DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE SECOND SESSION OF THE ELEVENTH ASSEMBLY

Tuesday, 2nd October, 2012

The House met at 1430 hours

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

_________

ANNOUNCEMENT BY MR SPEAKER

FORTY-EIGHTH INDEPENDENCE ANNIVERSAY ACTIVITIES

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members, I wish to inform the House that as part of the forty-eighth Independence Anniversary, the Ministry of Youth and Sport has lined up various activities, one of which is a football match between hon. Members of Parliament from the Ruling Party and the Opposition.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: This match is scheduled to take place at the Olympic Youth Development Centre (OYDC) on Friday, 19th October, 2012, at 1500 hours. The Ruling Party team will be co-ordinated by Mr Yamfwa Mukanga, MP, hon. Minister of Mines, Energy and Water Development and Chief Whip and Mr Stephen Kampyongo, MP, hon. Deputy Minister of Home Affairs while that of the Opposition will be co-ordinated by Mr Vincent Mwale, MP and Mr Munji Habeenzu, MP.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members wishing to participate in this match should therefore see their respective co-ordinators.

I thank you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

__________

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

56. Mr Mucheleka (Lubansenshi) asked the Minister of Agriculture and Livestock:

(a)whether the Government had taken any measures to revive the cashew nut sector in Western Province;

(b)whether the Government had analysed the cashew nut value chain in the province; and

(c)if so, what benefits would accrue to small-scale farmers involved in the farming of cashew nuts if the sector is revived.

The Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Livestock (Mr N. Banda): Mr Speaker, the Government has taken several measures to revive the cashew nut sector in the province and these include; the support to the Cashew Growers Association of Zambia in the acquisition of a new processing plant at a cost of K350,000,000 through a loan from the Citizens Economic Empowerment Commission (CEEC).

Sir, with support from the Government, the Cashew Growers Association of Zambia has imported 30,000 scions of improved varieties of cashew nuts from Mozambique to boost its production in the province. So far, 3,000 of the 30,000 scions have been brought into the country and have been grafted.

The ministry has been providing extension services to cashew farmers on improved production practices and facilitated the development of the National Cashew Development Strategy which gives direction on the reviving of the cashew nut sector.

Mr Speaker, the Government has analysed the cashew nut value chain. The major components in the cashew value chain are:

(i)agro support component – This will provide extension and phytosanitary services, germplasm improvement and qualify control;

(ii)production component – This is at production level and involves undertakings such as the establishment of nurseries, planting trees, management of trees, registering farmers and harvesting nuts; and

(iii)processing component – This is at the factory level for value addition. Some activities at this level include grading of raw nuts, roasting, peeling, packaging, distributing to wholesalers, retailers and final consumers.

Sir, when the cashew nut sector is revived, it will have the potential to produce 130,000 tonnes of cashew nuts annually in over a period of ten years, which can generate approximately K425 billion and create 10,000 jobs, as well as support over 40,000 small-scale farmers. Benefits to the small-scale farmers include the creation of jobs, income generation, poverty reduction and improved living standards.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mucheleka: Mr Speaker, arising from that answer given by the hon. Deputy Minister, may I find out why the cashew crop is not one of those crops which the hon. Minister said would be supported in the 2012/2013 season. Why have they left out cashew nuts particularly for the small holder farmers in Western Province as a means of taking them out of poverty?

The Minister of Agriculture and Livestock (Mr Chenda): Mr Speaker, in our process of diversification, we have begun with cotton, groundnuts and sorghum. As we go forward, we will begin looking at crops that are suitable within certain localities so as to promote their productivity and in this case, if it is proved to be economical for us to support cashew nuts in the Western Province, that will be done.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Ms Imenda (Luena): Mr Speaker, I am aware that the cashew nut trees, which are currently grown, are already diseased because of lack of a market and negligence in as far as nurturing them is concerned. I would like to know how many new trees have so far, been planted and what the Government intends to do with the current trees that are diseased?

Mr Chenda: Mr Speaker, in my reply, I stated that we had imported 30 000 scions from Mozambique, which are being grafted, so as to improve the quality of their parent tree. The diseased parent trees will be cut and the new scions that have been brought in will be grafted to the parent tree, which will result in value addition, thus making the plant more productive.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Muntanga (Kalomo Central): Mr Speaker, the growing of cashew nut trees in the Western Province has been developed in a big way. The only problem has been marketing the nuts. I would like to find out what marketing strategy the Government has put in place to ensure that this particular industry is supported.

Mr Chenda: Mr Speaker, the cashew nuts production in the Western Province is being driven by the private sector and we, as a Government, have not put in place any mechanisms to provide marketing facilities. The demand for cashew nuts in this country is much higher than the supply. So, this issue will be handled properly by the markets.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mufalali (Senanga) Mr Speaker, may I know the market value of cashew nuts on the world market.

Mr Chenda: Mr Speaker, unfortunately, I do not have that figure with me here, but if the hon. Member still wishes to have it, we will be able to check and avail him that information.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Ntundu (Gwembe): Mr Speaker, if I recall very well, an hon. Deputy Minister who was then responsible for commerce and trade, once told this House that the Patriotic Front (PF) Government had strategies to ensure that it provided a market for all the fruits and crops grown in Zambia. Now, I am wondering whether that hon. Minister (pointed at the hon. Minister) who is now …

Mr Speaker: Do not point your finger at him

Laughter

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, I am now wondering who is telling the truth between the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Livestock and the former hon. Deputy Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry.

Mr Chenda: Mr Speaker, I do not know who is telling the truth, but all I can say is that, as things stand presently, the demand for cashew nuts on the market is much higher than what we, as a country, are able to produce. This situation will be taken care of by the market forces and, so, there is no need for us to intervene. 

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Musokotwane (Liuwa): Mr Speaker, I recall the PF Government indicating that one of their strategies for developing agriculture in this country was to look at crops’ specific advantages, province by province and design strategies for that. Twenty per cent of the PF mandate is already gone and so, I would like to find out when the Government is going to implement this strategy of diversifying our agricultural sector according to regional advantages.

Mr Chenda: Mr Speaker, the process has already begun. That is why in this year’s Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP), we have included additional crops such as cotton, groundnuts and sorghum. It is a continuous process and we will continue to implement this programme.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Miyutu (Kalabo Central): Mr Speaker, I have listened attentively to the hon. Minister who has emphasised the issue of the demand for cashew nuts as well as the market being readily available. Owing to the fact that the Western Province is known to be one of the poorest provinces in this country, why can the Government not offer practical support to the farmers by coming in directly to help those poor people who have no ability to drive the market?

Mr Chenda: Mr Speaker, I did not say that there is no problem in as far as marketing is concerned. The demand much exceeds the supply by far and, therefore, there is no need for the Government to intervene.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Habeenzu (Chikankata): Mr Speaker, how is the Government going to advance the growing of cashew nuts since he has told this House that there is no marketing strategy that has been put in place?

Mr Chenda: Mr Speaker, our concentration has been to, firstly, provide extension services and training to the farmers so that they can improve their productivity. We do not need to intervene in the market because the farmers are able to sell their cashew nuts even without the Government’s help.

I thank you, Sir.

HISTORICAL SITES IN MUCHINGA PROVINCE

57. Mr Sichula (Nakonde) asked the Minister of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs:

    (a)    when the Government would recognise the following historical sites:
    
    (i)    Mwenzo in Muchinga Province; and

    (ii)    The burial site for Zwangendaba; and

    (b)    if the two sites would not be recognised, what the reasons were.

The Deputy Minister of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs (Mrs Kawandami): Mr Speaker, Mwenzo in Muchinga Province is a historical site recognised by the Government and is recorded as such in the National Register of Zambia’s Heritage and is protected by CAP 173 of the Laws of Zambia.

Sir, the burial site of Zwangendaba is also a recognised historical site and registered in the National Register of Zambia’s Heritage and protected by CAP 173 of the Laws of Zambia.

Mr Speaker, considering the above answers, the question in (b) does not apply.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Sichula: Mr Speaker, why are these sites not protected by the National Heritage Conservation Commission?

Mrs Kawandami: Mr Speaker, that is a supplementary question …

Interruptions

Mrs Kawandami: … and I will give an answer. Why are you murmuring?

Laughter

Mrs Kawandami: The National Heritage Conservation Commission (NHCC) maintains a national register listing heritage sites under its care and the care of others, as well as those under nobody’s care. This is the official list of Zambia’s heritage sites worthy of conservation. Sites listed in this register include places, buildings, structures and immovable objects that are nationally significant to Zambia’s natural and cultural history, that is, architecture, archaeology, engineering, ecology, gemmology, palaeontology and culture are protected by Cap. 173 of the Laws of Zambia.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwanza (Solwezi West): Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister to tell us where the burial site of Zwangendaba is. 

The Minister of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs (Professor Luo): Mr Speaker, one would expect an hon. Member of Parliament seated in this room and representing the people of Zambia to know the burial site of Zwangendaba.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: That is her expectation.

Laughter 

Professor Luo: Mr Speaker, I think that it is important to put it on record that we expect people who are part of the leadership of this country to know where the burial site of Zwangendaba is. We, however, invite the hon. Member of Parliament who does not know Muchinga Province to see where the burial site of Zwangendaba is. 

In fact, let me take this opportunity to also say that heritage sites actually have the potential to promote tourism. Therefore, if we are looking for development in this country, it is very important that we do not wait for somebody to protect the sites or tell us where they are. We should start being discoverers. Why should we wait for Vasco Da Gama or David Livingstone to come and find our natural wonders? So, if hon. Members of Parliament visit Nakonde, they will be able to find the burial site for Zwangendaba.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi (Namwala): Mr Speaker, how many heritage sites do we have in Zambia since the hon. Minister is very knowledgeable?

Interruptions 

Professor Luo: Mr Speaker, let me take this opportunity to inform hon. Members of Parliament that nobody in Zambia actually knows the number of heritage sites in the country.

Interruptions 

Professor Luo: Mr Speaker, that is true because heritage sites get discovered and Zambia is still …

Interruptions 

Professor Luo: Can I have your ears, hon. Members.

Mr Speaker: Order! 

Let us have order.

Professor Luo: Zambia, like many other countries, is still discovering heritage sites. Heritage sites can be either natural or cultural. What is happening all over the world is that historians and archaeologists are going around countries to discover new sites. In fact, in Ministry of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs, the most learned members of staff are those in the NHCC simply because we need many highly-qualified and skilled people to be able to discover heritage sites.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Chituwo (Mumbwa): Mr Speaker, my gallant people of Mumbwa would like to know how many heritage sites have been listed and recognised by the Government so that they can be turned into attractive tourist sites.

Professor Luo: Mr Speaker, how I would love some of the hon. Members of Parliament present here to bring to the attention of the Government the heritage sites they have in their respective places because some of the sites …

Interruptions 

Mr Speaker: Order! 

Professor Luo: … are hidden. An example that I would give is that of shrines. Shrines are rich in traditional heritage and it would be good if hon. Members of Parliament who know about them could bring them to our attention. We, in the ministry, are working very hard to discover more sites.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker: Hon. Minister, the question was about how many heritage sites are listed.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Luo: Mr Speaker, that is a new question …

Hon. Opposition Members: No!

Professor Luo: … and, for the information of the hon. Members, I would like to issue a ministerial statement to the House on the number of sites that are listed.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mbulakulima (Chembe): Mr Speaker, for the sake of my children who come from Muchinga and are learning civics, what is the place where Zwangendaba is buried called and where is it, specifically?

Professor Luo: Mr Speaker, I said that the burial site for Zwangendaba is in Nakonde.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mwiimbu (Monze Central): Mr Speaker, if I heard the hon. Minister correctly, she indicated that some of the most learned members of the public are in her ministry. I am also aware that only lawyers are learned. Therefore, how many lawyers are in that ministry because people in other professions are educated?

Laughter 

Mr Speaker: I will not require the hon. Minister to answer that question.

Laughter 

Professor Lungwangwa (Nalikwanda): Mr Speaker, clearly, from the responses being given by the hon. Minister, there is a deficiency of knowledge in her ministry.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: Being a new ministry, that is understandable. However, is the hon. Minister thinking of establishing a research department in her ministry, which will provide the necessary information to the public?

Professor Luo: Mr Speaker, I would like to just remind our hon. Colleagues that this is not a new ministry. It has been in existence for one year, and one aspect of its significance is that it has a research unit. As I speak, we have our staff from that unit going around the country documenting some of the information that we need for the ministry’s development and future activities.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

UNBUDGETED FOR EXPENDITURE IN 2012

58. Mr Simbao (Senga Hill) asked the Minister of Finance by how much the 2012 National Budget was expected to be overrun due to the following unbudgeted for expenditure:

(a)salary increments for Public Service workers;

(b)private trips abroad undertaken by His Excellency the President and his entourage;

(c)creation of new ministries and, subsequently, new positions; and

(d)the firing and hiring of diplomats, Permanent Secretaries and District Commissioners.

The Deputy Minister of Finance (Mr Sampa): Mr Speaker, the cost of the 2012 wage increase for Public Service workers was about K1, 542.2 billion. This was against the 2012 Budget allocation of K590.2 billion, thereby, leaving a shortfall of K952 billion. In order to meet this shortfall, the Government solicited for funds by declaring savings from within the 2012 Budget. The hon. Minister will soon be coming to this House to seek approval of this budget in line with Article 115 of the Republican Constitution. In view of the above, the Government is not anticipating a Budget overrun as a result of the 2012 wage award to the public servants.

Mr Speaker, the cost of all of the private trips abroad by the President and his entourage are not financed by the Treasury. The Treasury only finances costs related to the President’s official trips, both local and abroad. Therefore, there is no anticipated budget overrun due to costs incurred by the President’s entourage on his private trips.

Sir, the Government has merged more ministries than it has created. Further, its strategy to save on staff-related costs in the newly-created ministries has been to redeploy members of staff from both abolished and existing Government structures to the new ones. In view of this, the Government is not anticipating a budget overrun in the 2012 Budget as a result of the creation of new ministries. 

Mr Speaker, the Government has spent about K51.1 billion on facilitating the transportation of recalled, posted and transferred diplomats to various Zambian missions abroad in 2012. By the end of 2012, the Government expects to spend K71.2 billion on this exercise. 

Further, Sir, the staff replacements at Permanent Secretary and District Commissioner levels is an on-going exercise in the Public Service for which the Government always budgets for partial gratuities and other contract terminal benefits under the Ministry of Finance. These costs are always in the budget. That said, very few replacements of human resource have occurred at these two levels in 2012. As such, the Government expenditure on this item is expected to remain within the annual projected levels.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister able to convince me and this House that the private trips undertaken by his President are not funded by the Government? Is he able to lay on the Table of the House evidence of the funds that are used on the President’s private trips?

Mr Speaker: In all fairness, such questions cannot be answered in the manner proposed and the reason is obvious. 

Is there any other question?

Mr Simbao: Mr Speaker, we have had many officials retired in national interest, except for the Permanent Secretary who was retired yesterday. For the many others who have been retired, was their retirement budgeted for? If so, how much was it and how much of that has been spent?

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members, let us restrict ourselves to one question.

Mr Sampa: Mr Speaker, budgets always have contingency funds and such measures are budgeted for, anyway. It is not anticipated that one hon. Minister at the beginning of the budget year will still be the one at the end. There are usually changes and those are always factored into the budget. They are always in the budget.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mpundu (Nchelenge): Mr Speaker, may the hon. Minister confirm that the avoidance of the budget overrun is, clearly, an indication of the PF Government’s prudent financial management.

Mr Livune: Question!

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: I think that is a rhetorical question.

Laughter

Mr Mucheleka: Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister indicate, in percentage terms, the projected budget overrun given that we have witnessed a number of unplanned activities that have been funded. 

Mr Sampa: Mr Speaker, matters of figures need research. I cannot just produce them off-the-cuff. However, as we said, overall, we will not know the position until the end of the Budget year. I must hasten to mention, though, that this Government has been very prudent in the management of finances.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sampa: The Government is cutting costs everywhere. For instance, speaking for my hon. Minister, when we are going for a meeting, we do not even use two cars, but go in his car, including the Secretary to the Treasury, in the quest to save costs. Overall, you will see that there has been a major cost-cutting exercise.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Pande (Kasempa): Mr Speaker, have all the DCs who were either fired or retired been paid their terminal benefits? If not, what is the reason for not paying them?

Mr Sampa: Mr Speaker, that is a new question and I will need to investigate in order to bring to the House precise figures. However, I must mention that most are being paid. It is a gradual process and I know that, even in the new Budget, we will factor in such issues. The same applies to the people in the Diplomatic Service. Some have had their payments delayed deliberately because we want those figures factored into the new Budget, which will be brought here for approval.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Livune (Katombola): Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister bring me and the House to speed as to whether the K51.1 billion he mentioned in his answer to part (d) of the question is the sum of both the settling-in and retirement benefits to the diplomats.

Mr Sampa: Mr Speaker, for those who have been paid, it is the entire amount, which is for repatriation and benefits. For those who have not been repatriated, nothing has been paid to them. In principle, I can confirm that it covers everything. We do not pay partially when people have been asked to vacate office. Everything due is paid to them.

I thank you, Sir.

ZESCO EMPLOYEES

59. Mr Mushanga (Bwacha) asked the Minister of Mines, Energy and Water Development:

(a)    what the number of employees at ZESCO Limited was, as of June, 2012, and

(b)    of the total number, how many were in the following categories of employment:

(i)    senior management;

    (ii)    middle management;

(iii)    unionised employees; and

(iv)    casual workers.

The Deputy Minister of Mines, Energy and Water Development (Mr Zulu): Mr Speaker, as at June, 2012, the total number of employees at Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (ZESCO) in the mentioned categories was 11,152.

Mr Speaker, the breakdown of the different categories is as follows: 

        Category            No. of Employees

Senior management     291 
Middle management     1,133 
Unionised employees     3,363
Casual employees     5,029 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mushanga: Mr Speaker, certain parts of this country have been experiencing load shedding. As I ask this question, there are some parts of Lusaka …

Mr Mwango: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Mwango: Mr Speaker, I rise on a very serious point of order. The National Assembly Members’ Handbook, 2006, on page 22 says: 

“Members should not tear documents in the House in protest.”

Further, Mr Speaker, The Post newspaper issue No 5,827 of 1st October has a headline that reads, ‘MMD won’t take UPND’s insincerity – Kaingu.’

Mr Speaker, the newspaper article reads, “Michael Kaingu has likened the MMD and UPND disagreement over the Mufumbwe Parliamentary seat to two mothers in the Bible who wanted to tear a baby into two parts ….”

Mr Speaker, page four of the same paper further reads, “He said during a live phone-in programme on Mazabuka Radio that the working relationship between the two parties risked being spoiled if the UPND decided to float a candidate for the November by-election in Mufumbwe.”

Mr Speaker, another paragraph on the same page reads, “Responding to callers’ comments, Kaingu said he had no regrets for tearing the speech because the copy he tore was not the one the Republican President read when he officially opened Parliament.”

Mr Speaker, last week, before the House started debating the President’s Speech, you gave guidance relating to this matter. Is Hon. Kaingu, a senior Member of Parliament, in order to go on radio and discuss matters which are before the Parliamentary Committee on Privileges, Absences and Support Services? I need your serious ruling, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwango laid the paper on the Table.

Mr Speaker: Order!

Hon. Members, I would like to indicate to the House that this matter has already been referred to the Committee on Privileges, Absences and Support Services. It would be highly inappropriate for me to begin issuing rulings or comments on a matter that has been referred to the appropriate committee. This matter will be dealt with with despatch. I urge you to maintain patience. Let us give the appropriate body the opportunity to acquit itself with the matter. There shall be no more reference to this matter until the Committee on Privileges, Absences and Support Services has dealt with it. 

The hon. Member for Bwacha may continue.

Mr Mushanga: Mr Speaker, I said that a number of places in Zambia have been experiencing load shedding. As I pose this question this afternoon, there are places in Lusaka and Kabwe that are experiencing load shedding. Last week, this House experienced power failure three times. That is testimony enough that this problem of load shedding is very serious. In line with the feedback given by the hon. Minister, I want to know if the workforce at ZESCO is able to supply power countrywide, especially to seriously-affected areas.

Mr Zulu: Mr Speaker, yes, it is regrettable that the country is experiencing load shedding once in a while, and here and there.

Hon. Opposition Members: Question!

Mr Zulu: Mr Speaker, the current capacity of our generators is 1,600 megawatts. However, we need 1,850 megawatts. Therefore, we have a shortfall of 250 megawatts at peak hours. If we overuse these generators, they will blow up and we will have no power. That is why we experience load shedding. This load shedding has nothing to do with the number of workers. Meanwhile, the Government is putting measures in place. By the end of next year, load shedding will be a thing of the past. We have Maamba Collieries which will give us 300 megawatts.

Interruptions

Mr Zulu: We also have the Itezhi-tezhi, Kariba North Bank and Kafue power projects. We will even start exporting power.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mbewe (Chadiza): Mr Speaker, the Patriotic Front (PF) Government (pointing at hon. Government Members)…

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

It seems you have joined the hon. Member for Gwembe. 

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, yes.

Mr Speaker: Order!

Please, desist from pointing fingers.

Laughter

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, the PF Government promised to create jobs and put more money in people’s pockets. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Yes!

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, earlier, we were told that about 5,000 workers are employed as casual workers at ZESCO. Is the Government going to employ the casual workers on a permanent basis?

Mr Zulu: Mr Speaker, of course, ZESCO is putting measures in place to ensure that all the casual workers are employed on a permanent basis.

Mr Simfukwe (Mbala): Mr Speaker, from the answer given by the hon. Minister of Mines, Energy and Water Development, there have been several complaints that inefficiency at ZESCO is the major cause of blackouts, does the Government have any plan to unbundle ZESCO so that transmission, generation and distribution are handled separately. 

Mr Zulu: Mr Speaker, the Government has no plan to unbundle ZESCO.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kazonga (Vubwi): Mr Speaker, if I heard the hon. Minister correctly, the response to part (a) of the Question was the figure 11,152. The hon. Minister can confirm other wise. For part (b) of the Question, the figures given for categories of employees were 291; 1,133; 3,363 and 5,029.

Mr Speaker, can the hon. Minister harmonise these figures because the numbers given for each of the categories do not add up to 11,152. Did I get the figures right?

The Minister of Mines, Energy and Water Development and Chief Whip (Mr Mukanga): Mr Speaker, we answered part (b) of the Question according to the categories we were given. One of the categories not mentioned in the Question is temporary employees. So, we also have a figure for temporary employees at ZESCO, which is 1,336 which will add to the other categories.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mumba (Mambilima): Mr Speaker, out of the 1,424 workers in managerial positions, I would like to know what percentage of this are women.

Hon. Women Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, if that information was requested for in the main Question, we would have answered it. However, we will try and get this information.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Katambo (Masaiti): Mr Speaker, from the 291 senior management employees at ZESCO Limited, do we foresee some of them being fired?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, we are not in the business of firing people without any reason.

Hon. Opposition Members: Question!

Mr Mukanga: If an employee commits an offence, yes, he/she will be fired, …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Mr Mukanga: … but we are not going to fire people who are doing a good job.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, may the hon. Minister clarify the issue of the 5,000 employees that they intend to take on permanently. There are some casual workers who clear the way links. Are they also included in this plan? 

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, no. Those are temporary workers. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that 291 workers were in senior management. Now, when the new Managing Director for ZESCO was appointed, he fired some workers. How many workers were fired out of this number?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, that is a new question.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, recently, ZESCO applied for a tariff increase to the Energy Regulation Board (ERB). I would like to know whether one of the major reasons ZESCO is requesting the ERB to increase the tariffs is the huge wage bill that is attributed to it, as a result of the large number of employees.

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, that is not the reason ZESCO is trying to increase the tariffs. If anything, it is trying to engage all stakeholders so that we make them understand why tariffs should be increased.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Miyutu: Mr Speaker, may I seek clarification over casual and temporary workers.

Mr Speaker: Order!

What clarification?

Mr Miyutu: Mr Speaker, what is the difference between casual and temporary workers, according to ZESCO?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, the difference is that the casual employees are unskilled and are paid on an hourly basis while temporary workers are skilled or have a trade. They are paid on a monthly basis. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Speaker, Lukulu is not connected to the national grid. It is on thermal power, but it is also experiencing load-shedding. For example, there are times when there is no power from 2300 hours to 0500 hours. Why is it like that?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, although the question was not on load-shedding, I will state that Lukulu is not connected to the national grid. It is on a generator. This is the reason it cannot be running throughout. It requires to be maintained, checked and to rest because it is a machine. However, we will soon connect Lukulu to the national grid.

I thank you, Sir.

Ms Imenda: Mr Speaker, regarding the issue of load-shedding attributed to the deficit in power or the shortage in mega watts, may I know whether ZESCO is exporting power and what necessitates that if we already have a deficit in this country.

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, that is a new question, but I will state that when it comes to contracts, we always honour the contracts that we enter into even when we have a problem.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mucheleka: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that the Government had no intention of unbundling ZESCO. However, one of the arguments given even by the World Bank is that some of the inefficiencies that are in the energy sector could be as a result of ZESCO having the monopoly of generating, transmitting and distributing power. Are you then saying that we shall continue experiencing these inefficiencies and that the customers have to pay for those inefficiencies by regular adjustment of the ZECSO tariffs?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, the main question that we are discussing is labour or the number of employees. The hon. Member is asking a new question. If you want that question to be addressed on the Floor of the House, bring it forward and we will give you the answers.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Ndalamei (Sikongo): Mr Speaker, in answering the question, the hon. Minister said that Lukulu would be connected to the national grid very soon.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order!

You will not hear what the hon. Member is saying if you are making noise.

Laughter

Mr Ndalamei: How soon will it be connected to the national grid?

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, we were discussing this question the other day. It was asked on the Floor of the House and we answered it. We are still committed to the answer we gave you last time. 

Sir, this question is talking about labour. So, ask me about employees and I will answer.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mweetwa (Choma Central): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister said that the Government is looking at modalities of assimilating the 5,000 casual employees into the workforce of ZESCO. I think the Government was responding to the need for job creation. Was it doing it as a requirement for economic enterprise reasons for ZESCO, the viability of the running of ZESCO or trying to satisfy a campaign promise by the PF Government?

Hon. Government Members: Question!

Hon. Opposition Members: Just answer!

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, when it comes to campaign promises, people should understand that the PF Government is as committed as ever. We are fulfilling whatever promises we made during the campaign.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, yesterday, I was launching a project to supply power to Luangwa and Rufunsa districts. That is a PF campaign.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mukanga: The other day, the President launched the 8,000 km Road Programme. That is a PF campaign.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, what I am trying to say is that we have all these promises that we are fulfilling one after the other. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mukanga: We do not want to be pushed. We are on course and we will fulfill every promise we made. 

Sir, job creation is close to our hearts because we promised the people that we were going to put more money in their pockets. Maybe, we should wait and see what the hon. Minister of Finance will give us. It is important to note that the PF will not be swayed in the wrong direction by anybody. 

Sir, ZESCO is doing fine. As long as we are in Government, it will continue to operate the way it is operating. 

I thank you, Sir.

Rehabilitation of chiwala secondary school

59.Mr Chishiba (Kafulafuta) asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education when infrastructure that was in a deplorable state at Chiwala Technical Secondary School would be renovated.

The Deputy Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Mr Mabumba): Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education has a budget of K1 billion for the renovation of Chiwala Technical Secondary School. The renovations will begin as soon as the money is released by the Treasury.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chishiba: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Deputy Minister aware that Chiwala Technical Secondary School, which is the only technical school on the Copperbelt with a national character has no library as well as no water reticulation and sewage system?

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member for Kafulafuta should realise that when we had the indaba on the Copperbelt, Hon. Willombe and I visited Chiwala Secondary School and all the issues he is raising were brought to our attention. 

Sir, we need money that runs into the trillions which may not be available now. This is the reason we are embarking on a phased implementation programme. Like Hon. Mukanga said, the PF made these campaign pledges to the people of Zambia which it is going to fulfill. This is why we introduced a phased implementation when dealing with the rehabilitation of schools.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Habeenzu: Mr Speaker, what was the purpose of them visiting the schools?

The Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Dr Phiri): Mr Speaker, precisely to ascertain the state of selected secondary schools so that we have a clearer picture of the challenges in this area.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Simbao: Mr Speaker, does the hon. Minister understand that the answer he has given about the money not being available does not provide relief to the students at Chiwala Technical Secondary School?

Mr Speaker: Next question.

Laughter

COMMUNITY ACCESS IMPROVEMENT PROGRAMME

60.Mr Njeulu (Sinjembela) asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing why Shang’ombo District was left out of the Community Access Improvement Programme (CAIP) which was undertaken in all districts.

The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr Tembo): Mr Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that the CAIP is currently being undertaken in twelve districts in Zambia, four of which are in the Western Province. The programme is supported by the Royal Danish Government through Danish International Development Agency (DANIDA).

Sir, the selection of districts was based on the criteria set by the review mission that was engaged by DANIDA. Shang’ombo was considered, but did not meet the set criteria  and was left out.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Njeulu: Mr Speaker, may I know the criteria which were used in the selection of these districts.

The Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mrs Kabanshi): Mr Speaker, I would like to ask the hon. Member to come to the office where he shall be given the criteria.

I thank you, Sir.

Interruptions

Hon. Opposition Members: Question!

Mr Muntanga (Kalomo Central): Mr Speaker, it is important that the House takes interest in cases where a district is left out of development projects. When will the hon. Minister bring that information for the benefit of the House?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, that was not part of the question. The question is: Why was Shang’ombo left out of the CAIP project? If he would like this question answered, he should put it in writing and we will bring the answer to the House.

I thank you, Sir.

Interruptions

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, the question has already been brought to the Floor of the House. Why should the hon. Member of Parliament for Sinjembela bring in another question?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, the question that was brought to the House is: Why was Shang’ombo left out of the CAIP? We said that it was left out because it did not meet the set criteria. Shang’ombo was deemed by the DANIDA review mission as having not met the criteria. If you want the question by the hon. Member of Parliament for Sinjembela to be answered, then file it in as a question.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Order!

Let us not have a dialogue. This information is sought. Will the hon. Minister supply it to the House in due course. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Yes!

Mr Speaker: It is as simple as that. There is nothing mystic about the criteria.

INTIMIDATION OF WORKERS BELONGING TO UNIONS

62.    Mr Mutale (Kwacha) asked the Minister of Labour and Social Security why some companies intimidated and mistreated their workers for belonging to a trade union.

The Deputy Minister of Labour and Social Security (Mr Mbulu): Mr Speaker, the major reason is that companies perceive their employees belonging to a trade union as having the effect of increasing the wage bill and associated costs. This is because in work places with effective union representation, the process of collective bargaining results into reasonable wages and conditions of service for workers.

Sir, companies are aware that unions achieve effective representation on the basis of the principle of solidarity amongst their members. Some of the employers scheme to cause divisions within employee ranks through intimidation. 

Mr Speaker, in addition, some companies are shortsighted and choose to ignore that in the long run, trade unions do contribute to industrial harmony and worker productivity through social dialogue. 

Mr Speaker, as a result of the above, some employers tend to perceive a non-unionised workforce as more desirable as they are easier to exploit through low wages and poor conditions of service.

Mr Speaker, in the Industrial and Labour Relatives Act, (ILRA) Cap 269 of the Laws of Zambia, there is a provision for the right of every employee to take part in the formation of a trade union and to be a member of a trade union. This law does prohibit anti-union discrimination and interference in the internal workings of trade unions by employers and employers’ organisations. This law further prohibits dismissals, victimisation or prejudice against workers for exercising their rights. In this regard, any employer who intimidates or mistreats their workers for belonging to a trade union is in violation of the law and necessary punitive action should be meted out on them. It should also be noted that most employees who have strong unions are usually not discriminated against because these unions do not tolerate the violation on the rights of their members.

Mr Speaker, it is equally important for us to appreciate that Zambia is a signatory to international conventions. Convention No. 87 gives the workers the right to organise and bargain collectively. This international instrument provides that workers and employers, without distinction whatsoever, shall have the right to establish and join trade unions of their own choice without previous authorisation and workers and employers’ organisations authority.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mutale: Mr Speaker, what will be done in order to stop these employers from violating the rights of the workers with impunity?

Mr Mbulu: Mr Speaker, as the hon. Member for Kwacha may be aware, the Ministry of Labour and Social Security is now seriously undertaking inspections in places of work to ensure that it monitors conditions of work in all establishments. The inspections also cover issues related to workers’ freedom of association such as membership to trade unions. When acts of intimidation and the mistreatment of employees on account of belonging to a trade union are discovered, firstly, the ministry engages in dialogue with the employers to try and settle these issues amicably. In addition, the ministry undertakes awareness campaigns on workers’ rights as provided for under the law. After the dialogue takes place, anyone who continues breaking the law will not be spared, but prosecuted.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has correctly stated the laws which protect the rights of workers in this country. He has also said that every worker has the right to belong to a union of his or her choice. Is there any arm of Government such as the Executive, Judiciary or Legislature which does not allow union representation? 

Mr Mbulu: Mr Speaker, there is no institution whatsoever that prohibits anyone from belonging to a trade union. I want to put it on record that we had challenges in the previous Government. Under the MMD Government, there was a lot of interference in the operations of the trade unions. That is why we actually witnessed the formation of many splinter unions. This is because the Government then only wanted to support unions which could only dance to their tune.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Livune: Mr Speaker, it is public knowledge especially within the hon. Minister’s domain that the very Act referred to has been broken on several occasions by various employers. It is also well known that there are many employers who do not allow their workers to form unions within their industry. What is the ministry doing to bring such tendencies to an end in order to allow a required number to form trade union movements within certain organisations?

Mr Mbulu: Mr Speaker, I think it is important for the hon. Member to appreciate that as a tripartite body, we are always in constant dialogue. The Government usually plays the role of facilitator in most negotiations. We have the Zambia Congress of Trade Unions (ZCTU) and the Zambia Federation of Employers (ZFE) which are two institutions which play a critical role in ensuring a conducive working environment. We are receiving submissions from all the stakeholders as to how best we can change the status core that we inherited as the PF Government. Any submission is welcome.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Simfukwe: Mr Speaker, unemployment is the major task which our Government needs to address urgently. We have heard that there is an inter-ministerial committee that is spearheading the creation of employment in this country. We have also been told that over five million Zambians are unemployed and that most of them are youths. With all the efforts by the International Labour Organisation (ILO) workshops that we have seen, can the hon. Deputy Minister give us any formula which the Government has of creating employment in our country?

Mr Mbulu: Mr Speaker, I think that addressing the unemployment situation in the country is very challenging. I will respond to the question by Hon. Simfukwe just like Hon. Mukanga responded to an earlier question. There is no correlation between the question that the hon. Member has posed and the one that was originally asked. The principal question is talking about the intimidation and victimisation employees face for belonging to trade unions. Job creation is also a challenging topic, but let it come at the right time. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mweetwa: Mr Speaker, it is shocking that one year after the PF was voted into power, we are still talking about the mistreatment of workers. Would the hon. Minister be able to confirm to this august and, through the House, to the nation that the mistreatment of our workers, by now, would have actually been in the archives of history if the labour portfolio was left to Hon. Kambwili who was aggressively addressing such matters.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear! 

Mr Mbulu: Mr Speaker, it is quite regrettable that a question of that nature can come from Hon. Mweetwa whom we have a lot of respect for. For things to move, it does not matter who is in which position. At the end of the day, we work as a collective unit. That is the bottom line.  We do consult. That is why we are saying that we always have an inter-ministerial approach. I wish my brother would just appreciate that important fact. It does not matter whether Hon. Kambwili or Hon. Shamenda is in the ministry. What is important is that the Government should continue with its work. 

Mr Speaker, we are fully aware of issues to do with the intimidation and victimisation of workers. Let me also remind you, my brother, Hon. Mweetwa, that when we came into Government, we found only twenty-one labour officers for the seventy-three districts. That is how alarming the situation was. They could not be everywhere. What this Government has done is that, it given a go ahead to the ministry to fill all the vacancies. It is one step at a time.  At the end of the day, we will get there.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

SECONDARY SCHOOL TEACHERS COUNTRYWIDE

63. Mr Bwalya (Lupososhi) asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education:

(a)what measures had been taken to ensure that there is a sufficient number of secondary school teachers for secondary schools under construction country-wide; and

(b)whether the construction of a laboratory at Nsombo Secondary School in Lupososhi Parliamentary Constituency, which was currently under construction, was included in the construction plan.
The Deputy Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Mr Mabumba): Mr Speaker, the following measures have been put in place to ensure the availability of secondary school teachers including in both new and existing secondary schools:

(a)continued recruitment and deployment of 5,000 teachers, of which 1,000 are for secondary schools;

(b)teacher replacement, which allows the ministry to replace those who leave the system for various reasons. In 2012, 3,897 teachers were replaced; and

(c)teacher redeployment where teachers are transferred and deployed to needy areas. Further to that effect, the Government is also converting some colleges into universities.

Mr Speaker, two 1 x 2 laboratories are part of the scope of works for the construction of a boarding secondary school at Nsombo Secondary School, in Lupososhi Parliamentary Constituency.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Bwalya: Mr Speaker, I seek clarification on the issue of the laboratories. Does this include the construction of a computer laboratory, since we are in the Information Technology (IT) world?

The Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Dr Phiri): Mr Speaker, the requirement is that each secondary school must have, at least, two, preferably, three, science laboratories. For this new school, there was no provision for a computer laboratory, but that does not stop the school management from converting one of the classrooms into a computer laboratory, until such a time when a specific laboratory for computers is constructed.

I thank you, Sir.

Professor Lungwangwa (Nalikwanda): Mr Speaker, the recruitment of 5,000 teachers, of which 1,000 are secondary school teachers, has been in place since 2008. Why has the hon. Minister kept this same number, instead of coming up with another figure that could even be higher than 5,000?

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, I am elated that Hon. Professor Lungwangwa is working very hard to show that the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) left a legacy.

Laughter

Dr Phiri: In short, the 1,000 teachers that we are targeting for the new schools will, in the meantime, suffice because we are looking at the new Grade 8 and 10 intakes. We will build on the numbers as we enrol more children in the other classrooms. If we, somehow, mislead ourselves, we will know that there is Hon. Professor Lungwangwa to lean on.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mucheleka: Mr Speaker, with specific reference to part (b) of the question, I am aware that in that area there is no electricity. When will this school be electrified, given that he mentioned the construction of laboratories, which require the use of electricity?

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, we are working very hard to open these schools by January, next year, because this project is long overdue. There are contingency measures in place to complete the sanitary and water reticulation as well as power installations so that we enable these schools to open in January.

I thank you, Mr Speaker, 

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, has the ministry given any special consideration to the recruitment of science teachers among the 1,000 teachers allocated to secondary schools so that they can make use of the laboratories that are being referred to in part (b) of the question.

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, that is an on-going preoccupation in the ministry. Apart from the three measures that the hon. Deputy Minister indicated, the ministry is taking in preparing for these new schools, it has in place a fast-track training programme for science teachers. We hope that by next year, we will double the figure of teachers under this programme from 900 so that we should have an adequate number of science teachers. We have a heavy deficit when it comes to mathematics and science teachers, but we will see how we can address this challenge.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Chituwo (Mumbwa): Mr Speaker, can the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education confirm that, in fact, the fast-track programme was an initiative of the MMD, which he found working very well and whose target was 6,000 teachers.

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, I am quite amused. Let me confirm that the MMD did a training programme for 6,500 teachers but, in the end, we only settled for 900. It is now our responsibility to go back to the earlier figure by scouting for additional finances to complete the programme. However, since the MMD had the benefit of starting the programme, we want to have the privilege of successfully completing it.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

SETTLING-IN ALLOWANCE FOR HEALTH WORKERS

64. Mr S. Chungu (Luanshya) asked the Minister of Health what the Government policy on settling-in allowance for health workers was, especially when it was payable.

The Deputy Minister of Health (Mr Mulenga): Mr Speaker, the Government’s policy on settling-in allowances for health workers is in accordance with the provisions of the terms and conditions of service, and is payable as follows:

(i)it shall be paid by the Government to compensate an officer, in part, for unavoidable incidental expenses he or she has to meet on initial appointment to the Public Service or when the officer is transferred from one district to another, or from one rural station to another rural station within a district;

(ii)it shall be paid to an officer on first appointment and on transfer as may be agreed upon from time to time at the married or single rate as the case may be;

(iii)any officer shall not be eligible for settling-in allowance if he or she moves from one place to another in the area within any district or council boundary;

(a)settling-in allowance shall not be paid when a transfer results from an officer’s misconduct. 

(b)settling-in allowance will only be paid to an officer who is transferred at his own request if the responsible officer is satisfied that the transfer is in the interest of the Public Service; and

(c)claims for payment of settling-in allowance shall be approved by the responsible officers or by officers authorised by responsible officers, and shall be paid from the Travelling-on-Duty vote of the ministry, institution, province or district to which the officer is transferred.

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

CLEANING OF TOWNS AND CITIES COUNTRYWIDE

65. Mr Hamusonde (Nangoma) asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing:

(a)what measures the Government had taken to ensure that towns and cities countrywide were kept clean; and

(b)when vendors would be removed from the streets of Lusaka and other towns countrywide.

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, the Government has taken the following measures to keep our towns and cities clean:

(a)running programmes such the Keep Zambia Clean campaign,

(b)building the capacities of local authorities through the provision of vehicles and increased budgetary allocation to enable them effectively carry out their duties;

(c)engaging the private sector to participate in the management of solid waste through public private partnerships (PPPs); and

(d)stepping up sensitisation campaigns, through print and electronic media, to encourage the general public to take ownership of the general cleanliness of their surroundings.

Mr Speaker, the Government is engaged in consultations to find a lasting solution to the issue of street vending. Since there are many stakeholders involved, the Government wants to ensure that an exhaustive process is undertaken and that it is being treated with the urgency that it deserves. To this effect, the Government has drafted the statutory instrument (SI) on street vending which, once in place, will regulate how street vending is conducted countrywide. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Hamusonde: Mr Speaker, as long as we have vendors, the cities will remain unclean. How can we have clean cities when the Government has failed to remove vendors from the streets?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, vendors are very important people. 

Laughter

Mrs Kabanshi: Those vendors …

Hon. Opposition Member: They are voters. 

Mrs Kabanshi: ... are not only voters, but they are also making money to feed their families. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Kabanshi: If, for instance, we went with the police to chase them off the streets, today, they would starve. What this Government has done is to engage the vendors so that they get involved in keeping Zambia clean. We are sensitising them and want them to move off the streets into the markets on their own. We have already taken an audit of all the vendors. We, therefore, know where they come from, where they live and how to get in touch with them. Therefore, I promise that something good will come out very soon. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Namulambe (Mpongwe): Mr Speaker, ... 

Interruption

Mr Namulambe: Umfweni imwe kaili. Ichongo. 

Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister said that an SI will come out very soon, which will ensure that the streets are cleaned. However, we are in October. Very soon, it will start raining. With the dirt that we are seeing in towns, is this Government able to contain an outbreak of cholera that might result?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, keeping the streets of Zambia clean is not the responsibility of the Government alone. Even hon. Members of Parliament in this House are supposed to keep their environments clean. So, …

Interruptions

Mrs Kabanshi: ... even when I come to check on your streets, …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, this Government is working tirelessly to make sure that we clean the streets before the onset of the rainy season. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Belemu (Mbabala): Mr Speaker, in one of the responses by the hon. Minister, we were told that one of the strategies is the Keep Zambia Clean Campaign. What activities are actually being undertaken in this campaign? We just see the light trucks being driven around. 

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, this campaign is not only about trucks being driven around Lusaka. 

Laughter

Mrs Kabanshi: It is about engaging the business community to paint their premises and building the capacity of local authorities so that they are able to keep their environment clean. All local authorities are including this campaign in their budgets so that their cities and districts are kept clean. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Speaker, it is clear that, currently, our cities and towns are very dirty. Are we supposed to keep them clean or make them clean?

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order!

There are nuances coming through now. 

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, the essence of keeping our cities and streets clean is to make them clean and keep them that way. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Mazoka (Pemba): Mr Speaker, some countries have a policy of punishing people who litter their environment. Has the Government got any plan to put in place punitive measures for people who litter the environment? 

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, the Government is doing all it can to include this in the SI. Further, we will ensure that our inspectors in cities follow up on all culprits.

I thank you, Sir. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for a very clear policy statement by the PF that vendors are, indeed, a very important group in our society. 

Interruptions 

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, ever since the PF changed its stance on the issue of vendors, even people that had market stalls started trooping out of the markets to go and catch a sale on the street. May I know whether or not this Government has put in place measures to ensure that, and I want to be bluntly open here, when they defecate in empty ‘shake shake’ packs, because there are no public toilets sufficient enough to cater for these people on the street who trade from six o’clock in morning to six o’clock in the evening and, sometimes, even later, the waste from human beings …

Hon. Government Member interjected.

Mr Nkombo: Keep quiet! … is disposed of correctly so as to circumvent communicable diseases such as cholera, typhoid and dysentery as we go into the rainy season.

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, this problem that we are dealing with today was not created by the PF.

Hon. Opposition Members: Question!

Mrs Kabanshi: The MMD Government left this problem.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear! 

Mrs Kabanshi: They are the ones who did not give employment to the people.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Interruptions

Mrs Kabanshi: To rectify the problems that we found, we are trying to involve the street vendors so that they understand that the problem that they are in is not of their own making.

Hon. Opposition Members: Toilets! Toilets!

Mr Speaker: Order, order! 

The Speaker is the Chair.

Mrs Kabanshi: Therefore, this Government is working very hard to ensure that when these street vendors defecate in ‘shake shake’ packs, the council makes sure that they get rid of them at 2300 hours.

Hon. Opposition Members: Iyee!

Laughter

Mrs Kabanshi: At the same time, this caring Government has put an allocation in the Budget to make sure that all the markets have toilets, and toilets that are not working are repaired. Then the vendors can trade from markets where there are toilets.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Speaker: There you are! She has answered the question.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Laughter

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, may I find out from the hon. Minister whether the law on street vending has been scrapped by the PF Government.

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, the law has not been scrapped. We are trying to make sure that we keep the vendors in business and, at the same time, try and teach them how to do business better.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Lufuma (Kabompo West): Mr Speaker, I heard the hon. Minister mention voluntary repatriation from the streets to the markets. Could she kindly indicate how many vendors have actually embarked upon this voluntary repatriation from the streets to the markets.

Mr Livune: Hear, hear!

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, most of the street vendors are willing to go back to the markets. In fact, we are not calling them street vendors but street traders.

Laughter

Mrs Kabanshi: This is because most of them are contributing to the economy of this country.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Kabanshi: They are willing because we have respected and sensitised them. They are willing to trade from the market stalls that you imposed on them when you built them in locations of your choice.

Thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Livune: Mr Speaker, considering that most of the motor vehicles used for the ‘Keep Zambia Clean and Healthy Campaign’ are wearing out, are you considering buying a new fleet of vehicles?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, that is a new question, but I know very well that we have budgeted for the ‘Keep Zambia Clean and Healthy Campaign’. Everything will be brought to this House where the hon. Members will be told what will be on the plate for them.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1615 hours until 1630 hours.{mospagebreak}

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, four years ago, the Government of the Republic of Zambia, with the assistance of the European Union (EU), built a marvellous market in Kitwe called Nakadoli. From that time, the market has remained unoccupied. The traders opt to trade on the streets of Kitwe instead. May I find out from the hon. Minister whether she will continue lobbying and appealing to the marketeers to occupy Nakadoli Market without taking any necessary measures to ensure that the market is occupied?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, the people who we are dealing with are responsible adults. They know how important it is to do business in a good environment. So, in the near future, they will appreciate how important it is for them to trade from Nakadoli Market.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mweetwa: Mr Speaker, the problem of street vending that we are talking about is a very serious one in this country. We have been given firm assurances by the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing under the PF Government that, one day, in the near future, the vendors will be removed by taking a firm and bold step. May I find out whether, if at all, with this clear departure from Government policy, vendors under your leadership will ever be removed from the streets?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, they will not be removed, but they will move to the markets on their own.

Thank you, Sir.

Laughter

Ms Kalima (Kasenengwa): Mr Speaker, in the hon. Minister’s answer, she stated that the street vendors are no longer called street vendors but street traders. Could she clarify what she means.

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, the people we are talking about are business people who wake up very early every morning to go and trade on the streets so that they can put food on the table. This is a caring Government and, in the statutory instrument, there is an allowance for empowering street vendors so that they can lead a normal life.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Antonio (Kaoma Central): Mr Speaker, now that they are called street traders and not street vendors, I would like to find out when the Government is going to construct shelter for them, especially on Lumumba and Los Angeles roads as well as the road in Kaoma, seeing that we will soon get into the rainy season?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, my ministry is responsible for building more markets for street traders. Earlier on, I said that we had taken stock of all the street traders and what we found out was that we have more than 4,000 street traders and about 6,000 trading spaces in the markets. From our findings, it is clear that we have enough space to accommodate all the traders in the markets. We need to give them incentives, train them and enable them to understand what it really means to do business.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, since the hon. Minister has said her Government will not move the vendors from the streets, but that the vendors will decide on their own when to move from the streets, in an event that they do not see the logic to move from the streets and taking into account the fact that the Government’s responsibility is bigger than one section of a group, what will you do to protect the people of Zambia?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, I have done enough research by asking people in South Africa and other countries that have dealt with the issue of street vending. When I went to Italy, I had a meeting with a person who was dealing with street vendors in South Africa, and the advice I was given was that there has never been any country that has ever gotten rid of street vending by using forceful means. The best way is to engage them and make them see sense in what you are proposing to them.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out whether the hon. Minister has had any chance to look at the plans we left in her ministry vis-à-vis engaging the engineering departments in the local authorities …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Let the hon. Member complete the question in silence.

Dr Chituwo: … to identify spaces in various cities where lockable kiosks would be constructed and, with that, make available ablutions so that we can then provide amenable spaces for street vending. Have you had time to look at those plans which we considered would have given us quite some leeway in solving this problem?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, we have taken note of everything the hon. Member has talked about, but we have a way of dealing with this issue. We know that there is enough space in the markets to accommodate the traders. The MMD Government left a lot of problems among them high unemployment levels. So, if we move these people conducting their businesses on the streets today, there will always be others coming on the streets because they have no jobs and selling on the streets is their only source of income. However, we will build markets for the traders.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mulomba (Magoye): Mr Speaker, I would like to know if street trading has been legalised in Zambia.

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, it has not been legalised, but we are trying to find the best way to go round the problem.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

GOVERNMENT HEALTH WORKERS

66. Mr Chisala (Chilubi) asked the Minister of Health:

(a)what the total establishment of Government health workers in the country was; and

(b)of the total establishment, how many positions were filled as of 30th January, 2012.

The Deputy Minister of Health (Dr Chikusu): Mr Speaker, the total establishment of Government health workers in the country is 59,998. This number is made up of 39,318 health or medical personnel and 21,680 non medical personnel. Further, the establishment of 59,998 takes into account the establishment for the new health facilities that are under construction and are expected to be operational in 2012.

Sir, as of 30th January, 2012, the total number of filled positions stood at 33,137 translating into fifty five per cent of the establishment broken down as follows:

        Health workers        17,693
        Non-medical personnel    15,444

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Musokotwane (Liuwa): Mr Speaker, I see that His Honour the Vice-President is commenting, as usual. 

Laughter

Dr Musokotwane: Mr Speaker, health is obviously very important and, in most instances, somebody who is sick needs to have easy access to the nearest health establishment. Having gone round the country and, in particular, my constituency, you see that there are many health institutions that have been constructed in the last few years, but have no medical staff to man them.

Would the Government not consider to pay attention to the recruitment of medical personnel so that they can be deployed in these areas as quickly as possible, considering that the number of health personnel in these centres is below the authorised establishment?

The Minister of Health (Dr Kasonde): Mr Speaker, I would like to thank the hon. Member for raising this very important question of establishment versus actual employed. The hon. Member may wish to know that there is a rather dynamic cycle, which he may not have taken into account, that is the establishment is determined by the number of institutions that are either already constructed or about to be completed.

However, the actual number of health employees depends on the actual funding available at any given time and it may not be the same figure every time. In the present circumstances, we did propose to increase the number of medical personnel by 2,350 at the beginning of the year. We still have not reached the full establishment of 59,998 because of financial constraints. We do hope, however, that the figure can be increased by much more in the new year, depending of course on the funding. 

As for the figures available for next year, I am sure the hon. Member and myself are both ignorant about them since the situation all depends on the hon. Minister of Finance’s allocation to the Ministry of Health. I do, however, agree with the hon. Member that this is an important area for us to focus on. We are, indeed, focusing on it because we have shown that our output has been calculated in such a way that in the event that we are able to obtain the necessary funding, we shall ensure that each and every institution is served by qualified medical staff.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Simbao: Mr Speaker, in that case, are there some qualified people who are on the streets without any jobs?

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, I want to assure the hon. Member that if there are or, indeed, if he himself is looking for a position in the ministry, we are certainly able to offer employment under the 2,350 positions, which I quoted earlier and have not yet been completely filled. If there are qualified medical staff on the streets who looking for a job, surely they have not looked in the right places.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, has the Government got any plans to fast track the training of medical personnel since hospitals and clinics are not properly manned?

Dr Kasonde: Sir, the issue at present is not so much of fast tracking as compared to actually ensuring that the numbers that we produce go according to the plan that we laid out in the beginning of the year. Those numbers should be forthcoming. Our graduation ceremonies across the country are an example of what is going on. Other personnel being referred to universities have all been part of the human resource plan. There is no need for any fast tracking now, but there is need to maintain the momentum that we established at the beginning of the year.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, we heard recently that the Government was going to construct 650 health centres. With the current shortage of health personnel, how are they going to man the 650 new health posts to be constructed?

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, I was hoping that the hon. Member would have recognised in my statements that we did, at least, have the vision to train new staff as we prepared those institutions. So, we do not have a plan that shows specific personnel figures per structure, but have an overall plan for appropriate staffing of those structures. 

In this particular case, the hon. Member may recall that in the course of the year, I was present at the graduation ceremony of the first 300 community health assistants who will occupy a number of those 650 health posts when they are constructed. At the same time, it was the beginning of another 500 in training. I think the evidence, which the hon. Member may have missed, is that the planning certainly has been there and that whatever problems we inherited are being resolved.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Ng’onga (Kaputa): Mr Speaker, we know that there are quite a number of medical professionals who either retired or went to serve in other countries who have come back. Is there any possibility that these could be used or are being used while we wait for those that who are supposed to graduate from schools?

Dr Kasonde: Sir, we agree totally with the hon. Member’s suggestion. In fact, we have actually been offering that opportunity. I do not think I should go into a list of those who are working in that capacity. We are doing that and, I repeat, if there are those who want these positions and have either served the Government or any other part of the health sector, places are available. They might have missed the opportunity and some may even be former hon. Ministers still in this very House, but are looking for these positions.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter 

CHALIMBANA UNIVERSITY

67. Mr Chisala asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education what the progress was on turning of the National In-Service Training College into Chalimbana University.

The Deputy Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Professor Willombe): Mr Speaker, the transformation of the National In-Service Training College into Chalimbana University has progressed very well. A memo that was submitted to Cabinet has already been approved and a search committee appointed to advertise and research for the appointment of a Vice-Chancellor and Deputy Vice-Chancellor has already done that.

A special board of survey committee has also been set up for the verification of assets and …

Ms Imenda: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Ms Imenda: Mr Speaker, I can hardly understand what the hon. Minister is trying to say. He is not audible enough. Is he in order to speak like that?

Laughter 

Mr Speaker: Hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education, take note of that.

Interruptions 

Professor Willombe: Mr Speaker, I will repeat our response. The progress on the transformation of the National In-Service Training College into Chalimbana University has progressed very well. A memo that was submitted to Cabinet has already been approved. In addition, a search committee was set up which has already advertised for the appointment of a vice-chancellor and deputy vice-chancellor.

A special board of survey committee was also been set up for verification of assets and liabilities including taxes and severance packages for staff accrued to the college.

In terms of infrastructure development, the design for Phase I which includes the administration block, lecture rooms and a few hostels has already been done.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, looking at the progress that has been made so far, and bearing in mind that the President last year issued a directive to the hon. Minister of Education that within eighteen months the university be operational, can the hon. Minister confirm to this House and the nation as a whole as to whether that directive will be met especially with regard to the time frame, which will be March, next year.

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, we are alive to the directive given, but I can add my voice to what the hon. Deputy Minister has said to the effect that we are on course. This means that with the Cabinet approval we are going ahead to craft a statutory instrument necessary to establish Chalimbana University and the appointment of the Chalimbana University Council. The hon. Deputy Minister mentioned that there is a search committee at work and soon there will be a Vice-Chancellor and a Deputy Vice-Chancellor and that a special board of survey is busy as we are meeting here on the verification of assets and liabilities. Let me also add that the bidding document has been submitted to the ZPPA to seek the no objection to advertise the construction for the university’s infrastructure. It is expected that within this or next week, authority will be granted so that construction of the actual structures can begin.

Let me say that we have had a little delay with the designs, but since we have passed this stage, I am hoping that we could be on time to utilise the funds that were allocated for this university.

I thank you, Sir.

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, universities do not operate in a vacuum, but on the basis of a clearly-established vision and mission. Can the hon. Minister inform the nation, through this House, what the vision and mission of the Chalimbana University are.

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, I like the way Professor puts it. 

Laughter

Dr Phiri: If he has been following the development of this university, it must be clear to him that we have earmarked Chalimbana to be the sole university to deal with primary education because, for obvious reasons, the primary sector has not been stable because of low status in terms of income and other factors. We are hoping that with Chalimbana in place, our people who have decided to grow professionally in this sector will be given an opportunity to obtain various qualifications and improve on their professionalism in this field. Maybe, I should be saying that many people who have risen up to professorial level have had their foundations in the primary sector, but at one go had ejected from the sector to try out their skills in a higher status. I want to also mention that this university will start as scheduled because we are going to use the existing infrastructure albeit with a special reminder that the infrastructure that will be built will be for this university. We want it to begin and the infrastructure will follow in due course just as the University of Zambia started with structures near what we call the School of Medicine. Having done all the preliminaries, I think we are ready to launch the university.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Musokotwane: Mr Speaker, I heard the hon. Minister say that the university is still at design stage and wondered why it was necessary at this early stage to employ a Vice-Chancellor and the whole bureaucracy even if you consider the fact that you want to utilise some of the current infrastructure because the human beings who are still there are those that are being trained to be primary school teachers without those high qualifications. What, therefore, is the use of hiring expensive staff at this early stage before you are ready to receive the university students?

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, all considerations have been put into account. This is why we have a special board of survey to guide us on how we are going to proceed. It will verify not only assets and liabilities, but also the human resource and I can confidently inform the House that we have been working on the modalities of how we can begin serious activities at this institution. It is not a surprise institution at all. We have been working at it from last year.

I thank you, Sir.

POLLING STATIONS IN LUKULU

68. Mr Mutelo asked the Vice-President when the Electoral Commission of Zambia (ECZ) would declare the following schools in Lukulu District as polling stations:

    (a)    Lwee Community;

    (b)    Waloti;

    (c)    Masombo Community; and

    (d)    Lute Community.

The Deputy Minister in the Vice-President’s Office (Mr Kalaba): Mr Speaker, the schools can be considered as polling stations when the commission undertakes a delimitation of polling districts, but the local stakeholders would have to be consulted and an agreement reached.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

SAND MINING AT THE LUSAKA EAST MULTI-FACILITY ECONOMIC ZONE

69. Mr Hamusonde asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing:

(a)    why the mining of sand had been allowed around Kasisi area which was very close to the Lusaka East Multi-facility Economic Zone; and

(b)    whether the action at (a) would not compromise the security of the zone.

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that as regards part (a) of the question, Chongwe District Council has a sand by-law in place which was passed in January 1999 and confirmed by the hon. Minister under the Statutory Instrument No. 62 of 1999 in accordance with section 76(1) of the Local Government Act. The council is, however, in the process of revising the Sand By-law as a way of effectively managing the alarmingly high levels of sand mining arising from a number of developments in the districts, especially Lusaka Town.

The challenge has been that the current Sand By-law does not provide for the issuance of permits for those involved in the activity. However, it only imposes a levy on people who mine or export sand from the area. The other challenge is that this activity is undertaken on customary land. Despite several sensitisation meetings that have been held with the village headmen and community members in Chinkuli and Kasisi areas, people have continued to mine sand indiscriminately.

Mr Speaker, as a measure to avoid sand mining in the Kasisi and Chinkuli areas, which is affecting the security of the Lusaka East Multi-Facility Economic Zone, the Chongwe District Council has embarked on the process of revising its Sand Levy to put stringent measures that will bring effective control and regulation of the activity.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Hamusonde: Mr Speaker, how much is the levy on a tonne of sand?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, that is a new question. I will get back to him later.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Zimba (Kapiri-Mposhi): Mr Speaker, there is a lot of sand mining throughout the country. I think that the hon. Minister is aware of that. In some cases, there is some confusion in the communities. My question is: What benefit will the community get from the sand mining, which is done on customary land areas?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, the benefit that the people in the particular areas will get is that the miners will employ locals to fill their trucks. That is the benefit.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister referred to the Sand By-law, which is being enforced by the Chongwe District Council. My understanding is that the said by-law covers the whole district to enable the council to raise funds. The question is: Why has the council not stopped the mining of sand around Kasisi, which is near the Lusaka East MFEZ? That area is marked for development and is covered by the by-law. 

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister earlier mentioned the constraint that the local authority is facing, which is the fact that the mining is being done on customary land.

I thank you, Sir.

Ms Kalima: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister said that the levy is going to be increased as a way of controlling the mining activities. If these miners manage to pay this levy, because we know very well that, usually, when levies are increased, the cost is passed on to the customers, what is the strategy that the ministry has to ensure that there is control or complete stoppage of the activity?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, in the event that the cost of sand goes up because of the levies – the people dealing in sand are obviously business people – they will find alternative places to get their sand from. If they do not, we will put in more regulations to stop them so that we keep the MFEZ safe.

I thank you, Sir.

IMMIGRATION ATTACHES

70. Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi) asked the Minister of Foreign Affairs 

(a)how many immigration officers were currently working as Immigration 
Attachés at Zambia’s foreign missions; and 

(b)whether there was uniformity in the staff establishments in Zambia’s 
foreign missions and, if not, why.

The Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs (Dr Lungu): Mr Speaker, there are thirteen immigration officers currently working in the Foreign Service as Immigration Attachés. Two are in New Delhi and one in each of the following: Abuja, Beijing, Washington, Pretoria, Lilongwe, London, Lubumbashi, Gaborone, Harare, Kuala Lumpur and Dar Es Salam.

Mr Speaker, there is no uniformity in the staff establishment at Zambian foreign missions because some missions have heavier workloads than others.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Speaker, what is the Government’s policy on the identification or selection of people to work as Immigration Attachés? Is it the line ministry, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, or State House, which is involved in the identification of the officers?

Dr Lungu: Mr Speaker, thank you for that question. The appointing authority is the President. However, the people who do the identification are from the Department of Immigration, in conjunction with the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Monde (Itezhi - tezhi): Mr Speaker, what is the term of service for Immigration Attachés?

Dr Lungu: Mr Speaker, the contracts are for three years. However, they can be renewed, depending on the performance of the particular officer, for another three years. After that, they are supposed to come back to the base and work. They can be re-sent for a second or third time to foreign missions. However, we have noticed that our colleagues left these officers for over ten years. Hence, we have recalled them.

Mr Livune: Mr Speaker, do our colleagues serving in these portfolios have opportunities for promotion?

Dr Lungu: Mr Speaker, like all other officers in the Government, Immigration Attachés have opportunities to be promoted, depending on their performance.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Lufuma: Mr Speaker, could we know the Attachés that are required in the Foreign service.

Mr Speaker: Order!

Which categories of Attachés?

Mr Lufuma: Mr Speaker, Attachés.

The Minister of Foreign Affairs (Mr Lubinda): Mr Speaker, we have various Attachés in our missions abroad.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Let the hon. Minister respond. If you have follow-up questions, you will have the opportunity to ask. You do not have to ask questions while seated.

May the hon. Minister continue, please.

Mr Lubinda: Sir, we have trade, press, tourism and immigration Attachés. When the hon. Member asks if I have figures for the establishment of all attachés, surely, he should realise that that is a new question that will require us to come back to the House and provide an answer after some research. However, if he is restricting himself to the establishment of Immigration Attachés, which is the subject of the question on the Floor, the hon. Deputy Minister of Foreign Affairs, D Lungu, indicated that they are thirteen. That is the establishment.

I thank you, Sir.

__________{mospagebreak}

MOTIONS

PUBLIC ACCOUNTS COMMITTEE MEMBERSHIP

The Minister of Finance (Mr Chikwanda): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the following hon. Members of Parliament do constitute the Public Accounts Committee (PAC) for the Second Session of the Eleventh National Assembly:

Mr V. Mwale, MP
Mr M. H. Malama, MP
Ms M. G. Imenda, MP
Mr P. M. Mucheleka, MP
Mr C. Matafwali, MP
Mr H. H. Hamududu, MP
Mr J. E. S. Chishiba, MP
Mr A. C. Milambo, MP
Mr M. Mbulakulima, MP

Sir, during the First Session of the Eleventh National Assembly, the PF Government committed itself to take a zero-tolerance stance on corruption and abuse of public resources.

Mr Speaker, I wish to reiterate that our Government remains committed to serving our people and ensuring that we improve the quality of their lives through corrupt-free, local and central Government establishments.

Sir, in this respect, the PF Government will continue to fearlessly and aggressively pursue perpetrators of fraud so that public resources are safeguarded and utilised for their intended purposes, which is that of meeting the aspirations of our people.

Mr Speaker, it is for this reason that I take this opportunity to thank the members of the previous PAC for their meticulous handling of matters related to addressing the shortcomings in the governance of public resources.

Sir, in order to meet the public’s high expectations, we will work relentlessly with all stakeholders, especially PAC, to ensure that an environment which is favourable to the promotion of prudent and efficient financial management is created and allowed to thrive.

Mr Speaker, to further demonstrate our commitment to good governance, the Government has embarked on capacity building and orientation programmes at top management levels of the Public Service, especially among controlling officers. Orientation programmes for this cadre were conducted in the first and third quarters of this year.

Sir, in order to have more money for service delivery and development, our Government has also embarked on various reforms aimed at enhancing efficiency in the collection of non-tax revenue and a reduction in abuse and misappropriation of public resources, which has been a common feature in the annual Auditor-General’s Reports. For example, non-tax revenue for national registration and passports will no longer be collected by the Passport Office, but through commercial banks, with effect from 2013.

Mr Speaker, as stated in my Speech during the First Session of the Eleventh National Assembly, the Government shall continue to strengthen corrective action based on the Auditor-General’s Report and recommendations of PAC.

Sir, I seek the support of the whole House in effecting this measure which, in some quarters, might be misconstrued as victimisation.

Mr Speaker, I now wish to update this august House on the specific actions taken by the Government to strengthen the implementation of corrective action in the handling of public resources.

Sir, the Government has approved policy changes in the management of imprest. This is aimed at eliminating the abuse of imprest by public officers. In addition, we have approved a public financial management strategy, whose objective is to improve accountability and management for public resources in relation to the following:

(a)planning;

(b)budgeting;

(c)cash management, accounting and financial reporting;

(d)procurement;

(e)debt management;

(f)Government investments;

(g)domestic revenue mobilisation;

(h)internal audit and control;

(i)fiscal decentralisation; and

(j)monitoring and evaluation.

In short, Sir, we have decided to focus on improving efficiency, reducing waste, and using existing resources in more transparent and accountable ways. Therefore, any action that will be at variance with this stand will not be taken lightly. The law will take its course and there will be no sacred cows.

Mr Speaker, in this regard, I take this opportunity, through you, to appeal to hon. Members of PAC to objectively play their part in ensuring that public resources are applied effectively for the development of the country.

Sir, on our part, as a Government, we will endeavour to implement the recommendations of the Committee in accordance with the existing statutes.

Mr Speaker, on the part of PAC, it is my hope that it will go beyond just looking at the numbers, but also engage in performance and output analysis of Government investments.

Sir, I wish PAC and this august House a very successful session.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Simbao (Senga Hill): Mr Speaker, this is a very important Committee although it lacks proper balance. There are about six hon. Ladies on this side of the House and I have noticed that the PF is shy to appoint ladies to this very important Committee.

Laughter

Mr Simbao: Mr Speaker, ladies normally stabilise institutions and we need such kind of representation on a Committee such as this one. I find it very hard to accept the composition of this Committee without a greater presence of female Members of Parliament.

Sir, I would suggest that since we have about nine men and only one woman, this should be increased to accommodate all the ladies that we have that are Back Benchers. Alternatively, the number of hon. Female Parliamentarians should be increased. We cannot have a situation where it looks like we do not have ladies in this House.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Mr Simbao: Sir, I would like to encourage the hon. Minister to look into this matter so that we can have more ladies on this Committee. I would like to remind us that His Excellency the President of Zambia said that ladies serve better in committees such as this one where corruption is concerned. He has spoken more on corruption than anything else.

Sir, I would, therefore, like to urge the hon. Minister to consider adding the six or seven women that we have in the Opposition to this Committee in order to make it more representative.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, Hear!

The Minister of Mines, Energy, and Water Development (Mr Mukanga): Mr Speaker, thank you for giving me this opportunity to debate this important Motion.

Sir, I believe that this Motion should not be trivialised. It is important, as the hon. Minister has pointed out, for us to ensure that we operationalise this Committee by supporting it. 

Mr Speaker, as for the issue that was raised by Hon. Simbao, I would like to say that there are about six hon. Female Members of Parliament from the Opposition. Since these hon. Female Members are found in the fifteen Committees, adding them to this Committee will make it hard for them to carry out some of their other Parliamentary duties such as visiting their constituencies. If we were to look at the composition of Committees, we would see that the female Members of Parliament are found in almost every Committee.

Sir, we look at these issues from a point of level headedness and that is why they were appointed in that manner. We appreciate what you are saying, but it cannot happen because they are already in various Committees. His Excellency the President stated that female Members perform very well and they do perform well in the Committees they have been appointed to. It is important that we support the Committee the way it is at the moment. 

Mr Speaker, with these few words, I would like to support the Motion.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chikwanda: Mr Speaker, I thank my hon. Colleagues for their unanimous support and Hon. Simbao’s sensibilities which have been taken into account. The National Assembly of Zambia composes these Committees very well and, maybe, one lady on the Public Accounts Committee, out of the membership, might represent 10 per cent. Therefore, proportionality has to be properly contextualised.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, Hear!

 Mr Chikwanda: Mr Speaker, without prolonging the debate, I thank my colleagues for their unanimity.

I thank you, Sir.

Question put and agreed to.

MOTION OF THANKS

(Debate resumed)

Mr Hamududu (Bweengwa): Mr Speaker, I would like to thank you for according me this opportunity to critique the President’s Address to this House.

Mr Speaker, the State of the Nation Address in any country or democracy is a very important statement because it sets the tone for what is to come, especially as a precursor to the Budget Speech by the Minister of Finance.

Sir, the Head of State is given an opportunity to give his Government’s performance so far and the Government’s plans going forward. We, as a country, must ensure that we are accountable to our people for the progressive realisation of the socio-economic rights of the people who put us here at their expense. The people are looking up to us for a very noble cause. The Chief Executive Officer of this country, His Excellency the President, is supposed to be accountable through this House and in this House sits Zambia through the elected people. Therefore, this address must be taken seriously as delivered from that throne.

Mr Speaker, the State of the Nation Address is an opportunity to report, reassure and reinvigorate agreed national aspirations. 

Mr Speaker, I have never seen a country which jelly-meanders like Zambia. It is just going round in a vicious cycle, but making no progress at all. If it was a football match, I think people would not watch it. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Hamududu: Mr Speaker, I want to say that the President’s Speech was flat. If it was a meal, it could have been a very flat meal and we could have failed to eat it. I now want to touch on a few issues that the President addressed in his speech. 

Sir, the Constitution-making process that is being undertaken by the PF Government is the worst. It is a top bottom approach. How can you make a constitution and then after that, you go and consult the people? They are even making funny proposals such as the multi-member constituency. Who told them to do that? The Zambian people have already spoken through the various Constitutional Review Commissions (CRCs) such as the Mvunga Commission, the Mwanakatwe Commission and the Mung’omba Commission. Our understanding was that this committee could have sat for a month, collected views and then created a draft constitution. Today, we hear that they have spent over K95 billion. They are even justifying that they have not spent as much as what was spent at the National Constitutional Conference (NCC). At the NCC, there were over 500 people. Therefore, how can a few people spend K95 billion? Do you know what this translates into? If you give that money to the hon. Minister of Youth and Sport, he will be able to give K600 million per constituency for micro projects for youths. You could have given this money to the hon. Minister of Gender to create women’s clubs. This could have alleviated poverty and mitigated the unemployment situation in our country. These are the opportunity costs. The PF Government has made a scandal. These people have not met the expectations of the people. I think the MMD Government was a little better. The PF Government has brought the country down. 

Interruptions

Mr Hamududu: Mr Speaker, what views are they collecting? I wish I could be in Monze at the time they are going there. I would have asked, “What do you want?” The Zambian people have already spoken. The documents and the views are there. With all these three Constitutional Review Commissions, the submissions are consistent. You should be able to see what Zambians want. You have created this technical committee to rob this country. Where did you find this K95 billion? You are saying that there is no money to create jobs and to deal with poverty, but you have found K95 billion which is not even in the Budget. This document has no legal backing. 

Mr Speaker, I have come to conclude that a constitution cannot be driven by politicians because politicians are short ‘termists’. Their preoccupation is the 2016 Election and, therefore, any constitution-making process is a way of rewarding their supporters. This must be stopped. Let us give a neutral body, the Civil Society and the Church to lead this process, and not politicians. Politicians cannot see beyond five years. In this country, all governments have successfully failed to provide a people-driven constitution, which is a very simple thing. I can do it with five people. 

Mr Speaker, we need professionals such as engineers, accountants, economists and lawyers in the composition of this committee. In a month’s time, we will have a blue-printed draft constitution. This PF Government must stop wasting money on this headless Constitution-making process. It is not going anywhere.  The K95 billion is too much to be spent on this. 

Interruptions

Hon. Opposition Member: Hon. Mulusa is saying that one day, they will run away and we will not find them.

Laughter

Mr Hamududu: Mr Speaker, the President’s Address to this House gives the President an opportunity to run the nation in managing and sustaining an agreed national vision. The problem that we have in this country is that we do not have a shared vision that is non-partisan. I want to thank the Mwanawasa Government for producing the Vision 2030, which is a fairly good document. In this document, the aspirations of the Zambian people are captured and I am going to read a few of them. First of all, we need to have a shared vision across these little political divides. The President must manage and help us sustain this. He must also make sure that there is consensus around the national vision so that the governments that are coming in and out can continue pressing this agenda. This will enable us continue registering progress in all the parameters in this country. 

Mr Speaker, On page 2, the Vision 2030 document says: …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Can we avoid the running commentaries. This is serious business and the hon. Member is addressing the House seriously. I think you are undermining him by the running commentaries. In the same vein, I would say, let us stop those commentaries.

Mr Hamududu: Mr Speaker, Zambians, by 2030, aspired to live in a strong and dynamic and middle-income industrial nation that provides opportunities for improving the wellbeing of all, embodying values of socio-economic justice, underpinned by the principles of: 

(i)Gender-responsive sustainable development; 

(ii)democracy; 

(iii)respect for human rights; 

(iv)good traditional and family values; 

(v)positive attitude towards work; 

(vi)peaceful co-existence; and

(vii)private-public partnerships. 

Mr Speaker, among other things, the nation Zambians aspire for should be characterised as follows:

(a)a common and shared destiny, united in diversity, equitably integrated and democratic in governance, promoting patriotism and ethnic integration.”
Mr Speaker, I have read a lot about the Asian countries and I have learnt about the conflicts on the islands between Japan and China. Japan and China are both saying those islands are theirs. We need to have something above our political divide in terms of patriotism. For example, if you went to Finland today, you would find that even a small boy would tell you that he has been on a military attachment. He can even say that they will fight Russia. He can further say that there are five million people, but they will defeat the Russians and they will all agree. In this country, we are busy doing petty things.

Mr Speaker, the Vision 2030 document further states:

(b)a continuous path of ever refining, ever advancing, ever consolidating democratic dispensation and progressive adaptation from global-based practices;

(c)diversified and balanced and strong industrial sector, a modern agricultural sector and an efficient and productive services sector. 

Mr Speaker, I want to say that, as a country, we must agree to have this vision and own it. If there are any weaknesses, we can polish them up using a non-partisan platform so that this becomes a Zambian Dream like the American Dream. In America, you do not mess up with the dream. Otherwise, you can be sent out of the country immediately. You can only say, “I will enhance this dream.” Our competition in politics should be about enhancing this shared dream. Therefore, the State of the Nation Address should bring us together and show us how we are moving and the progress we are making. In the seventy years we live on this earth, we must leave a better Zambia for the children who will sit here in future. I sit on the seat of the late Harry Mwaanga Nkumbula. Therefore, we must continue to make progress for our children’s children. 

Mr Speaker, I do not know why we are excited about this multi-party issue. When you form Government, you forget about inclusive politics. Inclusive politics does not mean that we must join your Government. That is undermining democracy. We must play our role to provide checks and balances and not to be appointed. The unity that the President was talking about is not to join your Government. That is wrong. Anyone from the Opposition who agrees to that is undermining democracy. If you want to work with the Opposition, you must write to leaders of political parties for a kind of a coalition in Parliament. That is civility. You cannot be stealing hon. Members of Parliament. They are betraying their own people.

Interruptions

Hon. Opposition Member: Masholi!

Mr Speaker: Order!

Hon. Member, the word, ‘stealing’ is unparliamentary. You could use the word, ‘enlist.

Mr Hamududu: Thank you very much, Sir. Or ‘abducting’.

Mr Speaker: Order! 

That is equally unparliamentary.

Mr Hamududu: Mr Speaker, I withdraw that word. 

Laughter

Mr Hamududu: Sir, the unity the President was talking about is to play our respective roles. Our job in this House is to check on you like we are doing now. If people are not happy with you, they will turn to us. The Zambians must not be stranded. That is why you must let the Opposition hold political rallies so that people can hear the alternative ways.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Hamududu: In case you fail, they will have an option. You are just human beings. You are not super and there is nothing special about you. When you fail like others have failed, Zambia must switch to the alternative. 

So, please, can we deepen our democracy. Five years is enough for you. Then, as His Honour the Vice-President said, another Government can come to power and move this agenda. As the people in the trade union movement say, ‘United we stand, divided we fall’. There are inter-marriages between us and so what is the problem? Zambians under a one-party State made progress unlike now when there is a multi-party system, because they used to reach a consensus very quickly. In this multi-party State, those in power are just boasting and throwing their weight around. These people have a responsibility of deepening democracy because they have the instruments of power which they should use appropriately. The more power they have, the more responsibilities they have.

Mr Speaker, let me now move on to another issue. The Vision 2030 and the Sixth National Development Plan (SNDP) need resources to be financed. In any history, there are fat years and thin years. Most scholars can agree that Zambia is now in the fat years, in which we should keep the extra for tomorrow. I want someone here to challenge me that we are not in the fat years. The thin years may come when all these investors will have extracted all the copper. How do you refer to the extraction of copper as investment? That should not be called an investment because, in the actual sense, we are robbing the future generations.

Mr Speaker, I want to state that if it was the United Party for National Development (UPND) in power, it could easily have entered into a partnership with either China or South Korea for mining copper and using it to produce other products. This country of 13 million people would, in turn, have so much wealth and develop a very powerful sovereign fund of K100 billion for the future generations. A small country like Botswana which has little diamonds has beaten us. 

Mr Speaker, there is what is known as a political cycle of a Government. According to it, if a particular party in power does not work in the first two years then it would have lost its chance to do a good job. By the third year, everything will be done out of political expediency. The third year becomes the year of panicking. At the moment, vendors are allowed to be in the streets, but there are better solutions.

Mr Speaker, in a bid to change the society in China, the Government provides free social services such as quality education and health services as well as good infrastructure. Even if you pay people a minimum wage that does not mean that you have dealt with the issue of unemployment. For instance, if you pay a domestic worker K600,000 that will not ensure that she will pay rent and fees for a child at a private school. Let us go back to the fundamentals. You claim that you are a member of the Socialist International when your application is still pending. No wonder your application has not yet been accepted. That …

Laughter

Mr Hamududu: … institution has high requirements and is a noble and progressive association. During the fat years, you borrow US$750 million and yet this is the time we should accumulate reserves for the future. The mining companies are robbing us. During the windfall tax debate, the mining companies were fighting through the Zambia Chamber of Mines. When we increased the mineral royalty, they supported it because they found a trick of paying low amounts by increasing the figures of the expense side of things. They give through mineral royalty, while the take away through the corporate tax. The figures are here. As the mineral royalty increases, the corporate tax is reducing. That is why they never opposed the increment of 3 per cent to 6 per cent. What we need to do now is to amend the tax provision for the mines because this mineral royalty tax must not be disturbed by expenses. The mineral royalty ordinarily captures the windfall gains because it is based on revenue. I am, personally, for mineral royalty which is not disturbed by expenses because it continues forever even when there are high prices or not. When the mineral royalty went up, the corporate tax went down. You never saw them when they were stealing. They gave you with one hand and took away with the other. For them I can say that they were stealing because they are not hon. Members of this House.
 
Mr Speaker, finally I want to say that we are missing an opportunity. The former Prime Minister of Singapore said that Singapore had no resources, but only people and there was need to use the human capital to turn around the fortunes of that country. In this country, we do not only have human capital, but natural resources beyond measure. What more can you ask for from the Almighty God? What justification can the current Government give for the people suffering in the compounds, along Lake Bangweulu, Tanganyika and Shang’ombo and also those children who are not going to school? 

Mr Speaker, in conclusion, I want to urge the Government to put its house in order. They should set their parameters and begin to register visible progress in all areas. This country has had a cursed political leadership over the years and I am very sad about that.

With these few words Sir, I thank you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo (Chongwe): Mr Speaker, thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to add my voice in support of the speech by His Excellency, Mr Michael Chilufya Sata, the President of the Republic of Zambia which was delivered on Friday, 21st September, 2012.

Mr Speaker, let me say that this speech, was indeed, very well articulated, because it did cut across all the sectors in a very effective way. It was a very short, with everything summarised across all sectors of the Government. I was very disappointed to read in the newspapers that an hon. Member of this House actually tore …

Mr Speaker: Hon. Minister of Tourism and Arts.

Order! 

I provided guidance earlier on in the day, that this matter has been referred to the Committee of Privileges, Absences and Support Services, and we should give that Committee the freedom to deal with the matter. I therefore, ordered that every hon. Member should refrain from going in that area and this includes the hon. Speaker. Let us leave it that way.

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, I thank you for that guidance and I will make sure that I refrain from talking about that matter with the hope that justice is done. I want to say that if my colleagues had even cared to browse through the speech they would in all fairness have agreed with me that it was a very good speech which did set the development agenda of this country. I also want to say that, it is not only a good speech, but it is consistent. If one listened to the previous speech delivered by His Excellency in this House and later followed it up with the current speech you will see that there is consistency in the development agenda. 

Mr Speaker, one of the things that impressed me is during the President’s Address is that he included a lot of humour. In this country, there are very few politicians who can do serious business and include humour in it.

Mr Speaker: Order!

Hon. Minister of Tourism and Art, I have to update you on a lot of events that preceded you. I do note that you just returned from an assignment. 

Laughter

Mr Speaker: The area which you want to touch is another area that we have agreed will not be subject of debate on the Floor of the House. Please, simply focus on the substance of the speech. 

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, I thank you again for your guidance. You are right to say that because I was out, I may not know exactly what transpired.

Mr Speaker, I want to go straight to the substance of this speech which made me give such a preamble. Firstly, the President advised this House to look beyond partisan politics and that needs to be appreciated. He also advised the Executive to take criticism from the Opposition in good taste because we all have a common agenda of serving our people. However, it is also important that our colleagues on your left take this in a good way. 

Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: Order!

A point of order is raised. 

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I rise on a very serious procedural point of order. 

My sister, Hon. Masebo, who is on the Floor making her speech at this point, is the hon. Minister of Tourism and Arts. As an hon. Minister, she is supposed to respond to issues that have already been raised and issues which are yet to be raised by hon. Members of this august House. 

Mr Speaker, at what point, on the Floor of this House, will she be able to respond to the issues that we are going to raise pertaining to her ministry? 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: There are so many other hon. Members who are yet to speak and raise issues pertaining to her ministry. What she is doing now is making a cross-country debate without sticking to the issues of her ministry. These are the issues we want her to respond to. 

Mr Speaker, I need your guidance. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: The point is well taken and I think that all other hon. Members on my right should heed this advice. There is a risk of forfeiting an opportunity to respond to portfolio issues. However, if she elects to do so, the other hon. Members on my right are at liberty to respond on behalf of the Executive in general. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: I think that this is a point to take note of. The usual tradition in this House is to allow hon. Members on the left to have a bite at the cherry, so to speak, so that at the end of the day, we can close the debate in a very logical fashion. 

With that remark, I would urge the hon. Minister to continue. 

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, I thank you very much for allowing me to continue. 

Hon. Opposition Member interjected. 

Mr Masebo: No, why are you scared? 

Hon. Opposition Member: I am not scared. 

Mrs Masebo: So, keep quiet. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Aah!

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, when His Excellency delivered his speech, one of the issues he raised was that the Executive must listen to the criticism from the Opposition because in more ways than one it will be for our own good. This is what they are there for. 

Mr Speaker, on page 19 of the speech His Excellency says that the overall growth strategy is to increase growth to an average of 8 per cent per annum. He further states that in the medium and long term, the Sixth National Development Plan and Vision 2030 will remain the main development frameworks of the country and the Government shall pursue the growth strategy in line with the PF Manifesto.

Mr Livune: Question!

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, I felt that this was important for consistency because the Vision 2030, although done under the MMD Administration, is a vision of the people of Zambia. Just as the hon. Member for Bweengwa articulated in his debate, which I support, this vision is not for one person, but for all of us. If, therefore, something is good, we must say so and pursue it except it shall have to be in line with the PF Manifesto. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Livune: Question!

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, the other point was on education and health. You will note from the President’s Speech that he is very consistent regarding our vision in the education and health sector. We want to ensure that resources are given to these two sectors so that we have more universities and hospitals. 

Mr Speaker, I am a very happy hon. Member of Parliament. My colleagues on your left know why I am happy. There are things that I cried for in my constituency for the last ten years, and even though I was part of the previous administration, I could not get those things done. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: However, this listening President with his listening party called the PF has for the first time reflected a lot of things concerning my constituency in the Speech. This is why I am saying that this is a good statement. 

Mr Nkombo: On a point of order, Sir. 

Mr Speaker: Order!

A point of order is raised. 

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, my sincere apologies to the hon. Minister of Tourism and Art, whatever the nomenclature. 

Having got a point of order from the hon. Member of Parliament for Monze Central, is she in order to delve into her constituency while she debates, when as a matter of fact, procedure requires that she gives a policy statement and direction. 

Mr Speaker: As I see it, the hon. Minister of Tourism and Art has made cross reference to the speech as well as to some events that have taken place in her constituency in order to justify her commendation of the speech. This is the way I see it.  

The hon. Minister may proceed. 

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, once again, I thank you for your ruling. 

Mr Speaker, as I was saying, education and health continue to be key. This PF administration is not just talking, but also walking the talk. As you rightly said, I gave an example of the construction of a university in a place called Chongwe where, for many years, we cried for a university and we were never heard, as the system failed us. Now, however, even without being the main part of the system, we can be heard. We have been given an ear as a people. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, infrastructure development is cardinal. In his speech, His Excellency has again walked the talk by saying that infrastructure, which has a direct impact on tourism, shall form part of the main agenda of this administration. There can be no tourism without good roads. If we have good roads, people will be able to access the twenty national parks and the thirty-six game management areas (GMAs). As the President has stated, tourism is one of the sectors where we are diversifying for job and wealth creation, income generation and raising foreign exchange for our country. 

Sir, I want to challenge hon. Members of Parliament that the onus is upon us, as leaders, to go back to our constituencies and encourage Zambians to participate in tourism, especially in lodges and wildlife, instead of just doing politicking. All these things are there in the speech. The President is showing us our diversification vision, which includes tourism. Apart from agriculture and manufacturing, tourism is taking centre stage.

Sir, this morning, I was happy to hear that a president of an Opposition party was saying that, if elected, he would ensure that there was growth in the tourism sector. This just shows you that, suddenly, everybody has begun to understand that tourism is the way forward because PF has made that point.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Hon. Opposition Member: Question!

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear! Bwekeshapo!

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, …

Hon. Opposition Member interjected.

Laughter

Mrs Masebo: … if we do not have a good Constitution, there would not be good tourism and education. Therefore, having a good Constitution is the key. For this reason, the President and the PF Government are consistent in their actions. So, they agreed that, when they came to power, they will not have the arrangement of having 500 members of the National Constitutional Conference (NCC), but instead have a technical committee in place. Whether wrong or right, that is exactly what the President and PF Government is doing. They have put up a technical committee to look at the Constitution and summarise it, then go back to consult the people. Comments coming from politicians are being discouraged because we are trying, as much as possible, to ensure that the Constitution is people-driven. So, if we, as politicians, start commenting and giving our personal views, people will think we are interfering. So, that is why we have allowed the process to go on on the ground. 

Mr Speaker, I do not understand when people say the PF Government is doing something else. The party was voted into power based on its manifesto, and that is the same manifesto it is implementing. Of course, every manifesto will have supporters and opponents, but the fact of the matter is that we have more Zambians for the PF Manifesto.  That is why it won.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Mrs Masebo: Therefore, allow the PF to implement its manifesto fully, whether you like it or not. You should only remind us if we go outside the manifesto. For example, somebody said that we had been singing about the windfall tax. All of us in this Parliament had been singing about it, but it just depends on which side you belong. However, sometimes, when you are on the other side, you can say many things, but my advice is that you have to get into a car to become a driver for you to understand the car. Now that the PF is in Government, obviously, there are certain things that could have been said which its members now understand better than when they were on the other side. Hence, the emphasis that bringing back the windfall tax might damage investments in the mining sector.

Interruptions

Mrs Masebo: The challenge that we have is, of course, what the hon. Member of Parliament said and I want to support that. He said  …

Mr Muntanga: Which one?

Mrs Masebo: The hon. Member of Parliament for Mazabuka Central, not you, Hon. Muntanga.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Address the Speaker.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Avoid the temptation to be distracted.

Mrs Masebo: Thank you, Mr Speaker. There is a need for us to effectively collect even those taxes that we have imposed on the mining sector. There are weaknesses in our capacity to collect. We need to build our capacity to collect what is there. Sir, collecting taxes from the mining sector is as difficult as collecting them from ordinary citizens. As you all know, it still remains a challenge. In the informal sector, people are not paying tax. Even in some of the formal business sector, people use all sorts of tricks to avoid paying tax. So, I think, that is an area that we must emphasise on so that we increase our income from the mining sector.

Mr Speaker, if you look at this speech, every sector has been addressed. So, it is wrong for anybody to come here and start politicking. What the hon. Member of Parliament for Mazabuka Central was saying is good, to some extent …

Mr Muntanga: Bweengwa!

Mrs Masebo: Oh, Bweengwa. Thank you. 

The hon. Member of Parliament for Bweengwa normally speaks well. I wish he could speak like that in his party’s National Management Committee (NMC) meetings so that its members could do exactly what he says. Unfortunately, he does not and they do not. Mr Speaker, there is too much politicking in this country. Even when something is good, people just want to criticise.

Mr Mwiimbu: Talk about tourism!

Mrs Masebo: The opening of …

Do not worry! I am debating the President’s Speech. I have been here just as long as you have.

Mr Speaker: Proceed with your debate! 

Mrs Masebo: Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker, in the health sector, I was saying that there was an increase of 47 per cent on the budgetary allocation from the previous year and the President says he will continue to increase the allocation. Those of us who have been here long know that one of the challenges in the social sectors has been resources. For example, if you look at local government, ...

Interruptions

Hon. Opposition Member: Talk about tourism!

Interruptions

Mrs Masebo: Let me teach you something about tourism. Mr Speaker, tourism is multi-sectoral ...

Mr Speaker: Order! 

You may continue.

Mrs Masebo: ... and depends on the ministries of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs; Local Government and Housing; Foreign Affairs; Finance; and Transport, Works, Supply and Communication. Unless these sectors are sufficiently funded and supported by an adequate policy framework, there can be no tourism. That is why, as hon. Minister of Tourism and Arts, I will support the road infrastructure being constructed under the Link Zambia Project which was launched recently. I am very happy that that road – I think some of you on the left will remember that I kept advocating in this House for the Leopards Hill Road to be built – is going to be worked on. Every time, I was told that I was a case of sour grapes. Thank God that road was launched by His Excellency the President, which will link the rest of Zambia to the tourist points in Chiawa in the Lower Zambezi and Luangwa in the Eastern Province. That is just the beginning. All these roads are going to link the rest of the country. So, for me, …

Professor Lungwangwa: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Interruptions

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, thank you for giving me an opportunity to raise a point of order. Is the hon. Minister of Tourism and Arts in order to keep informing this House that she has been crying continuously in the past?

Laughter

Professor Lungwangwa: Is she in order to say so when she was an hon. Minister in the previous Government for many years and we never heard her cry in the Cabinet?

Laughter

Professor Lungwangwa: She talked about crying for a university. I was then the hon. Minister of Education, but she never cried in my office.

Laughter

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, is she in order?

Laughter

Mr Speaker: I think that she is in order, to the extent that she is using a figure of speech.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: The hon. Minister may continue.

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, the President talked about decentralisation, and we have been talking about the Decentralisation Policy for many years. We have been crying for this devolution.

Laughter

Mrs Masebo: Sir, for the first time, His Excellency the President has created fifteen new districts in this country. Do you know the implication of that? That is real decentralisation in action.

Hon. Opposition Members: Aah! Awee!

Mrs Masebo: Implementation is starting.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: For the first time, these fifteen districts will get money in the forthcoming 2013 Budget, which they would have never got had they not been declared districts. Rufunsa used to get money through Chongwe District, but it will now get its own allocation. Sir, we appreciate the creation of a new province, which is Muchinga. You all know that the administration of the Northern Province has always been a big challenge because it was so big that it was difficult to manage such that some of the districts were not being considered. Now that it has been divided, the two territories will be funded separately and also have separate staff establishments. The hon. Members on your left must be appreciative and admit that this is a good thing.

Sir, I am so surprised and shocked that, when this Government, under the leadership of this President called Michael Chilufya Sata, is implementing decentralisation, people are complaining and calling points of order, which are, in fact, just points of jealousy.

Laughter

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, with the creation of the fifteen districts and one province, this country is geared for better development, which is coming.

Mr Muntanga: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Hon. Government Member: Point of jealousy!

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister of Tourism and Arts in order to continue talking about other things, instead of explaining her policy on bungee-jumping between her, myself and Hon. G. B. Mwamba …

Laughter

Mr Muntanga: … as explained by the President? Is she in order not to give us the policy direction on bungee-jumping?

Laughter

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: My ruling is that I expect that, in due course, she will address that.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: May the hon. Minister, please, continue.

Mrs Masebo: Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Sir, one of the policy directions was that the hon. Minister of Defence and the hon. Member of Parliament for Kalomo Central should be taken to Livingstone to go and showcase Zambia by participating in the bungee-jumping on the bridge. However, I was just worried that the rope would break and they would die.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1815 hours until 1830 hours.

 [MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, before business was suspended, I had just started talking about the policy direction for the tourism sector.

Sir, I would like to wind up my debate by saying that, next year, Zambia and Zimbabwe will co-host the United Nations World Tourism Organisation (UNWTO) Conference, and I appeal to all hon. Members of Parliament to work together with us in showcasing Zambia. I also urge all hon. Members to avoid politicking during this conference. It is also my earnest appeal to the hon. Members of Parliament that we all get our people involved in domestic tourism as well as marketing the tourism sector to the world because that is key to the growth of the sector in any country. 

Sir, as a country, we have not done well in marketing Zambia’s tourism in the last forty or 100 years. However, it is pleasing to note that, since the PF assumed office, tourism is now being sufficiently marketed.

Mr Speaker, the PF Administration does not just talk, but also acts. Therefore, I appeal to the nation to give it a chance to rule and, after five years, judge for themselves whether or not the Government will have delivered to people’s expectations.

Mr Speaker, as a Government, if we proceed the way we are doing currently, Zambians will see light at the end of the tunnel. For instance, in my constituency, things are already happening. We have a university, secondary school and roads being constructed. Lighting and everything that the PF promised is being brought to fruition. Tourism is also on track. Just as the President stated in his speech to Parliament, it is clear that tourism is the way to go, and I urge everyone to become a tourist.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Ms Lubezhi (Namwala): Mr Speaker, I have with me two speeches, the one for the First Session of this the Eleventh National Assembly in this House, which had a very good agenda for Zambia, and the one for the current session. After the President presented his speech to this House last year, we went out and I told my hon. Colleagues on the left that we needed to pull up our socks because the PF meant business as evidenced from what was contained in that speech. So, I did not know how we would challenge them.

Sir, this year’s speech has given me hope because, now, I know that the PF has no agenda for this country.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, His Excellency the President, Mr Michael Chilufya Sata, acknowledged that poverty levels in this country are still very high. What is his Government’s policy on cushioning the plight of many Zambians?

Mr Speaker, in his speech, the President told this House that 75 per cent of the 2012 Budget has been released, but to whose benefit? Are there any developmental impacts that are being felt? The only notable thing from the 75 per cent implementation of the 2012 Budget is that of the hundred-and-one advance parties we see when the President is travelling out of the country and other administrative costs.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, if at all 75 per cent of the Budget has been released, this Government will go down in history as the only Government that has gone through one financial year without releasing the Constituency Development Funds (CDF) because I have not received the CDF in Namwala.

Mr Speaker, on page 15 of the President’s Speech, the one that was laid on the Table of this august House, he says, and I quote:

“My Government is in the process of establishing a Government-wide monitoring and evaluation system, which will enhance resource allocation and devolution system to projects.”

Sir, does this Government have the capacity to implement this, knowing that it is on record for not fulfilling implementing its many pronouncements?

Hon. Opposition Member: They do not have.

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, the PF Government does not have that capacity. The President also acknowledged that there is so much to be done, but what is it that these people are doing in their quest to help the President to achieve what he wants for this nation? President Sata, on the Floor of this House, pleaded with hon. Members of his Executive to be answering questions asked by fellow hon. Members, but what have we seen over the past week that we have been here? What have we been subjected to by these people?

Sir, the President told his Cabinet to respond to questions because he is trying to make Zambia better, but these hon. Members are failing their own President.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, when members of the Executive are asked questions, instead of responding, they refer us to their offices. Do we write questions on the Floor of the House so that we go to their offices for answers? The people of Zambia are listening to these debates and would want to hear what their Government has to say on issues that affect them and the nation. When questioned by other hon. Members, the members of the Executive get annoyed. They need to realise that we ask these questions because we want to be clear about those issues we question them on. Yet they even go to the extent of telling us that we are not operating on the same wave-length. Indeed, I would not want to operate on the same wave-length with an hon. Minister who cannot realise that vaccination is a preventive measure.

Sir, I would not want to operate on the same wave-length with an hon. Minister who cannot tell that a dip-tank is a long-term measure in fighting animal diseases. I would also not want to operate on the same wave-length with an hon. Minister who, when asked what was accumulated by Government institutions within a certain period at ZESCO, he tells us the figure is cumulative. Why can you not do simple subtraction and give us a figure? Obviously, I would not want to operate on the same wave-length with such an hon. Minister.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, I would not want to operate on the same wave-length with an hon. Minister who comes in this House and tells us that street vendors are street traders when I have never seen any SI to that effect, yet I am a member of the Committee on Delegated Legislation. Going by what has been happening, I wish Hon. Masumba was around …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: … because the President said that he lacked some leadership skills in his Executive. 

Sir, as I was saying, the President’s Speech gave me hope because the one year that the PF has been in office has been very disastrous. I expected the speech to highlight the challenges and the way forward, but that was not so. It was supposed to be an amplified vision because governance is a continuous process, but there is no connectivity whatsoever. It was as if it was a different PF when it is the same party.

Mr Speaker, I would agree that the mining sector is the economic hub of Zambia. However, looking at what is happening in this sector, we are not benefiting anything from it as a country. My hon. Colleague from Bweengwa mentioned the fact that the introduction of the mineral royalty tax, which we are happy about, was a positive move, and has worked to our disadvantage. The best we can do is to …

Mr Lubinda interjected.

Laughter

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, the best we can do in order for this mineral royalty tax to work to our advantage as a country is to repeal Article 43 (b) of the Mineral Act. As long as it remains the way it is with a high percentage, we will not benefit anything. The immediate solution I can think of is to reduce the percentage in the Act. Let it even come to 15 per cent. Then that way, maybe, you will never hear us talk about the windfall tax because we will be benefiting from the corporate tax.

Mr Speaker, the President, in his speech, said the mining sector has continued to perform very well but to whose benefit? Is it benefiting the investors or the country? Of course it is the investors who are benefiting from this good performance of the sector. How can we say the mining sector is doing fine when …

Interruptions

Laughter

Ms Lubezhi: Yes, I wanted to say the United Party for National Development (UPND) because I am proudly UPND. How can we say the mining sector is doing fine when we are collecting below 20 per cent of our national revenue from the sector? If we compare our gross domestic product (GDP) to other countries, we are the lowest in the region. We have enough resources in this country which we can manage to sustain the 13 million people but because we misdirect resources, nothing is happening in the country. 

Mr Speaker, if we look at Japan, what natural resources does it have, other than sea weed? However, the economy of Japan is doing fine. Why is it so? It is because they have the right people in public offices. They have the right policies in place in terms of taxation and so on and so forth. In Zambia that is not the case. I have always told people, even on the Floor of this House, that this country is very rich but poverty is in the heads of those entrusted to run the affairs of this nation.

Mr Speaker, I know that the Government has put in place mechanisms at the Bank of Zambia (BOZ) to monitor all exports. However, this is a country where copper is exported at all levels. We have seen trucks going out with those one-tonne bags, popularly known as ndandashe, as well as polished and raw copper direct from the mines. So, how is BOZ going to monitor that? What has the Government put in place to see that the figures of copper exports given by the mining companies are the true figures? The Government should employ people to monitor the whole process from mining and production up to the point of export.
 
Mr Kalaba: On a point of order, Sir.

Ms Lubezhi: Iwe, Kalaba.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Kalaba: Mr Speaker, I am trying very hard to make head and tail of the hon. Member’s debate. However, she has used a word on the Floor of this House called ‘ndandashe’ which, up to now, she has not translated so that we can all move on the same wavelength as she is saying. Is she in order to introduce words on the Floor of this House which are alien and sound like they are from Namwala? 

Hon. UPND Member: What is wrong with that?

Mr Speaker: Order! Let us not degenerate issues here. 

Please provide the explanation for those non-English terms, hon. Member.

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, ‘ndandashe’ means copper concentrates.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: I am afraid you were not heard.

Ms Lubezhi: I was not heard?

Mr Speaker: No!

Ms Lubezhi: It means copper concentrates.

Mr Speaker: I think it is preferable to just use the term ‘copper concentrates’. Then, we will avoid this kind of disruption.

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, it goes without saying that a fool finds no pleasure in understanding but delights in raising his own opinion.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Meaning what, hon. Member?

Ms Lubezhi: Meaning people would only want to air their own views without taking into consideration what the other person is trying to put across.

Mr Speaker: I think, hon. Member, sit down. This is a very simple matter. You used a strange word and the hon. Member wanted an explanation because he wants to follow your debate. May you withdraw that statement.

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, I withdraw it with pleasure.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, I expected the President’s Speech to highlight more on the Government’s agricultural policy. Coming from a constituency which is in a …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Proceed, hon. Member.

Ms Lubezhi: Considering the fact that I come from a constituency which has a lot of agricultural activities, I expected the Government’s agricultural policies to be defined in the President’s Speech. However, what we have seen is that there is nothing much that is being talked about in terms of agriculture. It even beats me more when even the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Livestock tells you that the first week of October is when the Government will start distributing inputs. Talking as somebody who comes from a farming background, the first week of October is too late for the distribution of inputs for either a commercial, peasant or backyard farmer. It is too late for practical farming unless for the rhetoric farming of the PF.

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, the Ruling Party has been talking about job creation. The agricultural sector can help it fulfill its job pronouncements. One particular area of interest is the textile industry, in relation to cotton. When the President went to the United Nations (UN) General Assembly, he talked about Zambia and Zimbabwe being Siamese twins. We are only twins when it comes to certain things. When it comes to agriculture we are not twins. Zimbabwe is taking care of its cotton farmers. Zimbabwe bought cotton from its farmers at 70 US cents but we are subjecting our farmers to 30 US cents, which they have not even been paid. 

Further, when the President was at the same UN meeting, he had a cocktail with some would-be investors and some of them were bankers. Do we need banks in Zambia today? Is the economy not already saturated with banks? I know there were pronouncements of a youth bank, which we do not know how it will operate. Maybe, those were the bankers he was soliciting so that they come to run the youth bank.

Ms Kalima: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, the inconsistence in this Government has reached alarming levels.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: On one side, this Government is talking about decentralisation by creating so many districts but, on the other side, it is centralising its functions. What has happened to the Road Development Agency (RDA)? It has been plucked from the Ministry of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication and the reason for that was said to be non-transparency in the awarding of road contracts. If the President himself cannot trust his own system, where does that leave the people of Zambia?

Interruptions

Ms Lubezhi: What has necessitated that move? Now that there is this outbreak of plucking portfolios from ministries, I see the Ministry of Finance losing the Treasury at BOZ to State House.

Laughter

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, I also see the Ministry of Mines, Energy and Water Development losing the control of ZESCO. I see the Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock losing the FRA to State House. I think the only ministry which will not lose anything is the Ministry of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs because there is no portfolio to pluck from there.

Mr Speaker, when we tell them that they have failed in the one year that they have been in office, they do not want to accept. Let me just give them a simple aptitude test.

Hon. UPND Members: Dossier!

Ms Lubezhi: They have not failed in everything. I will start with what they have scored high. They have scored highly in poor governance. 

Laughter

Ms Lubezhi: This is a Government that has constituted so many commissions of inquiry within the shortest possible time. You have scored zero in reducing the size of the Cabinet, restoring the Barotseland Agreement, providing a people driven Constitution within the shortest possible time and alleviating poverty by putting more money in people’s pockets especially the average Zambian who voted for you. You have also scored zero as regards creation of 1,000,000 jobs over a period of five years which, in simple arithmetic, would mean 250,000 jobs every year. Mr Speaker, the list is endless. 

However, one thing I know for sure is that some of the commissions of inquiries they have put in place have not yielded anything to the benefit of this country. You would find that the same companies that were being probed for oil deals are the same ones whose contracts have been renewed. We are still buying from the same sources and the fuel prices are still going up. Why then did we constitute these things? 

Hon. Member: We will arrest them.

Ms Lubezhi: Going by what Zambia is experiencing today, I would say that there is a national scandal due to the dismal performance for which this Government should be taken to task.

Hon. UPND Member: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: A commission of inquiry should be instituted on that Government to find out why there is this national scandal of not providing for its nationals.

Mr Speaker, we have heard so many things. If, truly, this is what it means to run a country with a rich political CV, having started as a councillor and serving in so many Government portfolios and running the country like this, Hah! I am glad my President HH has not started off like that.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, with these few words, I would urge our Government, …

Hon. UPND Members: Continue!

Laughter

Ms Lubezhi: … the PF Government to be listening to us when we give them advice because it is the only way they will remain in those seats. Hon. Muntanga has reminded them several times that when they do not listen, we are happy because we know that they are just helping us to get onto the other side. The people out there are listening. In economics, there is a law of diminishing returns …

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: … and it is working so much on you.

Interruptions

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, with these few words, I beg to move.

Mr Muntanga: No, why?

Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Speaker, to start with, I would like to extend my condolences to the First Republican President of Zambia. 

Sir, I would also like to congratulate the new hon. Minister for ‘Justs’.

Laughter

Hon. Member: Justice!

Mr Mutelo: I also extend congratulations to the youth appointed as hon. Deputy Ministers such as Hon. Kampyongo.

Hon. Member: Question!

Mr Mutelo: Sir, the President’s Speech brought out one word called ‘parley’ which means talk or speak. Another word which came out was ‘gap’. The President talked of the gap between the urban and rural people. Indeed, there is a gap and as long as this gap is not handled with care, we will have chaos.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutelo: The gap also applies to the fact that you have so many non-governmental organisations (NGOs) here in Lusaka and none in Lukulu West.

Hon. Member: Mucheleka!

 Mr Mutelo: You have schools where you build walls here in Lusaka while we have schools made of mud and pole. You have all the towers here in Lusaka but there is no single tower in Lukulu West. As long as this gap is there, there will be chaos.

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: There is too much concentration on the urban areas. You have all the roads. You have a tarmac road from Cairo Road to Kalingalinga. There is no tarmac road from Katunda to Lukulu. 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutelo: There is no gravel road from Lukulu to Washishi.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Kalima: Chaos!

Mr Mutelo: As long as these things remain like this, … 

Hon. Opposition Members: Chaos!

Mr Mutelo: … we are headed for yet another word which the President mentioned.

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: Doom!

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: The more we narrow the gap between the rural and the urban; the more we will be doing something for this nation. The gap is too wide. We have all the intellectuals and all the educated people here in Lusaka. We have none in Lukulu.

Hon Members: Chaos!

Mr Mutelo: We are saying that we are building primary and secondary schools, but there is no secondary school in Lukulu West. I have even gone through this document which has just been released for 2012/2013. It does not have even a single secondary school for Lukulu.

Hon. Government Members:  It is there. What about Miteto?

Mr Mutelo: There is one community you are building and that community, thank you very much, will become the street traders. As long you do not build schools in Lukulu West, we will become street traders. Sir, that gap has to be narrowed. It has to be thought of carefully. The President mentioned the right thing. 

Mr Speaker, the people on your right need to listen to facts no matter how painful they might be. We need to have the facts tabled and the left side has the facts. It is a fact that Lukulu Road is bad. It is a fact that as it is starting to rain now, we are in danger. It is a fact that there is no pontoon on the Zambezi River crossing from Lukulu East to Lukulu West. It is a fact that relief maize, even up to now, is not distributed in Lukulu West because there is nowhere to cross. It is a fact that you can access Liuwa National Park via Lukulu West, but there is no road there. Take care of these facts.

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: Surely, the answer will come. The real answer shall come one day. We have heard of the 650 clinics. How many will go to the rural areas, and what about the staff and houses for those clinics? We were given K100 million verbally, for an immigration office at Washishi, on the Floor of this House, but to date, the money is not there. We are here as a team. However, there is one thing about a team and that is scoring. Let the Zambia National Team play any other team. If they win, we are part and parcel of the win. If they lose, we will say that it is them who lost. Therefore, team work will only be welcome when we score as a nation economically. Further, team work will only be welcome when we score as a democracy in a number of important areas such as the Judiciary. It is one-sided team work when you have Mulakupikwa University and Palabana on one side, and no university in the Western province. Is that team work?

Hon. Opposition Members: No!

Mr Mutelo: You commissioned 8,000 km of roads. We do not need thousands of kilometres in Lukulu. We may need only 400 km out of those thousands of kilometres to reach Lukulu. It is high time we worked as a team to develop other parts of the country. 

Mr Speaker, it is dangerous to over promise. I wish to urge the PF not to over promise. They should just deliver. Then, they will not be doomed. It is better to just deliver and let your success tell the story.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutelo: If you over promise you, will be caught up in your promises. This team work we are talking about has reminded me of one phrase which is:“All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal.” We came here with a question: 250 cars enter Zambia daily, 6,000 monthly and 70, 000 per year. However, where are the roads? Make the Lukulu Road and you will help sort out the Lusaka traffic if you do that. Make the Bottom Road, too. If you do not make these roads, one day you will be stuck in here.

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: In Lukulu West, there is only my vehicle and there are no traffic lights.

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: If you do not make the roads, you will have traffic jams. Consider how many hours you are taking just to reach your work place in Lusaka. What time do you wake up, and how long do you take to reach your office from Kalingalinga? That team work will only do if we work together for common a goal. I repeat, if we will not score, it will tell at the end of our journey. There will be one term only for Hon. Mutelo if he does not deliver, and there will be one term only for the Government if it will not work.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutelo: Mr Speaker, an individual’s tenure is determined by performance. We can talk and do whatever we can. However, if we will not deliver, we will be caught up by our failure. The MMD was caught up by its failures even after they made the Mutanda/Chavuma Road. Let as build the Katunda/Lukulu Road as the PF. Let us have something we can point at and say twalingikwebi …

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order!

What does that mean?

Mr Mutelo: Mr Speaker, it means that this is what we have done.

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: People are listening. It is about what we will do and not what we say. There is only one school in Lukulu West, which is Mukuma. The one school that is there is a primary school which is made of poles and mud. There is also a school which is 18km from the civic centre in Lukulu which is also made of poles and mud.

Mr Speaker, the pain I feel due to lack of development in Lukulu West makes me feel like crying. We have the mobile hospital as part of our health system. Despite the mobile hospital being made for the rural set up, it has never been to Lukulu West. One year is gone and nothing significant has happened despite the PF promising changes in ninety days. Zambians have given us ninety days times four, which is another year. Zambians are very good. They have given us another ninety days times four. Come next year, you should be able to show us where you will have scored. You can, at least, tell us how by then you will have done the Lukulu Road. It will do for us if, out of the 650 clinics, one is in Lukulu West. It will not do to have 650 health posts without any in Lukulu West. 

Mr Speaker, rural people are clever. If you do not take roads, clinics and schools to rural areas, they will come to the streets of Lusaka and be vendors because that is what you are subjecting them to. That is not good.

Hon. Government Member interjected.

Mr Mutelo: Who did not come from a rural area here?

Hon. Opposition Members: Scott!

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: Who, here, is not proud of his village?

Hon. Opposition Members: Guy Scott!

Mr Mutelo: Sir, the gap between rural and urban areas is too wide. The gap in between Lukulu Boma and Washishi is too wide. Let us narrow this gap. It will help. There is no white man in Lukulu West …

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: … for me to befriend. If I had a white friend, maybe, I would have been taking leave from this place to go and smoke outside. 

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: At least, the President had one.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Laughter

Mr Mutelo: Mr Speaker, let me now talk about rural electrification. Despite us bringing our charcoal and timber to urban areas, we are still not given any electricity.

Mr Speaker, with a bleeding heart, I urge the Government to narrow the gap between rural and urban areas in terms of development. If that is not done, they will be doomed.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mbulakulima (Chembe): Mr Speaker, I thank you for this rare opportunity, more so, having to come after the great son of Lukulu West.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Mr Mbulakulima: Sir, I thank you for this opportunity to make a few comments on the President’s Speech.

Mr Speaker, as alluded to by my colleagues, I had difficulties in finding issues to discuss. I believe that the President missed the opportunity to set the tone for this country’s development. I went through the speech and picked ten items. Out of ten, I was particularly impressed by one item. This one comes as a piece of advice to my colleagues.

Sir, on page 5, the President said:

“I had the benefit of serving under a One-party State, which had an Opposition group within. There was no Opposition per se. However, we, who sat on the Back-bench were the Opposition and we took the hon. Ministers to task. I, therefore, urge my brothers on the Back-bench, Middle-bench and the Opposition, to take these hon. Ministers to task.” 

Mr Speaker, when we were in office, our colleagues, now in Government, were eager to say, if your Government makes a mistake and you do not agree with it, it is important to state it because you are representing the people. After doing my research, I discovered that the current Back-bench is the worst we have had since 1964.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mbulakulima: Sir, most of the people made names as Back-Benchers and later became hon. Ministers. The great sons of this country such as Mr Valentine Kayope were Back-benchers who spoke for the people. This was within a One-party State under the United National Independence Party (UNIP). There were great men like Mr Ben Zulu and Mr Chindoloma within the MMD. However, what we see now is different. For 365 days, no one has emerged as a real Back-bencher to provide checks and balances. This is a source of worry.

Mr Speaker, the concept of sebana utobele (politics of the stomach) is not good. This is what we are practising. 

Sir, I believe that with the President setting the tone here, the Back-bench will be able to stand and point out issues on behalf of the people out there instead of praising the Government every time.

Mr Speaker, the President also urged people to stop spilling of blood and electoral violence. Then he went on to talk about the Public Order Act. All the things he said regarding these issues did not go down well with me. Who was he telling to stop fighting or spilling blood? It is purely the members of the PF who do that.

Sir, for example, at the Cathedral when the UPND President was confronted by PF cadres, he did not have any cadres with him. I expected the President to condemn what happened and set the tone on how things should be. People at the Cathedral were harassed despite the announcement and warning by the police that violence was not going to be condoned. The cadres were at the Cathedral on the actual day chanting slogans while clenching their fists. This is not good for the country.

Sir, I believe that the PF Government will take note and correct the situation because we know who the fighters are. The police also like going round the problem. If it was the MMD or UPND cadres, they would have dealt with them, but because they know who is involved, they choose to do nothing.

Sir, let me now talk about the Public Order Act which I believe is being misused. We wanted the President to set the tone and tell us exactly how we are going to govern this country.

Mr Speaker, you recall that hardly two hours after losing the elections, the PF was on the road, campaigning. It is now over one year without the UPND and MMD holding any public rallies. We are stopped even from spending just a little time together. 

Hon. Opposition members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mbulakulima: Was there any logic for this Government to stop, for example, the UPND from having a rally in Kanyama? The excuse was because of the football which was taking place, but we clearly saw that there were more police officers in Kayama than in Ndola. That kind of approach, hon. Colleagues, brings tension in the country. What has HH done to you? Why are you afraid of him?

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Address the Speaker.

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, it is a pity that the police have fallen into a trap. I wonder why the Lusaka Province Police Chief  …

Hon. Opposition Member: Dr Jere!

Mr Mbulakulima: Dr Jere? He is a doctor in what?

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: He came on television to tell us that he had stopped two busloads which were coming from Southern Province to Lusaka. He was even laughing. What law was he using? Does he not know the simple basic law of human rights in the United Nations (UN) 1945 Charter? Does he not know what the 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights says about the freedom of expression and freedom of movement? 

Are you going to govern the country in this manner? Yet he claims that he is a doctor … 

Laughter 

Mr Mbulakulima: … and he is smiling because he has stopped people from entering Lusaka. We cannot allow that, colleagues. 

Sir, if anything … 

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

People on the right, may we stop the running commentaries. You will have an opportunity to respond. Just take notes.

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, I believe that the Inspector-General of Police has failed the people of Zambia. She is the one who is building tension in this country, and it is my sincere hope that the hon. Minister of Home Affairs will take note of these shortcomings.

Sir, the Public Order Act is not a licence to stop the Opposition from having public rallies. We believe that this Act has been misused by our colleagues. I would like to suggest that, if all means fail, we will appeal to the international courts because we cannot continue like this.

Mr Speaker, His Excellency the President said that if they did everything in one year, there would be nothing for the Opposition to talk about.

Hon. Opposition Member: Sure?

Mr Mbulakulima: I believe that this Government has failed and failed lamentably.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, His Excellency the President is in tune with what Hon. Kambwili has been consistently talking about, and I agree with him. He said that, when you marry a woman, you must have a child of your own to consolidate and strengthen your marriage. He puts it as ukufyalamo. When will this Government bear its own children?

Sir, a whole year, 365 days, has passed, yet the PF is still priding itself on achievements that resulted from the efforts and initiatives of the MMD.

Interjections

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

Hon. Opposition Member: It is true!

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, our colleagues may sit here saying ‘Aah’, but the people of Zambia are aware of their non-performance. You go to Nyimba and commission the houses that the MMD built. You go to Ndola and commission the stadium that the MMD built. You go to Kitwe and commission the houses that we left. The only thing that they have to talk about are the MFEZs.

Sir, even the current price of maize, the number of fertiliser bags accessible to farmers and the Eurobond are part of what we left. What are the original ideas that the PF can claim to have achieved? Intolerance?

Hon. Opposition Member: Donchi Kubeba 

Mr Mbulakulima: Sir, even the MMD made promises when it was campaigning, and you were there, although some of you could have been very young. The majority of you were there.

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: Dr Chiluba made it very clear that, when he came into office, the shortage of essential commodities in this country would be a thing of the past. However, he also said that the people’s purchasing power might take a bit of time to improve. We also mentioned that sleeping at bus stations would be a thing of the past. If you recall, hardly four months after the MMD assumed power, the transport system in this country was transformed and the dignity of the travelling public was restored. 

Sir, when the late Third Republican President, Mr Levy Mwanawasa, SC., that brave son of Africa, came to power, he mentioned the rule of law; the need for the respect of mankind, on the first day, and that was his message until he died. There was no abuse of authority and abuse of power by the police.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Interruptions

Hon. Opposition Members: Mr Kabimba knows.

Mr Mbulakulima: Sir, within four months, the kwacha had gained by 2,500 against the United States Dollar. That is the change that the people wanted. What can any reasonable Zambian attribute to the PF? The party is a total failure.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mbulakulima: The Zambian people knew that the MMD was performing. However, the expectation was that, where the MMD was building fifty schools, the PF would come and build 150. 

Hon. Opposition Member: Yes!

Mr Mbulakulima: Where the MMD was building twenty houses, the PF would come and build fifty. That was what the people expected. It can be related to the change that we saw during the Africa Cup of Nations. When Herve Renard saw that Chamanga was not playing to the expected level, he brought in Mayuka and, within five minutes, there was a goal.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, that was the change that the people of Zambia were expecting from the PF, not the change that took place when Zambia was playing Libya and Renard put in Mbesuma only to remove him ten minutes later. 

Laughter 

Mr Mbulakulima: If the people had the opportunity to have elections today, the PF would be voted out. It has failed.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear! 

Mr Mbulakulima: Sir, that is the change that the people of Zambia expected from them. What can our colleagues boast of? What have they done?

Hon. Opposition Member: Taking Masumba

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, we believe that the Government is contradicting itself on decentralisation. The creation of districts is an area of concern. When we want to bring changes, like it happens with respect to constituencies, there is a delimitation exercise that is done by experts to advise on the boundaries, taking into account every factor before a district can be moved or divided. What we have seen, however, are haphazard initiatives. For example, there is a need for the creation of more districts in the North-Western and Western provinces. Even the so-called district in my area called Chembe has been refused by the people and it is not welcome. His Honour the Vice-President must take his time and research to find out whether Chembe District has made sense to the people of that area.

Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister for Local Government and Housing should take note of the fact that the circulars coming from her PS are detrimental to decentralisation. She should take charge if she is, indeed, in charge.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mbulakulima: Sir, we are not impressed and will not accept it because it is a contradiction of what the Government is trying to preach. I am glad that the hon. Minister of Finance is here because, if the Budget is brought here and those circulars continue circulating, then we are not going to take part in that kind of debate. He is now defeating the whole purpose of the CDF. Who told him that was the way to go? Ala!

Laughter

Mr Speaker: May the hon. Member withdraw that expression.

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, I withdraw the expression.

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, the idea of creating districts and ministries could have been alright, but the manner in which they are being done is wrong. An example that I could cite is the Ministry of Health. The three pillars of Health in that ministry are: 

(i)public health;

(ii)primary health care; and

(iii)curative.

Sir, the first two have been taken to the Ministry of Community Development, Mother and Child Health. What has been left in the other ministry? It is just a skeleton. 

Hon. Opposition Member: Ask Dr Kasonde.

Mr Mbulakulima: Where is Dr Kasonde? It is not about Imilimo yabenakale. 

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: Where is he? He has run away. He would have advised.

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: Sir, the three pillars of health have been confused. The district and provincial levels have been confused in terms of reporting. 

Mr Speaker, the fight against corruption was an MMD programme that was hijacked by our colleagues. What is happening at Government Printers? What is happening there and who is behind it?

Hon. Opposition Member: ZESCO poles.

Mr Mbulakulima: Who is behind those ZESCO poles?

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: We also want to know the people who have been renovating the ablution blocks here. I have requested Hon. Namulambe to raise a question on that so that we may find out who the owners of the company renovating the ablution blocks are.

Mr Speaker, the high levels of poverty are worrisome. When our colleagues came into power, they thought it was easy to fight poverty.  They criticised us, yet they have not done anything. Now, they are quiet. They thought that, when they came into office, there would be no wheelbarrow pushers. Have they disappeared?

Hon. Opposition Members: No!

Mr Mbulakulima: They were saying that there would be no stone-crashers and street vendors. Have they disappeared? I bring you greetings from Chief Mwanya, from the Eastern Province. Mwanya is greeting you.

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: Mwanya.

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: Did you think it was easy?

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: I think, now, you can see how governance is. 

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, the Constitution issue is a mess. We should also compare light with light. The MMD had set the pace and 95 per cent of the job over the Constitution had been done. You only needed to iron out a few issues, such as the 50 per cent plus one, dual citizenship and running mate Vice-President. We did not need another commission for us to spend another K95 billion. Where is the roadmap for the referendum? One year has passed, but nothing has been done, yet they promised that a new Constitution would be ready within ninety days. 

Mr Speaker, even Americans said that they would do it in 100 days but, instead, they reviewed the process. In Zambia, one year down the line, we are nowhere near having a new Constitution, but our colleagues believe that they are on the right path. 

Mr Speaker, the people of Milenge are crying. In Milenge, there is no running water or electricity. The area has been re-classified from remote to something else so that the allowances for teachers have been withdrawn. Even the graduate retention and extra-duty allowances have been withdrawn, yet they had promised the people more money in their pockets. Further, these rural areas do not have any good facilities for the teachers. The people of Milenge have no kind words for you. Colleagues, you have to pull up your socks. Having gone through the speech, my opinion is that it was not inspiring. It was hollow and shallow. I believe that, next time, we can do much better.

Mr Speaker, with these few words, I thank you.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa (Nalikwanda): Mr Speaker, thank you very much for the opportunity to make some reflections on this speech. Before I go into details, I would like to add my voice to those welcoming Hon. Wynter Munachambwa Kabimba to the House. 

Hon. Kabimba indicated assent.

Professor Lungwangwa: Sir, as hon. Minister of Justice, you will have the very difficult task of managing our good governance programme which we are being reviewed on through the Peer Review Mechanism (PRM) of the Southern African Development Community (SADC) countries. As a learned hon. Member, we expect you to adhere to the highest virtues, which characterise the consensus of the learned. The consensus of the learned, the group to which you belong, is that, even in the bitter subjectivity of co-existence, one maintains objectivity. That is the ontology of the nation. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, the speech that we have before us, presented to the House by His Excellency the President, can be summarised in one word: lamentations. It is nothing, but the lamentations of the Presidency. That is exactly what His Excellency presented when he was in the House that Friday. What are the basic characteristics of the lamentations of the President? First of all, the President’s Speech reflects his heart, mind and soul with regard to the way he sees things in the nation. Clearly, as far as the lamentations are concerned, the President paid a lot of critical attention to his Cabinet. He was very forceful in informing his Cabinet, the Executive, that, indeed, they had a challenge in as far as delivering development to the people of Zambia was concerned. The gowns that they are putting on, the gowns of leadership, must be reflected in development for all the people of Zambia. Clearly, what he stated is how he saw things. 

Sir, first of all, those who were able to read between the lines of the President’s Speech saw that he was telling his Cabinet members that time for theatrical disposition in the House is long gone. They had had one year of theatre; …

Laughter

Professor Lungwangwa: … playing to the gallery where they thought they could hide in the blame game. All they did on the Floor of the House was to blame the former Government. The President was telling them that that time is long gone. They should deliver because they are now in charge. They should show the people of Zambia that they can do it. They should not be theatrical and play to the gallery. We want to see results. That is why the President lamented that the expertise is on this side of the House. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: He was challenging them. Indeed, if you took him very seriously, you should have made a critical self-assessment as to whether you are actually delivering in the way that the Zambian people would like to see you do. That was the lamentation of the President.

Sir, the other lamentation of the President was that the members of his Cabinet were supposed to recognise the achievements of their colleagues who had been in the offices that they occupied. That is governance and humility. The President was telling the Executive not to be arrogant, but humane, listen to criticism and, of course, improve. Clearly, in those lamentations of the President, he was very straightforward and categorical in the advice that he gave to the Executive members of this House. 

Mr Speaker, for example, when the President said that the Vision 2030 and the Sixth National Development Plan would be the frameworks for the development of our country, he was telling them to read those documents. He was telling them to reflect on those things and be able to operate in the context of how their colleagues who were there before them gave a lot of thinking to the direction of this country.

For example, when the President outlined the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP), this was in recognition of the effort of the previous Government and how good it was for the people of Zambia. When the President stated that the development of the optic fiber in the country would continue in order to improve communication, he was actually telling the Executive that the previous Government started this programme. One cannot deny this because it is a fact. We went all the way to install the optic fiber in the districts, connecting Zambia to the undersea cables and we are about to see an improvement in Internet connectivity. That was an admission by the President of the work that was done by the former Government. When the President stated that we will continue with the habilitation of provincial airports, that is work that was already started. 

Mr Speaker, for instance, when one looks at the projects in Chipata, Mansa, Livingstone, Kasama and Solwezi, he/she cannot deny or challenge the fact that these were projects that were started by the previous Government, because that is the truth. The President lamented about the current Government should acknowledge those facts and actually build on them. When the President talked about the pre-feasibility studies on the Chipata/Mchinji Railway Line connecting it to either Mpika or Serenje, that was what was done early last year and you will build on that. If you read the Road Sector Investment Programme (ROADSIP) II, …

Hon. Government Members: Question!

Professor Lungwangwa: … Road Maintenance Initiative (RMI) documents and the Sixth National Development Plan, then you see that those infrastructure development plans are already outlined. The challenge is that our colleagues are not reading, and we would like them to read. You cannot be an effective hon. Minister if you do not read. Sit down and read those documents and you will able to work for the people of Zambia better. The President said you should sit here and listen to the criticism from this side of the House. We will take the Government to task and also play our role of providing checks and balances for the development of this country. So, in line with the President’s directive, you should know that we are not here to shower you with praises. You are wearing very important gowns which are important for the people of Zambia, and we want to see to it that development is delivered.

Mr Speaker, the President lamented about the need for guidance. The speech made reference to the universities, and I know that there are many people in this House who have been to various universities. A few weeks ago, I was looking at the 1981 graduation booklet, and I saw the name of Hon. Kabimba as well as the hon. Minister of Home Affairs and Deputy Chief Whip’s name and a few others. We are the guardians of our time, and we have to be very serious about how we deliver development to the people of Zambia in all parts of the country. This should be done equitably, regardless of the situation our people are in. The President, indeed, lamented for guidance. When we look at the President’s attention to universities, there is no model of how the universities are going to be constructed.

Mr Speaker, if we look at the development of universities here, in Africa, the first universities in Africa which include Makerere, Achimota College and the University of Salisbury, were built on the model of metropolitan university colleges during the colonial days. If you look at the post-independence public universities like the University of Zambia (UNZA), Dar-es-salaam, Nairobi and so on and so forth, they were constructed on the model of national reconstruction of enabling them to play their role as institutions of national self-determination and independence.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: Then, you have the third-generation universities such as the University of Eldoret in Kenya, the Copperbelt University (CBU) and others which were built on the model of disciplines which are important for specific developments like engineering, agriculture and so on and so forth. If you look at the fourth-generation universities, and these are predominately private universities, they are constructed on the model of business.

Mr Speaker, universities do not just spring up. They have clearly-defined missions and visions. For instance, UNZA was constructed on the vision of service and excellence for the development of this country so that those of us who went through that university should be able to display excellence in whatever we do. For instance, a French philosopher Voltaire de Vie once said, “When we are handling issues of democracy, I have to say that I may not accept what you believe or agree with you, but I will defend your right to say it.” That is important for our democracy. So, the President was lamenting about the need for guidance. Hon. Minister of Health, if you look at the documents in your office, you will find a very big document which was developed by a team that was sent round the country to identify green fields for the development of universities and this document is there for you to make use of. During our time, we thought of developing universities along the model of land-grant universities, like the American universities. The land-grant university is specific to the problems of a particular locality. For instance, if you look at the land-grant university model in America, like the University of Illinois at Urbana–Champaign where I did my Doctor of Philosophy Degree (PHD), it was there to undertake teaching, research and public service which are specific to the problems of the locality, and that is development. If the hon. Minister will take time and ask the Permanent Secretary or Director of Planning, they will be able to give you the big document which indicates the universities to be constructed in the country on a clearly thought-out-model than what is happening at the moment where universities are being placed in different parts of the country on the basis of appeasement. That is not the way universities are supposed to be built. This is the lamentation of the President. He wants guidance from you. 

Laughter

Professor Lungwangwa: This is the role that you should play. 

For instance, the construction of Mulakupikwa University started in 2008. The construction of this university college did not start last year. It has its own history. Study those documents. This is the lamentation of the President. 

Mr Speaker, one of the opportunities missed by the President in the speech is the management of post-election periods. Throughout Africa, the management of post-election periods has been a challenge. In 2008, there was post-election disaster in Kenya and many people died. The same has happened in Zimbabwe, the Congo and Ivory Coast. In Zambia, the post-election period is characterised by a lot bitterness. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, there is a lot of bitterness in this country. People fight on the streets. We have many other problems such as human rights violations, abuse of the instruments of power by the police and other forces. All these are challenges in the management of a post-election period. The President should have taken time to create hope in the people about where this country is going. There was a need for him to talk about peace, stability and national unity. These are extremely important values …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: … that ought to build our nation. 

Zambia has been characterised as an oasis of peace and tranquility. This is a basis for the attraction of private sector investment to the country. The President should have taken advantage of this and created hope for the nation by looking at the post-election challenges much more seriously for the good of the country. 

Mr Speaker, with these few reflections, I would like to thank you, once again, for the opportunity to contribute to debate on the President’s Speech. 

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Order!

ADJOURNMENT

The Vice-President (Dr Scott): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn. 

Question put and agreed to.

_____

The House adjourned at 1953 hours until Wednesday, 3rd October, 2012.