Thursday, 1st December, 2022

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      Thursday, 1st December, 2022

[MADAM SPEAKER in the Chair]

The House met at 1430 hours






The Minister of Finance and National Planning (Dr Musokotwane) (on behalf of the Minister of Technology and Science (Mr Mutati)): Madam Speaker, I wish to thank you for giving me an opportunity to deliver a ministerial statement to this august House, in response to the concerns raised in Parliament by the hon. Member for Chama North Parliamentary Constituency, Mr Yotam Mtayachalo, regarding the connectivity challenge in his constituency, which is alleged to have affected farmers in Mbazi Ward, as they failed to receive their farming inputs due to mobile communication network disruption for more than two weeks.

Madam Speaker, in light of the concerns raised by the hon. Member of Parliament, I wish to state from the outset, that I am cognisant of the need for reliable mobile communication connectivity in supporting farmers who, through the use of their mobile phones, access information on the collection of farming inputs. However, we are aware that Mbazi Ward, in particular, has experienced a communication disruption in the recent past. The ministry has directly engaged the Zambia Telecommunications Company Limited (Zamtel), as the main provider in Mbazi Ward, to address the technical challenges, and that has since been resolved.

Madam, the ministry, through the Zambia Information and Communications Technology Authority (ZICTA), continues to ensure that all reported issues concerning unreliable mobile telecommunication connectivity are verified and dealt with promptly. Further, the authority is in the process of upgrading equipment to facilitate the monitoring of the quality of the service, which will be able to show, in real time, and the availability of service with accuracy. Further, all service providers that will not comply with the quality of service guidelines shall be sanctioned as prescribed in the quality of service guidelines.

Madam Speaker, in this regard, the Government wants to ensure that value added services are available in rural areas, such as mobile money, the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) and the Social Cash Transfer Scheme. I have, therefore, directed ZICTA to intensify the undertaking of comprehensive quality of service checks, and be in real time to ensure that the availability of quality communication connectivity is in place.

Madam, as I conclude, allow me to state that to ensure enhanced connectivity in unserved and under-served areas such as Chama North Parliamentary Constituency, the Government has committed to continuing to support the construction of tower projects as well as the upgrading of existing towers. It remains committed to promoting the safety and security of the domestic Information Communication Technology (ICT) sector.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mutati entered the Assembly Chamber.

Madam Speaker: Thank you very much. I acknowledge the arrival of the hon. Minister of Technology and Science.

Hon. Members are now free to ask questions on points of clarification on the ministerial statement given by the hon. Minister.

Thank you very much, hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, for stepping in on behalf of the hon. Minister.

Mr Tayengwa (Kabwata): Madam Speaker, I want to find out whether the Government has any intention of decentralising the offices of the Zambia Information and Communications Technology Authority (ZICTA) so that it can enhance the issue of inspections in various provincial centres.

The Minister of Technology and Science (Mr Mutati): Madam Speaker, it is no longer just an intention of the Government to do that. It is actually being done.

Madam, ZICTA is already in several provincial centres and its overall goal is to be in every provincial centre.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr E. Tembo (Feira): Madam Speaker, is the ministry aware that our mobile phone telecommunication network is generally very bad as compared to that in our neighbouring countries? That has been a problem, I think, from inception. If so, is there anything that is being done? In some countries just within the Southern African Development Community (SADC), you are able to move around the country without losing the network.

Mr Mutati: Madam Speaker, in our response, we did indicate that ZICTA is procuring quality of service monitoring equipment so that it can monitor service in real time and, therefore, be able to direct the mobile phone service providers to take corrective action.

We are also doing a bit more. At the moment, the coverage in this country is under 90 per cent. So, those areas along the road as you drive are bound to have no service. We are doing everything possible to resolve this, and our overall goal is that by 2024, we should have 100 per cent coverage across the country.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mtayachalo (Chama North): Madam Speaker, it is not a question. I just want to take this opportunity to thank the hon. Minister of Technology and Science for having responded expeditiously to deal with this particular matter. I think the people in Mbazi Ward, which is a highly agricultural area, started receiving farming inputs particularly D Compound. However, they have not started receiving Urea.

Madam Speaker, I am also happy that Chama North Constituency has been allocated a number of sites where communication facilities are going to be installed, I think, for the first time.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: I allowed the hon. Member to proceed by way of comment because he is the one who asked this question. Otherwise, it is supposed to be points of clarification.

Mr Simuzingili (Gwembe): Madam Speaker, many of our communication towers use second-generation cellular networks (2G) which do not support many platforms, including the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) in terms of connectivity. In Gwembe, we have that challenge. Are there any plans to upgrade the 2G to a better connectivity platform?

Mr Mutati: Madam Speaker, we are actually moving quite aggressively in terms of upgrading connectivity. Only last week, we launched the fifth-generation cellular networks (5G). In terms of connectivity, among the countries in Africa, only ten countries have 5G. For MTN, we are the third country in Africa that has 5G that provides unprecedented experience, speed and satisfaction. Our intention is to move ruthlessly. For simplicity sake, the difference between fourth-generation cellular networks (4G) and 5G in terms of speed is comparing a Mercedes Benz S500 with a Spacio.


Mr Mutati: That is the difference. So, we are moving into a space of speed.

Madam Speaker, in reference to the question from the hon. Member for Gwembe, yes, we have 4G and third-generation cellular networks (3G) in the country, but in most rural places, there is 2G. We are conscious of the fact that in terms of expanding, particularly delivering Government services, 2G is the main constraint. So, we are doing an upgrade of 2G to have a minimum of 3G because with 3G, you can receive any service even in the rural areas.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Sampa (Matero): Madam Speaker, let me confess that I am one of the proud drivers of Spacios, and they move fast, actually. Hon. Mtayachalo has done a 360-degree on the question, but let me state that issue is not isolated to Chama North. Overall, the service from the network providers, especially Airtel Zambia and the Zambia Telecommunications Company Limited (Zamtel) is poor. The talk time finishes fast and the internet bundles finish fast. Is the hon. Minister aware of this and what is he doing about that?

Mr Mutati: Madam Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Matero will recall that we dealt with the issue of consumption of internet bundles. In fact, at the time, that is when we introduced the issue of speed between two motor vehicles. So, the faster you move, the faster the consumption.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mutelo (Mitete): Madam Speaker, I listened to the accolades that came from the hon. Member for Chama North to the hon. Minister. In Mitete, we are bleeding, and the hon. Minister has the facts on his table. All services, be it the farming inputs, the social cash transfer scheme (SCT) or the marketeer booster loan cannot be accessed easily. It is a nightmare to access them in Mitete. I thank the hon. Minister for his promise to address this matter, but for now, how are we going to service the people of Mitete?

Mr Mutati: Madam Speaker, we truly honour and love the people of Mitete, and they are very close to our hearts. It is for that reason that we did engage with the hon. Member of Parliament for Mitete only two days ago, to see how working with him, we can create a sustainable solution, including the identification of the communication towers and asking where the priority is for us to plant the communication towers in order to provide the convenience required for our people in Mitete.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chisopa (Mkushi South): Madam Speaker, the challenge of network connectivity is in almost all parts of the country, including Luano. What is the quickest mode of identifying that a particular communication tower has problem as opposed to humans reporting?

Mr Mutati: Madam Speaker, the reason we distributed the schedule to hon. Members of Parliament is for them to assist us in terms of the accuracy with regard to planting of communication towers. This is because they are key stakeholders and they know the distribution, particularly, where there is density of people. Using technology, yes, we can plant the communication towers, but the areas we plant them in, may not necessarily correspond with the areas where there is density and need by the hon. Member of Parliament. So, it is a combination of using satellite technology and stakeholder involvement in order to deliver adequate coverage.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mung’andu (Chama South): Madam Speaker, communication in rural areas is still a challenge in spite of the communication towers that the Zambia Information Communication Technology Authority (ZICTA) or the Government erected. People cannot communicate. The hon. Minister circulated the schedule showing the areas that have been identified to put communication towers, and the hon. Member for Chama North thanked the hon. Minister for this.

Madam Speaker, when are these communication towers going to be erected? In my constituency, we are so excited because we have been shown about eight new and genuine sites, including Chipala, Lumezi, Chitukula, and many others in Chama North. When is the ministry likely to embark on the construction of these communication towers so that the people in rural areas are not left behind?

Mr Mutati: Madam Speaker, the intention of receiving confirmation from hon. Members of Parliament is to enable us create a road map of how we will deliver the towers per constituency. What we will do next is that we will circulate the list of the number of towers and where they will be located in each and every constituency to the hon. Members of Parliament. We believe that for the sake of equity and transparency, hon. Members of Parliament must know what we are doing across the country in terms of planting towers.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr C. Mulenga (Kwacha): Madam Speaker, is there any intention of bringing in a fourth mobile provider, preferably Vodacom Group Limited, so it can compete with the companies providing mobile services in the country because a lot of them have relaxed? So, if a number of companies come in and provide the best services, I think the Zambian people will have better services. Can the hon. Minister shed light on that.

Mr Mutati: Madam Speaker, as I earlier stated, it is not part of our Deoxyribonucleic Acid (DNA) to state intentions. We are actually doing it. As I speak, we have already licenced the fourth mobile provider company, and all things being equal, it will begin providing services next year.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chewe (Lubansenshi): Madam Speaker, this far, there are three mobile providers in Zambia providing network connectivity. When you go outside the country and try to call someone, there is a challenge of connectivity. My question is: What urgent measures is the ministry putting in place to ensure that whenever we are outside the country, we are able to access network and communicate to the people without any interruption?

Mr Mutati: Madam Speaker, the urgent measures that we are taking, as I said, are that we delivered Fourth-Generation Wireless (4G) and we are planting towers across the country. The Government, and telephone operators, being part of their licensing conditions, are planting towers. So, those are the urgent measures that we are taking.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: I was hoping that we will save time and go to the next item. However, I can see that hon. Members are still indicating.

Mr C. Chibuye (Mkushi North): Madam Speaker, I am riding on the question posed by the hon. Member for Mkushi South, and I suppose the hon. Minister did not get the question correctly, which was on the existing towers. The towers in rural areas have not been operational for two to three weeks. How can the Zambia Information and Communications Technology Authority (ZICTA) or the powers that be get reports in a quicker way other than waiting for people to report?

Mr Mutati: Madam Speaker, perhaps, the hon. Member did not get my response. I indicated very clearly that ZICTA is acquiring a monitoring equipment that will monitor all the towers in real time so that quick action can be taken as opposed to reporting the fault. So, that is what it is doing.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Dr Mwanza (Kaumbwe): Madam Speaker, my question is a follow-up to the question asked by the hon. Member of Parliament for Chama North, which I feel the hon. Minister of Technology and Science did not answer.

Madam Speaker, the people of Kaumbwe Constituency are excited to have been allocated seven sites. Now –

Madam Speaker: Order!

Hon. Member for Kaumbwe, the hon. Member for Chama North did not ask a question. Maybe, you mean the hon. Member for Chama South.

Dr Mwanza: Madam Speaker, when is the Government going to implement the project in the constituencies? What is the time limit because according to the hon. Minister’s answer, it is still under desk study?

Mr Mutati: Madam Speaker, we have to do these things in a methodical manner. We have to get information from hon. Members of Parliament, and that is the first step. We will use that information to determine the priorities and will match them with the resources, and that is what we will do. As I speak, we have enough resources to erect forty-five towers on top of the thirty-one towers that are being evaluated at the moment. Hon. Members of Parliament must note that the speed of implementing the project will be driven by the speed of their responses. So, the hon. Member has the answer in his hands.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Mangango and hon. Member for Kabushi, you have indicated, but I am asking if we can use the six minutes for other items. We have a lot of work to do. If you do not mind, with your indulgence, I am moving to the next item.





VOTE 53 – (Ministry of Green Economy and Environment – K774,748,986)

(Consideration resumed)

The Minister of Green Economy and Environment (Mr Nzovu): Mr Chairperson, allow me now to present an overview of the 2023 budget for my ministry. The ministry of Green Economy and Environment has budgetary allocation of K1.2 billion, representing 0.6 per cent of the total budget for climate change and environmental protection activities, including the following:

  1. green economy and climate change;
  2. climate change mitigation programmes;
  3. forestry development and management;
  4. environmental protection, management and research;
  5. meteorological services; and
  6. management and support services.

Mr Chairperson, the ministry has allocated K3.7 million to support the green economy and climate change programme implementation by developing a green growth strategy that will act as a blueprint for providing strategic guidance on Zambia’s transition to a green economy. Further, the ministry will enact the Climate Change Bill in order to regulate the carbon markets as well as respond to other climate related issues.

Mr Chairperson, K326.3 million has been allocated to facilitate the implementation of climate change mitigation programmes, including forest protection, climate smart agriculture promotion, biodiversity loss protection and other mitigation and adaptation activities to mitigate the negative effects of climate change.

Sir, K193.9 million has been allocated to facilitate the provision of forestry skills development and forestry management. This will enable the ministry to train students in forestry and natural resources management skills at the Zambia Forestry College. Further, the ministry will finalise the review of the Forestry Management Policy to provide a legal framework to protect this natural resource and promote its sustainable utilisation.

Mr Chairperson, K12 million has been allocated for the operationalisation of the Forestry Development Fund, which will enhance effective management and utilisation of forestry resources. Now that the fund has been established, we call upon co-operating partners to come on board and contribute towards the fund.

Mr Chairperson, K70 million has been made available to set up a timber exchange platform, which is a collaborative marketplace and digital tool for sawmills, timber importers and forwarders, to streamline trading and manage supply chains. It will enable suppliers to buy and sell timber directly with leading and vetted sawmills and importing companies around the world and cut out middlemen. The platform will offer tools for export/import, logistics, documentation, compliance, tracking and analysis to ensure maximum benefits to traders and the Government.

Mr Chairperson, given the increased number of pollution cases across the country, K174.7 million has been allocated to conduct risk assessments, develop conservation value maps and conduct monitoring and evaluation to ensure strict compliance with laws and regulations. The fund will also facilitate the reduction of environmental health risks in critically polluted mining areas like Chingola, Kabwe, Kitwe and Mufulira. With the Government aiming to increase copper production to 3 million metric tonnes per year in the next decade, pressure on pollution control will mount and the country needs to be prepared to tackle this challenge.


Mr Chairperson, K8.2 million has been allocated to ensure safety in the development, use and handling of gene modification as well as monitor and regulate compliance. This is to maximise the benefits of modern biotechnology for end users, producers, consumers and the general public.

Sir, K20.9 million has been allocated to support the provision of meteorological and weather services programme, which includes the provision of weather observation infrastructure, forecasting, research, climatology and advisory services. Hundred and sixty meteorological stations will be maintained ten observation weather stations will be equipped with computing facilities to enable timely and more accurate production of weather forecasts.

Mr Chairperson, in these times of climate change, this information is necessary for issuance of early warnings of a wide range of weather, climate and water related hazards to enable key institutions like the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) under the Vice-President’s Office in developing and delivering services necessary for protecting lives, livelihoods and property in a cost-effective, systematic and sustainable manner. This information is also necessary to support climate smart agriculture, water resources management, renewable energy production and effective power generation.

Mr Chairperson, K54 million was allocated to support the development of the 2022-2026 Strategic Plan, conduct research and develop the green growth strategy. The allocation will also facilitate the development of the service delivery charter aimed at improving service delivery, enhance accountability and promote prudent utilisation of public resources.

Mr Chairperson, as I conclude, I echo my earlier sentiments that my ministry, in collaboration with other line ministries, remains resolute in supporting efforts towards the promotion of sustainable development by expanding and exploiting opportunities that transform the livelihoods of our people through sustainable utilisation of natural resources in the country.

Mr Chairperson, let me end by urging all hon. Members of this House to get more involved in addressing the triple planetary crisis of climate change, biodiversity loss and pollution which threaten the very existence of humankind. Finally, let me request hon. Members of this House to strongly support the 2023 estimates of expenditure for my ministry to enable it deliver on its mandate.

Mr Chairperson, I thank you for your attention.

Mr Wamunyima (Nalolo): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for allowing the voice of Nalolo to contribute to the debate on Vote 53. From the outset, I strongly support the budgetary allocation for the Ministry of Green Economy and Environment and let me take this opportunity to thank the President for creating this ministry. This ministry could not have been created at a better time.

Mr Chairperson, you may wish to note that the allocation to the Ministry of Green Economy and Environment, standing at 0.6 per cent of the Budget, is the lowest allocation for a ministry that focuses on the environment, not only in Zambia, but also in Africa. Looking at the ambitious target that the country has set through the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning that we wish to mine 3 million metric tonnes of copper, it is very important that this ambitious target is equally mitigated with climate strategies. This is because this will bring destruction to the environment.

Therefore, Sir, in supporting the hon. Minister’s budget, I urge the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to consider doubling the allocation to this ministry because Zambia now has begun to commit to various international treaties. It is in this light that I have seen a budget particularly target to introduce a climate Bill. This will subsequently establish the department of climate change and domesticate the United Nations Framework on the Convention of Climate Change and the Paris Agreement.

Mr Chairperson, the Ministry of Green Economy and Environment needs to be decentralised by having an official in every district. One of the destructive elements which contribute to climate change includes deforestation, and the Government has committed to ending it. In this light, there is need for additional resources in this context to support institutional strengthening through having district officers who will look at how they can work with the community on issues that deal with climate change.

Mr Chairperson, you will agree with me that the issue of climate change in this country is a new phenomenon. Therefore, this very important ministry needs sufficient resources so that even when the Climate Bill is passed in this House, the additional resources will help operationalise this Bill.

Further, Mr Chairperson, I would like to take this opportunity to also inquire from the hon. Minister, what happens with resources collected from Carbon Tax? These resources were meant to strengthen institutions such as Zambia Environmental Assessment Authority (ZEMA) and foster good climate practices. As regards accountability, we have not heard from previous Governments concerning this money collected in from of Carbon Tax.

Mr Chairperson, as I support this allocation to the ministry, let me mention that part of the reason we need to take this ministry seriously is that we have conflicting practices. Not too long ago, we had an issue in the South Luangwa National Park, where there are proposed mining activities. When it comes to the critical aspect of the Ministry of Green Economy and Environment, it is very important that, going forward, sufficient resources are allocated.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Mr C. Mpundu (Chembe): Mr Chairperson, I am just wondering why the budget for this ministry has been reduced. What should be borne in our minds is that there is a critical relationship between the environment and development. All the resources that we are talking of in development are drawn from the environment. Henceforth, looking after the environment in a sustainable manner is critical. However, I wonder why the budget is reduced.

Mr Nkandu: From what?

Mr C. Mpundu: Mr Chairperson, Zambia being a developing nation, the ministry has a critical role to play because the ministry is under conflict. It is handling conflict with nature and at the same time, handling conflicts to do with society. There are pull and push factors that surround this ministry. Hence, allocating reasonable resources to this ministry is critical. The ministry wants to protect the environment, society also wants to develop. So, it is in this vein that we need to look at this ministry seriously, especially that it anchors on development.

Mr Chairperson, as much as …

Mr Munsanje: On a point of order, Mr Chairperson.

Mr C. Mpundu: …we are talking of looking after the environment, let us make sure that this environment is not polluted. However, at the same time, we need to make sure that we have localised controls of our environment. There is no way we can put in place laws that say stop charcoal burning meanwhile, that is the way of survival of that society. It is for this reason that the ministry needs to be carrying out more critical roles or should be more analytical of what it is trying to implement. Yes, controls are required in order to have a sustainable environment, but, at the same time, we need to also make sure that our people are not left in poverty because of the laws that we push.

Mr Chairperson, we are a developing nation and, therefore, need more from the environment. It is against this background that I remind the House that as we sign treaties and agreements with our partners or stakeholders, especially globally, let us be very cautious, especially as a ministry, because there are certain treaties and agreements that can derail our development. It is for this reason that even certain laws that we want to domesticate, pertaining to the environment, need to be analysed critically so that we do not derail our development process.

Mr Chairperson, many times, globally, for nations to develop, the environment was utilised. It is on record that they are the ones who have even polluted the environment heavily. For Zambia, as a developing nation, it has not even reached a take-off stage from a development perspective. We are still a traditional society, if I may say so.

Now, Mr Chairperson, certain things that the developed nations throw on us can hinder our development process. That is why we ought to be very careful with the way we tackle issues to do with the environment, especially at global level, because we may end up locking ourselves up.

Mr Chairperson, because this ministry is critical, I am happy that the hon. Minister has spoken of engaging experts. Currently, with these dynamics that have happened within the environment, we need experts who are able to analyse situations. If we just take it the way it is, we will end up failing to develop. Let us make sure that we call a spade a spade. It is not a matter of saying that because we have agreed to this global treaty, then let us domesticate it. No. Some of those treaties can end up making us colonised again.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr C. Mpundu: So, we need to be very cautious with the manner in which we handle matters, especially the hon. Minister and his technocrats.

Hon. PF Member: Hammer!

Mr C. Mpundu: Mr Chairperson, many are the times we have been taken on board on certain things through nice conferences and meetings. So, we need to be very cautious, and it is the reason I am proposing that those people the Government wants to engage must really be experts who are able to analyse situations pertaining to the environment vis-á-vis development. It will not help us to tell people to stop burning charcoal when in certain areas of my constituency that is their economic survival. So, we need to be looking at these things very seriously.

Mr Chairperson, I know that time is not with me. All I can say is that this ministry is critical, and we need to move forward and make sure that we understand that the environment and development are intertwined. We need more resources in this ministry if we are to score a goal in our development agenda.

Thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Hon. PF Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutinta (Itezhi Tezhi): Mr Chairperson, thank you so much for giving the people of Itezhi Tezhi an opportunity to debate this Vote.

Mr Chairperson, I want to mention that this Vote is a very serious one. It is a very serious ministry that every person has to support. Unfortunately, we still have people who believe that climate change is a hoax. The reason this Parliament has established a caucus is so that hon. Members of Parliament can agree on the theories of climate change and support Government intentions of fighting it.

Sir, one thing I can mention is that climate change has nothing to do with Zambia as a country; it is a global issue. Zambia is one of the countries that are least in contributing to climate change. Developed countries are the ones that are contributing, to a larger extent, to climate change. Therefore, climate change cannot be fought single-handedly. It is an issue that should be looked at from a global point of view. Hence, allow me, at this point, to also thank you, and through you, the Speaker, for facilitating two hon. Members of Parliament’s attendance to the Conference of the Parties of the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (COP 27) in Egypt where these issues were discussed in-depth. There is now serious awareness on how we shall work with this ministry to address how the issue is affecting Zambia and its desire to have a greener economy.

Mr Chairperson, I want to mention that this Government has demonstrated the desire to have a greener economy. First of all, it has created the first ever Ministry of Green Economy and Environment.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutinta: Mr Chairperson, secondly, for the first time, in the Eighth National Development Plan (8NDP), there is a pillar that is looking at environmental sustainability. These are kudos that should go to this Government. It is a true demonstration that it is championing a ‘greener’ agenda. That is where the whole world wants to go.

Mr Chairperson, allow me to share a few statistics just to demonstrate why this Vote is very important and why we should all support it. Climate change does not only affect humanity in general, but it is also an economic issue.

Mr Chairperson, climate affects approximately about 0.4 per cent of the annual economic growth. This is a serious issue that we need to look at. We should not look at climate change from in its sense. We should look at it from the economics point of view. If we say that 0.4 per cent of the annual economic growth is as a result of climate change, then we need to pay attention to this issue. About 13 per cent of Zambians are at risk of losing food security because of climate change effects. This is a serious matter.

Mr Chairperson, if we go to the energy sector, hydro electric energy is also at risk. We are likely to experience hydro electric power shortage because there is no rain. Right now, it should have been raining, but it is not. There is no rain and farmers are wondering when the rain season is going to commence. Some farmers even planted after seeing a few drops last week. They are not sure when more rains will come. This creates a threat to climate change.

Mr Chairperson, you will agree with me that 50 per cent of Zambians depend on agriculture. The agricultural sector is at risk because of different challenges that come, which also include deforestation. You are also aware that Zambia is now currently at about 300,000 hectors of forest annually lost to deforestation.

Sir, when you put these challenges together, you realise that we should look at climate change from a different perspective because it affects this country. If it is not addressed, it can bring this country to a halt. As I support this Vote, let me say that the 0.6 per cent that has been allocated to this Vote is a drop in the ocean. Last year, we had the same amount as this year. We, again, have the same amount. Climate change effects are advancing. We need to double the funding that goes to this sector. This is a matter of urgent public importance. If we do not address it, it will affect us today and in the future.

Mr Chairperson, one of the key areas where we want this year’s allocation to go is towards institutional support. For example, the Zambia Environmental Management Agency (ZEMA) has very little capacity to support environmental management. If you went to ZEMA today, you would find, perhaps, that there are less than ten inspectors. How are they going to manage inspection across the country?

Mr Chairperson, let us come to our districts. Come to Itezhi Tezhi, for example. The Forest Department looks like a war zone. Officers are spaced in a one room. The last time they had a vehicle to monitor various forests was in 1991, when Kaunda was almost departing. From 1991, with all the Governments that came, they still do not have a vehicle despite having two forests which are supposed to be monitored. They are even supposed to do what I refer to as ‘forest inventories.’ They do not do that. They do not know the number of trees they have and cannot conduct any campaigns in the community to discourage deforestation.

Mr Chairperson, we strongly feel that, with the political will that we are seeing from this Government and the hard working hon. Minister whom we are seeing now, we will see a total transformation in this ministry. At this point, Zambia is part of the global society. We believe that climate change is real. It is not a hoax and we are supposed to be integrated into the global community. We want capacity at the ministry to negotiate for a lot of treaties that are going to support this ministry.

Mr Chairperson, the hon. Minister of Green Economy and Environment, during the COP 27 was moving from one stand to another, lobbying for resources for this country. I have never seen a hard working hon. Minister like him apart from the hon. Minister of Livestock and fisheries, who is looking at me. The hon. Minister moved from one stand to the other lobbying for green funds. We are looking forward to a situation where Zambia will get as much as possible funds from different partners. We are seeing that from the COP 27. A lot of funds have started trickling into this economy.

Mr Chairperson, as I conclude, to the hon. Members of Parliament, let me state that climate change is real. It is not a hoax. Next year, we want to see this Vote doubled. Climate change does not only affect us as individuals, but also affects the economy, food security and the energy sector of this country.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mtayachalo (Chama North): Mr Chairperson, thank you for giving me this opportunity to debate this very important item, Vote 53. As other debaters have indicated, I am also shocked that the budget has been reduced. I feel that this ministry has huge challenges that lie ahead. We expect the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to consider increasing this Vote.

Mr Chairperson, this ministry has huge challenges which range from the shortage of man power to not having transport. So, it is quite difficult for these officers in this ministry to carry out their duties. Just like my colleague from Itezhi Tezhi said, for example, in Chama, the forest office has no vehicle, whatsoever. You find that foreigners are busy depleting our forests.

Mr Chairperson, I am aware that there are people who believe that issues of climate change are a hoax. Even at high level, people like the former President of the United States of America (USA), Mr Donald Trump feel that the issue of climate change is a hoax. We have begun to see devastating effects of climate change. I know the hon. Minister is hard working, having worked with him at ZESCO, and I am very confident that he will be able to deliver to the expectations of the people of Zambia.

Mr Chairperson, however, I think we must be cautious as we sign protocols and treaties on climate change because we are not the ones causing the challenges we are facing. The ones causing climate change are people in the Western world, who have reached very high levels of industrial development, even though they do not want us to industrialise. They want us to draw our industrialisation back by telling us not do this and that. I think that is not being fair. While these protocols are very important for us, we must also be weary that there are also negative consequences arising from the signing of some protocols and treaties.

Mr Chairperson, we have heard about issues of deforestation. As a country, we have undertaken to see to it that we reduce deforestation, but what alternatives are we giving to our people? The people in Chama still use charcoal as a means of economic survival. Even in Lusaka, people are consuming too much charcoal because electricity is expensive. The same Western world which tells to resort to green energy, also tells us that we need cost reflective tariffs. They want electricity tariffs to continue rising, but how do they expect our people to have access to electricity? I feel they are playing double standards. We need the Western world to fund developing countries. The Budget for the rural electrification is at K762 million. So, why is the Western world not pumping in more resources in developing countries so that many of our people can have access to electricity and other clean forms of energy? 

Mr Chairperson, indeed, as Africans, we must put our foot down, if at all, we are to achieve high industrialisation as countries. The people of Zambia who access electricity are only at 31 per cent, fifty-eight years after independence. So, I am saying that through the Vision 2030, we must achieve universal access to electricity by 2030. We are remaining with only eighty years to the Vision 2030. So, how are we going to achieve this if at all electricity tariffs are going to continue increasing?

So, these are some of the double standards which I believe the Western world is playing. I am happy that the Twenty-Eighth Session of the Conference of the Parties (COP 28) has demanded that the Western world honours its financial obligations to developing countries. During the Paris Summit – COP 21, an obligation was made that financial support be given to developing African countries, but that was not done. These countries have reached very high levels of development, but they tell us that we cannot do a, b, c and d. So, I think we must be very careful. We need to push and ensure that the Western world which is causing this pollution pays back.

Mr Chairperson, with these few remarks, I want to state that while I support this Vote, it is my appeal to the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to try by all means to adjust these figures so that this ministry can be adequately funded to have enough manpower and transport. We should also continue to invest in metrological equipment because that is the only way our farmers are going to be receiving early warning.

Mr Chairperson, with these few remarks, I support this Vote.

Mr Chairperson, I thank you.

Ms Halwiindi (Kabwe Central): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to add a voice to the debate on this Vote.  Thanks also to the hon. Minister for the Budget that he has presented. I am totally in support of his Budget.

Mr Chairperson, we all know that climate change is now considered to be one of the greatest threats to economic stability in the country, and it has a serious impact on the environment and the people. Any disturbance to the environment has a bad effect on most sectors such as the Ministry of Agriculture, the Ministry of Energy, and the Ministry of Water Development and Sanitation. All the ministries are affected if the environment is violated. So, it is very important that this ministry works well and hard to make sure that our environment is protected.

Mr Chairperson, let me comment on the flash floods and droughts that we experience as a threat on food security in the country. The hon. Minister needs to make sure that the ministry invests so much in research development so that they are able to know how much land has been deforested. When they know how much land has been affected, they would even know how to come up with interventions to protect our environment.

Mr Chairperson, I also want to mention that I am happy the ministry is coming up with the Climate Change Bill that will regulate the carbon tax. Currently, the carbon market mainly looks at huge pieces of land. However, if the ministry can redesign it in the Bill so that even people who have small pieces of land are considered, it would mean that many Zambians are going to participate to conserve the environment and get little tokens from the exercise. We need to make sure that every Zambian participates in issues to do with conserving our environment and our forests.

Mr Chairperson, I also want to make mention that land regeneration is a very important programme which the ministry needs to make sure it participates in. We already know that we have a lot of land that has been deforested, but now, as a country, we need to involve every Zambian to make sure that when trees shoot up where there is land that has been deforested, those trees are not disturbed.  We need to protect the trees and engage the people so that they do not to disturb the growing trees. So, we need to take much interest in land regeneration.

Mr Chairperson, may I also mention that we need to support our people who have new technologies in doing businesses such as the manufacturing of charcoal. We have many young people with new methods of how to make charcoal without cutting trees but only use materials such as maize poles.  So, the ministry has to take keen interest in collaboration with other ministries such as the Ministry of Small and Medium Enterprise Development to support such people and take a robust programme to teach others so that we avoid the cutting of trees. That is also very important to do.

Mr Chairperson, as regards issues to do with protecting our water bodies, we have seen that many rivers have dried up. We had a meeting where we considered the issue of the Magoye River which is drying up. This is because of the cutting of trees from water sources. Such tendencies need to be curtailed by way of engaging the locals to make sure that our rivers are protected. That can also be incorporated in the Climate Change Bill so that people who are interested in making sure that our rivers are protected are included. That is going to make sure that our rivers are protected.

Mr Chairperson, the final thing I want to mention is that issues to do with climate change are feminine in nature. When there is drought or there is no water, it is the woman who suffers because she has to fetch water and there will not be plenty of food in the home. When the roads are damaged because of floods, it is the woman who suffers when going to the hospital for maternity cases. So, as the hon. Minister plans for climate change, and teaches and educates people about it, he should make sure that he engages the women so that they are able to help with issues to do with climate change.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Menyani Zulu (Nyimba): Mr Chairperson, thank you for giving the good people of Nyimba a few minutes to add a few words to this very important topic.

Mr Chairperson, firstly, I am very disappointed that the budget has been reduced from K817,205,158 to K774,748,986. This does not help us as a country. If we are to fight climate change, we should start investing in forests.

Mr Chairperson, this ministry does not only consume money, but it also brings resources to the Government. Each person here owns a vehicle and pays Carbon Emission Tax. That money should be taken to this ministry so that things can start working.

Mr Chairperson, I thank the hon. Minister for coming up with a plan to send all the community forest management officers for training at the Zambia Forestry College in Mwekera as this will help us. The officers have little information and that is dangerous. So, training them will be excellent but the hon. Minister needs to look for money. The ministry’s target is to train fifty community forest management officers and this is important. I appreciate that the ministry wants to increase the number and I hope it can do more on this.

Mr Chairperson, I am a bit disappointed because the amount that has been allocated for forest protection is not adding up and it will not help us, and we need to increase this allocation. I agree with the past speaker. Our rivers are drying up. When we were growing up in the villages, there were trees along the rivers but those trees have been cut. So, we need to start planting trees. It is very difficult to tell people in the villages to plant trees but it is easy for an hon. Minister or an influential person to talk to them. We are losing rivers today and these are the things we should start protecting. We are losing forests today and we are not planting trees. I know it is very difficult for people to appreciate the importance of having trees.

Mr Chairperson, in the Southern Province and parts of the Eastern Province, especially between Sinda and Chipata, there are no forests. Trees have depleted because people used them for agriculture. Agriculture is destroying forests because we are not teaching people how to cultivate using an environment friendly agricultural system, and this is killing us. We know that industrialised countries, especially in Europe, and the United States of America (USA), are the main culprits of this problem we are facing today. I am happy that the hon. Minister attended the Conference of the Parties (COP) 27. These people should fulfil their mandate to invest in the countries they have destroyed. The ozone layer has been destroyed by the Germans, the British and the French and these people are not taking care of the environment. Next time the hon. Minister meets them, he should give them a good beating and tell them that they are destroying the world and not investing enough in it.

Mr Chairperson, I am looking at the Forest Development Fund. Surely, we can do better. K12 million is not enough because a number of forests have been destroyed. How are we going to redevelop forests withK12 million? This is a joke. The Ministry of Finance and National Planning should do better. If the United Party for National Development (UPND) projects to be in the Government for thirty years, although someone projected fifty years, it needs to invest in this. Forests are a money spinner. Let us encourage people to start planting eucalyptus trees, and – what is this –

Hon. Member: Mukula Tree.

Mr Menyani Zulu: No, not the Mukula tree. Do not disturb me.

Hon. Members: Pine!

Mr Menyani Zulu: Pine trees.

Mr Chairperson, every person is building and people are using – the Chichele Forest and all the forests Mr Kaunda left are gone. People have started getting our indigenous trees and are producing timber in support of the construction business. We can spend this money on construction businesses. ZESCO Limited imports poles from Zimbabwe. At one point, we were even importing poles from Tanzania. These are the things the country should invest in because if it invests now, some of the trees which are Genetically Modified Organisms (GMOs) will be ready for use fifteen years from now.

Mr Chairperson, the Forestry Department, under the hon. Minister’s management, is not doing any better. The money allocated for assets is not helping us. We need to invest in this department. It will be too late by the time we decide to invest in it because the money we are giving it is too – prevention is better than cure. We need to start investing now. As a country, we are not helping ourselves by being stingy today and not investing in forestry. We are just killing ourselves. My plea is that we start investing in forestry and protect our forests.

Mr Chairperson, lastly, the money being generated from carbon trading is not managed by the ministry and the people who are signatories are from the Ministry of Tourism. This does not make sense to me. Let the Community Resource Boards (CRBs) for wild animals be CRBs for wild animals. Let Community Forest Management Groups (CFMGs) be CFMGs. Before the hon. Minister brings the Act to Parliament for changes, he should see to it that his ministry controls forestry while the Ministry of Tourism controls wild animals. That way, it will collect the money generated from carbon trading. This money is being abused and the hon. Minister needs to protect it. We need to come up with a good Act to see to it that the community’s money is protected.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

The Deputy Chairperson: I know how passionate hon. Members are regarding this topic. You all want to debate, but we are running out of time. You will debate the coming Votes, but for now, I want us to proceed. I am appealing to you to understand what I am trying to put across.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Eng. Nzovu: Mr Chairperson, I thank my fellow hon. Members of Parliament sincerely for their kind words. Hon. Wamunyima strongly supports the Vote and he is obviously worried about deforestation. I think everybody expressed worry about the high rate of deforestation due to charcoal burning.


Mr Chairperson, another issue that came out strongly was the issue of more funding to the ministry. I will appeal to my hon. Colleague, the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, to see to it that what hon. Members of Parliament have put across is realised. I assure the House that we will ensure that we take due diligence on the international treaties that we have been requested to sign and only sign those that benefit the country. Remember that some international treaties will be brought to Parliament for hon. Members to debate and give them approval.

Mr Chairperson, the Forestry Department needs support and in the budget, we provided for employment of more forest guards. As you can imagine during the Structural Adjustment Programme, this was a department where officers were retired and there has not been employment in that area.

Indeed, we need experts in the department or the ministry to ensure that we answer to the challenges of our time. We need to hold the developed world to account for the negative effects of climate change. Indeed, at 27th Conference of the Parties of the United Nations Climate Change Conference (COP 27), we made this case that the developed world must increase the ambition and obviously we came up with some success and one of which was the issue of loss and damage not only being on the agenda but a framework being established. Now, we have our work cut out and we hope that we can start moving in this respect at COP28.

Mr Chairperson, I thank Hon. Mutinta for the passionate debate as well. He also called upon for Zambia Environmental Management Agency (ZEMA) support. Indeed, our desire to increase production of copper to about 3 million tonnes per year in the next decade will demand that we protect the environment more and more strictly because the scourge of pollution will only increase. Everybody raised concern that we need to protect our head waters and rivers. We need to ensure that we increase food and energy security. So, these three things are being negatively affected by climate change.

Mr Chairperson, I thank all the hon. Members of Parliament who debated. Hon. Mtayachalo, Hon. Mpundu, Hon. Halwiindi and Hon. Menyani Zulu, who all called upon the Ministry to increase expenditure in ensuring that the ministry plants more trees.  The hon. Members also called upon the minister to ensure that water resources are managed in a better way. Indeed, I can only agree with you that this is key because as you may be aware just last week generation is being restricted in the Kariba because of reduced inflows and water.

Mr Chairperson, carbon trading is an issue which we will be presenting to Parliament during the presentation of the Climate Change Bill. I hope that all the hon. Members of Parliament will debate and offer more insight on how our citizens can gain more revenue. I agree with hon. Menyani Zulu that, indeed, we need to do something about the dividends to the local communities. Currently, our local communities are not deriving enough benefits from this trade. However, I can assure him that when the Climate Change Bill comes on the Floor of the House and the law is enacted, this will be a thing of the past.

Mr Chairperson, to answer to the shortages of man power in the ministry, we have allocated funding to train forest guards at Zambia Forestry College, in Mwekera,and we hope to get started this coming year. However, the numbers are not enough and we will be appealing to the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to give us a bigger allocation. Indeed, the forest development fund despite it being operationalised now, there is a small budget allocation to it and I can only appeal that more funding is allocated to it.

Mr Chairperson, another big issue that we have is the encroachment of our forests. Most of the protected forests are encroached upon and this is not good for the environment. Remember, the reason forests are protected is because in there lie very sensitive echo systems. Most of the protected forests protect the head waters. Destroying the forests is basically increasing water insecurity. I appeal to councils, through the House, that expansion of cities by way of getting land from forests affects the environment negatively. We not only need to protect the existing protected forests but also to increase the forest cover.

Mr Chairperson, a concern was also raised on meteorological services. In this budget, we are going to install about 120 meteorological stationsand computerise about ten of them. This is important because with the negative effect of climate change, protecting our people against disasters, in particular flooding, will be key. This is information which is critical for the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unite (DMMU) under the Vice-Presidents office to ensure that various mechanisms are put in place to protect our people from floods and disease because floods bring about disease. Meteorologicalservices are also key in ensuring that we increase productivity in the agricultural sector because now we are promoting climate smart agriculture.

Mr Chairperson, with climate change, the drying up in certain areas is leading to the migration of people. The negative effects of climate change basically are issues of climate justice. I call upon all hon. Members of Parliament to speak with one voice. I have not heard many hon. Members of Parliament offering alternative solutions to deforestation or charcoal burning. However, we have stated that there are no alternatives. I want to tell hon. Members that there are alternatives.


Mr Chairperson, in the country currently, there are chiefdoms that have banned charcoal burning and have promoted agriculture. Let us promote alternatives to charcoal burning. This is not about the ministry but about our livelihoods. Let us speak with one voice. It is not a political issue. Let us not be shy about it. Let us hold a bully by its horns. I can only ask for your support. I thank you for urging the Minister of Finance and National Planning to put more resources because we need more resources in the Ministry of Green Economy and Environment.

I thank you.

Vote 53 – (Ministry of Green Economy and Environment – K774,748,986)

Mr J. Chibuye (Roan): Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on page 562, Programme 2155, Sub-programme 002 – Forestry Management (1) – K179,925,884. I would like to know why there has been this big reduction from the 2022 allocation of K296,908,727 to K179,925,884 in 2023 when we are facing challenges in forestry management.

Eng. Nzovu: Mr Chairperson, I would like to thank the hon. Member for that important question. I would also like to take this opportunity to respond on similar terms where you see big reductions.

Sir, hon. Members may wish to note that there are projects under the ministry like the Zambia Integrated Forest Landscape Project, Transforming Landscapes for Resilience and Development (TRALARD)and other projects which have been running for a number of years and now they are coming to an end. So, there is less allocation of funds to these projects, which were helping us in forestry management.

Mr Chairperson, I thank you.


Rev. Katuta (Chienge): Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on Programme 2155, Sub-programme 001 – Forestry Skills and Development – K12,818,084, Sub-programme 002 – Forestry Management – K179,925,884, Sub-programme 003 – Forestry Research and Development – K1,200,000. We were expecting an increased allocation to these sub-programmes so that we can plant more trees and also manage our forests. I just want to know why the allocation has been reduced from K303,817,831 to K193,943,968. This is quite worrisome. Maybe, if the hon. Minister can just explain why there is this reduction. We need to improve, but it is like this is being done the other way round.

Eng. Nzovu: Mr Chairperson, I thank Hon. Rev. Katuta for that important question. Again, most of these activities were supported by the World Bank through the projects. So, that project money was part of our budget. Now that these projects are coming to an end, we need to utilise our own resources to support them. So, currently, lesser inflows are going towards these projects hence, the reduction.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Kasandwe (Bangweulu): Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on page 570, Programme 2158, Sub-programme 10 – Reviewed National Policy on Environment in place – Nil. The hon. Minister has intentions of reviewing the Environmental Management Act, 2011.Therefore, I just want to find out if he also has intentions of reviewing the Forest Act of 2015, because these Acts need to be harmonised. Further, does the Government have intentions of coming up with a Climate Change Act in 2023?

Eng. Nzovu: Mr Chairperson, I thank the hon. Member for that important question. I can confirm that all those Bills will be before Parliament and we can only ask that you support them. For the information of the hon. Member, Environmental Management Authority (EMA) will be strengthened to not only reduce the fees, but also ensure that Environmental Impact Assessments (EIAs) are churned out timeously. In there, we also want to ensure that issues of compliance monitoring are enhanced and that offenders are obviously punished. So, there will be stiffer penalties.

Sir, In the Forest Act, it will be the same because there, the penalties and fees are small. We, therefore, want to ensure that these are increased. The hon. Member may wish to note that all these, in particular the Environmental Management Act and the Forest Act, are answering to the call to ensure that we do something about the negative effects of climate change. So, it is not only communication and advocacy we are promoting, but we are also legislating. We need necessary laws to be put in place if we have to win the climate crisis.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Mukosa (Chinsali): Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on page 569, Programme 2158, Sub-programme 011 – Environmental Management and Research – K56,445,852. You may have noted that there is a reduction from K80,105,586 to K56,445,852 in 2023. Could the hon. Minister shed more light on the reduced budget for this particular Sub-programme?

Eng. Nzovu: Mr Chairperson, again, it is the same reason here. Most environmental management and research were undertaken by the Lake Tanganyika Development Project, the World Bank supported project, which is coming to an end, hence the reduced inflows. So, that reduction will need to be supported by our own local resources.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Katambo (Masaiti): Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on Programme 2157 – Weather Observation Infrastructure – K 997,052 and on Programme 2157 – Meteorological and Weather Services – K 20,911,566. Is the hon. Minister with me?

Mr Chairperson, if we go to pages 566 and 560, they are talking about weather observation and infrastructure. If we go to page 559, Programme 2157, it is the same programme; Weather Observation and Meteorological and Weather Services. There is a reduction from K2,844,545 to K997,052. On page 559, Programme 2157, there is only an increment of K4,982,719. So, my issue is that we all need to be informed on projected weather patterns, issues to do with information dissemination on early warning systems and other issues, especially to our farmers.

Mr Chairperson, the hon. Minister talked of ten weather observation stations. These are issues to deal with weather forecast, yet there is need to procure – in his earlier statements some time back, the hon. Minister talked about procurement or purchase of meteorological spare parts for equipment in these weather stations because they become faulty as time passes. They have only allocated K4,982,719 and in the other programme, there is a reduction from K2,844,545 to K 997,052. I need his clarification.

Eng. Nzovu: Mr Chairperson, I thank the hon. Member for that technical question. He is becoming an engineer. Indeed, the most critical thing about meteorological data is the observation data itself, the instruments you have. This is because instruments in data collection and dissemination – obviously, on data collection, we need to repair most of this equipment because most of it is old. If the hon. Member can remember, when I came to Parliament last year, or a few months ago, I reported to the House that we had successfully maintained a lot of our meteorological equipment and most of it was functional. Actually, we attributed the success in predicting the way Tropical Storm Ana was travelling from Mozambique to the fact that we had repaired most of this equipment. So, the reduction, inevitably, is because most of it has been maintained.

Mr Chairperson, the other concern by the hon. Member is actually a plus because we are going to automation. Now, in the advent of climate change, the intensity of flooding is high. So, floods now come and overwhelm our populations much faster than before. So, that intensity is big. It needs to be measured by automation.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Kang’ombe (Kamfinsa): Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on Programme 2155 – Zambia Forestry College – K 5,800,000.

Mr Chairperson, the hon. Minister is aware that the Zambia Forestry College is in Kamfinsa Constituency. They have allocated K5,800,000 to the college. The hon. Minister and I have been discussing the water challenges at that college. Does the K5,800,000 they have allocated also sort out the rehabilitation of the water network at the college?

Eng. Nzovu: Mr Chairperson, I would like to thank the engineer for that very important question. Let me state to the hon. Members of Parliament here, that the college is very important. It also caters for the research unit which is within Kitwe. In that college is one of our protected forests which we use for various researches. We can only ask for the hon. Member of Parliament to help us on the encroachment of that forest because most of his voters have encroached on it. We kindly ask that he helps us remove them.

Mr Chairperson, indeed, I have inspected the water network at the college and confirm that some of these funds will be applied to rehabilitation works. We hope that we can also procure some tanks and pipes and also add more water reticulation points. However, as he has stated, the funds are not enough and I can only ask him to help me convince our hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to give us more funding.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Vote 53 ordered to stand part of the estimates.

VOTE 76 – (Ministry of Youth, Sport and Arts – K269,471,790).

The Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts (Mr Nkandu): Mr Chairperson, I want to thank you for according me this opportunity to present to this august House the ministerial budget policy statement in support of the 2023 Budget Estimates of Revenue and Expenditure for the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Arts.

Mr Chairperson, I will be failing in my duties if I do not congratulate our Under 17 Women Football Team, which is in Malawi and has beaten Botswana by five goals to nil.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, I also congratulate our basketball players who have beaten the host Malawi in the Africa Union Sports Council Region 5 Youth Games.

Mr Chairperson, I would like to mention, at this point, that 2022 has been a much better year compared to the previous year because of the decline in the prevalence of the Coronavirus 2019 (COVID-19) pandemic, making it easier for the ministry to implement its planned programmes and activities.


Mr Chairperson, the ministerial mandate is to formulate, co-ordinate, implement and monitor youth, sport and arts programmes in accordance with the Government Gazette Notice No. 1123 of 2021. Therefore, in the 2022 budget cycle, my ministry continued to implement youth, sport and arts empowerment and development programmes, provision of youth skills training and development of strategic documents to facilitate smooth implementation of programmes under my ministry.

Mr Chairperson, as you are aware, the arts portfolio function is new to my ministry and for 2022, the ministry’s focus was on realigning and operationalisation of the Department of Arts, in order to foster development of the arts sector. This was succeeded by initiating the processes of developing the arts and film policies to enable the ministry to provide a legal framework to guide the development of the arts sector in the country. You may wish to note that the country is developing the arts policy for the first time in the history of this country.

Progress Made on the 2022 Programme Implementation

Mr Chairperson, during the year under review, my ministry focused on implementing programmes under; youth development; sports development and management; arts development and management; and management and support services. To actualise the implementation of these programmes, my ministry had approved a budget of K119,392,178. Out of this budget, K14,360,950 was for personal emoluments and K105,031,228 was for recurrent departmental charges (RDCs), grants and infrastructure.

Mr Chairperson, I wish to report that as at 17th November, 2022, K119,392,178 had been released by the Treasury. Further, the ministry received supplementary funding of K45,250,000 earmarked for implementation of sports activities.

Sir, the following achievements were recorded as at 31st October, 2022:

Youth Development

Mr Chairperson, in our quest to actualise the National Youth Policy, my ministry implemented two sub-programmes, namely; youth skills development and youth empowerment. Under the youth skills training sub-programme, my ministry had an annual target of training 1,600 youths in various skills at the twenty-three youth resources centres under the ministry. During the period under review, my ministry facilitated provision of skills training to over 5,287 youths.

Mr Chairperson, the Youth Empowerment Programme, which is aimed at empowering registered youth organisations and enabling them to participate in the economic development of the country, had a number of empowerment activities, such as the general Youth Empowerment Programme, National Youth Scheme, youths in the transport sector and graduate empowerment programme.

In this regard, the ministry empowered a total of 5,529 youths, broken down as follows: 2,415 with grants, 854 graduates with start-up kits, thirteen co-operatives translating to 130 youth under general empowerment and seventy-one co-operatives translating to 2,130 youths with a fuel tanker to each co-operative on a loan basis.

Sir, in order to provide policy direction in the implementation of youth empowerment programmes, my ministry is in the process of reviewing the 2015 National Youth Policy and the development of a national youth strategy. To this effect, the ministry undertook provincial consultative meetings and a report has been developed to facilitate development of these documents.

Sports Development and Management

Mr Chairperson, my ministry implemented three sub-programmes under the sport development and management programme, namely; sport development, regional and international games, and sport management. In 2022, the ministry supported over thirty different sports associations and federations to enable them participate at both regional and international games. Further, over 500 athletes, coaches and officials from different sports disciplines have benefited from the ministry’s facilitation of funds so far.

Mr Chairperson, in addition, the ministry supported twenty-five podium performance athletes as follows: judo – eight athletes (five males and three females); boxing – eight athletes (four males and four females); and nine in athletics (five males and four females). This enabled the country to win gold in the 400 metres men’s race as well as silver and bronze in men’s boxing at the just ended Commonwealth Games held in Birmingham.

Sir, the ministry has also continued to sensitise sports persons on the dangers of doping. In this regard, 1,600 athletes (both senior and junior athletes) were sensitised on the dangers of drugs and alcohol on one’s health and integrity in sport.

Mr Chairperson, in order to improve the administration of sport in the country, my ministry is in the process of reviewing the National Sport Policy and its implementation plan.


Arts Development and Management


Mr Chairperson, under the arts development and management programme, the ministry has commenced the review of the National Film Policy and the development of the National Arts Policy. You may wish to note that both policies have been developed and await validation.

Sir, in order to develop the art sector, my ministry held the National Arts Festival, which included activities and forms of arts ranging from music, film screening, theatre and dance. The event drew over 1,000 participants from across the nation.

Mr Chairperson, the ministry continued to support artists and events in order to contribute to the development of the arts sector and creation of employment among the youth. In this regard, my ministry supported 119 arts events, which included the Sotambe Film Festival, witnessed by Hon. Mpundu of Nkana Constituency, that took place from 17th to 24th September, 2022 and the Reggae Summer Music Festival that took place on 29th October, 2022, to mention but a few.

Management and Support Services

Mr Chairperson, under this programme, my ministry continued to implement various sub-programmes aimed at providing logistical and support services to the ministry. In this vein, my ministry has commenced the review of the 2016-2021 Strategic Plan and development of the 2022-2026 Strategic Plan in order to align it to the Eighth National Development Plan (8NDP).

2023 Budget Estimates


Mr Chairperson, my ministry has a proposed Budget ceiling of K269,471,790, an increase compared to K119,392,178 appropriated by Parliament in 2022. This is allocation represents a 56 per cent increase from the 2022 Budget allocation for the ministry. Out of this amount, the ministry is proposing the following apportionments:

  1. K90,114,227 for youth development;
  2. K8,307,766 for arts development and management;
  3. K125,493,276 for sport development and management; and
  4. K45,556,521 for management and support services.

Mr Chairperson, the above stated programmes will be implemented as follows:

Youth Development

Mr Chairperson, the Government believes that there is need to adequately invest in the youth in order for the country to benefit from the demographic dividends of the youth population. Thirty-five per cent of Zambia’s population accounts for the youth, who have the potential to contribute towards national development with the right empowerment. To this end, we are going to expend K90,114,227 to facilitate the implementation of three youth development sub-programmes, namely; youth skills development, youth empowerment and infrastructure development.

Youth Skills Development

Mr Chairperson, under this sub-programme, we have an allocation of K7,614,514, which will be provided as grants to youth resource centres and also used for undertaking inspections of the skills training programmes in the youth resource centres. The youth resource centres have been established to provide skills training to the out-of-school and the never-been-to-school youths. To provide this service, the ministry currently has twenty-three resources (training) centres under its wing.

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Hon. Minister, your time is up, but maybe, we give you a bonus of two minutes.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkandu: Thank you very much, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Chairperson, under infrastructure development, which is very important, the ministry proposes an allocation of K50million for various inspections and construction activities for youth resource centres around the country. The ministry prioritised the completion of Chiyota, Kwilimuna and Kafue resource centres. The completion of the youth skills resource centres will increase access to vocational skills training and development of life skills for the youths.

Mr Chairperson, sports development contributes to physical and mental fitness, poverty and vulnerability reduction. To this end, the ministry has allocated K125,493,276 for the implementation of three main sub-programmes, namely sport development, sport management, and regional and international games.

Mr Chairperson, the ministry has allocated K39,968,961 for sport management, out of which, K6,932,141 has been proposed to facilitate the provision of grants to various sport grant aided institutions for the development of sport in the country. The remaining funds will be spent on activities that promote the participation of vulnerable groups in sports such as girls, women and persons with disabilities as well as purchasing of sports equipment, which everyone wants.

Mr Chairperson, in conclusion, I wish to state that my ministry has achieved a great deal due to collaboration with other institutions. As such, we will continue to work with line ministries, local and international organisations and the private sector in order to promote and effectively implement youth, sport and arts development programmes. I, therefore, urge hon. Members of Parliament to support the 2023 Estimates of Expenditure for the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Arts to enable it successfully implement youth, sport and arts programmes in the country and purchase equipment, which they need.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.


Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!


The Deputy Chairperson: Some hon. Members who have indicated to debate, should not be surprised if I do not pick them, because the Chief Government Whip, and the Deputy Whip of Independents, the hon. Member of Parliament for Roan, have availed us a list.

Mr Munir Zulu (Lumezi): Thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Chairperson, let me take advantage of the opportunity to debate this Vote to congratulate Mr Greg Lubesha for being elected President of Zambia Golf Union on Sunday in Kitwe. The sport has not been catered for in this Vote.

Mr Chairperson, permit me also to congratulate Sam from Team Tiyikosesa for winning the tournament in Kitwe and scoring forty-four points against the owners of Nkana Golf Club. We had hoped the hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts would be present because the tournament had attracted players from across the country.

Mr Chairperson, in supporting this Vote, I think, we have not paid particular attention to the swimmers. Recently, we saw swimmers fail to attend tournaments. This ministry has invested heavily in football and you will take judicial notice that at the current FIFA World Cup, Zambia is not represented. We have failed in football at the continental level in Africa and we continue allocating serious amounts of money to this ministry.

Mr Chairperson, this ministry is also involved in empowerment, and we have been singing the song of empowerment from the time the previous Government was in power. The current Government is giving out the same trucks and the criterion that is being used to empower the youths has remained the same. One tends to wonder why – the allocation for sports development and management has been increased from K37,192,062 to K125,493,276 in 2023. The increment is quite enormous and we hope this time around, this increment is not only going to favour football. We hope to see sports disciplines be it karate, boxing or mixed martial arts supported by this Vote.

Mr Chairperson, the allocation for the sub-programme on sports development has increased from K11,667,747 to K39,968,961 in 2023 and, again, a huge sum of money has been allocated to this programme. Going forward, we hope we will not have a situation in which our sports men and women are not supported to attend games outside this country and the continent. We were even better of allocating part of the money to the Ministry of Green Economy and Environment so that pupils can learn about the depletion of the ozone layer unlike hiring a plane that developed a fault and failed to bring the players from wherever they were, and at the end, the Government paid double the amount. However, we are allocating funds that are not being applied for the intended purpose.

Mr Chairperson, with those remarks, I support this Vote, and let me give chance to other hon. Members who want to debate. Hopefully, we will not see the mistakes of the past one year reoccur.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

The Deputy Chairperson: Thank you so much, Mr Zulu. You observed time.

Mrs Sabao (Chikankata): Mr Chairperson, thank you for giving the people of Chikankata an opportunity to add a voice on this important Vote, Vote 76.

Mr Chairperson, this ministry is very important. A good planner plans for today and tomorrow; this is the work of this ministry.

Mr Chairperson, let me take this opportunity to appreciate the hon. Minister’s good policy statement. Under his leadership, we have seen that the players are getting their allowances on time. Under his leadership, the women’s football team won. It means that the future of young people under his ministry is bright because he has a heart for them.

Mr Chairperson, in the budget, there is a component of infrastructure development. Before we talk of skills training, we need to have good infrastructure, which is well equipped, and good trainers. In Chikankata, there are no skills training centres and resource centres, but in the budget, I see a good future for the young people of Chikankata. Due to the lack of skills training in rural constituencies, we have had a challenge of a high level of teenage pregnancies among the young girls, who do not have skills to enable them do what they want in their lives. However, the young girls have the spirit to do something but they are not given the opportunity.

Mr Chairperson, in this country, this ministry received a lot of money for youth empowerment under the Movement for Multiparty Democracy (MMD) and the Patriotic Front (PF) Governments but the challenge was how the money was used by the people who were giving it out to the receivers. Why do I say so? We had situations in which young people were given money without even signing any forms. So, how would they implement a project? So, I urge the Government to come up with a good structure on how it will be monitoring resources that have been allocated to this ministry because the aim of giving the young people money is to change their mindset for them to be entrepreneurs. The richest person in the world is an entrepreneur. If we empower the young people today, we empower the future.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Sabao: Under the New Dawn Government, we do not want the mindset of tantameni. We want young people to work for themselves.

Hon. Members: Meaning!

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Mrs Sabao: Tantameni means that can you queue up.

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Business was suspended from 1640 hours until 1700 hours.



Mrs Sabao: Mr Chairperson, before Business was suspended, I was saying that under the New Dawn Government, we want to remove the syndrome of tantameni, meaning, to tell the youths to queue up for them to get something from you. Under the New Dawn Government, our vision is to see a youth who is resourceful. Youths are a resource to society. However, in the past, we saw a youth who became a problem to society because of how projects were being handled. I urge the Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts to come up with a good structure when giving out empowerment funds to young people.

Mr Chairperson, when we come to sports development, according to this budget, this is a department that has received the largest chunk of money. However, I am a sad person. In this country, we celebrate sports men when they are on the pitch. When they are off the pitch, they become destitute.

Mr Chairperson, I am urging the ministry to come up with a strategy on how it is going to help sports men so that when they are off the pitch, they remain stars in this country. We need a physiologist who should work with the team to help them understand that a sport is career. We need managers who will be attached to the footballers to help them manage their resources. When they are off the pitch, they need to maintain their status in society.

Mr Chairperson, sport is a career. However, in this country sport has been taken as business as usual. This is a career that can help our people, hence, the need to attach them to managers, who will be their mentors, to help them be good people even after active in sport.

Mr Chairperson, arts and development is a field that we have never concentrated much on. Even in the budget, it is the lowest allocation. It has been given an increment of 3.8 per cent. You can use art for the country’s theatre development to communicate information to society. Art is a career. It can add value to the Gross Domestic Product (GDP) of a country. However, the way we have received this thing, is like it is nothing. Art is a life time career. However, youths can only compete with the people at global level if they are given enough resources. According to this budget, it does not attract artists who can compete at global level because they are not being enhanced. Our artists are supposed to be given funds for capacity building so that they can do better than where they are today.

Mr Chairperson, it is important that under Youth Resource Centre, there must also be an allocation for art to allow our artists to train to compete at global level and play in Nollywood and Bollywood so that they bring resources to the country.

Mr Chairperson, in Chikankata, the young people are ready to work with the Government. Under Constituency Development Fund (CDF), we have a component of youth empowerment. Like I said earlier, it is the way we have been managing the resources under the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Arts. It is important that it capacitates its planning department. Before it releases the resources to the young people, there must be a proper monitoring and implementing tool used for the funds.

Mr Chairperson, with these few remarks, I support this important Vote.

Mr Fube (Chilubi): Mr Chairperson, let me start with a strategy that has been laid down in the budget about youth empowerment through vocational and skills training. To me, it does not capture the heterogeneous nature of young people. In this case, we are talking about the youths who are white color, or blue color and peasantry or unskilled. My main concentration in this budget is K90,114,227 which among other things targets youth skills development, youth empowerment and infrastructure.

Mr Chairperson, whereas the skills to arrest the skills gap is important, we also need to know that since this ministry has been anchored with two cluster areas from the Eighth National Development Plan (8NDP), which are economic transformation and job creation, human and social development, it means that we need to have strategies that should work towards that. I think the ministry is sitting on three documents that were produced about four years ago. These documents are supposed to guide. They guide in different areas. Among the factors that we are supposed to talk about is inclusivity.

Mr Chairperson, I am sorry to say that when we talk about youth, we are talking about the age group between fifteen and thirty-five.

Mr Chairperson, allow me to talk about what I have observed on the fuel tankers. The initial arrangement on the fuel tankers was that the sub-contractor, Kapesika Energy and Petroleum Limited (KEP), was supposed to run the fuel tankers. When the fuel tankers were found, it was discovered that more fuel tankers were procured to add on to what was already procured, but of course, political patronage clipped in and we saw some of the people who do not even qualify to be youths deceivingly coming in.


Ms Sefulo: Question!


Mr Fube: One of the beneficiaries is a cantankerous cadre who makes lots of noise on social media.

Ms Sefulo: Which one?

Mr Fube: He is not here to protect himself. So, I cannot mention him.

Mr Chairperson, the framework for the beneficiaries was supposed to be drawn as follows: Kapesika Energy and Petroleum Limited, the suppliers and then the youths. So, maybe, the hon. Minister may confirm to this House why the tracking systems have been removed from the fuel tankers. The tracking system was installed because of income value, versus economic activities. The tracking system was installed in order to monitor the movements of the tankers. However, looking at the ministry’s allocation of K269, 471,790, we need to know how we going to spend the money because where money is spent, it counts.

Mr Chairperson, I draw your attention to Key Outputs and Outputs Indicators. The ministry targets to train 3000 youths in vocational and life skills and empower 500 youths will be empowered with start-up kits. For me, those are very confusing outputs. The issue is about quantitative factors versus qualitative factors. I have in mind the money that has been allocated to King George, an institution that is supposed to train youths in leadership. I am convinced and still feel that it is not enough. King George has been allocated K571,385. When we look at the outputs, we see that they have not been taken care of. We have twenty-five operational youth centres, but when I look at the schedule for the same as well as that for sports, which has been glorified, I realise that the money is not enough. You can imagine that for community sports, countrywide, we are going to have only ten activities. Ni mwa Kalingalinga? Are we targeting one place or the whole country?

Ms Sefulo: Why are you using Kalingalinga?

Mr Fube: I am bringing in Kalingalinga because I am just trying to give an example of one place.

Mr Chairperson, another factor is that of Research, Monitoring and Evaluation. On this, I want to comment on the fuel tanker trucks again, which are supposed to empower young people. Research, Motoring and Evaluation has been allocated K933,720. However, when we are pumping money into youth programmes by stratum and value, we consider young people who are in education facilities, the unskilled ones and those who do blue-collar jobs. This means we are supposed to cater for young people in different categories so that they give life to the economy, although, even when the young people have an opportunity to participant in the Zambian census of population and housing as enumerators, they are troubled. We have heard of all sorts of calls and how some District Commissioners (DCs) negotiated with these young people so that they could have a cut from the little money that the young people were to receive.

Mr Chairperson, I also have other life opportunities in mind, such as the recruitment of teachers as well as health workers. As we speak, many young people’s names appeared in the newspapers, but they have not gotten their appointment letters to go and work at their respective work stations because they do not have anyone to stand for them. I think running a system like that is not very good.

Mr Chairperson, in summary, the young people are now guinea pigs for what should work and what should not. This is why, as we speak, new infections of Human Immunodeficiency Viruses (HIV) are prevalent in the eighteen to twenty-four age group–

Mr Chaatila: On a point of order, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.

Mr Chaatila: Mr Chairperson, I rise on this point of order on the hon. Member of Parliament who is on the Floor. I am short of quoting the Standing Order. However, we are having challenges. Our eardrums are going to pop.


Mr Chaatila: Is the hon. Member on the Floor in order to be shouting as if his colleagues are very far from this House.

Mr Chairman, I seek your serious ruling on this matter.

The Deputy Chairperson: You did not cite which Standing Order has been breached.

Mr Chaatila: This one is a serious health hazard.

Mr Kampyongo: Question!

Mr Chaatila: It is not provided for, I do admit, but it is a health hazard to the hon. Members. So, with your indulgence, I seek your serious ruling on this matter.

The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Member, you are out of order because you did not cite the Standing Order that has been breached.

Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Mulenga: Long live Chair!

The Deputy Chairperson: However, it is advised that we are mindful of others as we talk. We should know that we are in Parliament. So, we need to sound orderly.

Mr Fube: Mr Chairperson, I come from the Nsofu clan. That is why my voice is like this.

Sir, let me conclude by saying that today, we were celebrating the World AIDS Day, but on a sad note, the eighteen to twenty-four years age group, which is only 20 per cent of our population, is responsible for 40 per cent of new HIV infections. So, I think that has to be handled. There are documents within the ministry where we can churn out the educated and make sure that we arrest such statistics. If you heard me, you would recall that I said young people are now guinea pigs.

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

The hon. Member’s time expired.

The Deputy Chairperson gave the Floor to Mr Kangombe.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Hon. Government Member: Ema youth!

Ms Sefulo: He is a youth, a senior youth.

Mr Kangombe (Sesheke): Mr Chairperson, thank you so much.

Sir, I think there is nothing for the youths without the youths. I am happy that this Government has realised the importance of inclusiveness especially on the aspect of youths. From the policy statement which the hon. Minister read, you can categorically see the direction of the New Dawn Administration with regard to the inclusiveness of the youths.

Mr Chairperson, from the outset, I must make mention that I do support this Vote. I want to thank the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning as well as the hon. Minister in charge of the youthfor having set the bar too high from the time he became hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts.

Mr Sefulo: Hear, hear! The bar is high!

Mr Kangombe: I am happy to mention that it is under his administration and leadership that we have seen for the first time ever, the women’s football team bringing joy to this country. So, I want to appeal to the hon. Minister not to limit his search for talent. Sesheke, Mwandi, Mulobezi as well as Kazungula and even Chilubi have potential of youths, women in particular who are able to bring, not just the much-needed desire and happiness to this country, but also to put Zambia on the map.


I want to implore you to cast your net wide. Even as you talk about skills development and empowerment, it is very important to look at capacity building.

Mr Chairperson, I am happy that Sesheke has also benefited from the tankers.

Ms Sefulo: Hear, hear!

Mr Kangombe: My youth from Chayalima have also benefited, for the first time ever in this country. The hon. Minister’s selection was very transparent.

Hon. Opposition Members: Question!

Ms Sefulo: Yes!

Mr Kangombe: He never looked at where the youth came from, as long as they qualified. If they had the number one qualification of being citizens of this country, they benefited from the tankers. I want to thank the hon. Minister for this one.

Sir, as my colleague, Hon. Munir Zulu, earlier mentioned, let us not limit the aspect of sports to football and netball, but also go into sports like mixed martial arts. I am happy that my brother, Hon. Munir Zulu, at one point, declared that he could coach some of the youth.

Mr Chairperson, we have the potential to have, once again, people like Lottie Mwale and Joseph Chingangu in boxing in this country. We can also search the remotest parts of this country like Sikongo and find youths who can represent this country in boxing.


Mr B. Mpundu: On a point of order, Mr Chairperson.

Ms Sefulo: Point of order? Who is saying that?

Hon. Government Member: Nkana water!

Mr Kangombe: Mr Chairperson, as I mentioned earlier, the hon. Minister’s policy statement is encompassing all hon. Members of Parliament and I want to urge him to continue on that trajectory and bring joy to this country by searching for these talents that the previous regimes were unable to.

Sir, I do not want to use up all the time that has been given to me. Instead, I can give room to others, but as I mentioned from the outset, I support the hon. Minister. I support the Vote and I support all the programmes that this Government has, on behalf of the youth of this country, as a youth myself.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr B. Mpundu: On a point of order, Mr Chairperson.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.

Mr B. Mpundu: Mr Chairperson, I rise on a point of order citing Standing Order 202, which refers to the privileges that hon. Members of Parliament are entitled to.

Sir, when we come into this House, the people who elected us expect us to interrogate issues that relate to their welfare and issues that affect them. I worry that we are more worried about preserving resources as opposed to doing the work that we were brought here to do.

Mr Chairperson, I notice from your ruling that there will be about five hon. Members who will debate this very important Vote I say is very important because the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Arts now has the additional function of art, and art has built countries. Where I am sitting, I am aching to contribute to this important Vote, but I know that I will be curtailed from debating it. 

Mr Chairperson, is the House in order to take away the rights and privileges of hon. Members of Parliament to come here and debate and represent the people who brought them here by curtailing them from having an opportunity to debate important budgetary provisions such as the one we are about to approve for the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Arts?

The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Member, your point of order is against the Presiding Officer. To start with, it is contemptuous to raise a point of order against a Presiding Officer.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr B. Mpundu rose.

The Deputy Chairperson: Resume your seat, hon. Member.

It is not even allowed. It is contemptuous to raise a point of order against a ruling of a Presiding Officer.

Hon. Government Members: Sit down.

The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Member, resume your seat.

Mr B. Mpundu resumed his seat.

The Deputy Chairperson: I have guided you.

May the hon. Member who was on the Floor continue.

Mr Kasandwe (Bangweulu): Mr Chairperson, thank you very much for the opportunity given to the people of Bangweulu to reflect on the Budget allocation to the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Arts in the 2023 Budget.

Sir, I am looking at the allocation for youth skills development which is a meagre K7,825,443. This, in my considered view, cannot develop the youth’s skills in this country. I also want to put into categories the youth that we may be targeting because many are the times that we only target a specific type of youth.

Mr Chairperson, there are those young people who have never stepped foot in a structured education system, there are those who drop off at Grade 7; those who drop off at Grade 9; those who drop off at Grade 12; and others who manage to complete Grade 12, but do not make it to tertiary education.

Sir, when we talk about skills training, we are talking about investing in young people so much so that they can transform the economy of this country and create wealth amongst themselves.

Mr Chairperson, I also want to talk about the issue of co-operatives and empowerment. Many are the times young people come out to look for help and are asked to form co-operatives. Once they form co-operatives, they are given money. In my opinion, the young people whom we should be helping are the ones doing metal fabrication along Kalingalinga Road.

Sir, when you go to Lusaka West, you find young people doing metal fabrication. When you go to Samfya, you find young people who are already engaged in carpentry and metal fabrication. If you go to Kaputa, you find young people who are already engaged in rice growing. These are young people whom we already know are engaged in economic activities where we deliberately need to put money instead of going to look for young people who have no intention to form co-operatives. Those are the ones we are asking to form co-operatives, yet they have no idea of what a business plan looks like.

Sir, we already have young people who are engaged in various skills and activities. Create industrial yards for them. There are so many abandoned buildings throughout the country which the hon. Minister can transform and turn into industrial yards and can relocate all these people. I have given him an example of the young people along Kalingalinga Road. Find a space for them. Buy machinery for them. That is the empowerment that we should be talking about so that the activity is enhanced and improved rather than looking simply to empowering people who have no idea of how they want to be empowered.

Mr Chairperson, I also want to talk about the integrated empowerment programmes for the youths. You will discover that empowerment programmes for young people are spread almost in all the ministries. There is the youth empowerment at the Ministry of Community Development and Social Service, the Constituency Development Fund (CDF), and the Ministry of Fisheries and Livestock. Why are we not putting this money in one pool so that we integrate all these empowerment programmes to enable the Government come up with a structured empowerment programme which is connected to the labour market?

Mr Chairperson, as I have always debated in this House, any skill that the ministry will put resources into should be connected to the bigger picture of a kind of economy we would want to see as a country. As it stands now, money is given from every direction. I can use the term chipantepante which means, kicking everywhere.

Mr Chairperson, that is why Hon. Fube, some few months ago, brought a Motion to this House which sought to introduce the youth fund or find a bank for the youth so that those with projects could apply for funds to ensure their productivity is enhanced. These are some few issues that I wanted to bring to the attention of the hon. Minister. Let us integrate the empowerment programmes in one basket. I am also not a proponent of hand outs or free gifts in terms of empowerment. Let us come up with a well-structured empowerment programme for young people so that they can contribute to the economy.

Mr Chairperson, let me conclude by talking about helping young people who are skilled like I have already said so that the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Art can help them create companies. For example, some few years ago, I worked for an organisation that was empowering young people with skills training for free. In Kaputa, there were ten youths who were trained. These youths were trained in plumbing, metal fabrication, electricity, and computer management. So, if we bring skills together, the ministry can help these young people to form companies as opposed to co-operatives and businesses. These young people can be empowered through making desks. I remember a few days ago, the hon. Minister of Technology and Science displayed some substandard desks but through the structured programme that I am talking about –

Hon. Government Members: Question!

Mr Kasandwe: Mr Chairperson, I wonder why they are questioning when we have a deficit of one million desks. So, I urge the ministry to put these youths together and form companies for them so that they can be able to produce these desks that I am talking about. These are some of the issues that I wanted to bring to the attention of the hon. Minister.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Emmanuel Banda (Muchinga): Mr Chairperson, I would like to thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to debate the Vote for the Ministry of Youth, Sports and Art.

Mr Chairperson, allow me to start by thanking the hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts for the effort that he is putting in to make sure that the Zambian youths become relevant. The people of Muchinga are thanking him too.   Mr Chairperson, allow me to also thank the New Dawn Government for showing love to the Zambian youths. Many of our youths have been employed under the New Dawn Government and this is what they were lacking –

Mrs Masebo: On a point of order, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.


Mrs Masebo: Mr Chairperson, I would like to say sorry to my dear hon. Colleague for interrupting his very good speech. It is not always my intention to do so, but I thought it was necessary that I rise on this point of order.

Mr Chairperson, I am quoting Standing Order No. 207. During the consideration of Vote 46 –Ministry of Health, there was a vote that was called on that day and information has since come to my attention that apparently, our hon. Colleagues on your left, particularly, the hon. Patriotic Front (PF) Members of Parliament, led by their leaders had agreed to disrupt the Budget for the Ministry of Health by calling for that vote. All that was deliberate because if that vote had gone through, the effect was basically, going to collapse the whole Budget. 

Mr Chairperson, Standing Order No. 207(1) states:

“Contempt of the House refers to an act, omission or conduct, which obstructs or impedes either the House or members or officer in the discharge of their duties”

Mr Chairperson, as an old hon. Members of Parliament, I take note that we all have these rights, which in my humble view, are supposed to be exercised for the good of this country. Is the Leader of the Opposition of this House, a man who wants to be President of this nation, in order to organise his PF hon. Members to deliberately fail a budget for no good reason, but just for the sake of obstructing this Administration? They want us to procure ambulances, construct hospitals and complete several buildings and yet, on that particular day, they had an evil intention to completely collapse the budget so that the Ministry of Health would not have had resources.

Mr Chairperson, are they in order, in particular, this man who wants to be President to act in such a manner?

Mr Chairperson, I seek your serious ruling so that the PF hon. Members do not make a mistake to elect him. I think Miles Sampa can be a better President.


The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Members, Order!

I know the hon. Minister, as she has stated, is a very experienced politician ...


The Deputy Chairpersons: ... but she was trying to –


The Deputy Chairperson:  If some of you want to distract me from doing my work, I will send you out.


The Deputy Chairperson: You know that when I am here, I have many powers.


The Deputy Chairperson: So, if I exercise them, I will bruise some of you. So, let us just be orderly. What I am trying to say is that even though the hon. Minister has said that she is a very experienced hon. Member of this House, this House is governed by rules. Therefore, a point of order can only be raised on the day the breach is committed.


The Deputy Chairperson: So, I think she knew what she was doing. However, she delivered or stated her point. All of us are Zambians. Therefore, let us ensure that the business is transacted in a manner that the people in the villages will benefit. Any hon. Member of Parliament who wants to sabotage the budgeting process is not a Zambian. If you are Zambian worth your sort, you should ensure that this Budget goes through.

Mr E. Banda: Thank you very much, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Chairperson, I was thanking the New Dawn Government for employing the youths in 2022, and it plans to employ more in the coming year.

Mr Chairperson, in supporting this Vote, allow me to highlight the few challenges that the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Art needs to work on.

Mr Chairperson, the ministry should always make follow-ups on the empowerment funds that it gives the youths. We have had cases in which money was allocated to a club or co-operative but the beneficiaries ended up being a team of people whose names were not in the database. In my constituency, there is a case which happened in 2020 where a club called Teyeseko Youth Club was allocated K250,000 and it did everything that it was required to do, and it was told to wait for the money to be deposited in its account so that it could buy a Rosa Mini Bus, but to date, it has not bought the bus. At one point, it received a call suspected to be from the provincial administration asking it if it bought the bus and how it was working, but to its surprise, no money went in its account. This means that some people might have gotten the money and bought the bus. So, the ministry needs to make follow-ups on the money for projects given to the youths and that is the first point.

Mr Chairperson, the second point is that most youths who are vulnerable are in rural areas. Being a Member of Parliament who comes from a rural constituency, I know the number of youths who need empowerment from the ministry. Many youths can do better in agriculture and the ministry can buy more tractors and farming equipment and it can give them to youth clubs and co-operatives. This will enable them make a lot of money and this will change their lives.

Mr Chairperson, I appreciate that the Government, through the ministry, is buying tankers and buses, but it should also look at the youths in villages. Like the other hon. Member said, some youths have never been to school but they engage in farming. Farming does not need someone who has been to school. So, the ministry should consider buying more tractors, ploughs, cattle and so on and so forth, and some youths can do better even in fish farming.

Mr Chairperson, I also want to bring to the hon. Minister’s attention that the ministry needs to put up a lot of –

Mr Fube touched Mr E. Banda.

Mr E. Banda: Why are you touching me? What are you putting in my shoe? I do not know why he is touching me.

Mr Chairperson, am I safe here? He is touching my shoe. I do not know what he is putting in my shoe. Is this Bemba man in order? You!


Mr E. Banda: Mr Chairperson, the ministry needs to start funding schools so that art can be promoted in schools, of course, not boxing. Other forms of art can be promoted in schools so that talent can be identified in the children and youths whilst they are still in school. This will enable many people to take up art. I am sure we have seen how the Nigerian Government does it and we watch Nigerian movies. It starts investing into art at an early stage, and we can do better in that area.

Mr Chairperson, as I conclude my debate, I urge the ministry to sensitise the youths that it wants to empower. Some youths will be given empowerment funds but the money that it will give them will just go to waste. As the ministry empowers the youths and gives them money, it should ensure that the hon. Members know what is being done in the districts. Since I became Member of Parliament, I do not know if the youths in Serenje have ever received the Youth Empowerment Fund. Of course, at some point, I heard that people were getting money, but there were many statements such as money was coming from an individual’s pockets and things like that. We need to know what is being done in the districts so that we can help the ministry to monitor and ensure that the money it gives the youths is being used prudently.

Mr Chairperson, allow me to donate one minute and fifty-two seconds to the next debater.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

The Deputy Chairperson: As I said earlier, we do not have much time.

Hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Art, wind up debate.


Mr Nkandu: Thank you very much, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Chairperson, I thank all hon. Members of Parliament who have debated and even those who were just listening.

Mr Chairperson, I will start by saying that the level of desperation of some of the hon. Members on your left…

Hon. PF Members: Ah!

Mr Nkandu: … – Are you the one? – is very alarming. Why I have said this is –


Mr Nkandu: No! I am answering to one of the issues that was raised that we chartered an aeroplane –

The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Minister, you are only allowed to debate in the third person. Let us ensure that the environment is conducive for all because what will happen is that we will create animosity in the House and –


The Deputy Chairperson: Order!


Hon. Member, why are you debating whilst seated. Hon. Member, Mr Mutale, go outside.


Sergeant-at-Arms, ensure that he is out.

Hon. PF Members: Ah!

The Deputy Chairperson: Yes. Let us be orderly. I am speaking and then you are also talking. No, no, no. I will not allow that. You are embarrassing yourself and I will not engage into a debate with you.

Hon. Minister, you can continue.

Mr Mutale remained seated.

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, some hon. Members of Parliament raised some issues which we need to answer to. I am talking about desperation in the sense that an issue was raised that the Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts chartered an aeroplane which at the end of the day did not bring the players from Ivory Coast, and I am happy that our hon. Member of Parliament touched on that. That is not correct. It is true that the aeroplane had a fault, but it was replaced, and that is the one that brought the players from Ivory Coast when they played Comoros Island at the Heroes Stadium? So, it is not correct to say that the ministry lost money because the aeroplane was replaced.

Mr Chairperson, I also want to correct the position that our athletes were stranded in Lusaka when they were going to Malawi, and that was stated on a certain page of a certain political party. No person was stranded. As I am talking to you, everyone is in Malawi. So, I thought of clearing that issue.

Mr Chairperson, some hon. Members passionately debated about the young people and it is like it is only in the new dawn where we have young people, and we did not have young people previously. However, let me now answer some of the issues that were raised.

Mr Chairperson, this Government has shown inclusiveness when it comes to sports. The President has been very categorical. The President has said that there is no minor sport in the country. So, what does that imply?

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, my time is running out. I hope you will give me some more minutes because of some disruptions. The President has said that there is no minor sport and ever since we came into office, we have assisted more than thirty federations. My policy statement was very clear.

Mr Kapyanga: Just football.

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, that is not only federations for football but talking about thirty federations. There is only one federation for football. What about the twenty-nine that we have helped? So, I think that is not a correct position when we say, we have concentrated much on football. Yes, I will agree because football is a popular sport. We should not shy away from that fact. It is a popular sport and it has been allocated a lot of money, that we agree. However, that does not mean that we should not take care of other sporting disciplines.

Mr Chairperson, today, as I am asking now, we have about 356 athletes in Malawi, for the first time that Zambia has sent that large number to a foreign country.

Ms Mulenga: Question!

Mr Kampyongo: Ama Ministers aya.  

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, someone talked about swimmers. The swimmers, taekwondo martial artists, Judokas, footballers both girls and boys are in Malawi. So, about twelve sporting disciplines are in Malawi. So, we are not segregating any sporting discipline. It is the more reason I thank the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning for the increment because we believe the way we are looking at sport. Let me just pause. The way we are looking at sport as the New Dawn Administration is not the way previous regimes were looking at sport.

Ms Mulenga: Question!

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, for us sport is not just a mere entertainment. Yes, for us sport is, firstly, an entertainment and secondly, it is a vehicle we are using to create more employment and job opportunities for our young people.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, the second issue that we are using sport as a tool is to alleviate poverty amongst young people. So, as the New Dawn Government, we are motivated to give this ministry more money so that we can create employment using sport. Even when someone is talking about arts development, we know that a talent is the most well-paid job on earth. So, I thought I should clear that issue so that we understand and be on the same level.

Mr Chairperson, someone talked about the swimmers –

Mr Nkombo: On a point of order, Mr Chairperson.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.


Mr Sing’ombe: This is not Patriotic Front (PF).

Mr Nkombo: Mr Chairperson, If I have heard, I want to seek advance forgiveness. This is because I suspect that maybe I was dozing, but in case I was not, I heard you order someone from Patriotic Front (PF) to leave the Chamber. However, I do not know who it was. 

Ms Mulenga: He is gone.

The Deputy Chairperson: No, he is still here.


Mr Nkombo: Mr Chairperson, can I conclude my point of order? My point of order is pursuant to Standing Order 226 which refers to challenging the decision of the presiding officer, and I quote:

“A member who wishes to challenge a decision of a presiding officer shall move a substantive Motion.”

Mr Chairperson, in my state, where I thought I may have been dozing, I heard you sir, even order the Sergeant-at-Arms to assist one hon. Member to leave the Chamber. However, I was looking to see if that action was on to the extent that I started to doubt myself that maybe I was dreaming.


Mr Chairperson, if it was true you did send someone out of the Chamber, I am also worried as a senior hon. Member that the consequences of defying your order are much to grave to contemplate because if someone writes to your office to complain about the defiance of a hon. Member refusing to follow the order. From the convention having been here for a long time, I have been sent away from this Chamber before, and I know too well that when you are sent out, you are actually asked to go and reflect, then come back even a few minutes later, unless the presiding officer says go and do not come back, come back tomorrow.

Mr Chairperson, now that I am clear that I was not dreaming because I saw you point somewhere that the hon. Member is still seated in this House, and for a hon. Member to not get into trouble, is he or she in order to remain seated –


Mr Nkombo: Mr Chairperson, I am told now he has gone. I congratulate myself –


Mr Nkombo: Mr Chairperson, I congratulate myself for this point of order because if I had not done this, I would have personally written not against the hon. Member, but for the protection of the decorum of this House. This is because if you fail to achieve your order to ask a hon. Member to leave, you will fail continuous. It will be a precedent set. So, let me congratulate the hon. Member who has heeded to my point of order for walking out to go and reflect upon his conduct. I am thankful for the opportunity to raise this point of order.

The Deputy Chairperson: Thank you hon. Minister. Still he has resisted my order. So, I reserve my ruling. Let me study the matter. I will render the ruling on a later date.

May the hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts continue.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, thank you. Let me also say something on the issue of discrimination, especially on the swimmers. I think when I just got into that office, I was greeted by the swimmers that they did not have money. My first task was to find money so that we can give to the swimmers and they went to where they were going. So, I think that is not also correct. The position is that we have been assisting everyone. 

Mr Chairperson, again, especially to Hon. Fube who talked about discrimination and segregation.  In fact, people should be able to first thank me, as hon. Minister, to act above board. The first fifty tankers that someone talked about was given to Patriotic Front (PF) cadres. However, we have not repossessed even one tanker because those people are Zambians.

Mr Nkombo: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, they are Zambians. We have not repossessed even one tanker. Not even one.


Mr Nkandu: I am answering to what someone was saying. So, it is important that we set the facts right. The fifty tankers that we bought again, we selected in all the ten provinces. We gave five tankers per province –

Ms Sefulo: Even Shiwang’andu got.

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, even Shiwang’andu got one.

Mr Kampyongo: Question!

Mr Nkombo: Are you Shiwang’andu?

Mr Nkandu: Shiwang’andu District not Hon. Kampyongo.

Mr Chairperson, I think we have really done very well on this issue. Let the sleeping dog lie. That is very important.

Mr Chairperson, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for Bangweulu. As the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Arts, we know that we have people who are graduating as plumbers and tailors. We do not want them to join the queue of those who will be looking for employment when they graduate. We are giving them the equipment that is relevant to the training they have undergone so that they do not join the queue and go and establish themselves businesses.


Sir, if the hon. Member has not yet been to Kalingalinga and Samfya, I am surprised because in Samfya, we gave out so many kits to those who were graduating. I was not in Samfya because I was in Chilubi, where someone claimed I took confusion, but I was just doing my job; to go and grab that seat that really belonged to us.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkandu: To answer my hon. Colleague, Hon. Kangombe from Sesheke, we are aware that we need to tap talent from every corner of this country. So, we have now started what we are calling youth sports festivals, whereby we will be able to identify talent in every district. Every district will now feed into the province and finally feed into the national teams. So, in January, we will be in all the districts to make sure that we tap talent in each sporting discipline, so that people will know that this Government has really come to make sure it promotes talent. As I said earlier, talent is the best paying job.

Mr Chairperson, maybe, before I sit, I should clarify that the target of 3,000 does not mean that this is the limit. It is just a target. In fact, we have even gone beyond 3,000 to 5,000. So, I think I should now rest my case.

I thank you very much, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Kampyongo: On a point of order, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Chairperson, I appreciate the chance you have given me to raise a point of order. I would have loved to raise it whilst the hon. Minister was the Floor, so that he could clear some of the issues.

Mr Chairperson, I was listening patiently and I am happy that he got back to his policy statement.

The Deputy Chairperson: Now, you are debating again.

Mr Kampyongo: My point of order is premised –Mr Chairperson, you need to be fair to all of us. I saw my hon. Colleague, the hon. Minister there, debating a point of order, but mine will be very short. It will be shorter than the hon. Minister’s point of order.

Sir, I have been sitting here listening to the hon. Minister responding to the issues that were raised by hon. Colleagues, and shockingly, we did not hear some of the issues he was responding to being raised by the hon. Members. I did not hear anyone raising an issue of the plane. He went further and drew me in, seated here representing the people of Shiwang’andu, that he has given us a tanker.

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Hon. Member, you are supposed to cite what has been breached.

Mr Kampyongo: It is Standing Order 65, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: So, you start from there.

Mr Kampyongo: This is about content of speech.

Mr Chairperson, here, I represent the people of Shiwang’andu and the hon. Member stands on the Floor to inform the entire nation that the people of Shiwang’andu have received a tanker, which he did not invite me to go and witness. I do not even know where it is parked.

Sir, is he in order? If you had allowed him, I would have loved the hon. Minister to state properly, so that I can go and inspect the size of that tanker. I would like to know how it is working and who the beneficiaries are, so that I am not held answerable.

Sir, this is because I know my people in Shiwang’andu will be asking to know where this tanker is parked in Shiwang’andu. Is he in order to ‘tankerise’ ...


Mr Kampyongo: ... the people of Shiwang’andu?

I am seeking your serious guidance on this matter, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Member, you cited Standing Order 65, but you were not precise on the part of that Standing Order. Is it 65 (a) ...

Mr Kampyongo: Wait a minute, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: ... because in Standing Order 65, there is no content of speech.

Mr Kampyongo: Sir, Standing Order 65, which is entitled “Content of Speech”, states as follows:

“A member who is debating shall:

  1. confines his or her debate to the subject under discussion;
  2. ensures that he information he or she provides to the House is factual and verifiable.”

Sir, what I am seeking is for the hon. Minister to verify his submission to this august House and through this august House to the nation that the people of Shiwang’andu –

Ms Sefulo interjected.

Mr Kampyongo: Mwandi, I am senior than you. You might not come back.


The Deputy Chairperson: Hon. Member, you may resume your seat. I have heard you.

Mr Kampyongo: Sir, I want the verification of that information he has given, so that as people are asking me when I go back after we adjourn, I am able to speak to the information he has given to the House.

I seek your guidance, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

As you know, the hon. Minister is responsible for the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Arts. It is only the hon. Minister and his controlling officer; the Permanent Secretary (PS) and subordinates, who know the manner and model that is used to distribute the tankers.


The Deputy Chairperson: Now listen! So, he hon. Minister is not out of order.

Ms Mulenga: Zoona, public funding?



The Deputy Chairperson: The hon. Minister is not out of order, so let us make progress.

VOTE 76 – (Youth, Sport and Arts – K269,471,790).

The Deputy Chairperson: There is Mr Zulu, but I do not know which one.

Mr Menyani Zulu (Nyimba): Mr Chairperson, it is the big Zulu.


Mr Menyani Zulu: Mr Chairperson, thank you so much for giving me this opportunity just to seek clarification from the hon. Minister. I appreciate that the hon. Minister gave five tankers per province. That is very good, but my question is: In the Eastern Province, which are those five districts that received a tanker each?

Mr Chairperson, further, on Table 3: Budget Allocation by Programme and Sub-programme, I will take you to Programme 5511, Sub-programme 1003 – Infrastructure Development – K50,000,000. This is on page 643. I appreciate we are moving from a budget of K15 million this year for infrastructure development to K50 million, which is a sufficient increment. Although it is not enough, at least there is improvement and we are thankful for that.

Sir, I think that everywhere you go now, people want to be in sport because it is one of the good professions where people can be well paid. Now, my question is: Are we going to see even a playing field being erected or constructed in constituencies like Nyimba? I talk about my constituency. So, are we going to see at least a reasonable football pitch with poles or this is just for major cities like Chipata, Kasama, Livingstone or Mongu? Are we going to see anything in the rural areas like Nyimba?

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, I thank the hon. Member for that very important question. As a ministry, we believe that we can have quality athletes if we invested in infrastructure. So, I think the increment is timely, so that we can put up some of the multi-sports facilities, not only in the urban areas where they are concentrated. I think we need now to get to the districts and see where we can start from.

Mr Chairperson, I know money will never be enough, but I believe that we will start from somewhere. I may not be able to say here that we are starting with Nyimba because I do not want to commit myself to that, but who knows, we may start with the hon. Member’s constituency. However, the fact is we are about to start constructing multi-sports facilities in areas where we feel they are required, so that we can get quality athletes from such districts.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Elias M. Musonda (Chimbamilonga): Mr Chairperson, on page 641, Budget Summary, Table 1, in 2022, there is an approved budget of K119,392,178. The ministry is asking for K269,471,790. That is an increment of K150,079,612, representing 126 per cent. Having established that, on page 651, key outputs and output indicators with their corresponding targets, these have remained constant between 2022 and 2023 except for one, which is Number of Youth Skills Centres Constructed. There is zero from three in 2022. What is the justification for asking for an additional K150,079,612, over and above what was approved in 2022 when, effectively, they have reduced the level of activities in 2023?

The Deputy Chairperson gave the Floor to Mr Mukosa


Hon. PF Member: The hon. Minister has not answered.

The Deputy Chairperson: The hon. Minister has not responded? I thought he just –

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, the hon. Member is looking for an answer to justify the increment. I will start by saying that previously, women football was not funded by the Government. It was the responsibility of the Football Association of Zambia (FAZ). Now, because we attach great importance to sport, as I said earlier, we want to be as inclusive as we can so that we motivate our athletes. So, the upswing you have seen is because many hon. Members of Parliament, for instance, have been looking for equipment. They frequent my office to look for footballs, jerseys and other equipment that is relevant to sport. So, the increment is in answer to some of their demands and questions. Hon. Members will see that next year, in 2023, every hon. Member of Parliament will be given foot balls and jerseys. We had to factor that in. Hon. Musonda needs to appreciate that.

Hon UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, the second justification is: We have seen that with federations, sometimes, there was a lot of discrimination. Some of them were not given any money, previously. So, what we are introducing next year is the giving of grants to federations so that they can kick-start their leagues and deal with other issues that may come before them. For the first time in the history of this country, federations will be getting grants from the Government. That should also be appreciated. So, the issue of golf and swimmers not being given grants would have been sorted out by such grants from the Government.

Mr Chairperson, I also want to say that these are just targets. I gave an example earlier that we targeted about 3,000 youths to graduate from our resource centres, but we went as far as almost 6,000. So, even when we have zero Kwacha, obviously, we have funds which we can use in infrastructure development. I assure the hon. Member that even with resource centres, we have a target of how many we are going to build. We are just about to make a master plan to see how many resource centres will be developed in 2023.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Mukosa (Chinsali): Mr Chairperson, I thank the hon. Minister for the answer he has given to Mr Musonda. It has partly answered what I wanted to ask. However, I will take him to page 643, Table – Budget Allocation by Programme and sub-programme. This table reveals to us that from the K150 million that we have increased the budget by, you will see that 43.33 per cent relates to sports development and management, that is under Programme 5513 and the specific programme is 3002 – Regional and International Games – K85,000,000. There is an increase of about K60,000,000. Could the hon. Minister shade more light on these regional and international games.


Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, I thank the hon. Member for that very important question. When talking about regional and international games, it is important for hon. Members to understand that this is where we even pay the coaches. Zambia has not been so attractive in terms of attracting very experienced coaches that can give us positive results. The reason is very simple. I will give a practical example; we had Herve Renard here who was being paid US$30,000. When he was lured by Angola, his pay jumped to about US$60,000. So, obviously he could not come back. Then, when he went to Morocco, he was being given US$90,000. Today, where he is in Saudi Arabia, he is being given US$240,000. Now, we, are just paying only a US$25,000 to a coach. Let me take advantage of this opportunity because the Zambian people will always cry for positive results. Now, positive results will always come with a lot of incentives. One of the incentives is that you need to pay a coach very well. So, we are not so attractive in terms of attracting quality and experienced coaches. So, what we thought in this budget was to increase a little bit. That is the justification now. We are now increasing the pay for our coaches so that even when I know we cannot still attract quality coaches, but I think we should start from somewhere instead of just being stagnant on the same amount that we have been paying.

Secondly, I want this House to know that we are hosting the Under 18 and 20 African Athletics Championships in April, 2023. We have also shown interest to host the Africa Cup of Nations (AFCON) in 2025, and the House should know that. Obviously, the upswing is attributed to such factors.

I thank you, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: I want to inform the House that the question by Ms Phiri will be the last one.

Ms Phiri (Milanzi): Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on Page 643, Table 03, Programme 5511, Sub-Programme 1003 – Infrastructure Development – K50,000,000. The approved Budget for 2022, was K15,651,772 and the hon. Minister is asking for an increment of about K35 million to make it K50,000,000. I want to know the kind of infrastructure the hon. Minister intends to put up and where.

Mr Nkandu: Mr Chairperson, I thank the hon. Member for that important question. I think I partially touched on the last part and said that we are about to make a master plan. Even the hon. Member of Parliament for Nyimba wanted to know if the resource centre will be built in his constituency and I said that have not yet sat to see where we are going to put this infrastructure. I will come to this House, after we are done with everything, to indicate where we will start from. By then, we would have sat and made up a plan.

Mr Chairperson, the other question is about the jump in the amount. In my policy statement, I stated that our twenty-three youth resource centres are in a dilapidated state. Our students who are in carpentry have been queuing for a plane. So, we want to make sure that we assist these resource centres by procuring some equipment and also, rehabilitate them. Apart from rehabilitating this infrastructure, we also want to put three or four resource centres in places that do not have skills training centres. Hence, the jump from K15,651,722 to K50,000,000.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Vote 76 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

VOTE 62 – (Ministry of Energy – K2,048,138,098).

The Minister of Energy (Mr Kapala): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to present the 2023 Budget Estimates for the Ministry of Energy.

Mr Chairperson, before I proceed any further, I want to state that the budget estimates to be presented will be a true reflection of the developmental aspirations of the manifesto of the New Dawn Government’s effort to sustainably manage and harness the nation’s energy resources for socio-economic growth.

Mr Chairperson, the 2023 Budget theme of stimulating economic growth for improved livelihoods resonates well with the Ministry of Energy’s strategic objectives of 2023. In this regard, my ministry will significantly contribute to economic growth for improved livelihood by ensuring that all energy sources are explored so as to achieve energy provision to all industries and the Zambian people at large.

Mr Chairperson, the 2023 National Budget Speech indicates that the Zambian economy is projected to grow at 4 per cent in 2023, against the growth rate of 3 per cent in 2022. This upward trend in the growth rate of the economy is due to the good policies the New Dawn Government is putting in place in order to induce the once stagnant economy into recovery mode.

Mr Chairperson, through the 2023Budget, my ministry will ensure that it promotes job creation, socio development and environmental sustainability in all sectors of the economy by ensuring that there is equal and secure access to energy.

Mr Chairperson, I now wish to table the 2023 ministerial budget estimates. My budget presentation is divided into two parts. The first part highlights major achievements and challenges that occurred during the 2022 financial year while the second part focuses on proposed programmes for the year 2023.

2022 Performance Review

Mr Chairperson, my ministry in 2022 was allocated an estimated amount of K1.4 billion. This budget supported the implementation of the following programmes:

Petroleum Development and Management

Mr Chairperson, in a bid to ensure sustained supply of petroleum products, the Government embarked on reforms to restructure the petroleum sub-sector. This led to the process of conveying the Tanzania Zambia Mafuta (TAZAMA) pipeline from a crude oil to a finished petroleum product carrier. The conveying process is ongoing. In addition, this has further necessitated the placing of Indeni Petroleum Refinery under care and maintenance. The Government revised the pricing model from Cost-plus Model to Import Parity Pricing (IPP) Model for the purpose of ensuring that the pricing of petroleum products was cost reflective. The change of the pricing model dictated the revision of the pricing cycle from sixty days to thirty days.

Mr Chairperson, in an effort to increase petroleum strategic reserves, the Government, through the ministry, continued to ensure the security of supply by increasing the national petroleum storage capacity. In this regard, the construction of the Chipata Depot was completed by July 2022 and the new Lusaka Fuel Depot is expect to be completed by the first quarter of 2023.

Electricity Development and Electrification Management

Mr Chairperson, the national installed generation capacity of electricity in Zambia currently stands at 3,328 mW from 3,223 mW in 2021. The increase stemmed from the commissioning of one more unit of the Kafue Gorge Lower Project in 2022.

Sir, the Government is keen to increase the production of electricity in the country as we position Zambia as an electricity hub in the region. In this regard, I wish to inform this august House that the remaining 150 mW unit at the Kafue Gorge Lower Hydro Power Station is scheduled to be commissioned by the end of this year.

Mr Chairperson, the Government, through the Ministry of Energy, as earlier alluded to, has placed great importance on the need to achieve universal access to electricity for all Zambians. In this regard, the Government is implementing the Rural Electrification Master Plan which targets electrifying 1,217 rural growth centres by the year 2030. So far, 42 per cent of this target has been achieved.

Renewable and Alternative Energy Development

Mr Chairperson, the Government, through the ministry, has continued to implement alternative energy solutions through on and off-grid technologies. In this regard, the Government is encouraging all constituencies to tap into the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) to ensure that rural communities, schools and rural health centres are electrified.

Energy Sector Standards and Regulations

Sir, the Ministry of Energy, through the Energy Regulation Board, undertook the following:

(a)        conducted fuel sampling and analysis to ensure that petroleum products met stipulated technical standards;

(b)        continued the implementation of the fuel marking programme to prevent the adulteration of petroleum products and dumping, thereby, improving the quality of fuel and enhancing government revenue; and

(c)        promulgated new standards for bioethanol and biodiesel blends, including the Biofuels Code of Practice.

Mr Chairperson, in 2022, the sector faced the following challenges:

(a)        dismantling of the huge debt owed to petroleum suppliers which currently stands at K11.97 billion; and

(b)        none cost-reflective tariffs.

Priority Programmes for 2023

Sir, in 2023, my ministry has been allocated K2,048,138,098 as compared to an allocation of K1,448,718,669 in 2022, which translates into an increase of 41.38 per cent. This allocation will facilitate the implementation of the following programmes in the energy sector:

Petroleum Development and Management

Mr Chairperson, the ministry is keen on improving and strengthening the security of the supply of petroleum products in the country both in urban and rural areas. In this regard, this programme has been allocated K255,513,961. This allocation will be used towards the dismantling of the outstanding debt from the construction of fuel depots in Chipata and Lusaka.

Additionally, this allocation will be used for the facilitation of private sector developments in the construction of rural infrastructure such as filling stations and depots. Further, this allocation will facilitate the conversion of Indeni Refinery into an oil marketing company as well as the blending of biofuels. Lastly, the funds will also be used to facilitate the development of planned oil and gas pipelines from neighbouring countries.

  1. Electricity Development and Electrification Management

Mr Chairperson, this programme has been allocated K1,672,331,364. It will be used to enhance the generation, transmission and distribution of electricity. This will be achieved through the implementation of sector reforms, in particular, at ZESCO Limited; promotion of efficiency; energy technologies; and scaling up of rural electrification programmes.

The allocation of the Rural Electrification Programme has been increased to K758,722,660 in the 2023 Budget from K377,352,720 in 2022, which translates into a 101 per cent increment. The allocation will be used for the implementation of grid extension projects and off-grid projects in rural areas. The ministry also plans to conduct an Energy Access Survey in 2023 for the first time in history. This survey will provide important data and statistics that will be used to measure electricity access in Zambia.

  1. Renewable and Alternative Energy Development

Chairperson, this programme has been allocated K8,215,279. The allocation will be used to ensure smooth facilitation and promotion of the development of renewable and alternative energy sources.

Mr Chairperson under this programme, the ministry will implement the following:

  1. promotion of alternative energy sources through development appropriate regulatory framework; and
  2. increase the application of solar systems in public institution and installation of clean cooking solutions.

Energy Sector Standards and Regulations

Mr Chairperson, this programme has an allocation of K90,647,014.This programme will ensure adequate enforcement of energy regulations and standards by the Energy Regulation Board (ERB).

Management and Support Services

Mr Chairperson, these funds are allocated for the management and support services programme in order to facilitate co-ordination and management of programmes in the ministry.

Mr Chairperson, let me conclude by reassuring this august House that my ministry is working hard to develop the energy sector in the face of many challenges being encountered. The New Dawn Government under the able leadership of His Excellency, the President of the Republic of Zambia, Mr Hakainde Hichilema is providing an enabling environment that is attracting both local and foreign investment in the energy sector. To this end, I appeal to this august House to support the ministry’s budget estimates and priority programmes for the year 2023.

I thank you, Sir.


Mr Mabumba (Mwense): Mr Chairperson, thank you for the opportunity. The speech by the hon. Minister is very fantastic, but let me comment as follows.

Mr Chairperson, the hon. Minister requires providing strategic leadership as well as political leadership in achieving some of the benchmarks that he has highlighted in his presentation. I think more importantly, he has to look at the two sectors; the petroleum sub-sector and the electricity sub-sector.

Mr Chairperson, as regards the petroleum sub-sector, what is important is that our hon. Colleagues on your right made a commitment when they were in the Opposition to reduce the petroleum pricing in this country. Therefore, a reduction in petroleum products in this country will not be achieved on its own but by providing leadership around the following three things:

The first thing is the fuel storage capacity in this country. As you may be aware, we do not have sufficient fuel storage capacity in this country. I would encourage the Government to continue with what the previous Government was doing, but of course, with improvement because Governments come and go. Therefore, as you saw in Chipata, there was no budget which was allocated for the fuel storage facilities in Chipata and Mansa. This includes the many storage facilities that the current Government inherited. There was no money that was provided in the budget but because of the private sector, your Government has inherited those facilities. I encourage the hon. Minister to provide political leadership even in Choma and Kabwe where there is a bigger storage facility because when we have a bigger storage facility as a country, in Kabwe, we can then import fuel when it is cheaper and you can deliver that commitment that the Government gave to the Zambian people. However, without storage facilities, it will be very difficult for the Government to deliver the reduction in fuel prices. So, that investment is required, but your budget of K255,513,961 is not enough to deliver on that particular score. So, the Government will be required to work with the private sector.

Mr Chairperson, the hon. Minister has also talked about the transformation that the Government is making on the Zambia Tanzania Mafuta (TAZAMA) pipeline as well as Indeni Petroleum Refinery.The transformation of the TAZAMA pipeline into a finished petroleum product pipeline for me, in my own personal view, is a short-term measure. This is because it will not be able to deliver what we require as a Government. What the Government should have thought about, and those discussions were already done with the Tanzanian Government, is to do a multi petroleum product pipeline along the existing TAZAMA pipeline. This is because even when it comes to an environmental assessment, the Government is not going to spend money because the leeway is already there. However, if it wants to get a pipeline from Angola or anywhere else, it is going to be very expensive for the Government. However, if it uses the existing line where the TAZAMA crude petroleum pipe line passes, it will be much cheaper for the Government to have a new multi-facility petroleum product pipeline which can transport both diesel and petrol as opposed to what it is proposing now. Even now, the Government is only going to transport diesel. What about the petrol? The petrol is going to be transported using roads. Therefore, the environmental degradation and the damage to the roads will be a cost to the Government.

Mr Chairperson, I would like to urge the hon. Minister to relook at this particular proposal. It might help the Government in the short term, but in the long term, and if the Government did a new pipeline, it can take it to the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) and make a lot of money by the border. This also goes to the issue of the transformation of the Indeni Petroleum Refinery into a blender. I do not know if the Government’s decision was based on empirical evidence because what Indeni Petroleum Refinery required was just the hydro –

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

(Debate adjourned)



[MADAM SPEAKER in the Chair]

(Progress reported)


The House adjourned at1842 hours until 0900 hours on Friday, 2nd December, 2022.