DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE SECOND SESSION OF THE ELEVENTH ASSEMBLY

Tuesday, 16th October, 2012

The House met at 1430 hours

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

________

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

THREATS ON SINJEMBELA TEACHERS

124. Mr Njeulu (Sinjembela) asked the Minister of Home Affairs:

(a)    whether the ministry was aware that unknown people believed to be heavily armed are plotting to attack teachers at the newly-opened Sinjembela Basic School, on Independence Day, 24th October, 2012;

(b)    if so, what measures the ministry had taken to thwart the plot;

(c)    whether the ministry was aware that some villagers in the area are in illegal possession of firearms; and 

(d)    if so, what measures the ministry had taken to disarm them in order to ensure security in the area.

The Deputy Minister of Home Affairs (Mr E Lungu): Mr Speaker, firstly, I wish to express my anxiety over the question raised by the hon. Member of Parliament for Sinjembela. It is my hope that the hon. Member has reported the matter to the police in order for them to take immediate action because these are very serious matters. However, the Ministry of Home Affairs is not aware that unknown people who are believed to be heavily-armed are plotting to attack teachers at the newly-opened Sinjembela Basic School on Independence Day, 24th October, 2012.

Mr Speaker, however, the Zambia Police Force command has routinely deployed paramilitary, mobile, Criminal Investigations Department (CID) and police intelligence officers to Sinjembela to preserve law and order in the area. The officers are there to ensure that anyone who breaks the law is arrested and prosecuted. Let me emphasise that, in this respect, Sinjembela is not different from other districts in the country.

Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Home Affairs is not aware that some villagers in Sinjembela Parliamentary Constituency are in possession of firearms. 

Sir, the Government, through the Zambia Police Force, is running an amnesty programme on firearms not only in Sinjembela, but throughout the country. The firearms amnesty is meant to encourage people who are in possession of illegal firearms to surrender them to the police. Those who do so are given K500, 000 for each gun surrendered.

Mr Speaker, the police conducts regular security operations in all areas, including Sinjembela, when it suspects that people there are in possession of illegal firearms. All firearms confiscated, either through the firearms amnesty or security operations, are destroyed as per Government policy.

Mr Speaker, let me just conclude by urging my colleagues to be vigilant and help us maintain law and order. I was alarmed when I received this question because I felt that it would have been right to first report the cases to the police, unlike raising this question on the Floor of this House.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Njeulu: Mr Speaker …

Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I rise on a serious point of order that borders on the integrity and sanctity of this House. Last week, I raised a point of order on the issue of the presentation of the 2013 Budget Speech to this House. At that time, you indicated that it was prudent to wait and see how the Government would address this issue. Eventually, the hon. Minister of Finance, who is still the Acting President, which is the reason he is not in this House, came and delivered the Budget Speech on the Floor of this House.

Mr Speaker, are we in order, as a House, to allow the Government of the Republic of Zambia to abuse the processes of Parliament with impunity when it knows the rules that apply in this House? Is the Government in order to start setting precedent on the Floor of this House that demeans the integrity of the House? Is it in order to allow hon. Government Members to do wrong things because they know that they will get away with it? This is the first time in the history of this Parliament that such a thing has happened. This is not a moot Parliament, but one that is regulated by the Constitution of Zambia, and the Act of Parliament that regulates it. Are they in order to continue abusing the privileges that have been accorded to them in this House? I need your serious ruling.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Order!

The position is that we have a substantive holder of the position of Republican President. For the record, that is His Excellency the President, Mr Michael Chilufya Sata. He is, currently, outside jurisdiction and, in terms of the Constitution, as we are all aware, he has the power to appoint a Member of the Cabinet to act in his absence. Currently, Hon. Chikwanda, is the Acting President of the Republic of Zambia.

Primarily, the business of the day on Friday was presentation of the Budget. This function is executed, as we all know, by the hon. Minister of Finance. The fact that the hon. Minister of Finance is acting President of the Republic, in the absence of the substantive President, does not result in his vacation of his substantive position as hon. Minister of Finance.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Before the President left on national duty outside the country, he duly instructed the hon. Minister of Finance, as is the tradition, to deliver a message to this House. I was duly advised of this fact and the hon. Minister performed his duty in accordance with tradition. There is, really, nothing unprocedural about the way things were handled. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: The House is not in any way undermined, as suggested by the hon Member for Monze Central. The acting President, I believe, even now, is still performing a dual function, namely, that of Acting President as well as his statutory functions as hon. Minister of Finance. He came through specifically to discharge his function as hon. Minister of Finance. He has not vacated that position. The acting appointment is simply for administrative convenience.  

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: We still have a substantive order. President Sata is still President of the Republic of Zambia. 

I thank you. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member for Sinjembela may continue. 

Mr Njeulu: Mr Speaker, I am disappointed that the hon. Minister, whom I heard saying that he would be sending paramilitary police officers for routine patrols, is not aware of the plot, yet the matter was reported to the police which, in turn, should have reported to the headquarters. 

Mr Speaker, Sinjembela Basic School was closed in 2010…

Hon. Government Member: Question!

Mr Njeulu: Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister consider establishing a police post in Sinjembela and, possibly, work in collaboration with the Ministry of Defence to disarm those people who are believed to be armed and planning the attacks.

Mr E. C. Lungu: Mr Speaker, we are not witchdoctors or magicians to know what will happen on 24th October, 2012. The question, as put, is that something will happen on 24th October, 2012. We have been made alive to this prophesy. Therefore, we have caused our people on move onto the ground. However, the reference to the closure of the school in 2010 does not even arise in the question. All we are saying is that once we are made aware, we react to the information that we have. 

The hon. Member of Parliament asked us whether we were aware of what will happen on the 24th October, 2012. We have addressed our minds to this. In view of this information, we have confirmed that there are officers on the ground who are patrolling and, if the prophesy comes to pass, the police will deal with the culprits. We are most grateful that the information about the attack has come through. However, I would like to urge the hon. Member not to take such information through the channel that he did. It is better to give it to the local or national police so that they can deal with it. 

Concerning the police post, we have told this hon. House that there are plans to build a police post in every constituency where there is none. As far as I am concerned, these still remain our plans. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Muntanga (Kalomo Central): Mr Speaker, the problem of karavinas in Sinjembela, like the one in the Luano Valley, is a long-standing issue. Would the hon. Minister consider, as a matter of urgency, opening up a semi-permanent position for the police so that they curb the problems that are in Sinjembela. 

Mr E. C. Lungu: Mr Speaker, our desire is not to open a semi-permanent presence, but a permanent police presence countrywide to curb crime and ease the suffering of our people. We know that the problem of karavinas, as stated to by the hon. Member for Kalomo Central, has been long-standing. That is why I said that we are sending people wherever we anticipate trouble to go and see how they could bring the culprits to book. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you. {mospagebreak}

Mr Mufalali (Senanga): Mr Speaker, I am really disappointed with the hon. Minister of Home Affairs, who does not seem to know what is going on in his ministry. The issue of karavinas in Sinjembela has long existed. This is not the first time that such issues are happening there. 

Mr Speaker: Order!

Hon. Member, before you proceed, I do not think that it is fair to make such a generalised statement about the hon. Minister. You are saying that he is simply not aware of anything that is going on in his ministry.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! 

I think that, in all fairness, let us restrict ourselves to the issues before the House. That is too broad a statement to make. Please, restrict yourself to the issue on the Floor. 

You may continue. 

Mr Mufalali: I thank you for your correction, Sir.

Mr Speaker, the school where the attacks will purportedly take place has had a similar incident before, where teachers were attacked while playing football. Some of the teachers had their ribs broken, yet the hon. Minister is not aware. How much will the people bringing in the guns be paid in the amnesty programme? People in Sinjembela have many guns that came with the National Union for the Total Independence of Angola (UNITA) people. 

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members, let us follow these questions and answers very closely. I will, however, leave it to the hon. Minister to speak for himself. 

Mr E. C. Lungu: Mr Speaker, Sinjembela Basic School was contextualised in the question presented to me. The context was 24th October, 2012. Do you want me to cast backwards and tell you what happened in the past? I know what happened. I can tell you that, in June, this school was attacked and four teachers were injured. Is that what you asked for? I do not want to roam and go wild. Allow me to answer questions as put. 

Mr Speaker, I think that I did justice to the question. However, the follow-up question about the guns which have been collected in the amnesty in Sinjembela is a new question, but I am sure that I can answer it. I can even give you the details of how many guns have been collected countrywide. 

I am aware of how many guns have been collected region by region countrywide. If you asked me a question, I will answer it. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister said that he was shocked when he saw the question yesterday. In light of this question, has he considered sending all the staff he has mentioned to go and ascertain the situation, apart from the routine patrols that are conducted?

Mr E. C. Lungu: Mr Speaker, I know that English is not my first language, but can the hon. Member just paraphrase the question so that I can comprehend. 

I thank you. 

Laughter 

Mr Speaker: Hon. Mutelo, could you put a simple direct question? 

Mr Mutelo: Mr Speaker, after getting the question, yesterday, has the ho. Minister decided to quickly send officers from his ministry to Sinjembela? 

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: hon. Minister, what measures has your ministry taken since receiving the information?

Laughter 

Mr E. C. Lungu: Mr Speaker, I know that, some time back, you used to be a lecturer. so, thank you for helping out.

Laughter

Mr E. C. Lungu: Sir, upon receipt of the question, I engaged the State machinery to tell me what is being done on the ground, and what I was told is what I have brought before the House.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Simbao (Senga Hill): Mr Speaker, in his response, the hon. Minister mentioned that K500, 000 is offered for the return of a firearm. Has this exercise been successful?

Mr E. C. Lungu: Mr Speaker, success cannot be measured on a scale. I do not know how many firearms are out there. So, I can only tell when there is a robbery or misuse of firearms that there are still firearms in wrong hands. It is a very speculative question. All I can say is that the exercise is on-going and the police is doing something to reduce the numbers of firearms in wrong hands.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Lufuma (Kabompo West): Mr Speaker, I appreciate the hon. Minister’s predicament, …

Laughter

Mr Lufuma: … but I would like to find out how many guns have been cropped in since the exercise started. 

Mr E. C. Lungu: Mr Speaker, I know the word ‘cropping’ might sound misplaced, but it can be used differently. Somebody asked how many firearms have been cropped in or received from this exercise and I said that I cannot tell unless it came as a separate question. However, the police know how many firearms have been received through the exercise region by region and district by district.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

CONSTRUCTION OF A SECONDARY SCHOOL AT BWINA

125. Mr Sililo (Mulobezi) asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education:

(a)    when the Government would build a secondary school at Bwina in Mulobezi District;

(b)    what the estimated cost of the project was; and

(c)    what the timeframe for the project was.

The Deputy Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Mr Mabumba): Mr Speaker, …

Ms Siliya entered the Assembly Chamber.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear! Dora!

Mr Chisala: Waile kwi?

Mr Mabumba: Ati waile kwisa?

Laughter

Mr Mabumba: … the Government is, currently, constructing Mulobezi Day High School in Mulobezi District, which will cater for the population of pupils at Bwina as well.

Sir, the contract sum for the construction of Mulobezi Day High School is K15, 623,700, 262, and the school is expected to be completed in August, 2013.

I thank you, Sir.

CREATION OF DISTRICTS

126. Mr Simbao asked the Vice-President:

(a)    what criteria the Government used to create new districts; and

(b)    when Senga Hill and Nseluka in the Northern Province would attain district status.

The Deputy Minister in the Vice-President’s Office (Mr Kalaba): Mr Speaker, according to the Provincial and District Boundaries Act, Cap. 286, of the Laws of Zambia, under Section 2 - Division of Zambia into Provinces and Districts, the law states that:

“The President may, by statutory order, divide Zambia into such provinces and divide the provinces into such districts as may be convenient for the purposes of administration, describing the boundaries thereof and assigning names thereto.”

The Ministry of Local Government and Housing has developed administrative criteria to guide any recommendations to declare an area a district. Below are the criteria:

(a)    population size;

(b)    economic activity and developmental capacity of the area;

(c)    land extent in hectares; and

(d)    level of existing support infrastructure, such as banks, clinics and schools.

In the final analysis, the prerogative for declaring an area a district lies with the President.

Sir, given the scenario described at (a) above, it cannot be stated for certain when the President might exercise the power conferred upon him in Cap. 286 of the Laws of Zambia to declare an area a district.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Simbao: Mr Speaker, is there a plan on the creation of more districts by the Government?

The Vice-President (Dr Scott): Mr Speaker, I am not aware of any such plan. I would be surprised if the Presidential prerogative were to operate in that way.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ndalamei (Sikongo): Mr Speaker, what is the minimum population required for a place to be declared a district?

The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, there is no minimum population specified. The fact is that these are guidelines which the Ministry of Local Government and Housing has developed to assist the President in exercising his prerogative. Again, it would be very strange if there were prescriptions on population size.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mwiimbu (Monze Central): Mr Speaker, one of the major criteria that are being used is availability of infrastructure. What infrastructure is there in Chikankata for it to qualify for upgrading to district status and to make it a district council? Is there any council chamber in Chikankata?

The Vice President: Mr Speaker, that is asking for a level of knowledge and detail that would require more than my normal powers of witchcraft to answer …

Laughter

The Vice-President: … without a separate question on the specific districts coming.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Lufuma: Mr Speaker, since the power to designate areas as districts or provincial headquarters lies with the President, may I know, in view of the election that is going on in Mufumbwe, whether the President is going to declare Mufumbwe the provincial headquarters for the North-Western Province, instead of Kabompo?

Interruptions

The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I would advise the hon. Member to relax. I really would not be too exercised by that possibility.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

MEDICAL DOCTORS

127. Mr Mtolo (Chipata Central) asked the Minister of Health:

(a)    how many medical doctors were currently registered and practising in Zambia;

(b)    what measures the ministry had taken to help patients determine whether they were seeking help from a conventionally-trained medical doctor or a herbalist; and

(c)    how many Chinese doctors were operating in Zambia in the following categories:

(i)    herbalists; and

(ii)    conventionally-trained doctors.

The Deputy Minister of Health (Dr Chikusu): Mr Speaker, there were 2,289 medical doctors registered and practising in Zambia as at 30th June, 2012. The distribution is as follows:

Category of Doctors    No. of Doctors

    Provisionally-registered (locally-trained doctors)        141

    Temporarily-registered (foreign trained doctors)        150

    Fully registered (permanent registration)        1, 998

    Total            2, 289 

Mr Speaker, the Health Professions Council of Zambia (HPCZ) only registers conventional doctors, not herbalists. Therefore, the ministry always ensures that any person seeking health care services in Government and other conventional hospitals is attended to by a conventionally-trained medical doctor.

Mr Speaker, there are, currently, fifteen Chinese doctors registered with the Traditional Health Practitioners Association of Zambia (TPAZ) and operating as herbalists in Zambia.

Sir, currently, there are 132 conventionally-trained and registered Chinese medical doctors practising in the country. Of these, sixty-eight are on temporary registration while sixty-four are on full registration.

I thank you, Sir.{mospagebreak}

TRAINING COSTS AT THE UNIVERSITY OF ZAMBIA

128. Mr Chisala (Chilubi) asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education how much money, on average, was required to train one student in the following schools at the University of Zambia:

    (a)    Education;

    (b)    Humanities and Social Sciences;

    (c)    Natural Sciences;

    (d)    Medicine;

    (e)    Mines; and

(f)    Agriculture.

The Deputy Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Professor Willombe): Mr Speaker, on average, the cost required to train one student in the following schools at the University of Zambia is as tabulated below:

    School    Cost (K ‘Million)

    Education    9    

    Humanities and            12
    Social Sciences

    Natural Sciences        19    

    Medicine        40    

    Mines        46    

    Agriculture        35    

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kazonga (Vubwi): Mr Speaker, I am interested in the School of Education. Since the hon. Minister is aware that there are two programmes in education, namely, Arts and Sciences, did the average that he mentioned take into account the this fact?

Professor Willombe: Mr Speaker, yes.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, for over ten years now, there have been very strong reports of corrupt activities at the Bursaries Committee, to the extent that students from poor families who are studying at the two public universities cannot access bursaries. In view of that, and especially that our Government aims at fighting corruption, what measures has the ministry put in place to correct the situation?

Prof Willombe: Mr Speaker, that is a new question.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

Mr Mbewe (Chadiza): Mr Speaker, the Government is spending a lot of money on training people in universities and colleges. However, when the beneficiaries of the bursaries start work, some do not even work for the Government, but go into the private sector or start running their own businesses. What is the Government doing to bond such students so that they can work for the Government as a way of paying back the money the Government spent on their education?

The Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Dr Phiri): Mr Speaker, although this question by the hon. Member is slightly out of context of the principal question, it is a pertinent one. Let me state that, yes, these are huge amounts of money that are spent on training a single citizen at the various schools at the University of Zambia.

Sir, we are also mindful that the bursary regime does not cater for every citizen. This is why we are now finalising the creation of an independent or semi-autonomous institution, an authority to administer student scholarships and loans, so that, when a citizen gets a loan from this authority, he/she can be monitored and be made to pay back.

Mr Speaker, the authority will establish a revolving fund that will continuously help other citizens in need of academic and educational requirements.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Mweetwa (Choma Central): Mr Speaker, does the Government have any plans to recoup the money spent on training those who have passed through the university, such as the hon. Minister?

Laughter

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, apart from having that authority in place, we will also figure out how the hon. Member for Choma Central, who benefited twice from the University of Zambia, could help it enhance its operations. So, there, definitely, are plans that we will work on.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, is the former president of the University of Zambia Students Union (UNZASU), the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education, aware that, just like in the old days, it is difficult to bond any student from UNZA due to the Government’s failure to provide jobs? Is he confirming that the PF Government will be able to bond the people who are trained at these universities when it is not able to provide jobs for them?

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, with a fully-fledged authority, as I indicated, its other mandate will be to work out mechanisms that can be used to bond and recoup a little from those who have passed through the institutions. Modalities will be put in place by the authority once it is instituted.

I thank you, Sir.

PORNOGRAPGHY CASES

129. Mr Chisala asked the Minister of Home Affairs what the number of individuals arrested and prosecuted for offences related to pornography was, from October, 2011.

The Deputy Minister of Home Affairs (Mr Chilangwa): Mr Speaker, the Zambia Police has recorded three cases of pornography, resulting in the arrest and prosecution of three people since October, 2011. Two cases are, currently, before the courts of law while one person has since been disposed of.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Chisala: Sir, it has been discovered that pornography offences are as a result of the high exposure to information and communication technology (ICT), especially among teenagers. That being the case, how does the Government intend to bring these offences down?

Mr Chilangwa: Mr Speaker, as we are all aware, technological advances have brought numerous challenges, not only to this country, but also other countries. Further, this country is, currently, grappling with the issue of how to handle online publications, which has come as a result of technological developments. So, the Government is collaborating with many other stakeholders to tackle some of these issues through a holistic approach.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

REHABILITATION OF KAFUE/CHIRUNDU ROAD

131. Ntundu (Gwembe) asked the Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication:

(a)    when the Government would rehabilitate the stretch of the Kafue/Chirundu Road that was omitted when the rest of the road was rehabilitated;

(b)    why the stretch was omitted;

(c)    what the length, in kilometres, of the stretch was; and 

(d)    which contractor would work on the road.

The Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication (Mr Yaluma): Mr Speaker, the Government, through the Road Development Agency (RDA) and with financing from the World Bank, will start the works on the Kafue/Chirundu Road next month. 

Sir, the road has been split into four links for the purpose of tendering and financing support arrangements. There is link one and two, which are from the Makeni Road Junction to Turn Park Junction, where the Mazabuka Road turns off. We have also received a grant from a tripartite trust account comprising the following joint sponsors: the Common Market for East and Southern Africa (COMESA), Development Bank of South Africa (DBSA) and the East African Community (EAC). These are funding the last link, number four, of the road.

Mr Speaker, the stretch in question was omitted due to lack of funding then but, now, since we have got commitment, in terms of funding, we will work on it. 

Sir, the road section to be rehabilitated is 94 km and Messrs China Henan International Group of Companies has been contracted to do the road.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Ntundu: Sir, for the first time the hon. Minister has given a good answer.

Laughter 

Mr Speaker: Are you ending at complimenting?

Mr Ntundu: No, Sir. I have a follow-up question. Is the hon. Minister aware of the condition of the rest of the road that he has not mentioned?

Mr Speaker: Well, answer, hon. Minister.

Laughter 

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, I presume I have referred to the stretch of the road as requested in the question. I have, actually, referred to four segments of the road in the question.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mweetwa: Mr Speaker, is the PF Government aware of all the roads in this country that require maintenance and construction because, when President Sata was launching the Link Zambia 8,000 …

Mr Speaker: Order!

First of all, is that a supplementary question, Hon. Member for Choma Central?

Mr Mweetwa: Yes, Sir.

Mr Speaker: Ask a supplementary question.

Mr Mweetwa: Mr Speaker, now that the hon. Minister is aware of this stretch that requires completion on the Kafue/Chirundu Road, is he aware of the many roads across the nation that also require maintenance and construction? I ask this because, when the President was launching the 8,000km Link Zambia Project, he, actually, just mentioned roads, name by name, in one region and asked hon. Members of Parliament to submit the names of roads that required maintenance in the rest of the country. This means that, perhaps, the PF Government is not aware of the condition of the other roads and is only concerned about one region.

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, it is always my pleasure to answer bonus questions. However, I do not want to go very far. I think that Hon. Mweetwa did not do his homework and, therefore, I lay this document on the Table.

Mr Yaluma laid the paper on the Table.

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has just laid a very important document on the Table. When is he going to distribute that information to hon. Members of Parliament so that we know which roads are going to be included in the Link Zambia 8,000 roads projects?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, I guess I should not answer this question because the hon. Member of Parliament for Chadiza cannot even properly identify the project. It is not the 8,000 roads projects. I am sorry about that.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, if I heard the hon. Minister correctly, he mentioned that the road between the Kafue Roundabout …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I will repeat. If I heard the hon. Minister correctly, he mentioned that the road between the Kafue Roundabout and the turnoff to Mazabuka will be worked on soon. Arising from that answer, I would like to find out when the stretch from Turn Park to Mazabuka will be worked on, considering that we have lost a number of lives on that stretch.

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, the question that is being debated is on the stretch from Kafue to Chirundu. What I highlighted was the stretch starting from Makeni, here, in Lusaka, all the way to the junction at Turn Park, which turns off to Mazabuka and, further on. This is a stretch of 94km and mobilisation of equipment starts next month.

I thank you, Sir.

Ms Lubezhi (Namwala): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has just shown us a small document which has been laid on the Table. What are the contents in that document?

Interruptions

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, I feel a little disappointed because the hon. Members of this House were all invited to the launch of the Link Zambia 8, 000km Project. It was a big and well-publicised event. I do not know why they did not show up.  However, should they need an extension of this very important document, which will signify …

Mr Speaker: Order! 

Hon. Minister, for the sake of expediency, just speak to it briefly.

Laughter

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, this is the Link Zambia 8, 000km Project. At least three roads per province will be worked on. We have started executing and conducting feasibility studies and designs for these roads. Phase I …

Mr Speaker: Order!

I think, that is enough. We shall circulate the document.

Mr Yaluma: Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker: Order! 

I think that there is a point made by the hon. Minister that we should take interest in the public affairs as they are administered.

Interruptions

Mr Hamudulu (Siavonga): Mr Speaker, will the …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Mr Hamudulu: … contractor only confine works to the undone stretch or also work on the already done stretch which has since developed potholes?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, the contractor will start from the Makeni Junction and go all the way to Chirundu. That covers almost the entire road because only the stretch from Lusaka City Centre to Makeni Junction will be excluded.

Thank you, Sir.

Mr Mutati (Lunte):  Mr Speaker, the Kafue/Chirundu Road is an important link, particularly for exports, and the maintenance cost of this road, sometimes, tends to be colossal. Is the hon. Minister planning to introduce toll gates as part of the maintenance regime for this and other link roads?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, yes, we are introducing toll gates on this road.

Thank you, Sir.

Ms Namugala (Mafinga): Mr Speaker, I note that there are a number of road projects that are running through my constituency in this little booklet. However, I am worried. In view of the fact that the RDA has now moved to State House, can …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Namugala: … the hon. Minister assure this House that these projects will be implemented and delivered to the people on time.

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, firstly, I would like to commend the hon. Member for Mafinga for being highly proactive and in possession of the document. Keep it up. 

Laughter

Mr Yaluma:  Mr Speaker, firstly, I would like to commend the hon. Member for Mafinga for being very proactive and studying the document. Secondly, I would like to assure her that the President is involved because he wants to ensure that these projects promised to the people of Zambia are delivered on time and within the estimated cost. So, we are not sleeping, but working, day and night, to ensure that the President is briefed on whatever is happening. We will never omit anything. I will lose my job if that happened.

Thank you, Sir.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has blamed us for not having attended the launch which we were not informed of. Is the Mazabuka/Kafue Road included in the document?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, I will circulate the document to all hon. Members in this august House.

Thank you, Sir.

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Speaker, is the Turn-Off/Siavonga Road included in the booklet?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, the specific question that was asked is about the rehabilitation of the Kafue/Chirundu Road. I wanted to go through the booklet but, due to scarcity of time, I was stopped from doing so. So, this booklet will be circulated. If the hon. Member wants, he can see me at break time and I will give him the information he seeks.

Thank you, Sir.

Mr Speaker:  Hon. Members, I think the point has been made. This booklet, call it what you will, will be circulated. Those of you who want to engage the hon. Minister more in relation to your constituencies are at liberty to see him either during break time or beyond. There is a risk that these enquiries could go on endlessly until each and every hon. Member satisfies themselves about their constituency. I hope this clarifies the position.

Let us ask other follow-up questions, if any.

Ms Siliya (Petauke): Mr Speaker, as a follow-up to Hon. Mutati’s question, the hon. Minister should be gracious enough to inform the House since he is a public official interested in public matters and he is speaking to the nation through this House. We know that, in the past, successive Governments have talked about introducing the toll gate system and this Government has also indicated that it will do so in order to assist in the repairs of the road. Can the hon. Minister give us some specifics on when he, really, intends to do this so that it is not just a story anymore.

Mr Yaluma:  Mr Speaker, like I indicated earlier, it is my pleasure, always, to tackle bonus questions. We have an explicit plan which is committed for execution and, at the same time, with the projects in this document. The first toll gate will be on the Kitwe/Chingola Road, where a dual carriage way is being constructed. The fifteen places where the toll gates will be, in the entire country, have been identified.

Thank you, Sir.

MEDICAL PERSONNEL FOR KAFULAFUTA PARLIAMENTARY CONSTITUENCY

132. Mr Chishiba (Kafulafuta) asked the Minister of Health when qualified medical personnel would be posted to the following health centres in Kafulafuta Parliamentary Constituency:

(a)    Gelemani;

(b)    Kambowa;

(c)    Mutaba;

(d)    Mlengwe;

(e)    Chikumbi;

(f)    Lupiya; and

(g)    Bangwe

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, the filling of positions to reduce the variance between the approved establishment and the staff in post in any public health facility in Zambia is done in phases. The Government, through the Ministry of Health, intends to post qualified medical personnel to the following health centres in Kafulafuta Parliamentary Constituency:

(a)    Gelemani Rural Health Centre, which has an establishment of four qualified health workers. Currently, it has two qualified staff: a registered nurse and an environmental health technologist. A Zambia Enrolled Midwife will be posted before the end of this year;

(b)    Kambowa Rural Health Centre, which has an establishment of four qualified health workers. Currently, it has two qualified staff: a Zambia Enrolled Midwife and an environmental health technologist. A Zambia enrolled Nurse will be posted at the end of this year;

(c)    Mutaba Rural Health Centre, which has an establishment of five qualified health workers. Currently, it has three qualified staff: a Zambia Registered Nurse, who is the Health Centre In-Charge; an environmental health technologist; and a Zambia Enrolled Nurse. A Zambia Enrolled Midwife is expected to be posted by the end of this year;

(d)    Nyengwe Rural Health Centre, which has an establishment of four qualified health workers. Currently, it has three qualified staff; a Zambia Enrolled Nurse, a Zambia Enrolled Midwife and an environmental health technologist. A Zambia Registered Nurse or clinical officer is expected to be posted at the end of this year;

(e)    Chikumbi Rural Health Centre, which has an establishment of four qualified health workers. Currently, it has three qualified staff: a clinical officer, an environmental health technologist and a Zambia Enrolled Midwife. This facility is adequately staffed;

(e)    Lupiya Rural Health Centre, which has an establishment of four. Currently, it has one qualified staff, a Zambia Enrolled Midwife. A Zambia Enrolled Nurse will be posted before the end of this year; and

(f)    Bangwe Rural Health Centre, which has an establishment of four qualified health workers. Currently, it has two qualified staff: a clinical officer and a Zambia Enrolled Nurse. An environmental health technologist is expected to be posted before the end of this year.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chishiba: Mr Speaker, is it the policy of the Ministry of Health to allow clinics that have no qualified staff to continue running and risk wrong dispensation of medicine? 

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, if the hon. Member got the answers correctly, all these rural health centres have some qualified staff.  In one instance, there is even over-staffing.

I thank you, Sir.

Ms Namugala: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that most of the rural health facilities are manned by classified daily employees who even dispense drugs? If he is aware, what urgent action is his ministry taking to ensure that this does not continue to be the case?

Mr Mwila: Efyo mwashile!

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, the issue of unqualified staff manning some of our health centres is not known to us. If the hon. Member knows of any, …

Hon. Opposition Members: Aah!

Dr Chikusu: … she can bring the information and we shall deal with them. However, she must know that we have started the recruitment of health staff. We have already recruited 701 and are still recruiting 2,084 frontline health workers for this specific purpose.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, I was looking at the health centre at Lupiya where the establishment is four, yet there is only one qualified staff. What measures has the hon. Deputy Minister put in place to assist this centre so that the number of qualified staff can be raised to, at least, three, which is the case with other health centres?

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, we have indicated that another health worker will be sent there by the end of this year. We have also stated that this is done in a phased manner. Therefore, Lupiya will be taken care of.

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has brought the very good news that the Government is recruiting over 7000 health workers.

Hon. Government Member: Aah, 7, 000?

Laughter

Mr Mbewe: That is good news, hon. Minister. 

Laughter

Mr Mbewe: Hon. Minister, …

Mr Speaker: Order!

Hon. Member on the Floor, address the Speaker.

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, the PF Government is pretending to be doing very well by recruiting many workers. What measures has it put in place to ensure that the medical staff are retained, not allowed to run away to work in other countries?

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, to start with, let me correct the hon. Member on the figure he mentioned. I said that we have recruited, as of May, 2012, 701 health workers, and that we are, currently, recruiting 2, 084. Those are the correct figures. 

Sir, the hon. Member might wish to know that we have put in place retention schemes in addition to the general incentives that are in place.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, earlier, the hon. Minister said that some of the rural health centres in Kafulafuta are over-staffed. Would he consider moving one or two of those qualified staff to Chasefu Constituency where there is a problem of unqualified staff running some clinics? 

Laughter

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member seems to be very knowledgeable.

Laughter

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, the interest of the hon. Member for Kalomo in Chasefu is well-noted. We are looking at Kafulafuta, suffice to say that, during this recruitment, we shall build up the numbers of health workers at most health facilities.

I thank you, Sir.{mospagebreak}

AGRICULTURAL CENTRES FOR CHIMBAMILONGA PARLIAMENTARY CONSTTITUENCY

133. Mr Chansa (Chimbamilonga) asked the Minister of Agriculture and Livestock:

(a)    whether the Government had any plans to construct agricultural camps at 
    the following centres in Chimbamilonga Parliamentary Constituency:

(i)    Munwa;

(ii)    Kampinda;

(iii)    Kakoma;

(iv)    Kapisha; and 

(v)    Mikose; and

(b)    when personnel would be deployed to Nsama Agricultural Camp.

The Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Livestock (Mr N. Banda): Mr Speaker, the Government has plans to set up agricultural camps in Munwa when funds are available and authority to employ people is granted. Kampinda and Kakoma already have agricultural camps and staff houses.  Kampinda has an extension officer while Kakoma will be provided with one by March, 2013. Kapisha is serviced by two agricultural camps, namely, Nsumbu and Chishela, which have extension officers and staff houses, while Mikosa is meant to be serviced under Kasepa Agricultural Camp, which has a staff house, but no extension officer. An extension officer is expected to be sent to this area by March, 2013. Further, due to the vastness of Kasepa Agricultural Camp, there are plans to divide it into two once Treasury authority is granted.

Sir, personnel will be deployed to Nsama Agricultural Camp by March, 2013.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chansa: Mr Speaker, I want to know …

Mr Hamudulu: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: Order!

A point of order is raised.

Mr Hamudulu: Mr Speaker, I thank you and apologise to my brother who was about to raise a supplementary question. 

Sir, I rise on a very serious point of order. Are the Patriotic Front (PF) hon. Ministers in order to continue answering questions in this fashion? They say, “when funds or resources are available” as though these resources will fall randomly from somewhere. It is their duty to allocate these funds. Are they in order to insinuate they will only take charge after the resources fall randomly from somewhere?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Order!

I have not got the impression, if I may paraphrase, that they seem to be waiting for manna to fall from heaven. I do not think that is the point. Fortunately, we are in the Budget session and I am sure that, as our business evolves, between now and the first week of December, 2012, the plans on how the Government intends to execute the various programmes will be more evident. 

That is my ruling.

Mr Chansa: Mr Speaker, what measures will the Government put in place to help the extension officer who is at Nsumbu to cover Kapisha as well, which is near to Nsumbu?

Mr N. Banda: Mr Speaker, we understand that there is Lake Tanganyika between Nsumbu and Kapisha. It is difficult for the extension officer from Nsumbu to go and operate in Kapisha because of the lake. As a ministry, we will provide a speed boat that will help the extension officer to get to Kapisha.

I thank you, Sir.    

BOARDING FACILITIES AT SICHILI HIGH SCHOOL

134. Mr Sililo asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education when the Government would construct boarding facilities at Sichili High School where pupils arrange their own accommodation and live without any parental control, resulting in increased cases of pregnancies and the spread of HIV/AIDS.

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, the information available is that the Government provided funds for the construction of a hostel for girls at Sichili High School and that hostel is being constructed. We expect that the construction works will continue into 2013.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mufalali: Mr Speaker, what has delayed the construction of this hostel? 

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, obviously, it is a combination of factors, such as inefficiency and inappropriate use of the funds. That is why I said that the hostel will be completed in 2013. The Budget will be approved this year, and I expect that the hostel will be completed in 2013.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mbulakulima (Chembe): Mr Speaker, in Sichili, there is also a school called Kaletelete which means scandal or disaster in every Zambian language. There are many things happening at this school. Hon. Minister, is it not within your power to come up with a short-term plan to come to the rescue of this school by building, at least, two boarding houses.

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, that persuasive presentation is applauded. However, the House should know that there are many ‘Sichilis’ in the country.

Interruptions

Dr Phiri: Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for giving us that encouragement. As the hon. Deputy Minister indicated, within the confines of the 2013 Budget, we should be able to do something more meaningful than we have done before.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mutelo: Mr Speaker, in view of the HIV/AIDS levels in the area, is the hon. Minister not going to treat this as an urgent matter.

Mr Speaker: Order!

I think he just answered that question

ROAD SIGNS

136. Mr Hamusonde (Nangoma) asked the Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication how often the road signs on highways were maintained, particularly those on the Lusaka/Mongu Road.

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, the maintenance of road signs is part of the scope of work that is undertaken in off-carriageway routine maintenance by performance contracts. The road signs are maintained every time there is a performance contract on any road.
 
I thank you, Sir.

Mr Hamusonde: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that most of the roads in rural areas have no signs?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, as I have indicated in my response, most of the road signs are upgraded as we do other maintenance works on the roads. As to whether there are many of them across the country, I presume there are, and we are trying to see how we can address this issue as we undertake road maintenance works.

I thank you, Sir 

Mr Miyutu (Kalabo Central): Mr Speaker, how frequently are maintenance works done on major roads, considering the occurrence of accidents, especially between Tateyoyo and Kaoma?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, I am totally lost. I do not understand what the question at hand is, but I can address the question of how often maintenance is done. It all depends on the condition of the road. When working on the roads, we also work on the signs, as I indicated in my earlier response.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Habeenzu (Chikankata): Mr Speaker, what is the duty of the Road Transport and Safety Agency (RTSA)? Is it not responsible for the road signs because, after all, it collects a lot of money on these roads?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, like I said, road signs are put up by the Road Development Agency (RDA) or Rural Roads Unit (RRU). When doing maintenance works on the road, they check for deficiencies that are on the roads and upgrade such things as road signs. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Ng’onga (Kaputa): Mr Speaker, are there are any ‘panitive’ measures that would be instituted, especially to road contractors who do not put sufficient road signs when they are doing some road works?

Mr Speaker: I assume you mean ‘punitive’?

Hon. Members: Yes.

Laughter

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, ideally, that should be the practice, and we are trying to enforce it. We are supposed to have a penalty clause in each contract signed with the contractors. Should they fail to do what is expected of them, there should be some penalty applied, as indicated in the document. I think that it is a good practice, but I cannot tell whether it is being followed. However, we are taking that route.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister said that maintenance works are done depending on the condition of the road, and road signs include markings. Is he aware that the road between Kafue and Monze has no signs and its condition is actually getting worse? If he is aware, when will the Government undertake the necessary works?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, maintenance works include road markings. So, ... 

Which road is the hon. Member referring to?

Mr Muntanga: Kafue to Monze.

Mr Yaluma: Sir, we will work on that road when it will be due for maintenance. I cannot tell you when it will be done off-the-cuff. I guess that is an academic exercise which should be picked up by staff in the office. 

I thank you, Sir.

STRAY DOGS

137. Mr Hamusonde asked the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing:

(a)    how many stray dogs had been killed in Lusaka from the time the exercise started to date;

(b)    how many dogs had been registered in the same period;

(c)    how much money had been raised from the exercise at (b); and

(d)    how this money would be used.

The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr Tembo): Mr Speaker, 511 stray dogs have been killed in Lusaka from the time the exercise started to date. 

Sir, 7, 995 dogs have been registered in the same period and K439, 725, 000 has been raised from the exercise. The charge per dog is about K55, 000.

Mr Speaker, the funds raised will go towards meeting the cost of chains, collars and certificates that are issued during the exercise. The funds will also go towards meeting other operational costs, such as fuel, lethal drugs, bullets, sensitisation programmes and advertisements on Muvi Television, Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) and TV2, and for the procurement of disinfectants, refuse bags and protective clothing.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Hamusonde: Mr Speaker, will this exercise be extended to rural areas?

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, we intend to roll out the programme to all provinces and districts.

I thank you, Sir.

Professor Lungwangwa (Nalikwanda): Mr Speaker, is there a limit to the number of dogs a household can keep? If so, how many? 

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, to my knowledge, there is no limit. It all depends on the household …

Hon. MMD Members: Aah! There is a limit.

Interruptions

Mr Tembo: … because they may have more than one house. For example, polygamists have different homes and may need more than six or seven dogs in different homes.

Laughter

Mr Tembo: That is the reason I said that there is no limit.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Laughter

Mr V. Mwale (Chipangali): Mr Speaker, this massacre of dogs is very worrying. More than 500 dogs were killed. Was there any sensitisation before the dogs were killed?

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, we normally use the public address (PA) system to sensitise the community on the need to have their dogs registered before we start the exercise. So, sensitisation was done.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mufalali: Mr Speaker, is the Government considering establishing a shelter for abandoned dogs, instead of killing them and risking their extinction?

Interruptions

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, currently, we have no such option. If the need arises, we will consider that.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Belemu (Mbabala): Mr Speaker, more than 500, 000 dogs is quite a big number. Considering that Lusaka has very limited land and disposal sites, how are the dogs that are slaughtered disposed of?

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, I indicated that 511 dogs were killed, not 5, 000. We have a place where these dogs are burnt as a means of disposal.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, has the exercise reduced the incidence of rabies in the area, because I believe that one cannot kill a dog if it is not rabid?

Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, the intention of this exercise is to kill stray dogs, including those that have diseases like rabies. We kill these stray dogs because they are a danger to society.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

KABOMPO DISTRICT HOSPITAL

138.    Mr Lufuma asked the Minister of Health:

(a)    when Kabompo District Hospital would be rehabilitated; and

(b)    when the hospital would be expanded and accommodation for staff increased to cater for the increase in the number of patients.

The Deputy Minister of Health (Mr C. Mulenga): Mr Speaker, the rehabilitation of Kabompo District Hospital is scheduled to commence in 2013. 

Sir, the Ministry of Health intends to expand and construct staff accommodation in the 2013-2015 Infrastructure Capital Investment Plan which is currently being finalised.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister has indicated that the rehabilitation programme will start in 2013. As is known, every project has a starting and completion point. When will this rehabilitation programme end?

Mr C. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, if the hon. Member of Parliament heard me correctly, in my answer to part (b) of the question, I indicated that these projects would commence in the Infrastructure Capital Investment Plan which will run from 2013-2015.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Pande (Kasempa): Mr Speaker, during that period, the request is to also increase accommodation for staff. How many houses will be built?

Mr C. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, we are aware of the problems that our staff is facing in terms of accommodation. However, I cannot tell you how many houses will be built. If you want that information, I could make it available to you later if you approach me.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kakoma (Zambezi West): Mr Speaker, what type of rehabilitation will be done at Kabompo District Hospital during that period?

Mr C. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, infrastructure in the Ministry of Health is in a deplorable condition in most parts of the country. The kind of rehabilitation we will carry out is general, as some of the hospitals are in a bad condition right from the floor up to the roof.

 I thank you, Sir.

Mr Livune (Katombola): Mr Speaker, how much money has been set aside particularly for this rehabilitation?

Mr C. Mulenga: Mr Speaker, I do not have the figures with me now. However, the reason we are starting from 2013 to 2015 is that we are considering the 2013 Budget, which was presented to the House last week on Friday.

I thank you, Sir.

__________

MOTIONS

BUDGET 2013

(Debate resumed) 

Mr Matafwali (Bangweulu): Mr Speaker, I wish to sincerely thank all individuals and institutions that contributed to the preparation and subsequent presentation of the Budget for the fiscal year 1st January to 31st December, 2013.

Mr Speaker, it must be appreciated that the task of allocating limited resources among the numerous competing needs requires a sense of ingenuity. In all fairness, the Budget presented on the Floor of the House by the hon. Minister of Finance has harmonised and addressed the broader aspirations of our society beyond the political, regional and social divide. This feature of the Budget resonates well with its underlying theme of delivering Inclusive development and social justice.

Sir, before I venture into debating the 2014 Budget, allow me to, first and foremost, … 

Interruptions

Mr Matafwali: … outline some of the financial and economic achievements of the Government during 2012 so far. 

Mr Speaker, the Government has attained most of its targets. The gross domestic product (GDP) growth is estimated at just over 7 per cent as was predicted for 2012, and this is a positive boost for economic development. The increase in non-traditional exports, such as electricity, cotton and fresh flowers, which are projected to rise by over 50 per cent to $2.5 billion in 2012, from $1.6 billion in 2011, provides more empirical evidence that the economy is on the right track.

Mr Speaker, in addition, the PF Government is about to implement another important policy of rebasing the Kwacha. This initiative will not only assist in simplifying financial transactions, but also give more meaning to the Government’s resolve to conduct its transactions in the local currency.

Sir, allow me, now, to point out selected areas from the Budget Speech which prove that prosperity for all Zambians is within reach, and that it is not a mere pipe dream.

Agriculture and Forestry

Mr Speaker, agriculture has frequently been talked about. It has, actually, been analysed and promises have been made to revamp, improve and diversify it. Indeed, the agriculture song has been sung for such a long time that it is difficult to distinguish reality from fantasy. However, as the hon. Minister of Finance assured the nation last Friday, the PF Government will act differently by ensuring that the many good agricultural policies do not sit idly on the shelves in some Government ministries.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Matafwali: Mr Speaker, there is so much potential in the agricultural sector that the Government will tap into, which will show the Government’s commitment to expanding the scope of the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) to include crops like soya beans, cotton, sunflower and rice in the interest of achieving crop diversification. This will also attend to farmers’ requests to grow other crops apart from maize.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Matafwali: Mr Speaker, in order to guarantee crop diversification, the Government will also increase investment in extension services like irrigation, training institutions, and research and development in order to improve crop yields. These institutional strategies will go a long way in providing the much-needed support to our farmers, especially those in far-flung areas. 

Mr Speaker, I did not know that PF stands for ‘Proper Farming,’ ‘Professional Farming’ and ‘Perfect Farming’ …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Matafwali: … until Friday, 12th October, 2012, when the hon. Minister of Finance presented the Budget. 

Forestry

Sir, we are all aware that there has been a lot of indiscriminate cutting down of trees, mostly in the rural and some urban areas. We should all take cognisance of the need to preserve our trees, especially in this era when we are educated about the need to preserve our environment. The indiscriminate cutting down of trees has changed the climatic patterns, as evidenced in the variability in temperature and rainfall patterns, resulting in a negative  impact on agriculture and human life. However, we realise that, to redress this situation, the Government will have to fast-track the enacting of a new Forest Act so as to put measures in place that will review and improve forest management systems. These measures will also introduce forest extension services, provide tree seedlings and enhance private-sector participation in the forestry sector in Zambia.  

Manufacturing

Mr Speaker, this sector is a potential contributor to the economic the development of our country. Despite this potential, the sector has been beset by many challenges, such as the high cost of doing business, both from the perspective of acquiring raw materials and labour costs. In addition, the manufacturing industry faces the challenge of competing with second-hand goods and cheap imported products. To uplift this important sector so that it realises its full potential, the hon. Minister of Finance stated that the Government will facilitate value addition to locally-available raw materials by putting in place appropriate industrial infrastructure ... 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Matafwali: … for small and medium-scale enterprises, especially in rural areas, as well as promoting foreign direct investment (FDI) in the multi-facility economic zones (MFEZs). This strategy will be coupled with the provision of medium to long-term financing for micro, small and medium enterprises, through the banking sector. 

Mr Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1615 hours until 1630 hours.{mospagebreak}

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Matafwali: Mr Speaker, before business was suspended, I was about to discuss the tax policy reforms. 

Sir, in order for the Government to fulfil and sustain its development goals, it needs to continue growing its revenue base. There have been calls from the majority of our citizens for the Government to broaden its tax base, and the hon. Minister of Finance has outlined the different strategies will be employed to attain a holistic tax reform with the intention of increasing Government revenue. As mentioned by the hon. Minister of Finance, to be included among the strategies will be the diagnostic review of the entire tax system and the simplification of the tax system for small and medium enterprises. The tax policy will enable the Government to finance activities in the manufacturing and agricultural sectors, and other industries relevant to the growth of the Zambian economic.

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mining Sector Regulations

Mr Matafwali: Mr Speaker, for decades, since Independence, Zambia has relied heavily on the mining sector to grow and sustain its economy. This is understandable, considering that the mining sector has contributed to the development of this country more than any other sector. However, we all realise that this sector has the potential to contribute even more if we knew, exactly, how much is being produced and exported in terms of minerals. However, that is not the case, and the discrepancy could be attributed to poor management systems and deliberate falsification of declarations. It is, therefore, gratifying to note that the Ministry of Finance has indicated that the Government will put in place systems and institutions of governance to monitor and critically evaluate the minerals which are produced and exported in the 2013 Budget. 

Job Creation

Mr Speaker, the Zambian people, in particular our youths, continue with their request for more jobs so that they can have more money in their pockets. I have noted that this call has been answered resoundingly through the following ways:

(a)    the agricultural and forestry sectors will create 550,000 jobs;

(b)    the tourism sector will facilitate the creation of 300,000 jobs over the next five years;

(c)    the manufacturing sector will give Zambians 90,000 jobs in the next five years;

(d)    transport infrastructure development projects will provide 20,000 jobs across ten provinces; and 

(e)    90,000 jobs will be created in the energy sector.

Mr Speaker, it is important to realise that the PF Government is, actually, founded on the principles of transparency and accountability.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Utilisation of the Eurobond Loan

Mr Matafwali: In this regard, the Ministry of Finance gave a detailed breakdown of how this US$750 million is going to be utilised. 

Unity

Mr Speaker, as we endeavour to implement this Budget, let us all remember that unity of purpose is a very important element in the attainment of sustainable economic growth. This unity should not only be restricted to the inter-party, but also sustained at the intra-party level. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Matafwali: This applies, especially, to us in the PF Government. We cannot afford to be divided and balkanise our party. Let us remain united as we deliver what is expected of us.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Matafwali: Mr Speaker, for those hon. Members of Parliament who claim that they cannot work with the PF Government, my advice and challenge to them is that they should, actually, resign ...

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Matafwali: ... because such a situation is fallacious, non-attainable, and an exposure of intellectual bankruptcy.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Matafwali: Mr Speaker, this is because everybody knows that every hon. Member of Parliament is part of the Government. So, there is no way somebody can entertain the idea of not working with the PF Government. People should remember that this society is governed by very basic principles. 

Mr Speaker, society is governed by very independent scientific laws of dialectical and historical materialism. These harmonise the principles of the unity and struggle of the opposites. We can differ in principle and the way we look at certain issues but, certainly, we should find some common ground on which we can jointly deliver development to our people.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Matafwali: Mr Speaker, the 2013 National Budget is a resounding nod to the PF’s determination to make Zambia one of the best places to live in the region. Our aim is to ensure that people do not regret putting us in power. 

Hon. Opposition Member: We are already regretting.

Laughter 

Hon. Government Member: You did not put us in power. The people put us there.

Mr Matafwali: Mr Speaker, we are a candid lot, and realise that the road to success and development will not be easy. In order to get where we want to be, which is to attain inclusive development and social justice, we should be willing to be patient and make sacrifices when called upon to do so. 

Sir, I assure this august House that, with the unwavering support of everyone in Zambia, the PF Government will get Zambia to that level of development that will bring dignity and pride to all.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi (Namwala): Mr Speaker, allow me to commend the mover of the Motion, Mr Alexander Chikwanda, the hon. Minister of Finance, who is not in this House, for the able manner in which he moved the Budget Motion on the on the Floor of the House.

Hon. Opposition Members: Question!

Laughter

Ms Lubezhi: As we are aware, the National Budget gives the policy direction of any country. In this regard, let me, at this juncture, give an overview of some of the salient issues that were presented in the Budget, sector by sector. I note that the next year’s Budget Theme is, ‘Delivering Inclusive Development and Social Justice’. This is a welcome theme as all parts of the country require development and social justice. It is my sincere hope that, when the Appropriation Act is passed by this august House and its implementation commences, the PF Government will consider all regions of the country, not just concentrating on their strongholds, as was the case with the CDF, when the Southern Province was the last province to be given.

Hon. Opposition Members: Tell them!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister of Finance stated that the Government will be responding to the high unemployment and low income that result in the high levels of poverty among our people in next year’s Budget, through the implementation of the National Strategy for Industrialisation and Job Creation, which prioritises agriculture, tourism, manufacturing and infrastructure development, among other key areas.

Mr Speaker, it was mentioned to the House that the Government intends to create 960, 000 new jobs over the next five years, broken down as follows; 

Sector                     Expected number of new jobs

Agriculture and forestry            550, 000

Tourism                        300, 000

Manufacturing     90, 000

Infrastructure development     20, 000

Total    960, 000

Mr Speaker, come next year, I hope that the PF Government will not give excuses for not implementing these categorical promises it has made because it is on record for firing blank bullets.

Mr Speaker, on social and financial policies, the hon. Minister of Finance, informed this august House that his Government was mindful of the fact that it was not right to leave an unsustainable debt burden for future generations. In this regard, the Government aims at institutionalising a vigorous appraisal system for screening investment projects in order to ensure that all borrowed funds, including the Eurobond, are applied to projects that will directly contribute to the economic growth of the country.

Mr Speaker, the Government’s intention is to put in place the missing systems and institutions to monitor and account for what is produced and exported by the mining houses. I am very surprised and taken aback that the hon. Minister of Finance was conspicuously silent on the issue of introducing the windfall tax so that the Government can meet some of the promises that it made when it was in the Opposition. The hon. Minister of Finance should not forget that, when the Republican President was in the Opposition, he was very vocal on the issue of the windfall tax. 

Mr Speaker, on the issue of decentralisation, the Government intends to devolve power to accountable and democratically-administered councils to encourage the participation of all Zambians in the design and implementation of governance and development programmes. 

 Sir, it was further mentioned that the Government will increase the grants to councils from the current K25.71 billion to K49.6 billion in 2013. It is our sincere hope that there will not be a repeat of what transpired in the MMD Government whereby funds were only disbursed to councils which were under the control of MMD councillors at the expense of the councils under the control of the Opposition. 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, already, we, on your left, have observed with dismay that this Government is quick to disburse the CDF to constituencies that are PF strongholds.  

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, we appreciate the move by the hon. Minister of Finance to allocate K50 billion to trades training institutes aimed at empowering unemployed and vulnerable youths with vocational skills. However, the Government has not provided a clear guideline on how it intends to do this. It is not clear whether the Government will provide some form of bursary to these youths. Neither is it clear on the selection criteria of the beneficiaries of the scheme. As usual, the Government will always give us open-ended statements. 

Mr Speaker, if not implemented properly, the scheme will be a conduit for corrupt activities as is the case in already existing bursary schemes at various institutions around the country. Lessons can also be drawn from other empowerment programmes, such as Citizens Economic Empowerment Commission (CEEC), which has now been temporarily suspended. 

Mr Speaker, the Government intends to promote the agricultural sector by strengthening the livestock and fisheries sub-sectors through re-stocking. It also intends to boost and diversify crop production and further develop the irrigation system in the 2013 Budget. As an hon. Member for a constituency while agriculture is the main economic activities, I am disappointed that the Government has only allocated K300 billion to the Food Reserve Agency (FRA) for the maintenance of strategic reserves for the 2012/2013 marketing season. I am dismayed by this kind of anomaly because, currently, the FRA is spending more than what has been allocated. As a result, the agency is even asking for more funds in order to pay for the maize that has been purchased already. The Government should tell us whether it will buy all the maize from the farmers because this under-cutting in the budget is causing our poor small-scale farmers to be paid late. 

Mr Speaker, the Government of the Republic of Zambia has been spending huge sums of money on constructing the road network around the country. In the 2013 Budget, the Government proposes to spend about K3.4trillion to facilitate the construction of, at least, 1, 500km of roads. You will notice that the Government will be spending almost twice what it will spend in the agricultural sector. It is, therefore, necessary that revenue measures are put in place to help offset future costs of road maintenance. I am alive to the fact that the fuel levy is supposed to go towards road maintenance. It is my considered view that tollgates should be introduced on a number of highways. The revenue collected will supplement the resources raised from the fuel levy. This measure will not be unique to Zambia because other countries in the Southern African Development Community (SADC) region are already using this mechanism. 

Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister of Finance proposed that the excise duty imposed on carbonated drinks and packed water be removed in the 2013 Budget. He also said that the measure will enable these drinks to become more affordable for Zambians. This measure will make the products more affordable for Zambians at the expense of the manufacturing industry. I wonder how an imported product will compete with a locally-produced one. This is what killed the manufacturing industry in the post-United National Independence Party (UNIP) era when all the finished products were imported duty-free. 

Mr Speaker, we saw many companies closing down. If, therefore, the Government wants to create more jobs in the manufacturing industry, it should not encourage Zambia to be a big supermarket for finished products. I wonder how this will be achieved. Many companies will close down because of this move. The Government should, instead, have waived the excise duty on raw materials, not finished products. 

Mr Speaker, let me conclude by drawing the House’s attention to the Government’s intention to increase the level of domestic borrowing in the next financial year. I note that the hon. Minister of Finance has increased the level of domestic borrowing from the 2012 target of 1.3 per cent to 1.5 per cent of gross domestic product (GDP) in 2013. This is unfortunate because it has the potential to have a growing negative effect on the private sector as more banks will opt to lend to the Government rather than private companies. 

Brigadier-General Dr Chituwo: On a point of order, Sir. 

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised. 

Brigadier-General Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, I thank you for granting me the opportunity to raise this point of order. 

Mr Speaker, as elected hon. Members of this House, and having been here for some time, it is customary that the hon. Minister of Finance takes note of the issues being raised. I wonder whether His Honour the Vice-President is in order not to indicate to this House who, after such a lovely presentation of the Motion by the hon. Minister of Finance, is taking notes, because I cannot see anyone. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Kabimba!

Hon. Government Member interjected. 

Brigadier-General Dr Chituwo: You are an hon. Deputy Minister.

Laughter 

Brigadier-General Dr Chituwo: Who is really acting as hon. Minister of Finance to take note of these very important ideas from this side of the house? Is the Leader of Government Business in order? 

Mr Speaker, I need your serious ruling and guidance. 

Mr Speaker: I am not very sure whether the hon. Member for Mumbwa is referring to the absence or otherwise of the hon. Deputies to the hon. Minister of Finance or simply observing whether or not these notes are being physically taken. However, assuming that you are referring to the issue of representation or the absence of the hon. Minister of Finance, I take note that the hon. Deputy Minister of Finance …

Hon. Opposition Members: No!

Mr Speaker: Let me complete my ruling.

... is present. The Leader of Government Business, His Honour the Vice-President, is also present.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Let me finish. It is my prerogative. 

Above all, there are several others, both Cabinet and Deputy Ministers, present. 

Interruptions

The hon. Minister of Finance, following the same tradition that the hon. Member for Mumbwa referred to, will, at an appropriate juncture, come and wind up the debate on the Motion. Mind you, these proceedings are broadcast. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: They are captured verbatim, and I think that the anxiety, in all fairness, is misplaced. 

May the hon. Member for Namwala continue.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Lubezhi: Mr Speaker, before I was interrupted by the point of order, I was saying that the hon. Minister of Finance has increased the level of domestic borrowing from the 2013 target of 1.3 to 1.5 per cent. This is unfortunate …

Mr Muntanga: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, when the Leader of Government Business in the House is going to be absent for even one day, the House is informed about the hon. Minister who takes over as Leader of Government Business. When a substantive hon. Minister who is the mover of a Motion is not here, no hon. Deputy Minister acts in the position of an hon. Cabinet Minister. If at any time an hon. Minister is absent, another hon. Minister is appointed to act. Is it in order for His Honour the Vice-President to keep quiet on the issue of the hon. Minister who has been appointed to act in place of the mover of the Motion? As we address these issues, we are addressing them to the mover of the Motion. Therefore, we need to be told, as per tradition, which hon. Minister is responsible to answer? Is His Honour the Vice-President in order to do this?

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! 

Do not engage in inter-party dialogue!

The practice is so settled that it cannot require this kind of debate. I am sure that you agree that this is not the first time that a substantive hon. Minister is not present in the House. I am sure that we can all notice that there are a number of hon. Cabinet Ministers, currently, who have accompanied the Republican President. Their portfolios, right from the moment we started our business, have been taken care of, either by their Deputies or, generally, through His Honour the Vice-President and his colleagues.

Hon. MMD Members: No!

Mr Speaker: So, we do not have any functional lacuna here. This practice that is being insisted on, equally, is not founded on precedent. 

May the hon. Member of Parliament for Namwala continue, please.

Ms Lubezhi: Ndalumba!

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Before I was, again, interrupted by the point of order, I was saying that this scenario is going to discourage the private sector to borrow from the banks because the banks would prefer to lend to the Government.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kakoma (Zambezi West): Was I indicating?

Mr Speaker: You had caught my eye earlier.

Laughter

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, as I look at the hon. Minister of Finance invisibly seated there, …

Mr Muntanga: Where?

Mr Kakoma: … I hope he will be able to respond to the many issues that I am going to raise. Hon. Kabimba is looking at me, and I hope that he is the one who has been appointed Acting Minister of Finance.

Sir, the PF 2013 Budget has been highly politicised. Even when the hon. Minister of Finance was presenting it, he was referring to it as the PF Budget. Please, take note that this is not a PF Budget. If you think it is, then you are highly misleading this country. This is a National Budget and the nation is not PF. Neither is the PF the nation.

Hon. Opposition Members: Tell them.

Mr Kakoma: Anywhere in the world, when a government is presenting a national budget, it is referred to as a national budget. It is unfortunate that this inexperienced political party in power now …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kakoma: … is referring to a national budget as a PF Budget. If it is, indeed, a PF Budget, why should they expect me, who is not PF member, to support it?

Laughter

Mr Kakoma: I will not support it, unless it is a national budget. However, if it is a budget for the PF, I am not under any obligation to support it.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, the second observation I would like to make about this PF Budget is that it is worse than all other budgets we have seen in the past, including the 2012 MMD Budget, which you kept referring to.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

No running commentaries.

May you continue, please.

Mr Kakoma: This is worse than the budgets that we have seen, including the 2012 one. At least, in the 2012 Budget, the workers got a reasonable tax-free income threshold. If you are referring to the 2012 Budget an MMD one, then the party did a better job than you have done.

Laughter

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kakoma: At least the workers had the tax-free income threshold raised by 100 per cent while you are now talking about increasing it by 10 per cent, and you think that is putting money in people’s pockets. You are actually putting poverty in people’s pockets.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kakoma: From the time you took over until now, people have no money in the pockets. Instead of having more money, they have no money in the pockets. You have created poverty among Zambians.

Mr Speaker, the 2013 Budget was expected to be pro-poor. As I look at it, now, this PF Budget for 2013 is for the rich. The majority of the poor people in Zambia live in rural areas and are mainly in the agricultural sector. There is nothing in this fantasy budget suggesting that they are addressing the issues of the poor people in the agricultural sector. It is simple and straight forward because, if you are planning to develop the agricultural sector and depending on it to improve the welfare of Zambians and create 500, 000 jobs – because, out of the 200, 000 jobs targeted for next year, half are supposed to come from the agriculture sector – that is fantasy because you are not walking the talk. You do not create jobs by merely fantasising. You create jobs in a sector by investing in it. What have you invested in the agricultural sector for you to produce the output and employment levels that you are projecting?

Mr Speaker, the total budget for agriculture, forestry and fisheries cannot even meet the Maputo Declaration of 10 per cent of the total Budget. It is actually 5.9 per cent of the Budget for 2013, which is almost half of what is expected of the Government of a responsible African country trying to make agriculture benefit the people. On that score, the Government has failed and cannot expect jobs to be created when it is not investing in the agricultural sector.

Mr Speaker, apart from failing to meet the Maputo Declaration of dedicating 10 per cent of the total Budget to agriculture, the PF has only committed, and miserably so, K300 billion to the Food Reserve Agency (FRA) for buying and marketing all the maize in this country.

Sir, you know that, even from the current marketing season, the amount of money that was put in the Budget was inadequate. The FRA needs around K3 trillion to be able to buy all the maize from farmers. So, if we need to buy all the maize next year and to end all the problems in the marketing sector, how does the Government provide K300 billion, instead of K3 trillion? It means that the Government is fantasising because the current problems in the marketing of maize in Zambia will continue next year. If anything, they will become worse. How will the Government solve the problems anticipated again next year and create jobs in the agricultural sector?

Mr Speaker, the PF Budget for 2013 is a donchi kubeba one.

Mr Speaker: Meaning what?

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, in this context, it is a ‘don’t kubeba’ Budget because it is not telling the Zambian people the truth about what the Government is going to do.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kakoma: Sir, the hon. Minister of Finance is contradicting the Republican President, who said that the PF would create 1 million jobs, by saying that the Government would create 200, 000 jobs this year. He also told this House that, in the next five years, the number of jobs in the agriculture sector will increase to 500, 000.

Mr Speaker, it is clear that the hon. Minister of Finance is contradicting the President who had earlier come to this House and told us that his Government would create one million jobs by the end of its term of office, which is contrary to what the hon. Minister of Finance said in his Budget speech.

Sir, assuming that, miraculously, the PF manages to create 200, 000 jobs for the remaining four years of its term, it will only reach 800, 000 jobs. So, where are the one million jobs? That is why I say it is a ‘don’t kubeba’ Budget.

Sir, the youths who are desperate for jobs will begin to believe that the PF is going to give them jobs, yet there will be no jobs to talk about. So, this is meant to be a campaign budget to cool down the jobless youths of Zambia.

Mr Speaker, more than 300, 000 young people graduate from the education system every year, yet the hon. Minister of Finance targets the Budget at creating 200, 000 jobs per year for the next four years. What will happens to the remainder?

Sir, the job creation target is also unrealistic because we have been informed by the PF Government that 17, 000 to 18, 000 jobs have been created in the past one year. So, if only 17, 000 to 18, 000 jobs have been created in the one year that the PF has been in power, what miracle will it perform for the figure to jump from 18, 000 to 200, 000 jobs in the next one year? 

Mr Speaker, the issue is very simple and straightforward in economics. For you to create the jobs, you need to grow the GDP. If, for the past five years, the GDP has been growing at 6 per cent and formal sector employment has remained stuck at 500, 000, and you are going to increase the GDP by an additional 1 per cent, from 6 per cent to 7 per cent, as projected for 2013, can an additional 1 per cent GDP growth create an additional one million jobs? It is not making sense. Even if you re-created an econometric model, the equation will not work. The equation will tell you there is a serious error.

Laughter

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, we expect this Government to walk the talk by putting more money in the agricultural sector and irrigation. I cannot see any serious irrigation projects. Suppose there is not enough rain this year, are you going to get the amount of output of maize that you are expecting next year? No.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Just take note of the issues.

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, I can hear Hon. Kabimba and His Honour the Vice-President, Dr Guy Scott …

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member, just ignore those comments. I am trying to stop them in the first place.

Laughter

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, the other substantive issue, which is at the bottom of Hon. Kambwili’s heart, is that this country has missed yet another opportunity to catapult poor people from poverty to prosperity.

Hon. Government Member: Catapult?

Mr Kakoma: Malegeni, catapulting

Laughter

Mr Speaker: It is an English word, and it is permissible. it is not like ‘kubeba’ which requires explanation.

Laughter

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, the PF Government has decided to continue perpetuating poverty among our people in a country with many mineral resources. We were expecting this Government to grab the bull by its horns.

Sir, the half-hearted measures that have been put in place in the taxation of the mining sector will only yield a paltry K265 billion. All the measures that the hon. Minister has introduced in the mining sector, as outlined in the Budget, will only generate K265 billion. The mineral royalty will only yield K1.9 trillion.

Mr Speaker, whereas the rich mining company owners will only contribute this small amount, the poor workers of Zambia are going to contribute K5 trillion to the Treasury. The poor people should contribute more money to the Treasury and the running of Government than the rich people? Where is the fairness in this tax system? A tax system must be fair and equitable, which the PF Government is failing to make it.

Sir, we expected this Government to re-introduce the windfall tax. When the windfall tax was introduced in 2008, the country was projecting to earn US$400 million per year and, in two years, we would have earned US$400 million, which could have been used to develop the country’s railways. We could have also used that money to invest in energy without going to borrow from Europe. We could have done all these things without the Eurobond. Now we are going for kaloba …

Mr Speaker: Meaning what, again? You know these words are vernacular.

Laughter 

Mr Kakoma: Sir, I was told that it means lundalunda.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: On a serious note, let us use the official language. Otherwise, there will be a breakdown of communication in the House.

Mr Kakoma: Sir, it means that we are going to borrow at high interest rates. Recently, the World Bank in Zambia told us that we were going to be paying back US$40 million per year, which the hon. Minister of Finance did not disclose to us in this House. At US$40 million per year, we will end up paying US$400 million in the next ten years, which is a lot of money.

Sir, the cost of production of copper in Zambia …

Interruptions

Mr Kakoma: That is what my ears heard.

Interruptions 

Mr Speaker: Order!

Let me provide guidance for just a minute. I think that we are familiar with the structure of this debate. My left will be given an opportunity to debate as extensively as possible and, ultimately, the right will respond. It is as simple as that. We should not complicate a simple matter when there is no reason to do so. It is very disturbing for somebody who is speaking to be interjected unless there is very good cause.

You may continue, hon. Member.

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, the cost of production of copper in Zambia is around US$1,000 per tonne.

Mr Kapeya: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Kapeya: Mr Speaker, I am sorry to disturb Comrade, …

Mr Speaker: That word is not allowed.

Mr Kapeya: … the hon. Member of Parliament for Zambezi West. Is he in order to mislead this House and the nation at large by claiming that this country will be paying US$40 million per month because of having borrowed money through a Eurobond? The fact of the matter is that the World Bank said that, if this country fails to utilise this money according to its request, we would be forced to be paying that amount of money. Is the hon. Member of Parliament, therefore, in order to make such a claim without clear evidence?

I need your serious ruling, Sir.

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member for Zambezi West should, of course, take note of that observation. I will not rule on the factual correctness or otherwise of what is being debated. The least I would say is that it is important to be factual in our debates. I would also still urge those on my right to practise some patience as the debate ensues. You will be given an opportunity to clarify all these issues in terms of soundness of arguments, submissions and even some factual errors that may be presented. 

I am by no means encouraging or endorsing the making of misleading statements. That is not the purpose. However, you can still practise some patience and give your colleagues on the left the chance to debate your proposals. You are presenting these proposals for approval. So, there is a need for free and candid debate. 

As the hon. Member for Zambezi West has indicated, at the end of the day, we are dealing with the Budget for the nation, and you are all representatives of the people, irrespective of your political affiliation. It is a constitutional function you are performing, if I may add. It must be broached in that light and, in my opinion, a sober one at that.

The hon. Member may continue.

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, I thank you for your wise guidance. The thrust of my argument is that there was no need for us to go and borrow, at whatever percentage or amounts to be repaid, if we had implemented the windfall tax. The cost of production of copper is around US$1,000 per tonne, and we are now selling copper at US$7,000 to US$8,000 per tonne. That is a huge difference. Surely, even if we pegged the windfall tax at US$5,000 per tonne, it would still make sense. The mining companies would not make a loss. There is an opportunity cost to refusing to impose the windfall tax, it. We continue to impoverish Zambians, allow them to die in hospitals without medicines and deny our people proper education because of the Government’s decision not to do the right thing.

Mr Speaker, lastly, I have noticed that there is an increase of almost 100 per cent, as the hon. Minister of Finance said, in grants to councils. That is, of course, a good decision. However, increasing the grants to councils by 100 per cent entails that our colleagues on your right have, again, missed the point. I say so because the CDF has remained static at K1 billion. When the Government is increasing grants to councils, but not the CDF, what is going on in its collective mind?

Laughter

Mr Kakoma: When I went through the work plans of ministries under the health and education sectors and the Yellow Book, and saw that some constituencies have not been allocated funds for roads, schools or clinics. Therefore, the only fund that can solve these problems is the CDF. In the past, we have argued that it must be increased to K5 billion per constituency. That must be done or we are not going to support this Budget.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

ADJOURNMENT

The Vice-President (Dr Scott): Sir, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

Question put and agreed to.

_____________ 

The House adjourned at 1724 hours until 1430 hours on Wednesday, 17th October, 2012.

APPENDIX

WRITTEN REPLY TO QUESTION

SPEED HUMP CONSTRUCTION 

130. Mr L. Zimba (Kapiri-Mposhi) asked the Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication whether the Government had any immediate plans to construct speed humps and pedestrian crossings in Kapiri-Mposhi Parliamentary Constituency at the following places:

(a)    Mpula area along Mkushi Road; and

(b)    Barclays Bank crossing point on the Kabwe/Ndola Road.

The Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication (Mr Yaluma): Mr Speaker, the ministry has received submissions from the council, through the area councilor, that humps be installed at the Mpula area along the Mkushi Road. The ministry has since requested funds from the National Road Fund Agency (NRFA) to facilitate these works. The council has also requested that the humps at Chimsoro Milling (T2/Kabwe/Kapiri-Mposhi Road) be moved to the Barclays Bank area. These works have been included in the works document for the periodic maintenance of the Kabwe/Kapiri-Mposhi Road.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.