Wednesday, 22^ndJune, 2022

The House met at1430 hours

[MADAMSPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

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ANNOUNCEMENT BY MADAM SPEAKER

ACTING LEADER OF GOVERNMENT BUSINESS IN THE HOUSE

Madam Speaker:Hon. Members, I have received communication to the effect that in the absence of Her Honour the Vice-President, who is attending to other Government business, the Minister of Home Affairs and Internal Security, Hon. Jack Mwiimbu, MP, has been appointed Acting Leader of Government Business in the House from today, Wednesday, 22^nd June, 2022, until further notice.

I thank you.

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MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

HUMAN-ANIMAL CONFLICTS

The Minister of Tourism (Mr Sikumba): Madam Speaker,thank you very much for according me the opportunity to deliver a ministerial statement this afternoon.

Madam Speaker, I rise to deliver a ministerial statement on the recent human-animal conflict incidents that occurred in Chama North, Katombola and Mulobeziconstituencies.This is in response to the urgent matters of public importance, raised by the hon. Members of Parliament of the respective parliamentary constituencies.

Madam Speaker,I am grateful to you for granting methis opportunity to highlight the various measures that the Government, through my ministry, is putting in place to address the issue of human-animal conflicts and allay the fears of the people living in the affected areas.

Madam Speaker,in order to address the matter comprehensively, my statement will first address the human-animal incidents which took place in Chama North followed by Katombola andMulobeziconstituencies, respectively. Thereafter, I willoutline the steps that the Government has taken to address the human-animal conflicts across the country in collaboration with communities and its partners.

Madam Speaker,Chama North Constituency is in Musalangu Game Management Area (GMA), located east of the North Luangwa National Park. As such, interactions between humans and wild animals are inevitable. It is against this background that various areas of the constituency such as Kapalakonje, Kampuzunga, Mtanila, Mwimba, Mantepa and Kaozi Zonehave experienced an increase in the incidences of human-animal conflicts caused mainly by elephants, hippos, lions and crocodiles.

Madam Speaker, the increase in the frequency of human-animal conflicts could be attributed to multiple factors which are not limited to the following:

      (a)     continued encroachment in animal habitats by communities for various reasons such as farming and

               settlements;

      (b)     observable increase in wildlife numbers due to better policing;

      (c)     sharing of water sources, especiallyof the Luangwa River, between humans and wildlife; and

      (d)     search for forage by wildlife which results into destruction of crop fields and food storage bins.

Madam Speaker,in an effort to mitigate the human-animal conflicts, my ministry, through the Department of National Parks and Wildlife (DNPW), has continued to deploy officers to respond to affected communities so asto safeguard human life, their crops and livestock.

Madam Speaker, with respect to the recent incident in Kaozi Zone D, where a pride of lions strayed into a known farm and begun to hunt livestock, officers were immediately deployed to the area, and in no time, the beasts were driven back into the wild and calm was restored among community members. Officers have remained alert on the ground and are available to respond to another incident once reported.

Madam Speaker,my ministry, through the DNPW, has engaged various partners, who include the Community Markets for Conservation, popularly known as COMACO, which has a running project entitled “Consolidation of Livelihood Solutions for Wildlife Conservation”. This project is aimed at reducing human-animal conflicts by creating a community land bridge and to equip communities with knowledge on how to interact with wildlife in a manner that minimises the likely occurrence of human-animal conflicts. We hope that the project succeeds so that the lessons learnt can be rolled out in other affected areas across the country.

Madam Speaker, further, the DNPW and COMACO are working in collaboration with Co-operatives, Community Forest Managements Groups and Community Resources Board (CRBs) to implement the following interventions and preventive measures aimed at reducing human-animal conflicts in the area:

Training of Community Members as Blasters

Madam Speaker, this is aimed at training communities in scaring of wildlife away from crop fields, granaries, and general human settlements using chili powder. Under this initiative, thirty-six community volunteers spread across the chiefdoms have been engaged to help in scaring the animals. These are supported with the necessary gears and equipment to carry out field patrols around the farming blocks day and night.

Development of Participatory Village Land Use Plans (VLUPs)

Madam Speaker, VLUPs, as they are popularly called, are aimed at reducing unplanned settlements as this has been identified as one of the main contributing factors to human-animal conflicts. In this regard, traditional leaders and community members have been engaged on developing community land use plans. These plans have locally developed by-laws which outline the allowed and prohibited activities within chiefdoms and/or constituencies. Therefore, the VLUPs guide the communities on where they can settle, do their agricultural activities and many other social activities.

Paper Trail (Data Collection)

Madam Speaker, in an event of an incident of ahuman-animal conflict, data is collected to help provide information that includes the type of wildlife involved, crop or livestock damaged, location of this incident and the names of the affected individuals, among others. This helps management to make decisions and to predict future occurrences.

Other Mitigations

Madam Speaker, COMACOsupports the communities with planting early maturing cropvarieties and alternative livelihood activities such as gardening, poultry, goat rearing and beekeeping. This is to mitigate human-animal conflicts in the constituencies and deter community members from engaging in poaching activities.

Madam Speaker,with respect to the incidences in Katombola and Mulobezi Parliamentary Constituencies, the DNPW received reports on 22^nd May, 2022 with regards to human-animal conflicts involving elephants. The reports were from Kazungula District in Chief Musokotwane’sChiefdom and communities surrounding the Mosi-oa-Tunya National Park in Livingstone.

Madam Speaker, hon. Members of this august House may wish to note that elephants are migratory animals. During this season, it is normal for a high influx of elephants to arrive in the stated areas from the neighbouring countries of Zimbabwe, Botswana and Namibia. We call it the Kavango-Zambezi (KAZA) Region. As at 6^th June this year, more than 250 elephants were reported to have crossed into Zambia. This is an annual migration that happens as the elephants move in search of food and water. In this case, wildlife police officers were immediately deployed to the area to assess the threat and take appropriate action.

Madam Speaker, according to the report compiled by wildlife officers in the ministry, the crops destroyed in the areas are dry maize, fresh winter maize, tomatoes, sweet potatoes, cabbages, watermelons and groundnuts in Simonga, Maunga, Siyadavid, Mujala, Lushomo, Siya Soap and Kasiya villages. It was also reported that one goat and one sheep were trampled on by the elephants. The animals also caused damage to three water pumps. The communities living in these affected areas have been heavily affected by elephants destroying various crops and, at the moment, thirty farmers have had their crops and two domestic animals destroyed.

Madam Speaker,to control this situation, wildlife police officers were deployed on different occasions to attend to the reports. Assessments were conducted and action was taken by scaring the elephants through blasting, which is gunfire, and fire crackers. This option failed and one elephant wascontrolled as the last resort to ensure that the rest of the herd was dispersed. The option of capture and translocation was not possible because the large number of elephants involved, which had crossed into Zambia from the KAZA partner countries, was too much.

Madam Speaker,elephants are by nature migratory,like I mentioned. In this regard, we are having a challenge of influx of elephants migrating from the neighbouring countries into Zambia. Some of these animals have been reported to have injuries, thereby making them more violent. The injuries were occasioned by the community members who attempted to kill the animals with assorted sharp objects in retaliation. I would like to take this opportunity to advise members of the public to avoid such practices as they agitate the animals and increase the risk of attack.

Madam Speaker,reports of two lions attacking livestock in the Mulobezi GMA were also received from 7^th May to 10^th June, 2022. The lions have so far killed thirteen herds of cattle, two pigs and three donkeys. A team of wildlife police officers and veterinary officers were dispatched to the area. All attempts to capture the two lions failed due to the tall grass that affected visibility for our officers. However, the situation seems to have been controlled.

Madam Speaker,this august House may wish to note that the Mulobezi GMA is a prime area rich in many wildlife species including lions. Hence, members of the public rearing livestock in the area are encouraged to take appropriate measures to ensure safety of their livestock as it is not feasible to capture and relocate the lions to other protected areas.

Madam Speaker,the problem of human-animal conflicts is not just in the mentioned constituencies. We have received other reports of human-animal conflicts in various areas across the country such as Feira, Chiawa in Chirundu District, Chikankata, Luano, Mambwe and Siavonga and Livingstone constituencies.

To this effect, Madam Speaker, I can also be considered a complainant on behalf of the people of Livingstone because these animals are actually ravaging our fields. The animals mostly involved in the reported human-animal conflicts are elephants and lions. Unfortunately, in the last two weeks, we lost two human lives; a male aged twenty-nine years, in Chiawa and another male aged thirty-two years in Mambwe District. Both were killed by elephants.

Madam Speaker,while encroachments into wildlife areas and corridors could be a major cause of human-animal conflicts, an expert opinion from the DNPW indicates that ecological and climate factors could be contributing to the high incidents of human-animal conflicts across the country. For instance, the period from May to July is the breeding season for lions. This results into sub-adult males, and in a few circumstances, lionesses with young cubs, being forcibly ejected out of the pride by the adult lions, thereby forcing such lions to wonder far away from protected areas into community areas where they end up attacking livestock and sometimes humans. Equally, elephants are considered as wild raging animals whose feeding and migratory behaviour, if not recognised and taken into account in our town and land use planning, may continue to create conflicts.

Madam Speaker,some practical measures being carried out on the ground to mitigate human-animal conflicts include a variety of methods such as chili blasting, use of watch towers, electric fences and safe grain stores. Further, the use of community radio stations to educate and sensitise communities living around animal habitats on the threats paused by animals, the times that they are likely to materialise and mechanisms for preventing harm to human life and property will continue to be employed.

Madam Speaker,in order for us to have an active early warning system, the Government has continued to conduct regular monitoring of animal populations and movements coupled with early notification of communities and control to ensure animal densities stay within the recommended stocking rates. For effectiveness, the use of the Global Positioning System (GPS) satellite collars and aerial surveillance for animal tracking will need to be scaled-up, save for a few communities in which we already have collared animals.

Madam Speaker,it is importantto note that communities near wildlife protected areas will always face the risk of exposure to conflict with wildlife resources. Therefore, our aim as the Government is to reduce the scale and frequency of human-animal conflicts and, eventually, elimination of occurrences to safeguard the lives of people and property from the threat of wildlife.  On their part, communities need to desist from encroaching on protected areas. This is because experience has demonstrated that the increase in illegal settlements in protected areas result in conflict in land use in these areas. This is the central message we communicate to communities in our engagement.

Madam Speaker,other complementary measures that the Government has continued to implement is the delineating and demarcating of boundaries of national parks and GMAs. We are confident that the successful implementation of these integrated approaches to combat human-animal conflicts will go a long way in preserving life and safeguarding crops and domestic animals. It is our sincere hope that these measures will result in peaceful coexistence of humans and wildlife.

Madam Speaker, as I conclude, I would like to reiterate that in line with the mandate to conserve and manage wildlife protected areas in a sustainable manner, the ministry will continue to recognise and address human-animal conflicts as a perennial problem requiring sustainable solutions. At a higher level, the solutions to reducing the incidents of human-animal conflicts lie in mitigating the enabling factors at all levels. The ministry will continue working with co-operating partners to undertake sensitisation programmes in communities in and near GMAs and protected areas. Further, my ministry will prioritise implementing key initiatives and interventions aimed at addressing the problems of human-animal conflicts.

With those few remarks, Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Madam Speaker: In view of the fact that the hon. Minister has taken about eighteen minutes to deliver the ministerial statement, I will add fifteen minutes for purposes of debate so that hon. Members can have sufficient time to ask questions on points of clarification.

Hon. Members are now free to ask questions on points of clarification on the ministerial statement issued by the hon. Minister of Tourism.

Mr J. Chibuye (Roan): Madam Speaker, in the ministerial statement, the hon. Minister alluded to quite a number of issues contributing to human-animal conflicts and he cited Itezhi-Tezhi, where there is a national game park which houses quite a number of wild animals and, of course, human beings. The hon. Minister said that those whose livestock are being attacked by lions must take measures to protect their animals. In the same vein, he said that injured elephants are agitated because of their injuries, hence, increasing the rate of chances of attacksonhuman beings. Can the hon. Minister elaborate further as to whether the families whose cows and goats are being attacked can go to an extent of putting down these beasts if they can?

Mr Sikumba: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Roan for that question. I am not sure I got his question correctly, but I will attempt to answer what I picked up.

First things first, Madam Speaker, the challenge that we have within our protected areas is that we have an increasing threat of people farming or building settlements within GMAs. I wish to state in this august House that a GMA in our country is used as a buffer for the national park. However, what we have seen in the recent past, especially in the area that the hon. Member of Parliament has talked about, which is one such problematic area, is that we have settlements which, if I am correct, are 1 km from the national park. That in itself has put a lot of pressure on my department, my ministry and the Government.

Madam Speaker, when we encourage our colleagues to farm or use land in those particular areas, it needs to be in designated areas, hence, the use of the VLUPs that I talked about in my ministerial statement. However, unfortunately, certain individuals choose not to consider what is recommended by the VLUPs and they find themselves very close to a national park, hence, attracting animals looking for food. We are in partnership with our colleagues who are experts in managing communities in and around GMAs. We have seen successes in other national parks and we want to replicate that in a national park such as Kafue.

Madam Speaker, I know for a fact that the Mumbwa West GMA is one GMA which is extremely under threat from Kafue National Park. Kafue National Park is our pride as Zambia. It is our best national park sitting on 22,000 sq. km and we want to keep it as such. We want to keep it as pristine as we possibly can by managing the communities to stay away from the park boundary and stay in designated areas within the GMA. We encourage them to look at alternative sources of income or food, but not poaching.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chanda (Kanchibiya): Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister of Tourism for the statement. Maybe, to stretch it a little bit, we have circumstances in which when policing, in trying to prevent human-animal conflicts, policing itself has created a conflict between those who are supposed to police and the respective communities. I say this coming from a constituency that is also home to the Bangweulu Wetlands and there have been all these issues of the community versus those colleagues who are policing. To what extent is the Government ensuring that there is partnership between the people policing and the communities in order to harmonise the situation because, as it is, communities look at those who are policing as enemies and vice-versa? In certain cases, there have been confrontations which might even result in injuries or loss of life.

Mr Sikumba: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Kanchibiya for that timely question.

Madam Speaker, indeed, when we engage our collaborative management partners, who we popularly call CMPs, what we encourage them to do, or rather, the modus operandi is that the community comes first. In you coming to police or do conservation, what is important is that the community comes first. The people policing should make the communities understand exactly what they are trying to achieve. Sometimes, the media says the community is being denied the protein from the game meat and so on and so forth. Indeed, that is the confrontation and that is where the friction begins from. So, to answer the hon. Member’s question, we are engaging our collaborative management partners to see how best they can work with communities so that they have concerted efforts.

Madam Speaker, it is interesting that the hon. Member mentioned the Bangweulu Wetlands. In the Bangweulu Wetlands, we have a collaborative management partner, who I assume, is working very well in that particular ecosystem with the communities. In this regard, I am referring to the African Parks Network, which, in my honest opinion, has done a fantastic job within the Bangweulu Wetlands, but we will, indeed, ensure that any further engagement with our collaborative management partners deems the communities as the first point of call and ensures that they are all on the same page with regards to conservation.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mutale (Chitambo): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister’s statement appeared to be more reactive than proactive. He stated that he will treat this issue as a perennial issue, meaning that it is a bit more seasonal than often. Why did his statement appear to be more reactive than proactive?

Mr Sikumba: Madam Speaker, indeed, there is a way my statement is looking but, in any case, I will attempt to answer the question. Yes, these problems are perennial. I will give an example of Livingstone. On the onset of the rains in Livingstone, you will not see any elephants. If you are a fun of elephants, I highly encourage you not to come to Livingstone during the rainy season because you will not see any elephant.

As such, in the twenty national parks and thirty-six GMAs, there is normal policing of those particular animals. However, once we get overwhelmed, that is when your appearance in terms of reaction comes into play and we then deploy more resources to those particular areas. For example, in the KAZA Region, animals roam around five particular countries and that is when we deploy more people and, in your appearance, yes, it becomes reactive. However, overall, we have been managing these particular animals very well. I would like to mention, again, that in our quest to manage these particular animals within our country, we will employ more law enforcement officers to help us mitigate human-animal conflicts.

Madam Speaker, I request the Parliamentarians within the various GMAs and the affected areas to step up and join us into policing these animals and managing poaching, and they can come in as honorary wildlife police officers. We will give them an allowance when we finally fix the economy, than it is at the moment.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mandandi (Sioma): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has explained to us that elephants are migratory in nature. However, one disturbing fact regarding elephants in Sioma is that they have migrated to Sioma for good. They no long move out of Sioma and they have been terrorising villagers around Matebele, Kalongola, Nagweshi, Kaula and Mwanambao for the last seven days. The hon. Minister told us that when elephants become problematic in areas, the ministry instructs the officers from the Zambia Wildlife Authority (ZAWA) to scare them away. Many times, we have seen how officers from the ZAWA move with swiftness each time they hear a rumour that a villager has killed a rat or rabbit. How I wish that same effort or zeal can be applied when they hear that elephants have become a danger in our localities and to the people in the villages.

Madam Speaker, what measures has the Government put in place to ensure that the people of Sioma – we have heard about the measure of scaring elephants, which is not working in Sioma. I do not know whether the officers from the ZAWA in Sioma have run out of firearms which they should use to scare elephants away from our homes.

Madam Speaker, a serious trail of distraction has been left in terms of crops. Our farmers’ crops have been damaged. As I indicated last time, many farmers will walk out of their fields without anything in terms of food. What measures has the Government put in place to chase the elephants because my people are in danger? As I speak this afternoon, the elephants are in the villages of the people in Sioma. The ZAWA is just about 100 km –

Madam Speaker: Order,hon. Member! The question has been taken. Let us allow the hon. Minister to respond.

Mr Mandandi: Obliged, Madam Speaker. Let the ZAWA come in.

Mr Sikumba: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Sioma for that timely question.

Madam Speaker, yes, we have heard stories that the officers at the DNPW are very swift when they hear about poaching, but not as swift, when it comes to mitigating human-animal conflicts. However, the question asked is: Would you rather attend to somebody poaching or would you rather attend to issues regarding to warding off these particular elephants?

Madam Speaker, Sioma, which is very close to Sioma Ngwezi National Park,is one such area that was depleted of animals for a very long time. I am happy that elephants have gone to reside in Sioma. I hope the hon. Member of Parliament will work together with the ministry to see how best people can co-exist with the animals in that particular area.

Madam Speaker, like I mentioned in my ministerial statement, we have heightened our sensitisation in most GMAs and we are engaging the communities. A few minutes ago, I spoke about how best we are going to deal with communities and engage them on how best they should co-exist with those particular animals.

Madam Speaker, without being reactive in nature, like I mentioned earlier, we will continuously engage the communities to live in harmony with wild animals. We will continue urging our colleagues in the DNPW to be more responsive when most of these issues come to the table. The hon. Member of Parliament should volunteer so that we bestow him the honour of being an honorary wildlife police officer, together with his family and friends, in order to manage those animals that seem to be a threat to human life and crops.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Mabonga (Mfuwe): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister acknowledged that people’s crops have been destroyed by wild animals. However, I did not hear in the statement the immediate measures the Government will put in place so that the people who have been rendered foodless can have food on their table.

Mr Sikumba: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Mfuwe for that timely question.

Madam Speaker, fortunately, we have engaged our colleagues from the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) to ascertain the crops that have been destroyed as well as the three water pumps that were damaged. So, the DMMU will be in a position to give us its recommendations. Going forward, as a ministry and the Government, we will try and find a standard way to compensate those individuals who lost their food, crops and animals due to human-animal conflicts.

Madam Speaker, I must make it known to hon. Members in this august House that in view of the discussions we are having with the DMMU, only those people in legally designated areas, rather than a person who is a meter away from the national park, will claim for compensation. We will only consider those abiding by VLUPS that I spoke about in my ministerial statement.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Eng. Mabenga (Mulobezi): Madam Speaker, some people in Mulobezi lost some animals. My question has been partially answered, and I thank the hon. Minister for the statement. I, personally, sent him a message and he acted on it very quickly, and he should continue doing that. The people in Mulobezi depend on animals, but some of them lost their animals. When are they likely to be compensated? Is there any compensation? If not, why?

Mr Sikumba: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Mulobezi for that timely question.

Madam Speaker, like I mentioned earlier, the DMMU, which is the expert in ascertaining disasters, will give us a report with regards to the disaster. I can call it a disaster but then, maybe, the definition of a disaster might not be what the DMMU says it is. I can safely say that as soon as we get the report from our colleagues from the DMMU, we will formally write to the hon. Member of Parliament for Mulobezi, on the next action we will take. I thank him very much for acknowledging the quick response from the DNPW under the Ministry of Tourism.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mtayachalo (Chama North): Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for that ministerial statement.

Madam Speaker, I want to put it on record that the people of Chama North do not encroach on Game Management Areas (GMAs); it is vice-versa. The people in Katangalika, for example, Kaoze and Kapalakonje are within the Boma; they are not in the GMA, and by 1600 hours, elephants are already in these areas. So, it is important that I put it on record that the people of Chama North do not encroach on GMAs. The animals have multiplied and are competing for food with the people in villages.

Madam Speaker, we have been talking about human-animal conflicts, year in and year out, and we are not finding a lasting solution. Crops have been eaten, and we are waiting for the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) to conduct an assessment, but people have no food currently. Are we going to wait for another six or seven months when people have no food? Does the ministry have any immediate plan to fence these areas so that animals can stay in their own vicinity? That way, we will reduce cases of human-animal conflicts. For example, in Gwaza, which is managed by Zambia and Malawi, we do not have human-animal conflicts because that area is fenced. So, does the ministry have immediate measures to ensure that it fences these areas so that our people are safe and the food is secure?

Mr Sikumba: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Chama North for that timely question.

Madam Speaker, our immediate solution to that, in my honest opinion, is to sensitise communities to see how best they can coexist in harmony with wildlife. Secondly, we are looking for alternatives, hence our need to start working with communities and to get our partners to find other sources of income or food for those particular communities.

Madam Speaker, let me just give a bit of history. In 1989, Zambia assented to theConvention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES) and at the time, we did that purely because our animals were endangered. The elephant population had reduced to alarming levels, and hence, we thought we should try and protect that habitat properly. Over the years, due to policing and protection and conservation efforts that have been put in place, we have indeed seen an increase in these particular animals. At some point, – some of us were probably not yet born, – I believe that cropping used to happen within Zambia, but obviously, because we have assented to certain treaties or conventions, it is not just automatic that we can consider cropping some animals and we have to see how best we can reduce the population.

As such, Madam Speaker, I can safely say that the best alternative or solution other than sensitising the communities and looking for different sources of income, is to look at opportunities of translocating these animals to areas that seem to be depleted. That in itself is in our plans. You may have heard me on the Floor of the House talk about restocking certain national parks such as Nsumbu National Park up in the north which may not have elephants. We would want to take these particular animals to other areas, but that requires a huge budget to translocate those big animals.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Simuzingili (Gwembe): Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for the elaborate and excellent statement.

Madam Speaker, the lions in Mulobezi have not been located, meaning that they are still within the vicinity and the people of Mulobezi are still living in fear. A few weeks ago, we had a similar situation in Kafue, and it took so long for the lions to be located. Where are we getting it wrong? Is it the training? Is it the capacity of our wardens, or do we need to change the syllabus so that it becomes hands-on and more practical, so that our wardens are able to manage the situations? As I am seated here, I feel the people of Mulobezi are not really safe because those lions are still within the locality.

Mr Sikumba: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for that question.

Madam Speaker, the DNPW is well equipped to manage and conserve those animals. As regards the fact that those animals have not been sighted, I mentioned in my ministerial statement that this particular period we are in is the mating season and science dictates that these animals always fight for the pride. Those ones who lose the fight are meant to go elsewhere, wondering, hence you see them in other places. There is always a vicious fight when an animal is taken out of the pride.

I must make mention, Madam Speaker, that at no time will you find my officers at the DNPW going on a charade to start shooting down these particular animals. We will not do that. What we will do is sensitise the communities and make sure that we dart those particular animals and translocate them to other particular areas. I did make mention, much earlier, that the difficulty in locating these animals in Mulobezi is because of the tall grass that is there right now. Had it been in October, maybe, our sight would have been clearer than it actually is at the moment. So, we will continue sensitising communities and conserving these particular animals which we treat as our pride and joy as Zambia for our tourism sector.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

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MOTIONS

REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON MEDIA, INFORMATION AND COMMUNICATION TECHNOLOGIES

Eng. Mabenga (Mulobezi): Madam Speaker, I beg to move that this House do adopt the Report of the Committee on Media, Information and Communication Technologies for the First Session of the Thirteenth National Assembly, laid on the Table of the House on Thursday, 9^th June, 2022.

Madam Speaker: Is the Motion seconded?

Mr Lubusha (Chipangali): Madam Speaker, I beg to second the Motion.

Eng. Mabenga: Madam Speaker, in accordance with its mandate as contained in the Standing Order No. 198, your Committee undertook a study on the review of the media space in Zambia. The background of this inquiry is on the understanding that a media that operates freely plays a pivotal role in any democratic dispensation because it creates a platform for debate regarding governance issues. It also plays a watchdog role in society by ensuring that those holding public offices are held accountable.

Madam Speaker, for the media to be effective, the onus is on the Government to create an enabling environment through the provision of pieces of legalisation and policies that augment media freedom. However, this country lacks specific laws, rules or statutes to regulate or govern the operation of the media. As such, any alert media dispute is dealt with using laws from various statues, making it difficult to guide the media.

Madam Speaker, given the background, your Committee agrees with the stakeholders who observed that the practice of journalism is regulated directly or indirectly by mainly provisions of different statutes, some of which were drafted before Independence and are not keeping with international best practices. Sadly, some of these laws have continued to curtail media freedom that journalists ought to enjoy during the course of their duties.

Madam Speaker, to acquaint itself with the topic under review, your Committee interacted with several stakeholders who tendered both written and oral submissions before it.

Madam Speaker, I am aware that hon. Members have already perused through your Committee’s report. Therefore, I shall endeavour to highlight only a few pertinent issues that emanated from your Committee’s deliberations.

Madam Speaker, from the outset, let me state that the media is not operating in a conducive environment because there is no specific law for governing the practice of journalism. Legislation such as the Penal Code Act Chapter 87 of the Laws of Zambia, the Public Order Act Chapter 113 of the Laws of Zambia, the State Security Act Chapter 111 of the Laws of Zambia, the Printed Publication Act Chapter 167 of the Laws of Zambia, the Cyber Security and the Cyber Crime Act No. 2 of 2021, are among the laws that contain provisions that are an affluent to the practice of journalism. Most of the provisions in the cited pieces of legislation are being used to the detriment of the media in Zambia.

Madam Speaker, it is your Committee’s considered view that the above-mentioned pieces of legislation as well as others that contain provisions that are injurious to the media be revised and harmonised so as to curtail abuse by those in privileged positions. This will enable journalists to perform their duties without fear of abrogating the laws.

Madam Speaker, another issue that hinders the flow of information is inadequate revenue. Your Committee cannot agree more with stakeholders that most revenue from media houses in Zambia comes from advertising, which means that without advertising, most media houses will be financially unable to perform their obligation diligently. Your Committee, therefore, recommends that a body to regulate the distribution of advertising space among media houses be established. This will ensure that there is even distribution of advertising revenue to both private and public media houses. This will also enhance sustainability standards of media houses because they will have relatively stable income.

Madam Speaker, allow me to express your Committee’s profound sadness to learn that the access to information legislation was first presented to the House in November 2002. This means that if the access to information legislation is not presented to the House by November 2022, it would have taken the country twenty years without enacting this important piece of legislation.

Madam Speaker, your Committee is appalled to note that hardly a year passes without successive Committees reporting to the House about the concerns raised by the media personnel of how strenuous journalistic work is in the absence of the access to information legislation. Your Committee is further disheartened of the inordinate delay, especially that the law is not meant for the media alone but will also enable citizens to have access to information.

Madam Speaker, let me emphasise that whereas the law expressly facilitates media access to information held by public officials, the ultimate beneficiaries are the Zambian people in whose trust the Government holds information. In this regard, your Committee implores the Executive, as a matter of urgency, to speed up the process of enacting the access to information legislation to enable both journalists and members of the public have access to information. This piece of legislation will not only ease the work of the media personnel, but will also allow the general public to access information of public interest as and when they need it.

Madam Speaker, in conclusion, let me take this opportunity to thank you for the guidance rendered to your Committee during the session. I also thank the Clerk of the National Assembly and her staff for the invaluable support and the services rendered to your Committee during its deliberations. Last but not the least, my gratitude goes to all stakeholders who tendered both oral and written submissions before your Committee.

Madam Speaker, I beg to move.

Madam Speaker: Does the seconder wish to speak now or later?

Mr Lubusha: Now, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, thank you so much for giving the good people of Chipangali an opportunity to second this Motion moved by the Chairperson, that this House do adopt the Report of the Committee on Media, Information and Communication Technologies for the First Session of the Thirteenth National Assembly laid on the Table of this House on 9^th June, 2022.

Madam Speaker, in seconding the Motion, allow me on behalf of your Committee, and, indeed, on my own behalf, to sincerely thank the Chairperson of your Committee in the manner in which he presided over our deliberations.

Madam Speaker, I would like to inform this House that out of the many media houses that we interacted with during our long meetings and tours, only one media house was skeptical of the enactment of the Zambia Media Council, through an Act of Parliament. Your Committee, therefore, recommends that the Executive expedites the process of enacting the registering of the Zambia Media Council, which will establish a self-regulatory mechanism that will among many other things establish for the standardised code of ethics and create an ombudsman office, which will help to mediate between media houses.

Madam Speaker, I would like to bring it to your attention that many media houses emphasised that, in Zambia, we have suffered imbalanced reports due to the lack of motivation of journalists. Therefore, they believe that once this council is in place, it will help mediate and sort out issues between media houses and among journalists.

Madam Speaker, your Committee further makes a clarion call on the media practitioners to unite and support the process to resuscitate the Zambia Media Council so as to curb the unprofessional conduct exhibited by some media houses and journalists.

Madam Speaker, I would also like to join the Chairperson of your Committee in thanking all the stakeholders who appeared before your Committee during its sittings for their invaluable contributions. I would also like to take this opportunity, on behalf of your Committee, to sincerely thank the Office of the Clerk for the support rendered to your Committee.

I beg to second, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: A point of order is being raised by the hon. Member for Mitete. What is the point of order?

Hon. Member for Kanchibiya, you can debate.

Mr Chanda (Kanchibiya): Thank you so much, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, allow me to thank the Chairperson, Hon. Mabenga, and the seconder, Hon. Andrew Lubusha and the Committee as a whole.

Madam Speaker, I also thank you for allowing the people of Kanchibiya to contribute to the debate on this very important report. In debating this report, allow me to place it on record that we support its adoption.

Madam Speaker, allow me to address the challenges highlighted from pages 12 to 15, being the real challenges facing the media industry.

Madam Speaker, a diverse media industry is critical and very crucial to the dissemination of information as well as providing the much-needed checks and balances. At the risk of sounding as one who is practicing politics of braggadocio, …

Laughter

Mr Chanda: … allow me to note that in 2011, when the former Government, the Patriotic Front (PF) got into office, it found forty radio stations and five television stations. Within seven years, the number grew to 111 radio stations, and forty-two television stations were licensed at the time.

Madam Speaker, in saying so, it is important that we keep reminding ourselves of facts because there comes a time when society undergoes collective amnesia. Sometimes, it just happens and, sometimes, it is induced. So, we must keep reminding ourselves of facts, but also to benchmark ourselves going into the future in order for us to understand where we are coming from, where we are and where we are going. This report is critical if Zambia is to attain and realise its aspirations as captured in the Vision 2030.

Madam Speaker, your Committee made very courageous recommendations. One of the recommendations it made on page 21, is to put the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) under the ambit of the Independent Broadcasting Authority (IBA) Act.  This will be a gigantic step, if attained, because as it is, the private media is regulated by the IBA Act whilst the ZNBC regulates itself through the ZNBC Act. So, when the ZNBC falters, it becomes its own referee. If we are to level the playing field, it is important that all players in the industry are regulated by the same referee and it just makes sense that your Committee captured this particular matter on page 21.

Madam Speaker, it is also important to highlight the fact that the issue of the Freedom of Information Bill has been on the lips of many Zambians from 2002. There is every need to review and reconcile the provisions of the Official Secrets Act and the Freedom of Information Bill of 2002, in order to enact this Bill into law. In so doing, it is very important that we understand that this debate ought to move from the province of politics to understand what is it that is good for a free and an open society we seek to create as a Zambian people.

Madam Speaker, in opening and creating this open and free society, allow me to quote the former United States of America (USA) President, Mr John F. Kennedy, who said:

“The very word ‘secrecy’ is repugnant in a free and open society and, we, as a people, inherently and historically oppose secret societies to secret oaths and to secret proceedings. We decided long ago that the dangers of excessive and unwarranted concealment of pertinent facts far outweigh the dangers which are cited to justify it.”

Madam Speaker, there is every need that as the media undergoes serious transformation, –Information Communication Technology (ICT) has come on board and the media is not what it used to be. In the past, one person would communicate to the masses, but as it is, the masses communicate with the masses at the same time. The media has undergone this sort of change and we must be able to move with changing times.

Madam Speaker, it is important for me to state that in order for us to move to where we are supposed to be, we support the need for the media industry to self-regulate itself. It is also important that we continue to take information and access to information, by way of the media, closer to the people. On this score, it is important to mention that, in the last ten years, we saw the former Government take radio stations and television stations to all the ten provinces across the country. It is my prayer that the new regime will build on this foundation which has been laid so that when we look at what would have been done at the end of the five years, the people of Zambia will see that there was a commitment to build on the successes and the things that were working. As the wise have said, if something is working, do not fix it and if something is not working, you can fix that. So, a very solid foundation has been laid thus far.

Madam Speaker, it is important to pay critical attention to the conditions of people working in the media industry. Yes, we understand that the private sector is not having an easy time. It has to generate profits, have business and remunerate its journalists. However, it is also important that the journalists and their welfare is taken into cognisance as we talk about promoting and realising a thriving media industry.

What journalists get as the take home pay is something that would break our hearts. I pray that, going forward, there willbe political will by this august Houseto ensure that we create conditions of service for journalists out there as they play a critical role in disseminating information.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Sefulo (Mwandi): Madam Speaker, I thank the mover of the Motion, the hon. Member for Mulobezi. I support the report and the recommendations made therein.

Madam Speaker, first of all, I will comment specifically on online media space.

Madam Speaker, in this country, we have observed with sadness that there is abuse of online media space.  A week or two weeks ago, we were privy to a publication that was solely done to insult the Republican President. So, I agree with your Committeeon the need to strengthen the online media platform. Usually,you believe whatyou hear on the news, andon online media, there is a lot of misinformation. So, like stated in the report, we need to create strong media bodies that will bring to account online media publications.

Madam Speaker, I agree with the previous speaker who said that the former Government took radio stations to all the ten provinces. However, even if it did that, the challenge that was there was political interference.

Hon. PF Members: Question!

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Sefulo: Madam Speaker, that is very true. There was a lot of political interference when it came to media houses that were taken to the provinces. In as much as media houses should work with theGovernment of the day, they are supposed to report on facts.

Madam Speaker, in the report, your Committee said that it took note of the intimidation that existed. It stated that there was a lot of political interference and intimidation from the Ruling Party. However, we should not see such things in this New Dawn Government. In as much as we have opened up the media space, Zambians should take ownership of this freedom which they have been given. So, the abuse of the freedom that has been given should be taken care of.

Madam Speaker, cyber bullying is something that is also of concern. In the last Meeting, the hon. Minister of Community Development and Social Services issued a statement to tackle the issue of suicide. We need to make sure that we curtail cyber bullying by putting in place strong media bodies that will also ensure that there is control on what our children see online.

Madam Speaker, hate speech is also another thing that politicians –, let me say, they have managed to make sure that it occupies the media space.All they do is to make sure that they issue hate speech. In as much as we are looking at liberalising the media, we should also make sure that we enact strong laws against hate speech.

With those few submissions, Madam Speaker, I support the report.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: Today, it is for ladies.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Rev. Katuta (Chienge): Madam Speaker, thank you for giving mean opportunity, for the voice of Chienge to be heard on this very important Motion. I thank the mover and the seconder of the Motion.

Am I audible, Madam Speaker?

Madam Speaker: Youare audible, hon. Member, proceed.

Rev. Katuta: Thank you so much.

Madam Speaker, I just want to say a few words.

Madam Speaker, your Committee recommended that there be a body to regulate the distribution of advertising space among media houses.Most media houses are really struggling because they cannot make ends meet in terms of raising funds. As a result, journalists are paid peanuts or something that may just(inaudible) something that you cannot even talk about. I feel sad because I know (inaudible) in this industry.

Madam Speaker, in the past, when a media house was not in good terms with the Government of the day,it would be deprived of advertisements. Some big companies, which I cannot mention, would only advertise on certain media houses, which would benefit.Some media houses, like radio stations in rural areas,do not even have to access to big companies in Lusaka. Therefore, we should come upwith rules and laws to regulate how these companies should distribute their campaign messages or advertisements. This will help radio stations in rural areas like Kaputa, Chienge, Kawambwa, Mazabuka and other parts of the country, also feel part and parcel of the media.

Madam Speaker, we have a huge challenge in terms of dissemination of information.Some politicians would like to give out information to rural radio stations, but it is quite difficult to access them. We are not supposed to discuss ourselves – it is difficult for rural radio stations or media houses to access the information because the Zambia News and Information Services (ZANIS) has not been well equipped. So, it is very difficult for radio stations in rural areas to give information to the people of Zambia in these areas.

Madam Speaker, it was a good move for most areas to be empowered by being given radio licences but most radio stations are just there to entertain the nation instead of doing the actual work that media houses are supposed to do. Why isit so?This is because these media houses are not given an opportunity to access big companies, whichonly advertise at certain radio stations, making it difficult for some radio stations to operate.

Madam Speaker, I once again commend your Committee fordoing a very good job. However, we all want to access information but what kind of information should journalists access? We should not agree to enacting the access to information law. No. Even in the United States of America (USA), not every information is given to journalists.We should specify the kind of information that should be accessed. Itis not everything that is meant for public consumption. So, having that law cometo Parliament, would be the most welcome thing, but we should know the kind of information that journalists should access. We are not saying they cannot access information. Ifmedia houses are not well handled, they can bring down or build any Government in power. So,we should be very careful when talking about enacting this kind of law.

Madam Speaker, we have heard that the Bill was first brought on the Floor of the House in 2002. Why was it not enacted into law by any Government of the day? It is because there are implications.As much as we want people to access information, maybe, we should set limitations on the kindof information that should be accessed. Even in homes, children cannot enjoy everything just like that. So,it is very important that may be the law is crafted in a certain way, to limit certain kinds of information from being accessed. Wedo not want even outsiders to access the secrets of the nation in the name of accessing information.

Madam Speaker, with those few words, I thank you for this opportunity, and I urge the Ministry of Information and Media to find a way it can have advertisements equally distributed among media housesto empower them.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mtayachalo (Chama North): Madam Speaker, first and foremost, in supporting the adoption of this report, allow me to thank your Committee for having done a very good job, andthe report is an eye-opener.

Madam Speaker, a truly independent and free media is a catalyst of a democratic dispensation. Therefore, it is important that the media shouldbe allowed to operate in a very good environment. However, it is gratifying that post the one-party state era, we have seen the mushrooming of private media, which is very good, and asign of the growing of democracy in Zambia.

Madam Speaker, I am aware that this Committee came up with certain recommendations, especially on certain pieces of legislation which impede the growth of the media in Zambia such as the Preservation of Public Security Act, the Cyber Security and Cyber Crimes Act, theDefamation Act and the State Security Act, respectively. While these pieces of legislation are important in controlling the media so that individual liberties, rights, and national security are guaranteed, it is important that certain provisions in theseacts, which are very draconian, are amended in line with the current democratic dispensation.

Madam Speaker, your Committee also highlighted the issue of the Public Order Act. The genesis of the Public Order Acttraces back from 1955 when the colonial Government came up with this piece of legislation. This piece of legislation was meant to suffocate the rights of indigenous Zambians from advocating for independence. However, we still have this piece of legislation in our statute books even after being independent. I believe this piece of legislation must undergo radical changes so that the rights of individuals do not lie in the police. Currently, the Public Order Act gives power to the police to decide when you can assemble. So, I hope the hon. Minister of Home Affairs and Internal Security is listening to ensure that the Public Order Act undergoes radical changes.

Madam Speaker, coming from a trade union background, conditions of service for workers occupy a very special place in my heart. I have interacted with journalists from both the public and private media for more than twenty-six years now. Journalists work under horrible conditions, both in the public and private media. I think it is important that the Ministry of Labourand Social Security, working with the Ministry of Informationand Media, comes up with a minimum wage for journalists. Journalists are poorly paid. So, I want to see a situation in which journalists are paid handsomely.

Madam Speaker, I am alive to the fact that certain media houses abhor unionisation. Certain media houses do not allow workers to join trade unions. Therefore, the Government must come up with a punitive action against media houses that discourage the formation of trade unions in work places. I want to see a vibranttrade union that will be able to provide effective checks and balances. In the past, the Zambia Union of Journalists (ZUJ) used to be a very vibranttrade union, but I do not know what happened to it.

Madam Speaker, as regards the plight of the Times of Zambia, the Times of Zambia is dying a natural death. I am aware that more than forty workers have been given letters of redundancy, and, by 31^st July, they will be laid off. By 31^st December, a number of workers at the Times of Zambia would have been laid off. It is unfortunate that we have allowed the Times of Zambia, which has been operating in this country for many years, to die a natural death, and this is a very sad development indeed.

In conclusion, Madam Speaker, there are so many issues which the Committee highlighted, especially on newsprint and broadcasting equipment. Newsprint and broadcasting equipment are very expensive.My appeal to the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning is that we exempt tax on newsprint and broadcasting equipment in the 2023 National Budget, so that media houses can access this equipment, and that is the only way we are going to promote the growth of the media.

Madam Speaker, I also want to see a situation in which the Zambia News and Information Services (ZANIS) is present inall districts in this country. We do not have a ZANIS office in Chama and I am happy that the hon. Minister of Information and Media–we are goingto have an office very soon. My appeal is that that is done as quickly as possible. It is important that the people of Chama North have access to informationbecause they also deserve it.

With those few remarks, Madam Speaker, I support the adoption of this report.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Munsanje (Mbabala): Thank you so much, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, I wish to begin by thanking the Chairperson of the Committee onMedia, Information and Communication Technologies,Eng. Mabenga, and the seconder of the Motion, Hon. Lubusha.

Madam Speaker, thank you for awarding the people of Mbabala the opportunity to support the Motion on the Report of the Committee on Media, Information and Communication Technologies. We, the people of Mbabala, are veryhappy to support the report because the country has now seen an improved environment in as far as the media space is concerned.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munsanje: Madam Speaker, I actually thank His Excellency the President, Mr Hakainde Hichilema,and the Minister of Information and Media, Hon. Chushi Kasanda, for the excellent job because we no longer see the invasion of radio and television stations, and other media houses, …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munsanje:… something that became institutionalisedin the last few years. Cadres and other political hooligans would invade the media in the country and they had become part and parcel of its operations. However, since the New Dawn Government came into office, we have not seen cadres and other political operatives invade any media house.

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member!Please, withdraw the word “hooligans” and replace it with other one.

Mr Munsanje: I withdraw it, Madam Speaker, and I replace it with political operatives.

Madam Speaker, the environment that the New Dawn Government has created is what we need. However, we do not only need good people in office but we also need strong and good institutions to regulate and manage ourselves. As proposed in the report, there is a need to establish the Zambia Media Council and to come up with a self-regulatory mechanism. However, I want to state that self-regulation comes with a responsibility so much that the people who regulate themselves must be able to know that where their freedoms end, is where somebody’s freedom begins.

Madam Speaker, the sponsored video we saw of some young people demonstrates a level of irresponsibility where social media is used to insult and bring the name of His Excellency in bad standing to all of us. With that level of irresponsibility, the sponsors must be hunted down because that was not an independent action. That action was sponsored by people who are not happy with the freedom of association, freedom of assembly, freedom of talking and the other freedoms we are currently enjoying.

Hon. Government Members: hear, hear!

Mr Munsanje: Madam Speaker, the expansion of the media to all areas came under threat. Even a small radio station such as Macha Radio in my constituency was threatened with a letter of closure. That is how radio stations operated in the past few years, which was very sad.

Madam Speaker, we need to empower and support small radio stations such as Macha Radio and other community radio stations for them to operate nicely and bring out community news to the communities and broadcast programmes on agriculture, so that we lead development. Radio stations should also bring out information about sports and other things happening in the country. They should bring out information about policing and community policing for us whose cattle was stolen. That is what small radio stations in communities need to do. Community radio stations should talk about what is going on in every part of a constituency. For example, in Mbabala Constituency, they should talk about what is going in Mangunza, Mapanza and Simaobi as opposed to closing them on account of this and that bridge.  Never again should this country undergo such kind of behaviour.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munsanje: Madam Speaker, I also want to speak a little bit on cyber security and other national laws that, indeed, have been cited in the report, that need to be taken care of as the media self regulates itself.  We need to be conversant of laws that also depend on what the media can cover and what it cannot cover. Like I mentioned earlier, we need strong institutions to be headed by good people who are conscious of dealing with other human beings and need to take responsibility for what they are doing.

Madam Speaker, I want to remind the State about the closures that Muvi Television, Prime Television and others experienced. These stations today are a darling to a number of people who supported their closure. Such hypocrisy is what we talk about in this country and what we want to eradicate so that the country can be ruled in a straight manner; in a manner that brings about diversity and, indeed, is inclusive of everybody.

Madam Speaker, with those remarks, I rest my case and support the Motion.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.                             

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr E. Daka (Msanzala): Thank you very much Madam Speaker, for giving the good people of Msanzala this opportunity to debate on the media.

Madam Speaker, let me start by thanking the Chairperson and the seconder of the Motion.

Firstly, let me draw you, Madam Speaker, to page twenty-three of the report where your Committee talked about the poor conditions of service for journalists. It is important to note that the Government really needs to come up with a law which will provide for good conditions of service for journalists.

Secondly, Madam Speaker, I also want to highlight one key thing your Committee talked about, which is the harassment of journalists. Journalists are partners in development. They disseminate information that, we, as politicians, or the Government want to relay to our people. When journalists are harassed and vindicated, the relationship between journalists and ourselves is distorted.

Madam Speaker, let me mention one critical thing.Mostly, in the Government, discrimination is at par, because most journalists who go to participate in big events like where the President is officiating, need to, maybe, beg for them to be given credentials. However, if all media houses are treated equally, this would motivate them to disseminate information to who it is intended for.

Madam Speaker I also want to highlight one very important thing on the employment of journalists. Not every Jim and Jack in this country can masquerade as a journalist. As the report says, there should be a board to regulate and put some standards of qualifications for journalists, because others are just Disc Jockeys (DJs), then, the following day they become journalists. If such a board is instituted, it will help the industry to employ qualified and well-learned journalists.

Madam Speaker, finally, we also need to regulate the age group in the media fraternity because the media fraternity is the face of the nation. The information we give out to our people should build the nation, than information that divides this country. So, it is important that we look at the age group. Lastly, journalists must at least have basic knowledge.

With those few remarks, I thank you, and I support the report.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Mitete.

Interruptions

Madam Speaker: If he is not available, let us listen to another lady. The hon. Member for Kabwe Central.

Interruptions

Madam Speaker: Okay, she is not able to join. The hon. Member for Chama South.

Interruptions

Madam Speaker: It looks like the hon. Members are either – well, I do not want to say anything. We will have the hon. Minister of Information and Media respond.

The Minister of Information and Media (Ms Kasanda): Madam Speaker, I commend your Committee on Media, Information and Communication Technologies for its elaborate report and I thank all the hon. Members who have debated. I assure them that I have taken note of everything that they have debated about.

Madam Speaker, the report brings out pertinent issues. Among them are the following:

Access to Information Legislation

Madam Speaker, my ministry has taken note of your Committee’s observation. The New Dawn Government is committed to ensuring that the Access to Information Law is enacted. Currently, the ministry, in collaboration with the Office of the President and the Office of the Vice-President and with guidance from the Ministry of Justice, is studying laws that may be affected by the enactment of the Access to Information Law. To this effect, I will keep updating the august House on the progress regarding this matter.

Comprehensive Media Policy

Madam Speaker, my ministry has also taken note of your Committee’s observation on the media policy. The House may wish to note that one of the factors that led to the development of the Media Development Policy was technological advancements. Therefore, the Media Development Policy has already taken care of your Committee’s concern.

Zambia Media Council Legislation

Madam, my ministry has taken note of your Committee’s observation. The New Dawn Government, through my ministry, has received a layman’s Bill from the media fraternity led by the Media Liaison Committee for the enactment of the Zambia Media Council, by which the media proposes to regulate itself in Zambia. I have since submitted the Bill to the Ministry of Justice for processing towards enactment by this House.

Television Levy

Madam Speaker, my ministry has taken note of your Committee’s observation regarding the Television (TV) Levy. The Independent Broadcasting Authority (IBA) is mandated by law to collect the TV Levy. Further, the House may wish to note that the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) has no new system or mechanism for collecting the said TV Levy. Regarding the issue of increasing the TV Levy, the ministry is carefully studying the matter and will update the august House in due course.

Demotivated Workforce at the ZNBC

Madam Speaker, my ministry has taken note of your Committee’s observation. The House may wish to note that the demotivation of staff at the ZNBC is due to the financial challenges that the corporation has continued to grapple with. Therefore, what is required is to improve the financial position of the corporation. To this effect, my ministry is of the view that the ZNBC’s workforce needs to be rightsized and the House will be updated on this later.

The ZNBC to be Answerable to Parliament

Madam Speaker, we have taken note of that observation as well. The ZNBC is already answerable to Parliament as evidenced by the appearances it makes to Parliamentary Committees such as the Public Accounts Committee (PAC).

Public Order Laws Chapter 133 of the Laws of Zambia

We have also taken note of that, Madam Speaker, however, the House may wish to note that the ministry responsible for the application of the Public Order Act, to all the sections of the Zambian society, which include the media industry, is the Ministry of Home Affairs and Internal Security.

Public Media

Madam Speaker, the House may wish to note that the New Dawn Government has restored the editorial independence of the public media as promised when we were in the Opposition. We are all witnesses to the fact that the public media is now free to cover the Opposition.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Hon. Opposition Members: Question!

Ms Kasanda: On the advertising regulator, as a ministry, we have taken note of that as well. The House may wish to take note that, in 1991, Zambia transformed into a liberalised economy which meant all businesses would operate in accordance with market forces and the principle of the law of supply and demand. The media industry is also a business and should operate as such or else the country may drift back to the times of price controls.

Weak Media Bodies

Madam Speaker, my ministry agrees with your Committee’s observation. This is why the Government supports the proposed media self-regulation to strengthen media ethics and professionalism.

Tax Exemption on News Print and Broadcasting Equipment

Madam Speaker, my ministry has taken note of your Committee’s observation. The House is hereby informed that the ministry is studying the matter and consulting the Ministry of Finance and National Planning on the way forward.

Private Media Houses being Left Out by Presidential Entourage

Madam Speaker, my ministry has taken note of that also. The House is hereby informed that the status is no longer the same as the private media is now incorporated into presidential entourages.

Poor Conditions of Service

Madam Speaker, my ministry has taken note of your Committee’s observation. The House is hereby informed that my ministry is collaborating with the Ministry of Labour and Social Security to address the matter of poor conditions of service for journalists.

The Zambia News and Information Services

Madam Speaker, my ministry agrees with your Committee’s observation regarding the operational challenges that the Zambia News and Information Services (ZANIS) faces. To this effect, my ministry has been engaging various stakeholders including co-operating partners as well as the Ministry of Finance and National Planning for increased budgetary allocation to my ministry in the 2023 and future Budgets to deal with this matter, among others.

Madam Speaker, I assure this House that we have taken note of all that has been mentioned here and the IBA will be advertising frequencies very soon. My colleagues stated that the Patriotic Front (PF) Government laid the foundation of taking radio stations to all constituencies and I assure them that the United Party for National Development (UPND) Government will definitely complete what it started because it is the Government in office.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Eng. Mabenga: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Members who have supported this report. The hon. Member for Kanchibiya talked about the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) coming under the Independent Broadcasting Authority (IBA) and also talked about self-regulation. The hon. Member for Mwandi talked about online misinformation while the hon. Member for Chienge talked about the equal distribution of advertisements and also cautioned on the type of information which journalists need from us.

The hon. Member for Chama North talked about cyber security, the Public Order Act, the radical changes and the conditions of service for journalists. The hon. Member for Mbabala talked about the invasion of radio stations by cadres, and that that is no longer the case nowadays. The hon. Member for Msanzala talked about the poor conditions of services for journalists and the discrimination on presidential tours, which the hon. Minister has taken note of.

Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for supporting your Committee’s report and we wish the Bill will be brought to the Floor as soon as possible. Finally, I thank the Committee Members for the invaluable input to the report.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Question put and agreed to.

REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON NATIONAL GUIDANCE AND GENDER MATTERS

Mr Kamboni (Kalomo Central): Madam Speaker, I beg to move that this House do adopt the Report of the Committee on National Guidance and Gender Matters for the First Session of the Thirteenth National Assembly, laid on the Table of the House on Monday, 13^thJune, 2022.

Madam Speaker: Is the Motion seconded?

Ms Nyirenda (Lundazi): I beg to second the Motion, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kamboni: Madam Speaker, in accordance with its terms of reference as set out in Standing Order No. 197(g) and 198 of the National Assembly of Zambia Standing Orders, 2021, your Committee considered the topic entitled “The Welfare of Women and Girls with Disabilities in Zambia” and considered the action-taken report on its report for the Fifth Session of the Twelfth National Assembly.

Madam Speaker, since hon. Members had the opportunity to read your Committee’s report, I will only highlight a few concerns encountered by your Committee.

Madam Speaker, your Committee is very concerned that available statistics on persons with disabilities, including women and girls, are based on the 2010 Population Census, and the Zambia National Disability Survey of 2015. For example, despite the efforts by the Ministry of Agriculture to mainstream gender in its agricultural projects and programmes, the ministry does not possess statistics on women with disabilities. This has posed a challenge with regard to the equitable distribution of inputs and other interventions and mechanisms.

Madam Speaker, your Committee is of the view that solid statistics on persons with disabilities will ensure progress in all areas of policy-making and every stage of development and implementation of interventions and programmes. Your Committee, therefore, recommends that the Government establishes robust, reliable and comparable data on disability countrywide, which will take into consideration age, sex and disability in all socio-economic spheres for appropriate budgeting, targeting focus in programmes and other interventions.

Madam Speaker, your Committee is of the view that disability-based discrimination against, and degrading treatment of women and girls with disabilities will only reduce with the training of key service providers in both the public and private sectors. Your Committee recommends that there should be continuous training of law enforcement officers, health workers, legal aid service providers, lawyers and judges, among others, on gender and disability inclusion, especially in sign language, disability appropriate language and terminologies for the effective delivery of service. Your Committee further recommends that the Government should equip all officers working at one-stop-centres on sexual and gender-based violence with skills to effectively resolve matters related to women and girls with disabilities considering their multiple and inter-sectional discrimination.

Madam Speaker, your Committee observed, with great concern, that some pieces of legislation, such as the Penal Code Act, Chapter 87 of the Laws of Zambia, and the Criminal Procedure Code Act, Chapter 88 of the Laws of Zambia, still used offensive terminologies such as “imbecile” and/or “idiot” in relation to persons with intellectual or psychological disabilities. Your Committee strongly recommends that these sections in the two pieces of legislation should be amended to align them with those in Section (2) of the Mental Health Act, No. 6 of 2019.

Madam Speaker, your Committee observes, with concern, the non-mainstreaming of general and communication skills for the visually and hearing impaired in the different curricula which has posed a major barrier in the provision of services. According to Article 258(2) of the Constitution of Zambia, as amended by Act No.2 of 2016, a language, other than English, may be used as a medium of instruction in educational institutions or for legislative, administrative or judicial purposes. Your Committee recommends that the Government should consider recognising and promoting sign language as an official language to be used as a medium of instruction in educational institutions or for legislative, administrative and judicial purposes.

Madam Speaker, between 2018 and 2021, Kitwe Teaching Hospital, attended to 13,498 persons with disabilities. Your Committee learnt, with dismay, that the hospital received referrals from the northern region as well as former miners who were being served by mine hospitals. Your Committee recommends that a one-stop-centre, such as the Paediatric Centre of Excellence here in Lusaka, should be opened for persons with disabilities at Kitwe Teaching Hospital to facilitate a more efficient screening and therapeutic process.

Madam Speaker, as you are aware, your Committee undertook a benchmarking study visit to Mauritius for a comparative study on the welfare of women and girls with disabilities. Your Committee noted that Mauritius is the first country in Africa to legislate on corporate social responsibility. In that regard, Mauritius has set up the national social inclusion foundation, which is a central body for receiving and allocating public funds to non-governmental organisations (NGOs). The foundation operates under the auspices of the Ministry of Social Integration, Social Security and National Solidarity, which is similar to our Ministry of Community Development and Social Services, to receive, manage and allocate corporate social responsibility funds collected by the Mauritius Revenue Authority and other funds as may be appropriated by the Government, through the National Budget, for the support of persons with disabilities, among others.

Your Committee, therefore, recommends that Zambia put in place such a development and implement a framework which will ensure, for example, that the Zambia Agency for Persons with Disabilities (ZAPD) and other organisations for disabled persons are fully capacitated and adequately resourced to carry out programmes and projects.

Madam Speaker, in conclusion, I thank you and the Office of the Clerk of the National Assembly for the guidance and support services provided to your Committee during the session. I also thank all the stakeholders for their written and oral submissions.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: Does the seconder wish to speak now or later?

Ms Nyirenda: Now, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, I appreciate the mover of the Motion, to adopt the Report of the Committee on National Guidance and Gender Matters for the First Session of the Thirteenth National Assembly.

Madam Speaker, in agreeing with the mover of the Motion, I want to state that in our interactions with the witnesses who came along, one phrase that came out so strongly is that there is nothing for us, without us. Too much work has been done on behalf of the people who are disabled. Whilst the mover stated that the statistics of women with disabilities are not known, we met some very disheartening situations along our way, we, who were sent us to look at this very important issue.

Madam Speaker, as I support the Motion, I want to state that disability affects each and every person. As we are seated in this House, some hon. Members have left children who are disabled. During my interaction with one good hon. Member of Parliament, and due to confidentiality, I will not mention his name, he told me that both his mother and father are disabled, meaning that people with disabilities can have children, can become hon. Members of Parliament and, maybe, one day can be President.

Madam Speaker, there is a need for us, as Zambians, to support the Zambia Agency for Persons with Disabilities (ZAPD). The state of some offices we went to, particularly the one in Mansa, was very disheartening, as there were no desks and tables. Worse still, there are no permanent representative in some offices. In some instances, a teacher volunteers to sit in an office, to talk about the people and the challenges they go through.

Madam Speaker, as a woman, I understand the challenges that women face. However, women with disabilities go through triple challenges, firstly, as women, secondly, as people who are disabled, and, thirdly, as women living with a disability. Some women with disabilities have attained a level of education, but they cannot be employed today. At one of the colleges on the Copperbelt, we were told that there is a list of people with disabilities who have acquired diplomas and degrees. However, the private sector is not able to get them reason being they are people with disabilities and they have different rights such that when they commit a wrong, it will not be able to fire them. Having moved and looked around, it was quite disheartening.

Madam Speaker, low sensitisation on persons with disability is another issue. We became aware, after interacting with many of our people, that there is stigmatisation. The Chairperson talked about the use of offensive terminologies such as ‘idiot’ in relation to persons with intellectual or psychological disabilities. In today’s world, some people still tell a woman who is pregnant and disabled bad things such as “aba nabevebafunachanikomanibolemalakudala” meaning “what else does this woman want; Already, she is disabled and she is giving herself another task of carrying a baby.” There is a need for us as a nation to do something about people with disabilities because a disability can come biologically, through heredity, and through an accident.

Madam Speaker, I want to share with you the experience I had the time you saw me on clutches. When I arrived at the door, an officer told me that I could not go in the House. I told him that I was an elected Member of Parliament, so, why would I not go in the House and he told me that clutches are not allowed in the House because I can become violent and hit someone. Already it shows that even in your House, Madam Speaker, there is an issue of disability – rejection and stigmatisation.

Madam Speaker, when we went to the Lusaka Province Office, we found that there are no lifts and there is no provision of using a wheel chair.  Are the people who are disabled going to reach the hon. Minister? It is not possible. We went to the office of the hon. Minister for Copperbelt Province in Ndola, where there are only staircases. I appreciate the team I was with, because I was just recovering and I did not have enough strength to stand on my own.  The team held me and I thank Hon. Kamboni and the other team members who even said she has a third leg because they kept calling me. There is a need for us to make our buildings accessible to people with disabilities. In the public buses, which are affordable by any other person, there are no seats reserved for people with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, there is no specific policy and legal framework to address the welfare of women and girls with disabilities. Your Committee notes with concern that there are no specific policies and pieces of legislation addressing the welfare of women and girls with disabilities. For example, the National Gender Policy of 2014 makes no reference at all to women and girls with disabilities, whilst Section 21(2)(c) of the Persons With Disabilities Act No. 6 of 2012 simply provides that women with disabilities should have equal opportunities to participate in all walks of life.

Madam Speaker, the immediate budget allocation to the Zambia Institute of Special Education requires serious attention by us as the House.

Madam Speaker, with those very few remarks, I beg to move. I support this Motion with all my heart, with everything in me, and on behalf of the people in Lundazi.

I thank you, Madam.

Madam Speaker: I can feel your passion, hon. Member.

Mr Twasa (Kasenengwa): Thank you very much, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, I also appreciate the mover of the Motion for presenting this very emotional report, and the seconder who spoke so passionately about this report.

Madam Speaker, this report has highlighted so many important issues that affect our friends living with disabilities, especially the women and girls. This only goes to show that this report needs the Government’s support in totality and not in piecemeal, –

Madam Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1640 hours until 1700 hours.

[MADAM SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Twasa: Madam Speaker, I thank you, one more time, for giving the people of Kasenengwa this opportunity to add a voice to this very important Motion.

Madam Speaker, the people of Kasenengwa support in totality, the report presented on this subject matter. The people of Kasenengwa would want to see support from this Government in totality than in piecemeal. As alluded to by the seconder of the Motion, disability can be acquired at birth, biologically or hereditarily. So, it affects everyone or anyone. Therefore, we feel that this Motion should be supported in totality. The Government, non-governmental organisations (NGOs) and other stakeholders should hold hands and try to see to it that people living with disabilities are given maximum support.

Madam Speaker, it is very sad to note that such people are always stigmatised. It is worse for women and girls with disabilities. Like the seconder mentioned, we have seen this and we go through it. Women with disabilities get mocked when they are pregnant. Sometimes, even when they are trying to acquire education, they are asked questions such as “Mufunachani? Muzayenda kuti?”, meaning what do you want? How far will go? Why are you troubling yourself? What do you think this will do for you? Just go back home and stay. You are useless. You are nothing.” So, much as this affects people living with disabilities, it also affects their relatives and loved ones.

Madam Speaker, therefore, educating people on how to care for the people living with disabilities must be enhanced. Families who live with people with disabilities need to be counselled to encourage them and, they, and their neighbours, need to be taught how to care for such people within their environment and premises. In my personal capacity, I would have loved that there be a subject in schools to teach pupils how to coexist with people living with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, contrary to articles of the United Nations’ (UN) Convention on Rights of People with Disabilities, we have seen our friends living with disabilities being denied education, healthcare and financial support. They face a lot of stigmatisation even in other activities like sports. Most of them are denied participation. Talking about education, very few schools in this country cater for people living with disabilities. It is worse in rural areas, like us who come from Kasenengwa. If you live in Kasenengwa and you have a child with a disability, then, you are hopeless. You will not get anywhere. You just have to learn how to live with your disabled child or relative, and it ends there.

Madam Speaker, as we support this report, we wish the Government can come up with a deliberate policy to identify all the people living with disabilities. Some of them should be captured at birth, so that they can be tracked and followed at the time they are supposed to enter into school. They should be enrolled into school using the Government’s support and other stakeholders can come in to support them.

Madam Speaker, last week, there was a video trending on social media of a boy from Choma with no legs. When I saw that boy, I felt so sorry for him. I do not think he has even seen the inside of a classroom simply because of his disability. Children with autism, whether it is mild or serious, end up staying in their homes and do not see the inside of a classroom. I support this report and the Government must come up with a policy on the matter. It should even be in the Constitution. I know it is may be there, but we need strong laws that can, maybe, punish people who stigmatise people with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, the seconder of the Motion even attested to it that even in this House, an institution where rules are made, there is high stigmatisation. What more in the village where you find people who never went to school? For them, seeing someone without hands or legs is a taboo. If a lawmaker can be stigmatised, what more a child born in Mboza Ward in Kasenengwa or Shang’ombo?

Therefore, Madam Speaker, I feel that going forward, there be ramps at all learning institutions. All ambulances should have special facilities to cater for people with disabilities, for them to easily board the vehicles. All buses, taxis and many others should be equipped with such facilities to make it easy for people with disabilities. There should be ramps at health institutions so people with disabilities can easily access medical services. They do not need to wait for someone to lift them up the stairs.

Madam Speaker: Order!

The hon. Member’s time expired.

Mr C. Mpundu (Chembe): Madam Speaker, thank you very much for giving the people of Chembe this opportunity to echo a word on this important Motion.

Madam Speaker, the social exclusion of women and girls with disabilities can never be overemphasised. This exclusion is contrary to Article 6 of the United Nations’ (UN) Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities (CRPD). In this view, I will zero in on only two things; education and other professional bodies in Zambia, to be precise, the Engineering Institute of Zambia (EIZ).

Madam Speaker, the EIZ needs to look at its architectural works, in terms of the way it does its construction, in order to cater for people with disabilities. You will agree with me that many times when we move around towns, we see buildings that are not accessible by people living with disabilities. Even now, there are certain constructions going on, which are not looking at the angle of reducing social exclusion of our people with disabilities. It is time professional bodies came on board in order to help our people with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, most girls in rural areas cannot access education. In this view, the Ministry of Education should pave way for people living with disabilities in the existing schools or institutions so they can be enrolled in the same schools because all it takes is to employ teachers in special education and that will caution the burden of social exclusion of girls with disabilities.

In the same vein, Madam Speaker, the constructing of certain institutions specifically for people living with disabilities has a psychological impact on them because they feel marginalised. Hence forth, there is a need to construct institutions which even able-bodied people can have access to so that their interaction with people living with disabilities can improve unlike the way things are currently done. Just the fact that an institution is for people living with disabilities has a psychological effect on them.  This is something that needs to be looked at so as to reduce the social exclusion that has been in existence over time in our societies.

Madam Speaker, the report also talked about sign language. Sign language is a language that needs to be introduced in our school curriculum. Sign language has no line drawn on it. It has no tribe and colour; it strikes a balance. Even in our day to day living, when we are trading with our colleagues from other jurisdictions, before they learn our local languages, we first start communicating with the sign language. That shows us that sign language is critical and it should be enhanced in our curriculum, and this will lessen the social exclusion that has existed over time in our society.

Madam Speaker, with those few words, the Motion is timely and the people of Chembe support it, especially that in my constituency, there are many people living with disabilities, but they cannot access certain facilities. Therefore, the Executive needs to look at this matter. This report should not be put on the shelf and get dusty.

 I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Rev. Katuta: Madam Speaker, thank you, once again, for giving the people of Chienge this opportunity to have their voice heard on this very touching Motion.

Madam Speaker, I support the Motion and I hope it will not just end up being debated. I pray that the Executive will surely look into this matter urgently and bring it back to the House for us to change or make some amendments to our current law.

Madam Speaker, it is quite disheartening to see how, we, Zambians, have neglected people we believe are disabled. Most of the points I wanted to raise have already been raised by my colleagues. However, I will talk about schools for the disabled.

Madam Speaker, in Luapula Province, there is only Mambilima Special School. I do not think there is any other school for the disabled, and I stand to be corrected. We are supposed to have schools for people living with disabilities in every district. In Chienge, there is only one special education teacher at Kabu, where there are no facilities to help our children faced with this kind of challenge.

Madam Speaker, it is a pity that Zambians have taken this issue for granted. So, it is high time we took it seriously and made sure our children, brothers and sisters, feel like they are real Zambians. Even in universities, people living with disabilities are put together with the able-bodied people and they learn the same courses and do whatever they are supposed to do. I wish we could have universities specifically for people living with disabilities so they can learn at their pace.

Madam Speaker, there is a programme under the Ministry of Community Development and Social Services which takes care of the people living with disabilities. Through this programme, the Government tries to help such people and provides them with some farm inputs. Alas, these farm inputs end up in the hands of the able-bodied people. We should, therefore, come up with a very strict law that will lead to imprisoning those found with these inputs. Most of the disabled people in Chienge have complained to me that they have not received their inputs or the help they are supposed to receive from the Government. People who are not even physically challenged are the ones helping themselves. We should make the law stiffer in order to punish the ruthless people taking advantage of the disadvantaged.

Madam Speaker, on job opportunities, I applaud the United National Independence Party (UNIP) Government because we had a disabled hon. Minister named Mr Lazarus Tembo, may his soul rest in peace. We are supposed to see more people living with physical challenges in the Government. The Government should be the shining example as this will make society get rid of stigma.   

Madam Speaker, shops like Pick n Pay employ people who are deaf. I thank it for doing that because, even in South Africa, they do the same. However, we would want to see more institutions employing such people. I remember in the olden days where, the receptionist would be blind, and I am sorry to use that word, but nowadays,wedo not find any such people employed anywhere. We do not even see those books they call Braille. We used to see those books in the days of President Kenneth Kaunda, but you cannot find them anywhere now. Like the hon. Member of Parliament for Chembe said, we need to add this in the curriculum in our schools. It should also be one of the courses that each and every teacher should take so that they are able to interact with children with such challenges or those in the universities.

Madam Speaker, let me talk about sports. We have the Ministry of Youth, Sports and Art, and I am yet to see a tournament for people living with disabilities. In other countries, peopleliving with disabilities do not feel really challenged because there are sports that they can play. We do not have such sports for peoplewith disabilities in our country. It is very difficult for society to accept these people as normal people. I lived in South Africa for twenty years, and I would see people living with physical challengesplay hockey and all sorts of sports even in schools. So, we have to introduce such games. It is entirely up to us, as law makers, to decide to go this way and, in every school, there should be sports that accommodate children living with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, I also want to talk about the issue of people with disabilities accessing buildings, which some hon. Members have already talked about. There is a law which compels contractors, I think under the National Construction Council (NCC) Act, to put a provision for people living with disabilities to access buildings without difficulty. It is really difficult and a painful thing for people living with disabilities to access some buildings.

Madam Speaker, this is an emotional debate, and every mother or man should feel that this not the way we should not take care of women as well the youths with disabilities.I know we are talking about the challenges that girls with disabilities face but even a boy with a disability also faces these challengesin our society. I hope andpray that the Executive will bring a Bill that will help us change the perception that society has about people living with disabilities.

With those few words, I pray that a school for children living with disabilities will be built in Chienge because they have been deprived of education and it is their right to get that education.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Munsanje: Madam Speaker, thank you so much for giving the people of Mbabala this opportunity to debate on the Motion of the Report of the Committee of National Guidance and Gender Matters.

Madam Speaker, I commend this Committee for the report begins with arguments with an evidence-based approach. The report talks about issues of statistics, the legal and policyinadequacies, the challenges faced, opportunities and recommendations. In the past, we used to rely on the World Health Organisation (WHO) for statistics of estimating disability and it would be 10 to 15 per cent for countries, especially in our region. In the recent past, with support from co-operating partners, the Disability Study of 2015 was publishedin 2018 and that gave us full statistics in terms of the disability status in the country. This has shifted our disability prevalence from 2 per cent, which we used to quote according to the 2010 report and the WHO, to 10.9 per cent for adults, according to the report, and 4.4 per cent for children, and an overall of 7 per cent across the population.

Madam Speaker, this is now new evidence that uses an approved methodology from the WHO as well as the World Bank, in terms of those WorldBank questions and the United Nations Children's Fund(UNICEF) on measuring child disability. This helps us now, with this report, to ask the Government to take advantage of the census that is upcoming, this year or later, to ensure that we have sector specific evidence as the report calls for, for example, in agriculture, on agriculture and women with disabilities. The census is supposed to give us much more detail to go deeper into these issues so that we can be able to planproperly. The country’s planning will only be strong if it is based on very good evidence. As such, sector specific statistics will help us be able to plan properly for various interventions.

Madam Speaker, the report talks about equipping all workers with information on disability. I agree more around mainstreaming all levels of governmental and non-governmentaloperations to ensure that focal persons and other persons in these ministries support various activities that support persons with disabilities in terms of integration in line with the UN Special Rapporteur Report of 2018 that recommended in a similar manner.

Madam Speaker, on the recommendation of sign language, I would like to expand that we need appropriate communication,not only sign language, for the various categories of persons with disabilities like for those who use Braille, large print and other means of communication. The benchmarking tripto Mauritiusis an excellent demonstration of what a country can do to take care ofthose it deems need this kind of support.

Madam Speaker, I would like to echo the need to strengthen the Zambia Agency for Persons with Disabilities (ZAPD), and my sister got it wrong to say institute; it is the Zambia Agency for Persons with Disabilities, ZAPD. This agency needs support from this House in terms of appropriating much more funding to the Ministry of Community Development and Social Services, vis-a-vis, or via that ministry to the ZAPD, to ensure that the ZAPD can perform all its functions. The ZAPD is tasked with regulation, registration and monitoring of the disability sector, and delivering services to persons with disabilities. So, this is a mouthful that needs a lot of funding. I urge this House to ensure that more money is given to this ministry so that we can support persons with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, indeed, disability is not inability. As they say in my language, bulemabulaboolakoolanga. Each one of us can be disabled at any one time. So, let us do the best for persons with disabilities to ensure that when we have a disability, we can be able to enjoy equal opportunities.

Madam Speaker, I want also to cite the Mansa case. I visited Mansa two years ago, and I found that the computer was not working because the Data Integration Server (DIS) had been stolen. All this points to the lack of funding that the ministry was not enjoying previously. Today, this ministry, has had increased funding, and we hope that with the able Minister who is doing a wonderful job there, the ZAPD services we will be decentralised not only at the provincial level but also at the district level.

Madam Speaker, we also call for Community Based Inclusive Development (CBID) and integration at the community level. Instead of exclusion, in line with CBID, we should be talking about inclusion. We should no longer talk about special schools. We should be talking about inclusive schools that will accommodate everybody and ensure that persons with disabilities enjoy equal opportunities.

Madam Speaker, we need to take a systematic review of the disability life cycle for girls and women, and consider issues concerning adolescent females, teen girls, young mothers, adult females and the aged women, so that we are able to provide appropriate interventions. These interventions are what will help us deal with correct interventions for persons with disabilities. We should no longer talk about sheltered employment because persons with disabilities can do more. They are capable of doing anything, like you and me. They are no longer restricted to being in the telephone booth. That is sheltered employment.

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member! You have run out of time.

Mr Munsanje: I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Sefulo: Madam Speaker, thank you very much for allowing the people of Mwandi to add a voice to the topic at hand, which is very close to my heart, being a woman.

Madam Speaker, let me first categorically state that I support the Report of the Committee on National Guidance and Gender Matters. I also commend the team for addressing the topic on the welfare of women and girls with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, as other speakers have said, one of the challenges that girls and women living with disabilities face, is access to education. In Mwandi Constituency, or generally in the Western Province, right now, Sefula Secondary School is the only school that deals with children with disabilities, and that is where the late Mr Peter Kalumba Chishala went to. So, as the Ministry of Education considers building schools, we encourage it to ensure that it builds schools for people with disabilities. It is a challenge for someone with disability to move, for example, from Mwandi, to access education in Sefula, and that has remained a challenge, especially for most girls.

Madam Speaker, the second challenge is accessing medical care, especially in rural areas. This means that a girl child with a disability has to travel for kilometres and, because of the disability, it is difficult for her to travel and access medical care.

Madam Speaker, access to some buildings is another challenge for people with disabilities. Even here in town, it is very difficult for people living with disabilities to have access to some buildings, which is very sad. As many hon. Members consider building schools and health facilities in their constituencies, I urge them to make sure that they also respond to this challenge that has been posed to us when it comes to accessing buildings.

Madam Speaker, the other thing that is very close to my heart, which girls with disabilities are not excluded from, is teenage pregnancies. You will realise that access to sexual reproductive health information for people living with disabilities is still a challenge in our country. You will realise that most of the information that is given out there, is through print media and people living in rural areas such as Mwandi, have no access to this information at all. So, girls with disabilities are prone to teenage pregnancies and high infection rate because they do not have access to sexual reproductive health information.

Madam Speaker, another thing I would have loved to see in the report, which is not there, is the incorporation of disabled women and girls in the political reign.  As you have alreadyseen, it is difficult for women to get into politics and numbers do not lie. In 2021, less than 15 per cent of women were elected as Members of Parliament. So, it is difficult for women to be incorporated in the political reign, so, how about girls with disabilities. I think there are none.  So, we also want the playing field to be opened up for girls and women living with disabilities. We would also want them to have access to the political scene. I think this is one of the things that we should encourage. For us to attain a certain level of women and girls’ involvement in politics, we should have legislation that will be able to support women and girls with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, with those few words, I support the Motion.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Lubozha (Chifubu): Madam Speaker, on behalf of the people of Chifubu, I want to add a voice to the debate on the report of the Committee on National Guidance and Gender Matters.

Madam Speaker, many speakers who earlier debated, have said a lot on the challenges women and girls with disabilities are facing. In most cases, women and girls with disabilities are more vulnerable on the basis of sex and their disability, making them isolated, marginalised and prone to violence in mainstream society. This comes in the midst of a forest of legislation to protect, promote and defend the welfare of women and girls living with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, in view of this, women and girls living with disabilities are affected by several challenges, which are highlighted in the report, and one of them is accessing health services. Girls and women with disabilities do have not access to healthcare services, particularly those in rural areas. They travel long distances to access health services, which has been a very big challenge because already, they have disabilities. So, the increment of the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) must perform wonders, by putting up a very good number of health facilities in most constituencies so that girls and women living with disabilities can be able to access healthcare services.

Madam Speaker, the report also touched on the issue of stigma. Women and girls with disabilities are highly stigmatised to the level where they are sometimes viewed that they do not deserve to access reproductive healthcare services because people think their whole body is disabled, but they are entitled to these services. So, stigma affects women and girls living with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, due to customs and beliefs in some of the communities where they live, particularly in rural areas, they have always been the victims. For example, some believe that if you have the Human Immunodeficiency Virus (HIV) and you sleep with a disabled girl, you will be cured. So, they have been victims and these have been some of their challenges. So, we need information to reach these people and we need to protect them.

Madam Speaker, the mainstay of our economy today is agriculture and most women have ventured into it, but women living with disabilities have been marginalised in terms of accessing agricultural programmes and financing that can help them. In circumstances where they are able to access this, it has been very difficult to find markets where they can sell their agricultural produce as some satellite depots are closed in some areas and they have to travel long distances to go and sell their products. These have been some of the challenges faced by women living with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, women living with disabilities have also faced challenges even after acquiring the necessary academic and professional qualifications. It has been difficult for them to be recruited to key positions in most companies because of their disability. This has also been another challenge.

Madam Speaker, on access to justice, most women and girls with disabilities lack knowledge about their constitutional right that they deserve as citizens of this country. Police stations and court infrastructure are poorly designed without any provisions to cater for women and girls with disabilities. It is my humble appeal that modern courtrooms that will be constructed incorporate a provision for women and girls living with disabilities. Women and girls living with disabilities have very little information on the recourse available to them when they are faced with a crime and they are not aware of what they are supposed to do or where to report to. So, there is a need for more information to be provided to women and girls living with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, the Ministry of Justice, the Ministry of Agriculture, the Ministry of Education and the Ministry of Community Development and Social Services should work hand in hand to provide information and assist women and girls living with disabilities.

With those few remarks, I support the report.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms S. Mwamba (Kasama Central): Madam Speaker, I thank the mover of the Motion as well as the seconder.

Madam Speaker, may I begin by stating that if we all look around this House, everybody is very able, yet we still continue to call them persons who are disabled. Why do we not move to a more appropriate terminology and call them differently-abled persons? That is what we need to term them. We are all created fearfully and wonderfully by God so even those we term as persons with disabilities are actually just differently-abled persons and we need to continue using such a terminology so as to encourage them.

Madam Speaker, differently-abled persons are usually marginalised from political, social and economic opportunities. The left and the right had an adoption process, yet both sides did not consider that we need to cover everybody. The motto of the differently-abled persons is, “nothing about us without us”. No policy should be decided by any representative without full or direct participation of members.

Madam Speaker, do we have representation from differently-abled persons in this House? In our country Zambia, there are still people who feel albinos are a source of wealth. Albino children are usually hidden in their homes and do not attend school. Do we have statistics on them? Where are they? I remember growing up as a child, I was told that albinos do not die, and that they just go missing and, indeed, I have never heard of a funeral of an albino. Is it true that they do not die and that they just go missing because no one bothers to look after them? Mothers of these children do nothing because they have to constantly look after the children, who may be taken away for witchcraft.

Madam Speaker, the Government needs to come up with a deliberate policy for the differently-abled persons. Social workers need to be on the lookout. There are many differently-abled people in rural areas. In Kasama Central in particular, there are many differently-abled persons. Parents are afraid to come out with them. Parents are shy to expose their children because they feel as though there is something wrong. Some are neglected while others are not able to get proper medical care. We need to consider that they are human beings just like us, and need equal rights just like us.

Madam Speaker, there are many blind people at the traffic lights, especially near Kamwala. In some families, both the mother and father are blind and they remove their children from school, to take them to go and beg. We should have a policy that children of the blind must go to school and find other ways and means for parents to look after them because most of these parents are trying to make a living for these children.

Madam Speaker, there is a lady at the Manda Hill traffic lights, and I am sure each and every one of us drives past that lady. Has any social worker ever bothered to know what the problem could be? She might have a skill that she could work on. Why do we not encourage social workers to have a word with such people to find out how best we can assist them? Let us not just go on talking about differently-abled people. Let us make a difference in their lives. Let there be many deliberate policies that will encourage them and make them feel part of this country. Let them also know that they are Zambians and are entitled to everything that we are entitled to. Let them be entitled to free medical care. Let them be entitled to free education on a priority basis. Let schools also provide infrastructure for those particular girls.

I thank you, Madam Speaker, and I support the Motion.

Mr Tayengwa (Kabwata): Madam Speaker, thank you for giving me this opportunity to contribute to this Motion that has been raised. I also thank the mover of the Motion, Hon. Kamboni, and the seconder, Hon. Brenda Nyirenda.

Madam Speaker, this issue that has been raised of disabled girls and women in society is of grave concern. In my constituency, Kabwata Constituency, we realise that education is a priority, so, I will raise some things that the Ministry of Education will need to take note of.

Madam Speaker, there is a college in our constituency called the Zambia Institute of Special Education (ZAMISE). This college started operating many years ago and it is the only college that has been providing education to teachers who learn how to teach children with special disabilities.

From the time this college was put in place, it has been offering education up to college level, but the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) Government decided to upgrade it to a university. The construction works started in 2005 to about 2014 and it is at 78 per cent, but it never completed this structure. Today, the structure is a sorry site to look at. The institution provides education to people who train children living with special needs. So, there is an urgent need for the Ministry of Education to look at this infrastructure which was constructed many years ago and is still being vandalised. People living with special needs or disabilities need to be taken care of and given the best education that they deserve.

Madam Speaker, the issue of people living with disabilities is dear to my heart, especially that I have seen many people in society take advantage of these people. Some young ladies end up being defiled or are coerced over a K50 so that they can actually abuse them. So, there is an urgent need for the Ministry of Home Affairs and Internal Security together with the Ministry of Community Development and Social Services to come up with a policy that will help children living with special needs or the girls in society so that they can be given the protection they need.

Madam Speaker, I also want to talk about the issue of empowering people living with disabilities. In the past farming season or the past years, it was rare for people living with disabilities to be empowered, especially when it came to farming inputs. It is high time we considered these people. People living with disabilities are also human beings who can easily contribute to the growth of this nation.

Madam Speaker, in terms of acquiring loans or grants, I can confirm that in my constituency, Kabwata, – many speakers who have spoken did not mention that they have included people living with disabilities in the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) Committee. However, I can testify that I am one of the few Members of Parliament who has included people living with disabilities in the committee so that we can work together and we are going to achieve that.

Madam Speaker, the other issue I want to bring to your attention is that of people living with albinism. We have seen, in other foreign countries, that their body parts are exchanged with money. I hope and pray that this issue will not reach Zambia. The Ministry of Home Affairs and Internal Security should take keen interest in the people living with albinism. This issue needs to be taken with serious concern.

Madam Speaker, in conclusion, I support this report that was presented in this House and I ask that as we continue debating this matter – I pray that people living with disabilities are taken care of and are a priority in our national development plan.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

The Minister of Community Development and Social Services (Ms D. Mwamba): Madam Speaker, I am just coming from a conference regarding the people we are talking about. They are persons with disabilities. They are not living with disabilities. They are not differently-abled but persons with disabilities.

Madam Speaker, I would like to start by commending the Committee on National Guidance and Gender Matters for the comprehensive and well elaborate report on the welfare of women and girls with disabilities in Zambia. The issues raised and, subsequent, recommendations, were well thought through and give us a clear picture of some of the areas for improvement.

Madam Speaker, the observations and recommendations highlighted in the report, cover a number of areas which we will be responded to by my ministry in detail, through an action taken report. However, I would like to comment on a few major ones.

Madam Speaker, the first recommendation relates to poor funding of the Zambia Agency for Personals with Disabilities (ZAPD), a quasi-Government institution under the Ministry of Community Development and Social Services. The House may wish to note that the Government increased budgetary allocation to the agency in the 2022 National Budget from the previous allocation of K14,825,046 in 2021 to K16,089,346 in 2022. This is an effort to ensure that the ZAPD is well funded and its services are streamlined across the various sectors. The Government also embarked on the realignment of the operations of the agency considering many problems that existed as far as management is concerned. Improving accountability and transparency at the agency has been the priority of my ministry to ensure that resources are well accounted for as expected.

Madam Speaker, the second issue raised in your Committee’s recommendations is on the need for massive national awareness to educate communities and families on the rights of women and girls with disabilities. The ministry acknowledges the recommendation and wishes to state that ministerial programmes have specific components on sensitisation on gender, disability, sexual exploitation and child abuse. Therefore, communities are constantly engaged on such matters to reduce incidences of discrimination, neglect, maltreatment and exploitation, especially for persons with disabilities. Additionally, the Government, through my ministry, annually commemorates the National Day for Persons with Disabilities countrywide on 3^rd December to raise awareness on the rights of persons with disabilities. This is a platform for massive sensitisation on disability and the Government will continue using this important avenue.

Madam Speaker, the third issue raised is on disability statistics, and your Committee observed that they were outdated and not holistic. In acknowledging this concern, I wish to state that my ministry and the ZAPD, in partnership with the United Nations International Children's Emergency Fund (UNICEF) and other development partners, have developed a disability management information system to enhance management of information on disability across the country. The system enables us to register and keep track of all persons with disabilities and use this data set as a social registry for planning and programming. Further, considering that the country will hold a census exercise this year, more data will be collected on disability as the census questioner has taken disability as an area of priority.

Madam Speaker, I wish to acknowledge the concerns raised in the fourth recommendation, on the need for a Statutory Instrument (SI) to fully operationalise the provision in the Persons With Disabilities Act No. 6 of 2012 on the employment quarter system. The House may wish to note that my ministry has already drafted the SI on the employment quarter system for persons with disabilities and handed it over to the Ministry of Justice for final clearance.

Madam Speaker, the fifth issue raised is on the use of terminologies such as “imbecile”and “idiot” in reference to persons with disabilities in the Penal Code and the Criminal Procedure Code Act, and this has been noted. The ministry fully supports the Committee’s recommendation. The ministry, therefore, is prepared to make submissions so that such terms may be outlawed in all statutes. The ministry will seize the opportunity of the current law reforms of the Penal Code to ensure that this recommendation is implemented.

Madam Speaker, the Committee’s seventh recommendation on the need for the Government to consider recognising and promoting sign language as an official language to be used as a medium of instruction in education institutions or for legislative, administrative and judicial purposes is well noted and fully supported. Despite the fact that sign language has not been officially declared as an official language, there has been increased use and acknowledgement of sign language as witnessed on various public platforms. The ministry is committed to ensuring that more and more institutions adopt sign language to reduce the communication barriers especially for persons with hearing impairment.

Madam Speaker, the concern raised in your Committee’s report on recommendation number eight is well-noted. The ministry intends to review the Persons With Disabilities Act No. 6 of 2012 not only to attend to the issues raised in the recommendations, but also other emerging issues on disabilities. The Government, therefore, will strongly consider the submission by your Committee.

Madam Speaker, I acknowledge your Committee’s recommendation that the Government should consider financial and technical support to the National Vocational Rehabilitation Centre. For the centre to run effectively and efficiently, the Government, through my ministry, is progressively increasing finding towards the centre as evidenced from the 2022 National Budget.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Minister, your time is up.

Mr Kamboni: Thank you very much, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, surely, I am very grateful to all the ten hon. Members of Parliament who have debated. Firstly, I thank the hon. Minister for the contribution and assuring us that the report will be put into action. That is what we need.

Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for Kasenengwa, for the job well-done. Hon. Mpundu, the Member for Chembe, emphasised on sign language being put in the curriculum. There is nothing that beats that because all the signs on the road are not written in English. If they were written in English, the Chinese and the Spanish would not read them, and there would be terrible accidents. We use signs because signs are the universal language of the world, yet we do not learn about them. So, the hon. Member’s contribution is remarkable and very outstanding.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Chienge’s contributions are recognised and well appreciated. The hon. Member for Mbabala made a deep analysis and we are very grateful for his contribution. The hon. Member for Mwandi, as usual, supported the women and her contributions are highly recognised. The hon. Member for Kabwata was very emotional. The hon. Minister of Education is here; that university needs to be completed and I am sure he has heard. We greatly appreciate the hon. Member for Chifubu’s contribution, and all who debated. My seconder, Madam Hon. Nyirenda, made a good contribution and her contribution is highly appreciated.

Madam Speaker, before I finish, I am happy that the hon. Minister of Education and the hon. Minister of Health are here. As they allocate the 30,000 teachers, they should think of the people with disabilities. They should at least employ a few people living with disabilities. The Ministry of Health should do the same We request it to at least consider employing a few disabled people or any number it can manage in the ministry. It should also consider gender balance so that women and men are employed in these schedules of employment.

Madam Speaker, finally but not the least, I thank the National Assembly for giving us all the support for the report to be successful.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Question put and agreed to.

Madam Speaker: Order!

ADJOURNMENT

The Minister of Home Affairs and Internal Security and Acting Leader of Government in the House (Mr Mwiimbu): Madam Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

Question put and agreed to.

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The House adjourned at 1809 hours until 1430 hours on Thursday, 23^rd June, 2022.

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