Wednesday, 2^nd October, 2019

 

The House met at 1430 hours

 

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

 

NATIONAL ANTHEM

 

PRAYER

 

_______

 

QUESTION FOR ORAL ANSWER

 

NITROGEN CHEMICALS OF ZAMBIA

 

26. Mrs Chinyama (Kafue) asked the Minister of Finance:

 

1. whether any money from the Eurobonds was used to recapitalise the Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia;
2. if so, how much was disbursed;
3. when the money was disbursed;
4. how the money was used;
5. whether the Government had any plans to recapitalise the company further; and
6. if so, when the plans will be implemented.

 

The Minister of Finance (Dr Ng’andu): Mr Speaker, I think there is a bit of confusion here. The officials had advised that the hon. Minister responsible for education would answer the question and I would only deal with the component that has to do with the Budget allocation.

 

Mr Speaker: Very well.

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Minister of Finance, the question is on the Order Paper. It is Question No.  26. I hope you have the answer to the question.

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, my apologies. I was looking at the question on sanitary towels.

 

Interruptions

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, Hon. A. C. Mumba –

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Minister of Finance, I will give you five minutes to consult with your officials.

 

Interruptions

 

Hon. Opposition Members: Ema Chagwa Lungu aya!

 

Interruptions

 

Mrs Chinyama: Bushe answer iliko?

 

Mr Speaker: Are you ready, hon. Minister of Finance?

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, yes, I am ready.

 

Laughter

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that the Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia (NCZ) did not receive any recapitalisation funds from the Eurobond and therefore, questions (b), (c) and (d) fall away.

 

Mr Speaker, the Government, through the Industrial Development Corporation (IDC), has plans to recapitalise the NCZ through the introduction of a Strategic Equity Partner (SEP), who is expected to acquire a stake in the NCZ.

 

Mr Speaker, this august House may wish to note that the Government, through the IDC, has received a number of expressions of interest in the NCZ and is currently pursuing them for actualisation. The prospective partners have since been undertaking due diligence exercises in the NCZ with a view to making a decision to invest in it.  Therefore, subject to the outcomes of these due diligence exercises, the IDC is confident that this could culminate into concrete proposals and discussions with potential partners in the second quarter of 2020, and result in successful partnership with respect to revamping of the NCZ and its recapitalisation.

 

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mrs Chinyama: Mr Speaker, I appreciate the hon. Minister’s responses. However, it sounds like there is still a lot more work which needs to be done for this equity partner to come on board. The Government has been giving this response for some time now. Is the hon. Minister thinking of putting a bit of resources into the NCZ, in the short term, to enable the company produce fertiliser even just for the next farming season? Currently, there is no production which is going on and the workers have not been paid for seven months.

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, as I mentioned earlier, the NCZ is a company which is under the IDC. Any requests relating to additional financing which the company is not able to meet will be discussed between the Ministry of Finance and the IDC. If those discussions lead to a need to put resources into the company, it shall be done.

 

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

 

Dr Chibanda (Mufulira): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister is aware that the NCZ is involved in the production of fertiliser. I know that he has been inviting a certain company in my constituency to become an equitable partner. Why has it taken the Government this long to find an equitable partner for the NCZ? If fertiliser is locally produced, the masses will benefit. 

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, by nature, business negotiations take long, especially when dealing with a company which is in the state that the NCZ is. The Government cannot speed up business partners who are negotiating a business arrangement to move quicker than they are able to. So, as soon as they are ready, and their negotiations are satisfactory, the House will be informed. Nonetheless, it is hoped that they can be done as expeditiously as possible. This is a business arrangement that needs a business decision, and due diligence has to be taken. Sometimes, it is not possible to speed-up such negotiations.

 

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

 

Mr Muchima (Ikeleng’i): Mr Speaker, owing to the period that the NCZ has been idle, how economical is it for the Government to invest in the company in comparison with coming up with a completely new plant?

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, one of the outcomes of the negotiations that are being conducted between the company and potential partners is to look at exactly what is required in terms of future investment in the company. Whether the company’s equipment needs to be upgraded or probably scrapped-off, is a business decision that partners in this arrangement have to make.

 

Mr Livune (Katombola): Mr Speaker, –

 

Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir.

 

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I thank you for allowing me this opportunity to raise a very serious point of order that affects the lives of our people, in particular, patients in hospitals and other health facilities.

 

Mr Speaker, I am aware that in the President’s Address to this House, he made a very serious commitment pertaining to the provision of power. For ease of reference, allow me to quote what the President said on page 5, paragraph 17 of the speech:

 

“I am aware, Mr Speaker, of some health facilities going without power for long periods of time. I begin to wonder how our health workers are looking after our patients without water and electricity which are both, extremely important and a human necessity within the management of patients.

 

Sir, in view of the above, I am directing the Ministry of Energy, from midnight today, to prioritise power supply to hospitals and health centres. Further, the Ministry of Energy should prioritise energy supply to our water supply operations.”

 

Mr Speaker, I am aware that my hon. Colleagues on your right applauded this particular pronouncement, and there was excitement on the Floor of the House and in the nation. Further, the hon. Minister of Energy came on the Floor of this House and made pronouncements to actualise the presidential directive pertaining to the supply of power to health facilities.

 

Mr Speaker, I am aware that this is a matter that is within the provisions of our procedures in this House, taking into account that it was discussed here. As I speak now, there are a number of health facilities I know –

 

Hon. Government Members: Which ones, ah?

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Give me a minute, hon. Member, and resume your seat.

 

Hon. Members on the right, surely, we cannot conduct important affairs in this fashion. You cannot do that. It is so obvious that you cannot. There is a process to follow. Together, we are governing this country, if we do not realise this.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Muchima: Tell them!

 

Mr Speaker: This is why we are seated here.

 

Mr Muchima: Seminar!

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Speaker: We chose a multi-party system of Government on our own.

 

Laughter

 

Mr Speaker: That system has tenets, and we need to respect those tenets. One of those tenets is simply patience and tolerance.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Speaker: Whatever he wants to say, let it be processed without interference. Let it be processed full length. It may not even finish today, anyway. How can he answer the question, ‘where?’

 

You may continue, hon. Member.

 

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I thank you for the guidance that you have given to this House.

 

Mr Speaker, I was saying that I am aware that a number of health facilities in the country are experiencing load shedding, and the load shedding is getting worse as a result of the problems we are having pertaining to the supply of power.

 

Mr Speaker, I am aware that health facilities in Monze, Mazabuka, Kaoma, where I was, Gwembe and a number of other health facilities are facing this problem. As a result of the lack of power, even water is not available in the health facilities, and it is affecting the management of patients in the hospitals.

 

Mr Speaker, if the hon. Minister of Energy had problems pertaining to the directive given by the President over this matter on the Floor of this House, the best he should have done was to come back to this House and explain the difficulties which he is encountering. That is the noble and prudent way of managing national affairs.

 

Mr Speaker, is he in order to keep quiet after he listened to the President give that directive which he applauded, and he came on the Floor of this House and assured us that he would ensure that health facilities do not experience load shedding, but what is obtaining on the ground is different, and the lives of our people are being threatened? Is he in order to remain quiet as if nothing has happened?

 

Mr Speaker: My ruling is that in order to allow the hon. Minister of Energy to provide for sufficient time to conduct an exhaustive and comprehensive analysis of the situation nationally, I will give him up to Tuesday next week to come through with a ministerial statement to update the nation and also provide an opportunity to hon. Members in the House to engage the hon. Minister of Energy on this subject.

 

Mr Livune: Mr Speaker, this House has been grappling with the issue of Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia (NCZ) from 2011 to date. The Industrial Development Corporation (IDC) board is chaired by the Republican President where the hon. Minister of Finance is a member. Today, the hon. Minister is talking about issues of IDC supervising this or that company, while the people in Kafue are suffering. Can the hon. Minister tell us and give the timeframe when the problem will be sorted out. We cannot continue talking about protracted negotiations about business transactions when there is a management in place and the board chaired by the highest office of the land, and yet people are suffering in Kafue.

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, the only thing I can add to what I previously said is that the NCZ falls directly under the Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry. So, I do suppose that the hon. Minister who would be in a position to give the timeline as to when these negotiations will be completed would be the hon. Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry. So, to that extent, I would suggest that the question be directed to the hon. Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry, who will be in a position to tell the House exactly how negotiations are going.

 

I thank you, Sir.

 

Dr Malama (Kanchibiya): Mr Speaker, in order to promote buy-Zambian and to stimulate local industries –

 

Ms Kasune: On a point of order, Sir.

 

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Ms Kasune: Mr Speaker, this is a second point of order since I came to this House. This is a serious issue and it calls for the hon. Minister of Home Affairs to give the nation an update on what has happened in Chibombo District.

 

Mr Speaker, you may be aware, as the issue has been covered extensively by media, that there was an armed police officer who went to Chibombo District, particularly near Liteta Hospital. The police officer thought that his firearm was stolen by the two youths whom he tortured. One of the youths by the name of George Bwembya died and we buried him. I do not know the details of other people who may have been part of this situation. However, this same officer went on to torture the other young man by the name of Saviour Shibusoko, who right now is battling for his life.

 

Sir, it is for this reason that I stand on this serious point of order, so that the hon. Minister of Home Affairs should inform this House and the nation about the safety of Zambians in the arms of his officers. We do not want bad officers to pollute those who may be doing a good job. However, at the end of the day, the people are concerned because our youths are dying and we do not know the position of the one who is struggling for his life right now. Therefore, is the hon. Minister in order not to bring a statement to this House and update the nation about the safety and the wellbeing of our youths and Zambians at large? I seek your serious ruling.

 

Mr Speaker: I am on record that the remit of the hon. Minister of Home Affairs is countrywide. As I am speaking, there are so many things happening out there, including negative things to do with the maintenance of law and order. So, it is not possible for the hon. Minister of Home Affairs to be aware of each and every incident that is happening in various parts of the country. However, we have a procedure in this House as you have demonstrated, that when a matter requires immediate attention of the hon. Minister of Home Affairs or indeed any other hon. Minister, you file a question. After you file a question, obviously we will decide at that point how to treat it according to our rules and the hon. Minister of Home Affairs also needs to investigate the matter before it comes to the House. That is the procedure and I would urge you to follow that procedure.

 

Hon Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Dr Malama: Mr Speaker, would the strategic equity partnership –

 

Mr Jamba: On a point of order, Sir.

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

 I think I will allow the hon. Member for Kanchibiya to complete his question. You will raise your point of order later. Let him complete his question.

 

Dr Malama: Mr Speaker, correct.

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

I do not know where the correct is, which you are applying now. Please, continue hon. Member.

 

Laughter

 

Dr Malama: Sir, Kanchibiya is very big and requires finishing the question.

 

Mr Speaker, will the strategic equity partnership ensure that the policy of buy-Zambian products be prioritised so that the local industry regarding the purchase through the Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia (NCZ) is stimulated.

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, that is an appropriate suggestion, but I do believe that the parent ministry in charge of this transaction, which is the Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry, will take up this matter and appropriately reflect this particular aspect in the decisions that are arrived at.

 

 I thank you, Sir.

 

Mr A. C. Mumba (Kantanshi): Mr Speaker, I want to find out from the hon. Minister what plans he has considering the revelations that for seven months the workers for the Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia (NCZ) have not been paid their salaries. As you know, in the past, the Government had tried to capitalise NCZ, I think, three times, and this company always goes back to the Ministry of Finance to ask for funds for salaries. What immediate plans does the hon. Minister has to avert the challenges that the workers are facing?

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, at the risk of sounding like a broken record, I have explained that the supervising ministry is the Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry. The role that the Ministry of Finance plays is ensuring that funds which are agreed to after negotiations are made available. Furthermore, until such a time, I am not in a position to say exactly what the plans and amounts are required and when they are required.

 

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

 

 Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Members, let me provide some guidance here. Question No. 26 essentially sought to establish whether the money obtained from the Eurobonds was used to recapitalise the Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia (NCZ) and because of that question, it was referred to the Ministry of Finance. This is a classic example of what qualifies as a supplementary question. The questions that are now been posed are going to the line ministry, which is not the hon. Minister’s ministry regarding operations. That is why he is deflecting these questions. We could go on with these deflections for a while and I do not think it is an efficient way of utilising our time. So, those who are still keen on asking questions, please bear in mind the main question which is on the Order Paper.  Otherwise, you will drag the hon. Minister of Finance in an area where he has no remit or jurisdiction because there is another hon. Minister performing that function. Please bear that in mind.

 

Hon. Member for Kafue, you may ask your question.

 

Mrs Chinyama: Mr Speaker, I listened very carefully to the hon. Minister’s responses over the issue of interim funding to the NCZ. He said that anything to that effect is a subject between the Industrial Development Corporation (IDC) and NCZ. However, as a person who holds the purse and the key to the Treasury in this country, I wanted to find out whether the hon. Minister is aware of any such discussions currently going on. I ask this because I am sure that he would not just be aloof about what is happening between those two entities, which involves a very strategic industry such as NCZ at a critical time as this.

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, I am not aware that negotiations are taking place, which is not to say that they are not. However, at this point in time, I do not think the ministry’s involvement is found necessary because if it was, it will be informed and be party to the negotiations. I am sure at the right time, the parties negotiating will involve the ministry and at that point, I will be able to participate in the way that I should.

 

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

 

Mr Lufuma (Kabompo): Mr Speaker, I –

 

Mr Jamba: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

 

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Mr Jamba: Mr Speaker, I am sorry for interrupting the question by the hon. Member for Kabompo.

 

Mr Speaker, the issue of Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia (NCZ) is a very serious matter in this nation. The Government is buying fertiliser from manufacturers in other countries thereby providing employment in those particular countries. This is the fertiliser which is being given to farmers in this country under the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) which is funded by the Government. This question was given to the hon. Minister for some time for him to research on it. Is he in order to give such excuses to the nation concerning the manufacture of fertiliser at NCZ, which is a very serious business in this nation? If he does not know the answers, why can he not just say so and allow the hon. Minister in the relevant ministry to answer. Is he in order to continue saying that he does not know?

 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Jamba: I seek your serious ruling.

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Speaker: Order! Let us have some order!

 

The hon. Minister of Finance was asked a very specific question. As I have followed and seen it, he has answered that very specific question. However, the problem that we have here is that we have pitched NCZ away from the question. Nobody underrates the importance of NCZ. However, we have moved away from the original question. That is the problem. I think he is giving very honesty responses, as far as I am concerned. He is giving honesty responses and directing you to the right place but you are resisting going to the right place. In short, the hon. Minister is not out of order.

 

If the hon. Member for Mwembezhi has a question, he is still at liberty to ask the hon. Minister a question in line with Question 26. Anything outside that, you are at liberty to file in questions which will be considered and directed to the right ministry.

 

May the hon. Member for Kabompo continue, please.

 

Mr Lufuma: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister’s administration is on record as having been emphasising the promotion of agriculture or making agriculture to be at the centre of economic development of this country. Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia (NCZ), in that regard, is a strategic partner in fostering agricultural development and diversification, which we have been talking and crying about since independence. Now, because of that, his predecessor, Hon. Chikwanda, profiled the €50 million that was acquired. The hon. Minister has confirmed that it is true that €50 million was profiled.

 

Mr Speaker, your Committee on Parastatals Bodies visited NCZ in 2017, and the report, as I have said, was confirmed in terms of profiling. However, that €50 million was not disbursed. My question is; Why was this €50 million not disbursed to NCZ given the importance of this institution in the industrialisation and agriculture development of this country? If it was not disbursed, who then benefited from that €50 million?

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, before I answer the question, I just want to reiterate that I am the hon. Minister of Finance and not an hon. Minister in general. So, I will try as much as possible to answer questions that are within my portfolio. Now, as regards the last question that has been asked, it is a pity that Hon. Chikwanda is not here to deal with the question himself, but I would not wish in any way to mislead the House. If the House –

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Minister of Finance, let me give some guidance. Kindly resume your seat.

 

I think when it comes to these functions, there is the principle of continuity. So, you step into his shoes and there is no way, off course, that your predecessor can be made available to account for this. If you wish to look at this matter further, that is a liberty you have as well, so that you pick up from where your predecessor may have left so far as this matter is concerned. However, it is something that still falls squarely under your remit. That is the nature of public office and service.

 

Hon. Minister of Finance, continue with your answer.

 

Dr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, thank you very much for your guidance.

 

Sir, the challenge that I have is that I am not aware that there was such a commitment made. Therefore, for that reason, I cannot speak to it. Nevertheless, I can make all the necessary inquiries to find out if such commitments were made. If they were, I can make an effort to find out why the commitments were not met. However, at this point in time, I am not able to answer that question.

 

I thank you, Sir.

 

Mr Speaker: Very well. That is perfectly in order.

 

I will take the last four contributors as shown on the screen; Hon. Members for Serenje, hon. Member for Liuwa, hon. Member for Bweengwa and the last question will be from the hon. Member for Zambezi East.

 

Mr Kabanda (Serenje): Mr Speaker, I thank you –

 

Mr Jere: On a point of order, Sir.

 

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Mr Jere: Mr Speaker, I apologise to the hon. Member for Serenje for disturbing his line of thought.

 

Mr Speaker, I rarely rise on a point of order. If I do so, it means it is of extremely grave importance.

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Just on a lighter note. I do not know why people apologise about raising points of order.

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Speaker: Just raise them.

 

Laughter

 

Mr Jere: Mr Speaker, my point of order borders on the lives of the people of Livingstone. Every month, at least one person is killed by the elephants. Is the Minister of Tourism and Arts in order to remain mute instead of issuing a statement concerning the measures that the Government has put in place to safeguard the lives of our people in Livingstone and also the business community? I seek your serious ruling.

 

Mr Speaker: My ruling is that it is regrettable that points of order are being misused.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Speaker: Very regrettable. We have repeatedly stated that points of order are meant to bring violation of rules of procedure.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Speaker: It is only in exceptional circumstances where a situation is dire. This should not be modus operandi of eliciting responses from the right. There are established channels, like filing in questions, either ordinary or urgent questions. We will be wasting a lot of time if we continue in this fashion. Moreover, the people out there will be wondering what kind of culture we are pursuing. There is no shortcut. Just get a piece of paper and a pen. Write it down and give it to the Clerk. Maybe it is good for visibility.

 

Hon. PF. Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Speaker: Let us follow our procedures and rules. You know, as I always say, disruptive in character – who was on the Floor?

 

Mr Kabanda: I was, Mr Speaker.

 

Mr Speaker: You may continue, please.

 

Mr Kabanda: Mr Speaker, I am aware that a lot of monies have been spent to recapitalise Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia (NCZ). Notwithstanding the €50 million Eurobond, which is being talked about now, is NCZ capable of being resuscitated?

 

Mr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, I think the assessment as to whether NCZ is capable of being resuscitated, can be best answered by the hon. Minister in the line ministry, who I am sure will be privy to the information about the state of the company, which I am not.

 

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

 

Dr Musokotwane (Liuwa): Mr Speaker, part (c) of the question is asking whether the Government has any plans to recapitalise the company further or not. However, there are different ways of recapitalising the company including that of providing a working capital so that fertiliser can be produced this year. Is the hon. Minister considering providing a working capital this year?

 

Mr Ng’andu: Mr Speaker, I did mention that part of what is happening to meet the challenge of NCZ is the discussions and negotiations that are ongoing between the company, Industrial Development Corporation (IDC) and potential strategic partners, in order to deal with the long term challenge of solving NCZ problems. However, as of now, I have not been given a specific request as hon. Minister of Finance to consider providing resources to this company. Therefore, I cannot answer that question.

 

I thank you, Mr Speaker

 

Mr Michelo (Bweengwa): Mr Speaker –

 

Mr Lufuma: On a point of order, Sir.

 

Mr Speaker: No you cannot raise a point of order at this juncture.

 

Mr Michelo: Mr Speaker, I thank you so much,–

 

Mr Lufuma: On a point of order.

 

 Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Lufuma: It was at a different time.

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member, are you done with your business?

 

Mr Lufuma: Not yet, Sir.  That man (pointed at Mr Lubinda) is disturbing me.

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

The problem is that you are concerned about him. I want to give you chance so that you can engage him.

 

Mr Lufuma: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister of Finance has informed us that he does not have the information on the profile and why the €50 million was not disbursed to NCZ. He said that he will come back with the information. However, is he in order to keep quiet as to when he is going to come back here and inform this House accordingly?

 

Mr Speaker: Since it is a point of order I will rule. I expect that the hon. Minister will come back to the House in due course. That is my ruling.

 

Mr Michelo: Sir, my question is a follow-up on question (e) which is seeking whether the Government has any plans to recapitalise the company further. Now that the hon. Minister is in charge of the national purse, has he got any plans to compel hon. Ministers who stayed in office illegally when Parliament was dissolved to pay back the money so that he can use it to recapitalise the NCZ?

 

Laughter

 

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member for Zambezi East.

 

Laughter

 

Mr Kambita (Zambezi East): Mr Speaker, I would also seek clarification on part (e) of the question that we are debating at the moment. I am one of those who were privileged to inspect or visit the Nitrogen Chemical of Zambia (NCZ) in Kafue with the Committee on Parastatal Bodies. I saw the infrastructure. I want to know from the hon. Minister, especially the fact that he provided an answer to part (e) of the question informing the House and the nation at large that the Government has plans of re-capitalising the institution and the hon. Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry was actually pursuing a case where an equity partner was being sort by the Government. Has the hon. Minister cared to take a feasibility study? If so, could he share that information with us so that we know the Government’s plans well in advance so that we see where we are going and whether or not that equity partner would be interested in investing into such institution, which to me, is a dilapidated infrastructure.

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

A feasibility study of what?

 

Mr Kambita: Mr Speaker, I would like to know whether a feasibility study has been done to see whether or not the business itself is viable in terms of the company being able to produce what it is supposed to produce, to attract interest from would-be investors into the institution. Is it going to be feasible for them to put in money?

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Please, resume your seat.

 

I think, I have belaboured this point, operations of NCZ is not a remit of the Minister of Finance. His remit is simply to fund. Therefore, whether NZC is viable or not, there is another ministry that should answer that question. Not the Ministry of Finance.

 

_______

 

MOTION

 

SANITARY TOWELS PROVISION

 

Mr Speaker: At the outset, I would like to say that I have permitted the hon. Member for Chembe to use the Clerks- at-the-Table facilities to present his Motion.

 

Mr Mwale: Hear, hear!

 

Dr Kopulande (Chembe): Mr Speaker, allow me to express my gratitude and profound appreciation to you, for giving me this opportunity to move this Private Member’s Motion urging the Government to provide free sanitary towels to all girls in public schools.

 

Sir, let me point out that from the outset that this Motion borders on girls child empowerment…

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Initially, you just move the Motion and it needs to be seconded before you give your reasons.

 

Dr Kopulande: Most obliged, Mr Speaker.

 

Mr Speaker: Is the Motion seconded?

 

Mrs Chinyama (Kafue): Mr Speaker, I beg to second the Motion.

 

Dr Kopulande: Mr Speaker, allow me to express my profound gratitude and appreciation to you for giving me an opportunity to move this Private Member’s Motion which is urging the Government to provide free sanitary towels to girls in public schools.

 

Sir, let me point out from the outset that this Motion borders on girl/child empowerment and is aimed at closing the gender gap in education attainment that arises from lack of access to basic sanitary products and appropriate conditions by a girl/child and especially so, in rural and poor areas of our country. In this regard, I wish to request all hon. Members to support this non-controversial Motion aimed at educating our nation through the education of our young women who are the future mothers of Zambia.

 

Mr Speaker, let me remind the hon. Members of this august House that the genesis of this Motion was from my maiden speech which I presented on the Floor of this House on 1^st November, 2016, soon after the people of Chembe gave me the mandate to represent them in this House and to speak not only for them, but for all the citizens of our land including their children whose welfare need to be improved through various Government initiatives.

 

Sir, having observed the high girl/child school drop-out rate in Chembe and other rural areas, I called on this House to introduce the distribution of free sanitary pads to school girls in rural and poor areas of our country. This is simply because from my observation, this was clearly one of the major causes of the problem.

 

Mr Speaker, I argued then, and do so now that if we could distributer free condoms which are a matter of choice, what more the sanitary pads where there is no choice. You will agree with me that education is fundamental human rights that everyone must be given an opportunity to enjoy at the very least up to elementary level. As you are aware, education has a potential to transform lives of individuals, families and societies at large. Further, education helps people who acquire knowledge and skills to enable them get employed and start private business, earn an income and improve their living standards. In other words, education improves the quality of human resources who are required for the social economic development of any nation. It is an effective means for ending the poverty vicious cycle, reducing inequality and enhancing the well-being of an entire society.

 

Sir, the link between education and sustainable national development is, therefore, undeniable as been clearly demonstrated by the South-East Asian countries commonly known as the Asian Tigers, where the World Bank found a possible correlation between public investment in education levels and rate of development. It is for this reason that governments are investing a lot of resources in ensuring effective protection of the right to education.

 

Mr Speaker, I wish to acknowledge the achievements that the Government has scored over the years in promoting access to education. This has been through the enhancing of schools infrastructure and the implementation of policies such as free primary education, national policy on education, re-entry policy and the trading policy. The Education Statistical Bulletin shows that in the period, 2013 to 2017…

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member, just give me a minute. There are too many conversations going on.

 

You may continue hon. Member.

 

Dr Kopulande: Sir, the education statistical bulletin shows that between 2013 and 2017, there was an increase in Grade 9 completion rates from 61.5 per cent in 2013 to 71.7 per cent in 2017. Grade 12 completion rates also marginally increase from 31 per cent to 31.8 per cent over the same period. In terms of schools dropout rates at primary level, there was a reduction from 1.8 per cent to 1.5 per cent.

 

Mr Speaker, as a result of these efforts, the United National International Children’s Emergency Fund (UNICEF) reported Zambia to have achieved near-universal primary schools completion levels. Notwithstanding these achievements, gender disparities in education attainment are still prevalent, sadly so. Overall, girls continue to be at a disadvantage with a considerable number of them dropping out of school at primary or secondary levels. In terms of transitions to high school, girls have a relatively poor record due to many reasons including lack of sanitary facilities.

 

Sir, allow me to highlight some of the pertinent issues relating to this challenge. It is a fact and we are all aware that a good number of our girls, especially in rural areas cannot afford and do not have access to safe sanitary products. This has prevented them from engaging effectively in daily life activities, whether school or carrying out their normal responsibilities such as domestic, social or otherwise during the menstrual period.

 

Mr Speaker, with regard to schools attendance, a significant number of girls have had to miss class and lose learning time, which has negatively affected their academic performance. Statistics obtained from the Women for Change (WFC)  indicate that on average, a girl is absent from school for four days in a month, which makes thirteen days of learning time lost in one term. In one academic year, therefore, a girl will lose about thirty-nine school days more than fourteen per cent of the total learning time allotted.

 

Mr Speaker, in this scenario, can we really expect girls to perform to the same standard as their male counterparts who, all things being equal, enjoy 100 per cent of the time allocated? Can girls in this situation be in a position to advance with their education to higher levels? The people of Chembe Constituency have an answer. It is an unequivocal “no,” simply meaning that the girls cannot do it. Girls are clearly at a very huge disadvantage compared to their male counterparts, and this is for no reason of their own making, neither is it because of any failure whatsoever on the part of their parents. They are where they are purely because of their biological make-up over which they have absolutely no control and without which fact none of us would exist.

 

Mr Speaker, is it, therefore, fair and just, that the facilities that we the policy-makers provide in our learning institutions should discriminate against girls? Again, the answer is “no.” At least I do not think so, and neither do the people of Chembe Constituency. For us to sit in this august House and do nothing about the situation is tantamount to perpetrating an injustice that will curtail the productive lives of our girl/children and condemn them to all manner of injustices such as Gender Based Violence (GBV), sexual abuse, child-marriages and complete social exclusion.  It is, therefore, betrayal of the future mothers of our nation.

 

Sir, the girl/child, the people of Chembe and all the rural and poor people are gravely concerned about our inaction. With that, they ask whether or not it is morally right for the Government to take affirmative action that will give equal opportunity for both boys and girls to advance in their education without interruption from natural predisposition. Yes, we should, and indeed we must, because the amount of learning time lost by girls seriously undermines our efforts to achieve gender-inclusive development all because of a natural condition to which we are able to respond to as a nation.  As policy-makers, we must make a difference.

 

Sir, while trying to avoid getting into details here, let me illustrate the seriousness of the problem that our girls in rural and poor areas experience when their time comes. In order to manage their menses in the absence of hygienically proven sanitary towels, some girls tend to relay on crude, improvised materials which are, in most cases, unhygienic, ineffective and uncomfortable, hence posing serious risks to their health. To illustrate how disparate the situation is in Zambia, especially in rural areas let me make reference to a research on Menstrual Health Management that was conducted in the Western Province by the Maboshe Memorial Centre. This research was only undertaken this year in 2019, and it revealed that many school girls in the Western Province lack access to menstrual sanitary products and facilities such as water, toilets and changing rooms that would allow them to manage their menses in a more hygienic and dignified manner. Further, it was reported that in a bid to manage their menses, stuffing and other unhygienic ways that could even be threatening to their health are used during the time. This situation is, however, not only unique to the Western Province, it is a common phenomenon for many girls around the country, especially in rural and poor areas. Despite the dangers, these girls have no choice but to do this. The impact of failure to effectively manage their situation weighs heavily on a girl’s emotions, privacy, integrity and self esteem.

 

Sir, I am sad to alert this House that in extreme cases, some girls have committed suicide as a result of being shamed by their friends when they are on their menstrual periods. For example, on 11^th September, 2019, the British Broadcasting Corporation (BBC) reported that in Kenya, a 14 year old girl hanged herself after being shamed by the school teacher and her friends for staining her uniform during menses. Now, may be let me repeat this. The BBC reported that in Kenya a 14 year old girl hanged herself after being shamed by the school teacher and her friends for staining her uniform during menses. Surely, should we wait until we lose young lives because of a challenge to which the solution is within our hands? Remember that that Kenyan girl could have been your niece, granddaughter, or God forbid, your own daughter. Yes, she could as well have been your daughter or another relation.

 

Mr Speaker, the big lesson here is that the young girls are fragile. They deserve to be treated with care and dignity. It is our duty in this House, therefore, not only to speak for them but to protect them, make their lives better today and create a path for them into their future. Therefore, we must find a solution that adequately addresses the problem and contributes to a progressive Zambia that promotes girl/child education.

 

Mr Speaker, I dare move that one of the immediate solutions that is solely in our hand now is for this Government, the listening Patriotic Front (PF) Government, under the leadership of His Excellency, Mr Edgar Chagwa Lungu, to provide the young girls in rural and poor community schools with free sanitary towels. This will guarantee their uninterrupted education and a future full of promise, as they will become equal participants in the development process of the nation.

 

Mr Speaker, let me hasten to mention here that the challenge of inadequate sanitary amenities is not exclusive to Zambia. According to the United Nations International Children's Emergency Fund (UNICEF), one out of ten girls in African schools skip or drop out of school completely due to lack of menstrual products and poor access to proper sanitation. Numerous research and projects have been conducted, and have shown the negative effects that non-supply or inadequate supply of menstrual sanitary products has on female education achievement.            

 

Sir, the University of Oxford conducted such a research between 2008 and 2009 in schools across Ghana in remote rural areas, urban inner city schools and peri-urban areas. The research found that girls attending schools in several inner city schools and remote areas reported that they stay home during the entire length of their menstrual periods due to fear of the embarrassment associated with soiling themselves during their menses. The study also found that girls who were supplied with sanitary pads recorded increased school attendance, ability to concentrate in school, higher confidence levels and increased participation in a range of other school activities. However, the study noted that while this intervention may not necessarily address many negative, entrenched attitudes towards girl/child education on our continent, it might, nevertheless, have significant impact in the short-term on the educational achievements of the girl/child and positively impact other related negative outcomes such as early pregnancies and marriages, child-trafficking and so on.

 

Sir, again in Ghana, a study which was undertaken on Menstrual Health Management (MHM) by Water/Aid revealed that about 95 per cent of girls in rural areas do not attend school during menses. As a result, the coalition on menstrual hygiene petitioned the government to consider incorporating the supply of free sanitary towers into the senior high school policy, and this was done.

 

Mr Speaker, in an article published by the Global Citizen, a Kenyan movement involved in ending extreme poverty, it was reported that 1 million girls are forced to miss school due to lack of access to menstrual hygiene products. To address this challenge, the government of Kenya enacted legislation to ensure that free sanitary towels are provided to girls in schools.

 

Mr Speaker, in South Africa, a study undertaken by the Stellenbosch University Law Clinic found out that about 30 per cent of girls in South Africa do not attend school during their menstrual periods. Like Kenya, the government of the Republic of South Africa reacted proactively by annually allocating resources in the national budget to provide sanitary towels to low-income communities. In addition, Value Added Tax (VAT) on menstrual products was removed in order to make them more affordable for the female citizen.

 

Mrs Chinyama: Hear, hear!

 

Dr Kopulande: Sir, other countries that have taken action to address the challenge of school absenteeism by girls as a result of menstruation, include Botswana and Namibia. In Botswana, a law was enacted to provide free sanitary towels to all schools. In Namibia, the government launched a project in 2017, to provide free sanitary towels to 5,000 girls from low-income communities every month.

 

Mr Speaker, several other African countries have taken similar steps to enhance the quality of education by promoting good hygiene and sanitation. Zambia should emulate these efforts to ensure that the girl/child is empowered and protected. Our failure to address this challenge has grave repercussions not only in the education sector but in other socio-economic development sectors. I will endeavour, briefly, to highlight some of the repercussions that the inaction brings on this subject.

 

Sir, non-intervention has numerous consequences on our country’s development:

 

1. it will impede economic growth because it will lead to limited supply of skilled and productive labour required for various socio-economic activities;
2. it will widen gender inequality levels and lower standards of living. When girls are not educated, they tend to have low aspiration levels and engage in low-paying jobs such as domestic work, restaurant service, farm work, or worse still, prostitution. These jobs tend to make them feel marginalised and inferior to men;
3. it increases the levels of poverty in society as in developing countries, women play a critical role in taking care of families and tend to be breadwinners. However, if they do not attain the required education for them to earn enough income, they are unable to take good care of their families; and
4. inaction will undermine the progress that has so far been made in achieving gender equality through the implementation of various policies and legislation as earlier alluded to.

 

Mr Speaker, further, if the Government does not respond favourably to the menstrual challenges of girls, Zambia risks not achieving the following Sustainable Development Goals (SDGs);

 

1. goal No. 3, which is aimed at ensuring healthy lives and promoting well-being for all ages;
2. goal No. 4, which is aimed at ensuring inclusive and quality education for all and promote life-long learning;
3. goal No. 5, which seeks to achieve gender-equality and empower all women and girls; 
4. goal No. 6, which is aimed at ensuring availability and sustainability of water and sanitation for all; and
5. goal No. 8, which is aimed at promoting sustained, inclusive and sustainable economic growth, full productive employment and decent work for all.

 

Sir, given the above development implications arising from girls skipping school due to lack of sanitary materials, there is need for us, as legislators and representatives of the people we swore to serve, to urge the Government to put in place, measures that will effectively address the challenge. I propose that the following measures, among others, be undertaken:

 

1. amendment of the Education Act like Kenya did in order to:

 

1. provide for free, sufficient and quality sanitary towels to every girl/child registered and enrolled in a public, Government-aided, or community educational institution in rural and poor areas who have reached puberty and provide a safe and environmentally sound mechanism for disposal of the sanitary towels;

 

1. provide for the employment or secondment from the Ministry of Health of qualified female health professionals in both medical issues and psychosocial counselling to public, Government-aided or community educational institutions in rural areas; and

 

1. ensure availability of sufficient funds in the National Budget for the acquisition of sufficient and quality sanitary towels to every girl/child registered in a public institution; and

 

 b. remove the 5 per cent customs duty and VAT currently charged on menstrual products in order to make them more affordable for the female citizenry. I am very sure that the consequent revenue loss will not rob the Treasury;

 

c. provision of tax incentives to any investor wishing to manufacture sanitary products in Zambia so as to encourage investment in this area and help lower the cost of the final product to the womenfolk; and

 

d. engagement, in the immediate future, of our co-operating partners, international Non-Governmental Organisations (NGOs), churches and civil society organisations to support this initiative with sufficient resources to ensure programme success. I am confident that these organisations will respond positively, this not only being a development cause but also a humanitarian one.

 

Sir, I am aware that in response to my call in my maiden speech, as acknowledged by the then Minister of Finance, Hon. Felix Mutati in his Budget Address to this House on Friday, 11^th November, 2016, the Government, in the 2017 Budget, allocated resources to provide free sanitary pads to 14,000 pupils in sixteen districts. The same was also provided for both in the 2018 and 2019 National Budget.

 

Sir, sadly, according to the information available, no funds have ever been released towards the sanitary pads programme. We have slackened in our commitment made in 2016, hence this Motion, which should serve as a reminder to the Government to fund this important imperative.

 

 Further, the Government must go beyond providing free sanitary towels by also ensuring that schools are gender-friendly. School infrastructure must be appropriate to allow girls to adequately and hygienically manage their menses. In every school, there must be provision for privacy, running water, soap, space for washing hands and clothes as well as places for changing and disposing of materials used for managing menses. This will ensure that fundamental human rights to education, privacy and dignity of a girl/child are protected.

 

Mr Speaker, we are aware that several non-profit organisations such as Maboshe Memory Centre, Women for Change, AFRIpads, Kozo Girls and many others, have taken the step to address the problem by procuring and distributing sanitary towels to vulnerable pupils in schools, especially in rural areas. I wish to salute these organisations for the practical steps they have taken in addressing these real life situations.

 

Mr Speaker, as the hon. Member of Parliament for Chembe, following my median speech, I with a few colleagues did set up the Build Chembe Foundation, which is embarking on the distribution of free sanitary pads in schools all around the country, resources permitting. 

 

Sir, let me take this opportunity to acknowledge and thank the First Lady of the Republic of Zambia, Mrs Esther Lungu, for the support and encouragement she has rendered to me and the Girl/Child Education Support Programme that we are implementing under the foundation. Let me also render my sincere thanks and appreciation to the former First Ladies that are living, Mrs Vera Chiluba, Dr Maureen Mwanawasa, Mrs Thandiwe Banda and Dr Christine Kaseba Sata, for all the support they have given through their personal involvement in our programmes and events.

 

Mrs Simukoko: Excellent!

 

Mr Kambita: Hear, hear!

 

Dr Kopulande: Having said that, let me hasten to add that all these private efforts are not enough. The task is simply too heavy and calls for the contribution of our entire society. It calls for the private sector, civil society, church, donor community and all women and men of goodwill who are interested in seeing a progressive Zambia in which gender equality is in practice, rather than only in rhetoric, to come forth and make their contributions. The time to stand up and be counted is now.

 

Mr Speaker, as I conclude, allow me to emphasise that by moving this Motion, which obviously has financial implications, it is not my intention to bankrupt our already challenged Treasury, as the President clearly explained in his Official Opening Address to the Fourth Session of the Twelfth National Assembly on Friday, 13^th September, 2019, not at all. Our able hon. Minister of Finance in his Budget Address last Friday, 27^th October 2019, also acknowledged the challenges that we face in this area. While acknowledging these challenges, I must reiterate, however, the fact that educating a girl child has consequential improvements and benefits in societal productivity, thereby breaking the cycle of extreme poverty.

 

Sir, we should never at any one point at all think that investing in a girl/child education by improving sanitary conditions in schools is a waste of resources at the time when we are implementing austerity measures, not at all. Hence, my proposition is a win-win strategy that promotes access to education, economic prosperity, efficiency and the achievement of other critical human developmental goals, which in the long term would drive us out of perpetual austerity.

 

Sir, I, therefore, appeal to the Government and all hon. Members of this august House to come forth from both your right and left in a multi-partisan spirit and fashion to support this Motion, which is non-controversial and is in the interest of our girls, our people and indeed our country.

 

Mr Speaker, I beg to move.

 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear! 

 

Hon. UPND Backbenchers: His Excellency!

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Does the seconder wish to speak now or later?

 

Mrs Chinyama: Now, Sir.

 

Mr Speaker, let me thank you for giving me this opportunity to second the Motion, so elaborately and eloquently moved by the hon. Member for Chembe, Dr Kopulande, which is urging the Government to provide free and adequate sanitary towels to all girls in public schools.

 

Sir, allow me to thank my hon. Colleague for moving this very progressive Motion. As he has indicated in his speech, the challenge of girls missing classes and in some cases dropping out of school due to lack of sanitary towels is disturbing and worrisome. Therefore, I wish to add my voice and want to encourage hon. Members of this august House to support this non-controversial and non-partisan Motion.

 

Mr Speaker, in seconding the Motion, I want to contextualise my debate on the importance of girl’s education because we are talking about an issue that affects girls only. As people may be aware, females represent approximately half of the world’s population and form a significant global resource. Education is a human right and so, girl’s education in particular, is also a human right and a powerful tool for changing perception and belief systems. Professionally educated females tend to command more respect from the family and society because they earn an income and contribute to the welfare of their families. 

 

Sir, research has shown that a woman will earn more income if more time was spent in school. In fact, even at the national level, statistics show that a country’s Gross Domestic Product (GDP) will go up with more women having been educated. I, therefore, do agree with the mover of the Motion when he says that any effort meant to support girl’s retention in school is not a cost on our Treasury, but rather an investment for the future of this nation and an addition to the GDP in the long term.

 

 

Mr Speaker, it is claimed that a mother is a child’s first teacher. An educated mother raises educated children through the transfer of knowledge and values. Therefore, investing in girls’ education, addresses challenges such as early-child marriages, Gender Based Violence (GBV), abortion and child mortality which is always being tackled with. Educated mothers are well prepared to deal with these challenges. So, when we educate the girl child, we would have actually averted the root causes, rather than dealing with the effects thereafter.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          

Mr Speaker, I want to agree with the famous African proverb which says, “if you educate a woman, you educate a nation.” The mover of the Motion has clearly stressed the extent of this issue and one undeniable fact is that most of the girls cannot afford to buy sanitary towels, especially in rural areas, where poverty levels are high. In fact, poverty, as you are aware, even in urban areas now, has become quite rampant. The current situation, for instance, is that a family that earns just about US$2 in a day will not afford to buy a packet of ten pads, which costs US$1 or there about. So, for what I call the two Ps, a pamela of mealie meal and a packet of pads, I am sure, at the present time, a family will opt to buy a pamela of mealie meal and not look at the issue of pads. This is, therefore, denying the girl/child an opportunity to go to school and draw the equal advantage as the boy/child does.

 

Mr Speaker, we have heard from the mover of the Motion that this issue of menstrual periods makes girls stay away from school for something like thirty-nine days on an annual basis. That absence, itself, causes the girls eventually to fall out of school. The mover of the Motion has well challenged us not to allow for such an issue to happen which the Government can tackle. Menstruation is a reproductive right. It is a natural thing which cannot be prevented. It is, therefore, our obligation as leaders to do something about it so that we can support our girl/children to attend school in order for them to achieve the best. 

 

Mr Speaker, the question, therefore, is; why should we continue watching girls being deprived of their basic rights? Successive governments, as we have heard, have devised laws and policies to address unequal access to education. However, today, these laws and policies will not achieve the intended purposes if the challenges such as lack of sanitary towels are not addressed. Posterity will harshly judge mothers and fathers in this august House, if we do not use this rare opportunity to support this Motion for the Government to begin to do something about this very crucial aspect pertaining to the education of our girl/children.

 

Mr Speaker, in addressing the issue of lack of sanitary towels, we are also raising awareness and emphasising on the importance of educating the girl/child with the benefits that arise from there as I have already alluded to. Increasing access to and reducing gender disparities in education will result in increased numbers of people who do not only achieve their basic rights, but also develop a human resource that supports the bigger society. As already indicated, women are brought on board who constitute half of the population on this world, then a very important human resource carried along to contribute to the nation’s Gross Domestic Product (GDP). This means that if women are left behind, the productive contribution that the women and girl/children can make to the economy is being taken away.

 

Mr Speaker, as I conclude, allow me to reiterate the challenge of lack of sanitary towels as one of the inhibiting factors for girls’ attainment and that this particular issue needs to be addressed urgently. The starting point and building on the appeal of my hon. Colleague is that the Government must begin to provide these very important commodities to the girls in schools at no cost. I know that this is a period of austerity measures and that there are difficulties in mobilising resources. However, this is also demonstrated by the fact that in the 2016, 2017, 2018 and 2019 Budgets, when the Government made that commitment, no disbursements of funds were done, as my hon. Colleague has mentioned. I have not had a chance to look at the current Budget for 2020 because Volume I that I have does not include education. Therefore, I do not know whether or not there is a provision in the 2020 Budget. If it is there, I hope it will be honoured this time around. 

 

Mr Speaker, I hope that this particular Motion will help the Government to be able to commit resources in a practical way and avail them to the provision of free and adequate sanitary towels in schools. If money remains a question, I am aware that the global community is committed to providing support for the girl/child education. This is one matter that I am sure the global community would want to help us. I speak from experience and knowledge, having sat on the Global Partnership for Education (GPE) body. This is a multilateral funding mechanism for education only and the agenda for this global body puts girls’ education first. Whichever country is able to put up a bankable plan to access these funds which are meant to support the girls’ education will get them. I hope that the hon. Minister will take that direction if the National Budget will not be able to sustain this very important aspect which we are discussing today.

 

With those few remarks, Mr Speaker, I, therefore, end my debate and appeal to the hon. Members to support this Motion.

 

I thank you, Sir.

 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Speaker, I want to begin by thanking the mover of this very critical Motion. I also would like to thank the seconder of the Motion. I will be succinct and clear.

 

Sir, in supporting this Motion, I think that reality always has to dawn. What is the achievability of this Motion? This Motion was once brought to this House in form of legislation through the 2017 Budget that the Patriotic Front (PF) Government dubbed ‘Zambia Plus.’ Hon. Felix Mutati came to this House and indicated that the Government had made a plan for that year to provide sanitary towels to school children in the rural areas. We have done an assessment of the performance of that particular pronouncement and our findings are that it was a still-born baby. Important as it was, nothing happened.

 

Mr Speaker, so, in supporting this Motion, the hon. Member of Parliament for Chembe can bank on me and those who are like-minded to be emotionally attached to this particular drive that he is pushing because girl/children are mothers. They are not just girl/children.  As a matter of fact, we must not shy away from discussing menses because this is a process that brings out life.

 

Therefore, it is a sacred natural activity. Hence, we need to support this kind of thinking. I thank Hon. Kopulande for reminding the Members of this Government that it had actually cast it into law. No sooner had this House passed the 2017 Budget, than Hon. Mutati came to the House with an Appropriation Bill which we enacted into law. A law is a binding set of rules that compels people to behave in a certain manner. The question is, why did it not happen? The simple reason is that the Government that we have is not serious.

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Nkombo: The idea was cast into law. However, there was not even an explanation why this law was not only forgone, but abandoned. In that fiscal year, we should have actually learnt that, at least, in a particular area of this country, certain children benefited from sanitary pads or towels, but it did not happen.

 

Mr Speaker, this brings me down to the centre of my debate. I am sure many of the hon. Members know Abraham Maslow who brought the theory called Maslow’s Theory of Psychological Needs. The hierarchy of human needs is pyramidal. As human beings, we need air water, food and shelter. All of these are things that matter to human life. I can assure the House that this issue that is under discussion here ranks at the bottom end to the Patriotic Front (PF) on the Maslow’s hierarchy. Why should they bring out something that they cannot achieve? Why should they bring flamboyant statements indicating that they will be providing sanitary pads to girl/children and then fail to buy even one?

 

Sir, let me bring the argument close to home. For this particular Motion to work, there is need for us as hon. Members to agree on certain things. For example, we should ascertain what sanitary pads are made of. They are made of a certain fabric. Do we produce that fabric in this country? Unfortunately, Zambia does not produce even a match stick. At this point in time, Zambia under the leadership of the PF does not produce even a toothpick.

 

Laughter

 

Hon. Government Members: Question!

 

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, we have local industries. Let me say something without abusing anyone, we have local companies such as Sobi Industries which started a long time ago. It produces toilet paper and this company needs to be supported. Therefore, before the Government could bring an idea which could be made into law, it should speak to operators in such an industry who could manufacture sanitary pads, locally. If one went into any shop in town, he/she will only find Maxi Plus and Always brands of pads that are produced away from this country. Following Maslow’s Hierarchy of Human Needs, this could have been achieved a long time ago if we had a serious government in place.

 

Mr Speaker, let me share the Maslow’s Hierarchy of Human Needs according to the PF. There is no way we can dignify our girls and ensure we avail sanitary towels if our hon. Colleagues on your right are going to continue as business as usual. They are inflating prices of things that we do not need such as fire trucks. The amount of money that was used to acquire buying fire trucks is a lot. The cost of one fire truck, a million dollars, would have serviced the whole country even with imported sanitary pads.

 

Hon. Member: True!

 

Mr Nkombo: I want someone to argue that a million dollars could not have bought sanitary pads which are cheap. They are disposables. If we cannot do this, we could approach the same industry that I talked about so that we try to do something that can work for us for now. We can make re-usable sanitary pads which have enough absorption capacity and can be washed. This way, after they are used they can be put away and when the next menstrual cycle comes, the child can use them again.

 

Sir, there are no innovations from the people who make policies. There is nothing. I would like to say well done to the hon. Member for Chembe for bringing this Motion. However, for the group of people he is with, this is a farfetched Motion. They have no solution for this. When a serious Government, like the United Party for National Development (UPND) comes into power …

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Nkombo: … these are the matters that we are going to deal with like one is having porridge in the morning with little or no effort whatsoever because they sit right at the heart of the dignity of human beings. This is doable, and for the PF Government Members to have come in 2017 and make this proposal, they knew it was doable.

 

Mr Speaker, Hon. Chinyama, Member of Parliament for Kafue and also the mover, spoke about the good will from co-operating partners and non-governmental organisations (NGOs). Yes, this good will starts traction in a normal society that is free of corruption. For example, the social cash transfer scheme was smoking gun of money which is being embezzled. Do you think that the co-operating partners can give you money which you are going to embezzle in the pretext of wanting to help a girl/child? The answer is no. We have to first clean up our governance style, financial prudence and target to ensure that we achieve the dignity that we are trying to seek for the girl/child.

 

Sir, the stuff which the hon. Member for Chembe spoke about is alarming. It is alarming in the sense that he gave examples of some girl in Kenya who committed suicide because of the stigma that is associated with bleeding and yet it is a natural phenomenon. We shy away from talking about such things.

 

Mr Speaker, probably, in this country, the social shame that goes with a child leaking menses onto her dress is untold. The effect of the amount of ridicule that they get from colleagues and male counterparts is probably not just reported in this country, but it is blacked out. This is a serious matter and we need to support it at every step of the way and everyone should play their part.

 

Mr Speaker, both hon. Members spoke about the enterprise that the co-operate world can help. How can they help in the midst of high taxes? The PF Members on your right promised lower taxes, but today, the country is suffering from the highest levels of tax since it became a Republic. People have no extra money to support corporate social responsibility even towards human kind.

 

Sir, these are the few things that I wanted to state and this is achievable. To the hon. Member for Chembe and the hon. Member for Kafue, I would like to say that this issue can only be achievable with a government that is selfless and full of love for humanity; a government that has got compassion and feels that imiti ikula empanga, meaning that small trees grow into a forest. Similarly, the young children grow to be the future of a nation, however, for as long as they are neglected, they will not grow.

 

Mr Speaker, this should not only apply to a rural child. Right now in Zambia, towns such as Lusaka, Kabwe and some towns on the Copperbelt are most highly urban populated and there is squalor. Squalor is one of the highest descriptions of poverty. They cannot afford anything, they scavenge and they should not be excluded from this programme. For now, it is befitting, Hon. Kopulande, I would love to have a hard and soft copy of your proposal so that when we take over power from the PF in 2021, we can implement such brilliant ideas instantly.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Nkombo: We can implement them. Right now, what is going on with our hon. Colleagues in the PF is that they are fire fighting loans that they borrowed indiscriminately. They cannot even afford this programme. They are running a Budget of K6 billion because 90.1 per cent of the Budget that we are dealing with today is going to debt service and paying Civil Servants, 10 per cent to health which is part of this sanitisation that we are talking about. The Government cannot even provide water for its citizens today and yet water is a basic need.

 

Hon. Government Members: Question!

 

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, I think let me rephrase my statement to be a bit fair. The Government cannot provide adequate water to its citizens because it has over-priced the boreholes. The sinking of boreholes costs K14,000 but it has increased the price to K50,000. Therein, lies a difference of K36,000, if K14,000 is subtracted from K50,000. It is possible that in a year, K36,000, can be enough to buy sanitary towels for one community.

 

Mr Speaker, as I conclude, wastefulness on the part of Patriotic Front (PF) is one of the reasons Zambians must quickly rethink. They must quickly have a rethink on whether or not they should maintain the status quo of having people holding the purse strings of the country in the image of PF. The earlier the change the quicker we are going to achieve the dictates of this particular Motion.

 

I thank you, Sir

 

Mr Mweetwa (Choma Central): Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me an opportunity to add a voice on this important Motion on the floor of this House. At the outset, I would like to state that there are Motions which can be politicised and some which are so essential such that a clear line away from politics must be kept. This is because they speak to the very call and essence of the reason that the people elected us to come to this august House and make decisions that will better their lives.

 

 Mr Speaker, this afternoon I will not speak as hon. Member for Choma Central, but as the Chairperson for the Men’s Network in Support of Gender Equality group here at Parliament. Therefore, allow me to adopt the submissions of Hon. Kopulande, Hon. Chinyama and Hon. Nkombo. With that adoption, I proceed to state that it will be unreasonable for me to continue to debate on a matter that is straight forward. I think the whole House has agreed that this Motion is in good faith, and non-controversial. Additionally, the hon. Member for Chembe politely reminded the Executive not to make undertakings for the citizens which they have no capacity to deliver or in the event that it fails to fulfil. I think that that is the gist for this Motion. It is to remind the Executive that they made undertaking in 2016 in the 2017 Budget and made budgetary provisions for free sanitary towels. They have not come back to this House to tell us about the pronouncements which they made, what went wrong and why they failed.

 

Mr Speaker, I do not want to politicise this issue. I think that the hon. Member for Chembe has done a decent and honourable thing as a member of a ruling party to remind his hon. Colleagues. This is the way it should be. Allow me to say that, us as United Party for National Development (UPND) members are not like PF. When a Motion which has been moved on the floor of the House is good, we will be readily available to support it. As you have seen, even Hon. Nkombo has supported it. I do not think that there can be anyone who will disagree with this noble Motion.

 

Mr Speaker, as for the PF, no matter the nobility of the Motion,....

 

Ms Mulenga: He is answering!

 

Mr Speaker: Order! Hon. Mweetwa, resume your seat.

 

What you are doing now is that you have veered off from the Motion. You are talking about how these Motions are treated and how the behaviour is conducted. If it is a straight forward Motion, and making this point to the whole House, we should not spend too much time on this subject. I mean, even looking at this entire list with me – there is no controversy here. I want to move on very quickly with this, I suppose the hon. Member is finishing off.

 

Mr Mweetwa: Mr Speaker, I just have one more point to make that as Men’s Network following the workshop we had with the Non-Governmental Organisations Co-ordinating Council (NGOCC) two weeks ago, we were looking at sexual and gender based violence. Something very important emanated out of that discourse where it was agreed that this House needs to begin to look at harmonisation of the marriage laws in Zambia. This is because we have two different sets of laws speaking to different ages concerning the marriage age. Therefore, giving lies in many instances to early child marriages which the mover of the Motion mentioned. So, I would like the hon. Minister to respond and also be able to breathe some air on child marriages as to whether this Government has any intentions to consider enacting a law on this particular issue.  Mr Speaker, given that this is a non-controversial Motion and we are all in support of it, I cannot continue debating.

 

I thank you, Sir.

 

Mr Speaker: Surely, and I will allow the hon. Minister of Information and Broadcasting and the hon. Minister of General Education, on the right, in that order, to speak to the Motion then the hon. Member for Chembe, who is the mover of the Motion will wind up debate.

 

The Minister of Information and Broadcasting (Ms Siliya): Mr Speaker, I wish to thank you most sincerely for this opportunity to add my voice to a very important Motion. I believe that this is not a Motion that is looking for victory from either sides of the House but it is a Motion for us to make progress. It is not a Motion which is asking us to substitute support of one need in society for another. However, the Government supports the girl/child education in the nation.

 

Mr Speaker, I want to take this opportunity to thank the hon. Member for Chembe for being a champion on girls, women, and family issues, including national issues. I believe that this is a very innovative Motion. The fact that this Motion is being brought to this House by a member of the Patriotic Front (PF), I think that this is a true reflection of how transparent the party in Government is, and even for allowing for such kind of discourse to happen. It is said that water is life and sanitation indeed is dignity.

 

Mr Speaker, I believe that the statements made by the former hon. Minister of Finance in 2017, on this matter was a clear demonstration of political will. The time has come for the right thing to be done, and for political will to translate into action. This is why this matter has been brought back in this House by the Patriotic Front (PF).

 

Mr Speaker, we feel a great sense of responsibility as a quotation says, “what you leave behind is not what is engraved in stone monuments, but what is woven into the lives of others.” The question is; what are we doing for the girl/child in this society?

 

Sir, I would also like to thank the seconder of this Motion who spoke passionately. In the question of what have we done for the girl/child, I am aware that the hon. Minister of Finance is already making headway in speaking to young entrepreneurs in society such as urban girls who are trying to manufacture re-usable pads that the hon. Member for Mazabuka referred to.

 

Mr Speaker, the issue of the girl/child and the support that they need in terms of sanitary dignity is a very big one and it goes to the call of position of the young girl in our society and the environment in which they are, especially in the school environment. I was speaking with a counselor from Oxfam this morning. I was told that 80 per cent of the girls that they are counseling have been defiled and that is because the issue of sanitary pads goes beyond the issue of sanitation. However, it goes to the very call of our traditional beliefs that when a girl comes of age, it means she has physically or mentally matured. 

 

That is why we end up hearing of cases where girls who are in a school environment, where they are supposed to safe, are defiled by teachers or where girls in a home, where they are supposed to be safe because they have parents, they are defiled by the men whom they know in their families. Because we are hiding in the veil of a Christian nation, we keep quiet.

 

Mr Speaker, I am extremely pleased that it is one of the hon. Members on the right side of the House who has brought this matter to this House. It has become part of the normal discourse in our society. Like the hon. Member of Parliament for Choma said, it is time we looked at the real issues that our people wants us to address. This indeed, is a bipartisan issue.

 

Sir, I was disturbed recently when I read in one of the papers that a certain executive in a named bank had been abusing over thirty girls. If you go online, you will find a situation where one young man dared every girl to name and shame anybody who had raped them, and hundreds of names were released online. This is happening in our society on the eve of the National Day of Prayer and Reconciliation. I think we should all be rightly concerned about this. I believe that the hon. Member for Chembe is trying to crystallise the position of the girl/child in our society. The issue of sanitation for the girl/child means that she must be positioned in an environment at school and at home where she feels safe.

 

Mr Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Chembe said that if as a country, we are able to work with co-operating partners and Non-Governmental Organisations (NGOs) to supply condoms for free when sex is a choice, we can do the same for free sanitary pads. I believe that this Government is well-placed to act on this, and the hon. Minister of Finance, has already begun talking with co-operating partners and NGOs such as the Urban Girl, who are manufacturing pads that can be reusable. I am sure he will speak to this. It is an opportunity for business in the country to respond to the challenges that the hon. Member for Chembe has brought out.

 

Mr Speaker, it is important to understand that the girl/child or women are 50 per cent of the world population. Us on the right side of the House do not see a substitute approach to support provision of sanitary pads for girls because it is an investment in human development. Women have to play their rightful role in our society for this economy to continue to expand. Therefore, we totally agree that we do not see this as a measure of punishment of austerity but as a responsibility of a nation that believes in its people, especially the young girl. I believe that men have to be our partners and champions on this matter because there is no man, I want to believe, who has no daughter, sister, female cousin, nieces, mothers or grandmothers. So, this is a family matter, and it affects all of us. We need a few men to be champions on this matter so that the girl/child can truly enjoy what she deserves in our country.

 

Mr Speaker, in ending, I want to belabour one of the statistics that were provided by the mover of the Motion, which is that the girl child losses thirty-nine days of school every year because of menstruation which is not a choice. It is because of that that us on the right side are fully supporting this Motion. It is important to do the right thing and move from political will to actual action. We should be reminded that it is this same Government that wanted the nation to recognise the Bill of Rights as a fundamental right for all our citizens. This Government wants to do the right thing. We are always proud of doing the right thing on this side of the House, and that is the reason we are all supporting the Motion to provide sanitary pads and decent sanitation in schools for our girls. This is not a Motion about victory. The only victory this side is going to enjoy is doing the right thing to transform political will into action.

 

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

The Minister of General Education (Mr Mabumba): Mr Speaker, I thank you for the opportunity given to me to contribute to this Motion. I also thank Hon. Kopulande, the mover of the Motion, and Hon. Chinyama, the seconder of the Motion. Further, I thank my hon. Colleagues who have debated the Motion.

 

Mr Speaker, you could see that obviously, there is convergence of views in the discussion around menstrual hygiene management in our education system in the Republic of Zambia from the hon. Members here. As the hon. Minister responsible for general education, this is a progressive Motion which has been tabled before this august House.

 

Mr Speaker, I will just summarise my thoughts. I want to anchor my summary in terms of the points Hon. Garry Nkombo raised, just in case the Zambian people do not know what Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs Theory is all about, to avoid confusion.

 

Mr Speaker, there are five needs in Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs Theory. I want to demonstrate how the President and the Cabinet here have fulfilled those needs in our Zambian schools.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs Theory has five needs. One of them is physiological, the other one is safety, love and belonging, esteem and self actualisation.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mabumba: How does the menstrual hygiene management system apply to this debate?

 

Mr Speaker, I think the Government, through our President, Edgar Chagwa Lungu, has been able to meet these needs. Under the physiological need, our children in the Republic of Zambia need shelter. At the moment, the Government is constructing 197 secondary schools to ensure that shelter is provided as part of the physiological needs of our children.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mabumba: As part of providing those schools, the Government is providing safety as well. It is ensuring that the safety is provided for our children. The children used to walk long distances of about 20 km to get to schools. If a school provided for them near to their homes, that 20 km is reduced, thereby ensuring that their safety and security is taken care of. Therefore, the schools that the Government is building are addressing the physiological and safety needs. How is it providing love and belongingness? It has done that through the reduced user fees. This is because President Lungu and his Cabinet love the children. We want them to have a sense of belong to this country because they do not have another country that they can belong to.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mabumba: That is why the Government reduced the user fees.

 

Mr Speaker, the last need under this theory is the esteem and self actualisation. When these children reach Grade 12, they will be able to go to universities. There are so many universities in the Republic of Zambia that President Lungu and the Cabinet have been constructing to ensure that these children are able to reach their esteem and self actualisation. They can become doctors, politicians, and so forth.

 

Mr Speaker, the issue of menstrual hygiene is one priority programme that we have in our ministry as part of Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs Theory. This programme is about equity. The Government does not want children to drop out of the school system simply because they cannot afford to buy sanitary towels. That is why there is a budget provision under the school health nutrition programme, and this programme has three components. One of them is the water, sanitation and hygiene (WASH) component and menstrual hygiene, the other one deals with the provision of food to the schools as well as their health needs.

 

Mr Speaker, the Government is already doing these things, but this is a gradual journey. For now, it may not be able to buy all the sanitary towels that are required in our system. However, as Hon. Kopulande alluded to, the Government has been able to work with our co-operating partners in this area. This year, the ministry had a celebration in Chongwe about menstrual hygiene. Many of our co-operating partners came on board and provided sanitary towels to many girl/children.

 

Mr Speaker, going forward, the Government will embark on tapping resources from both domestic resources from the Treasury as well as from our co-operating partners to ensure that it continues supporting our children so that they do not drop out of our school system.

 

Mr Speaker, the Government is already doing this programme on a progressive process. I believe that everything being equal, the Treasury as well as our co-operating partners should be able to reach out to all our girl/children in this country as we go on.

 

Mr Speaker, I thank you and everybody who has debated.

 

I thank you, Sir.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Dr Kopulande: Mr Speaker, I hope I can wind up debate in ten seconds.

 

Sir, thank you for giving me the opportunity to have moved this Motion –

 

Mr Speaker: Order!

 

Laughter

 

Business was suspended from 1640 hours until 1700 hours.

 

[MADAM FIRST DEPUTY SPEAKER in the Chair]

 

Dr Kopulande: Madam Speaker, let me start by sincerely thanking the seconder of this very important Motion.

 

Madam, I believe that this is an important Motion because it is at the core of humanity and development. I am humbled by the unanimous support from the House on this Motion. I would like to assure Hon. Garry Nkombo that as the mover of this Motion, like I stated, in the actual Motion, I will count on the support of this House, hon. Members from both the right and left. At least, there is a matter over which we have unanimity and over which the spirit of multi-partism can prevail.

 

Madam, the Member for Choma, Mr Mweetwa, spoke on behalf of the Men’s Network. I thank him for his support. Let not matters of gender equality be left as the preserve of women alone, but should be a preserve of both genders. I am also absolutely humbled by the support of the hon. Minister of Information and Broadcasting, Ms Dora Siliya, and I must take a leaf from her and repeat her words that, while we have demonstrated political-will by supporting this Motion, there is need to translate that political-will into action.

 

Madam Speaker, within the Motion, I attempted to outline specific action points, and I will be looking to the time when we debate the Budget in full and in Committee to see whether those action points will be implemented or not. This country has never been short of ideas, but has always lacked implementation of policy stances that it takes. However, I take this support as a Government assurance and I hope I will start seeing some action taking place going forward. I thank Hon. Mabumba for his lecture on Maslow’s law of needs, and I thank him for having explained what Government is doing in response to those needs.

 

Madam Speaker, once again, I would like to thank the hon. Members of the House on both your right and left and commend them for the unity of purpose as demonstrated in the unanimity in support of this Motion.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Question put and agreed to

 

BUDGET 2020

 

(Debate resumed)

 

Mr Mweetwa (Choma Central): Madam Speaker, thank you very much for according the people of Choma Central Constituency an opportunity to have a say on the Motion on the Floor of the House in respect of the Budget Speech that was delivered on Friday, 27 September, 2019, by the hon. Minister of Finance, Dr Bwalya Ng’andu.

 

Madam Speaker, let me begin by congratulating Dr Ng’andu on his appointment to this portfolio, and wish him well at a time when the country and its economy are at crossroads. Therefore, all Zambians are being called to duty to ensure that we salvage our country from the jaws of poverty and suffering that our people are currently enduring.

 

Madam Speaker, in my discourse this afternoon, first, I would like to start my submission by defining this Budget as an admission of guilt by the Patriotic Front (PF), ...

 

Hon. PF Members: Question!

 

Mr Mweetwa: ... that it has run out of ideas. We on the left have been telling the PF for a long time now to heed the advice on how to govern the country and run the economy because governing a country and running an economy goes beyond winning an election. Anybody can win an election, even someone without any capacity to run the economy of a country. This is exactly the situation we are in.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mweetwa: The hon. Members on the right played funny songs such as dununa reverse and danced around, ...

 

Ms Mulenga: Shanakofye!

 

Mr Mweetwa: ... and they thought that was equivalent to running an economy. Now, they have hit a brick wall. Running an economy requires the skills to match the demands of the moment, but the PF lacks the same skills. Therefore, this Budget is an admission that the Patriotic Front (PF) can no longer deceive the people of Zambia. The PF can no longer hide in what it used to term as unprecedented development between 2011 and 2016. Our hon. Colleagues used to claim that there is unprecedented development all over the country, and Zambia has been turned into a construction site.

 

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

 

Mr Mweetwa: Have you seen your construction site now?

 

Laughter

 

Mr Mweetwa: Madam, only 10 per cent of the National Budget is what is available for discretionary funding because of populism and politics of appeasement. The PF embarked on programmes without long term solutions. Now, our hon. Colleagues on your right are saying that they will only fund projects which are at 80 per cent completion. What about the rest? These are PF failed projects.

 

Madam Speaker, no wonder on the social media, people are saying that the PF has now assumed a name called Palibe Future.

 

 Laughter

 

Mr Mweetwa: There is no future under the PF. It is a bad Government.

 

Madam, having defined this Budget Speech as an admission of guilt of failing to deliver the people of Zambia from the economic woes which they are going through, I would like to cascade down to the theme of this budget which is ‘Focusing National Priorities Towards Stimulating the Domestic Economy.’

 

Madam Speaker, really, I have been wondering because a theme of a speech of this nature gives an idea of the content and intention thereof of the Government. Hon. Members will agree with me that this theme appears not to be clear.  One cannot really figure out what the Government is saying. It says, “Focusing National Priorities Towards Stimulating the Domestic Economy.” What are these priorities? Is it the Seventh National Development Plan’s (7^thNDP) strategic goals or the seven pillars, namely; economic diversification and job creation, poverty and vulnerability reduction, reducing developmental inequalities, enhancing human development and creating a conducive governance environment for a diversified economy, among others? Are these the priorities which we are talking about? Are these the priorities that the hon. Minister of Finance is talking about or is he referring to the priorities as stated in this Budget Speech on page 1, wherein at point  number 6, he says:

 

“Sir, the 2010 Budget takes into account the challenges highlighted by His Excellency the President. The Budget and the policy measures, therefore, prioritise creating fiscal space, ensuring debt sustainability and dismantling domestic arrears. I will pay particular attention to the dismantling of arrears related to pensioners and suppliers of goods and services to Government.”

 

Madam, are these the priorities of the Government? When did our hon. Colleagues tell us that these are their priorities because they are just making reference to them? When did they tell this House and the nation that there are now their priorities and that the Budget should speak towards realisation and achievement of the same?

 

Madam, I would like the hon. Minister of Finance when he is winding up debate to be able to respond to those issues. Further, whichever hon. Minister wants to debate, they should respond to issues, unlike always debating the leader of the Opposition, the United Party for National Development (UPND), instead of debating issues. Any hon. Minister who stands up, they are always referring to HH, HH. What has HH done?

 

Laughter

 

Mr Mweetwa: Madam Speaker, let me proceed and state that considering what the hon. Minister has referred to as priorities, in line with the 7^thNDP, I would like to state that it appears that the priorities or sectors that need attention, among others, is the mining, agriculture, tourism sectors, and the Information and Communication Technology (ICT), construction and manufacturing sub-sectors. Therefore, let us talk about them a little bit.

 

Firstly, in line with what the hon. Minister of Finance said concerning mining at point number 8, he says:

 

“Sir, the theme for the 2020 Budget is therefore ‘Focusing national priorities towards stimulating the domestic economy’. For this Budget to achieve its objectives, it will require us to deliver on our commitments with discipline, determination and dedication. This is in accordance with our national values and principles of ethics, patriotism, national unity and integrity as enshrined in the Constitution.”

 

Madam, can these values be attained under the PF administration in Zambia? Can we attain the aspirations of the theme of this budget under the PF administration in terms of discipline? Does the PF have discipline?

 

The people in the Government recently went to the United Nations (UN) with the largest entourage yet the economy is the worst performing. Is that discipline? Our hon. Colleagues should not be coming to this House to talk about things they cannot achieve. Let us talk about realities. The time to deceive people is over. It is now time to accept that this theme is beyond the PF capacity. This is not a product of wishful thinking that they wish Zambia can development because they have to do it themselves. Currently, the PF lacks the necessary instruments to deliver a better Zambia.

 

Madam, in terms of mining and in order to stimulate the growth of the domestic economy, the PF has increased taxes. How has the PF done this? It will do it by increasing reduction on claimable Value Added Tax (VAT) and other consumables to 20 per cent, which is an invest introduction of a tax on the mining sector. This is likely to affect the operations of the mining sector. The mining sector is the anchor of the Zambian economy, but our hon. Colleagues are using the backdoor to introduce taxes and expect more jobs to be created. Do they understand what they are talking about? The answer is no! The PF is a bad Government.

 

Mr Mukosa: Question!

 

Mr Mweetwa: Madam Speaker, let me quickly move on to agriculture. The Fertilizer Input Support Programme (FISP) and the Food Reserve Agency (FRA) has now witnessed a reduction of K320 million in this budget in a year of hunger. We should have been seeing an increased in this sector because the PF are still arguing that there is no hunger.

 

Madam, how do they justify that this budget is responding to the needs of the people with such kind of provisions instead of looking at priorities in the land at the moment. In the priority areas they are decreasing funding in the agriculture sector instead, they have increased funding in defence force. Are we at war or do they want to continue going to eat serpents.

 

Laughter

 

Mr Mweetwa: Madam Speaker, this is unthinkable. Let me now talk about irrigation and the construction of dams. For a number of years, they have been talking about Momboshi Dam, Lusitu Dam and another dam in Mufulira. They have been talking about the same story word for word, as it was last year and the other year. What are they doing? Politics is not a game but it is a business which requires capacity and skill sets. It is not about misinforming people, play songs or dance around that they have won. It is about service to the people. Time has come for the PF to be exposed. There will be no hiding place in 2021. They will be go out!

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mweetwa: Madam Speaker, how do they explain that they are going to stimulate the domestic economy when under the agriculture sector they have failed as PF to pay agro-dealers? Many of them use their personal or company recourses to distribute inputs. To-date, the Government has failed and it is talking about remaining in power in 2021.

 

Madam Speaker, if the PF Government remains in power in 2021, by 2026, I do not know what Zambia will be turned into. The people of Zambia are already sick and tired of this PF Government. It is high time they begin to prepare. These are matters of reality and not wishful thinking. I know it is easy to wish that they can win, but how do they win when everybody else is suffering except them?

 

Madam Speaker, the issue of tourism –

 

Mr Mukosa: On a point of order, Madam.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Mr Mukosa: Madam Speaker, thank you very much for giving me an opportunity to raise a point of order.

 

Sir, I rise on a very serious point of order. One of the principles of debate in this House is that the person who is on the Floor has to debate issues that are relevant. In this case, what is on the Floor is the Motion of Supply, and this means that we should be debating the Budget Speech that was presented by the hon. Minister of Finance. Is the hon. Member of Parliament who is on the Floor in order to lose his relevance and start talking about the issue of a political party remaining in power without talking about the issues that are addressed in the Budget Speech? I seek your serious ruling.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: My serious ruling is that if the hon. Member on the Floor, indeed, becomes irrelevant in his debate, I will be able to guide him back to relevance. So far, he is not out of order.

 

May the hon. Member for Choma Central continue with his debate.

 

Mr Mweetwa: Madam Speaker, thank you very much.

 

Madam, I was just about to talk about the tourism sectors as one of the key drivers of the economic engine. In his speech, the hon. Minister of Finance talked about the Northern Circuit projects that were left by the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) Government eight years ago which were not completed. This means that the PF is a failed project. You cannot turn the Budget Speech into a ceremonial function, where you just talk about things that are beyond your reach.

 

Madam Speaker, as regards tourism in Zambia, what is it that we are seeing now? There is the probable theft of wildlife using huge trucks from foreign countries which are going into Malambo Constituency. This is the kind of theft which is going on under the PF Government; theft of wildlife in addition to the houses and other national scandals. What type of people are in the PF?

 

Mr Lusambo: Question!

 

Mr Nkombo: Nyama ipaya zina.

 

Laughter

 

Mr Mweetwa: Madam Speaker, in the construction subsector and in reference to stimulating the domestic economy, local suppliers are owed about K20 billion. However, the 2020 Budget of the PF Government has only allocated K2,278,733.732 for dismantling of arrears and it is confidently saying that it wants to dismantle local arrears and debts. Who are they cheating? I withdraw ‘cheating’ and replace it with ‘misinforming’ or ‘deceiving.’

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Withdraw the word, ‘deceiving’.

 

Mr Mweetwa: I withdraw it, Madam.

 

Why are they interested in not telling the truth all the time? Most of the time, whatever they say cannot be substantiated by facts. What type of a Government is this? It is a bad Government.

 

Madam Speaker, allocating K2,278,733.732 for dismantling of arrears out of K20 billion does not reflect any seriousness in dismantling the local debt. When one says these things, people do not listen or marry the facts to what is being said. They think that they will get away with it. No! Time to deceive the nation and the citizens is over.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member, withdraw the word ‘deceive.’

 

Mr Mweetwa: The time for the PF to misinform people is over.

 

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister of Finance made reference to climate change and said that this Budget is going to respond to challenges as espoused by the President. At the core of the President’s Speech was climate change. I thought the hon. Minister would tell us where this PF Government has been taking the Carbon Tax money, which motorists have been paying in response to climate change. Alas, our hon. Colleagues have never mentioned this tax. They cannot talk about Carbon Tax. Those are the issues we thought will marry and anchor when he talked about climate change with a speech of this nature.

 

Madam Speaker, in a year when there is a drought arising from climate change, we expected the hon. Minister to come and say that for this particular drought year, the Government is lifting the tax on boreholes. This is because the natural or traditional water reservoirs and niches have dried up and people are depending on boreholes for drinking water and for animals. The PF cannot think like that and it wants to be in power.  For what? Is it for games and jokes? Why? The people of Zambia are tired of people who do not think about their problems, except themselves. Whether the PF likes it or not, the people are tired of it.

 

Madam Speaker, the goodness in PF is that there are those people who were saying that Mr Sata would never be President and called him all sorts of names. They are now in PF.

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Mweetwa: They will continue saying those things. They are going out the same way MMD went out even with their defence of wrong doing. In fact, MMD was far much better than PF. It is just that the people of Zambia did not know. Today, if you put MMD and PF side by side, the MMD would win with a landslide, unless you bring in UPND. Then UPND would win.

 

Laughter

 

Mr Mweetwa: Madam Speaker, as regards the manufacturing sector, there is no provision for Kabwe and Mulungushi Textiles. However, people have been informing this House that they are going to revamp Mulungushi Textiles. Do you think the textile industry can be reopened by wishful thinking and making statements on the Floor of the House?  We have raised issues –

 

Mr Kampyongo interjected.

 

Mr Mweetwa: I have not spoken about President, Mr Edgar Lungu, except the reference to the serpent he was eating in Mbala. Therefore, I do not expect hon. Ministers to start talking about Mr Hakainde Hichilema.

 

Mr Kampyongo: On a point of order, Madam.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member for Choma Central, when you mentioned that earlier, I was a bit lost. Now that you have repeated it, you have to withdraw it. Withdraw that statement in which you are referring to the Head of State in that manner.

 

Mr Mweetwa: Madam Speaker, I withdraw and conclude that our hon. Colleagues in the PF have failed and they are failures. They are going nowhere and in 2021, they will be staring on a big door written exit, whether they like it or not.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

The hon. Member’s time expired.

 

The Minister for Eastern Province (Mr M. Zulu): Madam Speaker, thank you for this opportunity debate the speech given by the hon. Minister of Finance.

 

Madam, today, the saying by Sigmund Freud that sometimes a cigar is just a cigar rings true to me.

 

Mr Mweetwa crossed the Floor.

 

Ms Siliya: Where are you going? Coward!

 

Hon. Government Members: Where are you going?

 

Mr M. Zulu: It rings true because I now know that sometimes –

 

Interruptions

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order! Order!

 

Resume your seat, hon. Minister.

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Lubinda blocked Mr Mweetwa from leaving the Assembly Chamber.

 

Mr Ngulube: So, he wants to come out through here!

 

Ms Siliya: Coward!

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Minister of Justice, resume your seat.

 

Laughter

 

Mr Mweetwa left the Assembly Chamber.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: May the hon. Minister for Eastern Province continue with his debate.

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam Speaker, as I was saying, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar and sometimes the Opposition is just the Opposition.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu: I have been looking at the speeches from the time I came to this House.

 

Mr Nkombo: When?

 

Mr M. Zulu: That is from 2016, to date. I have looked at the debates of the hon. Members on your left. It seems they use the same template and only change the year.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Prof. Luo: Mediocre!

 

Mr M. Zulu: This time around, I thought the debates would be well informed. I seriously thought that there would be honesty in their debates this time around because barely three days before the presentation of the National Budget, the United Party for National Development (UPND) presented an alternative budget. However, none of the hon. Members on your left has referred to their alternative budget.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mrs Chinyama: We are still coming!

 

Mr M. Zulu: They have looked at the Government’s Budget, praised it and criticised some parts of it, but none of them have made reference to their alternative budget.

 

Madam Speaker, in their criticism of the National Budget, the hon. Members on your left said that the Government has allocated 0.6 per cent to climate change and that it is using climate change as an excuse. However, in their alternative budget, they refer to climate change as one of the factors that have contributed towards the global economic slowdown.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Ms Siliya: Shame!

 

Mr M. Zulu: An inquisitive mind may pause and ask, where they said that? I will refer to the Opposition’s alternative budget which I intend to lay on the Table so my hon. Colleagues on your left can have a look at it just in case they did not have a look at their alternative budget.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam, in reference to the economy, particularly in paragraph 6, the Opposition, in their alternative budget stated as follows ...

 

Mr Nkombo: On a point of order, Madam Speaker.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam Speaker, I seek your ruling on a matter.

 

Madam, I looked at the order paper for this afternoon and for fear of no contradiction, I shall read what it says. I invite you to the order paper, which all hon. Members have. The order on the Floor is the “Supply Motion, 27^th September, resumption of debate, as brought by the hon. Minister of Finance for the Government of the Republic of Zambia.” This is what is on the order paper.

 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam, I have heard the hon. Minister for Eastern Province gerrymandering, as usual, bringing in a document which is not on the order paper. I have a fear that the next moment he will bring an orbit magazine to debate on the Floor of this House which is not on the order paper. I have a fear he may bring One Bright Summer Morning by James Hardly Chase which is not on the order paper.

 

Hon. Government Members: Ah!

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

What is the point of order?

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam Speaker, is he in order to veer off from the Supply Motion which was raised by the hon. Minister of Finance and start bringing a document which probably he manufactured himself when he is an official in this House?

 

Hon. Government Members: Ah!

 

Mr Nkombo: I seek your ruling because if he continues as such we may also start wandering all over the show and achieve nothing. I seek your ruling on the matter.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: My ruling is that firstly, the hon. Minister for Eastern Province has only been on the Floor for three minutes and he is making reference to a document which, according to him, was done as a reaction to the Budget that we have started debating.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Therefore, the hon. Minister for Eastern Province is in order to strengthen his preamble by referring to a document which, in any case, he has indicated that he will lay on the Table of the House.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mwale: Mwawona manje?

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: The hon. Minister for Eastern Province is, therefore, in order and he will continue with his debate.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Prof. Luo: Hammer!

 

Mr M. Zulu: Thank you, Madam Speaker. As I earlier stated, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. I was referring to this particular document where it has been affirmed by the UPND as follows:

 

“The international economy remains quite constrained due to emerging protectionist foreign policies in manager global economic players, climate change effects and humanitarian challenges in some parts of the world. However, the world economy continues to grow at an estimated 3.5 per cent in 2019, and a projected 3.6 per cent in 2020. This means that despite the trade war between the United States and China and the United Kingdom Brexit issue, there is positive growth. Other factors that may have an effect on world economic growth could also include instability in the Middle East, which if sustained could have a negative effect on oil prices”.

 

With this great admission from the UPND’s document, which it purports as an alternative budget, I see that the hon. Members on your left do not seem to agree with their own thoughts. As a matter of fact, I did a comparison. If we had the UPND in power today and this was the budget they presented to this House, alas, we would be in shambles as a country.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam Speaker, it is no wonder that none of the hon. UPND Members of Parliament has referred to their alternative budget. None of them has referred to their alternative Budget because it makes little to no sense at all.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam, reference was made in the debates to the very issue of climate change. It was said that the Government has not prioritised what it ought to have prioritised. There was talk that the Government should have built dams, but if the hon. Opposition Members cared to read this speech, the Government stated that it had constructed dams in different parts of the country to address the issue of climate change. Kariba Dam is a dam that already exists, but the Government is not responsible for the rains to put water in those dams.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu: The Government can only do so much within its power, but what depends on God or what depends on nature should be done by nature. As a Government that is looking to improve the economy, it has started looking at all the limbs of the Seventh National Development Plan (7NDP) and setting what it has planned for them.

 

Madam Speaker, adjectives were being used to say that the speech was hollow and does not give hope except the fact that it retains the VAT which makes it a good Budget in so far as it relates to VAT. However, all the Budgets that were referred to from the time I came to this House in 2016 were given similar adjectives. However, let us look at this.

 

Madam Speaker, let us look at this. The very supposedly hollow Budgets that are being presented by the Patriotic Front (PF) have ensured the construction of the Solwezi/Chingola Road, the Mongu/Kalabo Road and the completion of the Dundumwezi road project.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu: The Budgets that the hon. Members on your left refer to as being hollow have also seen to it that the Turnpike/Mazabuka Road and the Choma township roads are being constructed as well as the Mongu township roads constructed. In the Eastern Province, the Great East Road has been constructed with the same Budgets. The Lusaka decongestion roads’ project is also being done using the same Budgets, and I am sure we all drive on some of the roads as we come to Parliament. What more is there to do?

 

Madam, if hollow means succeeding in these areas then the Government is hollow. If the Government is hollow and the hon. Members on your left are not, how come then this 2020 alternative budget is what comes out of them? The document in my hands is what the hon. Members on your left have called their alternative 2020 budget. As a point of reference, Hon. Mweetwa who debated before me, referred to the mining sector and read exactly what the Government has planned to do in the mining and the agriculture sector. However, in the alternative 2020 budget done by hon. Members on your left, the only reference to the mining sector in paragraph 20 is as follows:

 

“Let us move both away from sole dependency on copper for exports and further up the copper value chain.”

 

Mr M. Zulu: That is all. This is the only statement which they made as regards the mining from but what plans do they have for the mining sector?

 

Interruption

 

Mr M. Zulu: Should the people of the Copperbelt Province rely on hon. Members on your left, in relation to the mining sector? The answer is certainly, no.

 

Madam, the alternative 2020 budget from hon. Members on your left says the following on agriculture:

 

“We expect reforming the business environment to encourage investments in Agriculture, Services, Manufacturing and Tourism.”

 

Mr M. Zulu: This is what has been said on these issues; nothing more nothing less.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Ms Nonde: Ni budget nangu ni manifesto?

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam Speaker, the title of this document is “Alternative 2020 Budget” yet, inside it, I have just seen lamentations of things that the hon. Members on your left think that the Patriotic Front (PF) Government has not done well, and postured them as an alternative budget. It baffles me especially that they have technocrats amongst themselves, who are properly reposed and have once held the position of Minister of Finance, who I expect to give proper advice.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu: If there was proper guidance, indeed the people of Zambia would have said that the alternative budget makes sense. As a matter of fact, none of the hon. Members on your left has made any reference to this document. I suppose the document should be withdrawn, by this evening. I do not think we will be able to find it on the internet, because it is as hollow as it comes.

 

Madam, the Budget that the Government has chosen to present, answers to the aspirations of the people of Zambia. In the Agriculture sector, the Government has set out what it is going to do in terms of the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP). In the Mining sector, the Government has set out what it is going to do in terms of taxation and facilitation for Zambians to take part in the mining industry.

 

Madam Speaker, in tourism, the program has been set out and airports are being worked on. Not as it was suggested that 0.0001 per cent use the airport but because we anticipate that there will be a boom in the economy of this country. Through the airports more tourists are going to be attracted to come to Zambia. The Government is working on the Copperbelt International Airport, the Kenneth Kaunda International Airport (KKIA) and the Harry Mwanga Nkumbula Airport in Livingstone. So much progress has been done that even the ones that see it choose not to acknowledge but politic and give the Government the so called the alternative 2020 budget which is simply lamentations. Lamentations cannot be turned into alternative budgets.

 

Madam, reference was made to the time when the Movement for Multi-Party Democracy (MMD) left office. Someone said that there was so much money in the reserves. Yes, we had so much in the reserves because nothing was being done with the money. 

 

Hon. Member: Yes!

 

Mr M. Zulu: This Government has chosen to do something with the money, and in doing something with the money the Government is making sure that rural roads are constructed, agriculture is given the priority it needs and urban roads worked on. The Government is also ensuring that civil servants are paid. If the Government can do so much with 9.9 percent as was alluded to, what more then would be done with more than that.

 

Madam, hon. Members on your left lamented that at least 50 percent goes to wages, 40 per cent to debt servicing and the only deposable money available is about 9.9 per cent. With that 9.9 per cent, the Government has made a great difference in the economy of this country and delivered to the expectations of the people. The social cash transfer has been delivered to our people.

 

Hon UPND Members: Ahh!

 

Mrs Mwansa: Relief food!

 

Mr M. Zulu: Relief food as also been delivered to our people. As a matter of fact,–

 

Interruption

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Do not debate while seated. If you wish to debate please indicate. We still have time.

 

May the hon. Minister continue, please.

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam Speaker, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. In this particular case it is known very well that my grandmother in the village is receiving the social cash transfer. It is known very well that even on our Order Paper day in, day out, questions from the left rise as regards infrastructure development. All that is being done with the 9.9 percent, and a difference is being made in various constituencies across the country and it is there for everyone to see. This alternative 2020 budget does not support any of such programmes. The document does not make any reference to how debts will be serviced, or how revenues will be raised. All what has been talked about is that Value Added Tax (VAT) will reduce to 14 per cent, but without any scientific explanation to it. I wonder, we have a former Minister of –

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order! Hon. Minister.

 

Interruption

 

Mr M. Zulu: I will certainly withdraw that.

 

However, in making reference to the former Minister of Finance, I would say that his debate is not reflective of the position that he held, especially that he chose to ignore the issue of debt, that every country will require a certain amount of debt to be able to sustain its projects. As the Government, we are borrowing and investing in our economy. We are investing in infrastructure and the welfare of our people. As a matter of fact, even the very Motion that hon. Members on your left supported as regards the provision of sanitary pads, that it is an investment in our people. We know that as long as we keep investing in our people, we have a great country that we should all be proud of.

 

Hon. Member: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu: I therefore, expect that going forward debates from your left will probably make reference to this document. In case hon. Members on your right have chosen to ignore this alterative 2020 budget, I will lay it on the table as I conclude, so that they may make reference to it in further debates.  With this, I choose to lay this document on the table.

 

Hon. Government Members: No, no!

 

Interruptions

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam, there was another careless reference to the issue of animal capture in Malambo Constituency. 

 

Hon. Member: What about it?

 

Mr M. Zulu: As I speak, the hon. Minister of Tourism and Arts has suspended the translocation of animals because perpetrators of misinformation lied to the people of Zambia.

 

Madam First Deputy: Order!

 

Will you please withdraw the word ‘’lied.”

 

Mr M. Zulu: Perhaps I may be told that ‘’lied’’ is unparliamentary, I would say “misinformed” and mislead the people of Malambo and the people of Zambia at large. We took a chance to explain to the people of Malambo about the Government programmes. As a listening Government, we have heard their cry. The translocation of animals was the initial programme of the Government, but all that has been suspended for further engagements.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Aah!

 

Mr M. Zulu: This is the same way we suspended the issues of the Sales Tax. It was because we are a listening Government. We listened –

 

Interruption

 

Mr Nkombo: On a point of order, Madam.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order! A point of order is raised.

 

Hon. Government Members: No, point of order.

 

Interruption

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order on my right !

 

Mr Ngulube: Point of order on a Minister?

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam Speaker, the information the hon. Minister has brought out is in the public domain. This House has procedures, and facts must be spoken in this House.

 

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that, his hon. Colleague, the hon. Minister of Tourism and Arts, has suspended the translocation of animals from the chiefdom of Chief Nsefu in Mambwe District. It is in the public domain that the chief himself, His Royal Highness, was on both public and private media castigating the Government. He even went as far as say that the Government was translocating their animals and yet when there are traditional ceremonies, it refuses them to get two or three to feed their people.

 

Madam Speaker, we saw how the people in that area picked sticks and stones to chase away the drivers who would drive the trucks that were meant to translocate buffalos from that area.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member, you are debating.

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that his hon. Colleague has suspended the translocation of animals. It is in the public domain that yesterday, 1 October, 2019, was the deadline to stop the translocation of those animals, by the Government’s own provision in the law.

 

Madam Speaker, is the hon. Minister in order to mislead the House in the manner that he has? He could have simply stated that the Government was guilty of not consulting with the locals and that is the reason the hon. Minister of Tourism and Arts has suspended the translocation of animals. The facts are in the public domain. The people translocating the animals had to be chased away from that place to prevent them from translocating animals.

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam Speaker, I seek your serious ruling on this matter.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Firstly, hon. Members, we have guided that points of order must relate to issues of procedure, or issues that are so urgent in nature such as national issues that the Government must be made aware of. The issue you are raising, hon. Member for Mazabuka Central, does not qualify as a point of order. Seeing that you already debated, I urge you not to try and debate through points of order. You already had your chance. Therefore, that point of order is inadmissible and the House is encouraged to debate. Hon. Members, if you had an opportunity to debate, please, do not disturb the flow of debate in the House through points of order.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Was the hon. Minister for the Eastern Province still debating?

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam Speaker, yes, I was still debating.

 

Madam Speaker, the point I was making was that as the Government, we listened when the people talked of the Sales Tax. When the people of Malambo Constituency said that they were not consulted, we realised that there must have been a problem in communication from the Department of National Parks and Wildlife (DNPW). We listened. That is the point I am trying to put across. We are a listening Government.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam Speaker, being a listening Government, we will do what is in the best interest of our people. Instead of proposing such alternative budgets that have the Patriotic Front (PF) in them such as this document – In our Budgets, the PF Government did not mention the United Party for National Development (UPND), but the UPND refers to the PF in its Budgets.

 

Hon. Government Members: How many times?

 

Mr M. Zulu: A couple of times, I dare not count. One of the things that I do not agree with the UPND budget is this last statement in its conclusion which says:

 

“There is no shortage of intellect and ideas in the UPND camp so we will continue offering advice to the Government …”

 

Madam Speaker, this is the advice it is giving to the Government, and it is saying that there is no shortage of intellect in the UPND. I wonder if that statement is particularly true.

 

Laughter

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam Speaker, this document is so shameful that no reference has been made to it because of statements such as, “there is no shortage of intellect in the UPND.” With that said, I will lay this on the Table.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu laid the document on the Table.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr M. Zulu: Madam Speaker, in concluding, I have chosen to lay the document on the Table because I suspect that it may be withdrawn from the net so that the people of Zambia do not see it. In this case, it should be properly publicised for all to see that there is actually no alternative budget, but lamentations of the UPND.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Evg. Shabula (Itezhi-tezhi): Madam Speaker, I thank you for having given me this opportunity to debate the 2020 National Budget. It is true that in the United Party for National Development (UPND), we have geniuses.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Evg. Shabula: Madam Speaker, in the UPND, we have men and women with high Intelligence Quotient (IQ).

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Evg. Shabula: As a teacher of economics, I want to teach people. Firstly, I want to deal with the Budget and will not veer from it. I am going to look at the 2019 and 2020 Budgets. I will not talk about anything else but the Budget. I have two documents in my hands here. I have the President’s Speech and the Budget, and I will marry the two. I would like to draw the attention of this House to the President’s Speech, on page 11, paragraphs 36, 37 and 38. In paragraph 36, the President said:

 

“Our economy has, in the recent past, faced some serious headwinds. The country registered a Gross Domestic Product (GDP) growth rate of 3.7 per cent as at the end of 2018. The growth rate for 2019 was earlier projected at around four per cent but is being revised downwards to about two per cent on account of adverse weather conditions which have affected the energy and agricultural sectors.”

 

Madam Speaker, this is dununa reverse.  In paragraph 37, the President said:

 

“Since 2015, when we experienced droughts that affected electricity generation, growth slowed down to an average of 3.5 per cent between 2015 and 2018 from an average of 6.4 per cent between 2011 and 2014. This slowdown was largely attributed to climate variabilities.”

 

Madam Speaker, in paragraph 38, he said:

 

“To have meaningful impact on the high poverty levels in the country, we must grow the economy at a minimum rate of seven per cent per annum.”

 

Interruptions

 

Evg. Shabula: Madam Speaker, I urge my hon. Colleagues to please listen.

 

Madam, I am now taking the House to the Budget. I will marry the 2020 Budget with the 2019 Budget. I want to show the House where we have come from with the Patriotic Front (PF) so that even when my hon. Colleagues on your right say whatever they want to say, they must refer to this page and this is page 11 of the President’s Speech.

 

Madam Speaker, the PF Government came to power in 2011, and between 2011 and 2014, the Gross Domestic Product (GDP) was at 7 per cent or 6.4 per cent, somewhere there. Between 2015 and 2018, it was 3.5 per cent. What does this mean? It means that the growth rate reduced. The GDP did not grow but went down from 6.4 per cent to 3.5 per cent. The economy went down. In 2018, the GDP growth rate went to 3.7 per cent. It grew a bit by 2 per cent, but could not be sustained.

 

Madam Speaker, in the first part of 2019, I hope the people on the right are listening, the GDP growth rate was projected at 4 per cent. Then in 2019, this same year, it came down from 4 per cent projection to 2 per cent, and it was revised. Now, move with me. The GDP growth rate has dropped from 7 per cent to 2 per cent. I would like my hon. Colleagues in the PF to tell me whether this is an improvement or it is dununa reverse.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Dununa reverse!

 

Evg. Shabula: Madam, I want to see someone from the PF who has done arithmetic. This is not even calculus or mathematics, but arithmetic.

 

Laughter

 

Evg.  Shabula: We came from 7 per cent to 2 per cent GDP growth rate. Are we progressing? No! In the 2020 Budget, it is projected that the GDP will grow by 3 per cent in 2020. Come on men!

 

Laughter

 

Evg. Shabula: The hon. Minister of Finance is projecting 3 per cent growth from 2 per cent.

 

Madam Speaker, I have run companies before. There is no way you can sit and begin to plan your projection at 1 per cent growth, unless you have gone bananas.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear! Bananas!

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member, withdraw the phrase “gone bananas.”

 

Evg. Shabula: It means that something has gone wrong. So, if this Government is planning to grow the economy by 1 per cent GDP growth next year, we are going nowhere.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

The hon. Member must withdraw the phrase “gone bananas.”

 

Evg. Shabula: Madam Speaker, I withdraw the phrase “gone bananas” and replace it with “something has gone wrong.” That is one part.

 

Madam, let me make comparisons so that people who know arithmetic can argue using figures because figures do not lie.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear! Numbers do not lie.

 

Evg. Shabula: Now, let us get back to figures, men!

 

Laughter

 

Hon. UPND Member: Hear, hear!

 

Evg. Shabula: Madam Speaker, this Budget for 2020 is divided in ten parts. For those who are following me, I am on page 17. I am looking at the heading “2020 Expenditure by Functions of Government. In 2020, “General Public Services” has been allocated 41.6 per cent of the Budget, while in the 2019 Budget, it was 36.0 per cent of the Budget. In other words, this function has been adjusted upwards by 5 per cent, which is good, but not very good. The function “Economic Affairs” has been given K21,833,351,543, which represents 20.6 per cent of the 2020 Budget. In 2019, this function was 23.8 per cent of the Budget. Are we progressing? This is a reduction, and therefore, we are not progressing.

 

Hon. Government Members: We are!

 

Evg. Shabula: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister of Finance is not moving forward, and he knows this. He is going backwards, dununa reverse. This is what is happening, and no one can refute this because the figures are here, unless you went to a wrong school with a wrong teacher.

 

Laughter

 

Evg. Shabula: Madam Speaker, the function “Education,” has been given K13,121,648,466, which is 12.4 per cent of the 2020 Budget. In 2019, it was allocated 15.3 per cent of the Budget.  Come on men! Are we progressing with these friends of ours? People of Zambia, as you are listening, are you progressing with the PF?

 

Hon. UPND Members: No!

 

Laughter

 

Hon. Government Member: Yes!

 

Evg. Shabula: We are going down. We are digressing. This means that children in schools will continue sitting on the floor. Those teachers who have not been paid will continue not being paid. Whatever is happening will continue because of this reduction.

 

Madam Speaker, let me move to health. The hon. Minister has allocated K9,366,591,584, which is 8.8 per cent of the 2020 Budget. In 2019, this function was 9.3 per cent of the 2019 Budget. Come on! Are we progressing here?

 

Hon. UPND Members: No!

 

Evg. Shabula: I would like to see one intelligent person who is going to refute these figures and come up with something different. If it is the same figures the Government has failed.

 

Madam, let me look at the function “Defence.”In the 2020 Budget, it has been allocated K6,526,391,423. In 2019, its allocation is K5,072,431,839. The Government has increased the allocation to this function, yet we are not at war. We are not fighting anybody. Our enemy number one now is climate change, HIV/AIDS, poverty and ignorance. Our public enemy number one is the PF Government.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear! Hammer!

 

Interruptions

 

Evg. Shabula: Let me look at the function “Public Order and Safety.” Look at me while I am talking. This year, 2019, it was 3.3 per cent of the Budget, but in 2020, it is 3.8 per cent of the Budget. It has been increased, when allocations to education and health have been reduced.  There is an increase in the allocation of funds to acquire pepper sprays and guns. Who is the Government fighting?

 

Mr Kampyongo: On a point of order, Madam.

 

Hon. UPND Member: Awe!

 

Evg. Shabula: Who are we fighting? There is no war –

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Mr Kampyongo: Madam Speaker, indeed, our time will come to respond to these matters that are being raised on the Floor by various debaters. As you say, we must react contemporaneously to some of these misleading statements.

 

Madam, the hon. Bling, bling pastor –

 

Interruptions

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Can the Hon. Minister of Home Affairs withdraw those words.

 

Mr Kampyongo: Madam Speaker, I withdraw the words “Bling, bling looking.” Is the hon. Member of Parliament for Itezhi-tezhi who is making reference to the Ministry of Defence and public order, aware that even preacher men like him take-off leaving Bibles behind when there is public disorder in any country?

 

Laughter

 

Mr Kampyongo: Is he in order, first of all, to refer to us as “enemy number one,” when we are looking after the –

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Business was suspended from 1810 hours until 1830 hours.

 

[MADAM FIRST DEPUTY SPEAKER in the Chair]

 

Mr Kampyongo: Madam Speaker, when business was suspended, I had just reluctantly risen on a point of order on the hon. Member for Itezhi-tezhi as he was debating on the Floor of the House.

 

Madam Speaker, earlier in the afternoon, we had what were seemingly alternative lamentations on the Budget laid on the Table and we were expecting that the hon. Member debating on the Floor would make reference to the document. However, my concern, like I said, is that we are ready to respond and react to some of the debates as we come to debate our aligned ministerial budgets.

 

What I could not allow to pass while I was seated here was the seemingly trivial way that the hon. Member who was on the Floor was trying to debate matters of national security. I was saying that countries where there is disorder and peace has been thrown to the wind and everything else, it does not matter whether one is a preacher man because they run without Bibles. We keep refugees who can recount very well for what happens when there is disorder.

 

Madam Speaker, we are a nation with a very reliable Commander-in-Chief who has demonstrated that he is not a coward because he can be with his men when it matters most, including eating with them and showing them the survival skills. Is he in order –

 

Interruptions

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members on my left!

 

You may continue, hon. Minister, and state your point of order.

 

Mr Kampyongo: Madam Speaker, as I was saying this country has the privilege of having a Commander-in-Chief who is reliable, committed, dependable and can be with his men in uniform when it matters most. It is not for the faint-hearted or cowards.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: The word ‘cowards’ is unparliamentary. Can you state your point of order, hon. Minister.

 

Mr Kampyongo: Is the hon. Member of Parliament for Itezhi-tezhi, who I regard very well in high esteem and who is looking nice, in order to trivialise matters of national security in the manner he was referring to the Ministry of Defence and the public order maintenance? He knows that we have to work with the available resources by ensuring that this country remains at peace and tranquil, as it has been known for on the continent of Africa. I seek your serious ruling, Madam.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: My serious ruling is that the hon. Minister of Home Affairs will have an opportunity to articulate issues of national security.

 

Could the hon. Member for Itezhi-tezhi continue. please.

 

Evg. Shabula: Madam Speaker, I am grateful for giving me this opportunity. I just wanted to bring it to the attention of the hon. Minister that this man he is seeing here is a trained soldier.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Evg. Shabula: He has never on the parade square –

 

Interruptions

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Debate the Motion on the Floor.

 

Evg. Shabula: He is very trained.

 

Laughter

 

Evg. Shabula: Madam Speaker, regarding social protection as of 2019, it was given 2.5 per cent of the Budget and 2020, was allocated 2.4 per cent. This is a reduction. Everything is going down until we hit rock-bottom.

 

Environmental protection is at 0.1 per cent, 2020, it is at 0.6 per cent of the Budget. This is where you find climate change and many other things. What does this mean? It means that we will not be able to achieve our goals. Recreation, culture and religion were at 0.3 per cent in 2019 and 2020, they are at 0.4 per cent, which is an increment by 1 per cent.

 

Madam Speaker, as I conclude, the Budget of the Patriotic Front (PF) –

 

Interruptions

 

Evg. Shabula: No, I am coming to the United Party for National Development (UPND).

 

 The way the Budget of the PF is portrayed and the figures in the Budget, for a lay person who does not understand figures, they will stand up and jump and begin to relate thinking that all is well. Right now, if I am to ask these hon. Ministers the question that out of the 2019 Budget, how much have they been given in the ministries? Many of them have not even gotten 25 per cent of their ministry’s allocation. They have received nothing.

 

That is why all the questions that we ask each time in this House, the answer that is given will always be “when funds will be available”. The reason is because there is no money. The reason is that these programmes have not been planned for. The reason is that is Budget is meant to find money to pay back debts. This is not for us as a nation to develop. Only very few people are going to develop and it is those who have the money. For a common Zambian, this Budget will not do anything.

 

Madam, I stood here in 2016 talking about the Budget and somebody told me that it was just fresh air. In 2017, I said the same about the Budget that it would not achieve anything. In 2018, I said nothing. This year, I am still saying in 2020, the hon. Minister of Finance will not achieve anything.

 

Mr Ngulube: Question!

 

Evg. Shabula: If he will achieve anything, then it will be a serious miracle. Under this Government, there is nothing. Now, I think it is better that I cry again. It is better I cry for the people of Zambia. People should have matched to Parliament dressed in black. This economy is bad.

 

Evg. Shabula cried.

 

Laughter

 

Evg. Shabula: We cannot allow this Government to go in the way it is going. The PF Government –

 

Interruptions

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member, resume your seat.

 

I know that you all have different styles of debating, but certainly crying is not expected of an hon. Member. What is expected is for the hon. Members to offer solutions.

 

Hon. Member for Itezhi-tezhi, please continue with your debate.

 

Evg. Shabula: Madam Speaker, as I end my debate, I would like to say that the Ministry of Gender is very important at this time in this country. It is probably more important than climate change because the lives of all the Zambians begin with her ministry (pointing at the hon. Minister). I want to urge the hon. Minister of Gender to make sure that her ministry is given money.

 

Now, how do I end? I will end this way; I would like to give hope to the people of Zambia that in this country there is a party which is …

 

Mr Livune: That is right!

 

Evg. Shabula: … in waiting and will see to it the present party, which is the PF crashes. UPND is on the move and it is coming. It is not joking! It is unstoppable! HH will fix it! UPND will fix it! The people of Zambia will fix it but we must fix PF first!

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Hon. Government Members: Question

 

Evg. Shabula: I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

 

Hon. Government Members: Question!

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Mung’andu (Chama South): Madam Speaker, I thank you for according me this opportunity to debate on the Motion which is on the Floor of the House. I must mention that in my debate, I will be looking at particularly expenditures by functions of the Government, which a number of my hon. Colleagues have been referring to.

 

Madam, general public services consume about 41.6 per cent of the Budget. What is under these general public services are items such as the external and domestic debt, dismantling of arrears and the Local Government Equalisation Fund (LGEF). That is where one will also find the Sinking Fund, Constituency Development Fund (CDF) and many others.

 

Madam Speaker, as regards the domestic debt, the hon. Minister of Finance was very clear that the 2020 Budget will seek to address the dismantling of domestic debt. This is a commendable move by our working Government.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mung’andu: In case our hon. Colleagues do not understand the implication of this decision, the Government has many suppliers of goods and services. The hon. Minister emphasised that there are citizens who have supplied goods and services to the Government and have not been paid. A number of them are facing closures, especially those who had borrowed from financial institutions. Literally, businesses have gone down. Therefore, to encourage and help such businesses to grow and in turn create a taxable base for the Government, there is need for the Government to prioritise the dismantling of these domestic arrears in terms of debt. This simply means that the Government will have the much needed liquidity or velocity of money. The rate at which money will be exchanging hands will be higher.

 

Madam Speaker, I think that if one cannot agree with this, then he/she must be suffering from political schizophrenia.

 

Mr Chabi: What is that?

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

May the hon. Member, repeat that.

 

Mr Mung’andu: I said that if one cannot agree with such an idea, he/she may be suffering from political schizophrenia. Let me explain the word ‘schizophrenia,’ for the benefit of my hon. Colleagues on the left.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Hon. UPND Members: Aah!

 

Mr Mung’andu: These are people who –

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Please, explain for the House to understand.

 

Mr Mung’andu: Madam Speaker, for the House and the hon. Member for Chipili –

 

Mr Chabi: Aah!

 

Laughter

 

Mr Mung’andu: … political schizophrenia –

 

Mr Chabi: On a point of order, Madam.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

The hon. Member for Chama South will avoid mentioning his hon. Colleagues. Resume your seat, hon. Member for Chipili.

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Chabi: Nalamuma ine uyu!

 

Laughter

 

Interruptions

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member for Chama South, focus on your debate and you may continue, please.

 

Mr Mung’andu: Madam Speaker, a political schizophrenia is someone who does not believe in reality. If one does not believe in reality, then he/she suffers from schizophrenia.

 

Madam, the Patriotic Front (PF) Government has prioritised the dismantling of the domestic debt. It is a pity that the hon. Member of Parliament for Liuwa is not in the House. I say so because I heard him talk about the domestic debt. The PF Government has prioritised to liquidate this historical debt.

 

Hon. UPND Members: No!

 

Mr Kambita: You are not a Minister!

 

Mr Mung’andu: I am here to give facts. This afternoon, there are people protesting at the Ministry of Justice. These are retirees who retired in 2007 but who was the hon. Minister of Finance in 2007?

 

Hon. UPND Members: Question!

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Mung’andu: Someone was lamenting that the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) Government left a better economy. However, they left these retirees unpaid, and if the economy was doing well then, why did they not pay them? I want answers. It is unfortunate, as I said earlier that the hon. Member who was talking about this issue is not in the House. We are here to debate the budget the way it was presented.

 

Ms Mulenga: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mung’andu: The fact that the hon. Minister has indicated that the 2020, Budget will prioritise the dismantling of the domestic debt, it is a commendable and progressive idea which has to be supported by all well-meaning Zambians.

 

Hon. Kambita: Question!

 

Mr Mung’andu: Madam Speaker, there is an increase on the public order and safety, particularly under Defence. It is only in this country where we take the peace that we have been enjoying for granted. This peace that we are enjoying as country is coming at a cost. I heard my hon. Colleagues from your left, particularly, from the UPND trying to trivialise the budget line to Defence. It is unfortunate. As hon. Members, we would not be in this House debating or arguing, if there was no peace in the country. In addition, Zambia is part of the global village. In other countries, our colleagues are investing in defence technology and we cannot remain behind. If anything, in both the developed and the least developed countries, most of the budget line goes to Defence. That is, 20 per cent or 30 per cent. I urge my hon. Colleagues to check.

 

Madam, I also heard some hon. Colleagues arguing that 0.6 per cent has been allocated to environmental protection. Further, they are questioning why the PF Government is referring to the climatic conditions as the reasons for the many challenges that the country is facing and why it has allocated 0.6 per cent.

 

Madam Speaker, my understanding is different probably because I am privileged to be on the right of this House.

 

Hon. Opposition Members: Is that a privilege?

 

Mr Mung’andu: It is! It is a privilege from the people of Zambia. I know that I will continue being here maybe, for the next 100 years.

 

Hon. Government Members:  Hear, hear!

 

Hon. Opposition Members: How?

 

Mr Mung’andu: Madam Speaker, regarding the issue of climate, the Government has indicated that it is working in clusters. Therefore, the budget line under public order, general public services or health, it means that there is an embedment of environment protection and climate resilience activities. This is just a clarification because I have looked at how the budget has been presented and what is happening except that under the environment protection heading, the activity and function under it is standing in isolation.

 

Madam, regarding health, there is an emphasis on infrastructure development. Again, on this issue, I heard some of our hon. Colleagues giving what I would call very unrealistic examples about the international reserves and the debt that has been accumulating. Others were saying that we should have been investing in this and that.

 

Madam, with regard to the emphasis on infrastructure, health is not the only sector where much emphasis has been placed. Other sectors such as environmental protection and economic affairs also have emphasis on infrastructure. Under energy, the budget shows that power infrastructure has the highest percentage. The health infrastructure project has also received the highest allocation. Again, under social protection, the Public Service Pension Fund (PSPF) has also received the highest allocation. What does this mean? It means that Zambia uses the pension funds to invest in infrastructure. It is not only in Zambia but many other countries as well.

 

Madam Speaker, under the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) regime, Zambia kept its reserves and import cover ratios extremely high. Did that translate into tangible benefactions to the people, particularly those in the rural areas? The answer is no. What has the PF Government done? It has gotten the resources, including the much talked about “borrowed funds” and put it into the construction of roads.

 

Madam Speaker, I have always challenged my hon. Colleagues in this House who have never said that they need feeder roads in their constituencies? Who has never said that they need communications towers? Therefore, Zambians should judge us by what we are asking for in this House. Where do they expect the money for the clinics which they are crying for, to come from?

 

Madam Speaker, the people of Chama South are in need of Communication Towers, feeder roads, health posts and school infrastructure. I know that this is what the people of the Southern Province, the Western Province or the North Western Province want. In short, this is what all the people want. In addition, this is what the PF Government has been delivering for a long time.                    

 

Madam Speaker, let us face reality. This country had been deteriorating for a long time in terms of infrastructure. People had to cover long distances to access health facilities. President Edgar Lungu, is reversing that trend. PF Government is providing medical services. Probably by 2028/2030, people will not be covering a distance of 2 km or 3 km in order to access medical services in this country. This is what is being emphasised in this Budget. On behalf of the people of Chama South Constituency, I am very grateful for the suggestions and highlights that have been projected in this Budget. Therefore, I support it.

 

Madam Speaker, the President talked about the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) in his speech, and this programme was echoed by the hon. Minister of Finance in his Budget Speech. Further, the hon. Minister of Finance said that the financial sector will be undergoing transformation. As a country, we want to go towards a paperless, electronic financial system, as the hon. Minister mentioned in this Budget. This will help the country to reduce the risks that are attached to manual financial transactions. These are the good, well-meaning proposals in the Budget.

 

Madam Speaker, I have also heard arguments that the higher allocation particularly to the public order and safety is an indication of dictatorship, but that is far from it. This is an indication that there is need to preserve and protect both private and public investment. If someone wants to be funny and to disturb my peace, he needs to be smoked-out wherever he is hiding so that he can face –

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order! 

 

Hon. Member for Chama South, you have gone in a very different and strange direction. Are you still discussing the Budget? Bear that in mind and continue with your debate.

 

Mr Mung’andu: Madam Speaker, I thank you for that guidance.

 

Madam, the point I was trying to emphasise is that to equate such a good budget line to dictatorship is extremely unfair. In my understanding, a dictator is someone who would order his followers not to agree with something that is of public interest, such as the amendment to the Constitution. Such a person is a dictator.       

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mung’andu: Madam Speaker, for example, it is my duty to make laws. How can someone who has never been a ward chairperson, councillor or branch chairperson order me not to come and make laws? Such a person is a dictator. He is not someone who wants to preserve public peace and order.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mung’andu: Madam, in conclusion, regarding the dismantling of domestic debt and the money that has been set aside for it, I urge my hon. Colleagues to commend this Government for that move.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mung’andu: As I have said, this debt has been accumulating from 2007. When Hon. Dr Musokotwane was the hon. Minister of Finance, he did not dismantle it.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member for Chama South, resume your seat.

 

I guided before that you cannot debate your hon. Colleagues in that manner.

 

You may continue with your debate.

 

Mr Mung’andu: Madam Speaker, thank you.

 

Madam, my appeal to Zambians is to critically look at what is going on. Are they not happy that this Government is undertaking the Lusaka Decongestion Road Project, for example, which is widening our roads? If you have been a Lusaka resident like me, you know that it used to take us almost two hours to reach town centre from Chelston or Chilenje, but now, our city is changing. Are Zambians in rural areas not happy that their feeder roads are being worked on? Are they not happy that they have telecommunication infrastructure, they are receiving the much needed health posts and the social cash transfer, particularly targeting the disabled, for the first time? Are they not happy?

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Mung’andu: These things and projects were never there. They have been proposed and implemented by His Excellency, the President, Mr Edgar Chagwa Lungu. If the answer to the question whether or not the people are happy is yes, they should continue with this working the PF Government.

 

Madam Speaker, contrary to the United Party for National Development (UPND), I would call its alternative budget, a mere speculation as it has no details, and 98 per cent of its ten-point plan was already implemented by the PF. In fact, probably 100 per cent has already been achieved.

 

Madam Speaker, time is against good ideas.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

The hon. Member’s time expired.

 

Laughter

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Michelo (Bweengwa): Madam Speaker, thank you for allowing me to debate the Budget Speech which was presented by our newly appointed hon. Minister of Finance, my elder brother, Hon. Bwalya Ng’andu. I congratulate him.

 

Mr Chabi: He is your father!

 

Mr Michelo: We are almost age mates. We are growing together.

 

Mr Mukosa: Question!

 

Mr Michelo: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister of Finance has to be congratulated for presenting a few good ideas in this Budget.

 

Hon. Government Members: Quality!

 

Mr Michelo: I remember quite well that in the last sitting, there was an hon. Minister on the Floor of this House who screamed and jumped while talking about the Sales Tax working for the people of Zambia. I congratulate the hon. Minister of Finance for diverting from that route, and I thank him.

 

Madam, however, I am scared and very worried that the hon. Minister of Finance may get spoiled if he associates himself with people with thin minds. I do not think this Budget will work.

 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

 

Ms Mulenga: People with thin minds?

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member for Bweengwa, what did you say? Can you repeat that?

 

Mr Michelo: Madam Speaker, what I was trying to say is that I am a bit scared for the hon. Minister of Finance if associates himself with people who do not really mean well for this country. This Budget Speech is another eighth gamble speech which could backfire and turn out to lead to the downfall of President Edgar Chagwa Lungu.

 

Mr Mutale: On a point of order, Madam.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Mr Mutale: Madam Speaker, thank you very much for according me a chance to rise on a very serious point of order.

 

Madam, the decorum of this House must always be respected and I believe that all hon. Members of Parliament who come to this House are called honourable. The hon. Member on the Floor of the House debating right now in his statement to the hon. Minister of Finance said that the he should not associate himself with people of thin minds.

 

Madam, many are the times that you have told us to debate with facts and to ensure that what we say here should be true and reflect the true picture of what is happening. Is the hon. Member of Parliament debating in order to demean the capacity of interaction of the hon. Minister of Finance? I seek your serious ruling.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Interruptions

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

My ruling is that yes, indeed, the statement that the hon. Minister of Finance must not associate with people of thin minds actually kept me wondering, but when I asked the hon. Member for Bweengwa to repeat it, he stated differently.

 

Hon. Government Members: He lied!

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Yes, and I will use this point of order to give counsel.

 

Hon. Members, you are all here because you have been chosen out of the many millions of Zambians to come and represent them in this House. In order for you to effectively represent the people of Zambia, you must ensure that you uphold the dignity of the House. This is the only Parliament that we have in the country and the citizens are looking up to us to see if, indeed, they made the right decision to send each one of you to this House. When you stand to debate, remember that you are representing those people that sent you to this House and your language should reflect that. As presiding officers, we do constantly remind you to ensure that there is mutual respect, if we are going to be relevant and deserve that opportunity given to us.

 

 Hon. Member for Bweengwa, if you have noticed, whenever you stand to debate, I sit on the edge of the chair …

 

Laughter

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: … because I know that I will constantly be interjecting your debate.

 

Hon. Government Members: Shame!

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Hon. Member for Bweengwa, let me sit back and enjoy your debate as I listen to your contribution to the Motion on the Floor. Let us try now.

 

May the hon. Member continue, please.

 

Mr Michelo: Madam Speaker, you are going to enjoy this time around.

 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

 

Laughter

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member for Bweengwa, I am looking forward to enjoying your debate tomorrow.

 

(Debate adjourned)

 

Dr Ng'andu: Madam Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

 

Hon. Members: Aah!

 

Mr Lubinda: No, no, tomorrow.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

 

It is not for you to do that. Please resume your seat.

 

Laughter

 

Dr Ng'andu: Madam Speaker, debate will be resumed tomorrow.

 

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Hon. Minister of Finance, do not worry, you will get there. We all had to learn.

 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

 

ADJOURNMENT

 

The Chief Whip and Acting Leader of Government Business in the House (Mr Mundubile): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

 

Question put and agreed to.

 

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The House adjourned at 1912 hours until 1430 hours on Thursday, 3^rd October, 2019.

 

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