaker, I will be the first person to stand up and say you are doing the right things when the Chinese change the way of paying our people.

Mr Mulyata interjected.

Mr D. Mwila: Hon. Mulyata, you will debate. Now, I have been given the Floor.

Mr Speaker: Order!

Address the Chair!

Mr D. Mwila: Thank you, Sir, for your protection.

Mr Speaker, most of the contracts have been given to the Chinese, this week, and this Government cannot dispute, and yet we have people who own companies and want contracts. If the Chinese have come to grab all the jobs, do you expect us to like them? No. However, if our colleagues on your right think that they are doing the right thing, the people of Zambia will judge us.

Mr Speaker, we had elections just yesterday and the Ruling Party do not know the reason they lost.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear! Tell them.

Mr D. Mwila:  The Government has been working on the Kasama/Luwingu Road for more than seventeen years and it expects the people of Kasama to vote for it. In addition to this, the people on your right went further to mislead the President that the Kasama/Luwingu Road had been allocated K192 billion. It is not true. The hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, on Page 18, paragraph 114 says, and I quote:

“Some projects that will be undertaken in 2010 include the upgrading of Choma-the Chitongo Road, Chembe Bridge, Mongu-Kaoma-Tateyoyo, Kasama-Luwingu and Luansobe-Mpongwe roads, at a cost of K142 billion.”

Mr Speaker, the people of Kasama are not children. It is up to the Government to change its attitude because those who are praising it just want something from it.

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

Mr D. Mwila: I am telling you.

Interruptions

Mr D. Mwila: I have challenged you on the Chinese and you cannot dispute.

Mr Speaker: Order!

The hon. Member for Chipili should address the Chair.

You may continue, please.

Mr D. Mwila: I am addressing you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker, civil servants had gone on strike, this year, for more than two weeks. Who is to blame for this? The Government is to blame. It does not plan properly. The unions have asked the Government to start negotiations, but it is dilly-dallying. When the civil servants go on strike, the Government will start saying that it is the Opposition inciting them. It is not us in the Opposition who incite civil servants to go on strike, but poor planning. When you start negotiations late, you expect the negotiating team to start panicking.

Mr Speaker, the people of Kasama have voted. That is a protest vote that shows that they do not want the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) Government.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, you just have to look at the difference in votes. You can see that the people on your right are finished unless they change their attitude towards work.

Mr Speaker, looking at the figures in the Budget Speech, we do not expect the civil servants to get more than a 15 per cent salary increment next year. The ball is in the Government’s court because the people have continued to be destitute when they leave employment. Moreover, it takes two or three years for them to get their benefits. What type of a Government is this? We have jokers in this country. We need serious people to take over the Government and it is only the UPND/PF Pact which can take over.

Interruptions

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, I am a very proud hon. Member of Parliament for Chipili. Under the UPND/PF Pact, we have won the elections in the Kasama, Livingstone, Mwinilunga and Itezhi-tezhi constituencies despite the Vice-President going there to campaign.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr D. Mwila: That is a protest vote which means that this Government has to change its attitude towards work. We are now going to Solwezi.

Mr Speaker, I want to echo what the Member for Kalomo, Hon. Muntanga, said. I have been in this House for three years. Why should we continue talking about arrears for civil servants? The Government must explain why it has taken long to solve this problem. I just want to give them a piece of advice which can either be taken or thrown out.

Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning has admitted that we have a problem in the Ministry of Health. If you look at the budget of K1.3 trillion, the hon. Minister of Health will agree that there are usual problems of ambulances not having fuel in our clinics unless the Government changes its approach towards the donors who are funding us, as a country. The people who are stealing money in the Ministry of Health fall under those that supervise it.

Interruptions

Mr D. Mwila: You will continue losing if you continue being arrogant. The donors have no confidence in the Government. That is why they cannot continue funding us. My advice is that it is up to the Government to see to it that they rebuild the confidence that the donors have lost.

On the issue of roads, I have talked about the Kasama/Luwingu, Mutanda/Chavuma and Mansa/Luwingu roads. These roads must be completed. Our colleagues on your right must listen to us.

Mr Speaker, the last point is on the issue of the constitution-making process which is very important. K50 billion has been allocated towards the National Constitutional Commission (NCC) and the national census. The Government has not indicated anything, and I stand to be corrected, on the issue of the referendum. All of us will be affected by whatever mistakes are made because the Government is using tax payers’ money and not money from its pockets. Why is there no mention of a referendum when there are issues that will call for it? Why has it been omitted?  This means that the Constitution will not be ready by 2011. That is what it implies.

Interruptions

Mr D. Mwila: Those who do not understand issues will say ng’wing’wi, but that is the position.

Interruptions

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, we have a problem when it comes to money.

Mr Speaker: Order!

The House requires to know what “ng’wi ng’wi ng’wi” means.

Laughter

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, that refers to the interjections the hon. Members on your right are making in disputing what I am saying.

Laughter

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, we, as a country, have a problem and the Government must employ cost-serving measures by, especially, reducing on trips. We admit that the President is everybody’s President, but he must reduce on his trips.

Hon. Opposition Members: Yes, foreign trips.

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, I know my friends will dispute this, but it is on record. We are not going to allow a situation where the President visits a country just to go and watch small girls who are below the age of sixteen dancing in Swaziland.

Laughter

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, that is a very serious matter.

Hon. MMD Members: Order iwe!

Mr Mulyata: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Mulyata: Mr Speaker, I meant to disrupt him.

Laughter

Mr Mulyata: Is the hon. Member of Parliament in order to talk about presidential trips, which are planned for by the Government and necessary for this country as a result of certain conventions this country subscribes to? Is he in order to say that the President went to watch young girls dancing, when he has no facts about that particular trip? I need your serious ruling.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: The hon. Deputy Minister for the North-Western Province has raised a point of order on the contribution by the hon. Member for Chipili, especially with regard to the allegation that the Zambian Head of State went to Swaziland to watch sixteen-year old girls dancing.

That point of order assists the Chair to stress that hon. Members of this House must be very careful with the way they make reference to the Head of State and other respected dignitaries in this House.

It is in poor taste to say what the hon. Member for Chipili said. He has no facts because he did not carry out a census to determine the age of the girls he is referring to. Unless he was in Swaziland, he would be unable to tell this House that what he was referring to was not part of the cultural way that the King of Swaziland receives other Heads of State, if he so wishes.

The imputation regarding the sixteen-year old girls is one that is in very poor taste. The hon. Member will withdraw the reference and continue.

Mr Munaile: Mukutamba amabele ayantutu.

Hon. Government Members: He must apologise.

Mr D. Mwila: Mr Speaker, as guided, I withdraw my remarks. Allow me, therefore, to talk about the Constituency Development Fund (CDF). We have advised the Government over the increase of CDF. I agree with my colleague, the hon. Member for Mazabuka, that CDF be increased to K5 billion.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya (Mpika Central): Mr Speaker, I thank you for allowing me time to debate the Budget Speech, which was presented by the Hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning.

Mr Speaker, allow me, first of all, to congratulate the UPND/ PF Pact on …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: … hammering the MMD Government in the Kasama by-elections convincingly. Secondly, I congratulate the people of Kasama on speaking loudly.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya:  Mr Speaker, my line of debate will be centred on the popular song by the MMD Government, which is sung year in and year out. This is the song about the creation of employment.

Mr Speaker, the idea of inviting Zambians in the Diaspora to come back home is a welcome one. Indeed, they could come back to Zambia and contribute to the growth of the economy. However, it is only when there is positive growth in our economy, that we will see growth in the creation of employment.

Mr Speaker, the first thing that this Government must do, forty-five years after independence, is to look at critical areas that need development.

I will repeat my usual pronouncements that since the independence of this country, we have achieved a lot along the line of rail. Indeed, we have done quite wonderfully in terms of developing the urban areas. However, it is high time this Government turned around to look at rural Zambia. I have always emphasised this point. It is high time the Government of Zambia focused on developing the rural areas as it has done in big towns and cities.

Mr Speaker, for us to create employment, as has been the Government’s song, the Government must choose the areas to develop so that we attract Zambians living in the Diaspora to come and contribute to the development of the country.

Mr Speaker, I am looking at the development of rural areas as that will be the only way we can create employment in this country.

Mr Speaker, what is required is for the Government to take a lead in developing the rural areas.

The Government must intensify the development of rural areas by putting up good roads, hospitals, schools and opening up industries and speeding up the rural electrification project. That will be the only way to attract Zambians in the Diaspora to come back and contribute to the development of our country.

At the same time, the Government should formulate a deliberate policy in that regard. The Government alone will not create employment that will cater for the large number of the unemployed on the waiting list. The most important factor is for this Government to come up with a deliberate policy to ensure that it attracts all the well-to-do Zambians. There are many Zambians who are rich today, Sir. Those are the Zambians we need the Government to encourage to go into the rural areas and help develop these parts of our country. Today, once Zambians from rural areas get rich through the national assets, they all concentrate along the line of rail. That is where they locate their businesses. Some hon. Member of Parliament from rural areas …

Mr Daka: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Daka: Mr Speaker, I rarely stand on points of order. Is the hon. Member of Parliament for Mpika Central in order to emphasise the line of rail when Mpika is part of the line of rail which was built by the Chinese? Can he take that into cognisance?

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: Mr Speaker, I was emphasising on the well-to-do Zambians in cities and towns vis-à-vis the Government encouraging them to take development to the rural areas of this country. Today, most rich people from the Eastern Province are all camped in Makeni on very small pieces of land.

Laughter

Mr Kapeya: There is a need to encourage these people to go back to the Eastern Province and develop that part of the country.

Mr Speaker, I must admit that there are some Zambians, even hon. Members of Parliament in this House such as Hon. Chifumu Kingdom Banda, SC …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: … who is, indeed, among the few Zambians who have worked hard to invest in rural areas.

Mr Mulyata: What has he done?

Mr Kapeya: Hon. Chifumu Banda is doing very well in his constituency.

Hon. Government Members: What about you?

Mr Kapeya: This Government must encourage hon. Members of Parliament to take a lead in developing the areas they represent.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: This is the only way this country will create jobs in order to cut on the long list of the unemployed in this country.

Mr Daka: What has Sata done in Mpika?

Mr Kapeya: Mr Speaker, there is also a need to create incentives for the people in the Diaspora who may be interested in coming back to take part in growing our economy. The incentives I am talking about are like the ones extended to traders from “Sasa” Africa or …

Interruptions

Mr Kapeya: … those that were extended to the mining companies. These are the incentives that should be extended to Zambians who want to participate in the development of rural areas.

Mr Speaker, I am always at pains to see Zambians …

Ms Cifire: On a point of order, Sir.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Ms Cifire: Mr Speaker, I rarely rise on points of order, but is the hon. Member of Parliament for Mpika in order to keep confusing us even after your stimulus plan …

Laughter

Ms Cifire: … by talking about easterners and worse still, he is now talking about “Sasa” Africa?

Laughter

Ms Cifire: I am wondering where this “Sasa” Africa is.

Laughter

Mr Cifire: Is he in order, Sir?

Mr Speaker: The hon. Deputy Minister of Sport, Youth and Child Development is encouraging the Chair to come up with more stimulus packages …

Laughter

Mr Speaker: For the time being, the hon. Member for Mpika Central may continue.

Laughter

Mr Kapeya: Mr Speaker, I thank you for your protection. Sir, we have traders from South Africa …

Laughter

Mr Kapeya: … who have established their businesses in Zambia. These are the traders I am referring to and likewise the incentives that were extended to them.

Sir, I was talking about the Zambians who have acquired wealth in this country, but have decided to invest it outside Zambia. It is allowed for anybody to invest wherever they like because there are no restrictions, but let us ensure we invest in our country, then the surplus can be moved to other countries. Today, some patriotic Zambians have really invested their wealth locally. Many of them move out of the country to invest their wealth in Europe immediately they become wealthy. Others have invested in hotels in South Africa. This is the kind of attitude that I am saying does not augur well with a poor country such as Zambia. They should not take the little that is supposed to develop this country outside. There is a need for patriotism among Zambians at the moment. Not until we develop our rural areas, shall we see the creation of jobs. Without that, we will continue listening to the same song by the MMD Government about creating employment opportunities.
I will repeat, the Government alone cannot create employment opportunities. As well-to-do Zambians, we need to also participate or come on board and participate in the creation of employment in this country.

Mr Speaker, I was saddened when the President talked about the banning of the crop or grain levy by district councils. Most councils have employed officers specifically for the crop levy. Banning that kind of levy means freezing their employment. I am saying so because the officers who were employed by the councils will be unemployed. Could I request the Government to reconsider the idea of banning the crop levy by district councils.

Mr Speaker, CDF has definitely done a lot in our constituencies. For some of us who are in the Opposition, CDF has made a great deal of improvement in our constituencies.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Mr Kapeya: Mr Speaker, therefore, there is a need for the Ministry of Finance and National Planning to come up with a K50 million increment in next year’s Budget. The hon. Minister should think about it. He promised that the CDF would come to K1 billion. This would be enough and it would take us a long way in developing a constituency. This is a humble request to the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to review CDF because the K650 million is not enough. My colleagues who have been to Mpika Central would bear me witness on this matter. I am sure they have seen the wonders we have performed through CDF. We therefore, request that you reconsider your stand and increase CDF to K1 billion in the next financial year.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Order!

I will suspend business for some minutes and we shall remain here.

Mr Nyirenda (Kamfinsa): Mr Speaker, thank you for according me the opportunity to express my views on behalf of the people of Kamfinsa. Before I go any further, I would like to thank the Government and NCC for having changed the budget cycle.

Interruptions

Mr Nyirenda: It is, indeed, a unanimous decision that we can debate the budget for a full twelve months’ period. We shall ensure that the budget will be well executed without leaving anything in the coffers.

Mr Speaker, the 2010 Budget gives hope to the nation and its citizens. It is inspiring in the sense that we are in the global credit crunch whereby we expect such a budget for Zambia to resurrect it from its present status. It is gratifying to see that mines and banks are being opened. More employment opportunities are being created while other countries are in a very bad state of affairs. Therefore, I thank the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning for making an effort to bring the budget to this level.

Sir, the increase of the budget to K16.7 billion is not a joke, considering the situation we are in today. Looking at the prevailing situation in the country, I would like to say that we should reduce on the dependence on donor funding, but instead, widen our tax base. For our survival, we should not have lazy arms. The economic evidence is not that aid is the answer if growth is the question. We can abandon aid if we consider revisiting our tax regime. This tax regime could have made us have a better status, hence we have the gravity, but we have not applied the windfall tax that we have been crying for. This year’s Budget has reduced dependence on donor funding. It is now 14.7 per cent. This tells us that we have got hope that one day, we shall reduce it even to 3 per cent. The emphasis is that we should not have this syndrome of donor dependence.

Mr Speaker, it is easy to talk about diversification and many other things, but are we serious about our pronouncements and the promises we make? All Presidents and hon. Ministers give very good policies, but the problem is implementation. I am repeating this for the second time. It is imperative that every member of the Executive looks after his or her own ministry to ensure that funds are utilised properly by the controlling officers. The hon. Members of Parliament should also take a keen interest in monitoring the use of funds on the activities allocated to their areas.

Sir, this is an activity-based budget, it is, therefore, important that we update ourselves with whatever happens in our areas and bring this to the attention of the Executive in this House or their respective offices. For Zambia to develop, it needs a joint effort of people working together, as a team, and fighting this white crime that we have. The white crime is doing us more harm than good. One might ask what the reference to white crime is. It is corruption. If corruption is our biggest enemy, should we leave it to be fought by only one particular institution which is the Anti-Corruption Commission? What about you and I? Can we not report the suspects who are trying to drain our country’s resources to the Anti-Corruption Commission? I am, therefore, appealing to this august House that we should report all the suspects or the culprits who are involved in this white crime that we are experiencing day in and day out.

Mr Speaker, it would not be bad if we eradicated poverty and hunger in our areas. Yes, we can do this if only we work as a team. Whenever we are on the Floor of this House, let us give suggestions and alternatives rather than always looking for faults in other people. If we have all the answers, let us contribute in this House. Let us do what we can. All we should do is add one plus one, which is two, and not one plus one minus one. If we do that, we will not get anywhere. It is, therefore, important that we work together and listen to the complaints of the people.

Mr Speaker, colleagues in my constituency are eager to hear about the economic growth and diversification that we have gone into. However, they are also concerned about our donor dependency. They have sent me here to express this fear to this listening Government. Let us revisit the tax regime, especially the windfall tax. It is only the windfall tax that will help us out of the state of affairs we are in at the moment. 

Mr Speaker, I would, therefore, like to appeal to this august House that every member of the Executive be responsible for his or her area if we are to improve infrastructure development in our country. Then we shall see a road through to development. In the absence of road infrastructure, we cannot have any development.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nyirenda: As you are aware, Zambia is a landlocked country. We need better roads to Botswana and Malawi. Even the internal roads are vital for our development. However, nothing much is going on in terms of road and infrastructure development.

Mr Speaker, it is very exciting and pleasing to hear that the Government has allocated K60.7billion to Kitwe and Ndola, but this is nothing, but a drop in the ocean. It may only cater for one road. The Chibuluma Road, which is used by heavy trucks, will probably use up all this money.

Mr Speaker, a lot has been said about education and skills development. This is another milestone for this Government. They are doing a good job in ensuring that more schools are built in our rural areas. We should also commend the private sector for putting up community schools. Therefore, I would like to encourage local investors to invest more in education because an educated nation is a healthy and working nation. Education is cardinal and I thank the hon. Minister of Education for the effort he has made in putting up schools throughout the country.
 
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nyirenda: Mr Speaker, we appreciate the effort that the Ministry of Health is making. The ministry’s commitment to providing quality health care services to mother Zambia must be commended. Access to quality health services has significantly improved. However, let us not abuse the funds that the donors are giving us. Let us crosscheck our controlling officers and end users of the funds that the donors give us. Let us guard this money jealously. Let us see to it that the money is put to good use. Of course once beaten, twice shy. We have learnt a lesson.  This lesson is attributed to the work of the Executive who have unearthed this scam, which did not start yesterday but way back.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nyirenda: I think that if we keep rotating the personnel in the controlling offices, we shall unearth a lot of such thefts or white collar crimes.

Mr Speaker, as we are aware, mining is the mainstay of our economy. I would like to suggest to this Government to utilise any means of taxation to uplift the living standards of the people in this country. The mineral royalty tax was meant to be shared with the residents in mining areas. However, what is happening on the Copperbelt, for example, a major mining area, is that development is very slow compared to Lusaka which is a mere commercial place. Where is the money in these mining areas going to? In Chief Mushili’s area, where emeralds are mined, nothing is happening. The chief is still sleeping in a ramshackle. There are no schools, and yet emeralds are mined in that area.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nyirenda: I think that the Government should seriously consider sharing the little they have with the people in this area. 

In conclusion, I would like the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to seriously consider the plea of the people of the Copperbelt. There are a lot of requirements that the people have. Please consider re-employing the people who were retrenched during the recession. Do not employ anyhow. First consider the people who lost employment because of the global financial crisis.

Mr Speaker, with these few words, I thank you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa (Chifunabuli): Mr Speaker, I thank you for the opportunity you have given me to contribute to debate on the Budget Address by the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning.

Mr Speaker, I would like to begin my address by saying that we have one country which must be developed by all of us. Whatever we say or do, must be for the good of our country. There will be voices of assent, agreeing to what has been said and there will be voices of dissent, disagreeing with what has been said in the Budget Speech. I do, however, believe that we must take a leaf from both those who are assenting through taking note of their points and also those dissenting by taking note of their points. Let us ask ourselves why those who are dissenting are disagreeing. What are they are saying which will make our country better? Even out of a mold of rubble, there might be one gem that will be good for the country. 

Mr Speaker, we must always bear in mind that each and every one of us should, when debating, and I believe that we do, be aware that whatever we say or do should be contributing to the development of our country.

The Budget Speech has come and we are debating it. I want to bring out a few issues that I feel the Government needs to take cognisance of and be able, if possible, to make necessary changes on.

Mr Speaker, let me begin with an item that has been in my heart for a long time, CDF. I happen to be one of those, among the three, who initiated this programme. Today, it is an accepted programme, which began with tears and threats of being expelled from the MMD at the time. The reason I am saying this is to emphasise the point that sometimes things that do not seem and sound nice at first, and are coming from people you may not trust, may actually be the things you need to make the necessary changes for our country.

Mr Speaker, CDF is the only fund that goes directly to the projects which the people want.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: This is critical to development. Development is not about what we imagine people in various localities want. It is about what people in those localities believe is development. I may think that I am rich because I own a car. Another Zambian thinks he/she is rich because they own cattle. If you are dealing with the two of us, obviously, the interests will be different.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: We need to look at these issues from that angle if we are going to develop our country. We need to map our country according to the interests and desires of the people in the localities.

Sir, CDF does exactly this because it goes to the people who supply the requirements. They outline the projects they want done. They plan and write the project proposals and consequently, when those proposals are approved, then the Government is doing exactly what the people in that particular locality want, which is a plus for the Government.

Mr Speaker, what I have noticed concerning CDF is that when it is coming in the budget, it is still at the behest of the Government in power. There is law that ensures that CDF rightfully belongs to the people of this country. This is where the problem is. We need to go beyond that.

Sir, I want to say something that I have never said before. I had written a letter to the late President of the Republic of Zambia. In the letter, I told the President that we needed to institutionalise CDF in our law and that by establishing it, he had already set a precedent which no one would take away from him.

I know that he received it very well, but unfortunately my advice was not followed because of certain Cabinet Ministers who I will not name, even though they know that things should have been done better. At the end of the day, the President passed on and CDF is still at the behest of those in power.

Mr Speaker, my humble advice to the Government is that it should look at CDF as a fund that will provide money to local communities to engage in projects that they will come up with themselves.

 Mr Muntanga: Very Good!

Mr Mwansa: Look at it as a fund that the community decides on in their own right.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, if you look at things that way, you will obviously help this country begin to develop the grassroots from the base. I would, therefore, like to plead with the Government to ensure that there is nothing sinister about CDF. Even when it takes development to areas dominated by the Opposition, please remember that it is easy to explain to the people that the money comes from the Government.

 Mr Muntanga: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: There will no difficulty at all because people will realise that this Government cares for them despite the fact that they did not vote for it.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Correct!

Mr Mwansa: Therefore, you make people begin to rethink their opposition to your Government.

 Mr Muntanga: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: If you do not take development to their areas, you are confirming that you do not like them. In effect, you are hardening their stance against you.

Mr Speaker, I also want to talk about the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries. I will particularly talk about fisheries because that is an area in the hearts of the people that have brought me here, the people of my constituency. The last time I asked a question regarding fisheries, I heard that there were no plans to restock fish in the Bangweulu and Mweru-Wantipa lakes. Yes! I was told that. I watched and listened in utter shock because, you se, when you make such statements on the Floor of this House, you are telling the people of Luapula Province that you do not care about them when their lives revolve around fishing.

 Mr Muntanga: Correct!

Mr Mwansa: Such responses are very careless and unhelpful to the Government.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: As far as we are concerned, fishing is something that is in our blood. Let me suggest a way forward for the Government if it will listen. There are certain dambos in the Luapula and Northern provinces whose access to the main lake can be blocked. The Government can create fish stocks in those dambos. The dambos are a hive of activity because there is already some fish in there. All the Government needs to do is ensure that there is a fish ban throughout the year in those areas. Then, at the opportune time, it can allow the fish to go back into the lake. That will be very easy to do. The Government has just been saying the restocking exercise would cost a lot of money when that is not the case. It is a very simple project.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: I can assure you that if you enlarge the fish stocks in real terms for the people of Luapula Province, they will change their minds and vote for you, but if the Government does not do that, it is just creating problems for itself.

 The restocking of fish can easily be done in the Luapula and Western provinces. Do not listen to those who are saying it is impossible. It is the Government that must put the necessary policies in place for this exercise. It is the Government which is finally answerable to the people of Zambia. If the Government has a policy for fish restocking, it must ensure that the Civil Service carries out the programme because it will be those in Cabinet to go while those who work in the Civil Service will remain.

 Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Therefore, I would like to plead with those in Government to look at these issues from that perspective. We mean well when we advise that way.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, if the Government does that in the Luapula, Northern, Western and Southern provinces, it will discover that it will actually be doing what the people want it to do. I, therefore, plead with this Government to just listen to us because we mean well.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Mr Speaker, I want to congratulate the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning on increasing funds to the education sector.

Sir, education is at the heart of development. A populous, which is not educated, can easily be manipulated and controlled. A populous that does not understand what you are doing, is not going to help you at all.  Therefore, putting more money in the education sector, as the Government has done, is a noble task and responsibility.

Mr Speaker, let me go further and say that by funding the education sector, the Government is also indirectly helping to reduce the disease burden in the country because when people are educated, they know how to look after their lives. They understand hygiene and a lot of things, including nutrition. If you put money in education, but do not revise the current syllabus, then you are undermining your own efforts.   Let me elaborate that point. Education is not only about academic knowledge of what is going on, but also teaching people to think independently. It is about empowering people to have life skills, skills that they can be utilised even if they do not go far in education. It is about teaching people to lead a particular way of life.

 Mr Muntanga: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa:  I am therefore, appealing to the hon. Minister of Education to, please, come up with a programme to revise syllabi and find a way of fusing in survival and health skills for our children. You can find a way of fusing those skills into our education system. The end result will be that we will have an educated populous, a population that can survive on its own and will look after itself properly. It will put in place all the necessary health preventive measures.

 Mr Muntanga: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Despite saying that, I do not mean to undermine the role played by the Ministry of Health. I want to say something that I had said almost ten to fifteen years ago. As long as Zambians depend on medical facilities and medicines as a way of combating the disease burden of this country, the country will lose a lot of people in death because our finances cannot match the requirements of the health sector. It is time to change our strategy and look at preventive measures as a starting point. It may take a little longer to put them in place, but at the end of the day, we are going to have better results. The Government is spending too much money on drugs, caring for the sick and forgetting that the sick come from a society which has a huge disease burden.

 Mr Muntanga: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwansa: Therefore, we need to tackle diseases from the communities in which these people who go to the hospitals come from. If we do not do that, it does not matter how much we put in the fight against disease, we shall still lose it.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Order!

(Debate Adjourned)

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The House adjourned at 1255 hours until 1430 hours on Tuesday, 20th October, 2009.