DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE SECOND SESSION OF THE ELEVENTH ASSEMBLY

Wednesday, 3rd July, 2013

The House met at 1430 hours

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

_____   

ANNOUNCEMENT BY MR SPEAKER

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members, I am pleased to inform the House that the Inter-Parliamentary Games between the National Assembly of Zambia and the National Assembly of Malawi eventually took place on Sunday, 30th June, 2013. As earlier announced, the games took place at the Olympic Youth Development Centre, popularly known as the OYDC. 

I am pleased to inform the House that our teams in the three disciplines, chess, netball and football, won all the games. 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: The results were as follows:

Discipline    Zambia     Malawi

Chess    3    1

Netball     17    15

Football    2    1

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Let me seize this opportunity to place on record my gratitude to all the hon. Members who participated in the three games.

 Further, I would also like to extend my thanks and gratitude to all the hon. Members and staff for their moral support without which, I suppose, victory would have eluded us. The close margin of the results is clear evidence of how competitive the games were. 

Finally, I wish to extend my appreciation to the Clerk of the National Assembly and her staff for the excellent co-ordination and services rendered during the sporting event. I must also intimate that, over dinner, I had a discussion with my counterpart. We both agreed on the need to expand the sport disciplines to include boxing. 

Laughter

Mr Speaker: I am sure that we have very good candidates.

I thank you. 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

 _____ 

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

ZAMBIAN FOOTBALLERS BASED IN EUROPE

641. Mr Chungu (Luanshya) asked the Minister of Youth and Sport:

(a)    how many Zambian footballers were based in Europe as of March, 2013; and

(b)    what the names of the players and the clubs they played for were. 

The Deputy Minister of Youth and Sport (Mr Miyutu): Mr Speaker, as of March, 2013, there were a total of seventeen players playing in eleven different countries in Europe and registered with the Football Association of Zambia (FAZ). 

Mr Speaker, the names of the footballers, clubs for which they play and countries in which they are based are as follows:

Name    Club    Country
    
Rodgers Kola    KAA Gent FC    Belgium
Marvin Suwilanji    Unattached    Denmark
Emmanuel Mayuka    Southampton FC    England
Mohammed Fawaz    Leeds United    England
Anastasios Calavrias    Queens Park Rangers FC        England
Loveday Mumbuluma    Chelmsford City        England
Collins Handongwe    Cardiff City        England
William Njovu    Hapoel Be’er Sheva        Israel
Luciano Pasquini    Empoli Calcio IM Academy        Italy
Jacob Mulenga    FC Utrecht    Netherlands
Emmanuel Mbola    FC Porto    Portugal
Fwayo Tembo    Astra Giurgiu FC    Romania
Chisamba Lungu    FC Ural Sverdlovsk Oblast    Russia
Anthony Banda    Pontevedr    Spain
Constaninos Iaonou    Celta Vigo    Spain
Edwin Phiri    FC Trollhattan    Sweden
Boyd Mwila     FC Trollhattan    Sweden
        
Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Chungu: Mr Speaker, out of the seventeen names that the hon. Minister has mentioned, only five have, so far, been featured in the Zambia National Football Team, both at senior and junior levels. What has happened to the rest of the players? Are they not monitored so that they too can be featured in the Zambia National Football Team?

Mr Miyutu: Mr Speaker, the data before me is current. Out of the seventeen players, ten play with the Zambia National Soccer Team while the remaining seven are under twenty. I can even give a bonus answer by naming those who are currently drafted in the national football team.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kalila (Lukulu East): Mr Speaker, seventeen is quite a low number to play in quality leagues because the more players we have out there, the better for our team. This is because they will be exposed to quality training, coaches and facilities. I would like to find out what deliberate interventions the ministry intends to put in place to increase the number of boys playing in quality European Leagues.

Mr Miyutu: Mr Speaker, the Government is willing to attract all the potential players out there. It should be borne in mind that sport, first of all, works on voluntary minds. Whatever efforts the Government puts in must fall on willing minds. FAZ, the body which is mandated with the responsibility of running football in Zambia, has put up measures to attract Zambians who are outside the country to come and play for their mother country.

Sir, there are not so many tangible measures that we can point at, but fruits are there to show. For instance, in the Under Twenty National Team, we have a player who is based in Belgium. 

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has indicated that one of the players, plays football in Israel, and yet the question by Hon. Chungu sought to find out how many footballers are based in Europe. From a geographical perspective, I would like to find out when Israel moved to Europe.

Laughter

Mr Miyutu: Mr Speaker, as far as the sport fraternity in Zambia is concerned, …

Hon. Nkombo interjected

Mr Speaker: Order!

You want an answer.

Mr Miyutu: … Israel falls under the European Football League. 

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr L. J. Ngoma (Sinda): Mr Speaker, I am wondering if the hon. Minister is following these questions properly. In responding to the question by the hon. Member of Parliament for Lukulu East Constituency, he took us in a wrong direction. I would, therefore, like to reiterate the question by paraphrasing it as: What is the Government doing to increase the number of professional players playing in the European League as well as other international leagues? Seventeen Zambian footballers playing in other leagues is too small a number for us to be content with.

Mr Miyutu: Mr Speaker, the Government is here to create a conducive environment for the development of sport in this country. It is a fact that it has always been calling upon all well-wishers and co-operating partners to help improve sports in the country. It is not only the Government’s duty to see to it that players are exposed to international football, but also stakeholders have an important role to play in ensuring that they create an enabling environment for players to play in international football leagues.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Speaker, out of the seventeen players the hon. Minister has named, how many are from the rural areas of Zambia like Washishi?

Mr Miyutu: Mr Speaker, that is a new question. The hon. Member should raise that as a Question.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

CIVIL SOCIETY ORGANISATIONS’ FUNDING

642. Mr Matafwali (Bangweulu) asked the Minister of Health:

(a)    how many civil society rganisations (CSOs) received funds from the Government from January, 2010, to January, 2013, for sensitisation of the public on the dangers of cancer and diabetes diseases;

(b)    what the names of the CSOs, if any, were; and 

(c)    if none, why.

The Deputy Minister of Health (Dr Chikusu): Mr Speaker, …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! Order!

Dr Chikusu: … the Ministry of Health has signed a memorandum of understanding (MoU) with faith-based CSOs through the Churches Health Association of Zambia (CHAZ), which co-ordinates the activities of the church-based organisations. From January, 2010, to January, 2013, the Government disbursed a total of K27, 615,412.33 to implement various health programmes, including the sensitisation of the public on the dangers of cancer and diabetes diseases. In addition to the CHAZ programmes, the Government also released K980,569 to the non-governmental organisations (NGOs) in the health sector for similar programmes.

Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Health has been collaborating with CHAZ, the Breakthrough Cancer Trust, Diabetes Association of Zambia, Cancer Association of Zambia and Kayula Foundation in conducting public awareness on cancer and diabetes. 

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Ng’onga (Kaputa): Mr Speaker, how much effort is being put in sensitising the rural communities, especially in areas like Kaputa, on the dangers of cancer and diabetes? Where I come from, anybody suffering from these diseases is considered to be bewitched by others.

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, that is a relevant question because it is important that we sensitise the people about the dangers of these diseases and how to contain them. CHAZ has a network of various health facilities and its programmes are well-known for being effective at various community levels. The other aspect is that the district medical officers carry out certain programmes which are initiated by the ministry headquarters.

I thank you, Mr Speaker. 

Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo (Mumbwa): Mr Speaker, what mechanisms have been put in place to ensure that the CSOs do not overcrowd in certain places thereby neglecting to partner with the Ministry of Health in others?

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, normally, the CSOs have their own terms of reference but, as a ministry, we operate through the MoU with CHAZ which basically covers a relatively large area in the country. If there are places that are not covered within that confine, we tend to encourage the CSOs to reach these areas as much as possible. Even those that have not partnered with the ministry are encouraged to go in that direction.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Dr Kaingu (Mwandi): Mr Speaker, the First Lady is doing very well in this regard. How much of the K1.5 million appropriated by this House to her office has been used?

The Minister of Health (Dr Kasonde): Mr Speaker, I think the hon. Member is distinguishing himself for red herrings.

Laughter

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, the issue of budget allocation and expenditure was the subject of discussion in this very House. How is it that I am, therefore, requested, as the hon. Minister of Health, …

Dr Kaingu: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: No, no.

Dr Kasonde: … to begin analysing how much of that amount was spent on health? The Office of the First Lady has got an agenda of its own, using the resources that were allocated. Our point of confluence is the fact that our cancer programme is a national issue and the participants in this national effort are the Ministry of Health, Ministry of Community Development, Mother and Child Health and, of course, the Office of the First Lady. I do not think I can go beyond that in answering that question.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mbewe (Chadiza): Mr Speaker, I heard the hon. Minister say …

Dr Kaingu: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Dr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, I asked a very clear question …

Interruptions 

Dr Kaingu: … and I do not think it required such a reply from the hon. Minister. I was very clear that K1.5 million was appropriated by this House …

Mr Speaker: What is the point of order?

Dr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister in order to make such a disparaging remark on the good hon. Member for Parliament for Mwandi, who is the vice-president …

Hon. PF Members: Question!

Dr Kaingu: … of a very big party?

Laughter 

Dr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, if you are going to encourage insults here, we are capable of insulting as well. Is the hon. Minister in order to insult me?

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: My ruling is very simple. The hon. Minister of Health has neither disparaged the hon. Member for Mwandi nor has he insulted. I followed him very clearly and none of his words were insults. He responded in conformity with his style of responses, which is well-known.

Continue, hon. Member for Chadiza.

Laughter

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, I heard the hon. Minister clearly say that the CSOs and some NGOs receive money from the Government. If they have any other sources of funding, he has not disclosed. Therefore, is this money which goes to the CSOs and NGOs audited? If it is, who does the audits? If not, why not?

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, all expenditure incurred by the Ministry of Health is audited. The issue of whether this expenditure was on the CSOs, traditional healers or on any other organisation only arises in the context of the auditing of the expenditure of the Ministry of Health. This has been done, is being done and will continue to be done.

I thank you, Sir.

COPPER AND GOLD PRODUCTION AT KANSANSHI MINE

643. Mr Ng’onga asked the Minister of Mines, Energy and Water Development how many tonnes of copper and gold the Kansanshi Mining Plc produced in 2011.

The Deputy Minister of Mines, Energy and Water Development (Mr Musukwa): Mr Speaker, Kansanshi Mining Plc produced 244,604 tonnes of copper and 3.56 tonnes of gold in 2011.

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

Mr Ng’onga: Mr Speaker, what was the grade of the copper that was exported, if the answer is available?

Mr Speaker: Hon. Minister, you may answer, if the answer is available.

Mr Musukwa: Mr Speaker, the answer is available. The grade of the copper and gold which was produced at Kansanshi Mining Plc varied depending on the resource base. Principally, it ranged from 0.3 to 6 per cent and beyond, where we have a good base.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

NCHELENGE MEDICAL STAFF

644.     Mr Mpundu (Nchelenge) asked the Minister of Health when the Government would send more qualified medical staff to the health facilities in the following wards in Nchelenge Parliamentary Constituency:

(a)    Shabo;

(b)    Mulwe;

(c)    Kasamba;

(d)    Chisenga;

(e)    Kilwa;

(f)    Kashikishi;

(g)    Chilongo; and

(h)    Nchelenge.

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, the filling of positions to reduce the variance between the approved establishment and staff in post at Shabo, Mulwe, Kasamba, Chisenga, Kilwa, Kashikishi, Chilongo and Nchelenge in Nchelenge Parliamentary Constituency and, indeed, in all health facilities countrywide is being done in phases. The Government sets aside funds in the National Budget for the recruitment of health workers each year. This year, it has set aside K31.5 million for recruitment of health workers. It is expected that, through this exercise, more health workers will be sent to health facilities in Nchelenge Parliamentary Constituency. 

Mr Speaker, in fact, the update is that, under Phase I, the recruitment of June, 2013, has posted four registered nurses and one environmental health technologist to Nchelenge Parliamentary Constituency. These officers are expected to report within three months.

Further, the Government, through the Ministry of Community Development, Mother and Child Health, in Phase II, will also recruit and post fifteen health workers within the course of September, 2013.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.{mospagebreak}

STREET LIGHTING AND ROAD TARRING IN NCHELENGE

645.     Mr Mpundu asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing:

(a)    when the Government would tar the townships roads in Nchelenge District; and

(b)    when street lights would be installed in the following areas:

(i)    Nchelenge Boma;

(ii)    Kashikishi;

(iii)    Kabuta;

(iv)    Kambwali; and

(v)    Kasumpa.

The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr Kufuna): Mr Speaker, the Nchelenge Township Roads Rehabilitation Programme has been earmarked to be undertaken under the 2014 Annual Works Programme. 

Mr Speaker, the programme for street lighting for Nchelenge Boma, Kashikishi, Kabuta, Kambwali and Kasumpa areas will also be undertaken under the 2014 Annual Budget. The amount of work to be covered will be dependent on the funding levels that will be made for 2014.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

MARKETS AND BUS STATIONS ACT

646.     Mr Mushanga (Bwacha) asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing:

(a)    when the Government would implement the Markets and Bus Stations Act No. 7 of 2007;

(b)    what had caused the delay in the implementation of the Act; and

(c)    whether the Government had any plans to review the Act.

The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr N. Banda): Mr Speaker, the Market and Bus Stations Act No. 7 of 2007 is the current Act that is governing the operations of the markets and bus stations in the country. The Act is already in effect and, therefore, there is no delay in its implementation. As mentioned above, it is the Act that is being used in the market and bus stations sector. 

Mr Speaker, the Government has already prepared a Bill to review the current Act in order to improve and further harmonise it with other Acts relevant to the sector. The objective of the Bill is to amend the Markets and Bus Stations Act No.7 of 2007. This amendment is envisaged to wholly enhance and improve the overall management of markets and bus stations by the local authorities.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

  Mr Mwiimbu (Monze Central): Mr Speaker, first and foremost, I am happy to note that the hon. Member for Bwacha has not been injured by the Patriotic Front (PF) cadres in Kabwe.

Laughter

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that the Government has implemented the Act. I would like to find out whether a board has been constituted to manage the Lusaka Inter-City Bus Station and all the markets in Lusaka, including Nakadoli Market in Kitwe. If it has been constituted, who are the members?

Mr N. Banda: Mr Speaker, the Act which is being implemented has a provision which states that if there is no board, the council should take charge. This is the situation that is prevailing at the markets the hon. Member has asked about.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kakoma (Zambezi West): Mr Speaker, under this piece of legislation, the council is mandated to collect revenue from bus stops and markets. If this Act has already been operationalised, why is it that in Lusaka, particularly in Kaunda Square, the PF cadres have been fighting over money that they have been collecting from bus stops, according to stories that have been running in the media?

Mr N. Banda: Mr Speaker, I am reluctant to respond to hearsay. However, I wish to believe that the council is in charge.

I thank you, Sir.

Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister said that in the absence of boards, the councils are mandated to operate the markets and bus stations. Therefore, when will market boards be appointed because the law provides for their appointment?

Mr N. Banda: Mr Speaker, earlier in my answer, I indicated that the Government is reviewing the Act. Thus, currently, the councils are responsible for the markets and bus stations. It has been difficult to operationalise the Act. This is why the ministry has deemed it important to review it so that it can be capacitated to deal with issues such as that of the board, as the hon. Member has mentioned.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kalila: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has informed us that there are difficulties that the ministry is facing regarding operationalising this Act. I would like him to share some of those difficulties with us and what ills the review intends to address.

The Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mrs Kabanshi): Mr Speaker, I think that the difficulty that the hon. Member is talking about is the formation of the boards. The formation of the boards is a long process and its members need to be scrutinised. We need to make sure that everything is put in place for the boards to be effective.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Ng’onga: Mr Speaker, I just need a clarification from the hon. Minister. What plans does the ministry have for the markets in Lusaka, which I understand are run by co-operatives?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, in consultation with the people who are running the co-operative markets, the Government is trying to see how best it can take over these markets.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr L. J. Ngoma: Mr Speaker, why is this issue of appointing the boards taking long when the Act was passed on the Floor of this House a long time ago?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, I think that it is a very well-known fact the local government has not been operating the way it should have. Therefore, the Government is trying to revamp it and the way it runs the markets.

I thank you, Sir.

EXAMINATION CENTRES IN KAPUTA

647. Mr Ng’onga asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education:

(a)    how many General Certificate of Education (GCE) Examination Centres were in Kaputa District as of December, 2012;

(b)    how many candidates re-wrote their GCE examinations from 2010 to 2012, year by year;

(c)    what conditions had to  be met for a centre to qualify to be an examination
centre; and

(d)    when additional GCE examination centres would be opened in Kaputa
District.

The Deputy Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Mr Mabumba): Mr Speaker, before I answer the question, let me provide a context to this issue. Examinations in the Republic of Zambia are guided by a document called Guidelines for the Administration and Management of Examinations. This document was produced in 2012. Therefore, all aspects to do with the management of examinations …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, I was saying that all examinations that are conducted in the Republic of Zambia are guided by a document called Guidelines for the Administration and Management of Examinations which was produced in 2012.

Mr Speaker, there is only one centre in Kaputa District which is called Kaputa General Certificate of Education Centre.

Mr Speaker, the statistics for those who re-wrote THE GCE examinations from 2010, 2011 and 2012 are as follows:

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

There are too many on-going consultations and some of them are quite ferocious. If you wish to consult, please, you are at liberty to withdraw from the Chamber and conclude your discussions outside so that we can concentrate on our business here.

Continue, hon. Minister.

Mr Mabumba:

Year    2010    2011    2012

Males        178    226        175

Females    143    141        181

Total        321    367        356

Mr Speaker, the following are the requirements, as provided in the Guidelines for the Administration and Management of Examinations in this county:

(a)    the school must have an existing internal examination school centre;

(b)    the school must have, at least, two science laboratories;

(c)    the school must have a lockable strong room for the storage of examination papers;

(d)    the school must have adequate space for its candidates to write the examinations;

(e)    the examination centre should have a minimum number of fifteen candidates for it to have a centre number; and

(f)    the school should have adequate furniture for the candidates to sit during the examinations

Mr Speaker, at the moment, Kaputa Boarding Secondary School is under construction and the hon. Member is aware of that. Once construction has been completed, this school will become a GCE Centre for Kaputa District.

I thank you, Sir.

COMMUNITY CENTRES IN KWACHA TOWNSHIP

648. Mr Mutale (Kwacha) asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing when the Government would re-open community centres in Kwacha Township in Kwacha Parliamentary Constituency.

The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr Tembo): Mr Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that the re-opening of community centres and the hand-back to the public is scheduled for the fourth quarter of this year. This is to allow time for the current tenants to relocate.

I thank you, Sir.

MINI-HYDRO POWER STATIONS AT CHIKATA

649. Mr Lufuma (Kabompo West) asked the hon. Minister of Mines, Energy and Water Development:

(a)    what the progress on the construction of two mini-hydro power stations at Chikata in Kabompo District and Chavuma Rapids in Chavuma District was;

(b)    whether feasibility studies for the two projects had been done;

(c)    what the estimated cost of construction of each project was;

(d)    what the output capacity of each station would be;

(e)    whether contractors for each project had been identified; and 

(f)    when the works on each project were expected to commence.

The Deputy Minister of Mines, Energy and Water Development (Mr Zulu): Mr Speaker, as regards Chikata Falls, the Government, through the Rural Electrification Authority (REA), contracted SMEC International Pty Limited in May, 2012. This contractor was to carry out a feasibility study and detailed engineering design for the proposed Chikata Falls Mini-Hydropower Station located in Kabompo District of the North-Western Province. The consultant moved on site in July, 2012, and the study is in progress.

Sir, the submission of the final feasibility study report by the consultant will be the basis for the decision on whether to proceed with the design stage.

Mr Speaker, the Government, through REA, contracted VKE and ZMCK Consulting Engineers to carry out a detailed feasibility study for the proposed Chavuma Falls Mini-Hydropower Station. The consultant has since submitted the final report.

Sir, the feasibility study for the Chikata Falls will be submitted by the end of August, 2013, while the feasibility study for the Chavuma Rapids was completed and the report was submitted on 24th January, 2013.

Mr Speaker, the cost for developing a mini-hydropower station at Chikata Falls will be known once the feasibility study has been completed. The estimated cost for the Chavuma Rapids is K275 million (US$51 million).

Sir, Chikata Falls is estimated to produce 3.5 MW while the production at Chavuma Rapids is estimated at 14 MW. Identification of a contractor for Chikata Falls awaits the completion of the final feasibility study report which is yet to be submitted.

Mr Speaker, the procurement of a developer for Chavuma Rapids is in progress and is expected to be completed by December, 2013.

Sir, it is difficult to estimate when the works will commence because these processes must be completed and finalised first.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, …

Mr Mufalali: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Mufalali: Mr Speaker, I apologise to the hon. Member who was about to ask a question for interrupting him.

Sir, the PF Government, through its hon. Minister of Tourism and Art, assured this House that it was preparing for the United Nations World Tourism Organisation (UNWTO) Conference. With that assurance, we thought the Government knew what it was doing. Is the PF Government, through the Ministry of Tourism and Art, in order to mislead the nation by going to Mongu to put up a poster written “Welcome to Mongu, Umutomboko Ceremony of King Mwata Kazembe.” Is it really in order to say that it is preparing for the UNTWO Conference when, in fact, it is misleading us and the people who are coming to Zambia for the conference by stating that Mwata Kazembe is in Mongu?

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order! 

The problem I have with that point of order is how the hon. Member has attributed the erection of that poster to the Ministry of Tourism and Art. There is really no evidence that the erection of the poster was authorised by the ministry. However, on a serious note, if you intend to pursue that issue, as usual, file in a Question through the Office of the Clerk of the National Assembly.

May the hon. Member for Zambezi West continue, please.

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, the Government promised the people of the North-Western Province, in particular, those in Kabompo, Zambezi and Chavuma, that the electricity blues that they were facing would end because the two projects that the hon. Minister has been talking about would be connected to the national grid. Now that the hon. Minister does not even know when those projects will commence, may I know what will happen to the people of Zambezi, Chavuma and Kabompo who are experiencing power blackouts everyday because the generator sets are malfunctioning.

The Minister of Mines, Energy and Water Development (Mr Yaluma): Mr Speaker, firstly, I could not figure out the question here. Is it on the mini-hydro power station or the interconnector to the national grid?

Mr Speaker: May the hon. Member for Zambezi West, please, clarify.

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, the Government promised the people of the North-Western Province, in particular, those in Kabompo, Zambezi and Chavuma to have their areas connected to the national grid. This was because the generators which are being used by the Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (ZESCO) are ineffective and inefficient thereby resulting in power outages. 

Sir, since the hon. Minister does not know when those projects will commence, what will happen to the assurance that was given to the people of the North-Western Province?

Mr Muntanga: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, I rise on a point of procedure. The question that was asked by the hon. Member for Zambezi West was clear. However, the hon. Minister said that he did not understand it. This has resulted into the hon. Member for Zambezi West repeating the question. Is the hon. Minister in order not to have listened to the question to a point where it had to be repeated in full …

Hon. Opposition Member: in Parliament!

Mr Muntanga: … here in Parliament?  Is this procedurally correct, Sir? I seek your ruling. 

Mr Speaker: The hon. Minister is just human. He did not follow the question and wanted clarification. So, I gave the questioner an opportunity to clarify his question. There is nothing extraordinary about that.

 Hon. Minister, I am sure you have heard the question now. May you respond.

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, I have understood the question.

The people of Kabompo and Zambezi have not been left in the dark. The two hydro-power stations, Chikata and Chavuma, are on track. We have given dates on which their construction will be started. As for the interconnector, the tenders have gone out and interconnecting the towns in the North-Western Province to the grid is being evaluated. 832 km will be completed very soon.

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Lufuma: Mr Speaker, since the hon. Minister indicated that the construction of these projects will take long and Kabompo, Manyinga, Zambezi and Chavuma are experiencing a lot of power blackouts, is the ministry considering procuring additional generator sets for each of these places in order to ameliorate the problem?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, I do not think it would be economical to procure a generator set at this stage when we know we are going to interconnect the area to the national grid. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Ntundu (Gwembe): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out …

Mr Muntanga: On a point of order, Sir.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Go ahead and ask your question, hon. Member.

Mr Ntundu: … whether the people of Kabompo, Manyinga, Zambezi and Chavuma are meant to stay in darkness as they wait for the Government to interconnect their areas to the national grid. What interim measure has been put in place?

Mr Yaluma: Mr Speaker, as far as we are concerned, there is a generator set which is repaired by technicians every time it has a fault. We are maintaining electricity supply to the area and ensuring that we minimise the power outages as regards the generator. I can assure you that we have cannibalised a lot of equipment. There are generators spread across the country and when an area gets connected to the national grid, all the equipment is moved to areas powered by generators sets, including Kabompo and Zambezi West, as spare equipment. We will try as much as possible to minimise the forced outages.

I thank you, Sir. {mospagebreak}

EARLY MARRIAGE CASES

650. Mr Bwalya (Lupososhi) asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing which province recorded the highest cases of early marriages in 2011 and 2012. 

Mr N. Banda: Mr Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that the Eastern Province recorded the highest cases of early marriages in 2011 and 2012.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

Mr Bwalya: Mr Speaker, the issue of early marriage is quite critical. I would like to find out …

Mr Muntanga: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, I must apologise to the hon. Member for interrupting him. The problem we have is timing at which point to rise during the questions.

Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing said that his ministry is in a total ‘mess’ and every government …

Mr Speaker: The word ‘mess’ is unparliamentary.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, may I substitute it?

Mr Speaker: Please, do.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Local Government and Housing is not properly administered. It has been governed for about twenty-one months by the PF. The issue that is being brought out in the question is that of managing markets. The Market and Bus Stations Act No. 7 of 2007 was passed by the former Government. When the new party came into power, it introduced many freedoms like vending and formation of new markets. Is the hon. Minister in order to insist that the ministry is in a ‘mess’ or …

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member, the word ‘mess’ is not acceptable so you cannot use it again.

Mr Muntanga: … that it is in disarray without her coming into the House to clarify what problems it is facing so that the House is made to understand them? Is she in order?

Mr Speaker: I have ruled on similar points of order in the past and stressed that points of order should be raised timeously and contemporaneously.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: This matter has already been dealt with. However, if you still want to pursue it, which you are at liberty to do, please, file in a Question.

May the hon. Member for Lupososhi, continue.

Mr Bwalya: Mr Speaker, the issue of early marriage is quite critical and happening in almost every part of the country. One of the contributing factors is the lack of recreational facilities. What is the Government doing to ensure that play parks and other recreational facilities are repossessed from those who are renting them so that the community in the Eastern Province can use them? 

Mr N. Banda: Mr Speaker, the question asked already guided the answer I should give. The ministry, through the local authorities in the Eastern-Province, is repossessing some of the recreational parks so that it can use them for their intended purposes. There was a time when these parks where given out, but we are now reclaiming them for the right purpose.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kazonga (Vubwi): Mr Speaker, before the ministry came up with a measure to repossess those play parks, did it carry out an assessment of what is causing these early marriages?

Mr N. Banda: Mr Speaker, the ministry carried out a research to establish why some of the provinces have higher records of early marriages. One of the reasons arrived at was that some poor families regard marriage as a source of income.

Also, some harmful initiation practices which are a rite of passage for girls and boys usually aged between ten years and fifteen years trigger early marriages. Once initiated, the girls and boys feel that they are ready for marriage and they go into early marriages.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, one of the factors that foster early marriages in the Eastern Province is poverty and I agree with the hon. Minister on that. Therefore, what is that Government (pointing at the hon. Government Members.) doing to alleviate poverty so that those people who are marrying off their children before they are completely mature can survive economically? 

Interruptions

Mr Mbewe: Yes, I am pointing at them.

Interruptions 

Mr N. Banda: Mr Speaker, the Government has so many wings through other ministries which empower citizens. For example, the Ministry of Gender and Child Development empowers women in families. The Ministry of Community Development, Mother and Child Health also has a package for families. The Ministry of Youth and Sport is also in the provinces to encourage the youths to take advantage of the economic empowerment so that they can refrain from engaging in detrimental vices.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kalila: Mr Speaker, statistics are very important and serve a purpose, especially when it comes to designing interventions. We must, therefore, be very concerned about the source of such information and how accurate it is. I would like to find out, especially that we have not been given information about other provinces, the source of the data that the Eastern Province has the highest record of early marriages. I am saying so because councils do not register underage marriages.

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, this information came from the Ministry of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs. The ministry made a quick analysis and it is still doing further studies on this matter.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mulomba (Magoye): Mr Speaker, now that initiation ceremonies are the root cause of these early marriages, is the Government considering doing away with them?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs has launched a campaign to sensitise the people and also to amend the curriculum which Bana Fimbusa, the women who counsel young women before entering into marriage, use.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mufalali (Senanga): Mr Speaker, the Eastern Province is one of those regions with a very rich culture. However, has the ministry carried out a survey to establish the repercussions of exposing breasts at a traditional ceremony to an extent where these young girls are likened to concrete mixers?

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, I think the issue of showing breasts at traditional ceremonies is not a big one.

I thank you, Sir.

Interruptions

Hon. Opposition Members: Show us!

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Hon. Minister, the question has not been answered.

Could you answer it, please.

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, the issue that the hon. Member of Parliament raised of the young girls exposing their breasts, ...

Hon. Opposition Member: Amabele!

Mr Speaker: Order!

Laughter

Mrs Kabanshi: … as you call them …

Laughter

Mrs Kabanshi: Sir, the Ministry of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs and the Alangizi, the  women who counsel the girls when they attain puberty, are sensitising the girls on the need to dress decently and uphold our culture which will, in turn, build our societies.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! 

The question was: “Has any study been done or not?”

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, I already answered that question. I said that a study is being done by the Ministry of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr L. J. Ngoma: Mr Speaker, the nature of answering of the hon. Minister is very worrying.

Mr Speaker: Order! 

Just ask your question. Those are my worries.

Laughter

Mr L. J. Ngoma: Mr Speaker, it is gratifying to know that we share the same worries.

Laughter

Mr L. J. Ngoma: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has indicated that the statistics from which the conclusion that the Eastern Province has the highest record of early marriages was drawn through an analysis by the Ministry of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs. My concern is how this analysis was conducted. Was it being done through pocheza mu madzulo, …

Laughter

 Mr L. J. Ngoma: … where you just gathered these chiefs and engaged them into convocations or is it the policy of the PF Government to compile statistics through a traditional arrangement? This type of gathering statistics is questionable.

Mr Speaker: Order! 

Just to make progress, the hon. Member of Parliament is asking about what methodology was employed in gathering these statistics.

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, it was a sample study that was done by the hon. Minister and not the chiefs.

 I thank you, Sir.

Mr Miyanda (Mapatizya): Mr Speaker, I have been visiting my constituency very often and I have not come across any officials from the Ministry of Chiefs and Traditional Affairs conducting a survey. May I know if there were specific areas that were targeted in the Southern Province for Siavonga Constituency to have been omitted.

Mrs Kabanshi: Mr Speaker, I would advise the hon. Member to direct that question to the ministry responsible.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

__________

MOTIONS

REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON NATIONAL SECURITY AND FOREIGN AFFAIRS

Lt-Gen. Shikapwasha (Keembe): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that this House do now adopt the Report of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Affairs for the Second Session of the Eleventh National Assembly, laid on the Table of the House on 10th June, 2013.

Mr Speaker: Is the Motion seconded.

Mr Bwalya (Lupososhi): Mr Speaker, I beg to second the Motion.

Lt-Gen. Shikapwasha: Sir, in its work, your Committee was guided by the terms of reference as set out in the National Assembly Standing Orders. In this regard, your Committee considered the registration of non-profit making organisations in Zambia, an update on the conflict situation in Syria, Somalia, the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), Mali, The Republic of The Sudan and South Sudan and operations of Zambia’s missions abroad. It also considered the Action-Taken Report of your previous Committee’s report.

Mr Speaker, during the year under review, your Committee received reports from Parliamentary delegations to the Pan African Parliament (PAP), the Parliamentary Forum of the International Conference on the Great Lakes Region and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs on the Sixty-Seventh Session of the United Nations General Assembly. In order to have an on-the-spot-check, your Committee undertook a local tour of the Northern and Muchinga provinces.

Sir, I now wish to highlight some of the salient features of your report. Your Committee appreciates the importance of registering non-profit-making organisations in Zambia. However, it is concerned about how outdated the Society’s Act Cap. 119 of the Laws of Zambia, which is the law governing registration of these organisations, is. This Act was enacted way back in 1957 and, as such, does not fully address the current trends in the operations of non-profit making organisations in Zambia.
Mr Speaker, in addition, this piece of legislation is in conflict with other pieces of legislation such as the Companies Act Cap. 388 of the Laws of Zambia and the Non-Governmental Organisations Act of 2009. In light of this, your Committee recommends that the law governing the registration of societies be amended and harmonised with the other relevant laws. 
Sir, your Committee notes that the Government of Zambia has been following, with keen interest, the developments in the DRC, Mali, South Sudan, The Sudan, Somalia and Syria.
Sir, with regard to the situation in the DRC, your Committee notes that there is commitment at regional level, with support from the international community, in addressing the conflict situation in the eastern part of the DRC. It also notes Zambia’s position on the matter and urges the Zambian Government, as a neighbour to the DRC, to foster peace through the Southern African Development Community (SADC), International Conflict on the Great Lakes Region (ICGLR), Common Market for Eastern and Southern Africa (COMESA), African Union (AU) and the United Nations (UN).
Mr Speaker, on the situation in the Sudan and South Sudan, your Committee notes that the AU has continued to pay the necessary attention to the issue. Your Committee wishes to implore the Government, through the necessary channels, to continue advocating for a peaceful resolution to the conflict.
Further, your Committee calls upon the Government to continue pressing on the governments of The Sudan and South Sudan to conclude and implement the comprehensive agreement.  This will put an end to the disputes pertaining to the delimitation of border boundaries, the oil revenue and citizenship. It will also foster peace concerning the provinces of South Kordofan and Blue Nile in order to achieve peace, security and stability in both countries with the help of the international community.
Mr Speaker, regarding the Syrian conflict, your Committee welcomes the efforts by the UN and the Arab League in finding a lasting solution to the crisis. However, it is deeply concerned about the conflict in Syria which has led to a great loss of lives thereby leading to a serious humanitarian crisis. Your Committee, therefore, urges the Government to implore the Syrian Government and the opposition to exercise restraint in the conflict for the benefit of the Syrian people. In addition, your Committee calls on the Government to support efforts by the UN and the Arab League in finding a peaceful and lasting solution to the Syrian crisis.
Sir, your Committee appreciates the role that Zambian Missions abroad play. However, it is greatly concerned with the poor and erratic funding to these missions. This has led to the dilapidation of the infrastructure and negatively hampered the efforts of the officers to market the country abroad. In this regard, your Committee strongly urges the Government to increase budgetary allocation to the Zambian Missions abroad and ensure timely release of funds. It, further, urges the Ministry of Foreign Affairs to make a budgetary line specifically for the maintenance of its properties abroad and to enhance visitation to the missions abroad so as to ascertain their status.
Mr Speaker, your Committee notes and appreciates the briefing on the deliberations of the Sixty-Seventh UN General Assembly and recommends as set out below:
(a)    the Cabinet Office, together with the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, should devise a strategy or plan to advance Zambia’s  participation in the UN matters;

(b)    the Zambian Government needs to give policy guidance on the issue of moratorium on the death penalty in view of the constitution-making process;

(c)    the Zambian Government should continue to engage with the relevant stakeholders on the issues of sexual orientation and homosexuality so that the country’s position is well-articulated by all citizens, especially those attending UN conferences and meetings;

(d)    the Zambian Government needs to be current with the demands and required skills of peacekeeping;

(e)    the Zambian Government should invest in the required equipment and peace- keeping training for the Zambian military, Zambia Police Force and civilians as peace-keeping missions get more competitive and complicated;

(f)    the Zambian Government should consider establishing a department of peacekeeping and embrace the competencies of various stakeholders such as the ministries of Foreign Affairs, Defence, Home Affairs and other civilian competencies available in the country; and 
(g)    the Zambian Government should urgently repair or, better still, purchase a new residence for Zambia’s Mission in New York. It is in a prime area, but in a deplorable state. In addition, the Government should urgently attend to the old five-storey Chancery structure which is in a deplorable state and needs urgent repairs.

Mr Speaker, your Committee takes note of the PAP recommendations and urges the Zambian Government to start preparing strategies to handle the post 2015 millennium development goals (MDGs). 

Mr Speaker, your Committee was also privileged to undertake a local tour to the Northern and Muchinga provinces on matters pertaining to Zambia’s international borders. I now wish to highlight your Committee’s recommendations, based on its findings. 

Sir, your Committee observed that about 35 km of Zambian land, along the Kaputa/Sumbu/DRC Border, on the Zambian side, has been encroached by Congolese nationals in military attire. As a result, Zambians who pay homage to Chief Lubombo and visit relatives in the area are made to go through border formalities in their own country. 

Further, your Committee observes that there is no no-man’s land on the border between Zambia and the United Republic of Tanzania. In light of this, your Committee urges the Zambian Government, through the Joint-Permanent Commissions, to seriously address the various challenges Zambia is facing regarding her international border with the DRC and the United Republic of Tanzania.

Sir, your Committee further urges the Zambian Government to find ways of reclaiming her land that has been encroached upon along the Zambia/DRC Border so that life and security for the Zambians living along the border can return to normal. 

In addition, Mr Speaker, there is a need to deploy more security personnel to Zambia’s international border boundaries in order to avoid loss of more Zambian land. Your Committee notes that there are no communication facilities available for security personnel in Kaputa, Nsama, Mbala and Nakonde districts, resulting in officers using their personal mobile phones for the purpose of communicating official and sensitive information with their superiors. 

Further, Sir, your Committee observes that the country lacks marine transport to monitor the security situation on and along the Lake Tanganyika Border. Further, there is inadequate and unreliable land transport for security personnel in Kaputa, Mbala and Nakonde. Your Committee, therefore, urges the Zambian Government to provide communication facilities and reliable land and water transport to security personnel manning Zambia’s international borders with the DRC and United Republic of Tanzania to enable our officials and security personnel to carry out their work effectively. 

Mr Speaker, your Committee observes that there is inadequate infrastructure, in terms of accommodation and office space, at Zombe and Lumi Border posts in Mbala as compared to the Tanzanian side. Your Committee, therefore, recommends that the Zambian Government constructs infrastructure at these border posts. The Government should also seriously consider relocating Lumi Border Post, which is currently located 10 km away from the borderline, to near Mosi Border Post in Tanzania. Lumi and Zombe Border posts in Zambia share boundaries with Kaseshya and Mosi Border posts in Tanzania respectively. 

Mr Speaker, your Committee observes that Mbala and Nakonde districts lack maps showing their boundaries with the United Republic of Tanzania and urges the Zambian Government to provide maps depicting beaconed boundaries not only for the districts visited, but also all districts bordering international boundaries.  

Mr Speaker, your Committee wishes to extend its gratitude to you for the support rendered to it throughout the year. It is indebted to all the stakeholders who appeared before it for their co-operation in providing the necessary memoranda and briefs. 

Sir, your Committee is very hopeful that the observations and recommendations contained in this report will go a long way in improving matters of national security and foreign affairs in Zambia. 

Finally, your Committee wishes to express its appreciation to the Office of the Clerk of the National Assembly for the invaluable and tireless assistance rendered throughout its deliberations. 

Mr Speaker, I beg to move. 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Does the seconder wish to speak now or later?

Mr Bwalya: Now, Sir.  

Mr Speaker, in seconding the Motion so ably moved by the Chairperson, let me thank the Chairperson and the entire membership of your Committee for the manner in which we conducted business. Since the Chairperson has already highlighted the salient issues, I will be very brief. 

Mr Speaker, let me also take this opportunity to pay tribute to all stakeholders who spared their time to interact with your Committee on matters of national importance, as contained in your report. 

Sir, your Committee appreciates the role of the Registrar of Societies in registering non-profit making organisations in Zambia. However, it observes that the Office of the Registrar of Societies has inadequate office space and staff. Further, the office is not decentralised and computerised. Your Committee, therefore, urges the Government to increase budgetary allocation to the Office of the Registrar of Societies, through the Ministry of Home Affairs, so as to address issues of human resource, office space, transport, computerisation and decentralisation. 

Mr Speaker, your Committee is deeply concerned about the situation prevailing in Mali and condemns the illegal occupation of the northern part of that country by armed groups, which has resulted in a humanitarian crisis. In view of this, your Committee urges the Zambian Government to continue supporting the AU and the Economic Community of West African States (ECOWAS) in their mediation efforts aimed at reaching a solution to the crisis in Mali. It also urges the Government to impress upon the international community to help in the humanitarian crisis in Mali. 

Mr Speaker, your Committee notes that some relative peace has returned to Somalia through the establishment of a new Somali Government, which has resulted in the reconstruction of the country. Your Committee, therefore, urges the Government to impress upon the new Somali Government to ensure that peace is upheld for the benefit and development of the people of Somalia. 

Mr Speaker, let me also touch on the issue of the DRC. Your Committee is happy to note that the state of unrest in North Kivu has calmed down following the intervention of the ICGLR, the AU and the UN. This was after the M23 had captured the City of Goma in November, 2012. Your Committee is, therefore, encouraged that the Zambian Government is committed to providing the necessary support to the peace process in the DRC.

Sir, with regard to the local tour, your Committee is concerned that the Zambian fishermen on Zambian waters are being arrested for allegedly fishing on the DRC waters by that country’s security personnel.

Your Committee, therefore, urges the Government to not only deploy more security personnel to the Zambian international boundaries with the DRC, but also provide marine services as well. That will try to address concerns raised by the people of Chibangu Village and investors in Nsumbu area of Nsama District.

Mr Speaker, your Committee is worried about how porous the border between Zambia and Tanzania is. This has led to illegal activities and crimes such as human and drug trafficking, smuggling, stock theft and aggravated robbery, among others. In light of this, your Committee strongly urges the Zambian Government to deploy more security personnel to Zambia’s international borders with Tanzania to curb the illegal activities and crime along the border.

Mr Speaker, finally, your previous Committee had urged the governments of the Republic of Zambia and the DRC to agree on the demarcation of their boundary, especially the boundary beacons between Lake Mweru and Lake Tanganyika, with special attention to Chibangu Village.

Your Committee learnt that the joint survey team presented a Zambia/DRC Physical Boundary Demarcation Project Proposal and sensitisation materials for the joint committee of experts for approval. However, the project could not take off as planned in 2011 due to non-responsiveness by the DRC. Your Committee was informed that the Zambian Government has since written a reminder to the DRC.

Sir, while appreciating the response, your Committee wishes to know whether the Delimitation Treaty of September, 1989 between Zambia and the DRC is being used in the border discussions. In addition, your Committee wishes to be updated on the progress made in the discussions of the boundaries between the DRC and Zambia.

Mr Speaker, I beg to second.

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Speaker, from the response that hon. Members have given, I can see that I may be the only one to debate this report. I would like to thank both the mover and the seconder of this very important report, which addresses issues of national security and foreign affairs.

Sir, in the interest of time, I will not endeavour to dwell much on foreign affairs because the maintenance of the infrastructure that this country owns abroad is a song that we have been singing year in and year out. Suffice to say that it is a matter worth noting by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. I will try to dwell on issues that were addressed in the report relating to defence as well as national security, which is internal security.

I would like to congratulate Hon. GBM …

Mr Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1615 hours until 1630 hours.{mospagebreak}

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, before Business was suspended, I was in the middle of giving a few accolades to the Minister of Defence, Hon. Geoffrey Mwamba, who is seated here in front of me, together with his two hon. Deputy Ministers for finding a solution, which I hope is a permanent one, to the difficult challenges the people of Luano Valley suffered for many years at the hands of the notorious Mailoni Brothers. I think it is common knowledge that when you do the right thing regarding security, you obviously attain peace, tranquillity and a certain level of harmony.

Sir, I have no subscription to the manner in which the solution was found because the means does not justify the end. It would have been nice to have had these Mailoni Brothers come and answer for the many atrocities that they committed.

Mr Speaker, the mover of the Motion indicated that, in Chief Lubombo’s area in Kaputa, the Congolese soldiers have established a cantonment, 35km inside our territory, if I heard correctly. For those of you who may not understand the extent of that distance, it is a distance such as the one between Lusaka to near Kafue. These soldiers have entered our sovereignty and the hon. Minister and his hon. Deputy Ministers are aware about it because they have read this report which was circulated a while ago. It would be nice to hear the hon. Minister of Defence explain to me, and those interested, what the Government has done about this encroachment and establishing a cantonment on our land by our neighbouring country. If nothing is done, tomorrow, we will find that these soldiers would have inched in another 35 km since there is no action that has been taken thus far.

Sir, in the past, the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) and previous governments have been very swift to attend to such kind of encroachment and Hon. Mwamba has some fighting equipment. I would be happy if he took his Mig 21 and dropped a bomb at that cantonment because it is within our territorial sovereignty and see what those people who have encroached into our territory will do.

Mr Speaker, it does not make sense for your own nationals to seek a travelling document or passport, as we have heard from the mover of the Motion, to move from one village to another within the same country. I think this is a crosscutting issue and it must be taken seriously by the hon. Ministers responsible. Instead of the Minister of Home Affairs, Hon. E. C. Lungu, Minister of Defence, Hon. Geoffrey Bwalya Mwamba and Minister of Foreign Affairs, Hon. Effron Lungu being away from the office organising by-elections, it would be good for them to assemble a team of experts and address this matter. There is no value in winning the Chipata Central seat, but lose ground in Kaputa because Chipata will always be part of our country. I urge the Government to find a real solution to this encroachment problem.

Sir, the mover also indicated that the area bordering the Republic of Tanzanian and Zambia, there is no no-man’s land. Did I get you right?

Interruptions

Mr Nkombo: Not a no-man’s land. Just for clarity’s purposes, there is the absence of a no- man’s land because we are not separated by a natural feature such as a river or otherwise. I think that it is also important that the Ministry of Lands, Natural Resources and Environmental Protection speeds up what the MMD started. The MMD had begun a vigorous process of actually identifying the Malawian Border. So, it is not so difficult for the current Government to continue up north to the Tanzanian Border so that, at least, the no-man’s land is identified.

Mr Speaker, while I congratulate the hon. Minister of Defence for covering for the failure of the Ministry of Home Affairs in dealing with internal security such as what happened in Luano Valley, I think that it is also important that we realise that there are no boundaries regarding the security of individuals. National security starts with the security of individuals, and fundamental rights and freedoms within our inland borders have been a serious issue of concern to some of us. We have heard how lives have been lost. As people were exercising the fundamental right of movement to buy football tickets, we heard how a policeman shot an individual in Ndola. To me, that is a serious security concern that must be addressed by the Executive. 

Mr Speaker, it does not end there. Instead of putting political campaigns and elections top on the agenda, the Government could have circumvented the issue that happened in Kampasa in Chongwe, not far from here, where Hon. Geoffrey Bwalya Mwamba’s officers shot at innocent human beings. That, to me, is a total breach of security and it brings out despondency. Worst still, when people go to sympathise with the people affected by some of these occurrences that are created by Government operatives such as the Zambia National Service (ZNS), militia from the Patriotic Front (PF) are sent to cause instability and threaten the peace in this country.

Mr Livune: Shame!

Mr Nkombo: I think that is something you should forget …

Mr Chilangwa: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Chilangwa: Mr Speaker, is my brother, Hon. Nkombo, in order to bring into his debate issues which were adequately covered when he was not in the House when points of order were raised, necessitating their being debated after ministerial statements were presented? I need your serious ruling.

Mr Muntanga: Just sit down.

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member for Mazabuka Central is contributing to the Motion on the Floor. However, as he does so, I think it is also important to bear in mind that this subject, in any case, had been dealt with previously. For the efficiency of the debate, I would urge him to focus more on the Motion and the report that has been presented by the Committee.

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, I am really at a loss. I would have been happier if I was ruled out of order because I do not understand how I should proceed now going by your ruling. However, I will stick to the report that …

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member for Mazabuka Central, I am glad you have indicated that you are not clear about the ruling. Earlier on in the Sitting, some ministerial statements were made on the subjects that you are referring to. Following those ministerial statements, those subjects were debated extensively. The point that is being made is that there is no need to re-open, as it were, that debate. Nonetheless, what we have is a report by the Committee and it is very specific. In the nature of this Motion, I invited further debate on the Motion. I hope this clarifies the point. It is a question of focus, really, more than anything else. I will be reluctant to say that you are out of order.

You may continue, hon. Member.

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, I am consoled by your ruling. Now that I have been ruled out of order, it helps me to try to change the course of my debate. Since I am disadvantaged because of not having been in the House at the time when these matters were being dispensed, please, forgive me for that digression. However, I am discussing the Report of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Affairs and I have chosen to address the issue of national security.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo: Seeing as the issue of Kampasa was dealt with in my absence, I apologise for pushing that agenda any further. 

Sir, I also said that the issue of all of us being champions of fundamental human rights and freedoms is of absolute importance. In my view, there is absolutely no value in this Committee on National Security and Foreign Affairs coming to this House and telling me about the Malian, Eritrean or Somali situations when the PF members are busy beating clergymen in Matero.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear! Shame!

Mr Nkombo: For me, that amounts to my national security and of those people whose rights and freedoms have been curtailed. If people decide to take the law in their own hands, it means that there will be anarchy in this country.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo: So, please, hear me out. I have to say this because it borders on national security.

Sir, I am glad the hon. Minister of Justice is here somewhere. I have been itching to say something since last Friday when he told me he thought I was strong enough to have defended myself when I was being attacked at a certain place and time. If I decided to do that, there would have been a breakdown of law and order which would hinge on national security, an issue that we must all hold dear to our hearts. 

Mr Speaker, due to the fact that most of the issues that I had in mind appear to have been dealt with extensively, as per your ruling, while I was away, I beg to support the report. However, as I sit down, I want our colleagues in the PF to search their souls. I want our colleagues in the Committee that dealt with the issue of national security to also search their souls and stop glossing over serious matters that border on national security.

Mr Speaker, the issue of Mr Frank Bwalya having been chastised in Kitwe is one that borders on national security because he also has a following. If his people decided to retaliate and teach …

Ms Kapata: On point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Ms Kapata: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Member of Parliament for Mazabuka Central, who is my shaku, which means mulamu in my tribe, in order to say that the PF cardres attacked a church when, in fact, people in that church were not congregants, but had gathered with an intention to distabilise the Government?

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: The problem with that point of order is that you are debating. 

Laughter

Mr Speaker: It is not procedural in nature.

The hon. Member may continue.

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, I was just about to conclude when I said that the issue of national security should not be a matter that we should be glossing over. You should not think that you will be in the Government forever. Mark my words. There is a need for you to be fair with one another.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! Order!

Mr Nkombo: My wish, Sir, is that from this moment on, this country should not degenerate. I want to invite the Executive on your right not to simply watch the Big Brother Africa Show, but tune in to the Cable News Network (CNN) and see what the Egyptians are doing. They have risen against a legitimately elected government …

Interruptions

Mr Nkombo: Just keep quiet.

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member for Mazabuka Central, you know better than that. You are one of the leaders of the House.

You may continue.

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, you know, I am grateful …

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, you have helped me grow in this area since I was made a leader. In the past, I would have said shut-up, but I have not done that. I have simply said keep quiet and I withdraw that remark.

Mr Speaker: No, whatever nomenclature you use, you just do not have the authority to do that.

Mr Nkombo: I was terminating my …

Mr Speaker: Let me reiterate what I said. Focus on the report and you are on the verge of winding up, anyway.

You may continue.

Mr Nkombo: Sure, Sir. 

Mr Speaker, I urge my colleagues on your right hand side, when we rise tonight at whatever time, to go home and tune in to the CNN, the British Broadcasting Corporation (BBC), the South African Broadcasting Corporation (SABC) or watch Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation television and see that a legally-elected government can have a lot of headaches as a result of not listening to people. 

Mr Speaker, the right to assemble is an enshrined human right. The trouble is that the Government has been busy blocking people from assembling. The hon. Minister of Justice is seated there looking all innocent, and yet he has been a champion of mutilating fundamental human rights.

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member for Mazabuka Central, you are not permitted to debate a colleague in the fashion that you are proceeding. 

You may continue, hon. Member.

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, I withdraw my remarks. As I terminate my debate, I seriously think that it is always good to remind one another that people-power is the greatest power that one can ever experience in their lifetime. For the purposes of national security, I invite you, on Mr Speaker’s right, to search your souls and begin understanding that there is importance in dealing with local security than running to Darfur.

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: Finally, let me address myself to the hon. Minister of Defence. I am assigning you to go to Kaputa to check …

Mr Speaker: I hope that is said in jest or I will curtail the debate.

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: The hon. Minister understands that it is said in jest.

Mr Speaker: Very well.

Mr Nkombo: Hon. G. B. M and your colleagues, the hon. Ministers of Foreign Affairs and Home Affairs, I see the hon. Minister of Home Affairs holding his chin, get involved and settle this matter of encroachment in Kaputa because, by this time next year, you will find that the encroachment would have spread to somewhere near Mporokoso and they would have taken up our land which we dearly need. 

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Minister for Southern Province (Mr Munkombwe): Mr Speaker, may I, once again, thank you for affording me this opportunity to join my colleagues who congratulated you on your election to the position of the Hon. Mr Speaker of the National Assembly in 2011. It is equally appropriate for me to congratulate you on your successful legal practice in Zambia which enabled you to rise to the position of Judge of the High Court of Zambia.

Mr Speaker, I would also be failing in my duties if I did not thank …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order, on the left! Can we stop making those running commentaries.

Mr Munkombwe: … the President of the Republic of Zambia, …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: … Mr Michael Chilufya Sata, for joining his four predecessors in recognising and appointing me as hon. Minister in his Government.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, it is also important to know that politics …

Hon. Opposition Members: Of the belly!

Mr Munkombwe: … is the art of the possible. It means that everything in politics is possible. In this regard, I want to refer to a mild comment made by the hon. Member for Mwandi. He attributed to some speech where I referred to the PF ruling this country as a fantasy. I want the hon. Member for Mwandi to assist me in understanding the meaning of the word ‘fantasy’. Fantasy has three interpretations. The first meaning of fantasy is ‘impossible thinking’. The opposite of that is ‘impossibility possibility’.

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: The PF interpreted the word fantasy in the opposite direction. It made possible what was impossible. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: What was an impossibility turned into a possibility. I think that was a mild comment as regards what I said against the PF.

Mr Speaker, my role in this honourable House, in whose surroundings I have been around for many years of my life, …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: … is to continue to guide. Sir, when Hon. Kambwili would be sent out of the House, I would go out to admonish him. I would tell him that he had the quality of leadership if only he could sober up.

Hon. Opposition Members: Traitor!

Hon. Member: Judas!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, another man I used to encourage is now a senior Minister, Hon. Yamfwa Mukanga. I always wrote notes to him telling him that if he continued in that fashion, he would one day become a powerful hon. Minister.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, I think that he is a powerful hon. Minister and he is alive to see what I told him come to pass. I want to take advantage of the debate by the hon. Member for …

Mr Speaker: Order!

Hon. Deputy Minister for Southern Province, it is with a great deal of reluctance that I have to intervene. Considering that this is your maiden speech, I should have been the last person to do that. However, given the trend of the debate, I am under duty to remind you that one of the cardinal principles of the House is to restrain ourselves, collectively, from debating ourselves. This is so cardinal that we cannot depart from it. Just in case you have a litany of references in that regard, I think that it is appropriate that I step in to stop you. 

You may continue, bearing that counsel in mind.

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, I thank you for your guidance. The presence of a person in any political circle depends on his influence. My role in my sixty years of participation in the politics of this country has been that of a stabiliser.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, in 1989, there was a powerful conference at the Mulungushi Conference Hall. At that conference, there was a debate about how to return to multi-partism. After a serious debate, some people walked away, among them, Hon. Alex Chikwanda because …

Mr Speaker: Order!

Hon. Member for Southern Province, please, avoid those references and, unfortunately, including references to yourself. I suggest that you focus on relevant issues. That way, we will make progress.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, now when (spoke off the microphone).

Hon. Members: Use the microphone!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, the PF was formed when His Excellency the President of this country felt that he had been mishandled by the MMD.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, he resigned and formed the PF in September, 2001. He went into an election, barely three months after he had resigned.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

May I have order on the left. Hon. Minister, just pause for a moment. Hon. Members, your voices are as clear as your faces.

Laughter 

Mr Speaker: Order!

I do not even need to look at you in order to identify you. At the rate we are going, I will be inclined to give you an opportunity to make those commentaries, as loud as you can, outside the Chamber. 

Hon. Munkombwe, you may continue.

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, the PF, under His Excellency Mr Michael Sata, contested an election in 2001. However, he did this just to test the waters. After 2001, his party positioned himself for the 2006 General Elections. During these elections, the MMD filed in candidates in 150 constituencies. The United Democratic Alliance (UDA), which was a group of political parties meant to defeat the MMD, sponsored one man in the United Party for National Development (UPND). Speaking from my experience, the grouping of political parties in a quest to defeat a larger one tends to fail. For instance, when the South West Africa People’s Organisation (SWAPO) took over the reins of power in Namibia, a new group called the Democratic Alliance wanted to defeat it. However, while the party got votes, it could not swallow SWAPO. When South Africa held its first democratic elections, the whites formed what they called the National Democratic Alliance and that also failed. Another time around, they came up with a colourful word ‘COPE’ standing for the Congress of the People, but it also failed as in the first instance. Alliances which are formed for the purpose of defeating a larger group tend to fail.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, in Kenya, the Kenya African Democratic Union (KADU) broke away from the Kenya Africa National Union. 

Interruptions 

Mr Munkombwe: That comment broadens my scope in analysing the political situation anywhere in Africa.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Hon. Opposition Member: Question!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, when elections came in 2006, the MMD had 150 candidates, the UDA had 148 and the PF had 110. 709 candidates were adopted. The PF got 804, 000 votes in the presidential elections. The President at that time, President Mwanawasa, SC., may his soul rest in peace, secured 1,177,000.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, his nearest rival was Mr Michael Chilufya Sata, even though he had a deficit of forty constituencies. From 110 constituencies, he secured 804,000 votes. The group of political parties, the UDA, only managed to secure 696 votes. There are 449 councils in the country. The MMD won in 397 of them.

Hon. Opposition Member: Which you were part of.

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, yes I was part of the MMD and I am proud of it. The UDA got 291 and the PF won 300 …

Hon. Government Members: Plus!

Mr Munkombwe: … plus. Mr Speaker, if you want to exist in politics, you must preach love and not hatred …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear! Tell them!

Mr Munkombwe: … and you will last for as long as I have lasted, … 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: … although, again, that statement is against your ruling, Mr Speaker.

Sir, how then did I find my way in the PF?

Interruptions{mospagebreak}

Mr Munkombwe: Four months before the 2011 General Elections, there was a council of chiefs in the Southern Province. I accompanied the then Vice-President to the Kuomboka Ceremony when five chiefs approached me and asked about the stories which were circulating that my relationship with the President was not in good books. When I came back, I was called by the President then, who told me that I went there to undermine his minister …

Mr Speaker: Order!

Hon. Minister, stick to issues and, please, refrain from debating yourself, including other persons, especially those who are not available in the House.

Continue, please.

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, I am grateful …

Interruptions

Hon. Opposition Members: Talk about developmental issues.

Mr Speaker: Order! 

He will select what he wants to talk about. You cannot suggest an agenda for him.

Please, continue.

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, how, then, can one individual be influential? I am the current hon. Minister for the Southern Province and I know that some people are embarrassed by the development that is taking place in the Southern Province. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: Sir, I have the privilege of being part of all the governments in this nation. In all these governments, we have been singing about the Bottom Road year in and out. However, in the current Government, it is being worked on and the works have gone as far as near Munyumbwe.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: The great man, the hon. Member of Parliament for …, again, perhaps that may not be possible.

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: He is appreciating what the PF Government is doing in his constituency.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Ntundu: On a point of order, Sir.

Hon. Governments Members: Continue!

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, I have been assured by His Excellency the President that he will be at the ground breaking ceremony for the Monze/Nicko Road. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: We have been singing about that road over the years. 

Ms Lubezhi waved her hand across her face.

Mr Munkombwe: You can wave your hand, but that is up to you. You are entitled to.

Hon. Opposition Member: We cannot see anything.

Mr Munkombwe: Mr Speaker, we have a programme of rehabilitating and building new schools and clinics and this is part of the PF Manifesto. Nobody is strong outside a strong party.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munkombwe: The PF Government won elections without me. 

Mr Speaker, recently, there was a football match between a very powerful party and us. I was asked to play the mid-field role …

Laughter

Mr Munkombwe: … with GBM (Hon. Geoffrey Bwalya Mwamba) as a defender, …

Laugher

Mr Munkombwe: … and Sylvia Masebo as Number 9. We scored and defeated. Just as Roger Milla was recalled in 1990 to play a game, I was also recalled. We scored and defeated the opponents.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Minister of Home Affairs (Mr Kampyongo): Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to support the adoption of the Report of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Affairs which has been moved by Hon. Lt-Gen. Shikapwasha and ably seconded by Hon. Chungu Bwalya.

Sir, I know that the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs will conclude the debate on behalf of the Government, but I just want to say that, as a ministry, we have taken keen interest in the first part of the report where your Committee has talked about the issues of registration of non-profit making organisations.

Indeed, the legislative framework relating to regulations of organisations in Zambia fell under a number of statutes, namely Societies Act Cap. 119 of the Laws of Zambia, the Companies Act No. 388, Legislation of Business Names, Act No. 16 of 2011, the Co-operative Act Cap. 397 of the Laws of Zambia, the Land and Perpetual Succession Act Cap. 186 and the Non-Governmental Organisation Act of 2009.

However, like I have indicated, the regulatory framework relating to the registration of non-profit making organisations is mainly falling under the Registrar of Societies Act Cap. 119, which falls under our ministry.

Sir, I am happy to note that your Committee invited critical organisations to make submissions. We have acknowledged and taken note of the observations that the Committee has made in relation to the Registrar of Societies. 

Mr Speaker, indeed, as a Government, we have started to put measures in place so that we make the Registrar of Societies more effective so that it serves the members of the public better. 

Mr Speaker, it is worth noting that by the time your Committee was conducting its business, the number of organisations, such as political parties, stood at thirty-eight. However, the number has since increased to forty-eight. 

Mr Speaker, we are also dealing with about 40,000 organisations and it has been very difficult for the Registrar of Societies to deal with these matters due to the lack of capacity and centralised operations. We would like to assure this House that the PF has decided to decentralise, as recommended by your Committee, the operations of the Registrar of Societies. We shall start by going down to the provincial centres and, budget permitting, we can have our presence in the districts.

Mr Speaker, the report has also recommended that we revisit Act 199 which, indeed, is not in tune with the prevailing situation. In doing so, we are trying to have an inclusive process where we will bring all the stakeholders together. It is worrying that we are seeing churches mushrooming everyday. There is no regulation to monitor the activities of some of these churches. 

Sir, we have requested all the church mother bodies, some of whom appeared before your Committee, to come up with a self-regulatory framework through which some of these organisations can be scrutinsed before submissions are made to the Registrar of the Societies. 

Further, we have noted the discrepancies which exist between the Companies Act and the Registrar of Societies. This has left room for unscrupulous characters to register their companies with the Patents and Companies Registration Agency (PACRA) as limited by guarantee. They do this because they know that the Registrar of Societies scrutinises individuals to determine their credibility to register an organisation. I would like to assure your Committee that we have also noted this discrepancy with concern and we have been doing everything possible, since last year, to try to harmonise the working arrangements between PACRA and the Registrar of Societies.

Mr Speaker, I would like to take this opportunity to remind members of the public that when they decide to register organisations, they must understand the obligations. I was talking about the number of political parties that we have. It is easy for people to register political parties, but it is another thing to maintain an organisation and ensure that all the statutory regulations are adhered to. In the past, we have seen people registering organisations and later abandoning them without coming back to the Registrar of Societies to indicate that they are no longer one Kantemba party …

Mr Speaker: What does that mean?

Mr Kampyongo: This means a party run solely so that we delete them from our records. As long as they are on our records, we continue to expect statutory fees. As people are coming to register these organisations, they must be aware of the requirements of the law.

Mr Speaker, every time there is an attempt to remind people of their statutory requirements, they start politicking … 

Prof. Lungwangwa: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Prof. Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Deputy Minister of Home Affairs, who is on the Floor, in order to debate without a written text? 

Mr Speaker, on several occasions, in previous rulings, you are on record as having advised members of the Executive, whether Cabinet Ministers or Deputy Ministers, not to speak off-the-cuff, but to debate from a clearly written text because what they say on the Floor of this House is policy. 

Mr Speaker, is the hon. Deputy Minister in order to stand before you and make pronouncements off-the-cuff without a written text? Is he in order, Sir? I need your serious ruling.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Last year, I made a ruling on this subject. In the course of that ruling I particularly cited the precedent that was set by the then Minister of Foreign Affairs, Hon. Given Lubinda, as a paragon of how these responses should be made. I stated that I hoped the colleagues on the right would take a cue from the then hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs. 

I would like to reiterate what I said then. It is important for hon. Ministers to respond in an informed manner and the best practice is to have a written response. I hope that this point will be taken note of so that we do not go over this point time and gain. 

In short, the hon. Deputy Minister of Home Affairs should take that point of order into account and I hope that he has a written response. 

You may continue, hon. Minister.

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Speaker, what I am referring to are written responses and …

Hon. Opposition Members: Aah!

Mr Kampyongo: … I have made it very clear that all the figures I am quoting are written. It is just that I understand the issues I am talking about very well. So, there should not be any worry that I am borrowing things from outside the report. That is why I have indicated that our only interest is the first part of the report which is talking about the Registrar of Societies which falls under our ministry. I will be very brief because I am aware that the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs will respond and wind up the rest of the issues.

Mr Speaker, I was informing the members of the public that it is a right for everyone to register an organisation, a political party and a society. However, they should know that as they do that, there are obligations that they need to fulfill in order for their entities to continue being in existence. As the PF Government, we are now going to make sure that, as we decentralise the operations of the Registrar of Societies, all the registered institutions are adhering to the provisions of the law. In short, I would like to finally assure your Committee that we have taken note of the need to decentralise our operations, computerise our record-keeping as well as avail the statutory fees members of the public are supposed to pay when they are applying for registration. 

With these few remarks, I beg to support the Motion, Mr Speaker. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

The Minister of Foreign Affairs (Dr Lungu): Mr Speaker, I am delighted to address this august House in the Second Session of the Eleventh National Assembly. Most importantly, allow me to congratulate the Chairperson of the Committee on National Security and Foreign Affairs on presenting the Motion to adopt the Committee’s report. I also wish to thank all the hon. Members who have contributed to this debate. 

Sir, on the conflict situation in Syria, Somalia, the DRC, Mali and the Sudan/South Sudan, the Committee raised important observations and recommendations. 

Mr Speaker, the escalation of conflict in the neighbouring countries have had a negative effect on Zambia as we have had to cope with the refugee situation which comes with social, economic and security challenges.

Mr Speaker, as this august House is aware, Zambia, being a member of SADC, COMESA, the International Conference on the ICGLR, AU and UN, is obliged to render support in mitigating conflict in hot spot countries in order to move promulgate the regional and continental developmental agenda. As such, Zambia has not been hesitant in positively contributing to efforts aimed at conflict prevention and resolution under regional, continental and international frameworks. In this regard, your Committee shall be updated on the prevailing situation in these countries soon.

Mr Speaker, on the ministry allocating the budgetary line for the maintenance of mission properties abroad, the House may wish to know that the ministry has a budgetary line, specifically for the maintenance of its properties abroad, but budgetary releases have not been adequate in the past. This has resulted in a backlog of maintenance works.

Sir, since there are a number of properties in missions abroad in a state of disrepair, the ministry is prioritising these for renovations. My ministry’s objective, in the long-run, is to own most of the properties instead of relying on rented office space and residential accommodation. 

Sir, recently, Zambia put up a spirited campaign for Hon. Mutati to the position of Director-General of the UN Conference on Trade and Development. Despite our candidate not being successful, not all is lost. We sold him very wisely and proudly as the nation of Zambia. Zambia shall continue to double her efforts in trying to secure jobs for her citizens in the international organisations to which it belongs. 

Mr Speaker, with these very few winding up remarks, I, once again, want to thank all those who have contributed to this very useful debate.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Lt-Gen. Shikapwasha: Mr Speaker, I thank every hon. Member who has contributed and, indeed, the hon. Minister for supporting this report. 

Mr Speaker, I beg to move.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Question put and agreed to.

REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON YOUTH AND SPORT

(Debate resumed)

Mr Mulomba: Mr Speaker, thank you for according me yet another opportunity to continue seconding the Motion which was ably moved by the Chairperson of our Committee. I will continue from where I ended on Friday, 28th June, 2013.

Sir, in the past, schools used to compete through provincial school leagues which enhanced commitment towards training as compared to the current system which is focused on short-term tournaments at zone, district and provincial levels.

Mr Speaker, talent cannot be developed using tournaments. A permanent league is required. Schools need to revamp sports days and use them as an opportunity for different schools to compete. School competitions, once well-developed and co-ordinated, could offer a remedy to many of the challenges that the country is facing in the sporting sector. 

Sir, may I remind this august House that, in the past, the country had a Schools Eleven National Team. Most of those players ended up in the Senior Football National Team. Players like the late Ashios Melu, may his soul rest in peace, Kalusha Bwalya, popularly known as Great Kalu, and others made their names from schools and ended up in the National Football Team.
Mr Speaker, your Committee, therefore, strongly recommends that the Government should enforce the introduction of sports in schools by reintroducing the sports day and sports league so as to tap the much-needed talent in the country.
Sir, your Committee also bemoans the perpetual encroachment of sports facilities in the country. This has greatly contributed to the country’s poor performance in international sports competitions. Your Committee is very concerned because institutions and public officers charged with the responsibility of protecting community and public sports infrastructure have been found wanting as they are in the forefront of these encroachments.
Mr Speaker, your Committee was saddened and disappointed during its tour on the Copperbelt. In Luanshya, at Roan Antelope Golf Course in particular, it found thirteen heads of cattle, pigs, goats, ducks and chickens grazing on a golf course.
Hon. Opposition Members: Shame!
Mr Mulomba: From its findings, your Committee was notified and believed, beyond any reasonable doubt, that the herd talked about belonged to one of the legislators, …
Hon. Opposition Members: Aah! 
Mr Mulomba: … which is very sad.
Mr Speaker, a case in point is the inability of Zambia to benefit from the FIFA Goal Three Project which would have seen pitches placed at the Football Association of Zambia (FAZ) Technical Centre near the Independence Stadium. However, the situation, as it is, is that houses have been erected hindering the project from being implemented. Your Committee, therefore, recommends that the Government demolishes all structures that have been erected on sports facilities such as golf courses, community and school grounds.
 Lastly, allow me to thank you, Hon. Mr Speaker and the Clerk of the National Assembly for the guidance rendered to your Committee during its deliberations. Allow me to also thank the members of your Committee for giving me this opportunity to second this important Motion. I beg to second.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Mr Muntanga (Kalomo Central): Mr Speaker, I wish to support the Report of your Committee on Youth and Sport. The issues raised in this report are very important. As I have always said, the only worrying fact about your reports is that they are hardly read. After I debated the other day, I went to the pigeonholes and found that they were filled with reports.  Ever since they were placed there, they have never been read. Some hon. Members do not even bother to read them. It is very important that your reports are read and, please, encourage the hon. Members to read them. We will not stop reminding the Executive on the importance of reading the reports.
Sir, we are trying to depart from the trend of stopping to support sport in proper ways. As the report has stipulated, schools have stopped encouraging sports in schools in contrast to what is required of them. It goes further than that because physical education, which was very well supported, is currently not being supported. The Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education needs to review its syllabus and ensure that physical education is brought back. We have heard that good players came from schools and later joined the National Football Team. So, what have we lost? We have stopped tapping talent in sport from schools.
Mr Speaker, in some countries, there are special schools that train young people in various sport fields. It is important for us to correct what has been brought out in the report. I know that we always talk about inadequate funds to support sports activities. However, there is one thing that I have observed and it worries me because if corrected, it can be a source of funds. Whenever we have these games, for instance, the game in Ndola between the Zambia National Football Team and Sudan, aside the tickets that were printed, a large number of complimentary tickets were also printed. These were given to the people that could afford to pay for ordinary tickets. Most of the hon. Ministers, actually, go to the Very Important Persons (VIP) Wing using complimentary tickets.
Hon. Government Member: Question!
Hon. Opposition Member: Look at them.
Mr Muntanga: This does not only happen during sports events, if they are saying question.
Mr Speaker: Just continue, hon. Member.
Mr Muntanga: This also happened during the just-concluded trade fair event. Out of the 8,000 tickets printed, 2,000 were complimentary. We are not going to underplay these situations. Let us be serious. We should tell the VIPs to pay for their tickets. Why should the poor people in the compounds pay while the VIPs use complimentary tickets to attend these events? They should also pay because we need those monies to raise and improve the sport training facilities.
Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!
Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, that is the point that I am making. It should never be underplayed. I want the hon. Minister of Youth and Sport to check that. I would like to urge the various organisations that are in support of various sports disciplines such as FAZ, Zambia Association of Paralympics (ZAPA) and the tennis association, among others, to avoid introducing these complimentary tickets in the case of a big competition. If you are inviting, me, Hon. Muntanga, you should let me pay. I do not need to watch these games for free. All these people that are saying that I am going to be …
Mr Livune: On a point of order, Sir.
Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.
Mr Livune: Mr Speaker, I sincerely apologise to the Igwe, Hon. Muntanga, who is on the Floor debating so well.
Mr Speaker: Who?
Mr Livune: I have disturbed his flow of debate, but my point of order is on whether he is in order to tell us about those tickets which are printed, more or less, as souvenirs to the hon. Ministers and other people without telling the nation that those are actually subsidies.
I need your ruling, Sir.
Laughter
Hon. Members: Question!
Mr Speaker: I am sure that there is a distinction between ‘complimentary’ and a ‘subsidy’.
Continue, hon. Member.
Laughter
Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, I am grateful for that point of order. The term complimentary means that they can watch these sporting events for free, but, in a way and to their dissatisfaction, it may be looked at as their acquiring these tickets at a subsidised rate. Since they are doing away with subsidies, I think the use of those complimentary tickets to enter the stadiums should come to an end.
Mr Speaker, in the report, it is stated that various sporting grounds are being misused. An issue in point is where, in Luanshya, a herd of cattle, including goats and pigs, were led to graze on a golf course. I think the person in charge is running the grounds as a farm.
Hon. Government Member: Question!
Mr Muntanga: The question is that: Would you remove those animals …
Laughter
Mr Muntanga: … from those grounds because they are not supposed to be there? Mr Speaker, your Committee has submitted that those animals must be removed from those grounds. It does not matter who owns them. In my opinion, the Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock should place these animals elsewhere.   

Mr Speaker, I am at a loss because the Luanshya Municipal Council has regulations on where animals must be kept. If the municipal, city and district councils reach a stage where they cannot differentiate between a sports pitch and grazing field, then, they are a letdown. They have powers to impound these animals and place them in designated areas. However, we have reached a level where animals can graze on a golf course. Perhaps, there is no more golf in Luanshya. 

Hon. Government Member: Question!

Mr Muntanga: This is not something we should ignore. Let us correct the situation. We need to look after the various sporting fields, whether for soccer or any other sports discipline, so that we can enable our youth to participate in different sports disciplines.

 Sir, in the olden times, when we went to school, facilities for different sporting activities were available for young people. There were swimming pools, tennis courts for lawn tennis, facilities for table tennis and courts for volleyball. Now, you will find a poultry house or a teacher’s house where a sports pitch is supposed to be, shoving sports aside. Why should a sporting field have teachers’ houses built on it? Let us find another area for sporting activities. If we do not do this, no one will ever do well in sport. 

At this point, Sir, I wish to congratulate the National Assembly of Zambia on beating the National Assembly of Malawi in chess, netball and football. 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: Sir, I have had problems because every time I met up with our friends in Malawi, especially your counterpart, he harassed me over losing to Malawi. Although I was not around during the games, I celebrated when I heard that we had beaten Malawi 2 goals to 1 in football. 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: I am now itching to meet your counterpart, Sir. 

Laughter 

Mr Muntanga:  Although I am reliably informed that he played for half an hour, it was good. 

Laughter 

Mr Muntanga: Had I been around, I would have played for ten minutes. 

Laughter 

Mr Speaker: He played for less than half an hour. 

Laughter 

Mr Muntanga: We look forward to such sporting activities. I hope that the next games will include my good friend, Hon. Geoffrey Bwalya Mwamba, and others.  

Mr Kampyongo: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Speaker is the hon. Member in order to simply praise the team and not mention to the House that the games were, actually, his and Hon. Mooya’s idea? Is he in order not to mention to the nation that he suggested an idea which he has since abandoned?  When we were in Malawi, he indicated to the Hon. Mr Speaker that he would be part of the team, but we have never seen him on the pitch. 

Laughter 

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member for Kalomo Central was not in the House earlier this afternoon when I indicated that we are actually extending the sports disciplines to include boxing.

Laughter 

Mr Speaker: I think that it is appropriate that he is now back. 

You may proceed. 

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, I introduced something that Hon. Kampyongo is doing very well in. I am on the verge of retiring from playing soccer and I intend to be the coach. 

Laughter 

Mr Muntanga: The hon. Minister will agree that it was through my tutoring that he is doing so well. As regards boxing, I will leave that to my friend, GBM.

Laughter 

Mr Muntanga: He is very good at that.

Sir, we will support sport. Our womenfolk also won, but, unfortunately, they were not heavily supported. I did not see the Clerk of the National Assembly play. 

Mr Speaker: No, she played. 

Mr Muntanga: All the Clerks-at-the-Table should have played. 

Laughter 

Mr Muntanga: We shall support the games. 

Mr Speaker, I am concerned about the youth. Where are the children? What games are we supporting? Are we able to support them? If we do not have nurseries for all sport disciplines, then, we have a problem. We will not be winners. Let us stop talking about playing names. Let us start using the young ones in sport. This way, we will win.  

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

Dr Kalila (Lukulu East): Mr Speaker, I want to thank you most sincerely for affording me an opportunity to add my voice to the debate on this Motion. From the outset, I would like to say that, like Hon. Muntanga, I support your Committee’s work.  

Mr Speaker, sport is a very big social venture and, for some of us, it goes beyond words. As you are aware, sport can be used as a tool for empowerment for our youth, which is exactly what Hon. Muntanga put across. It can also be used for recreational and health purposes. I know that in the case of our Parliamentary team, it was used as a tool of interaction with colleagues as well as for recreation and keeping healthy. 

However, beyond this, sport answers to the tenets of other economic spheres. In fact, in other nations, sport has contributed to the Gross Domestic Product (GDP). It is for this reason that I would like to believe that it should be taken more seriously than just mere pronouncements. 

Mr Speaker, Africa is awash with talent, but it is mind boggling how we continue to underperform. The simple reason is the lack of organisation. Sport is very complex. It is an intricate enterprise and unless we understand it fully, we will continue to underperform even though we have the requisite talent. 

Mr Speaker, in continuing with my debate, I would like to first and foremost acknowledge the strides that we have achieved as a nation, considering where we are coming from. No doubt, we have made some appreciable gains. I know that your Committee was looking at the reasons for underperformance and what can be done. 

Sir, in Zambia, sport appears to be synonymous with soccer, but this should not be the case. Even now, we are talking more about the Parliamentary soccer team than the other two disciplines. It is good, however, to note that you intend to broaden the sphere. We are looking forward to Hon. Muntanga going to the Malawian Parliament as a professional soccer player, wrestler or boxer when he retires. 

Laughter {mospagebreak}

Dr Kalila: Mr Speaker, before I go to what I feel we can do concerning sport, I think that it is important to note that there have been some gains that have been made. As you are aware, sport thrives on the feel-good-factor. The feel-good-factor is when sportsmen are doing fine and winning. Everyone gets excited and companies even begin to get commercial value out of this feel-good-factor. They pour in money and try to get commercial mileage out of it. Generally, this is what is known as sports marketing and we have made some strides in this area. 

We have made some strides in this area as well as in the results. For a long time, we were not able to win some of these major trophies, but more recently, in 2012, we were, for the first time, able to win the African Cup of Nations, which obviously must be acknowledged as we criticise some of our efforts. The nation also began to host major tournaments, which we were not able to do before. For instance, we are now about to host the Council of Southern Africa Football Associations (COSAFA) Tournament. The All Africa Games were successfully hosted in our country when, in the past, we were not able to do that.

Mr Speaker, in the area of infrastructure, before, it was a shame to invite international players to play on their home grounds. However, now, the nation is beginning to make strides. This is because an athlete needs an environment in which he can play his trade. If he is a tennis player, he needs a tennis court and if he is a footballer, he needs a football pitch. The people who also watch these sporting events also need somewhere to sit. Now, we are seeing a roll out of massive infrastructure, not to mention, of course, our showpiece stadium, the Levy Mwanawasa Stadium. We are now working on the Lusaka Stadium, which will even be bigger and more beautiful than the Levy Mwanawasa Stadium. There is also talk of the Ndola Stadium and I thought I heard some rumours or murmurs about the Livingstone Stadium. That is the way to go if the nation intends to develop sport.

Mr Speaker, we have seen attempts to professionalise our leagues. All those that are familiar with football will realise that there is an attempt to make the football clubs run as professional businesses. They have all been asked to register as commercial entities or companies, with Chief Executive Officers (CEOs) and elaborative administrative systems and structures. That is how sport is moving worldwide.

However, Sir, we have seen that, for a very long time, we have continued to cry because we are not at a level where we ought to be. That is the reason your Committee obviously felt that there was a need to raise the profile of sport. They went round and looked at various reasons we appear to have stagnated. This is where I will base my debate very briefly.

Sir, to begin with, in the Zambian context, one of the biggest problems our sport is skewed towards football and is also not making a major stride is because of our policy environment. Our policy environment does not favour or support the production of quality athletes or champions. This is because there is a big disconnection between the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education and the Ministry of Youth and Sport. That is the number one problem. I say so because athletes are better coached or trained or discovered when they are still young. 

Mr Speaker, your Committee has mentioned that fact, but the biggest pool of young people is under the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education. However, there is no synergy between these two ministries. Hon. Members will recall that many years ago, when Zambia was doing very well and producing sportsmen was when the Ministry of Youth and Sport was under the Ministry of Education. I think, then, it was called the Ministry of Culture, Education and Sports. Since so many aspects were placed together, at that particular time, a lot of money was going to this ministry and it trickled to sport. However, at the moment, the greatest pool of our children is under the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education and very little money goes there. The budgetary allocation to sports under the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education is paltry. Hon. Members will agree with me that when they are in their constituencies, schools request them for footballs and jerseys. That is so because everything is going to the Ministry of Youth and Sport which does not collaborate with the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education.

Sir, there is a need to, obviously, re-engineer our policy environment so that there is a greater synergy between the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education and the Ministry of Youth and Sport if we are to identify these athletes while they are still young.

Mr Speaker, secondly, I do not know how many hon. Members realise that, as a country, we appear to be very strong on individual sports. Although we spend most of our money on group sport such as football, you can agree with me that we have done better on individual sport such as boxing where we have produced Mr Lottie Mwale. In Chess, we have had several boys graduating and, only recently, we had one athlete trying to reach Kenya by road.

Sir, we need to re-engineer our policy to also concentrate on individual sports. I think, as a nation, we are much stronger on individual sport than on football where we have been pumping in huge resources. I am not saying we should not pump money into football because I support it 110 per cent, but I think that we should also begin to look at various other areas. For example, we have Esther Phiri and Catherine Phiri in boxing, Manyuchi and the youngman, Phiri, who is an athlete. I think that our policy environment should begin to consider that while we continue to pour resources into football, we can do much better in realising individual sport.

Thirdly, on the issue of youth development, I would like to state that there can be no success in the area of sports without major investments in youth development programmes.

Sir, even the current Brazilian Football National Team, which we were watching recently, comprised of players who are a product of an elaborate youth development system. Even when the team already has good players such as Kaka and all these others, we have not seen them feature in the current Confederations Cup because they are developing a future team embracing the young. Just to buttress the importance of youth development, you realise that the success attributable to our national soccer team at the last Africa Cup of Nations is as a result of most of these young players who were groomed or developed by various individuals. I can give various examples and I am sure Mr Sikazwe there agrees with me.

Mr Sikazwe indicated assent.

Dr Kalila: Mr Speaker, you see, Mr Kennedy Mweene came through an elaborate youth system from Telesport and Kitwe United. Rainford Kalaba, Jacob Mulenga and Stophila Sunzu came from Afrisport while Davies Nkausu came from Chiparamba. These boys were a result of various individuals who ran these youth development programmes. The point here is that, development programmes work. However, in the past, we have spent most of our money on participation rather than development. You will agree with me that hon. Members in this House always questioned why we spend billions when it was time to participate in a tournament only to lose. The next time there is another tournament, you send a team only to lose. So, it became a cycle of investing money in tired legs and we were losing.

Mr Speaker, not until we invest in an elaborate development programme in all sport disciplines shall we begin to reap benefits for a very long time.

Mr Speaker, obviously, you can never succeed in sport without the requisite funding. I would like to make a case that, obviously, a lot of money should be given to the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education for development programmes and that the two ministries should come together to see how some of those programmes which we had in the past can be rekindled. The unfortunate part about our setup is that we venture into programmes which are too small to make an impact. Many times, hon. Members ask what the Government is doing to develop sport and the answer is that there is a programme focused on youth sports, but that does not make any impact. The way to go is to increase resources to these development programmes and also refocus our policy on sport so that we do not only participate, but also pay attention to development. There is also a need to support those individuals, groups and teams that are involved in development. We also need to look at the issue of reserve leagues which, I think, the Committee talked about.

Mr Speaker, to allow my other colleagues to add their voices to this debate, I will end here.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mooya (Moomba): Mr Speaker, from the outset, I would like to say that I support this report. I only have two issues to discuss.

Mr Speaker, the first one is on page 16 and 17 regarding the problem of water. The stadium is brand new, and yet we already have a problem regarding water. I think this should be looked into quickly. I also note that the Government gives a grant of K84,000 per month for the stadium’s expenses and I am wondering for how long the Government will continue doing this.

Mr Speaker, the second issue is on the new Dag Hammarskjöeld Stadium. I have a feeling that we need a second …

Mr Speaker: Which stadium are you referring to? Is it Dag Hammarskjöeld or Levy Mwanawasa?

Mr Mooya: Pardon me. It is Levy Mwanawasa.

Laughter

Mr Mooya: I feel we are putting too much pressure on this stadium because all the national league and international matches are played there. So, I would suggest that we have a second stadium in Ndola, just like we have here in Lusaka, to supplement the existing one. Lusaka has an old and new stadium.

Mr Speaker, I have in mind the Dag Hammarskjöeld Stadium in Itawa, Ndola. The building process for this stadium started in 1989. Massive steel and concrete piles were sunk underground. As far as I know, the substructure was ready a long time ago and what remained was the super structure. Over the weekend, I was reading an article on page 16 of the Times of Zambia dated 18th November, 2005. It was stated in this newspaper that 1,234 piles of concrete were sunk and each standard pile measures 12 m. Now if you multiply that 12 m by 1,234, you get about 15 km of piles sunk underground. That is a lot of money going down the drain. 

Mr Speaker, in addition to that, there are five support pillars already buried underground. Each pillar weighs 100 tonnes. If you multiply five by 100 tonnes, you get about 500 tonnes buried underground. So, like I pointed out earlier on, we need a second stadium to supplement the Levy Mwanawasa Stadium to reduce pressure on the new stadium. When the hon. Minister reacts to the contributions that have been made on this debate, I would like him to tell us what plans the Government has for the substructure in Itawa, which was started a long time ago, awaiting a super structure.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mutale (Kwacha): Mr Speaker, thank you for giving me this opportunity to accept and appreciate the Report on Youth and Sport. We have the National Sports Council of Zambia (NSCZ) which is the mother body of sport in this country. However, it seems to be a very silent body because it does not come up with programmes to encourage sports. In the past, I remember that there was a programme initiated by the NSCZ called Sports for All. When this programme was started, it was inclusive of all sport disciplines. Today, we have not seen what has been achieved from that programme. So, we would want to see that programme resuscitated so that sport disciplines are spread out all over the country, especially to the rural areas which do not have the same facilities as the urban areas. There is talent lying idlY in most rural areas.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: Mr Speaker, when the Sports for All Programme is well-implemented, especially in rural areas like I mentioned earlier, we will capture a lot of talent. We have a lot of swimmers in areas around water bodies like THE Zambezi River, Lake Bangweulu, Washishi and Lake Tanganyika, among others.

Interruptions

Mr Mutale: If the swimmers in these rural areas were given the opportunity to swim in a pool, they would make very good swimmers. That is the kind of talent which is lying idly in the rural areas. 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: Mr Speaker, if you recall, we used to have Yotam Muleya, may his soul rest in peace, who represented Zambia at international sports tournaments before we had any sports facilities to talk of.

Mr Speaker, I remember the question I posed earlier in the House about community centres. These centres play a major role in molding children in various sport disciplines or careers. Your Committee recommended that we need to catch them young. Catching them young should not just be done in schools. If boys and girls get exposed to different types of sport such as athletics, football, netball, table tennis, which they call ping pong and draughts, among other sport disciplines, before they start school, they will develop interest in sport at a tender age. If you go to certain countries, you will see the amount of sport activities being played by toddlers. They are trained to compete in rugby, football or tennis at a tender age. That encourages them and they make up their mind of what sport career to pursue. 

Mr Speaker, I would like to urge hon. Members of Parliament to start engaging in sport activities in their constituencies so that we can evoke an interest for sport among our people. Otherwise, if we just leave it to one group, we will not be able to succeed in sports development. The only way we can achieve this is by heavily investing in various sport disciplines. That is when we can win gold medals or trophies in international competitions.

Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Education …

Mr Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1815 hours until 1830 hours.

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Mutale: Mr Speaker, before Business was suspended, I was saying that sport at constituency level should also be encouraged. In this regard, all hon. Members of Parliament must approach the hon. Minister of Youth and Sport for support. I know that support has been there in the form of jerseys and footballs, but we should interpret this into actual competition amongst constituencies so that we can ensure our participation in the development of sport.  

Mr Speaker, the issue of community centres, which I talked about earlier, can be related to constituencies. For example, Kwacha Constituency already has sports infrastructure and I am happy that the ministry will help us revamp sport centres so that children can go there and participate in various sport. 

 Mr Speaker, your Committee spoke about infrastructure which is key in sport development. It toured several dilapidated infrastructure which has been left to go to waste. I note also that Mopani Copper Mines Plc has embarked on infrastructure refurbishment. For example, Nkana Stadium, today, has a new look. Special individual seats like those we only see on Digital Satellite Television (DSTV) have been installed at Nkana Stadium. The surface and the surroundings have been worked on and an additional pitch for training purposes has been put up. The Mopani Copper Mines Plc has also embarked on the refurbishment of the dilapidated Nshinde Stadium and an Olympic standard swimming pool has also been worked on in Mufulira.

Sir, when your Committee speaks about investors giving back as a form of corporate social responsibility, it means what Mopani Copper Mines Plc is doing. For example, in my constituency, the Diggers Rugby Club is one of the best sporting facilities in this country. Your Committee toured the club which has a state-of-the-art gymnasium. Although the space is a bit tight, the equipment which has been bought for the players and the public in general for the purpose of keeping fit is something to admire and we should commend Mopani Copper Mines Plc for that.

Mr Speaker, the list is endless. The point is that we should encourage big companies in this country to take up the responsibility of assisting the Government in improving infrastructure in the areas where they operate by setting up facilities like it was in the past. From the background of the provision of sports facilities is where the late Emment Kapengwe, Godfrey Chitalu and others, may their souls rest in peace, were born.

Mr Speaker, your Committee’s observations in infrastructure development programmes are correct and I agree with its findings. We need to make headway so that we can become a sporting nation with infrastructure that supports sport.  The only problem that we have is that we mostly put emphasis on football. Yes, world over, football is a popular sport. However, we cannot afford to ignore other sport disciplines which have equally brought honour and glory to this country.

Mr Speaker, not so long ago, a cricket national team went to South Africa and brought honour to this country. This means that if we invested in this sport, we could achieve a lot. Therefore, we must pay particular attention to some of these sport disciplines so that they are also funded and made strong.

Mr Speaker, another issue is that sport administrators in most sport disciplines are not adequately trained as your Committee observed. For someone to impart knowledge to another, he/she must be adequately prepared. However, what we see is one athlete trying to teach another. It is an honour that we have our Samuel Matete who competed at high levels of competition. Today, Samuel Matete is imparting knowledge in sports men and women. However, we only have a few of Samuel Matete’s calibre. Therefore, we need to do more to tap talent. Some of the talented people are just not interested because they have not been encouraged. We need to bring them on board so that they can help us to develop sport in Zambia because without technocrats and coaches, we are not going to do anything.

Mr Speaker, there used to be a lot of cycling in this country. Suddenly, cycling, as a sport, has gone quiet. Why? It may be because there is nobody who is driving it. As a country, we must identify people who can drive some of these sport disciplines. Otherwise, we will want to compete, but not have people to manage these sport disciplines.

Mr Speaker, in conclusion, I would like to say that we can only achieve something in sport if we invest in it. If we do not invest, we cannot expect to reap anything that is good out of it. All the gold medals that we see in various sport disciplines where some countries walk away with ten or fifteen come a long way in terms of preparations, and yet we want to take people that are ill-prepared, after camping for two to three weeks, to compete against people that have been exposed to high levels of competition. 

They do not even know when to take a break, slow down or increase their pace. This is because the coaches have not been exposed. Sport has now become scientific. It is so scientific that somebody has to understand the effect of the direction in which the wind is blowing has on their sport. Therefore, just telling an athlete to just do certain things to get to the top does not work, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker, I agree with and support the findings and recommendations of your Committee.

I thank you, Sir.

The Minister of Transport, Works, Supply, and Communications (Mr Mukanga): Mr Speaker, we thank your Committee for the report and appreciate the comments raised by all the debaters.

Mr Speaker, we will look at all these issues and implement those that we are able to. We will also find a way of implementing those that can be implemented later. 

Mr Speaker, we would like to support sports in Zambia because we know that Zambia is not only a Christian nation, but also a sporting nation. We would like to be leaders in the region and in Africa as a whole. We understand the challenges that were faced in the past, especially at the NSCZ, which is our co-ordinating body. However, we are addressing these issues within the limited resource envelope that we have.

Mr Speaker, to improve the quality of sportsmen in the country, we have a programme called Sports Education and Accreditation Systems at the Olympic Youth Development Centre (OYDC) that is being implemented. This programme is aimed at building capacity for coaches, referees, and sports administrators in various sports associations. We are also carrying out talent identification in the provinces. We will reorganise the management style and ensure that Zambia’s sport is not the same with the commitment of our Government. 

Mr Speaker, we will also try to look at the Ndola Dag Hammarskjöeld Stadium site. We will send engineers to look at the substructure so that we check what is there and how it can be utilised. We are doing a lot of improvement to stadia in the provinces. This year, we have earmarked working on Maramba Stadium in Livingstone, David Livingstone Stadium in Chipata and Mongu Stadium in Mongu. These projects are on course. When these stadia are constructed, they are not only going to be meant for football. They will have various provisions for other games and it is important for everybody in the country to know that we are not only looking at soccer, but also other games. We desire to create an enabling environment to move sport from one level to another. 

Sir, we also request all stakeholders to come on board and plough back in the community through supporting sport in this country. We need corporate social responsibility that will speak for itself rather than only having it written on posters. We want everybody to come on board like some mining houses have done on the Copperbelt.

Mr Speaker, with these few words, I thank you, Sir.

Mr L. J. Ngoma (Sinda): Mr Speaker, I would like to thank all the hon. Members from both sides who have debated this issue. On a lighter note, as regards the issue raised by Hon. Muntanga, your Committee was adequately informed that should those animals continue grazing on that golf course, they would be taken to the abattoir.

Laughter

Mr L. J. Ngoma: Mr Speaker, that is what the council said. I thank Hon. Dr Kalila, Hon. Vitalis Mooya and Hon. Mutale from Kitwe. It now remains for the Executive to further dissect this report. You, Mr Speaker, and your Committee await its positive response through the Action-Taken Report.

Mr Speaker, I beg that this House do adopt the report.

I thank you, Sir.

Question put and agreed to.

Mr Speaker: Order!

ADJOURNMENT

The Vice President (Dr Scott): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

Question put and agreed to.

________

The House adjourned at 1846 hours until 1430 hours on Thursday, 4th July, 2013.