Thursday, 24th February, 2022

Thursday, 24^th February, 2022

[MADAM SPEAKER, in the Chair]

The House met at 1430 hours

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

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ANNOUNCEMENT BY MADAM SPEAKER

ESTABLISHMENT OF THE ZAMBIA YOUTH PARLIAMENTARY CAUCUS

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, I wish to inform the House that management has approved the establishment of the Zambia Youth Parliamentary Caucus (ZYPC). The objectives of the caucus include the following:

to build solidarity among youthful hon. Members of Parliament;
to influence youth policy and legislative agenda through cross-party co-operation; and
to facilitate dialogue on youth issues among communities and political parties.

In accordance with the practice in other parliaments, and in line with the Inter-Parliamentary Union’s (IPU) definition of a youth parliamentarian, the ZYPC will be open for membership to parliamentarians who are forty-five years and below. In addition, membership has been extended to all hon. Members who were forty-five years at the time of their election to the National Assembly.

In view of the foregoing, the Office of the Clerk will circulate membership forms to eligible hon. Members. The filled membership forms should be handed back to the Office of the Clerk not later than Friday, 4^th March, 2022.

Thank you.

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MATTERS OF URGENT PUBLIC IMPORTANCE

MR MTAYACHALO, MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT FOR CHAMA NORTH, ON THE HON. MINISTER OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS AND INTERNATIONAL CORPORATION, ON HIS SILENCE ON THE SITUATION IN UKRAINE

Mr Mtayachalo (Chama North): Madam Speaker, the matter I wish to raise is directed at the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs and International Corporation.

Madam Speaker, following the decision by the Russian Government to send thousands of troops to the border with Ukraine, tension in the region has been rising. Tension has further been heightened following the decision by President Putin to recognise the two break-away regions of Ukraine, that is, Donetsk and Luhansk. Several attempts by the international community to reach a negotiated peaceful settlement have proved futile. When war breaks out, lives and property are at great risk.

Madam Speaker, is the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs and International Corporation in order to keep quiet without updating this nation or this august House? I presume that we have Zambian students and those who are working in Ukraine.

Madam Speaker, I seek your guidance.

MR J. E. BANDA, MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT FOR PETAUKE, ON HER HONOUR THE VICE-PRESIDENT, ON YOUTHS COMMITTING SUICIDE IN THE COUNTRY

Mr J. E. Banda (Petauke): Madam Speaker, thank you for giving the good people of Petauke a chance.

Madam Speaker, in the past two months, we have seen many youths posting on social media that they want to commit suicide, and after that, they usually commit suicide. The same disease called suicide has claimed many lives in Zambia. What is the good Government, the New Dawn Government, doing to curb this disease called suicide, which is more deadly than the Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19)?

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Petauke, the point that you have raised is on which institution? Could you assist us with that so that we know whom to direct it at. Which ministry are you directing that at?

Mr J. E. Banda: Madam Speaker, it is directed at Her Honour the Vice-President.

MR MUNG’ANDU, MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT FOR CHAMA SOUTH, ON HER HONOUR THE VICE-PRESIDENT, ON FLOODS IN CHAMA SOUTH CONSTITUENCY

Mr Mung’andu (Chama South): Madam Speaker, I am raising this matter on Her Honour the Vice-President.

Madam Speaker, Chama South has been experiencing floods of unprecedented levels. As I speak to you right now, more than thirty houses in two chiefdoms, that is, Chief Chikwa in Manga area and Chief Chifunda in Zebe area have been flooded, affecting even the few chickens that the people there have been keeping. They have been totally washed away.

Madam Speaker, I engaged the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) National Co-ordinator, a very co-operative young person, Dr Pollen, and he indicated that he has challenges of funding. As I speak, the people of Buli are in water. The people of Tembwe are in water. The entire constituency has completely been cut off from other areas.

Madam Speaker, is Her Honour the Vice-President in order to remain quiet instead of sourcing funds so that our ever co-operating partner, the Zambia Air Force (ZAF), can go to the rescue of the poor people of Chama South in these areas?

Madam Speaker, I need your serious ruling.

Madam Speaker: I will start with the last matter. Hon. Member for Chama South, the point that you have raised is not only peculiar to Chama South; the floods have had an impact on the whole country. If you have been following the order of proceedings, you would be aware that today, Her Honour the Vice-President is making a statement. So, maybe you can wait and listen to the statement that she is going to deliver and then you can ask questions on that matter.

On the Ukraine situation, the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs and International Corporation can update the House in terms of what the foreign policy is on that issue and the likely impact of this standoff between Ukraine and Russia so that through this House, the people of Zambia can be notified and be made aware of what the policy of the country is on that issue.

On the issue of suicide, just like accidents, there have been many cases of suicidal people. Maybe, Her Honour the Vice-President’s Office – I do not know which ministry should be involved here, the Ministry of Community Development and Social Services most likely would be the best to brief the House, and through this House, the country, on what is happening on this issue where people are threatening to commit suicide and others are actually committing suicide in the process. We need to know what the position of the ministry is since the hon. Member for Petauke has raised the issue. The people of Petauke are concerned and want to know the answer. The ministry can shed some light on the issue and how these cases can be controlled or prevented.

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MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

PROLONGED DRY SPELL AND FLOODING DURING THE 2021/2022 RAINY SEASON

The Vice-President (Mrs Nalumango): Madam Speaker, I wish to thank you sincerely for granting me this opportunity to deliver a statement to this august House, and through this House, the nation at large. This is regarding two issues of great importance to the New Dawn Government and Zambians at large. These are: the prolonged dry spell at the beginning of the 2021/2022 Rainy Season and the flood situation in the country during the 2021/2022 Rainy Season.

Madam Speaker, let me begin by defining a disaster. According to the Disaster Management Act No. 13 of 2010, a disaster is:

“An event that is associated with the impact of human-induced or natural hazard, which causes a serious disruption in the functioning of a community or society, causing widespread human, material or environmental losses which exceed the ability of the affected community or society to cope with the hazard using its own resources.”

Madam Speaker, it is important to emphasise that this event disrupts the functioning of a community or society and the affected community or society has no capacity to cope using its own resources. Having defined a disaster, I believe that the hon. Members of this august House do understand and will, therefore, in future, interpret the same correctly.

Madam Speaker, to continue with the rest of my statement, I will state the impact of the dry spells experienced before the onset of the rains in some parts of the country. As forecasted by the Zambia Meteorological Department, the country was expected to receive normal to above normal rainfall in the 2021/2022 Rainy Season. However, the North-Eastern part of the country was projected to have a delayed onset. Although the rainy season was projected to be established by the end of November, 2021 in most parts of the country, it was only towards the end of December, 2021 that continuous rainfall started. The delayed onset was experienced in the North-Eastern, Central, Lusaka, the Southern and the Western parts of the country.

Madam Speaker, due to the delayed onset of rainfall, it was only in December, 2021 that the country’s staple crop, maize, was being planted across most parts of the country, which is about a month late compared to the normal situation. The negative impact also included the following:

for farmers who planted in early November, 2021, there was generally poor germination due to insufficient soil moisture resulting in many farmers acquiring extra seed for replanting, subsequently leading to increased production costs;
there is a likelihood of reduction in areas planted for most crops; and
the dry spells also created a conducive environment for the outbreak of fall armyworms. A total of 158,010 ha belonging to 269,273 farmers were adversely affected by fall armyworms. However, in response to the outbreak of fall armyworms, the Government, through the Ministry of Agriculture, distributed 110,000 litres of pesticide to all the ninety-four affected districts in the country. Most of the affected farmers have been able to access these chemicals through their respective agricultural extension officers.

Madam Speaker, the House may wish to note that prolonged dry spells pose a threat to the national food security situation, particularly if the rainy season does not run its full course as would be required to nurture maturity of crops.

Madam Speaker, the Government has been proactive rather than reactive. Among other preparedness measures, the Government procured drought sovereign insurance with the African Risk Capacity (ARC) to cover farmers’ yields against the impact of drought and dry spells for a total premium amount of US$1 million. The Government of the Republic of Zambia contributed US$200,000, while the Swiss Agency for Development and Cooporation (SDC) and the African Union (AU) through the Multi-Donor Trust Fund (MDTF) covered the rest. The country is expecting a pay-out of at least US$2,500,000, which will invariably cushion the impact of dry spells.

Madam Speaker, the Government has also been providing early warning information such as agricultural advisories to farmers, to prepare and respond to changing weather conditions. These advisories have included advising farmers to plant vegetables and alternative crops such as cowpeas, a departure from dependence on maize and a focus on holistic nutrition, in the quest for food security. The Government, through the Ministry of Agriculture, has also been monitoring stock levels to ascertain the food security situation in the country.

Impact of Floods on the Affected Communities Countrywide

Madam Speaker, allow me now to proceed to discuss the impact of floods on the affected communities across the country. The House may wish to note that following the episode of dry spell, the start of rains came with flooding incidences of varying degrees in all provinces adversely affecting 7,020 households across the country as at 14^th February, 2022. The flooding situation has been characterised by loss of human lives. Six lives were lost due to flash floods; four in the Southern Province, one in the Eastern Province and one life was lost in the Western Province.

Madam Speaker, further 1,066 households have been displaced from their habitual residents, though some displaced households have reportedly re-intergrated into nearby communities. Currently, 433 households are in temporary camps which have been established in Namwala, Monze and Mwandi districts, as well as an additional ten households in Chipulukusu, Mapalo Ward in Ndola which had their homes affected by floods and heavy rains.

Madam, given the nature and intensity of the flooding, transport and communication links in terms of associated infrastructure such as roads, crossing points and bridges have been damaged or washed away hindering economic activities and disturbing normal functioning of some communities.

Madam Speaker, based on reports reaching our regional offices at least a total of 107 bridges and crossing points have been damaged or washed away. While 130 schools and forty-six health posts have had roofs blown off during the 2021/2022 Rainy Season.

Madam Speaker, 17,923 farmers had their crop fields covering 16,540 ha destroyed in the Southern Province. Preliminary assessments done by the Ministry of Fisheries and Livestock indicate that a total of forty-nine heads of cattle were lost out of which 43 are reported to have drowned in Mazabuka.

Madam Speaker, a total of 269,558 cattle, 46,259 goats and 2,509 pigs are currently at risk due to floods experienced from around mid January, 2022 to date. The house may also wish to note that the Government has provided humanitarian assistance in terms of food and non food relief items to the flood victims. Nevertheless, as the situation is highly dynamic, assessments and interventions are on-going. The DMMU has so far spent about K29,805,800 to procure food and non food relief items to support the victims of rain, storms and floods.

Madam Speaker, I wish to acknowledge the support extended to the Government by different local and international stakeholders. Combined, these stakeholders have provided food and non food items to victims of floods through the DMMU. Utmost gratitude is extended to Western Seed Company, Afri-Seed Company, Seed-Co, Sunshine Millers, First National Bank (FNB) and Japanese International Cooporation Agency (JICA). We appeal to different stakeholders; local and international, to hold the Government’s hand and provide humanitarian assistance. We believe that disaster management is a responsibility of everyone.

Madam Speaker, if the scale and scope of devastation remains on the current trajectory, a total of 751,764,786. 40 will be required to implement disaster preparedness and response activities during the 2021/2022 Rainy Season. The intensity of flood and rainstorm incidents are projected to increase due extreme weather events as forecasted by the Zambia Meteorological Department. Provision of humanitarian assistance will require resources for procurement, logistics and distribution of both food and non food relief items. In addition, the resources will be required for communication and dissemination of early warning information, assessment, monitoring, as well as camp management and camp coordination.

Madam Speaker, the Government through the DMMU, working with the stakeholders such as the United Nations (UN) system, local and international Non Governmental Organisation (NGOs) will undertake an in-depth vulnerability and needs assessment around mid to early April 2022 to gauge the full impact of flood and dry spells on food security and nutrition for the 2022/2023 consumption period. The information obtained will determine the relief and recovery intervention in water and sanitation, health, infrastructure, education, human settlement and shelter as well as energy.

Madam Speaker, as I conclude, let me remind this august House that some disasters are human induced and therefore, can be avoided altogether if proper and correct behavioral attitudes are encouraged and practiced. Some of the perennial human induced disasters are associated with the following:

careless dumping of litter in drainages;
establishment of settlement in flood-prone areas;
lack of proper urban planning; and
poor workmanship on critical infrastructure such as bridges, crossing points, schools and health centers.

Madam Speaker, indeed, with concerted efforts, we can avoid these human induced disasters.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, you are now free to ask questions on points of clarification on the ministerial statement given by Her Honour the Vice-President.

Mr J. Chibuye (Roan): Madam Speaker, having listened to the definition of the term ‘disaster’ from the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit Act and of course, coupled with various points of urgent matters of public importance that have been raised by various hon. Members across this country, the negative effects of the army worms on our crops and the drought that hit the nation before the rains set out, is Her Honor the Vice-President telling the nation that the New Dawn Government will declare this year’s rainy season as a national disaster?

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I wish to thank the hon. Member of Parliament for Roan for asking that question, basically, observing what has happened in the country by asking if it would be in order for us to declare a national disaster. At the moment, it would be inappropriate for us to declare a national disaster. If you heard me clearly, you would recall that that is done when it is at a point where we get overwhelmed and we can literally do nothing about the situation. That is the point at which we declare a disaster and ask other nations to come through and give assistance. That is the purpose of declaring a national disaster. At the moment, yes we are struggling, but like you heard in the statement, we have given quite a bit of humanitarian support to people who are going through these difficult moments.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Mutale (Chitambo): Madam Speaker, thank you very much for according this chance to ask a question on the statement that has been given by Her Honour the Vice-President. I am so grateful with the statement. However, I know that we are expecting more disasters to come because I have seen what is obtaining in the wetlands of Bangweulu right now. It is raining heavily and water is coming up.

Madam Speaker, I note the channel of reporting is quite long and tedious. With your permission, maybe I can explain. We are told that firstly, we need to inform the District Commissioner (DC) and then from there, the report goes to the regional Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) officer, then it gets to DMMU. Now, there are some disasters which require urgent attention. If you reported here in Lusaka, they will indicate to you that you have not reported to the other two or three persons. How can we fast-track the reporting channels so that we avert loss of lives and property?

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for Chitambo for understanding the procedure. However, in as much as that is the way it should go, if there is efficiency, it should not take you four hours to reach the District Commissioner (DC). If you can reach the DCs office, it means you are in the vicinity and that is the nearest office of the DMMU and it should not take another 30min to make a phone call to the regional office. This ought to be done within a very short time. The problem is when we have gaps, we do not know who is reporting. However, that does not mean that a person who is aware of a looming disaster cannot come and tell us. If they do, we will go ahead and do the verification. The issue that comes in is really the same definition that some people will tell you; a house has been blown off, it is a disaster. Is that beyond the community capacity? So, we always want to verify. However, where there is a real disaster, we have responded on time.

Madam, I would like to say to the House that you do not have to wait until Parliament is sitting for you to raise an issue. You have had the whole six hours since morning but you want to come and report here. Let us report and we will do the verification ourselves. At least, you would have told us what is going on. We want to respond as quickly as we can. A disaster needs urgent response.

I thank you, Madam

Mr Kampyongo (Shiwang’andu): Madam Speaker, I thank Her Honour the Vice-President for updating this august House and the nation on the disasters.

Madam Speaker, I am sure all of us seated here may talk about one disaster from one place to another. Shiwang’andu is not spared from flash floods, and washed away bridges and so, we would want to attend to these issues immediately they happen because we cannot wait. Some places are becoming non accessible. We have a component in the Constituency Development Fund (CDF), a percentage which is apportioned to disaster management and that for me and many other hon. Members would be the quickest intervention where the CDF Committee and the District Administration can quickly intervene.

The Vice-President talking to Dr Musokotwane.

Mr Kampyongo: Madam Speaker, I am trying to give Her Honour the Vice-President time to finish her consultations.

Madam Speaker: Her Honour is listening. The longer you take hon. member for Shiwang’andu, the more you deprive other hon. Members from asking questions.

Mr Kampyongo: Now, that Her Honour has been updated by the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, can we take it that the hon. Minister of Finance will be in a position to release that component of the CDF to help the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) to address these disasters that have overwhelmed the unit?

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, in fact, for me, as a person under whose office disaster falls, when I saw that component of 5 per cent going to disaster, I felt a little bit of relief because this will go a long way, especially if we are going to be very serious with how we handle this. That is why consultation is good. The hon. Minister has reaffirmed that this component of CDF will be released very soon because of the situation in the country so that it can mitigate where the national disaster management is failing.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Mung’andu: Madam Speaker, as I indicated earlier on, Chama South has been completely cut off. Lubelezi Bridge connecting Chief Chikwa was washed away last year, another bridge connecting Kasela to Chifunda was also washed away and the bridge connecting an area called Tembwe was also washed away. A number of villages have completely been washed away including chickens. People have been left homeless.

Madam Speaker, is Her Honour the Vice-President considering making the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) be funded through under instruments rather than Control 99? The reason I have asked this is because the DMMU is waiting for funding from the Ministry of Finance and National Planning. If this funding is not available, it is difficult for the DMMU to respond to these emergencies. I have engaged DMMU personally. Is the Government considering setting up a trust fund that should be able to accrue resources so that the DMMU can fall back on as emergencies arise unlike the current situation? All the areas are inaccessible by road. The District Commissioner failed to reach these areas. Is Her Honour the Vice-President considering to send the Zambia Air Force (ZAF) personnel to Chama South like she did in Namwala so that our people can get help?

Madam Speaker: Order!

Hon. Members, as you ask questions, remember that other hon. Members also want to ask and we do not have the whole day. You are making your opening remarks too long. Ask the question directly then you will not be interrupted.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Chama South for his question. I think there are two things that we need to separate. He has talked of bridges that were washed away last year. Those bridges should have been lobbied for to be put under the right ministry, which is the Ministry of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development. My office deals with disasters that are happening and not things that have been pending. So, I personally have not heard of this report that the hon. Member is talking about. I have just heard today that there are so many areas that are flooded. When people are in flooded areas like Namwala which the hon. Member is comparing to some areas in his constituency, we have a few tents that we send to such places.

Madam Speaker, I do not know whether the hon. Member is really sure that the report indicating that these areas are flooded while we verify that. We cannot leave people in flooded areas. However, it seems the floods in Chama South are perennial, and so, a permanent solution should be looked at because if the floods were there and they have been there for so many years, we should find alternative land for the people. I believe that Chama has places where people can be resettled rather than going through the same situation year in and year out. So, we should not have people being called homeless.

Madam Speaker, regarding funding to the division or the Office of the Vice-President, as all of us can tell, it is difficult to plan and have a concrete figure for this kind of work. This is something I did state during the Budget Meeting. That is why we rely on contingency funds. This should not take a long time to be responded to because it is a disaster. The Ministry of Finance and National Planning is supposed to respond as and when we request because it is a disaster. However, for the Ministry of Finance and National Planning to know that we need this particular figure towards this event or occurrences is a bit difficult. So, for now, we will continue to depend on the contingency funds until when we establish or know exactly where a disaster will occur and how much it will need.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Mwila (Mufulira): Madam Speaker, I thank you for the opportunity to ask a question. I also thank Her Honour the Vice-President for the statement that she has issued.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwila: Madam Speaker, I do not think there is any part of this country which has been spared from the heavy rains. I know even in Mufulira that we had a number of houses collapsing leaving families without accommodation. We, however, reported to the appropriate offices and I think the matter is being handled. However, my question is centred on food security which Her Honour the Vice-President touched on in her statement. We are coming from a marketing season where some of the maize went to waste because it was not bought in time and rains were heavy in some of the parts of the country and we lost the maize.

Madam, the country is still allowing the exportation of maize. Her Honour the Vice-President said, in her statement, if my memory serves me right, that the Government is monitoring the food security situation. Looking at the current rainfall pattern and what we have experienced, we do not expect a very good harvest unless the assessment that is done by the Office of the Vice-President states otherwise. How food secure is the country between now and the next agricultural season?

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Mufulira for that concern, which should be a concern for all of us.

Madam, as I stand here, the country is food secure when it comes to maize, and the Government has taken a deliberate approach to the way it is exporting maize; we have done the count on how long the food with us will last, and we are very sure that it will last us well into the next season.

Madam Speaker, we can only accelerate the exportation after we do what I mentioned, namely the vulnerability assessment, in April. That is when we will know exactly how to handle the issue of exports. For now, we are very cautious on that, although we are very food-secure for the next one year.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Katakwe (Solwezi East): Madam Speaker, on the same issue of food security and the negative impact that it has on households and the nation as a whole, are we seeing any reduction in prices of commodities like fertiliser and mealie meal in order to enhance food security at household level any time soon?

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I may not answer this question here because it is an economic issue and it needs to be looked at.

Madam Speaker, we are hoping that we will have competitive prices in the fertiliser industry. There are industries that are promising us that when they start production, the price will reduce. I will not talk about the percentage, we are yet to see. However, that is an economic issue, we manage what comes to the people at a particular time. The season is over, but we did manage to give fertilisers under the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) to members countrywide. However, I do understand the issue of fertiliser being so expensive and the issue of growing maize itself being so expensive. This is because the fall army worms have led to the increase in the price of maize. Therefore, I think the issue is how do we handle ourselves? We probably need to slowly move to cultivating other crops as we leave the food security pack, the little fields, to growing our staple food. However, people must go into other areas of farming so that they can raise resources that may support food security and still be able to have money for other things.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Sampa (Matero): Madam Speaker, I thank Her Honour the Vice-President for her responses. In Lusaka, we have had this problem for the last thirty or forty years. I think errors were made and houses were built where they were not supposed to be built. Madimba in Matero is one of the areas. We got the help, but with this unprecedented weather patterns, it only rains once and we are, again, back to square one. People leave their homes and go to stay with relatives elsewhere. When it is dry, they come back. When there is overnight rainfall, they are stuck. Is Her Honour the Vice-President looking at setting up permanent camps, say, at Heroes Stadium or Matero Stadium so that these families can be temporarily resettled and then go back later on. Otherwise, we will be rushing to the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) everyday and kuti bakutendwa. May Her Honour the Vice-President shade light if setting up a camp is a possibility.

Madam Speaker: What does kuti bakutendwa mean?

Laughter

Mr Sampa: Madam Speaker, it means they may get tired looking at our faces knocking at the Vice-President’s, the District Commissioners (DC’s) or the DMMU’s offices. So, we are looking for a slightly permanent solution like a camp in the meantime.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Matero. So far, we are not fade up with Matero because what the hon. Member says has been the situation. We have been in Matero to try and assist where we can. Hon. Member for Matero, thank you, but taking people to centres like the stadium is not a permanent solution.

Madam, for Lusaka, we are thinking of a permanent solution. How do we drain Lusaka? I think this is something all Governments have overlooked because of political fear. I also call upon the planners to ensure this is stopped. When we see people constructing on waterways, we should stop the very first person doing that so that the second one does not do the same. However, because the person doing that is a relative or we want political popularity, we have allowed these things, especially in Lusaka.

As long as it rains on the eastern side, we are sure Matero or Kaunda Square will be flooded and people will be running in the night. This is what the DMMU goes through. However, it is our hope that with planning, a solution will be found because we need to extend the drainage system of Lusaka. Taking the affected people to the stadium has not been part of what we are currently planning. We hope that we will not have to go that way.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Hamwaata (Pemba): Madam Speaker, my question is almost similar to one that was asked by the hon. Member of Parliament for Matero Constituency.

Madam, I am alive to the fact that this problem is not new, especially when it comes to floods. I am also aware that the Government of the Republic of Zambia relocated people from Namwala and other areas, a measure which I believe is not permanent.

Madam, are there any permanent plans to relocate the affected people and also build houses for them?

Madam Speaker: Although the question has been answered, maybe, Her Honour the Vice-President can respond to the housing issue.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, now building houses also becomes part of a disaster. I think that is going a little far. However, the issue of resettlement is very important. That is why we have resettlement schemes in many places. The people of Namwala are not really out of land. If I am not mistaken, some were even relocated to Mumbwa and of course, there is encroachment there. There is a lot of indiscipline also.

Madam Speaker, we cannot resettle people when they feel where they are staying is not good enough. However, we can always help by finding them alternative land where to settle. To say we will be building houses for all flood victims is too much for the Treasury. Those who build houses in developed countries have their houses insured. For us, it will mean the Government building cities every year. Currently, that is not in our plan.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mtayachalo: Madam Speaker, we are alive to the fact that the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) is moving at a snail’s pace in responding to these disasters, largely due to funding challenges. Is the Government not considering allocating adequate resources to provincial DMMU in order to expedite the response? This is because even the 5 per cent from the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) may not be able to handle a disaster of a certain magnitude.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, truly, we have prepositioned food and non-food relief. We do that in provinces and when they run out, that is when they come to the national centre. We are already working on that. Although the hon. Member is calling it a snail’s pace, we believe that we are trying to run as fast as we can. Yes, the resources may not be readily available every day, but that is why we have some things already positioned. If there are blankets or food needed, we are able to respond.

Madam Speaker, if there are no flash floods, people must be able to move on their own without waiting until the floods reach their knees and then cry out. I think when they start stepping in the water, it is important to make a move then wait for the Government, saying Government ilikuli? That is not a very good way of handling these things. As leaders in the House, we should help our communities by ensuring they are in safe places. Whether it is Kuomboka, let them omboka, not in the floods. Suddenly, it has become a disaster when it is a good thing for the people to see water, but they know when to move. Everything is politically a disaster. That is way I gave a definition of a disaster.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Fube (Chilubi): Madam Speaker, I thank Her Honour the Vice-President for paying attention to what is happening in the nation. I think these are the issues that we have addressed before in this particular Parliament.

Madam Speaker, having said that, I appreciate that Her Honour the Vice-President did tackle issues based on pests and disease related disasters as well as climate linked disasters. However, I bring to her attention the fact that as we stand, there is hunger in areas like Chilubi. The hunger has been caused by brown streak disease which has affected cassava fields. I do not know what the Government is doing on that score. I note that that particular component was not tackled in her statement. I, however, appreciated the pesticides that she talked about as having been distributed. That has been distributed even to farmers in Chilubi and they have received. However, when it comes to brown streak disease –

Interruptions

Mr Fube: Can you please behave like an adult!

Madam Speaker: Order!

Hon. Member for Chilubi, just structure your question quickly so that we do not interrupt you.

Mr Fube: Madam Speaker, is the Government intervening in the outbreak of the brown streak disease, especially the hunger-stricken areas. This disease has affected areas like Kaputa, Chienge, Chilubi and part of Luwingu.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I will just be very straight and say that in fact, I come from a cassava growing and eating area We need a report on that because I am not aware of that disease. Maybe, the Ministry of Agriculture is aware, my office is not aware that we also have a problem with cassava. If it is, this is one crop that we want to promote in the country. Let us get the report and see what can be done about that, but at the moment, I am not aware.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Chilubi, have you submitted your report?

Mr Fube: Madam Speaker, I am just from my constituency and I got that report from the ground experts. I have not yet submitted it.

Madam Speaker: Alright then, please take steps to submit the report. Two more questions. I think we have had enough time on this statement and I will give the Floor to hon. female Members of Parliament.

Rev Katuta (Chienge): Madam Speaker, I thank Her Honour the Vice-President for the answers she has given.

Madam, based on her definition of disaster, if a roof of one block of a school is blown off, would that be classified as a disaster? I ask because Her Honour the Vice-President gave the blown off roof of a house as an example.

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, in the definition, I talked of not just the infrastructure, but also the number of people affected and the capacity to rebuild that infrastructure. It just depends on whether or not people can afford. Like now, when the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) comes, we are hoping that those are not issues that will be brought to us because people can do a roof with very little money. Such issues should not be coming to the National Disaster Management Unit. They should end at the constituency. Such cases have been considered as disasters over a period of time yet we can manage them. Going forward, we will leave it to the constituencies to use their CDF to ensure that Government infrastructure such as clinics and schools, whose roofs are blown off are looked at. We should plan for that and leave a little contingency in the 5 per cent for such eventualities.

I thank you, Madam.

Ms Sefulo (Mwandi): Madam Speaker, firstly, I want to thank Her Honour the Vice-President for the swift action that was taken. I was one of those affected by flash floods. I should also make mention that this is the only time in a long time in Mwandi we saw the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) come through to work following a disaster. The last time we saw the DMMU coming to Mwandi to work was when the unit was distributing mealie meal during elections. That is the only time that we saw it working.

Madam, Her Honour the Vice-President has spoken about how food secure the country is and the drought that we have experienced. Does the Government have any plans to immediately ban the export of our staple food to make sure that it is secured and we do not have anything that is going outside the country?

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, firstly, I assure the hon. Member of Parliament for Mwandi and the House that there will be no more disaster elections.

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

The Vice-President: I will repeat. There will be no more disaster elections. The DDMU will not give relief to elections as we may have seen in the past.

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

The Vice-President: So, the hon. Members should be assured that if we appear in their constituencies, it is because there is truly a disaster.

Madam Speaker, with regards to exporting of the staple food, I did indicate how we are proceeding.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

_______

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

MINING COMPANIES LABOUR INSPECTIONS IN LUANSHYA

205. Mr J. Chibuye: asked the Minister of Labour and Social Security:

when the Government last conducted labour inspections at all mining companies in Luanshya District;
what the outcome of the inspections were;
whether the Government is aware that foreign nationals have been employed in positions that local people can fill up at I5 MCC Mining Contractors in Luanshya; and
if so, what measures the Government is taking to ensure that all mining companies abide by the country’s labour laws.

The Minister of Labour and Social Security (Ms Tambatamba): Madam Speaker, the Government last conducted inspections at some copper mines in Luanshya on 5^th November, 2021. You may wish to note that the inspections of work places is an on-going exercise.

Madam Speaker, the outcome of the inspections were as follows:

collective agreement which regulates the terms of and conditions of employment expired in December, but negotiations had not yet been concluded at that time. They have since applied to the ministry for an extension to the collective agreement to enable them to conclude negations;
poor sanitary conditions. This is contrary to public health and occupational hygiene standards;
huge number of expatriates and the process of verifying their status is on-going in collaboration with the Department of Immigration in our sister ministry; and
no evidence of attested employment contracts was found.

Madam Speaker, the Government is aware of the foreign nationals who have been employed at 15 MCC Mining Contractors. It should be noted, however, that some of the investment agreements that the country signs with certain countries also contain clauses or issues pertaining to expatriates.

However, Madam, it should be noted that work permits are issued by the Department of Immigration and as such, if we notice any anomalies during our inspections, these are immediately brought to the attention of the Ministry of Home Affairs and Internal Security for rectification.

Madam Speaker, I also inform the House that the Employment Code Act No.3 of 2019 has established the Skills Advisory Committee (SAC) at my ministry, which will advise on skills that are in short supply where expatriates could be engaged. This will address the current challenge that is being faced with regard to the processing of work permits to expatriates and other foreign labour.

Madam Speaker, inspections are on-going and it is the surest way of ensuring high levels of compliance. Therefore, the ministry will scale-up the undertaking of inspections at all work places throughout the country. Ideally, when we are well resourced, we should be doing it on a quarterly basis.

Madam, further, let me add that the ministry and its tripartite social partners will, within this quarter, be visiting mines including those in Luanshya to undertake follow-up inspections and to determine or assess whether there is a need to promulgate a minimum wage for the mining sector, inclusive of the contractors.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr J. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, I am glad to hear that the hon. Minister recently visited the mine on 5^th November, 2021. However, because of the inadequate staffing levels at our office in Luanshya District, where only one officer manages Luanshya District, Mpongwe and Masaiti, it is becoming a challenge to undertake these snap visits to such areas, especially since he does not even have a motor vehicle. What is the ministry doing to ensure that the staff is properly equipped with both human resources and vehicles?

Madam, there have been a lot of lapses between the employees and employers where, especially at Luanshya Copper Mines, people from Panorama Securities and Cobra have been abrogating the labour laws with impunity. What is the ministry doing to ensure that we have regular visits to such places?

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, the spirit of sharing together is what we survive by. While seeking measures, my ministry is at the moment negotiating with the appropriate arms of Government that can help us to optimise resources to routinely undertake what we plan quarterly and the Ministry of Finance and National Planning is one of them. We are, at the moment, utilising those sharing methods by engaging with our statutory institutions such as the National Pension Scheme Authority (NAPSA) and the Workers Compensation Fund Control Board that undertake inspections. They have become handy for us and our staff joins them when they are undertaking their inspections.

Madam, needless to say, the hon. Member must be assured that we are doing everything possible to rationalise and get to a place where we begin to place food where the mouth is. We are looking through our structure as well. In the long-term, we will be looking at the whole ministry and start to pick up some of our staff or human resource that are sitting in the wrong places and taking them to the frontline to ensure that inspections are taking place and that we mean business.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mtayachalo: Madam Speaker, I sympathise with the workers in Luanshya. I am alive to the fact that workers in this country are going through a lot of challenges. What is the role of trade unions in this country because we are overloading the Ministry of Labour and Social Security? There are certain things that are supposed to be handled by trade unions and that is why they get union contributions.

Madam, does the Ministry of Labour and Social Security have any plans to reprimand trade unions that are failing to represent workers effectively? We have collective agreements at work places and labour laws, but why are small things being taken to the Ministry of Labour and Social Security? Does the hon. Minister have plans to reprimand these trade unions so that they represent the workers effectively?

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, I appreciate this feedback coming from the hon. Member who is a former senior unionist and understands the role of the worker’s representatives.

Madam, as I have indicated time and again, our tripartite consultative fora is one place where we are finding space to continuously guide each other. The Government guides the workers’ representatives and they do the same on their issues.

Madam, we will be, I suppose, stronger. I believe they are listening and we have talked about the roles of workers’ representatives time and again and how we need to optimise and step up to ensure that there is no gash. If they do their role and undertake their functions effectively, we will see fewer grievances coming to the ministry and the workload will be reduced.

Madam Speaker, the comment is highly appreciated. As we will be going to the Tripartite Consultative Labour Council (TCLC) on 4^th March, 2022, this issue will be on the agenda.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr J. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, during the official opening of the First Session of the 13^th National Assembly, His Excellency the President of the Republic of Zambia, Mr Hakainde Hichilema, stressed the point that this is the time the Zambian people should start enjoying the fruits and benefits of the various mineral resources that this country has been endowed with.

Madam, it is nice to hear from the hon. Minister in her response that her ministry will soon be looking into how best it can harmonise the working conditions and salaries of the mining sector employees. How soon is this “soon” when the Government is going to start looking at this aspect of harmonising the conditions and salaries of the mining sector employees in our country?

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, could the hon. Member repeat the last part of the comment?

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Roan – I thought the question was how soon you are going to harmonise – anyway, hon. Member for Roan, go ahead.

Mr J. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, from the response that the hon. Minister gave, I would like to find out how soon that “soon” will be when her ministry will start considering the harmonisation of the conditions of service and the salaries in the mining sector across the country?

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, the consultations start next week, as I indicated. Basically, our Employment Code Act goes for two years before we review it. I know that we will be starting to look at the Employment Code sometime this year.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Rev. Katuta: Madam Speaker, I have been watching and following what the hon. Minister of Labour and Social Security has been doing, and I thank her for that.

Madam, Zambia has weak labour laws, which have been oppressive to labourers in Zambia. The hon. Minister mentioned that some conditions come with the investment agreements and that that could be the reason we have foreigners doing the jobs that Zambians are supposed to do. When is the hon. Minister going to bring a policy here so that we can change it into a favourable Act to protect Zambians from being deprived of their jobs?

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, I indicated earlier on that the labour laws are reviewed for improvement within our tripartism. As I speak, we have a few proposals that have come through from stakeholders on a number of areas that the Zambian people would like to see us review.

Therefore, the next meeting that we will be having will give us a consolidation. We will be agreeing to consolidate how we move going forward. Matters such as these relating to labour and labour being a backbone of the economy are not to be taken lightly. We must make sure that all parties involved are consulted.

Madam Speaker, within the consultations, we have to always refer to the relevant others who are not necessarily amongst us as we are discussing these matters. So, at the next meeting, we will certainly come up with how we will move on the review of the Employment Code.

Madam Speaker, this country’s Employment Code is one of the best in Africa and this has been attested to by the law. So, in reviewing it, we have to take very serious care that we do not throw away the baby with the bathwater. We will inform the nation when we are clear after the consultative forum as to when we will start adding dates to the agenda of reviewing the Employment Code.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

CONSTRUCTION OF POLICE STATION IN CHIENGE

206. Rev. Katuta asked the Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development:

when the construction of a police station at Mununga in Chienge District will be completed; and
what the cause of the delay in completing the project is.

The Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development (Eng. Milupi): Madam Speaker, the construction of a police station in Mununga in Chienge District will be completed once projects that are 80 per cent and above are completed and if funds are made available for projects below 80 per cent. Works on the police station stalled at 35 per cent in August, 2016.

Madam Speaker, the delay in completing the project has been due to financial constraints and the Government policy to priorities projects that were 80 per cent and above complete.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Rev. Katuta: Madam Speaker, we are talking about the police who are in charge of the security of the Zambian people at the border between the Democratic Republic Congo (DRC) and Zambia, and Mununga Police has not been taken care of by all the successive Governments.

Madam Speaker, since this project was under the Ministry of Infrastructure and Urban Development, could the ministry maybe allow the Constituency Development Fund Committee (CDFC) to complete the project because it is very urgent.

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, this is probably one of the easiest supplementary questions that I have been asked. However, just to help the hon. Member, let me give a little bit of background information about the project.

Madam, the contractor given was Reakas Investments Limited. This project commenced on 21^st January, 2016. The contract sum was K3,850,632.18. The amount certified to date is K1,182,430.57. The Interim Payment Certificate paid so far is K1,182,430.57. There was no advanced payment to the contractor.

Madam Speaker, I am giving these figures so that in answering the question whether CDF can be used, yes, we would be glad to give that permission. These amounts are not too big, they could be handled under the CDF. I thank the hon. Member for her suggestion.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mrs Chonya (Kafue): Madam Speaker, whereas the hon. Minister thinks that those figures are not too big, I was a bit alarmed because I thought it was too much. This is because we have also been asking for a police station and now, we have been told we can consider funding it from the Constituency Development Fund (CDF).

Madam Speaker, is the hon. Minister in a position to tell us what facilities this stalled police station has to warrant that amount as per contract figures?

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, when I said it was not too much, it was not relative to the total value of the work that had to be done. It was relative to the amount of CDF available, which is K25.7 million. So, if we do have an outstanding amount of K1 million, that is why I am saying it is not too much to be handled under CDF.

Madam Speaker, with regards to the value of contract projects, you have heard me time and again bemoan the fact that a number of these things where grossly overvalued in the past. If you ask what facilities are available in this particular police station, I am sure it is the usual facilities that are available in rural police stations like those which you have in Kafue. So, whether that amounts of K3.8 million was the right amount, that really can be answered relative to what we are doing to bring these costs down.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Rev. Katuta: Madam Speaker, I must say that as the Member of Parliament, I am shocked at the figures. This is because looking at the size of the police station, if I had my way, I would use my own money to build that. To hear K3 million, allow me to ask the hon. Minister to cancel that contract. He should come to Chienge and see for himself that the building is not worth the amount that has been mentioned. Even the K1 million that has been spent is too much. That structure cannot cost K1 million looking at the works that have been done.

Madam Speaker, sorry, I am getting emotional because this is too much for the police personnel in Chienge. They literally walk because they have no transport. It is hell. How do they work when they are so frustrated.

Madam Speaker, I am asking the hon. Minister to cancel that contract. It does not matter what the legal implication will be. Please, hon. Minister, cancel it and come and see. We need a police station constructed but with the correct amounts. So, would you please cancel that contract with immediate effect.

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, I think it is heart-warming to listen to the hon. Member for Chienge. That is why I always say she is a very reasonable hon. Member of Parliament. I say reasonable because as an hon. Member of Parliament for Chienge, she is able to question these figures which were contracted by the party opposite. In other words, she is agreeing with us that some of the things that were happening were not right. There is nothing to question here. The people are saying K3 million for a simple police station was too much. I agree with her and everybody must agree with that.

Madam, I assure you that going forward, the New Dawn Administration will not go into contracts of this nature. So, I will take that suggestion to cancel or terminate this contract and get the CDF to complete the works.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr J. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, with the concern that is coming from the hon. Member for Chienge, could the hon. Minister state before he cancels the contract as to whether there are any hanging or rather outstanding Interim Payment Certificates (IPCs) to this particular contractor and if at all in the clauses of the contract there is any interest charges that the Government has to foot.

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, yes, indeed, I did state that there is an amount to date, certified of K1,182,430.45. Any contract that is delayed attracts certain penalties such as interest payments and so on and so forth. As to whether this is applicable in this particular contract, that is something that we shall determine.

Madam, I think the point that the hon. Member for Chienge is making is that, first of all, this particular contract has taken too long. The community wants a police station and she is concerned about that amount. In that concern, we are in total agreement with her. The New Dawn Government is in total agreement that that has always been wasteful expenditure.

Madam Speaker, going forward, it will not happen. The ones that we can terminate or review, we will be able to do that. I think some time in the near future, we will be coming to the House to state what we are going to do with some of these projects and contracts that have been outstanding for a long time or have variations that are greater than 25 per cent.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

LEGAL OWNERS OF LAND OCCUPIED BY NJOLWE VETERINARY CAMP IN PALABANA

207. Mr Samakayi (Mwinilunga) asked the Minister of Lands and Natural Resources who the legal owners of the land occupied by the Njolwe Veterinary Camp in Palabana area in Chongwe District are.

The Minister of Lands and Natural Resources (Mr Muchima): Madam Speaker, there has never been Njolwe Veterinary Camp. What is there is Njolwe Agricultural Camp, which is part of the Njolwe Dairy Development Scheme. The property is located in Njolwe area of Chongwe District and is numbered as NJOLW/LN_25181/11. However, the property is not held on certificate of title, just like most Government properties.

Further, Madam Speaker, Njolwe Agricultural Camp was created in 1994 from a ranch which was owned by the then Ministry of Agriculture. The camp is still operational and provides the Njolwe community and surrounding areas with agricultural and veterinary extension services.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Samakayi: Madam Speaker, this land was subdivided and I would want to find out who subdivided it and what authority did he/she have to subdivide and who are the occupants of this land as we speak?

Madam Speaker: Although now this is expanding the question, I do not know if the hon. Minister is ready to answer that question.

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, we can give him a bonus answer. Njolwe area, Lot 79 located in Palabana in Chongwe District was Njolwe Dairy Development Scheme. The property was re-planned from Lot Njolwe 79 to NJOLW/LN_25181/1-11. The following were the beneficiaries according to the Zambia Integrated Land Management Information System (ZILMIS), the system we have at the ministry:

NJOLW/LN_25181/1 – Nkandu Muma, issued in 2018;
NJOLW/LN_25181/2 – Prosper Magamu;
NJOLW/LN_25181/3 – Francis Musonda;
NJOLW/LN_25181/4 – James Kamanga;
NJOLW/LN_25181/5 – Mohammad Chikasa;
NJOLW/LN_25181/6 – Kennedy Kasonde;
NJOLW/LN_25181/7, 8, 9 and 11 – Not allocated in the system;
NJOLW/LN_25181/10 – Esther Lungu Foundation.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Samakayi: Madam Speaker, the other part of my question has not been answered. This is land that was under Government’s possession. With those people who are being mentioned, it means that land was subdivided and given to them. Who did the subdivision and did that person have the authority to subdivide land that belongs to the Government? Further, what measures is the Government taking to ensure that the kind of behaviour that was in the Patriotic Front (PF) Government does not come to the United Party for National Development (UPND) Government?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, this land was subdivided under the instruction of the Permanent Secretary (PS) by then in the Ministry of Fisheries and Livestock, whose name I cannot disclose here because he is not around. However, if you allow, the PS by then was Dr David Shamulenge. The question is: Does a PS have power to subdivide or sell a property of the Government? The answer is no. All Government assets are sold under the Board of Survey with the authority of the Ministry of Finance and National Planning.

Madam, this is a question which needs to be explored further for abuse of office because we checked and according to our records, there was no survey by the Board of Survey and there was no authority from the Ministry of Finance and National Planning. As you know, our friends there (pointing at hon. PF Members) had the audacity to go out of their way to do anything they wanted as though the property of the Government belonged to them or was for personal use.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Katakwe: Madam Speaker, is the land in question the same land that has fish ponds? If yes, who are the owners of those fish ponds?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, today, I am answering questions from the North-Westerners. It is true, this farm has got fish ponds as well, especially on the Esther Lungu farm. There are fish ponds there. Do not confuse it with the Palabana Farm because there are also fish ponds there and the land used to belong to the Government.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Kalimi (Malole) Madam Speaker, was procedure not followed when the sub-division was done on this land?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, I put it clearly that any Government asset cannot be sold by anybody. It has to be championed by a Board of Survey, which is authorised by the Ministry of Finance and National Planning. According to our records, the Ministry of Finance and National Planning never appointed a Board of Survey to sell any asset. However, because of the arrogance of our colleagues, they decided to sell all properties. To mitigate that, the Government has put in place measures to ensure all properties on Government land are on title. That way, we will protect it from any future invasion as was the case in the previous Government.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Mapani (Namwala): Madam Speaker, may I know when the hon. Minister intends to take legal proceedings for this matter to be redressed.

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, we have been going round to see what is on the ground. As you are aware, in spite of title deeds having been given for the land in Palabana and Balmoral, the land has been grabbed and given back to the Government. So, if it is established that there was abuse and the right channels were not followed accordingly, the land will be grabbed.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Samakayi indicated his intention to ask a question.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Mwinilunga, you have already asked twice so, you have exhausted your chances.

Mr Jamba (Mwembezhi): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister may note that there is always the issue of saying that there are title deeds even when we know that the land in question has been grabbed dubiously and people tend to go to court to protect the dubious title deeds. Is the hon. Minister able, or through the President, to cancel title deeds like the one he is talking about which we know are dubious? An example is the land in Kawena where the former got pieces of chunks of land and put them on title?

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member, we are talking about the land in Njolwe. Let us not address Kawena. If you want it addressed, put in a separate question.

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, this Government is quite prudent and it will follow all the title deeds that were given in the past to see if the right channels were followed because certain individuals fast-tracked the issuance of title deeds. If at all, they did not follow procedure, the only unfortunate thing is that a title deed can only be cancelled in two ways; by court order or compulsory acquisition using the Presidential powers. Those are the only two options, unfortunately. I think, in future, there will be a need to review the law so that the Commissioner of Lands or the hon. Minister can have powers to cancel such titles. There was a lot of abuse and people are hiding into this lacuna that exists. If there is abuse, we shall recommend that such title deeds are cancelled.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Lubozha (Chifubu): Madam Speaker, what is the fate of the Permanent Secretary (PS) in question who sanctioned the sale of government property as senior Government official when he knew that he had no right to do so?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, any abuse will be subjected to investigations. Right now in my ministry, there are cases that are being investigated by a team of officers from various security wings.

I thank you, Madam.

CONSTRUCTION OF BRIDGES IN KAMFINSA

208. Mr Kang’ombe (Kamfinsa) asked the Minister of Local Government and Rural Development:

when the construction of bridges at Kwesha and Catholic Church crossing points connecting Mulenga and Ndeke Townships in Kamfinsa Parliamentary Constituency will commence;
whether a contractor for the project has been identified;
if so, who the contractor is;
what the estimated cost for the project is; and
what the estimated time frame for the completion of the project is.

The Minister of Health (Mrs Masebo) (on behalf of the Minister of Local Government and Rural Development (Mr Nkombo)): Madam Speaker, I inform the House that the Government through the Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development intends to construct bridges at Kwesha and Catholic Church crossing points connecting Mulenga compound and Ndeke township in the 2023 Annual Work Plan.

Madam Speaker, the contractor has not yet been identified. He will be known once the project commences.

Madam, the current estimated cost is K3 million for each bridge. The timeframe for the project will be known once the project commences.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kang’ombe: Madam Speaker, allow me to thank the hon. Minister for providing responses indicating that the works on the bridges will be done 2023. Do we see these works being advertised this year for procurement in readiness for the works to start in 2023?

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, as I said, the bridges are expected to cost K3 million and this money will only be budgeted for in the next Budget. The preliminary works which have been done so far are being done by the Road Development Agency (RDA), and they include assessments and quantifications of the works on the bridges.

Madam, it is proposed that the project will be included in the 2023 Annual Work Plan, which work plan is being informed by the ten-year infrastructure plan which the ministry is currently developing. So, because of that, it cannot be advertised this year because the ministry is, this year, advertising what has been prioritised for this year.

I thank you, Madam.

CONSTRUCTION OF PERMANENT TOLL PLAZA AT MPONGWE

209. Mr Ngowani (Mpongwe) asked the Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development:

whether the Government has any plans to construct a permanent toll plaza at the Mpongwe Toll Plaza on the Mpongwe/Luansobe Road; and
if so, when the plans will be implemented.

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, the Government has no immediate plans to construct a permanent toll plaza on the Mpongwe/Luansobe Road.

Madam Speaker, because of the answer in part (a), the question of when such plans will be implemented, therefore, falls off.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr J. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, I usually use that road when going to my constituency. The most inconveniencing thing about this toll gate is that even if it is raining, you have to park your vehicle by the roadside, walk out and go to the office to make a payment and come back to your vehicle.

I understand the hon. Minister when he says certain things can only be done when funds allow. what is the Government going to do in the immediate term to ensure that motorists are not inconvenienced by walking out of their vehicles to go and make payments while car engines are running, which may cause some accidents in the future? What is the hon. Minister doing to ensure that motorists pay from the comfort of their motor vehicles?

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, I thank Hon. Chibuye, the Member of Parliament for Roan. Indeed, when funds are available, it is our intention to upgrade the simplified toll gate on the Mpongwe/Luansobe Road. We understand that it is a simplified toll station.

Madam, following his supplementary question, we will delve into it a bit further to find out what needs to be done. I know that we have a number of fairly simplified toll gates. The ones that I have been to and are all over the place. Between Mbala and Nakonde, there is one. My experience is that the National Road Fund Agency (NRFA) personnel do come out to collect money even, say, on the Mongu Road just near Mongu or near Tapo. They do come out to collect the money. So, we will have to find out why at this particular simplified toll Plaza, they expect the motorist to go to them. I think, the proper thing is that the employee must come out, collect the money and issue a receipt. We will find out what is going on.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

IDCS INVESTMENT IN PALM OIL PRODUCTION

210. Mr Chanda (Kanchibiya) asked the Minister of Finance and National Planning:

how much money the Industrial Development Corporation invested in Zampalm Limited in Kanchibiya District, for palm oil production from inception to October, 2021;
what the annual estimated value of palm oil when the company is fully operationalised will be;
how many jobs will be created when the plantation is fully operational; and
whether the Government has any plans to engage an additional equity partner to invest in the company.

The Minister of Finance and National Planning (Dr Musokotwane): Madam Speaker, the Industrial Development Corporation (IDC) has invested a total of K200,163,346.81 both in the company and Oil Palm Out-growers Company Limited (OPOC) as follows:

Category Amount (K)

Zampalm Working Capital/SOE Support 151,027,203.09

Zampalm-Outgrower/SOE Support 49,136,143.72

Total 200,163,346.81

Madam Speaker, the company is expected to be fully operational by the year 2025. The annual production of Crude Palm Oil (CPO) is expected to average above 9,200 metric tonnes at the value of US$1000 per metric tonne. Therefore, the company’s annual turnover is projected to be about US$9.2 million.

Madam Speaker, once the company is fully operational; it is expected to employee a total of 312 staff on fixed term contract and 1,200 on short term basis. Additionally, the out-grower scheme which currently is about has about 1,117 participating farmers, intends to reach at least 5,00 beneficiaries and a minimum of 40,000 ha of oil palm plantation targeting at least 30 per cent women and the youths.

Madam Speaker, in the interim, the IDC has no intentions of engaging an additional equity partner to invest in the company. However, once the company I fully operational and attains mature stage the IDC remains open to a strategic equity partner.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Chanda: Madam Speaker, I bring warm greetings to the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning from the people of Kanchibiya Constituency and thank him for the response that he has given this afternoon.

Madam Speaker, considering that Zambia imports edible oils in excess of 200 million tonnes per annum according to the Zambia Development Agency (ZDA) Food and Processing Sector Investment Profile and the local market for edible oils is estimated at 120, 000 tonnes per annum, what role do we see ZAMPALM Plantation playing in cutting down importations from the far East, East Africa and South Africa?

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Kanchibiya for his follow up question. As I said earlier on, the expected annual production of crude palm oil by 2025 will be 9,200 metric tonnes per annum and that sits on 3,700ha. The company owns a total of 20,000ha of land, which when fully developed can increase palm oil output to 70,000 metric tonnes per annum which is equivalent to about 85 per cent of the current imported edible oils.

The continued expansion of out-grower schemes from the current 1,000 ha will also contribute significantly to reducing the demand for imported edible oils. So, in short, as the company expands production to cover all the 20,000 ha, we will be able to meet Zambia’s demand by 85 per cent possibly higher as out-grower schemes expand, but of course, that will still be below what the country requires.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chanda: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minster as we look forward to his much anticipated visit to Kanchibiya District and the Zampalm Plantation. How do we see Industrial Development Corporation (IDC)? Again, looking at the opportunity space that exists for crude palm oil, the Southern African Development Community (SADC) region, as it is, is a huge market. Angola and the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) reportedly, are massive importers of crude oil. Does that form part of a long term plan for the IDC to tap into the SADC market?

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, indeed, the idea is to produce enough for Zambia and after that, export beyond Zambia, but as you can imagine, it requires a lot of money to expand the production. At the moment, up to 2025, we are only expecting that only 3,700 ha of the 20,000 ha of land will be under production. Even when we expand to 20,000 ha, which of course will take time because it has to be step by step given the shortage of money, we will still not be able to meet the total demand for the country. So, what this requires is that people, especially in Kanchibiya and the surrounding areas where agronomically, it has now been proved that this crop can grow. We will take advantage at a private sector level so that this country becomes a major producer of palm oil.

I thank you Madam Speaker.

Mr Fube: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister did indicate that the company will be fully operational by 2025. Having indicated that, what is the current status of the project in terms of deliverables considering that the Government had pumped in K200 million plus? My main interest is on the side of the out-growers scheme which is giving the raw material to the same project.

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, I am sorry I do not have the data on what is being produced right now. The data I have is on the issue of employment as of September last year, which is the last time we had the data for. We had 218 staff on fixed contract employment and 459 on short term seasonal basis.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mrs Chony: Madam Speaker, I do not know if the hon. Minister also has the information on what hectarage this project covers.

Dr Musokotwane: Madam Speaker, I do not have the data on the hectarage on production right now. Actually, yes, I have it. It is 3,700 ha, which is already under production, but the full production from the harvest will only be realised in 2025 because it takes time for trees to come into production.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members conferred with each other.

Madam Speaker: The hon. Ministers there are having a good time and exchanging notes. Those who were not here have joined their friends and they are enjoying themselves and not listening to the questions and answers. Please, can we have some order!

CONSTRUCTION OF THE D769 LUSAKA/MONGU ROAD

211. Mr Mutinta (Itezhi-tezhi) asked the Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development:

why the construction of the D769 Road, from the Lusaka/Mongu Road junction to Itezhi-tezhi, has stalled;
when the project will resume;
what the cost of the outstanding works on the project is; and
what the time frame for the completion of the project is.

The Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development (Eng. Milupi): The construction of the D769 Road from the Lusaka/Mongu junction to Itezhi-tezhi has stalled due to cash flow constraints.

Madam, the project will resume once funding for the project is secured.

Madam Speaker, the cost of the outstanding works is estimated at K152,231,146.84.

Madam, the estimated time frame for completion of the project is twelve months.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mutinta: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for the response given. It gives hope to the people of Itezhi-tezhi. However, I seek clarity with regards to the information, which I gathered, that this road was downgraded from bituminous standard to gravel. Could that be true? If that is the case, would that be fair since this road goes to a place which is a tourist attraction, a food basket, and also harbours one of the largest hydro power stations in Zambia?

Madam Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended 1640 hours until 1700 hours.

[MADAM SPEAKER in the Chair]

Eng Milupi: Madam Speaker, before business was suspended, the hon. Member of Parliament for Itezhi-tezhi was expressing anxiety on what he has heard, which is that this road has been downgraded or re-scoped to a gravel road. He stated that this was an important road in terms of where it goes, which is a big tourist place and in terms of farming. He said the place is a big farming area and in terms of electricity generation, it is quite important to the country.

Madam Speaker, the construction of the D769 is part of the upgrading of the D769 Road from the Mumbwa/Itezhi-tezhi junction on M009 to Itezhi-tezhi, which is about 109 km and this includes the 2.2 km of the Inkonkaile to Itezhi-tezhi Boma access road in what was then the Central Province but now back, quite rightly so, to the Southern Province.

Madam Speaker, the contract was awarded to Messirs Build Trust Construction Limited in a joint venture with Power Flex Zambia Limited in 2014 at a contract sum of K285,886,120.49 with a completion period of twenty-four months.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Member is right in his assertion. When we came into office, we found that this projects had been re-scoped from bituminous standard to an all whether gravel road due to funding challenges. However, let me make this very clear. The difficulties we have with the management of these road contracts, is first of all, the excessive costs which were assigned to specific road contracts. With regards to this particular one, the figure I have mentioned of K285 million, in 2014, the exchange was just over K5 to US$ 1. So, this equated to about US$51 million, which meant that each kilometre on that road was about US$500,000. Compared to the world prices we are getting now, this would appear to be reasonable. However, if you look at the time; in 2014, the average construction on kilometre basis was in the order of about US$200,000 to US$250,000 per kilometre. When you also consider that this was an existing road, there was no tree cutting and uprooting of trees and so on, this figure was excessive.

Madam, this is the legacy that we have inherited from our hon. Colleagues on the other side. I do not know what costing Messirs Build Trust Construction Limited went through to come up with these figures. It is as a result of that that even the Government, then under the Patriotic Front (PF) administration, failed to pay for these contracts and this is what we have inherited.

Madam Speaker, the New Dawn Administration fully recognises the economic benefits of Itezhi-tezhi. It is a tourist area and is part of what the New Dawn’s Government is doing in tourist areas like the Northern Circuit and the Western Circuit on the other side, which includes Itezhi-tezhi. So, this broad is an important road and the New Dawn Administration wants it back up to bituminous standard, in fact, to an international bituminous standard road. We are not going to compromise on that, including other facilities, which are not subject to this question.

Madam Speaker, I assure the hon. Member of Parliament for Itezhi-tezhi that we are looking at this. It does not qualify for a Public-Private Partnership (PPP) initiative, but it is one of those roads that are important economically and we will be looking at resources as soon as possible so that we can undertake to complete the works to bituminous standard.

Madam, I do stop to see the works done on the roads and what I have seen is that is not pleasing at the moment. So, a lot of work has to be done to ensure that the full 109 km stretch from that turn-off right up to Itezhi-tezhi is done properly and we undertake that we will do that.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Wamunyima (Nalolo) Madam Speaker, the background the hon. Minister has given for this road is that it was downgraded and that its plans have existed since 2014. Is the same contractor going to be used considering that again, the road has to be upgraded to what should have been the case? If that is the case, what is the implication in terms of penalties and interests to be charged since works have stalled for over seven years now?

Eng Milupi: Madam Speaker, we are carrying out a comprehensive review on all projects. The problem we have as the Government and as the nation is that we over committed ourselves on a number of projects. As a result of lack of funding, a number of contractors demobilised and some left their equipment. So, there are charges accruing in terms of standing charges, interest payments and so on and so forth. This review will result in us getting on top of this. It will also result in the termination of a number of projects or contracts. Not because we do not want to undertake those projects, but we want to put a cap on these expenses that are accruing. When we are ready with this review and we have carried out necessary consultations, I will come to the Floor of this House to inform the House.

Madam Speaker, let me take advantage of the question whether we will use the same contractor or not and say that we should not be misunderstood when we will be carrying out reviews of these contracts. We are not targeting anybody on political lines or any other lines. It is purely to ensure that we take control of the costs. I think the House knows that this Build Trust Construction Company that got this contract in 2014 is owned by the hon. Leader of Opposition. Everyone knows that.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Eng. Milupi: So, when we take action, it will not be because we are targeting anybody, but because we want to take control of that which has gone wrong, not only on this contract but on many others.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mapani: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that shoddy work was done on this road. Can the Government still recover the money from the contractor who was assigned to do the work for a job that was not well done?

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, every contract will be reviewed. As the New Dawn Administration, we have made it clear that some of the debt we have as Government is fresh air for work not done while some of it is for work that was done poorly. In my travels throughout this country, I have observed that a number of roads commissioned in the last three or four years are not fit for a purpose. They are beginning to fail. This is one of them and there are others that I can mention. Even the middle of the 40 km stretch of the Solwezi/Chingola Road is in a terrible condition yet it has not even been handed over. The Mbala/Nakonde Road commissioned in 2017 is in a terrible state.

Madam, we are reviewing all of these things. In fact, we are carrying out a technical evaluation to ensure that the specifications that were given at the time of award of the contract were met. What is unfortunate is that in terms of tar roads, the ordinary citizen will see a black surface road and be happy initially, but they do not know whether that conforms to even the width of what was specified. Did someone get half a metre? How about the various layers? We have the means through the National Council for Construction to go, check and make callouts. We shall be doing this for most of these roads. When that report is ready, we shall come here to the report, road by road, to this august House.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

CONSTRUCTION WORKS AT KATIKULULA RESETTLEMENT SCHEME IN

CHITAMBO

212. Mr Mutale asked the Vice President:

(a) whether the Government has any plans to construct the following infrastructure at Katikulula Resettlement Scheme Phase II and Phase III in Chitambo District:

(i) schools;

(ii) markets; and

(iii) shopping centres; and

(b) if so, when the plans will be implemented.

The Vice-President (Mrs Nalumango): Madam Speaker, according to the current plan for the scheme, two schools are earmarked for construction; one in each phase. Further, two market sheds for agricultural produce and one service centre have been planned for. These centres are meant to accommodate facilities such as shopping centres and other amenities.

Madam, the plans I have mentioned will commence once funds are available. In this regard, I urge the hon. Member to consider the projects mentioned as part of the projects that could be funded under the Constituency Development Fund (CDF).

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mutale: Madam Speaker, this scheme was set up during the Kaunda era and the people of Katikulula have been suffering a lack of those social amenities. The Constituency Development Fund (CDF) might be there, but Chitambo is a rural area with many needs. What area can Her Honour the Vice-President assist me in as I employ my CDF? Which projects can her office take on and handle and which ones it can leave for the CDF?

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I would not stand here and over-commit because what we say here becomes a Government assurance. Therefore, I cannot be more specific beyond what I said regarding funds being made available because that would not be correct.

Madam, perhaps to give a general assurance, the Government has been looking at resettlement schemes as the hon. Member alluded to. Many of these schemes date as far back as the First Republic era, yet there has been no development. We have stated here that we currently have ninety-three schemes around the country and for some, there is nothing to show that they are schemes. People who got those plots have either handed them over or we cannot see them because the records and what is on the ground are different.

Madam Speaker, this is why we are working on a programme that we are calling the Resettlement Infrastructure Investment and Enterprise Support (ARIISE) Programme. This programme is planned and is supposed to be implemented this year. It is under the same PPP that hon. Members hear about road infrastructure. This road infrastructure under the Ministry of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development also has an extension in this programme of resettlement schemes so that we can revamp them. The idea of this programme is to revamp resettlement schemes, which means taking amenities, energy, water, issues to do with sanitation and everything that makes life comfortable so that they become hubs that can encourage production. This is on the programme.

Madam, I could go on about this. It is a very wonderful programme that we call ARIISE in short. It is supposed to take infrastructure to these resettlements countrywide so that people can realise the same vision the Kaunda people had of production where we will see production, manufacturing as well as finding the markets by providing the roads. The roads you have heard going into Angola, for example, are not for nothing. They are there to facilitate the resettlement, inner roads and inner infrastructure. This is the plan on the books.

Madam Speaker, this is meant to start this year, as the House has heard and we will invite the private sector in developing it. That is the general assurance, but for Chitambo, specifically, we have planned for the construction of these facilities, it is just that funds are not currently available.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

DEPLOYMENT OF ADDITIONAL STAFF TO KABWE CENTRAL HOSPITAL

213. Mr Katakwe (Solwezi East) (on behalf of Ms Halwiindi (Kabwe Central)): asked the Minister of Health:

(a) whether the Government has any plans to deploy additional staff to Kabwe Central Hospital;

(b) if so, when the plans will be implemented;

(c) what categories of staff will be deployed to the Hospital; and

(d) how many staff will be deployed, category by category.

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, the Government has plans to deploy additional health workers across the country including at Kabwe Central Hospital.

Madam, the plans will be implemented starting this year, 2022. The categories of staff to be deployed will be in line with the approved establishment for Kabwe Central Hospital.

Madam Speaker, the number of staff to be deployed will be determined by the amount of treasury authority to be granted.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mrs Chonya: Madam Speaker, the last bit of the hon. Minister’s answer is that recruitment will be based on how much treasury authority will be granted. I am wondering if this is not at variant with the commitment that has already come from the ministry that 11,200 different categories of workers will be employed in the Ministry of Health. Could the hon. Minister please provide further clarity.

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, the commitment announced by His Excellency the President was to the effect that we shall employ 11,200. To that effect, that commitment still stands. However, it will be important for hon. Members to take note that if we were employing one category, it would be easy. Then you would say we are employing 11,200 nurses or 11,22 doctors, but that is not the case.

Madam, the case is that the Ministry of Health workforce consists of different categories. In each of these categories, the number of health workers needing or hoping to be employed is, in fact, over 11,200. Therefore, what this means is that we are looking at the number of nurses who are looking to be employed. We are also looking at the other categories. Then, we are looking at the available health facilities country wide and the demand.

Madam Speaker, this is why I am saying that it will depend on the amount of money that we will be given. This does not mean, therefore, that the numbers will change. It is some matrix that has to be done. For example, apart from employing, we also have a category of health workers who are already in employment but require upgrading. So, that is another issue that is being looked at so that staff in different categories who are supposed to be upgraded will also be considered under the same 11,200.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Elias Musonda (Chimbamilonga): Madam Speaker, what is the current nurse-patient and doctor-patient ratio at Kabwe Central Hospital? What are the expected new ratios once the recruitment has been done?

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, I will not be very precise because I may mislead the House except to say that currently, the health sector is operating at around 52 per cent capacity. So, with the 11,200 that we are going to capture, it will improve to maybe, around 58 to 60 per cent. That means we will still have a shortfall.

Madam Speaker, you may recall that I did indicate on the Floor of this House that the desire of the Government is to next year, again, do exactly what we are doing this year into the third year. So, we are depending on what we are calling a three term Medium Term Expenditure Framework (MTEF) plan, whereby this year, 2022, we will employ 11,200. In 2023, we will employ another 10,000 and in the third year; 2024 another 10,000. If we do this for three years, we feel that is when the situation will stabilise. The problem of human resource deficiencies will not be solved by employing the 11,200 health personnel.

Madam Speaker, the House may wish to note that in the past, we used to have very few doctors, for example. I remember the time I was Minister around 2008/2009, we would have about fifty doctors graduating from our university, and we were all fighting for those fifty. Some of them were sponsored to university by the mines and others were going to the private sector and so we had a challenge.

However, we are now producing over 500 doctors every year and so, that in itself brings challenges. It will not be easy for one to say or think that we can get 500 to 700 doctors every year because we also have to consider nurses who now are 20,000. Then, we have pharmacists, dentists, biomedical and clinical officers. We also need drivers for the new ambulances, we need cooks in hospitals and we need people to work in the laundry section and security personnel. So, all these are important because you cannot get a nurse to clean or cook for the patients.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Katakwe: Madam Speaker, the categories of doctors that have been mentioned by the hon. Minister are a recipe for corruption. You will recall that previously, graduates in the School of Medicine and the various categories that have been mentioned were being told to go with K10,000 to Ndeke House for them to be employed. What surety or assurance is the Government giving the people of Kabwe Central that such corruption will not be there for that little number that needs to be employed?

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, one of the areas that we are looking at, which has been agreed upon in line with the new policy of decentralisation, is that employment of health workers will not be done from the headquarters. It will be done in the various districts. So, obviously, at every level there could be an issue, but we are trying to decentralise.

Madam, we are also trying to make sure that there will be some committees that will be put in place by the Civil Service Commission so that it is not one person making decisions, but a committee at the district level. From the district, the appointments will be scrutinised at the provincial headquarters and from the province, they will come to the ministry’s headquarters. From the headquarters, the appointments will finally be sent to the Civil Service Commission. So, you can see that it is not one section or one individual making that decision.

Madam Speaker, we have heard stories of people giving money such as K5,000 or K10,000 to those purporting to be conducting the recruitment. We have heard of some officers getting money from our people who are desperate to be employed. We have been told, but we have no evidence. These are stories we hear, but there is no evidence and those people who give this money have never come to tell us. Nobody has reported anybody. I really wish somebody would come and give us that information because that person would be considered as a whistleblower. We would still give that person employment, as long as that person is able to give us evidence of the person in the ministry, so that we flash out that person. So far, these are just stories.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Lubozha: Madam Speaker, I am very thankful for the answers given by the hon. Minister of Health. This ministry stands cardinal and very critical. It is a very delicate ministry because it deals with life. As we are talking now, the absence of members of staff at the Kabwe General Hospital means loss of life. Lives are being lost in Kabwe. We appreciate the technical matrix the hon. Minister has highlighted in the recruitment process, but the prevailing situation has continued to contribute to the loss of life. What is her ministry doing to expedite the process of recruiting these people so that we can save lives in Kabwe? We have received report after report that the ministry will be recruiting, but when will this happen? I plead with the hon. Minister to save the lives of people in Kabwe.

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for his follow-up question. The challenges that Kabwe General Hospital is facing are being faced by many other hospitals. What we have been doing in the meantime is that when we see that there is a very bad situation, we are not waiting for the long process. In some cases, we have had to make temporary arrangements to ensure that we do not lose lives whilst this process is going on. Sometimes, we have transferred some of the health workers who are more in a particular hospital to save a situation.

Madam, maybe, this question was asked like a general question, but, if, indeed, today, I was told that Kabwe General Hospital does not even have one doctor, the following week we would make sure there is a doctor at the hospital.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

GOLD DEPOSITS PRESENCE IN KAFUE DISTRICT

214. Mrs Chonya asked the Minister of Mines and Minerals Development:

whether the Government is aware of the presence of gold deposits in Shamulonga area in Kafue District; and
if so, what measures are being taken to harness gold mining in the area.

The Minister of Mines and Minerals Development (Mr Kabuswe): Madam Speaker, the Government is not aware of the presence of gold deposits in Shamulonga area of Kafue District.

Madam, the Government has already dispatched a team to investigate the reported gold mineralisation in Shamulonga area of Kafue District and we await a report from the team.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mrs Chonya: Madam Speaker, I am delighted that at least the hon. Minister is saying that he has now dispatched a team because I had raised this matter earlier on the Floor and then there was a bit of communication with some officers, but then things went quiet. However, my follow-up question is: to what extent will the ministry consult or collaborate with the traditional leadership in the area, particularly, Her Royal Highness Chieftainess Mukamambo Nkomesha II in whose chiefdom these deposits are believed to be lying?

Mr Kabuswe: Madam Speaker, as Government, we have taken the issue of gold very seriously. The approach is that wherever there is mineralisation of anything, especially where their royal highnesses exist, we want to make sure that there is respect to their royal highnesses and people where that asset is domiciled and also respect just in terms of the policy that the Government is formulating.

Madam, the Government is, therefore, currently working out reforms around the gold sub-sector. When the policy is completely done, hon. Members will be informed on how we are going to progress because we take gold as a very serious asset in terms of changing the fortunes of this country.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chisanga (Lukashya): Madam Speaker, I just want to appreciate the answers being given by the hon. Minister. My question is to find out if the team that has been deployed also includes security personnel because of the excitement that comes with discoveries such as gold in communities.

Mr Kabuswe: Madam Speaker, issues of gold are quite sensitive and as such, whenever people are visiting areas where suspected gold deposits are, there is always security provided.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mubika (Shangombo): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister of Mines and Minerals Development in his earlier response stated that the Government is not aware of gold deposits in Kafue. However, again he has said that he has sent officers to go and check on the same gold. So, how did he send officers when he is not aware?

Mr Kabuswe: Madam Speaker, this is the Floor of the House. If I bring a report and say this is there, it means that I am telling the nation that we have confirmed. However, for the hon. Member’s information, when we say we have sent our people, it means that they are going to go, they will do a report and then we will report to the nation that the purported mineralisation is actually real or just a hoax.

I thank you, Madam Speaker,

Mrs Chonya: Madam Speaker, while the hon. Minister is doing that, will he also see about the possibility of cooperating with either the Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development or Ministry of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development, so that they can quickly work on the road leading to the area because it will be difficult for his officers to go and carry out this investigation?

Mr Kabuswe: Madam Speaker, mining is a very complex undertaking. You rarely discover minerals where there are roads and whatever infrastructure. Normally, minerals are discovered in a bush. However, when we know that there is mineralisation, all those things come into play. Of course, it also depends on the kind of investor who comes. It could be able an investor or the Government. So, we will then begin to develop access to that. It is like when you discover a mine, that there is a mineral, before you access the mineral, you now start digging – I will use very plain language – to access that mineral. So, even access to where there is mineralisation, what will happen is that roads will start being developed so that we access the area.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

PROVISION OF PIPED WATER TO MUFULIRA

215. Mr Mwila asked the Minister of Water Development and Sanitation:

whether the Government has any plans to provide piped water to the following areas in Mufulira Parliamentary Constituency:

Kansuswa;

Kawama West;

Kalukanya;

Kamuchanga;

Francis Mukuka; and

Bwananyina;

b. if so, when the plans will be implemented; and

c. what interim measures the Government is taking to provide clean water to the areas at (a) to avert waterborne diseases.

The Minister of Water Development and Sanitation (Mr Mposha): Madam Speaker, the Government has plans to provide piped water to Kansunswa, Kawama West, Kalukanya, Kamuchanga, Francis Mukuka and Bwananyina areas in Mufulira Parliamentary Constituency.

Madam, the Government has been implementing the plans to provide piped water in the above named areas as follows:

in Kansunswa the water supply network extension by 2.7 km and rehabilitation of three water kiosks and construction of 100m³ tank started in August, 2020 and has now reached 75 per cent completion level. The works are expected to be completed around March, 2022;
in Kawama West, the water supply network extension and rehabilitation of 5.7 km and construction of a 100m³ tank and rehabilitation of twelve water kiosks started in August, 2020 and has now reached 75 per cent completion level. The works are expected to be completed in March, 2022;
in Kalukanya, the extension of water supply network of about 2.2 km started in May, 2020 and has now reached 90 per cent completion level. The works are equally expected to be completed in the second quarter of 2022; and
in Kamuchanga, Francis Mukuka and Bwananyina, which is also Kawama East, the Government will implement the plans in 2023 subject to availability of funds.

Madam Speaker, to avert water-borne diseases, the Government is already supplying clean water to Kansunswa, Kawama West and Kalukanya as a result of the progress that the project has so far attained. While in Kamuchanga, Francis Mukuka and Bwananyina, the Government is providing water using the existing infrastructure and supported by water bowsers.

I thank you, Madam

Mr Mwila: Madam Speaker, indeed, I corroborate what the hon. Minister has outlined because I have seen works going on on the ground. The hon. Minister may wish to note that the areas in question represent almost 70 per cent of the entire constituency. So, we have a big problem with water in the constituency. The problem is that even in areas that have piped water, water rarely flows. In some places, you can have water for only two hours out of the twenty-four hours of the day. In some places, water does not even come out from taps. The clarification I need is: with the rehabilitations that the hon. Minister has outlined, are we going to see a twenty-four hour supply of water to the affected areas?

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, the projects that I have outlined are meant to build capacity and thereby improve service delivery to the areas that I have mentioned. I would not say that once these projects are completed, we will be able to provide supply for twenty-hours every day on a daily basis. However, suffice to say that there will be some significant improvement in the hours of supply in all the areas that I have mentioned.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mwila: Madam Speaker, we appreciate the assurances that the hon. Minister has given. We also appreciate the fact that in the interim, there is water being delivered through water bowsers. However, reality on the ground is that Mulonga Water and Sewerage Company is supplying water to three districts on the Copperbelt and it only has one water bowser.

Madam, while the hon. Minister may give us assurances, to see that water bowser in the constituency is a big problem. We have to make phone calls and wait for some days before we can see that water bowser.

So, Madam Speaker, the interim measure that the hon. Minister has mentioned is not working to his expectation. How often does the hon. Minister get feedback from the people on the ground to determine whether what they have told him is actually what they are doing? I ask this because we are not seeing what the hon. Minister is saying and I think he may have been informed by the officers on the ground. We have to push for the water bowser to be seen in the areas that are affected and it is quite frustrating for the people to go for days without water. It is a big problem.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, again, I thank the hon. Member for Mufulira for that question. It is, indeed, true that the catchment area for Mulonga Water and Sewerage Comppany is quite wide, covering Mufulira, Chingola and Chililabombwe. These are towns whose populations have grown over time and, indeed, we only have one water bowser for Mulonga Water and Sewerage Company.

Madam Speaker, what is important there is to acknowledge that this water bowser has been put on the ground to ensure that the people of Mufulira equally receive some water in the interim to avert an outbreak of water-borne related diseases in areas where the network is failing us. I get feedback very frequently.

Madam, with regards to the hon. Member of Parliament referring to where they have had challenges seeing the water bowser in Mufulira, indeed, we did have a challenge at some point where bailiffs pounced on our utility company, Mulonga Water and Sewerage Company. Unfortunately, equipment which was affected in that operation is the water bowser, itself. My office had to intervene and it took about two to three weeks for us to rescue the water bowser. However, I assure the hon. Member that the said water bowser is back in our possession under Mulonga Water and Sewerage Company and in the interim, we shall continue to provide water, in addition to our networks, to those areas where we have challenges.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

ROADS REHABILITATION IN PEMBA DISTRICT

216. Mr Hamwaata asked the Minister of Local Government and Rural Development:

whether the Government has any plans to rehabilitate the following roads in Pemba District:

Pemba/Mapanza;

Chisekesi/Habbanyuka;

Pemba/Maambo; and

Muzoka/Moyo;

b. if so, when the plans will be implemented; and

c. if there are no such plans, why.

Mrs Masebo (on behalf of the Minister of Local Government and Rural Development (Mr Nkombo)): Madam Speaker, the Government is desirous to rehabilitate feeder roads across the country. However, there are no current plans to rehabilitate the said feeder roads in Pemba District as the ministry has not yet received the request for their rehabilitation from Pemba District Council. The feeder roads in Pemba District can only be included in the annual work plan once the local authority submits the prioritised list of roads.

Madam Speaker, as stated in (a) above, the commencement period will depend on the submission of the roads to be worked on as this is the information used when developing the work plan.

Madam Speaker, as stated in (a) above, the Government has plans, therefore, part (c) of the question falls off.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Munsanje (Mbabala): Madam Speaker, I thank you for according the people of Mbabala an opportunity to ask a follow-up question on Pemba feeder roads.

Madam Speaker, on the feeder roads which are being talked about in Pemba are three bridges that collapsed in the last ten years of the past regime. Is the ministry going to prioritise those bridges that are on the Pemba/Mbabala route given that we have a mini national disaster in that region?

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, the question was on feeder roads but now I am hearing bridges. I think it will be necessary to help hon. Members when it comes to questions dealing with feeder roads, bridges and what should be prioritised. I think the first point that hon. Members must take note of is that the Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development does not decide which roads and bridges to fix.

Madam, it is the local authority and hon. Members of Parliament who are supposed to meet in their respective district councils and prioritise what they want done in a particular year. To this effect, in the past, the Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development worked on a three year work plan but under the New Dawn Government that has changed. The ministry is working over a ten year work plan.

Madam Speaker, what that means therefore, is that respective district councils, countrywide, must sit with the hon. Members of Parliament and everybody concerned and decide which roads, in the next ten years, they want constructed, rehabilitated, fixed and so on and so forth. That information should be sent to the Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development. Based on what they submit, the Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development will then prioritise their work plan not over three years but over ten years.

Madam, the ministry will, however, not do what it was doing in the past where it committed beyond its budget. It will commit annually. So, arising from that work plan, the ministry will be able to say, for 2022, based on priorities received from the various districts, these are the roads or bridges that we are going to deal with, so that at the end of that year, those roads and bridges would have finished. Next year, it will look at what you, yourselves had submitted. Again, it will be able to budget within that year, so that works are completed within the year and that we do not get involved in things that create problems in terms of outstanding debts. Currently, our hon. Colleagues left a mess of a debt at local government which this Government is grappling with.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Hamwaata: Madam Speaker, I want to bring to the attention of the hon. Minister that we have a minim hospital in Moyo Chiefdom. This is where the Moyo/Muzoka feeder road is. Along this road, we have a number of bridges.

Madam, in as much as the hon. Minister said that we are talking of feeder roads and not bridges, I want to make it clear that as we are talking of roads, where there are crossing points, we have to sort out the bridges. Therefore, bridges are part and parcel of feeder roads. Now, it is on this road where we have a mini hospital. Further, the distance from there to the nearest point where we have to refer patients who have critical conditions is slightly more than 60 km. Now, in the interest of the people of Pemba, in as much as the hon. Minister has clearly indicated that we need to submit a request before the ministry can include a feeder road into the budget, could the hon. Minister consider bringing a Supplementary Budget so that the lives of people and also the farmers who are supposed to be using that route are served. I need an answer.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Pemba, I would advise you to visit the Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development to submit your requests. As the hon. Minister has said, you have not submitted your requests yet so it cannot be considered if you do not submit your requests.

STALLED REHABILITATION OF ROADS IN CHAMA NORTH

217. Mr Mtayachalo asked the Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development:

why the rehabilitation of the following roads in Chama North Parliamentary Constituency stalled:

Chama/Matumbo;

Chama/Lundazi; and

Chama/Muyombe;

b. when the works on each project will resume;

c. how much money was owed to each contractor, as of September, 2021; and

d. what the timeframe for the completion of each project is.

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, in fairness to the subject of these roads, I think we have discussed them extensively. However, in fairness to the hon. Member, this question was submitted on 4^th October, 20221. So, we have to answer it, but bearing in mind that on the Floor of this House, we have discussed what the Government is doing. However, the following is the answer:

the construction works on the Chama/Matumbo, Chama/Lundazi and Chama/Muyombe roads have stalled due to funding challenges;
the construction works on the Chama/Matumbo, Chama/Lundazi and Chama/Muyombe roads will resume once funds are made available by the Treasury; and
as of September, 2021, the amount owed to contractors for certified works on each of the projects are as follows:

Name of the Road Amount (K)

Chama/Matumbo 40,228,289.38

Chama/Lundazi 22,672,007.20

Chama/Muyombe 32,309,401.80.

the initial time frame for the completion of each project was as follows:

Name of the Road Duration

Chama/Matumbo 12 months

Chama/Lundazi 18 months

Chama/Muyombe 12 months.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mung’andu (Chama South): Madam Speaker, now that Chama has been taken back to the Eastern Province, civil servants take a minimum of seven hours to travel from Chama to Lundazi and another two and half hours to reach Chipata, which is the provincial headquarters for the Eastern Province.

Madam Speaker, is the Government considering carrying out immediate emergency works on the Chama/Lundazi Road? Civil servants who used to take two to three hours are now taking the whole day to reach Chipata. What assurance is the Government giving us that Kampemba and Luangwa bridges and the 61km –

Madam Speaker: Order!

Hon. Member, ask only one question.

Eng Milupi: Madam Speaker, first of all, let me assure the hon. Member and the House that, right at this particular moment, the trip from Chama to Chinsali is not two hours. It is a lot more than two hours because I have been on that road. It is equally bad, especially after the Luangwa River.

Madam Speaker, we are working, and yesterday, we were talking about the same road. I think it was raised by the hon. Member for Chasefu and we said this New Dawn Administration is committed to upgrading it from where it was downgraded or rescoped to gravel road to bituminous tar road. I also made mention of the low bridges on right along that road between Lundazi and Chama.

Madam Speaker, our intention remains the same. This is part of our plans; to open up that particular corridor and we think that we can attract investors to help us on a Public-Private Partnership (PPP) basis. We are fully mindful, that now that Chama is back into the Eastern Province, we must provide easy connectivity between Chama and Lundazi. In the same token, we must also work on the Chipata/Lundazi Road, especially from where Chipangali Constituency finishes. I think there is about 50km that is in terrible state. I have seen videos and pictures of that particular road. We must work on it so that there is complete connectivity from Chama as the district headquarters to Chipata the provincial headquarters. So, we are working on that.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, please ask supplementary questions which have not been asked before because this question has already been tackled. Even yesterday, it was also discussed before this honourable House.

Mr Mtayachalo: Madam Speaker, once more, I just want to take this opportunity to thank the hon. Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development for coming to Chama District and the people of Chama were extremely excited because this has not been done over a long period of time. Further, I want to thank the Government for having reversed the downgrading of the road from bituminous to gravel, but this time, I think it will go back to bituminous, and the people of Chama are very thankful.

Madam Speaker, lastly, I just want to ask the hon. Minister whether he can be so kind to the people of Chama by just giving us the timeframe when this road will be worked on. Could he state whether it will be two or three years when this road link from Matumbo to Lundazi will be developed into bituminous standards.

Madam Speaker: From my recollection, that question was asked and the hon. Minister answered. So, I do not know if there will be a change in the answer or not.

Mr Kampyongo: Madam Speaker, mine is slightly a rider to the one asked earlier. Equally, the people of Shiwang’andu were very happy to see the hon. Minister coming out of Chama through Shiwang’andu on this Chama/Matumbo Road. The stretch in Shiwang’andu is all done. I do recall that last year, the hon. Minister assured us that once the Budget is passed, the people of Shiwang’andu and Chama would see some works commence on that stretch.

Madam Speaker, could the hon. Minister kindly share with us whether the position has changed from what he assured us last year?

Eng. Milupi: Yaa! Mwaiche wandi. Madam Speaker, –

Madam Speaker: Mwaiche wandi, meaning?

Laughter

Eng. Milupi: My young man.

Laughter

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, we are not running away from responsibilities. We are keen on that road. Our main agenda is to drive the economy anchored on trade and investment, especially trade. To have trade, you have to open up these routes. That route has to be opened up, but we are mindful of the difficulties we have, and that is why for this one, I have time and again emphasised that the anticipated volume of traffic on that road qualifies it for a PPP.

Madam, if you went there to count how many vehicles are passing, especially now, you would find very few four-wheel drive vehicles. However, we know that once we have an international standard tarmac on that road, the volume will be tremendous. So, that is our commitment, but when you are dealing with investors, you cannot give a timeframe until you have engaged them. By the way we speak in this House and elsewhere, the private sector and others are aware that the Government wants to engage with them and come up with a PPP for that road. I think that is the correct way to go. As to whether I can say we will do it this year or we will not do it, if I get some investor-contractor now – what I can assure the hon. Member is that I will do everything in my power to facilitate that particular transaction.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr E. Tembo (Feira): Madam Speaker, when the Executive has been asked to give us answers, I am of the considered view that it needs to give us details as well as clear answers. I am also of the view that the hon. Minister needs to specify when the funds will be available and I think that is very important. Otherwise, we will be sitting here getting allowances without really doing our work as Members of Parliament and providing oversight. So, for me, I think that it is important that the hon. Minister gives a timeframe even it is fifty years from now, it is okay, at least he would have answered.

Madam Speaker: From my recollection, hon. Member for Feira, you asked that same question yesterday and an answer was provided. So, in order to avoid tedious repetition, I will spare the hon. Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Developmentfrom repeating the same answer, and we make progress. Next question.

CONSTRUCTION OF LEVEL ONE HOSPITAL IN KATUBA

218. Mr Nkulukusa (Katuba) asked the Minister of Health:

whether the Government has any plans to construct a level one hospital in Katuba Parliamentary Constituency;
if so, when the plans will be implemented; and
if there are no such plans, why.

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, the Government has plans to ensure that all districts in the country have quality health facilities as close to the people as possible, but obviously, this will be achieved over a period of time.

Madam Speaker, as regards Katuba Parliamentary Constituency, I inform the hon. Member of Parliament that Katuba falls under Chibombo District, and currently, Katuba Parliamentary Constituency is being serviced by a hospital known as Mwachisompola Demonstration Zone.

Madam, Mwachisompola Demonstration Zone was recently upgraded to a level one hospital, meaning it has been given a district status. What this entails is that you cannot have two district hospitals within a district. So, what this mean, therefore is that we are reviewing this decision so that instead of declaring Mwachisompola Demonstration Zone district hospital, we just improve it by upgrading it and improving the structure including equipment and staffing levels, but proceed to give Chibombo District a proper district hospital.

Ms Kasune:Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, because of this, this will not be possible in this year’s Budget but in the 2023 Budget. However, this year, we shall improve the facility at this current hospital, which is a demonstration zone, and we shall also try to improve the rural health centre within Katuba Parliamentary Constituency, but next year, we will give the district a hospital.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Nkulukusa: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for that good response.

Madam Speaker: Sorry. Is that the hon. Member for –

Mr Nkulukusa: Katuba.

Madam Speaker: Proceed hon. Member for Katuba.

Mr Nkulukusa: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for that elaborate response and for assuring the people of Katuba and Chibombo as a district. I know that the hospital that she has spoken about is in Keembe, which is quite far from Katuba. However, I asked that question because several times, I know Katuba was promised a hospital and the ground-breaking ceremony was done but unfortunately, that never materialised. So, we look forward to it materialising in2023. That is the comment I wanted to make.

CONSTRUCTION OF NAMFUNGO BRIDGE IN ISOKA

219. Ms Nakaponda (Isoka) asked the Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development:

when the Government will complete the construction of Namfungo Bridge in Isoka Parliamentary Constituency;
what the cause of the delay in completing the project is;
what the cost of the outstanding works is; and
what the timeframe for the completion of the project is.

Eng. Milupi: Madam Speaker, this is one of the questions overtaken by events. In fairness, it was given on 29^th October, 2021. Nevertheless, the construction of Namfungo Bridge in Isoka Parliamentary Constituency was completed in January, 2022.

Madam Speaker, the cause of the delay then in completing the project was funding challenges.

Madam Speaker, there is no outstanding cost on the construction of the bridge.

Madam Speaker, the timeframe for the completion of the project was three months.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Nakaponda: Madam Speaker, I am glad to let you know that the bridge has been completed and the people of Isoka are happy. I just want to remind the hon. Minister not to leave the owner of the constituency behind when the time to commission it comes.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: Order!

_______

MOTION

ADJOURNMENT

The Vice-President (Mrs Nalumango): Madam Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

Question put and agreed to.

_______

The House adjourned at 1821 hours until 0900 hours on Friday, 25^th February, 2022.

____________

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