Tuesday, 19th September, 2023

Tuesday, 19^th September, 2023

The House met at 1430 hours

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

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ANNOUNCEMENTS BY MADAM SPEAKER

COMMONWEALTH WOMEN PARLIAMENTARIANS AFRICA REGION POSITIONS

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, I wish to inform the House that the Commonwealth Women Parliamentarians (CWP) Africa Region, which is an organ of the Commonwealth Parliamentary Association (CPA) with the objective of promoting gender equality and equity in the work of the CPA, has a Steering Committee that consists of the Chairperson, the Vice-Chairperson and four Sub-Regional Representatives, one from each of the four sub-regions, namely Central Africa, East Africa, West Africa and Southern Africa.

At the end of the 85^th CPA Africa Region Executive Committee Meeting held in Dar-es-Salaam, Tanzania, from 2^nd to 7^th August, 2023, three positions of the CWP Africa Region fell vacant. The vacancies are as follows:

Chairperson;

Vice-Chairperson; and

(c) Central Africa CWP Sub-Regional Representative.

In line with the leadership rotation roster adopted by the CWP, the above positions will be distributed as follows:

the position of Chairperson has rotated to the East Africa Sub-Region;

the position of Vice-Chairperson has rotated to the Central Africa Sub-Region; and

(c) the position of CWP Central Africa Sub-Regional Representative has rotated to Zambia.

In this regard, the CPA Zambia Branch Executive Committee held a meeting on Wednesday, 6^th September, 2023, and resolved to nominate Ms Emeldah Munashabantu, the hon. Member of Parliament for Mapatizya, …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: … as CWP Central Africa Sub-Regional Representative for the period 2023 to 2026. Ms Munashabantu will be unveiled at a business meeting of the CWP Africa Region to be held virtually tomorrow, Wednesday, 20^th September, 2023, at 1000 hours.

I wish to take this opportunity to congratulate Ms Munashabantu for her well-deserved nomination.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: I further wish to urge all female hon. Members of Parliament to attend and participate in that very important meeting tomorrow.

The notice of the meeting and the logging-in credentials have already been circulated to all female hon. Members of Parliament.

I thank you.

SESSIONAL COMMITTEES – MEMBERSHIP

Madam Speaker: I wish to inform the House that in accordance with the provisions of Standing Order No. 166(5), I have made the following adjustments to the Composition of Committees:

GENERAL PURPOSE COMMITTEES

Public Accounts Committee (1)

Mr Lackson M. Lungu, MP

Committee on Delegated Legislation (1)

Rev. Given Katuta, MP

Committee on Media, Information and Communication Technologies (1)

Mr Elias Daka, MP

PORTFOLIO COMMITTEES

Committee on Education, Science and Technology (2)

Mr George Chisanga, MP

Mr Pavyuma Kalobo, MP

Committee on Health, Community Development and Social Services (1)

Ms Marjorie Nakaponda, MP

Committee on Local Governance, Housing and Chiefs’ Affairs (2)

Mr George K. Kandafula, MP

Ms Emeldah Munashabantu, MP

Committee on Cabinet Affairs (2)

Mr Newton Samakayi, MP

Mr Peter Phiri, MP

Committee on Transport, Works and Supply (2)

Ms Tasila Lungu, MP

Mr Joel Chibuye, MP

Committee on Youth, Sport and Child Matters (2)

Mr Jay E. Banda, MP

Mr George Chisanga, MP

Committee on National Guidance and Gender Matters (1)

Mr Mutotwe Kafwaya, MP

Committee on National Security and Foreign Affairs (1)

Ms Chrizoster Halwiindi, MP

I thank you.

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MATTERS OF URGENT PUBLIC IMPORTANCE

MR J. E. BANDA, HON. MEMBER FOR PETAUKE CENTRAL, ON HER HONOUR THE VICE-PRESIDENT, MRS NALUMANGO, ON PEOPLE IN PETAUKE CENTRAL NOT HAVING THREE MEALS A DAY

Mr J. E. Banda (Petauke Central): On a matter of urgent public importance, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: A matter of urgent public importance is raised.

Mr J. E. Banda: Thank you, Madam Speaker, for giving me this opportunity, on behalf of the good people of Petauke Central, to raise a matter of urgent public importance. Before I do that, let me congratulate the people who carried the day during the awards ceremony. I thank management for coming up with the awards ceremony to motivate the people. Indeed, those people who just make maiden speeches have been motivated. If you want to get an award, just make a maiden speech.

Laughter

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member, raise the matter of urgent public importance. That is now water under the bridge.

Mr J. E. Banda: Madam Speaker, the matter is directed to Her Honour the Vice-President.

Madam Speaker, the people of Petauke Central Constituency have been struggling to have three meals a day. In the Eastern Province, especially in the areas of the valley, –

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member for Petauke Central!

You know how to raise a matter of urgent public importance. Raise the matter. Do not debate. What is the matter that you want to raise?

Mr J. E. Banda: The matter is directed to Her Honour the Vice-President, Madam Speaker, and it is about the –

Madam Speaker: I have got that, but what is the gist of the matter that you want to raise?

Mr J. E. Banda: Madam Speaker, the people of Petauke Central Constituency, the Eastern Province and Zambia at large are asking the New Dawn Government, through Her Honour the Vice-President, to give the people of Petauke relief food because they are struggling; they do not have food. So, they are asking the Government for help so that they can have food on the table. We do not have the Zambia National Service (ZNS). Other areas have the ZNS –

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Petauke Central, I have taken note. Please, file in a question addressed to Her Honour the Vice-President, under Standing Order No. 74.

MR J. DAKA, HON. MEMBER FOR CHADIZA, ON THE HON. MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, MR MTOLO, ON ADDITIONAL REQUIREMENT FOR FARMERS TO ACCESS FARMER INPUT SUPPORT PROGRAMME INPUTS

Mr J. Daka (Chadiza): On a matter of urgent public importance, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: A matter of urgent public importance is raised.

Mr J. Daka: Madam Speaker, my matter of urgent public importance is directed to the hon. Minister of Agriculture.

Madam Speaker, farmers in my constituency are very worried. Our District Commissioner (DC) is making pronouncements to the effect that there is an additional requirement to those that farmers know to participate in the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP). Farmers are being told that they need to provide proof of sale of any crop to the Food Reserve Agency (FRA) in form of a receipt for them to qualify to participate in FISP in the 2023/2024 Farming Season. If this is not handled properly, it might cause food insecurity in my constituency and the country at large.

Madam Speaker, is the hon. Minister in order to remain quiet when farmers in my constituency expected him to come to the Floor of this House and state the Government’s position on this matter?

Madam Speaker, I seek your serious guidance on this matter.

Madam Speaker: I believe, sometime last week, a matter was raised on whether the Government would maintain the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) or the programme would be replaced by another facility. I ordered the hon. Minister to issue a ministerial statement in the House. So, as the hon. Minister addresses that, I am sure, he will also address this issue. I do not know what day we had agreed on.

Interruptions

Madam Speaker: Oh, the ministerial statement is actually ready. Is it supposed to be issued today? I think, it is not today because it has to be approved by Her Honour the Vice-President, who is the Leader of Government Business in the House. Can it be rendered tomorrow? Tomorrow, the hon. Minister will come and address that issue.

MR TWASA, HON. MEMBER FOR KASENENGWA, ON THE HON. MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, MR MTOLO, ON CANCELLATION OF FERTILISER TENDERS

Mr Twasa (Kasenengwa): On a matter of urgent public importance, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: A matter of urgent public importance is raised.

Mr Twasa: Madam Speaker, thank you for giving me this opportunity to raise a matter of urgent public importance. This matter is directed to the hon. Minister of Agriculture. He has become very popular in this House.

Madam Speaker, the matter I am raising today is very serious.

Hon. Members: How serious?

Mr Twasa: It is very serious, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, you have an idea about the Member speaking being a farmer. I come from a rural constituency where people are predominantly farmers.

Madam Speaker, there has been a tendency of cancelling fertiliser tenders, which is causing a lot of panic in farmers. Last year, when farmers were supposed to receive top-dressing fertiliser, they received basal-dressing fertiliser. When farmers were worrying about their crops, that is when top-dressing was being distributed. The –

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Raise your matter of urgent public importance. Do not debate.

Mr Twasa: Madam Speaker, I seek your serious indulgence. We need to be addressed by my elder brother, my mentor and my neighbour in the constituency. What is happening with the procurement of fertiliser? Last year, we had the same problem, until the Government single-sourced –

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Mr Twasa: Are we going to have the same problem this year?

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Since the cancellation of fertiliser tenders has been ongoing, it is not of recent occurrence. I advise that you file in a question addressed to the hon. Minister of Agriculture.

Thank you very much.

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QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

GREAT LAKES REGION BECOMING ONE OF ZAMBIA’S MAJOR EXPORT

MARKETS

31. Mr Chanda (Kanchibiya) asked the Minister of Transport and Logistics:

what measures the Government is taking to ensure that the Great Lakes Region becomes one of Zambia’s major export markets;

how the Government intends to use Mpulungu Harbour as a gateway to the Great Lakes Region; and

whether the Government has any plans to create shorter routes from the Copperbelt Province and the North-Western Province to Mpulungu Harbour to enable faster transportation of goods.

The Minister of Transport and Logistics (Mr Tayali): Madam Speaker, the Government has recognised the lucrative markets and trade opportunities in the Africa Continental Free Trade Area (AfCFTA), which includes the Common Market for Eastern and Southern Africa (COMESA), the Southern African Development Community (SADC) and the Great Lakes Region. These markets are great opportunities for Zambian goods. In order to enhance market access to the Great Lakes Region, the Government is implementing the following measures:

establishment of strong bilateral relations with the countries in the Great Lakes Region, including the Republics of Burundi, Ethiopia, Tanzania, Uganda, Kenya, the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), South Sudan and Rwanda. It is for this reason that the Government of the Republic of Zambia, through the Ministry of Transport and Logistics, has written a letter of intent to join the Central Transport Corridor Agreement, which will be merged with the Dar-es-Salaam Corridor. Further, Zambia has signed a bilateral trade agreement with the DRC which, once operationalised, will enhance trade between the two countries via the Great Lakes Region;

(b) engagements with trading partners, through the Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry, to eliminate existing barriers to trade using existing regional mechanisms such as the tripartite online non-tariff barriers elimination mechanism as well as the secretariats of the regional economic communities;

(c) formalisation of informal cross-border trade. The Government, through the Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry, has set up a well-equipped trade information desk at the harbour to provide support services to small-scale cross-border traders to formalise informal trade, thereby ensuring that the country is able to increase her non-traditional exports to the Great Lakes Region; and

(d) hosting of roadshows and regional trade fairs to ensure market access for Zambian products and resources. The Government is also facilitating and promoting business linkages and partnerships to increase trade and investment in the Great Lakes Region.

Madam Speaker, in order to enhance the use of Mpulungu Harbour as a gateway to the Great Lakes Region, the Government, through the Ministry of Transport and Logistics, has embarked on the modernisation and expansion of the harbour. The modernisation will include the expansion of the quay platform from 20 m to 300 m. This will reduce vessel delays being experienced and enhance the cargo handling capacity of the harbour from the current 200,000 metric tonnes per annum to 1,000,000 metric tonnes per annum. The expansion will include increased capacity for cargo storage, a container deport and cargo handling facilities for loading and offloading ships efficiently.

Madam Speaker, the feasibility study for the project which is supported by the African Development Bank (AfDB), has since been concluded, and the Government is mobilising resources to modernise and expand the harbour.

Madam Speaker, a shorter route to Mpulungu Harbour already exists via the Pedicle Road through Mansa, Luwingu, Kasama and Mbala. Due to the state of the road, the Government, through the Road Development Agency (RDA), has engaged a contractor to rehabilitate the last 11 km of it as well as undertake spot improvement works on the remaining 60 km. Works on the Pedicle Road commenced on 11^th January, 2023, and are expected to be completed by 10^th October, 2023. The progress of works on the projects is currently at 18 per cent. Further, the Government is undertaking pothole patching on the Kasama via Mbala to Mpulungu Road, and those works are currently at 90 per cent, as well as on the Mansa to Chembe Road. Additionally, the Government plans to patch the potholes on the Kasama/Luwingu Road, and works will commence once funds are made available.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Chanda: Madam Speaker, allow me to thank the hon. Minister for his response, which is quite thorough.

Madam Speaker, my follow-up question to the hon. Minister is with regard to the letter of intent for Zambia to join the Central Transport Corridor Agreement. Is there any projection for the timeframe in which Zambia’s aspiration to join the Central Transport Corridor Agreement will come to fruition and, in that regard, the benefits thereof accrue to this country?

Mr Tayali: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for the brilliant follow-up question.

Madam Speaker, it is suffice for me to say that the talks have really advanced. Not only does Zambia wish to join the corridor, but the current members of the said corridor are equally pushing. Realising Zambia’s strategic geographic location, it is imperative that we become members as soon as possible but for my busy schedule, having accompanied His Excellency the President on that very successful China State visit, …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Tayali: … by now, progress would have already been made. At the technical level, my Permanent Secretary (PS) has already combed out all the relevant issues that must be covered in the agreement. I expect that, sooner rather than later, I shall join my counterparts, the Ministers responsible for transport who are members of the corridor for the signing ceremony.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mundubile (Mporokoso): Madam Speaker, mine is on alternative policy. Mpulungu Harbour and, indeed, Lake Tanganyika provide a natural gateway to the Great Lakes. Previously, there was an exposition in the Northern Province. One of the areas that were looked at was how industries can be created around Mpulungu Harbour, and one of the options was to improve the milling capabilities in Mpulungu and set up industries as seeing that two of the products that are finding their way into the Great Lakes are mealie-meal and flour. As opposed to delivering them as finished products, the proposal was to set up milling industries in Mpulungu as a way of creating jobs. So, my question is: Working together with the Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry, the Ministry of Small and Medium Enterprise Development and the Ministry of Agriculture, does the ministry intend to continue looking at that option?

Mr Tayali: Madam Speaker, I thank my brother, the Leader of the Opposition in this House, for this good question.

Madam Speaker, indeed, I wish to concur with the hon. Member’s assertion as to what would be important in order for this country to maximise the Great Lakes’ potential by using Lake Tanganyika as a gateway to the Great Lakes Region.

Perhaps, Madam Speaker, the question is what comes first. Is it the chicken or the egg? The New Dawn Administration, being methodical, realises that, perhaps, it might be premature for the value addition industry chains to be established. I think, the issue of connectivity comes in front and centre, to provide the logistics in not only the road network, but also our future plans of connecting Mpulungu to our railway network, from the Tanzania-Zambia Railway Authority (TAZARA) to Nseluka and from Nseluka to Mpulungu. I think, that will be very important for us to move the relevant products that may be produced in terms of value addition and readiness for export to the Great Lakes Region. So, it is, indeed, part of our grand scheme of things that this country, for once, begins to do things that will be sustainable and have a greater impact on its general economic status.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Chanda: Madam Speaker, let me also thank the Leader of the Opposition for his supplementary question. Maybe, the question should be one of getting the chicken to exist alongside the egg.

Laughter

Mr Chanda: Madam Speaker, in his response, the hon. Minister spoke about the improvement of infrastructure and logistics for maritime trade on Mpulungu Harbour, which includes modernising the harbour. What is the cost of the modernisation project?

Mr Tayali: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for this question.

Madam Speaker, the cost of the modernisation and expansion of Mpulungu Harbour is estimated at US$72 million.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr E. Tembo (Feira): Madam Speaker, I take cognisance of the fact that the hon. Minister indicated that the Government appreciates the export market and its potential in the Great Lakes Region. In view of this investment and, of course, considering that the hon. Minister has stated that the Government is methodical, has he itemised the products and services that will be exported to the Great Lakes Region?

Mr Tayali: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Feira, who is a brother and, indeed, a friend, for this question.

Madam Speaker, like I stated earlier, I think, my responsibility is to ensure that the connectivity aspects are catered for. As a country, it is a pity that for many years, we have not had a vessel to talk about capable of ferrying sufficient tonnage of our cargo to the Great Lakes Region. It is even sadder that countries that, not long ago, were behind Zambia have today taken front and centre stage. Countries such as our friendly neighbour of Tanzania are building massive ships about to be launched on that particular water body. I think, it is important that we move speedily and, as the New Dawn Administration, we are going to put our house in order.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Member asked what sort of goods we will be looking at. I am sure, he can file in a question addressed to the hon. Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry, and he all be will be availed the necessary details.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, we need to make progress. Three people have indicated, and I will allow them, but they should be precise and to the point.

Mr Katakwe (Solwezi East): Madam Speaker, I appreciate the hon. Minister’s responses.

Madam Speaker, I had an interaction with the management at the port in Mpulungu. One of the issues they raised was on the archaic laws governing the port’s operation, as compared to the way the Tanzania Ports Authority (TPA) operates. Does the Government have any intention to repeal the archaic laws governing the operation of the port in Mpulungu so that there is efficiency in the delivery of the services that the hon. Minister has itemised?

Mr Tayali: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Solwezi East for this question.

Madam Speaker, I want to state categorically and without fear of contradiction, as the hon. Minister of Home Affairs and Internal Security would say, that as the President has said, time has come for us to identify any rigidity that stands in the way of development in this country. So, yes, we shall look at the relevant laws and ensure that they are harmonised with modern trends so that the maritime sub-sector is allowed to flourish.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mabeta (Kankoyo): Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister of Transport and Logistics for indicating that the works on the Pedicle Road are at 80 per cent. However, what measures has the Government put in place to ensure that the road will last long? I ask this because, in the past, we have seen the road maintained every year. Huge sums of money have been spent on the road, but the people of Mufulira and Kankoyo do not get the value for the money.

Mr Tayali: Madam Speaker, I think, the hon. Member must draw comfort from the pronouncement that the New Dawn Administration has already made on issues surrounding not only the cost of projects, but also the quality and timely delivery of such projects.

Madam Speaker, as the New Dawn Administration, we would, obviously, not want to fall into what the Latin maxim says, “Inchitid infovium confechit”. We do not want to fall into the same trap our hon. Colleagues fell in. We shall do everything possible and go out of our way to ensure that projects last for a long time so that Zambia does not keep pouring its meagre resources into a bottomless pit. So, the hon. Member can rest assured that the Government, through the Ministry of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development, is taking these matters very seriously. We will supervise the projects so that they are delivered to the right specifications.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Madam Speaker: The last question will be from the hon. Member for Lubansenshi.

Mr Chewe (Lubansenshi): Madam Speaker, thank you for giving me the opportunity, on behalf of the people of Lubansenshi Constituency, to ask a supplementary question.

Madam Speaker, the exportation of products and services at Mpulungu Harbour, definitely, cannot be achieved if Kasaba Bay is not incorporated into the model. My question to the hon. Minister is: What measures are being put in place to ensure that Kasaba Bay contributes to the increase in the exportation of products and services at Mpulungu Harbour?

Mr Tayali: Madam Speaker, I am sure, the hon. Member is fully aware of some of the interventions that the New Dawn Administration is taking insofar as bringing Kasaba Bay to a position of what it ought to be in the region. We are not only promoting tourism in what we are calling the Northern Circuit, but also intend to put up a really good airport in that area. You may have already seen that we have advertised for consultancy services for the implementation of the project, which will play a meaningful role for those who will not want to use the road. As you know, there is a fund of US$100 million ...

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Tayali: ... that this Government has already been bequeathed with, that will go a long way in improving infrastructure, particularly roads. So, we intend to put up an airport that is different from what is there now so that we can meet the requirements of Kasaba Bay playing its part in development.

Eng. Milupi interjected.

Mr Tayali: Cheche, indeed.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

REPAIR OF COMPUTED TOMOGRAPHY SCAN AT UNIVERSITY TEACHING HOSPITAL

32. Mr Mtayachalo (Chama North) asked the Minister of Health:

when the Government will repair the Computed Tomography (CT) Scan machine at the University Teaching Hospital (UTH), which has not been working since August, 2020; and

what the cause of the delay in repairing the machine is.

The Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development (Eng. Milupi) (on behalf of the Minister of Health (Mrs Masebo)): Madam Speaker, the Government will repair the Computed Tomography (CT) Scan at the University Teaching Hospital (UTH) this year. The House may wish to note that the manufacturer’s authorised distributor, which is Techmed Africa Limited, has already done the preliminary needs assessment for the repairs needed.

Madam Speaker, the House may wish to note that the delay in repairing the CT Scan at the UTH was due to inadequate funds allocated for procurement, maintenance and servicing of medical equipment in the 2020 and 2021 financial years.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mtayachalo: Madam Speaker, issues of health are very delicate. Is the hon. Minister aware that patients at the University Teaching Hospital (UTH) use the Computed Tomography (CT) Scan at the Cancer Diseases Hospital except those on the National Health Insurance Management Authority (NHIMA) Scheme, and those with emergency cases. So, poor people are having serious difficulties accessing the service. Is the hon. Minister aware that we are losing lives as a result of the delay in having the CT Scan at the UTH repaired?

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Chama North for the supplementary question.

Madam Speaker, the Government is, indeed, aware of the need for all equipment to be operational in order to serve its people insofar as health matters are concerned. It is for this reason that in my answer, I stated that the CT Scan at the UTH will be repaired this year. Having recognised that in the 2020 and 2021 financial years, there was no allocation of resources for the repair of equipment, this Government has allocated resources to ensure that this situation is corrected. As matter of fact, the Government has increased budgetary provisions for procurement and servicing of medical equipment in 2022 and 2023, that is to K196,228,890 and K900 million, respectively, compared with the K14,590,000 for 2020 and almost nothing in 2021. These substantial increases in budgetary allocations do, indeed, speak to the fact that the Government has recognised the need for the equipment to be repaired.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Chama North, do you have any other question?

Mr Mtayachalo: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister said that due to budgetary constraints, there was no allocation for the repair of the CT Scan. Would he be in a position to know the cost of a CT Scan?

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, I think, it is important to state that the cost of CT scans has been taken into account, but what we are talking about here is the repair. If the hon. Member now wants to know what we are doing with respect to new CT Scans, let me state as follows: the Government is working with partners, that is the World Bank and the Global Fund for Women, Children and Adolescents, through the Zambia Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19) Emergency Response and Health System Procedures Project, for two CT Scans; one for the UTH, that is the old adult hospital, and the second one for Levy Mwanawasa University Teaching Hospital to be delivered and installed by December, 2023. The non-functional CT Scan machine at the UTH will be repaired. So, by the end of this year, we will have two new CT Scans, and the one that is not functional will be repaired.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Member specifically asked about the cost. I do not have the figure, but suffice for me to say that we will repair and deliver the CT Scans. This is indicative of the fact that adequate provision has been made for the purchase of the two machines and the repair of the non-functional one at the UTH.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: The question is specifically on one item: When is the CT Scan going to be repaired? The response was that it will be repaired in 2023, and funds have been made available. So, let us make progress. It was a specific question.

CONSTRUCTION OF STAFF HOUSES AT POLICE POSTS IN KABWATA

33. Mr Tayengwa (Kabwata) asked the Minister of Home Affairs and Internal Security:

whether the Government has any plans to construct staff houses at the following police posts in Kabwata Parliamentary Constituency:

Maxwell Sibongo;

Mary Mwango;

Godfrey Miyanda; and

Luckson Mapushi; and

if so, when the plans will be implemented.

The Minister of Home Affairs and Internal Security (Mr Mwiimbu): Madam Speaker, I wish to inform the House that the Government has plans to provide housing infrastructure for all police officers across the country, including those under the listed police posts, namely Maxwel Sibongo, Mary Mwango and Godfrey Miyanda. The Government intends to build the housing units in accordance with the available land at the police posts as follows:

there are twenty-three police officers at Maxwel Sibongo Police Post but, the available space can only accommodate ten houses;

there are twenty police officers at Mary Mwango Police Post but, the available space can only accommodate five houses;

there are thirty-three officers at Godfrey Miyanda Police Post but, the available space can only accommodate about four houses; and

there are twelve police officers at Luckson Mapushi Police Post, but there are no housing units. The building belongs to Kamwala South Secondary School and was built as a store room during the construction of the school. The Government has no immediate plans to construct houses at the police post, since the land belongs to the school. However, the Ministry of Education will be engaged on the possibility of building an appropriate structure and housing units to enhance security in the area.

Madam Speaker, the implementation of the plans at the three police posts will be done when funds are made available. The Constituency Development Committee in Kabwata Parliamentary Constituency is being engaged to consider the provision of funds for the construction of police houses at the three police posts.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Tayengwa: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has stated that the Government intends to build staff houses for police officers. In the past, we saw some parcels of land meant for police houses be invaded by cadres, who ended up putting up illegal structures. Does the ministry have any intention of starting the process of acquiring title deeds for the said police posts?

Mr Mwiimbu: Madam Speaker, you may recall that the President of the Republic of Zambia, Mr Hakainde Hichilema, directed all public institutions to ensure that land that belongs to the Government is protected and title deeds for all the infrastructure acquired. I would like to confirm that arising from that directive, we are working with the Ministry of Lands and Natural Resources, and we are in the process of acquiring title deeds for all our infrastructure.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr E. Tembo: Madam Speaker, thank you for giving me the opportunity, on behalf of the people of Feira, to seek clarification from the hon. Minister.

Madam Speaker, I take note of the hon. Minister’s response: he has stated that the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) can be used to build police houses. For instance, in Feira, there is land for twelve police houses but, in view of the community projects that are supposed to be implemented in one year, the CDF will not be enough. Is the Government, through the Ministry of Home Affairs and Internal Security, willing to build the houses or does the CDF still remain an option? I just want clarity.

Mr Mwiimbu: Madam Speaker, as I indicated, the CDF is merely an option in the event that we take too long to source funds to build the houses on behalf of the Government ministry. We are in the process of negotiations with regard to the contract pertaining to infrastructure for the security wings. Once the negotiations are concluded, the process of construction will commence.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Tayengwa: Madam Speaker, I just want to confirm that we are putting up a police post. So, we will not be using the infrastructure the hon. Minister talked about. However, my question is: Is the ministry in a position to share the designs for staff houses so that we can share them with the local authority, in case we decide to use the Constituency Development Fund (CDF)?

Mr Mwiimbu: Madam Speaker, I can confirm that my ministry has prototype diagrams not just for police houses, but also police posts and police stations.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Interruptions

Madam Speaker: Thank you. We make progress.

Hon. Member for Chama South, you have just come in and you are making noise. I believe, you have a suitcase full of dollars from China.

Laughter

CONSTRUCTION OF STADIUM IN MANDEVU

34. Mr Shakafuswa (Mandevu) asked the Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts:

whether the Government has any plans to construct a stadium in Mandevu Parliamentary Constituency;

if so, when the plans will be implemented; and

what the cost of the project is.

The Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts (Mr Nkandu): Madam Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Mandevu may wish to note that the ministry has no plans to construct a stadium in Mandevu Constituency. In this regard, his attention is drawn to the existing ultra-modern stadium, which is opposite Mandevu Constituency, called National Heroes Stadium. Independence Stadium and the Olympic Youth Development Centre (OYDC) are also in close proximity to Mandevu Constituency. As such, the people of Mandevu Constituency can utilise those facilities for various sports activities.

Madam Speaker, the ministry, as I said, has no plans to construct a stadium in Mandevu Constituency. Hence, the project will not be implemented.

Madam Speaker, the ministry has not costed the project because it does not have plans to construct a stadium.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Shakafuswa: Madam Speaker, out of the seven constituencies in Lusaka District, only Kanyama and Mandevu do not have stadia, and these two biggest constituencies have the highest population in Zambia. It is a disservice to the youths of Mandevu to get such an answer from the hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts. Mandevu Constituency starts from the western side, covers the National Heroes Stadium and Ng’ombe, and shares a border with Munali Constituency. So, it is not fair for the youths from Ng’ombe to walk all the way to Heroes Stadium.

Madam Speaker, I asked this question because sport is developing. As you may be aware, the two stadia could not host international games because of technological advancement. Now that I have indicated that most constituencies have stadia, is the ministry going to build sports infrastructure or a stadium for the people of Mandevu, who are 464,000? Otherwise, our colleagues will remember us in 2026.

Madam Speaker: I wanted to say that the hon. Member for Mandevu is speaking like a striker until he said that. Now, I do not know what he wants to strike at.

Mr Nkandu: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Mandevu, especially given that we will remember them in 2026. However, he should not mislead the nation by saying that there is a stadium in every constituency. That is a very misleading statement because where I come from in Kaputa, and in Mporokoso, Isoka and Shiwang’andu, there are no stadia that we can write home about. So, I think, that was a very misleading statement.

Madam Speaker, I also want to indicate that the hon. Member needs to know his constituency well because the Olympic Africa Sports Facility is in Mandevu Constituency. At the facility, people play volleyball, basketball, football, netball and tennis. Maybe, he is looking for an ultra-modern or multi-sports facility. Otherwise, a stadium is there and there is just a need to improve it.

Madam Speaker, let me take this opportunity to urge all hon. Members of Parliament to build stadia in their respective constituencies.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkandu: We need to apportion funds for this purpose, especially when we will be debating the Budget. Further, the Ministry of Education, the Ministry of Health and the Ministry of Home Affairs and Internal Security are using the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) to implement projects and, as a ministry, we can also do the same. However, I encourage hon. Members of Parliament to apportion funds in the Budget for putting up infrastructure in our respective constituencies.

Madam Speaker, the Government is not committing itself to putting up stadia in every constituency because it may not have the capacity and the resources. However, I am happy that some hon. Members of Parliament approached me and indicated that they want to put up simple stadia using the CDF. So, we have come up with a prototype design, and those who want to put up stadia are at liberty to visit our offices. We will give them that prototype design so that they can consider putting up such facilities in 2024.

Madam Speaker, I believe, and I agree with the hon. Member, that sport is developing. As the New Dawn Administration, we are not looking at sport as just mere entertainment, but as a vehicle that we may use to alleviate poverty among the young people and create employment opportunities for them.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Please, as you build stadia, do not forget the constituency offices because they are a priority, too.

Laughter

Mr Kanengo (Kabushi): Madam Speaker, Mandevu Constituency is more like Kabushi Constituency. If you were following the happenings in 2021, you saw that there was too much violence in Mandevu Constituency just like in Kabushi Constituency.

Madam Speaker, I know that –

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member for Kabushi!

This is a constituency-based question. I know you want to bring in Kabushi, but we have business of the day, which we need to get to quickly. So, please, let us not stretch the question.

The hon. Member for Mandevu can ask his second question.

Mr Shakafuswa: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts has been good to us. For example, he gave us jerseys. However, we still need a pitch.

Madam Speaker, the Olympic Africa Sports Facility that the hon. Minister mentioned is where I was declared winner as Member of Parliament for Mandevu Constituency. So, I know it very well. However, there are stones and sand at the pitch. So, I urge the ministry to consider constructing a stadium in the constituency. Having been Councillor and Deputy Mayor, I know that in Lusaka District, stadia were built in every constituency except in Kanyama and Mandevu, and that is why I asked this question. So, my appeal to the hon. Minister is that the ministry considers the people of Mandevu as it looks at infrastructure development in the country.

Madam Speaker: It was a comment. Let us hear from the hon. Member for Vubwi. We have not heard from him for some time.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear! Hammer!

Mr A. Banda (Vubwi): Madam Speaker, thank you very much for giving me the chance, on behalf of the good people of Vubwi, to ask a question.

Madam Speaker, let me take advantage of this question. Like the hon. Minister has stated, there is a need to have stadia in all constituencies. Has a research been conducted to know the amount needed to construct these facilities in constituencies?

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkandu: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Vubwi …

Laughter

Mr Nkandu: … for this important question.

In fact, I was discussing the issue of costings with the hon. Member for Kabwata. We are about to finish the costings, and I will revert to the hon. Members of Parliament. Hon. Members of Parliament can even come to our offices and ask us some of these questions, and we will provide answers, unlike bringing them here. When we commit to constructing a stadium in Mandevu, obviously, the hon. Member for Vubwi will also ask ‘what about us?’ So, hon. Members of Parliament should visit our offices, and we will have a chat. I also want to add that the National Olympic Committee also came to ask for the same thing the hon. Member is asking for. So, we have agreed on something. The hon. Member for Mandevu should visit our offices, and we will be able to chart the way forward.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, please, visit the office of the hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts to enable you to get clarity on this issue.

Let us make progress.

TARRING OF CHIEF NKANA/KAGEM ROAD

35. Mr Siachisumo (Lufwanyama) asked the Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development:

(a) whether the Government has any plans to tar the Chief Nkana/Kagem Road in Lufwanyama District;

(b) if so, when the plans will be implemented; and

(c) if there are no such plans, why.

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, the Government has plans to upgrade to bituminous standard the Chief Nkana/Kagem Road in Lufwanyama District.

Madam Speaker, the tarring of the road will be undertaken when the Treasury sources the required funding.

Madam Speaker, as indicated at (a) above, the Government has plans to upgrade the road to bituminous standard.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Siachisumo: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for the good answers he has given. I am sure, he knows that road because he visited Lufwanyama a few months ago, and he said that it will be upgraded as soon as funds are found. Lufwanyama is supposed to be one of the richest districts, yet it is the poorest, as it has been neglected by successive Governments. When does the hon. Minister think the Ministry of Finance and National Planning will find the funds? He can estimate whether the funds will be found in 2024 or 2025.

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for the follow-up question.

Madam Speaker, I know his area very well because, for many years, I was a resident of Kalulushi, which is a town near that area. Just to comfort the hon. Member, let me say that the Chief Nkana/Kagem Road is about 40 km long, and the Government understands that it is an important economic road in the area and the district, as it leads to Kagem Emerald Mine and Grizzly Mine Limited. It also connects communities involved in agricultural production in the area.

Madam Speaker, the Government will, indeed, consider incorporating studies and detailed designs in future Road Sector Annual Work-plans to determine the cost estimate of upgrading the road to bituminous standard. Thereafter, the required resources will be allocated to the project. However, I think, the hon. Member wants to know what is happening as of now with regard to that road. The two mining firms I mentioned earlier, Kagem Emerald Mine and Grizzly Mine Limited, often keep the road in a motorable condition as part of their corporate social responsibility (CSR). The interim measure helps to keep the road motorable through the year. However, for more permanent rehabilitation and upgrade to bituminous standard, we have to wait until we have made plans in our annual work-plans.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Siachisumo: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for the good answers. I appreciate the fact that he mentioned Grizzly Mine Limited and Kagem Emerald Mine.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has stated that as soon as the money is found, the Government will upgrade the road. Chibuluma Copper Mines, Grizzly Mine Limited, Kagem Emerald Mine and many other small companies use the same road. Is the ministry not thinking of putting money aside for tarring the road because it passes through villages and vehicles leave dust for the people? As you may be aware, the road passes through Chief Nkana's Palace, and vehicles leave dust. The people of Lufwanyama feel that they were neglected by the previous Governments, not the New Dawn Government.

Laughter

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, let me assure the hon. Member for Lufwanyama that the New Dawn Government has not neglected the road and has no intention whatsoever of neglecting the people of Lufwanyama. In terms of infrastructure development, the hon. Member knows that within Lufwanyama Constituency, we have very concrete plans, as he has already admitted. I visited the constituency and made certain pronouncements, and those pronouncements will be followed through. He has to understand that the needs of the constituency are great because big as it is, there has been no bituminous road except, of course, the one from Kalulushi to Lufwanyama. There is nothing into the hinterland. The Government is fully aware of this, and is doing everything possible to ensure that Lufwanyama Constituency is included in the plans, going forward.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Two other hon. Members have indicated. They want to ask questions. Please, let us stick to the question. It is a constituency-based question.

The hon. Member for Lubansenshi will be followed by the hon. Member for Roan.

Mr Chewe (Lubansenshi): Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for the response.

Madam Speaker, I know that in July this year, the ministry announced that 5,000 km of feeder roads would be worked on, and I know that the Kalulushi and Chief Nkana roads are two of the roads that were submitted. Does the hon. Minister think that under that category, the road will be worked on?

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, indeed, under the Feeder Road Programme, that can be done. However, the question was specifically on upgrading the road to bituminous standard, which requires a resource envelope other than that which is available for the Feeder Road Programme.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr J. Chibuye (Roan): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has lamented the issue of resources while the hon. Member for Lufwanyama clearly indicated that the road leads to three major companies. Has the Government been able to sit down with those companies to see how they can meet it halfway in upgrading the road to bituminous standard?

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, I thank the Member of Parliament for Roan, Hon. Chibuye, for the question.

Madam Speaker, indeed, I indicated in my answer that the two companies operating in the emerald area are already involved in keeping the road in a motorable state. As to whether they can be involved in upgrading it to bituminous standard, the stretch of the road that requires upgrading is 40 km and, even at our reduced cost of constructing tarred roads or bituminous roads compared to what was prevailing before, it would cost in the range of US$20 million to upgrade it. That is a significant amount, and it would probably be unfair to expect private companies to put up that sort of money. This is the responsibility of the Government, and we will have to wait until the road is incorporated into our future annual work plans, and we have stated that it will be.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

_______

MOTION

MOTION OF THANKS

(Debate resumed)

Ms Nyirenda (Lundazi): Madam Speaker, the people of Lundazi Constituency are grateful. Allow me to welcome the Leader of the Opposition, who is back in the House after being involved in an accident. I also want to wish Ms Naomi –

Hon. Government Members: The Chief Whip.

Ms Nyirenda: He can be the Government Chief Whip.

Laughter

Madam Speaker: We were getting worried –

Ms Nyirenda: Kwaba, kwaba.

Interruptions

Ms Nyirenda: Do not worry. You know what I mean.

Madam Speaker, it is good that he is back in the House, and I would like to wish Ms Naomi a quick healing. I also wish Hon. Kalimi, who has been suffering since his accident, a quick recovery. In addition, may Hon. Chilangwa, who is still suffering in prison, …

Hon. Government Members: Question!

Ms Nyirenda: … be strengthened as he undergoes what is undergoing.

Madam Speaker, this afternoon, the people of Lundazi are grateful that the speech that was made by His Excellency the President of the Republic of Zambia was made out of duty. The President had to come and make the speech. When I read it, I saw that there were some acknowledgments. On page 27, the President said the following:

“The Government acknowledges that the supply of essential medicines and medical supplies in our health facilities has been inadequate.”

Madam Speaker, this is a very serious admission. In other countries, it can call for many changes. In view of the fact that we have had no medicines in our hospitals, there is a need for a serious change in the procurement system. Maybe, the old system was okay. The new system is failing us because for two years, we have not had medicines, and children are dying. We cannot continue on this trajectory.

Madam Speaker, the other thing I want to talk about is what the President stated on page 14 as follows:

“To support investments and diversification in exploration, mining and processing of minerals, our administration will embark on a national geological mapping.”

Madam Speaker, for how long is Zambia going to be mapped whilst our resources are being stolen? We cannot manage to have our mining –

Interruptions

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

There is just too much talking on my right. Can we listen to the hon. Member for Lundazi.

May the hon. Member proceed.

Ms Nyirenda: Madam Speaker, the people in remote areas are the ones identifying where gold or sugilite are and by the time the Government knows about the minerals, some people would have taken advantage of the situation and stolen the minerals. At the end of the day, we do not know what the Government is going to map. Maybe, when mapping, the Government will find that there are no minerals.

Madam Speaker, I want to talk about the issue of fertiliser. In my constituency, there is a disaster. We have been hearing different policy statements. One hon. Minister comes to Lundazi and says the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) will continue, then another one gives a different policy direction. The people of Lundazi are farmers. In fact, they feed the nation. So, we will be worried if this trajectory continues. Right now, there is no maize in all our sheds in Lundazi Constituency, and generally in Lundazi District. What is causing that is a lack of clarity. You cannot give a policy direction today and, tomorrow, give another one.

Mr Nkandu: Question!

Ms Nyirenda: Madam Speaker, we were directed here, in the House, to inform our people that FISP would no longer be there by 2026. Our colleagues said that there had been a change and that they would be giving farmers loans instead of fertiliser. I want to inform you that the people of Lundazi have rejected the suggestion of giving them K5,000 loans. Why am I saying this? In Malawi, just across the border, people buy fertiliser at MWK4,000. So, where have we gone wrong? Why should fertiliser be expensive on our side, yet our neighbours buy it at a cheaper price?

Madam Speaker, with regard to health facilities, I have on the Floor of this House talked about the hospital in Lundazi, and I pleaded with the hon. Minister and even with Her Honour the Vice-President to reopen the old hospital. I am not asking them to build a hospital, but to reopen the old one and bring in furniture. To date, that has been falling on deaf ears. The people in Lundazi are concerned, but the President said that we are making headways. There are no headways that have been made. We are retrogressing because the issues I am talking about are affecting the people in my constituency.

Madam Speaker, I want to talk about single-sourcing. The Tanzania-Zambia Mafuta (TAZAMA) Pipeline cannot be single-sourced and used by only one person while oil companies in the country are just watching and cannot take care of the people whom they employed. I urge the President to take keen interest in oil companies and the procurement of fertiliser because that is where there are many issues.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Nyirenda: I also want the President to take keen interest in the Ministry of Agriculture, the Ministry of Health and the Ministry of Mines and Minerals Development. These three ministries, to say the least, are not doing any good to the country today …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Nyirenda: … and I am being factual. If he wants, he can call me and I will tell him what each one is doing. What we want is for our nation to take off. People voted because they wanted change. If we are not going to bring that change, the people of Zambia will continue languishing in misery. We cannot sit here and pretend that all is well. We know that some people will be rewarded with K6.4 million each for being in prison. Should we just sit here and fold our arms?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Nyirenda: That is money that, as a Member of Parliament, I will not get during my stay in this House. However, someone will be awarded that much for being in prison for five months or so. The Budget will be presented here, but do you expect the people of Lundazi to support it?

Hon. Opposition Member: No!

Ms Nyirenda: They will not support it. Why am I saying that? We need to be methodical like our colleagues always say.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mundubile (Mporokoso): Madam Speaker, thank you for this opportunity for me to add my thoughts on the President’s Speech.

Madam Speaker, as my colleagues observed, we had two versions of the speech, the verbatim one and the one that came from Cabinet Office. When I compared the two, I needed to find the midpoint. I was persuaded by one statement the President made on page 1 of his speech, and it reads:

“Our two years in office confirms to us that development is not a straight forward journey.”

I cannot agree with the President more on this statement.

Madam Speaker, development has to be structured for it to have meaningful impact. Under the Patriotic Front (PF) Government, we had what was called an integrated multi-sectoral approach to development.

Mr Samakayi: Question!

Mr Mundubile: Madam Speaker, we are seeing meaningful transformation even in far-flung districts because of that structured development. Communication towers were erected in those areas and the Government connected electricity, constructed roads and schools, …

Mr Simushi: Not in mine!

Mr Mundubile: … as opposed to what one may call a butter-spread approach, whereby meaningful impact is not felt. As an alternative, this Government must seriously look at employing an integrated multi-sectoral approach so that we have impactful development, going forward.

Madam Speaker, I agree with the President that development is not a straightforward matter, but I will take you back. The hon Minister of Finance and National Planning, on this Floor, gave incentives to mining companies with the intention of ramping up production towards 3 million tonnes per year. What has happened now is that there is a reduction in production, yet the intention of the hon. Minister, Dr Musokotwane, was that by giving those incentives, resulting in losses of up to K3 billion, we were going to ramp up production. So, yes, I agree with the President that development might not be a straightforward journey.

Madam Speaker, let me talk about the much-celebrated International Monetary Fund (IMF) programme. We celebrated the IMF programme and continue celebrating it, but little did we know that it was going to result in reduced support to the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) and other programmes. It is not a coincidence that now that we have the IMF programme, we are having problems with FISP. There have been different statements on this programme from the Cabinet, and two hon. Cabinet Ministers have had different positions on it. This is unheard of.

Mr Nkandu: Question!

Mr Mundubile: So, development is not a straightforward journey, indeed.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister of Agriculture says that we are going to go the loan scheme way, while another hon. Minister from the same Cabinet says that FISP is here to stay. This is consistent with the President’s statement that development might not be a straightforward matter. I will give you an example. You may have a well-intended and spoken-about programme to fight corruption. However, programmes of that nature are diluted by illegal mining, for instance, at Konkola Copper Mines (KCM), by companies like Sensele Mine, which nobody has been able to explain. Hon. Members of Parliament go to KCM and find illegal mining; a huge operation. These are some of the things that dilute genuine efforts to fight corruption.

Madam Speaker, I agree with the President that development might not be a straightforward journey, and I will cite examples. For instance, from a distance, the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) is a masterpiece; K28 million per year. The plan is to give each constituency K7 million per quarter so that committees plan how to disburse the funds and come up with development projects. However, in the third quarter of 2023, what has been disbursed is only K6 million. So, I agree with the President that development is not a straightforward journey, after all. Can you imagine what would happen if from the K28 million, every quarter, your constituency is given K7 million? A lot would happen in the constituencies. So, part of the celebration that people have been embracing is not on the ground.

Mr Nkandu: Question!

Mr Mundubile: It is a mirage. Development can be realised but, as the President said, it is not a straightforward journey. I know that I am speaking to somebody out there. We are all hon. Members of Parliament, and these realities affect all of us.

Madam Speaker, the examples are many. For instance, the President spoke about Kasama Airport, which is a welcome development. I was once Minister for Northern Province and, at the time I was leaving office, the airport was at 85 per cent. However, development is a continuous process. It does not matter whether the airport was at 15 per cent or 10 per cent, it has now been completed for tourism purposes. Now, instead of people focusing on how Kasama Airport will complement the other bigger airports that were built earlier – some people are turning Kenneth Kaunda International Airport (KKIA) into a gold and dollar exchange centre instead of using it for tourism.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mundubile: Madam Speaker, development is not a straightforward journey, indeed.

Mr Mposha: What is the connection?

Mr Mundubile: Madam Speaker, the connection is that a facility such as KKIA should be used for tourism. You do not want to turn that big runway into a gold trading centre. That is not the intention. I do not think that is the best way of using it. So, I tend to agree that development may not be a straightforward matter.

Madam Speaker, in view of the completion of the Kafue Bulk Water Supply Project, ordinarily, you would expect urban areas like Mandevu and Chawama to have running water. However, today, we are launching boreholes in those areas. So, development may not be a very straightforward matter, after all.

Mr Nkandu interjected.

Mr Mundubile: Madam Speaker, generally, as we look at development, we must expand our thinking to find the line of best fit.

Madam Speaker, the Constitution provides for watchdog institutions like the Auditor-General’s Office. Instead of many Governments appreciating the work that the office does, they view it as an inconvenience. The Auditor-General’s job is to express an opinion on how well you have managed resources. Now, the moment Governments realise that important ministries like the Ministry of Agriculture, –

Ms Halwiindi: On a point of order, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Order!

Sorry, hon. Leader of the Opposition for the interruption. There is an indication for a point of order.

Hon. Member for Kabwe Central, what is the point of order?

A point of order is raised.

Ms Halwiindi: Thank you so much, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, it was not my wish to interrupt the debater, the hon. Leader of the Opposition. I am sure, this is the first point of order I am raising since I came into this House, and I am compelled to raise it. The point of order is pursuant to Standing Order No. 65.

Madam Speaker, is the hon. Leader of the Opposition, and even the other debaters, in order to keep saying that the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) allocation for 2023 has not been disbursed when the –

Mr Kapyanga interjected.

Ms Halwiindi: Listen! Guidelines No. 4.1.2 provides that you need to submit a return of how you have spent your money before other funds can be disbursed. Are they in order to say that, when councils have not submitted reports on how they have used the money?

I need your serious guidance, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

I believe, when the hon. Minister for Local Government and Rural Development makes his response, he will address those issues. He can even name the constituencies that have not submitted the reports. It is very easy. So, let the hon. Leader of the Opposition debate. When queries are made, hon. Ministers respond to them.

Mr Mundubile: Madam Speaker, I was talking about the Auditor-General’s Office. We have discovered that since development is not a straightforward journey, Governments even become uncomfortable with the Auditor-General’s Office, …

Mr Munsanje: Question!

Mr Mundubile: … to the extent that when it is about to produce a report, it is disbanded so that a diluted report is brought to Parliament for hon. Members of Parliament to debate. This also confirms that development might not be a straightforward journey, after all.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mundubile: Madam Speaker, as has been debated by my hon. Colleagues, it is evident that when you are in the Government, you need to follow certain processes. We have seen how costly it has been for this country. Contracts were cancelled arbitrarily and, two years later, we have failed to recover. What is sad is that nobody has been courageous enough to evaluate the loss of human life that has resulted from that bad decision. So, we pray that, going forward, we will be a bit more prudent when making decisions for critical ministries.

With those few remarks, Madam Speaker, I wish to thank you.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Jamba (Mwembezhi): Thank you, Madam Speaker, for allowing me, on behalf of the people of Mwembezhi, to add a word to the debate on the President’s Speech.

Madam Speaker, I will title my discourse, ‘insoni ebuntu’.

Hon. Opposition Members: Meaning?

Mr Jamba: Madam Speaker, it means that shame is part of humanity.

Madam Speaker, the President talked about restructuring debt. In view of that statement he made, it was important that the debt be restructured. Some people who got money and are talking loudly today did not use it prudently.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Jamba: This is simple mathematics that we can do even in our homes. Some people borrowed money, the Eurobonds. However, one cannot tell how that money was used, yet they are saying that we are celebrating the restructuring of debt. Nothing is happening.

Madam Speaker, let me state why members of the United Party for National Development (UPND) are celebrating the restructuring of the debt. Money was borrowed, but there is nowhere to show where it went. Our colleagues claimed that they worked on roads in the northern side and in the Eastern Province, but there are no roads there. When we were on the other side, they would say tamu vota bwino. However, even in the Eastern Province and the Northern Province, people are crying that there are bad roads. Where did the money go?

Mr Munsanje: They stole.

Mr Jamba: When you borrow money, you should ensure that it doubles so that you repay the debt. No one is happy to go and beg a friend to restructure his/her debt. We did that because the previous Government was reckless. It got money, but we do not know where it took that money, and we were forced to ask for a restructuring programme.

Madam Speaker, I wish to thank the President for what he has done. This is very serious. The people in the Government must learn something about borrowing. One lesson they should learn is that they should not use the money they borrow for consumption, but rather for production so that they are able to repay the debt. When these people borrowed the money, they put it into their pockets, and that is why we are where we are today. They are crying about mealie meal prices and the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP). If they had not put the money they borrowed into their pockets, it would have been used to buy fertiliser, and the price of mealie meal would have been low.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Laughter

Mr Jamba: However, they borrowed the money and put it into their pockets; feeding around.

Madam Speaker, one of the things that I want to talk about is that –

Interruptions

Mr Kapyanga: On a point of order, Madam.

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member for Mpika!

Please, put down your notes. If you want to react, take down notes and you will respond. Let the hon. Member debate just like I allowed the other hon. Members to debate. If you have any reaction, write down your notes, and you will rebut at the appropriate time.

May the hon. Member for Mwembezhi continue.

Mr Jamba: Madam Speaker, during the time of the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) Government, the country reached the Highly Indebted Poor Countries (HIPC) completion point. The people we owed money gave us breathing space. However, immediately the Patriotic Front (PF) Government came into power in 2011, it started borrowing until we ended up in the ditch we are in now. We are in this ditch because some people did not think of what to do with the money they were borrowing, and we had to beg people to restructure our debt. This is a very big lesson to us, members of the UPND. We should not borrow for consumption. Instead, we should only borrow for production so that we are able to pay back the people we owe money.

Madam Speaker, let me talk about mining and tourism, and I wish the hon. Minister of Tourism was here. Kafue National Park is as big as a country in Europe. There are minerals in the national park, but we cannot go and mine them because some people are trying to control us. Some people from outside are saying that we should not mine in national parks. Why can we not sit down and decide that that part of the Kafue National Park be reserved for mining and agriculture, and leave the other part for tourism? We cannot continue –

Interruptions

Mr Jamba: You wait, you thieves.

Interruptions

Mr Jamba: We cannot continue on this trajectory whereby some people are saying that the park can only be used for tourism. When national parks were being created, the population of Zambia was almost 3 million. Now, it is 18 million. For instance, in Mwembezhi, there is no land for farming. Why can we not degazette some areas and move the animals somewhere then we can farm and mine in the depopulated areas?

Madam Speaker, we must discuss the issue of tourism and mining properly on a round table. We cannot continue being controlled by people who are saying that we cannot mine in some areas so that some people can live their lives vicariously. They destroyed the natural resources in their countries and they now want to preserve ours by saying that we cannot mine copper or gold. What type of talking is that? This is a very serious issue.

Madam Speaker, I know that time is not a good ally. As I end, let me talk about mining in Mwembezhi and Konkola Copper Mines (KCM) under Vedanta Resources Limited. Vedanta Resources Limited has been given back the mines, and this is a very good development. However, I want to say –

Interruptions

Mr Jamba: Wait you. Yes, it has been given back those mines.

Madam Speaker, I want to say that there is a problem. In Nampumbwe, there is a mine and these people promised to invest in it but, immediately they came, they started selling mining equipment as scrap. How can someone who comes all the way from India to invest and mine in Zambia start selling scrap? So, we must warn those people. I know that members of the UPND are serious people. We must warn Vendanta Resources Limited to not do what it did with these people, the PF, where –

Interruptions

Mr Jamba: You wait, you. You are the people who made that thing. Insoni ebuntu.

Madam Speaker, what I am saying is that even when KCM was given the right to mine, instead of mining, it ended up vandalising the mine. Since it has been given back the mines, we do not want a repeat of what happened. If it repeats that, then, it must go away. Actually, members of the PF went to bed with it and could not even reprimand it, which is a very big and dangerous statement to be made in a country because those people actually killed many people.

Madam Speaker, when a mine like Nampundwe is operating, other people are supposed to carry out side works and supply nuts and tyres. We do not want to see a mine bringing all its materials from South Africa and India. We want our local suppliers to be given an opportunity to supply things to the mines.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Madam Speaker: The hon. Member for Nyimba.

I am just balancing the debate.

Mr Menyani Zulu (Nyimba): Madam Speaker, let me add a few words to the debate on the President’s Speech. My take is on agriculture because I come from a farming district.

Madam Speaker, the President said that US$300 million would be used to develop farming blocks, and that 400 small-scale farmers in different areas of Zambia were provided with tractor-based mechanisation services. I am worried because we have not spoken about the US$300 million since last year, when it was stated that new farming blocks would be established and that infrastructure in other farming blocks would be rehabilitated. I expected the President to tell us where the Government has spent that money, but the speech was silent on this, and I am worried.

Madam Speaker, through you, let me address the hon. Minister of Agriculture and the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning. We have spoken about the US$300 million too much. Why have we not started using that money to rehabilitate the old farming blocks and farming schemes across this country? We can rehabilitate the roads, build irrigation infrastructure and dams in those areas, and start developing new areas. If the Government gave each district K2 million or each province K5 million, things would change, and a good number of people would be taken out of the streets into farming.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Member for Mpongwe will tell you that Mpongwe Farms, which is under Zambeef, employs more people than some mines in this country. A good number of people can be taken out of the streets because every qualification is needed in farming. So, the Government should spend the money. Let us not just be talking about it unless it is just figures being mentioned in Parliament while the money is not there. If the money is there, let us start using it now.

Madam Speaker, where were the 400 tractors distributed? I come from a farming district. If they were distributed, we would like to know how many were distributed in the Eastern Province, Nyimba in particular, because the speech is quiet on this. I do not know the areas we have tried to mechanise using tractors. So, I am not satisfied with the number of tractors, and we need to see to it that each district receives what it deserves.

Madam Speaker, I agree with the President that the Ministry of Fisheries and Livestock is doing something because we can see what is happening. At the district level, we can see that the hon. Minister of Fisheries and Livestock is working. We can see whatever the ministry is doing there, and the people are appreciating. That is what we need. People need to feel the presence of the ministry at the community level.

Madam Speaker, the Ministry of Water Development and Sanitation is important, but whatever we are doing using the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) is not enough. We need to fund this ministry with a substantial amount of money. If the hon. Minister of Water Development and Sanitation intends to come with a half-baked budget here, it is better he starts working on it and sees to it that he gives us a responsible one. That is important.

Madam Speaker, we were told that 149 schools had been completed, meaning that all the previous schools had been completed. Surprisingly, Kacholola Secondary School and Chiwale Secondary School have not been completed. The school halls and laboratories have not been completed, and the children are in school in order to protect the school, yet it was stated that all the old schools had been completed. What is happening? Is it that we, as a district and constituency, are usually in Zambia? This should come to an end. When the Government is building in other districts or provinces, it should remember that there is a district called Nyimba on the map of Zambia.

Madam Speaker, if there is something that makes me very unpopular to people, it is the rule of law. Today, let me speak about it because it is very important. Let me tell the people on your right hand side that there is no police service that has ever made a political party popular. One of these people seated here used the police to intimidate our colleagues, but where are they today? You people are doing the same.

Hon. Government Members: Who?

Mr Menyani Zulu: What are you doing about it? The police will never make you popular. It never made them popular. So, do you think that you are different from them?

Hon. Opposition Members: No!

Mr Menyani Zulu: This is Zambia. You cannot use the police. The hon. Minister of Home Affairs and Internal Security is a lawyer, and he understands this, as a politician. He would run up and down defending the people in the United Party for National Development (UPND), and you know how unpopular that made the Patriotic Front (PF) Government. That is where you are going, and you are allowing it to be like that. Can you tell those police officers to stop –

Madam Speaker, the hon. Members of Parliament in the Opposition are even scared to speak because when they do, the following day, they receive a –

Interruptions

Mr Menyani Zulu: Let me say this.

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Let us listen in silence.

Hon. Member for Nyimba, as you debate, please, try to be as factual as possible. You have to be factual.

Mr Menyani Zulu: Madam Speaker, I am very factual. If evidence is needed, I am ready to lay it on the Table.

Madam Speaker, most people here, especially Independent hon. Members –

Interruptions

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member for Chienge!

Do not debate while seated. Allow the hon. Member for Nyimba to make his points. If you have your own points –

Mr Menyani Zulu: Speak.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Nyimba, can I just say something.

Mr Menyani Zulu: Yes, Madam Speaker.

Interruptions

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Do not debate while seated. As I earlier guided, if you have a point to rebut, write it down, Also, as you debate, hon. Members, be factual.

Hon. Member for Nyimba, you may continue.

Mr Menyani Zulu: Madam Speaker, the fact is that these people are seated on your left because of the police. God forbid that our colleagues follow suit. We need the K28.8 million to keep coming to our districts. So, we want them to be there. They should not force the people to take them out of the Government. That is my advice. They can take it or leave it.

Madam Speaker, this Government has allowed – Thank God, the President said that there will be no cadreism in this country. That is good.

Madam Speaker, cadres were sent by a Minister to demolish somebody’s house. When that was reported to the police, the police did not do anything. Even when the matter was taken to court, the court did not do anything, and the private prosecutor was stopped by the Director of Public Prosecution (DPP). The hon. Minister is just seated here, yet a house was demolished in Ndola, specifically, in Ndola Central. Let me declare interest in this issue because it is my elder brother’s house that was destroyed.

The hon. Member’s time expired.

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Your time is up.

Mr Menyani Zulu: Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rest my case.

Ms Nakaponda (Isoka): Madam Speaker, allow me to talk about some of the projects highlighted in the President’s Speech.

Madam Speaker, my appeal is that capital projects not included in the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) be considered for either completion or upgrade.

Madam Speaker, on page 24, paragraph 78, line 3 and the last line of the President’s Speech, the President states as follows:

“To avoid compromising the quality of education, the Government has continued to increase learning spaces. The construction of 149 secondary schools across the country has since been completed and all the schools are now operational. In addition, 132 early childhood and sixty-one secondary schools are at various levels of completion.”

Madam Speaker, the construction of Michael Chilufya Sata Girls Boarding School in my constituency has stalled for quite a long time, and I am appealing to the President to complete the school because, right now, the girls are squatting at Isoka Boys Secondary School, and they are being impregnated every day.

Laughter

Ms Nakaponda: Madam Speaker, pregnancies are the order of the day. I am glad that two Ministers, the hon. Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development and the hon. Minister of Education, went to that school. However, to date, nothing has been done, yet it was stated that the Government has completed the secondary schools.

Madam Speaker, do you want me to cry because of this situation?

Hon. Government Members: Yes, cry.

Interruptions

Ms Nakaponda: Madam Speaker, the pupils at Michael Chilufya Sata Girls Secondary, together with their teachers, are being booed by the boys at the school they are currently learning from. They are being told to go back to their school, which is incomplete. I want those pupils to study in a conducive and secure environment, just like other pupils do.

Madam Speaker, we have been talking about educating the girl child. There is the Bemba saying that “Nga mwasambilisha umwana umwanakashi ninshi mwasambilisha ichalo chonse”. This means that when you educate the girl child, you educate the whole nation. However, here we are.

Madam Speaker, you are a mother. Please, tell the President that that school should be completed.

Interruptions

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Let us allow the debate to flow.

Ms Nakaponda: Madam Speaker, I would like that school to be among those to be completed this year. My heart bleeds because the pupils are suffering, as they do not have a place where they can have their preparations from.

Madam Speaker, on road infrastructure, on page 22, paragraph 72, the President said as follows:

“We have continued rehabilitating and maintaining rural roads across the country. Currently, over 1,700 km of these roads have been rehabilitated and maintained in Central, Northern, Luapula, Eastern, Southern and Muchinga provinces.”

Madam Speaker, the Mbesuma/Kasama Road in Isoka Constituency in Muchinga Province connects Muchinga Province, the Northern Province and Luapula Province, but it is a death trap. The road is in a very bad state and has no bridge. You will remember that at the beginning of this year, in January, I stood on the Floor of this august House and talked about crocodiles. I was almost eaten by a crocodile. In this regard, I appeal to the President to ensure that the road is completed. The road is also has economic benefits, as it links the country to the neighbouring countries like the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) and Malawi.

Madam Speaker, another important road is the Sansamwenje/Kanyala Road in Isoka, as it connects Zambia to Malawi through Kanyala and Chitipa. If constructed, there can be a very good trade link between Zambia and Malawi. Apart from that, farmers would transport their produce easily. Even the communities around the road would greatly benefit from its construction. Therefore, I appeal to the hon. Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development to complete it. I am happy that the contractor constructing the Isoka/Mafinga Road is on site, and I appeal to him to finish constructing it before the rainy season begins.

The hon. Member’s time expired.

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Your time is up. Can you wind up.

Ms Nakaponda: I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Interruptions

Mr Kalobo: Cry!

Ms Nakaponda: Do you want me to cry?

Hon. Opposition Members: Yes!

Madam Speaker: It is not good for women to cry in public.

Mr Ngowani (Mpongwe): Madam Speaker, thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to add my voice to the debate on the Motion on the Floor of the House on behalf of the people of Mpongwe. Since I come from a farming constituency or district, I will start with agriculture.

Madam Speaker, I wish to commend the President for delivering a categorical and honest speech. Farming is a business. So, farmers need to make profits. We do not need, as a country, to have cheaper mealie meal at the expense of the farmers who work hard. If there was a year when farmers were very happy, it is this year under the New Dawn Government.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ngowani: Farmers are selling one bag of maize at K280, and that has resulted in most farmers in Mpongwe buying fertiliser on cash basis, and I commend the New Dawn Government for that.

Madam Speaker, the only way we will have cheaper mealie meal in the country is increasing production. We do not need to leave farming to rural communities. Even those who live in urban areas need to engage in farming so that we improve production in the country and add to our traditional export, which is copper. We need to export maize, soya beans and other crops. That way, we will improve the economy of this country and, when we do that, we will have cheaper fertiliser, chemicals and other farming inputs. Further, the production of maize will increase and we will have cheaper mealie meal in the years to come.

Madam Speaker, the Government is working hard to improve agriculture. I think, the introduction of loans will enable farmers to grow more maize and other crops. If farmers produce more, we will see more exports in the country, and the economy will be improved.

Madam Speaker, this Government is encouraging farmers to engage in irrigation farming. I wish to appeal to the hon. Minister of Agriculture to encourage the commercial farmers in Mpongwe to also grow winter maize. That way, the price of mealie meal will reduce, and the economy of this country will improve.

Madam Speaker, this Government is also encouraging farmers to diversify into livestock farming, and it is already doing a lot in livestock farming by providing free vaccines for animals. The Government is also pumping money into farming block development, and K300 million has been set aside to improve farming blocks. This will also improve farming in our country.

Madam Speaker, the next thing I want to talk about is the Constituency Development Fund (CDF), which is a game changer.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ngowani: The projects we have implemented just in 2022 in Mpongwe surpass those that were implemented from 2011 to 2021, and I commend the New Dawn Government for this fact.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ngowani: Madam Speaker, using the CDF, we are able to sponsor children for skills development.

Madam Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1640 hours until 1700 hours.

[MR SECOND DEPUTY SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Ngowani: Mr Speaker, the President also talked about roads. For the past ten years, in Mpongwe, the Government did not commission any capital project. However, there is an assurance from the Government that the Mpongwe/Machiya Road will be worked on. This is commendable because that road leads to most commercial farms in the constituency.

Mr Speaker, the President also talked about remunerations of Councillors. This will be a great achievement for this Government. When Councillors are well remunerated, most hon. Members of Parliament will have breathing space. Most of the time, it is the hon. Members of Parliament who sponsor funerals and attend to other problems in the wards or constituency. So, when Councillors are well remunerated, I think, hon. Members of Parliament will have breathing space. I want to mention that before I became a Member of Parliament, I was a Councillor.

Mr Speaker, lastly, I want to talk about tourism. In order to increase the inflow of tourists into the country, the Government needs to explore new tourism sites, which will increase employment and inflow of tourists into the country.

Mr Speaker, lastly, the people who hate the President and the New Dawn Government need to be strong because they have a long way to go in decampaigning him.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mung’andu (Chama South): Mr Speaker, my approach will be different. I will try to identify some of the challenges that the President acknowledged and offer solutions or alternatives.

Mr Speaker, I am more concerned about the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP). You have heard almost all hon. Members of Parliament who have debated express their concern on it. If the Executive or those seated on the right are not careful, by the end of this year or late next year, they will have to contain civil strife to do with food problems.

Hon. Government Members: Question!

Mr Mung’andu: Take this seriously. This is because FISP is not being handled well, and I will offer a solution.

Mr Speaker, we can play with other things, but not food. We are actually food. Governments have faced problems because of food, particularly mealie meal. If my colleagues do not listen to my solution, they will have themselves to blame. Why are we having less maize production? Is it because we had unfavourable rainfall as a nation? The answer is ‘no’. We received good rainfall. It is the manner in which we handled FISP that was bad. Instead of removing the beneficiaries of FISP and recruiting new ones, the Government encouraged the formation of more co-operatives.

Madam Speaker, more people were recruited in co-operatives, but the Government maintained the number of bags of fertiliser it was giving them. What did that translate to? People started sharing fertiliser in what we call tu meda. What were the consequences? People only produced enough maize for their consumption. Go and check. The hon. Minister will admit that the Food Reserve Agency (FRA) struggled to meet the strategic food reserve tonnage for this country. Basically, that was the reason. If this is not corrected this year, we can bet that by December, a 25 kg bag of mealie meal will be above K400. If we do not correct things, at the end of next year, it will be K600.

Mr Speaker, what we are supposed to do is remove all the people who were benefiting from FISP and register new ones. I am giving solutions, – so that an individual can collect four bags of D Compound and four bags of Urea fertiliser. That way, we will maintain the output.

Mr Speaker, the Government has introduced a very good programme, the loans programme. That is a fantastic programme, and those who will be removed from FISP should benefit from it.

Mr Kambita: Ema MPs aba.

Mr Mung’andu: Once the Government does that, we will have food security because people will produce enough maize for their consumption, and they will be able to sell some to the FRA. It is maize stock from the FRA that helps us to cushion the price of mealie meal. If the FRA does not have maize, which it offloads at a lower price to millers, whether the Government likes it or not, it will need to subsidise the farmers. Let us not be cheated. Even in the West, they subsidise their farmers. So, here, we cannot be told that we cannot subsidise the farmers. That is one best way to subsidise the cost of mealie meal. The technocrats will tell the hon. Minister all sorts of things, but he is a politician. We need to do that.

Mr Speaker, due to a time limitation, let me talk about the Constituency Development Fund (CDF). The CDF needs to be released on time. You have heard hon. Members say that we are in the third quarter of 2023, but only K7 million or K6 million has been released. Let that money be released on time. Then, let us also avoid politicising the CDF. Our colleagues should not make laws that seemingly target the Opposition. I can assure them that they will be the worst affected. From experience, I have seen it. You make a law thinking that you are targeting individuals, but you will be the worst hit. Let us not politicise the CDF. We all need that money in our constituencies for all of us to come back to this Parliament. Moreover, the enhanced CDF is the President’s. If we all build schools and houses for teachers in our constituencies, I am sure, when the President will be campaigning, he will say that he gave us money to do those things. However, we are seeing, in some instances, that District Commissioners (DCs) want to politic with us politicians. I can guarantee them that the people who will be affected negatively are them, who are on the right, not us.

Mr Speaker, if I come back to this House, I will count the hon. Members who will come back. Only 2 per cent might come back in 2026.

Laughter

Mr Mung’andu: Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development should be very serious with the implementation of the CDF. I was in my constituency, and what is happening on the ground is horrible. Money is being released, but go and see the amount of work being done. It is unacceptable, especially given that we have been given vehicles for monitoring the projects. Councils, in most cases, are not serious. Go and check. I will give the example of Solwezi, where there are projects that were abandoned. So, let us not politicise the CDF. Let us deliver for our people, and it is our colleagues who will reap the benefits.

Mr Speaker, with these few remarks, I wish to submit.

Hon. Members: Shishe!

Mr Mung’andu: Shishe!

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Laughter

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

We will be alternating.

Mr Hamwaata (Pemba): Mr Speaker, I want to thank the President and his Administration for restructuring the debt, which was a thorn in the flesh for many Zambians. This is, indeed, not a mean achievement. The previous Government tried its level best to restructure the debt, but that did not work out because the creditors could not trust it.

Mr Speaker, the topical issue I want to talk about is agriculture. I want to thank the President for increasing the floor price of maize from K180 to K280. That has motivated many farmers, including those who did not have an interest in venturing into farming.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Hamwaata: I have no doubt in my mind that that will result into a bumper harvest in the 2023/2024 Farming Season. However, at the same time, I want to indicate that for a long time, commercial farmers and small-scale farmers have been subsidising the price of mealie meal. I say so because for a long time, our farmers have not been paid for their maize, and that to some extent, caused the cosmetic low price of mealie meal. I also want to commend the Government and the hon. Minister of Agriculture for delivering D Compound fertiliser on time.

Mr Speaker, the President talked about expanding the coverage of extension services. That will really help to boost agriculture in the country. Above all, the recruitment of frontline staff will also improve agriculture in this country, especially crop and livestock farming, and aquaculture. In my view, one of the problems that we have, as a country, especially when it comes to farming, is what I may call a management problem, and I will give you a typical example. Farmers growing maize on a hectare, under normal circumstances, and with proper management, are supposed to produce between 140 and 160 50 kg bags of maize. Now, because of the management problem, they produce between fifty and eighty 50 kg bags of maize. When extension services are within reach and there are frontline staff, I strongly believe that it will really help our farmers to understand the management and growing of maize. I want to appeal to the hon. Minister to ensure that our farmers are given the knowledge they need to increase their yields.

Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the New Dawn Government for completing 149 secondary schools. However, at the same time, I would like to appeal to the Ministry of Education to speed up the completion of Kanchomba Secondary School. Girl children in the area move a long distance to access secondary school education. We want that school to be completed so that there are boarding facilities for our children.

Mr Speaker, I extend my gratitude to the Ministry of Health for completing a modern mini-hospital in Pemba. I also want to thank the Ministry of Water Development and Sanitation for allocating two dams to my constituency. That will go a long way, especially when it comes to the harvesting of water for our animals and human consumption.

Mr Speaker, the CDF is truly a game changer. Between 2022 and 2023, in Pemba, we will construct forty-seven classrooms. We will also install twenty-three water schemes by the end of this year, and five houses will be constructed. This is the New Dawn Government at work. Further, twenty-seven boreholes will be drilled and equipped with hand pumps.

Mr Speaker, we have managed to deliver 2,800 desks to our schools and rehabilitate the much-talked about, Habanyuka Clinic, whose roof was blown off. It is now operational all because of the CDF that has been enhanced. By the end of this year, two dip tanks will be handed over to the community, and I am a proud Member of Parliament because of that. Further, 177 clubs and co-operatives have been given resources. What this simply means is that not just the 177 co-operatives and clubs have benefited, but also 1,770 households.

Mr Speaker, with those few words, I thank you.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chala (Chipili): Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Laughter

Mr Chala: No, no, listen. He is looking like Madam Speaker.

Mr Speaker, that was on a lighter note.

Laughter

Hon. Opposition Member: Is he beautiful?

Mr Chala: Yes, he is very beautiful.

Laughter

Mr Chala: Mr Speaker, before I make any comment on the President’s Speech, allow me to state that there is a new wave of the scramble for Africa. We have to open our eyes as we do our business.

Mr Speaker, before I contribute to the debate on the President’s Speech, let me say that if you have ten groundnuts and four of them are rotten, when eating them, all the ten will be affected. Therefore, considering what is currently happening to the majority of Zambians, who are poor, the President’s Speech is not inspiring. It does not give confidence and hope to the majority poor Zambians.

Madam Speaker, Mr Speaker, –

Hon. Members: Ah!

Laughter

Mr Chala: Do not worry about that.

Mr Speaker, the President talked about reducing the price of mealie meal and proposed that we grow winter maize, and that by doing that, we would have enough maize in our country and, thereafter, the price of mealie meal would come down. I totally disagree because the President did not talk about the high cost of production of the same maize that we are talking about. How are we going to deal with the cost of doing business in the agriculture sector? I have the solution, …

Hon. UPND Members: Ah! Question!

Mr Chala: … which I am trying to give you. Listen. You question yourself and your mother.

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Resume your seat.

May you withdraw those words and apologise.

Mr Chala: Mr Speaker, I withdraw the words ‘to question your mother’ …

Laughter

Mr Chala: … and I say ‘sorry’.

Laughter

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: May you resume your seat.

Mr Chala resumed his seat.

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Next, may the hon. Member for Chinsali take the Floor.

Interruptions

Mr Mukosa (Chinsali): Mr Speaker, in debating the Motion on the Floor of the House, I will refer to what His Excellency the President talked about on page 4 of the speech. He said the following:

“Madam Speaker, upon assuming office, our priority was to restore the rule of law, fix the economy, by sealing leakages, introducing financial prudence and maintaining macroeconomic stability for sustained growth.”

Mr Speaker, the President talked about the restoration of the rule of law, an issue the United Party for National Development (UPND) Government prioritised, but what has been happening is contrary to what can be referred to as restoration of the rule of law.

Mr Munsanje: Question!

Mr Mukosa: Mr Speaker, to those who may want to be reminded, according to the Oxford Dictionary, the rule of law means a political idea that all citizens and institutions within a country or a community are accountable to. It is generally agreed that the rule of law prevails when the Government, itself, is bound by the very law it establishes.

What do I mean, Mr Speaker? If we are saying that we are committed to upholding the rule of law, then, we should ensure that it is not applied selectively. We had a situation in which when the Sixth Republican President wanted to congregate at a certain church on the Copperbelt, a battalion of police officers were sent to stop him from attending the church service. There are also people who have been stopped from traveling out of this country, and that is not the rule of law. Another example is when the Sixth Republican President, Dr Edgar Chagwa Lungu, wanted to go to South Korea, but he was stopped without any proper explanation and told that he did not get permission to go outside the country. Does someone need permission to go out of the country?

Hon. Government Members: Yes!

Mr Mukosa: When we hear people saying ‘yes’ then, it is a clear demonstration that the Government is failing to restore the rule of law.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mukosa: Mr Speaker, some people are saying that for one to move, one needs permission. This means that they are infringing on people’s freedom of movement.

Mr Speaker, let me talk about another issue that clearly shows that we are failing to restore the rule of law. When the President was addressing this House and the nation, while seated where you are seated, he said that all those committing offences would be prosecuted and persecuted, and we were all listening. Persecution basically means the act of treating somebody in a cruel and unfair way, especially because of his/her race, religion, ethnicity, tribe or political beliefs. Why should we proudly say that we shall persecute people? There is nothing wrong with prosecuting those who commit offences, but there is everything wrong with persecuting people.

Mr Musanje: Question!

Mr Mukosa: Mr Speaker, I have left that topic. Let me now talk about restoring and maintaining macroeconomic stability.

Mr Mwene: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mukosa: Mr Speaker, when we talk about maintaining or restoring macroeconomic stability, a country –

Interruptions

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Let us avoid running commentaries, and let us allow the debate to flow so that as many people as possible can debate. At the same time, let us not insinuate things to avoid people debating while seated. Let us be factual and debate accordingly. The speech that we are supposed to refer to was circulated. I know, we are politicians but, if we continue making insinuations, there will be acrimony in the House. Let us be issue-based and debate accordingly. Let us stick to the speech.

Mr Mukosa: Thank you for the guidance. The good part is that whatever I said is in the Hansard. However, I strongly value your guidance, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker, I do not think that Zambia, at the moment, can brag about maintaining macroeconomic stability. An economy that has achieved macroeconomic stability will be associated with factors such as low volatility of the exchange rate, low or moderate inflation rate, and acceptable and appropriate interest rates. However, when you look at the inflation rate at the moment – in as much as we can see from the Zambia Statistics Agency (ZamStats) that the inflation rate was around 10.8 per cent in August, compared with 10.3 per cent in July, what is obtaining is that the real inflation is very high. Look at the rate at which the price of mealie meal has gone up, from K160 to K330 and K350 now in Chinsali.

Ms Sefulo: Question!

Mr Mukosa: Mr Speaker, our people are suffering. These are the things that we need to talk about. Look at the exchange rate volatility, which has risen from around K17 per United States (US) Dollar to K21.50, K22 and K19. So, the rate of volatility is too high, which means that there is no stability in the macroeconomic sector.

Mr Speaker, if you are to look at the fiscal ‘deficiti’ –

Mr Kambita: Deficit.

Mr Mukosa: Deficit, thank you for the correction.

Mr Speaker, fiscal deficit is one of the factors that you have to look at when you are looking at macroeconomic stability. In 2021, the fiscal deficit was about 8.1 per cent of the gross domestic product (GDP). In 2022, it was about 8.9 per cent, an increase of almost 0.8 per cent.

Ms Mulenga: Of the gross domestic product (GDP).

Mr Mukosa: Yes, 8.9 per cent of the GDP, which means that the fiscal deficit increased. So, what macroeconomic stability are we talking about? In view of a high fiscal deficit, we have a problem implementing Government projects in Chinsali. People are crying that the Chinsali/Mulilansolo Road is in a bad state. The Government is failing to work on it, but we need it to be worked on. The road from Chinsali to Serenje is also in a bad state, and we need the Government to work on it.

Mr Speaker, with those few remarks, I thank you.

Mr Katakwe (Solwezi East): Mr Speaker, thank you very much for giving me this opportunity, on behalf of the good people of Solwezi, to add my voice to the debate on the Motion that was ably moved.

Mr Speaker, a wise President came to this wise House to speak to the wise people, and only the unwise would not see sense from such a speech.

Mr Kapyanga: Question!

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Katakwe: Mr Speaker, let me start with the conclusion that was given by the wise man. He said that the forward march to progress and prosperity must continue. The road might be bumpy, but we are on course. Ours is, collectively, a winning team. These are the words of the wise President who came to this House.

Mr Speaker, it is more prophetic to look at the words that the wise man crafted, talking about the forward march. Even when the children of Israel were getting into the Promised Land, they were told to move forward, not dununa reverse, not going backwards, …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Katakwe: … despite the challenges ahead of them. The challenges, in this case, could be the prices of mealie meal and fuel going up but, because the Israelites had a captain who had a vision, they did not relent. The captain said, ‘Move forward. Let us go’ because he had a vision. In this case, our President is a visionary leader, and the team he is leading has a vision, not what we saw in the past, people being led by a visionless leader who said it, himself, that he had no vision.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Katakwe: Mr Speaker, it is said that without a vision, people perish. This country was on the verge of perishing because the pilot had no vision. The country was on autopilot and about to crash until over 2 million Zambians realised that and joined hands with the visionary leader. It was going to be a mini Titanic but, thank God, somehow, the people of Zambia realised that it was important that they joined a visionary leader.

Mr Speaker, there is the saying that a wise man’s eyes are in his head. Our colleagues from the Bemba land say umungulu. If you have no vision, mungulu. Kwenda umungulu. Waponeina mungungulu ne ngulu shakwengila, meaning if you have no vision, you move aimlessly like, somebody would say, a headless chicken.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Katakwe: Mr Speaker, we need a visionary leader who has been in the doldrums preparing for twenty-three years, meaning that leader has a vision.

Mr Speaker, let me talk about the few things the visionary leader, the wise man, talked about. He talked about economic transformation and job creation. He centred on the fact that productivity, value addition, investment and trade are the pillars of economic transformation, and these must be done through the citizens. Who are the citizens? These citizens must be educated and empowered, and we are seeing that.

Mr Speaker, in addition, the President talked about resolving the issues that surrounded Vedanta Resource, and those issues have been resolved. We are seeing the Copperbelt Province coming to life because jobs are being created.

Ms Sefulo: No mining in court.

Mr Katakwe: No mining in court, as it has been said. So, with the creation of jobs, citizens are going to be empowered. Even the people of the North-Western Province are waiting for the issues surrounding Kasenseli Gold Mine to be resolved so that, indeed, they can also see life coming to the province.

Mr Speaker, the President talked about economic transformation with respect to the US$300 million that was allocated to the farming blocks. The people of the North-Western Province, in particular Mushindamo District, have a farming block. They know that the allocation that will be given to their farming block will go towards the construction of roads, building of skills centres and powering of the area so that they can grow food and bring the price of mealie meal down. That is the assurance the visionary leader gave us.

Mr Speaker, we have seen the creation of a credit window so that civil servants and we, hon. Members of Parliament, can benefit by getting money from it, and become productive by growing maize and wheat for export, and create value addition. Going forward, we do not expect people to come here and talk about the price of mealie meal because a platform has been set by the President. The President is also spearheading the empowerment of small and medium enterprises (SMEs). In my constituency, people have benefited through the Busulu and Marketeer Booster loans, and they are doing something. Further, the Ministry of Fisheries and Livestock created a fingerlings hub, and the youths are now engaging in meaningful activities that will enhance fish production. So, we will be able to export fish even to the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), our neighbour.

Mr Speaker, the President talked about the aviation industry. Kasama Airport is being constructed and, very soon, there will an airport in Mansa. The people of the North-Western Province are glad that very soon, they will see a modern airport being constructed in Solwezi so that it can handle big aircraft. That is, indeed, transformation.

Mr Mulunda: Pineapple pa ndeke!

Mr Katakwe: Somebody is saying ‘pineapple pa ndeke’. That sounds good.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Katakwe: Mr Speaker, in the education sector, we have seen that the President is doing something. We were told that 4,500 teachers and 3,000 health workers will be employed. In my constituency, we are already benefiting because forty health workers were deployed to Mushindamo District.

Mr Speaker, the President who is wise acknowledged the fact that when it comes to medical supplies we have been inadequately supplied. He is a wise President who is able to acknowledge the challenge, but he also said that the Government is not sitting idly. Something is being done to make sure that everyone is healthy.

Mr Speaker, let me not bore you with many words. Our President has a vision, and we need to support him even up to 2041. We need to support a President with a vision.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Interruptions

Mr E. Banda (Muchinga): I want to sing. So, do not worry.

Mr Speaker, I want to start by saying that the best way of sorting out any problem is to acknowledge it. When the President came here, he told this House that in areas where there are problems, the Government is going to sort them out, and it is working to sort the problems out. That was very brilliant of our Republican President.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Sefulo: Ema MP aba!

Interruptions

Mr E. Banda: Mr Speaker, I should be protected. Somebody is beating me here.

Interruptions

Mr J. E. Banda: Awe, ni chimbuya.

Mr E. Banda: Mr Speaker, on the rule of law, the police telling somebody that he/she cannot congregate because he/she does not have a permit has not started today. This started some time back. I am one of those who were pushed out of church, as simple as I was then, a villager. I was told to not congregate because I did not have a police permit.

Mr E. Tembo: On a point of order, Mr Speaker. He is debating himself.

Mr E. Banda: Mr Speaker, let me talk about the road network, which the President talked about. We are very happy that roads are being constructed, and the people of Muchinga are very hopeful that they will have roads during the term of the New Dawn or United Party for National Development (UPND) Government.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr E. Banda: Mr Speaker, I want to bring to the attention of this House the fact that while the Government is spending a lot of money constructing roads, the roads are being destroyed by tipper trucks, which load up to 50 tonnes and gallivant within Lusaka, and nothing is being done. Our roads are not safe, and they will not last. The Government will continue wasting money on constructing them if this is not attended to.

Mr Speaker, this Government has given hope to the people in rural areas. Apart from the Constituency Development Fund (CDF), many pronouncements have been made, and things are taking shape there. Bridges are being constructed, and I will be a beneficiary of three Acrow bridges. Why should I not mention this on the Floor of this House?

Mr Munsanje: Ema debate aya!

Mr E. Banda: Mr Speaker, work is being done. Of course, the people are seeing what they have lacked for a long time now being provided.

Mr Speaker, let me talk about peace and unity in this country. No doubt about it, today, I can sit with Hon. Mundubile without any fear.

Interruptions

Mr E. Banda: Mr Speaker, back then, it was not like that. This time, you can go anywhere. I can go to any place with Patriotic Front (PF) regalia, and no one will beat me up. That is peace and unity. I am a Member of Parliament in the northern part of Zambia. That is the unity that the President preaches about when he comes to address the nation and this House.

Mr Speaker, I only have one thing to say about the CDF: it is doing very well.

Mr Fube disturbed Mr E. Banda.

Mr E. Banda: Mr Speaker, somebody is putting something in my shoes.

Laughter

Mr E. Banda: I should be protected, Mr Speaker.

Mr J. E. Banda: They are doing chimbuya.

Mr E. Banda: Mr Speaker, we are doing many things using the CDF. It is not a secret that the CDF is a game changer.

Mr E. Tembo: Wenye!

Mr E. Banda: The CDF is developing the rural parts of Zambia. Tapali wenye apa. I am not lying. This is the truth. Some hon. Members of Parliament are saying that they will do many things in their constituencies before 2026. The same hon. Members of Parliament who are saying that the CDF is a scam are appreciating it. What the people of Zambia are seeing here are just politics, and they should know that what they are hearing, especially from our hon. Colleagues in the Opposition, are just politics.

Interruptions

Mr E. Banda: When out there, our colleagues accept that they are doing things in their constituencies using the CDF.

Interruptions

Mr E. Banda: Yes. What our hon. colleagues are doing here are just politics. When out there, they are appreciating the CDF. So, why can they not stand up here and appreciate what the CDF is doing? They just have to appreciate so that the people of Zambia know that we are all benefiting.

Mr Speaker, I am not politicking. Zambians know that the CDF has changed things. This morning, I visited fifty-eight students from rural parts of Muchinga and Serenje who are at Lusaka Business and Technical College, and would not have been at the institution if the CDF was still at K1.6 million. Is that not development?

Mr Speaker, as I wind up, …

Hon. Government Members: No, continue.

Interruptions

Mr E. Banda: … I want to say that there are three secondary schools in Muchinga. The construction of Mailo Boarding Secondary School started under the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) Government, when the late Vice-President, His Honour, Mr George Kunda, may his soul rest in peace, was Member of Parliament. This is when the contractor is seriously working on the school so it can be completed. Nothing happened in the last ten years.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr E. Banda: Mr Speaker, as I speak, works are being done at Chibale Day Secondary School. All I ask is that the Government makes sure that contractors work at the agreed speed, and I am sure that will be done. This is what we call development.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Ms Mabonga (Mfuwe): Mr Speaker, thank you very much for giving me the opportunity to add my voice to the debate on the President’s Speech.

Mr Speaker, let me start by saying that the speech was not inspiring to me, …

Hon. UPND Members: Question!

Ms Mabonga: … and that is my opinion, because the President has continued making pronouncements that do not translate into policy. When he was delivering the speech, he spoke about the rule of law. After that, we saw a Member of Parliament being arrested on the grounds of Parliament, breaking the law, …

Interruptions

Ms Mabonga: … and those police officers were from State House. That is what I mean by saying that what he says and what he does are different things. What we know is that when the President makes a pronouncement, it is policy, and those people who are supposed to support him –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

I think, I have already advised that hon. Members should stick to the President’s Speech and you cannot substantiate the assertion that those police officers came from State House. No one has a job register. So, let us stick to what we know. You cannot say that those police officers came from State House. Where is the record that they came from State House? Let us just debate the speech.

Ms Mabonga: Most obliged, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker, I was talking about the rule of law. For the first time in this country, we witnessed even respect for women and their rights being violated by the United Party for National Development (UPND) Government. We have seen women being arrested and detained longer than they should be without considering the fact that they are women. We all know that women are sacred and that all of us seated here came from them …

Mr Nkandu: Question!

Ms Mabonga: … and, because of that, we respect them. I am not implying that women are immune and not supposed to be probed when they do something wrong. However, we all know that all the women I am talking about were arrested because they are politicians. We are very few who have taken up this role of being politicians, and we have been hoping that more women will join us. However, what is happening is discouraging other women. The President always talks about the rule of law but, for me, he has failed lamentably in that area.

Mr Speaker, for the first time, we saw a Former First Lady being demeaned and, as a woman, I feel ashamed to call myself a Zambian and a leader during this time because what happened was not right. I think, the President must be told that, as women, we are not happy with the things happening to us.

Mr Speaker, there are many pronouncements that the President made in his speech, and I will talk about the recruitment of teachers. I know that people talk about the 30,000 teachers who were recruited, but I highly doubt that was the actual number because we saw the list. I do not want to go into the details, but most names appeared more than four times. However, this time around, on behalf of the people of Lavushimanda in Mfuwe Constituency, I am appealing to the hon. Minister of Education to ensure that the ministry recruits people from our constituency because we do not even know where the people who were deployed there came from. I think, most of them came from Lusaka or elsewhere, and they requested for transfers. They have been transferred, and those transfers came from the top.

Mr Speaker, at the moment, for example, in Mpamazu Ward, there is no single teacher. All the secondary school teachers who were posted there did not come from Lavushimanda. So, they failed to stay. They requested for transfers, and they have been transferred. So, this time around, the ministry should consider the people of Lavushimanda. Well qualified teachers were left out last year during the recruitment process. Those teachers are willing to work and stay in Lavushimanda because that is where they were born, unlike teachers from elsewhere, who fail to stay in the area.

Mr Speaker, I also want to talk about the other pronouncements that were made. We were told that we are now in the Champions League, although I am wondering what is happening. Does it mean that being in a Champions League is buying mealie meal at K350? Fuel is, at the moment, K30 …

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Mabonga: … and electricity tariffs are out of this world.

Mr Speaker, another pronouncement I heard the President make was that we are prudent in our spending, and I wondered what he was talking about. The UPND Government found K1.3 billion in reserves and, within a year, that money was used and we do not even know where it went. The UPND Government also found maize in reserves that should have lasted three years even if we were to have a drought. That maize was sold, and that has made us buy mealie meal at a high price. Is that prudent spending?

Hon. PF Member: No!

Ms Mabonga: We are exporting power, yet the Patriotic Front (PF) Government worked so hard that, by now, we should not have been experiencing load-shedding. However, because our colleagues have chosen to sell power outside the country, we are experiencing load-shedding. Is that being prudent or methodical?

Mr Speaker, on the issue of fertiliser, the Government would give the farmers six bags each. However, last year, the farmers in Mfuwe got a meda each.

Hon. PF Member: That is being in the Champions League.

Ms Mabonga: That is being in the Champions League, …

Mr Munsanje: Question!

Ms Mabonga: … and there is hunger today in Mfuwe. So, I do not know what we talk about and what those pronouncements mean.

Mr Speaker, let me talk about debt. The PF Government borrowed US$12 billion in ten years. In just two years, we have borrowed US$6 billion, and this is in the Champions League.

Mr Speaker, let me talk about the schools that are purported to have been built. I am wondering where those schools were built because where I come from, in Muchinga Province, not a single school has been built. Maybe, the President was talking about the classroom blocks that we have been building using the Constituency Development Fund (CDF), and I want to make the correction that a classroom is different from a school. We were told that a school would be built in Mfuwe but, to date, it has not been built. So, my question is: Where are those schools that have been built? The truth is that in Muchinga Province, we have not seen even one school. The school that my mother was talking about was started by the PF Government, and it has not been completed. So, what schools are we talking about? Where are those schools? Maybe, they are in the Western Province or somewhere else, as I have not seen a single school that has been built in Central Province, Copperbelt Province or Muchinga Province.

Mr Speaker, the other methodical thing is that there is hunger.

Interruptions

The hon. Member’s time expired.

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Ms Mabonga: Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Munsanje interjected.

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Hon. Member for Mbabala.

Mr Munsanje (Mbabala): Mr Speaker, it was a point of order because of the lies that were being propagated by my colleagues on the other side. I already debated on Friday. I just wanted to rebut a number of lies that were being propagated by the other side.

Mr Simunji (Nalikwanda): Mr Speaker, thank you for giving me the time to contribute to the debate on the Motion on the Floor.

Mr Speaker, I want to talk about the debt issue. One of the issues that the President talked about was debt. Our hon. Colleagues on the other side have been talking about the debt, which they cannot elaborate. Between 2011 and 2021, these people borrowed about US$12 billion. Let them tell us what items they invested that money in. We expected them to invest in roads, schools, dams and energy. However, there is nothing I can point at in Nalikwanda, and say that they did it.

Mr Speaker, the President stated that our balance sheet is not even balancing. When you have the huge debt of US$12 billion, you expect assets at the top. Now, since we are not seeing those assets, the people on your left should tell us where they took the money.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Simunji: We cannot tell where the money went.

Mr Speaker, a government is a going concern. When there is a change of government, the new one has to take over all the debts that the previous one left. Therefore, the United Party for National Development (UPND) Government took over the US$12 billion debt, but it went and sat down with the creditors and negotiated with them. It told them that ‘bane, we are not able to pay this money. Look, our colleagues were not even able to pay the interest. So, allow us to restructure the debt so that we are able to breath’ and they agreed. We have been told that the money will be paid back over a period of fourteen years. In the business world, when you borrow money from a bank today and, two years down the line, you are not able to pay it back, you can ask the bank to increase the tenure too. However, the bank will agree to increase the tenure and the interest rate. Now, because our people knew what they were doing, the tenure was increased but the interest rate was reduced. The people on the other side of the House do not appreciate that. If they were to come back into power, which will not happen, they would have to consult us so that we tell them how to negotiate. So, our colleagues failed, and the way forward is having public-private partnership (PPPs). A PPP is a method in which a Government agency collaborates with the private sector for investment.

Mr Kampyongo: Ema waffler.

Interruptions

Mr Simunji: Mr Speaker, those are the people who failed. They know where they took the money. Maybe, they shared it.

Mr Speaker, a PPP is a new method of investment. For example, the Government has not asked for any money anywhere for the Ndola/Lusaka Dual Carriageway. Instead, an investor will invest in the project and will be in charge of the property for twenty-five years. That will enable the Government to implement other projects that cannot be implemented through a PPP.

Mr Speaker, let me elaborate more on a PPP. When you enter into a PPP, the investor will construct the property, operate it, maintain it and, at the end of the tenure, give the asset to the Government. That is the best way to go. If we do not go the PPP way, where will we get the money for investment when our colleagues left a huge debt? Now, because we are going the PPP way, I am sure, the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning will increase the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) in the next Budget, and I will be able to construct clinics and crossing points for the people of Nalikwanda because the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning would have made a saving, instead of servicing the debt that our colleagues left. We are not going to pay the debt for now, but even if we do, we will pay less on the principal and less interest. This is a well-co-ordinated way of running the Government.

Mr Speaker, let me talk about cadreism. Let us look at the way we are living now. I am able to walk from here and go to talk to Hon. Kampyongo. Previously, he was untouchable.

Mr Kampyongo: On a point of order, Sir.

Interruptions

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Hon. Member for Shiwang’andu, may you resume your seat.

Mr Simunji: Yes. Those days, I was not going to –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Hon. Member for Nalikwanda, avoid debating other people. Stick to the President’s Speech.

You may continue.

Mr Simunji: Mr Speaker, previously, I would not go to the Intercity Bus Terminus because I am from the Western Province and, if some people knew that I was from the UPND, I would be slaughtered. I would not go to City Centre in a T-shirt written ‘UPND’. Now, if you go to town or any compound in Lusaka, you will find people dressed in Patriotic Front (PF), UPND and Socialist Party regalia. They are able to mingle and go anywhere they want. That is the way we want to live in Zambia.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Kapyanga (Mpika): Mr Speaker, thank you very much for allowing me to add my voice on behalf of the people of Mpika and the party that sponsored me, the Patriotic Front (PF).

Mr Speaker, the President, on page 1 of his speech, stated that development is not a straightforward journey. We must begin from there. What should have followed that admission is an apology to the Zambian people. Further, all the proponents of ‘Bally will fit it’ should have followed suit and apologised to the Zambian people for having mislead them in the 2021 General Elections.

Mr Speaker, the role of the Government is to harness and distribute national resources equitably. The question that must be answered right now is: Is Zambia short of resources? The answer is a categorical ‘No’. In Zambia, there are abundant natural resources that must be harnessed to enhance service delivery to our people, and minerals such as sugilite, gold, diamond, and cobalt that can be sold to change the lives of our people. This Government prides itself on borrowing. So far, it has borrowed US$6 billion. Instead of harnessing our resources and paying debts, it is celebrating debt restructuring.

Mr Speaker, let me talk about the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP). It was on the Floor of this House that we were told by the hon. Minister of Agriculture to inform the people in our constituencies that this Government would abolish FISP and replace it with agriculture loans. As hon. Members of Parliament, we went flatout and informed our people. Now that the Government has felt the pressure, it has U-turned and wants to introduce what it is calling the Comprehensive Agriculture Support Programme (CASP).

Mr Speaker, how many farmers –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Let me guide the House. I was attentive the day the hon. Minister issued the statement. Let us avoid misleading the public. What the hon. Minister said on the Floor of this House was that the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) would run concurrently with the loan scheme. He did not say –

Interruptions

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

I heard that. Let us not mislead the people out there. He said that FISP would run concurrently with the loan scheme that is yet to be introduced. So, as we debate, let us be factual and avoid misleading the public for political expediency.

You can continue.

Mr Kapyanga: Mr Speaker, the 1 million small-scale farmers in rural areas are the ones driving the agriculture sector of our country. The commercial farmers in Mkushi or elsewhere export what they produce. So, our nation is fed by small-scale farmers. When the Government decides to temper with FISP, it will be punishing the small-scale farmers in Kasenga in Mpika, Mulilansolo in Chinsali and Shiwang’andu, who make a livelihood out of farming. So, this Government should not temper with FISP.

Mr Speaker, the President postured as a person who has delivered development massively. Let me talk about the Great North Road from Serenje to Chinsali. The road is a death trap and, in the last two years this Government has been at the helm, nothing has been done, literally.

Interruptions

Mr Kapyanga: Mr Speaker, let me also talk about the road from Mpika to Nabwalya. The President promised the people of Nabwalya that when he formed Government, in the first six months, he would construct the Mpika/Nabwalya Road. Many projects in Muchinga Province, the Northern Province and Luapula Province have stalled, yet the President said that he has delivered development. The question that must be answered is: Where has he delivered that development?

Hon. Opposition Members: Nowhere.

Mr Kapyanga: Where has that development been delivered?

Mr Speaker, it is baffling that there are people claiming on the Floor of this House that they have not seen what the Patriotic Front (PF) Government under the leadership of the late President, Mr Michael Chilufya Sata, and President Dr Edgar Chagwa Lungu, did in ten years. A few days ago, I was in the Western Province, and the road from Mongu to Kalabo was constructed by the PF Government. As I speak, there is a specialised hospital that deals with organs like hearts and kidneys. These are the things that the PF Government did. Our colleagues must up their game so that they can match the delivery record of the Government under those two sons of the soil. We are grateful for the job that Dr Edgar Chagwa Lungu, the sole surviving Former Head of State, wherever he is, did for our motherland.

Mr Speaker, infrastructure development under the PF Government was unprecedented, and one develops a headache when one hears the Head of State say he has delivered. In Muchinga Province, the Northern Province and Luapula Province, there is nothing there. The UPND Government found Kasama Airport at 80 per cent and only added 20 per cent, but it wants to celebrate and beat drums over that project. It is laughable.

Mr Speaker, the 129 secondary schools mentioned in the President’s Speech do not even exist anywhere. They are only an imagination. If they existed, then, why are they not in Muchinga Province, the Northern Province, Lusaka Province and Central Province? Where are they? We cannot see them. The representatives of the people here are asking where they are.

Mr Speaker, this Government is undertaking a mobile national registration exercise in three provinces, …

Mr Jamba: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

Mr Kapyanga: … discriminating against other provinces as if there are no children who want to acquire National Registration Cards (NRCs) in the other provinces. We want this Government to answer. When the President talks about unity, is that something that will unite us? The answer is ‘No’.

Mr Speaker, there is the issue of the high cost of living. The prices of mealie meal and essential commodities have gone up. The Zambian people were duped into believing that this Government would reduce the high cost of living. Right now, we are buying a bag of mealie meal at K350, and this is the more reason this Government must apologise to the Zambian people. A litre of fuel cost K17, but we are now buying it at K30. This has never happened in the history of this country.

Mr Speaker, the tu pamela cooking oil were moving, but this one now costs a lot of money (lifting a small plastic bag containing cooking oil). Akakupimisha aka ka saladi, bushe nkabofye lwisa? Nalaya nako kwi?

Laughter

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member! Resume your seat.

Hon. Members, you all know that our rules do not allow bringing foreign items into the House. Maybe, that practice has been rehearsed because, a few days ago, someone brought mealie meal here. There is already a precedent for whoever brings in materials that are not allowed on the Floor of the House. I think, we should avoid doing what we know is wrong because a precedent is already there. If any measure is instituted, you are the same people who will be complaining. The Serjeant-At-Arms should ensure that we up our game, going forward. The bringing in the House of things that are not allowed on the Floor must be stopped.

Hon. Member, you can continue.

Mr Kapyanga: Mr Speaker, what I was saying is that this Government must reduce the high cost of living. We need to buy mealie meal at K50, as was promised. We need a litre of fuel to cost K9, as was promised.

The hon. Member’s time expired.

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Resume your seat.

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Speaker, thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to contribute to the debate on the Motion on the Floor.

Mr Speaker, first of all, allow me to thank the people of Dundumwezi, and Katanda Ward in particular, for their unwavering support on 7^th September, 2023, and for ensuring that Councillor Nkuyanda Malawo went through unopposed. This is an indication that the people of Dundumwezi are not looking over their shoulders to see who will take development to their areas. It is clear that the New Dawn Government will ensure that the people of Dundumwezi are supported.

Mr Speaker, allow me to also pay my heartfelt condolences to the Mudenda family in Dundumwezi Constituency for the demise of Hon. Mudenda, who was a Member of Parliament in this House from 2001 to 2006. May his soul rests in peace.

Mr Speaker, it is unfortunate that our colleagues who are known to be knowledgeable are failing, this time around, to debate this Motion. Maybe, let me start by stating where we are coming from.

Mr Speaker, we are coming from a scenario in which we had Heads of State coming here and promising this nation 650 health posts. Out of 650 health posts, Dundumwezi and a number of other constituencies did not get even a single health post.

Mr Speaker, we are coming from a scenario in which a Head of State would come here and say that over fifty people had lost their lives during the gassing period and that the Government would ensure that all the perpetrators were brought to book. As I stand here, it is sad that many people died, ...

Ms Sefulo: Ba Kampyongo.

Mr Sing’ombe: ... but very few perpetrators, if any, have been brought to book.

Mr Speaker, I heard a colleague say that people in certain regions are not being given National Registration Cards (NRCs). I wish to state that our colleagues gave children who were thirteen years old NRCs in advance. So, why do they want NRCs when their children were given in advance?

Mr Mundubile: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Speaker, it is in public domain that there are a number of former Government officers who are actually –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Ensure that you stick to the President’s Speech to avoid contravening the rules.

You can continue.

Mr Sing’ombe: Thank you very much, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker, we are coming from a situation in which the Food Reserve Agency (FRA) almost became defunct and was failing to pay our farmers on time. We are also coming from a situation in which one of your hon. Members who attended a function in his constituency was attacked in the presence of a Former Vice-President. We are coming from a situation in which a lady was stripped naked in the presence of a Former Vice-President.

Hon. Government Members: Mawe.

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Speaker, where are we today?

Mr Speaker, the Zambian people have now started appreciating the peace that we are enjoying. Further, the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) has been increased. What is its multiplier effect? Some people are saying that the speech is not inspiring. To some extent, I agree with them. These are the people who have formed their own companies and instead of distributing the CDF to their members for them to benefit, the CDF is going into their pockets.

Interruptions

Mr Kampyongo: On a point of order, Mr Speaker

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Speaker, –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order!

Interruptions

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Let me guide.

Hon. Member for Dundumwezi, do not talk about things that you cannot substantiate. Stick to this beautiful copy of the speech. The content of the speech should be the basis of your debate. So, concentrate on the President’s Speech. Do not say things that the President did not say. Your debate should be related to the President’s Speech.

You can continue.

Mr Sing’ombe: Much obliged, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker, let me ask some of my colleagues a question. Why is it that the people in constituencies they come from are not benefiting from the CDF? Where is the money going? Last week, we heard one hon. Member of Parliament state that the President was misled by the technocrats because – Actually, the former regime stopped buying desks outside the country a long time ago, and the hon. Member only named one company that was distributing the desks. So, the question is: How many companies are benefiting from desk manufacturing today? In Dundumwezi, there are three companies.

We have created employment in our constituencies, and we have a situation, Mr Speaker, –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

How many companies did you say are in Dundumwezi?

Mr Sing’ombe: Three companies.

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Why are –

Mr Sing’ombe: In the previous Government, only one company was benefiting from desk manufacturing, according to what our colleagues stated.

Ms Sefulo: At the national level.

Mr Sing’ombe: The entire country. In Dundumwezi, three youth groups are manufacturing desks and getting a lot of money from the CDF.

Mr Speaker, we have given twenty-nine companies contracts. Where is the money going? In the pockets of the people of Dundumwezi. Let those who do not believe in what we are saying wait for the Budget so that they can see the connection. Last time, they were asking where the money for recruiting 30,000 teachers would come from. There you are; 30,000 teachers were recruited. So, for them to believe what the New Dawn Government will do for them, they should wait for the Budget, then, they will see the connection.

The hon. Member’s time expired.

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order!

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Hon. Member for Dundumwezi, you are very happy. You said that there are three companies in Dundumwezi. Three is not enough. In Luangeni, there are thirty groups.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr J. E. Banda (Petauke Central): Mr Speaker, thank you for giving me an opportunity to debate on behalf of the good people of Petauke in the Eastern Province.

Mr Speaker, we want to thank the President for coming to this House to update the nation on various happenings.

Mr Speaker, I will start with the rule of law. The President talked about the ‘lule’ of law.

Mr Nkandu: Rule!

Mr J. E. Banda: Whatever!

Mr Speaker, the President talked about the rule of law but, here, it is not being implemented, and you will find that the people managing the affairs of Parliament want to –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Hon. Member, resume your seat.

I know you are a Whip.

Mr J. E. Banda: Yes.

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: You know that you do not debate the House. That is contempt of the House. So, desist from debating the House because that is being contemptuous, and it has repercussions.

You may continue debating.

Mr J. E. Banda: Mr Speaker, I withdraw the statement that Parliament does things according to certain groupings.

Interruptions

Mr J. E. Banda: Madam … Mr Speaker, –

Ms Sefulo: “Madam”?

Mr J. E. Banda: Yes, he can be ‘Madam’ because you are Madam.

Laughter

Mr J. E. Banda: Mr Speaker, the President talked about the rule of law, yet his appointees are the ones at the forefront of breaking the law. Imagine, the Permanent Secretary (PS) responsible for Local Government, deciding to change the Constitution from his House, forgetting that it can only be changed here.

Mr Speaker, the guidelines on the utilisation of the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) are under the Constituency Development Fund Act, but he just dreamt up changes, forgetting that we are guided by the Constitution.

Ms Sefulo: Question!

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Hon. Member, whom are you referring to?

Mr J. E. Banda: The PS responsible for Local Government, Mr Nicolas Phiri, who changed the –

Laughter

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Why are you referring to people who are not here and, therefore, cannot defend themselves?

Mr J. E. Banda: This is happening in the country. This is why we are debating them. He just –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Resume your seat.

You should take time to read the guide of your stay in Parliament, which are the Standing Orders. Let us take time to read them. The Permanent Secretary (PS) whom you are referring to cannot defend himself, and our rules do not even allow that. Even if he were able to defend himself, our rules do not allow that. So, stick to the President’s Speech, which you were given a few days ago so that you could have ample to read and understand it. If other people needed to help in interpreting, there was time to do that. So, ensure that you stick to the President’s Speech.

You can continue.

Mr J. E. Banda: Mr Speaker, I understand the Standing Orders very well, but the people on your right are failing to understand them. The Standing Orders are very clear in providing that no one should debate while seated, but you allow them to do that.

Laughter

Mr J. E. Banda: Mr Speaker, the President talked about the CDF, which is a good thing, and the good people of Petauke are very happy about it. However, the CDF Account for Petauke Central Constituency is loaded with money for 2020, 2021, 2022 and even 2023. I wish the President, when he came here, had warned the people whom he appointed to be implementing projects that if they did not work, they would be fired. So, I hope, the next time he comes, he will warn them so that they can start implementing the projects. The people of Petauke expect to benefit from the CDF, but the banks are the ones benefitting. Every day, the banks benefit through bank interests, but the good people of Petauke are crying and do not even know –

Ms Sefulo: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

Mr J. E. Banda: Mr Speaker, I know that the CDF is a game changer, but the good people of Petauke do not see it as such because of the people whom the President appointed, who are blocking its utilisation.

Mr Speaker, the road construction projects that were approved in Petauke Central Constituency, –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

You know very well that the President has not appointed anyone to implement the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) in Petauke. You appointed more than 70 per cent of your Committee. I do not want to be part of your debate, and I do not know why you are blaming that Committee.

Laughter

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Avoid bringing the President into your debate.

Mr J. E. Banda: Thank you, Mr Speaker.

I, Hon. J. E. Banda, am a researcher, and I researched that the people who are not implementing the projects are not from the Committee in Petauke, but from the province, which is under the hon. Minister for Eastern Province and the PS for Eastern Province who, not long ago, were cadres.

Laughter

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: I do not know how many times I can guide; this hon. Member.

Laughter

Mr J. E. Banda: Maybe, they are being blocked because of political groupings.

Laughter

Mr J. E. Banda: Mr Speaker, let me talk about schools. Right now, in my constituency, people are learning under trees.

Hon. UPND Members: Why?

Mr J. E. Banda: That is because the people you appointed are failing to implement the CDF projects that we approved.

So, why are you debating while seated and the Speaker is watching you?

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

Concentrate on your debate.

Interruptions

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Hon. Members, avoid running commentaries, and let us give chance to Hon. J. E. Banda to debate.

May the hon. Member continue.

Mr J. E. Banda: Mr Speaker, children cover 20 km when going to school. We approved eighteen schools and eighteen health posts to be constructed using the CDF, and the money is there. However, the people under the leadership of the hon. Minister for Eastern Province are blocking –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member for Petauke Central!

Resume your seat. I guided you earlier.

We do not debate ourselves, so to say. You do not have to debate your colleague. Debate the President’s Speech.

Mr J. E. Banda: Thank you, Mr Speaker, for your guidance. It is only that they are blocking the roadmap of the President.

Mr Speaker, let me talk about our natural resources. The Ministry of Mines and Minerals Development has geological reports from all over the country, and each mine here, in Zambia, has a geological report that indicates the type of minerals it has. However, I do not know what the hon. Minister of Mines and Minerals Development is doing. He is just seated. Some mining companies only declare copper and cobalt. The other minerals leave the country undeclared while we are suffering. The Government is failing to subsidise the price of mealie meal whilst the money is going out every day. So, the Ministry of Mines and Minerals Development should up its game and protect the resources of our country so that even the poor benefit. There should be a trickle-down effect of our resources. Not only our colleagues should enjoy.

Mr Speaker, with those few words –

Ms Sefulo: You are enjoying.

Mr J. E. Banda: It is you who is enjoying.

Laughter

Mr J. E. Banda: Mr Speaker, with those few remarks, the hon. Member for Mwandi Constituency is enjoying, but her people are suffering.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Laughter

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Mr C. Mpundu (Chembe): Thank you, Mr Speaker, for allowing me, on behalf of the people of Chembe, to add my voice to the debate on the President’s Speech.

Mr Speaker, my debate will only zero in on one thing, which is environmental sustainability vis-a-vis economic sustainability.

Mr Speaker, Zambia continues to underutilise its natural resources, as if it were under economic sanctions.

Mr Speaker, it should be borne in our minds that there is a relationship between environmental sustainability and economic sustainability. The two move in tandem because all the resources that we need to develop the economy are taken from the environment.

Mr Speaker, in Zambia, it is business as usual. We talk about borrowing but, the world order is now changing, and we are being encouraged to get domestic financing –

Mr Second Deputy Speaker: Order!

(Debate adjourned)

_______

The House adjourned at 1841 hours until 1430 hours on Wednesday, 20^th September, 2023.

____________

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Tuesday, 19th September, 2023

Order Paper

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