- Home
- About Parliament
- Members
- Committees
- Publications
Debates- Friday, 29th November, 2013
DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE THIRD SESSION OF THE ELEVENTH ASSEMBLY
Friday, 29th November, 2013
The House met at 0900 hours
[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]
NATIONAL ANTHEM
PRAYER
______
ANNOUNCEMENT BY MR SPEAKER
FOUNTAIN OF HOPE MEETING ON HOMOSEXUALITY AND ABORTION
Mr Speaker: Hon. Members, I have an announcement to make. I wish to inform the House that I have authorised the Fountain of Hope, a local non-governmental organisation (NGO), to hold a half-day meeting for hon. Members of Parliament on 3rd December, 2013, from 0930 hours to 1200 hours in the Amphitheatre, Parliament Buildings. The meeting will focus on the health aspects of homosexuality and abortion. Let me hasten to add that on 16th July, 2013, the organisation held a one-day meeting with some members of the Committees on Legal Affairs, Governance, Human Rights, Gender Matters and Child Affairs, and Health, Community Development and Social Services. Arising from that meeting, the hon. Members who attended the meeting recommended that the information that was disseminated was vital and should, therefore, be further disseminated to all hon. Members of Parliament, hence the meeting. As usual, attendance at this meeting will be on a voluntary basis.
I urge all hon. Members to attend this very important meeting.
I thank you.
Hon. Members: Hear, hear!
_______
BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE
The Vice-President (Dr Scott): Mr Speaker, in accordance with your instruction, I rise to acquaint the House with the programme that has been drawn up for next week.
Sir, on Tuesday, 3rd December, 2013, the Business of the House will begin with Questions for Oral Answer. This will be followed by presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. The House will then resolve into Committee of Supply on the 2014 Estimates of Revenue and Expenditure, and will consider the following Votes:
Head 76 – Ministry of Youth and Sport;
Head 31 – Ministry of Justice; and
Head 18 – Judiciary.
Sir, this will, of course, be preceded by the residue Votes from today, which are likely to be the Anti-Corruption Commission and Ministry of Labour and Social Security.
Mr Speaker, on Wednesday, 4th December, 2013, the Business of the House will begin with Questions for Oral Answer. This will be followed by presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. Thereafter, the House will consider Private Members’ Motions, if there will be any. After that, the House will deal with the second reading stage of the following Bills;
(a) The Competition and Consumer Protection (Amendment) Bill; National Assembly Bill No. 15, 2013;
(b) The Environmental Management (Amendment) Bill, National Assembly Bill No. 16, 2013;
(c) The Fees and Fines (Amendment) Bill, National Assembly Bill No. 17, 2013;
(d) The Patents and Companies Registration Agency (Amendment) Bill, National Assembly Bill No. 18, 2013; and
(e) The Weights and Measures (Amendment) Bill, National Assembly Bill No.19, 2013.
Mr Speaker, the House will then resolve into Committee of Supply to continue with the 2014 Budget and will consider the following Votes:
Head 88, 90-98 – Office of the President – Provinces.
Sir, on Thursday, 5th December, 2013, the Business of the House will start with Questions for Oral Answer. This will be followed by presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. Thereafter, the House will resolve into Committee of Supply on the 2014 Estimates of Revenue and Expenditure and will continue considering the following Votes:
Heads 88, 90-98 – Office of the President – Provinces.
Sir, on Friday, 6th December, 2013, the Business of the House will commence with the Vice-President’s Question Time, assuming that he is not in possession of a letter from the doctor, excusing him from this responsibility.
Laughter
The Vice-President: Sir, this will be followed by Questions to hon. Ministers, if there will be any. After that, the House will deal with presentation of Government Bills, if there will be any. Then, the House will resolve into Committee of Supply on the 2014 Estimates of Revenue and Expenditure and will continue to consider Votes 88, 90-98 – Office of the President – Provinces.
Mr Speaker, I thank you.
_______
HIS HONOUR THE VICE-PRESIDENT’S QUESTION TIME
Mr Mbewe (Chadiza): Mr Speaker, students from the University of Zambia (UNZA) and the Copperbelt University (CBU) are considered for bursaries. I would like to find out if the Government is considering offering bursaries to students from other universities such as Mulungushi.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, that is a new Budget line. However, that is part of the plan.
I thank you, Sir.
Dr Kaingu (Mwandi): Mr Speaker, your Government has removed fertiliser and fuel subsidies, frozen wage increments, suspended recruitment in the Civil Service and now wants to over-borrow. It is clear from the writing on the wall that your Government is broke. Why do you not just run away or when will you run away?
Laughter
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, the reply to that question should be something like, “I can no longer afford the fuel to put in my car to run away so I am stuck here with him.”
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Laughter
Mr Mucheleka (Lubansenshi): Mr Speaker, the Government has expressed disappointment at some of the mining companies that are avoiding paying tax. I know that the civil society has given evidence to that effect. I would like to know if the Government has taken steps to correct the anomaly by engaging the mining companies.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, the Zambia Revenue Authority (ZRA) is in continuous dialogue with both the major and minor taxpayers. Certainly, as a mining company, you cannot just produce a set of accounts, send it to the ZRA and expect everything that you put in that set of accounts to be automatically accepted. That is not how taxation works. There is continuous dialogue, inquiries and so on and so forth. We are strengthening the capacity of the ZRA so that it is able to capture all the people who ought to be paying tax. That is just part of the game of life. Obviously, people do not like paying tax and if they can get away with it, they will. However, the Government’s job is to stop them from getting away with it.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mushanga (Bwacha): Mr Speaker, we have read in one of the newspapers that the vice-president of the United Party for National Development (UPND), Dr Canisius Banda, visited State House and, because of that, he is under pressure from his party to disclose the purpose of the visit. May His Honour the Vice-President tell this House and the nation at large if visiting State House is restricted to certain citizens.
Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!
Interruptions
Mr Speaker: Order!
The Vice-President: Sir, that is a matter that relates to very basic civics. Of course, I cannot comment on the relationship between Dr Banda and his party. It would be very superfluous of me to talk about that but, certainly, as far as any Zambian citizen or, in fact, any Zambian resident is concerned, if the President invites him/her or he/she invites himself/herself to State House, it is perfectly normal to speak to the Head of State. It is not a political-party matter. I do not happen to know the content of that meeting. I would not even divulge it if I did, but it is perfectly standard, in peaceful times, for matters of business in the country to carry on.
I thank you, Sir.
Ms Namugala (Mafinga): Mr Speaker, early this year, the Government of the Republic of Zambia sent millions of litres of fuel to Malawi under very unclear circumstances. I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President whether Malawi has paid for this fuel because you will agree with me that we need that money to deal with the many challenges that our people are facing.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, that question was posed some time back so, it is an old question for the Vice-President’s Question Time. I think it was last year when the predecessor to President Joyce Banda, Mr Bingu wa Mutarika, died. We helped out with some fuel to keep Malawi running for a couple of weeks while the South Africans were organising themselves and basically took over. As far as I am aware, the Malawian Government is liable to pay us for that fuel at some stage, but I doubt it has done so. However, I must say that I am quite proud that we were able to step in and bring law and order to one of our neighbours.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Muntanga (Kalomo Central): Mr Speaker, there are problems at UNZA because a student died …
Lt-Gen. Rev. Shikapwasha: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.
Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.
Lt-Gen. Rev. Shikapwasha: Mr Speaker, is His Honour the Vice-President of the Republic of Zambia in order not to answer Hon. Namugala’s question? Has Malawi paid for that fuel or not? If not, when will it pay?
Mr Speaker: I think he answered that question to the extent that he was not sure, if I gathered him right.
Interruptions
Mr Speaker: That is also an answer.
Laughter
Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, UNZA lost a student last week due to typhoid. It is said that the health situation at the university is very bad. What is the Government doing to ensure that no more students die?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, if I recall correctly, the hon. Member for Kalomo Central arrived a few minutes late for the Vice-President’s Question Time last week. That is why he is now asking me the question that somebody else asked me last week. I will repeat, very briefly, the answer which is that there is no logical evidence or clinical history that, that disease was acquired in the university. The poor-deceased person had just been to Mongu and came back from there the previous day. So, it is unlikely that she contracted the disease at the university. Meanwhile, the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education is reviewing the state of all the institutions of learning with a view to ensuring that standards are up to the required level.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mwila (Chipili): Mr Speaker, can His Honour Vice-President inform the House and the nation how far the Government has gone with the works on the Bottom Road because hon. Members of Parliament from the Southern Province have been complaining about the state of this road.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, so far as I am aware, the Bottom Road is under construction. The project is at the stage of contractors mobilising and starting work from both ends towards the middle. That is the situation as it is obtaining on the ground, according to my sources.
I thank you, Sir.
Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Sir, time and time again, His Honour the Vice-President has used me as a pawn when hon. Members of Parliament have asked him questions about the repair of infrastructure that has suffered disasters associated with extreme weather conditions. Now, I am a bit tired and have lost patience. The Mugoto Dam, which got damaged in February this year, should have qualified to be repaired under the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) emergency response. Assurances have come from His Honour the Vice-President and this department. I have looked in the Yellow Book, but, have not seen any allocation for the repair of Mugoto Dam. I risk losing 4,000 heads of cattle in that area.
Dr Kaingu: On a point of order, Sir.
Mr Speaker: Let us complete this session, unless there is something extremely compelling, and I will be alert.
Dr Kaingu: Sir, it is very compelling.
Mr Speaker: No, the point of order is still denied.
Mr Nkombo: Sir, in the absence of money being allocated for the repair of Mugoto Dam, whose bill of quantities, amounting to K2 million, was prepared, I want to know what to go and tell the people this afternoon because they are waiting for me regarding the repair of that dam. Already, it is oozing and the water is flowing to the Indian Ocean.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, we can discuss, review that matter and visit the dam, but I cannot produce an answer like a rabbit out of a hat. I thought we had dealt with the dams in Mazabuka through the DMMU. However, I am sorry if we have not addressed that particular matter. So, the hon. Questioner is, again, invited to come and talk to us so that we see what we can do about that dam.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Pande (Kasempa): Mr Speaker, I stand here very saddened in that a number of Zambians are starting to believe that politicians, particularly hon. Members of Parliament, are insincere, especially after the Patriotic Front’s (PF) admission that most of the promises which were made before the 2011 General Elections were mere political rhetoric.
Hon. PF Members: Question.
Interruptions
Mr Speaker: Order, order!
Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, can His Honour the Vice-President give comfort to the Zambians by stating that the PF has brought down the agriculture industry from the level at which the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) left it.
Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I would recommend to the hon. Questioner that he goes to consult the people in Mansa whether they have observed that the agriculture industry has collapsed …
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
The Vice-President: … because, in so far as people vote with their voter’s cards, they seem to believe that we are delivering. The truth of the matter is that there has basically been no rundown of agriculture since the PF came into power. The MMD built up an enormous Farmer Input and Support (FISP) Programme which was largely corrupt both from the fertiliser supply-side and the distribution in the districts, which was designed to basically promote the results of the 2011 General Elections. We have had to try to clean it up, and bring the fertiliser in cheaply and down to the farmers. They know it and they understand it too. Therefore, that is just rhetoric from Kasempa.
I thank you, Sir.{mospagebreak}
Mr Chansa (Chimbamilonga): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President what the position of the Government is on the proposed 1,000 job losses at the Konkola Copper Mines Ltd (KCM) and the Chief Executive Officer (CEO) who has run away from Zambia.
The Vice-President: The CEO for the KCM, Mr Kumar, was deported, but he has appealed against the deportation. That is a routine matter and is being considered by the Government.
Hon. UPND Members: Routine?
The Vice-President: Yes, it is very routine. The law says that if you are deported, you leave the country and you appeal if you want to. Chapwa, kwamana.
Laughter
Mr Speaker: What do all those words mean, Your Honour the Vice-President?
The Vice-President: I accidentally said in Bemba that it is enough. That is it.
Laughter
Mr Speaker: The other word?
The Vice-President: I switched to Tonga, Sir.
Laughter
The Vice-President: Sorry, I should have said it in English that, that is it. That was the part of the question concerning the CEO. As regards the potential job losses, there is a committee of twelve high-powered people who are engaged in this and have already started briefing us. I am told that the ultimate beneficial owner of the KCM, …
Interruptions
Mr Speaker: Order, on the left!
The Vice-President: Mr Anil Agarwal, who is also the owner of Vedanta Resources, has been in the country and has assured us that there will be no job losses. So, we are on to this one very hard at the moment. We are actually looking at it every minute of the day and night.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mwiimbu (Monze Central): Mr Speaker, my intention was to ask a different question altogether, but now that His Honour the Vice-President has indicated that Mr Kumar was deported by the Government of the Republic of Zambia, I would like him to reconcile that statement with the one from the hon. Minister of Home Affairs, who informed the nation that Mr Kumar was never deported, but left this country of his own volition and that the Government had no intention of deporting him unless other circumstances arose. Can he comment on that.
The Vice-President: To clarify the situation, he left; he ran; and he bolted. He was followed closely behind by the prohibited immigrant status.
I thank you, Sir.
Laughter
Mr Mumba (Mambilima): Mr Speaker, …
Laughter
Mr Speaker: Order!
Mr Mumba: Mr Speaker, the fishing ban is about to be effected. I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President what measures the Government has put in place to avoid the loss of life and unnecessary arrests by the forces from the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC).
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, the fishing ban is a totally routine matter. It happens every year. The issues involved in policing it are well known. I do not know if anything new has arisen for me to report on.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Miyanda (Mapatizya): Mr Speaker, I thank you. Your Honour the Vice-President, the Food Reserve Agency (FRA) has failed to pay the farmers what is due to them. At the moment, you have started distributing D-Compound fertiliser without seed. What kind of farming arrangement under the PF is this?
Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I think that we have gone over and over this ground. It is very easy to stand up and say that farmers have not been paid and it is also very easy for me to say that, yes, they have.
Laughter
The Vice-President: The hon. Minister in charge of agriculture has to continually make ministerial statements to reassure people about how much input has been distributed. We are trying to micro-manage the whole thing as a group of 158 people, which seems, to me, to be very difficult. It is much more productive to go and see the hon. Minister and say, “These people here, by the names of chakuti, chakuti have not been paid.”
Laughter
Mr Speaker: Meaning what now, His Honour the Vice-President? You have lost me.
The Vice-President: It is just a sample of a name, Sir. It might be Guy Scott who has not been paid for his maize. I think that it is much more useful to get down to the actual details that such and such a person or so and so has not been paid.
I thank you, Sir.
Laughter
Mr Chishimba (Kamfinsa): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President when the Government will review and redesign the current mining concessions offered to the mining corporations which are excessively generous and no longer make sense in today’s market conditions.
Mr Mucheleka: Wayeshako, nabakulembela?
Mr Mwila: Ya PF, aya ama questions.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, the mining taxation framework is under constant review. It gets changed at Budget time most notably, but can also be changed at other times. It is evolving and I do not think that there is going to be any sudden spectacular changes, but you never know. There might just be some change. However, as far as I know, this is still an on-going process.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Kunda (Muchinga): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President whether he is considering resigning from his position, …
Hon. Government Members: Question.
Mr Kunda: … seeing that he has failed to address the violence that has rocked this country and the issue of food security. He also said that his Government is corrupt.
Mr Livune: That is right,
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I will think about it.
I thank you, Sir.
Laughter
Mr Speaker: That is also an answer.
Laughter
Mr Chipungu (Rufunsa): Mr Speaker, in the recent past, we have witnessed many traffic accidents involving minibuses, especially between Chongwe and Rufunsa. As a result, we have lost a number of lives. Two weeks ago, there was an accident and about ten passengers died in that accident. I would to find out from His Honour the Vice-President what the Government intends to do in order to arrest the situation.
I thank you, Sir.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, the House debated this issue in front of you and under your command. There was an attempt by mostly people from the Opposition to remove the weekend jail provision for road traffic offences. The question I have is: What are they proposing we do other than actually imposing penalties for offences like drunken driving? Alcohol is responsible for the many deaths on the road. The number of deaths in which it is definitely implicated is low because the police do not carry breathalyses, and they do not have people checked at the hospital for alcohol content, generally. However, alcohol is a well-known contributor to the totally unnecessary deaths that we get, especially on the Great East Road. It is not just on the way to Chongwe, but once you get to the Luangwa Escarpment, you get into almost a killing field. I think that we have to come down much harder and actually implement the provisions that we have in the law against irresponsible driving. We are hardliners on this.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Speaker, it is clear that the Government has failed to grow the economy of this country.
Hon. Government Members: Aah!
Mr Sing’ombe: I would like to know whether the Government is considering halting the construction of the house for President Michael Chilufya Sata.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I do not think that we have any intention of halting the construction of any President’s house. In fact, we are behind schedule with some of them.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Muchima (Ikeleng’i): Mr Speaker, time and time again, I have asked His Honour the Vice-President what he is doing about the Mwinilunga/Ikeleng’i Road, which is an international road. At the moment, the Angolan Government is seriously working on its road, linking Angola with Zambia, in order to promote trade. What is the Government doing to improve this road to international standard? Are you not doing anything about it? You do not seem to like the North-Western Province.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I think that I have gone more often to that province than to any other province in the two years that I have been Vice-President of the Republic of Zambia. I think that it is not gentlemanly to accuse us of not liking the North-Western Province. There are many places that need roads in this country, and the construction of these roads has to be scheduled, planned and paid for. Many times, I have said to the hon. Questioner that my office is there. So, if he wants to deal with the nuts and bolts of any road, he should come to my office and we will deal with it.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Lufuma (Kabompo West): Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Mines, Energy and Water Development is a controlling and regulatory body for the mines in this country and the Permanent Secretary (PS) is at the helm of this ministry. Could I find out why the PS sits on the Board of First Quantum Minerals Operations Limited (FQMO). Is this not a breach of fiduciary duty?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, this question of wearing two hats is quite common. It is not just in the Ministry of Mines, Energy and Water Development. It has become a bit traditional in Zambia for PSs to be chairpersons of boards. However, this norm is currently under review. We understand your concern and we are attending to it.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr I. Banda (Lumezi): Mr Speaker, I would like to ask His Honour the Vice-President why the Government decided to have two years of a wage freeze, when it will have a lot of money from the removal of subsidies on maize and fuel, as well as the tollgate fees that will be introduced on our roads? The money saved from the removal of subsidies and introduction of tollgate fees can be used to recruit essential workers in the health and education sectors as well as in the security wings such as the police where we have a shortage of manpower.
Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, with your indulgence, I would like to say that this issue was debated at great length in this House during the Budget Session. I do not know whether the hon. Minister of Finance made a ministerial statement on it, but he certainly clarified the issue in almost painful detail. Therefore, with your indulgence, Sir, I will say that the hon. Member should look at the Hansard and inform himself.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Simbao (Senga Hill): Mr Speaker, on several occasions, I have talked about the plight of the people working for the Tanzania-Zambia Railway Authority (TAZARA) in this House.
Mr Speaker, one of today’s newspapers says that TAZARA employees, that is, drivers and cabin crew, have gone on strike. I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President why this Government is stressing the people that voted it into office.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I am informed that the union that is on strike is not actually a legally-recognised union. I presume that this goes back to the problem that we have had before. TAZARA is a jointly-owned international company and not a parastatal company as such. I will certainly look into that question and will have a better crack at it next week.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Miyutu (Kalabo Central): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President why the PF Government decided to contract 200 trucks from Tanzania, leaving our truckers here in Zambia. What favour did the Government find in Tanzania?
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, again, I think I have covered that before. I think that this question is like one of those animals that you let free and then it comes back to you.
Laughter
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, this question has been asked several times in this House.
Hon. Opposition Members: No.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, it is much more economical to load the fertiliser where the trucks are …
Mr Livune: Question.
The Vice-President: … than to send the trucks empty to Dar-es-Salaam. This decision was made in light of the urgency of the situation. If we had not done that, you would be complaining about fertiliser not being delivered.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mbulakulima (Chembe): Mr Speaker, 2013 is almost coming to an end, just like this session of Parliament. Would His Honour the Vice-President update the Zambians on the whereabouts of Judge Chikopa and whether his presence in the country is a prudent way of managing public affairs.
Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I will certainly find out his whereabouts and let you know. However, as far as I am aware, nothing has changed.
I thank you, Sir.
Hon. Opposition Members: Where is he?
Mr Speaker: Order!
Your Honour the Vice-President, your response is not clear.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, I have no idea where his physical …
Mr Livune: Question.
The Vice-President: … presence is. I am not Interpol or something like that.
Laughter
I thank you, Sir.{mospagebreak}
Mr Ndalamei (Sikongo): Mr Speaker, why is the Government so cruel to the people of Kalabo and Sikongo? The people there are starving, but you have sent some maize to Sinjembela. This has been confirmed by the PS for the DMMU.
The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, it is under current.
I thank you, Sir.
Interruptions
__________
QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER
BOREHOLES IN KASEMPA
202. Mr Pande (Kasempa) asked the Minister of Local Government and Housing:
(a) how many boreholes were sank in Kasempa District in 2012;
(b) how many boreholes were earmarked to be sank in 2013; and
(c) of the boreholes at (b), how many were sank as of 30th September, 2013.
The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr Tembo): Mr Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that no boreholes were sunk in Kasempa District in 2012.
Sir, forty-five boreholes were earmarked to be sunk in 2013. However, only thirty boreholes were sunk out of the number that was earmarked for sinking as of 30th September, 2013.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, I would like to know why …
Dr Kaingu: On a point of order, Sir.
Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.
Dr Kaingu: Mr Speaker, I seek your indulgence. When His Honour the Vice-President was answering the question raised by the hon. Member of Parliament for Kalomo Central, he said that the student who died at UNZA had just come from Mongu, Western Province, implying that she could have contracted the typhoid from Mongu. Now that His Honour the Vice-President is comfortable in his seat and the time for answering his questions is up, is the hon. Minister of Health in order to also sit comfortably in the House, with his eyes closed, without investigating whether there could actually be typhoid in Mongu.
I seek your ruling, Sir.
Mr Speaker: My ruling is simple. You file in a Question for Oral Answer.
May the hon. Member for Kasempa continue, please.
Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister …
Mr Nkombo: On a point of order, Sir.
Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.
Mr Nkombo: Sir, I tried, as much as I could, to …
Mr Speaker: Order!
Just sit down, hon. Member for Mazabuka Central. I indicated that I would not permit points of order during the last session because I manage this House. A point of order is not a right.
Please, continue.
Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, we have been told that we must raise points of order contemporaneously. I am quoting the Laws of the Republic of Zambia under Chapter One, Article 87 – Privileges and Immunities of the National Assembly, that says:
“The National Assembly and its members shall have such privileges, powers and immunities as may be prescribed by an Act of Parliament which resides in Cap 12.”
Sir, a point of order addresses the decorum and dignity of this august House. In the question that was raised by the Member of Parliament for Mapatizya, Hon. Miyanda, regarding farmers who have not been paid by the FRA, His Honour the Vice-President said:
“The hon. Minister of Agriculture and Livestock has come to this House constantly, with ministerial statements to the effect that people have been paid.”
Mr Speaker, while we keep saying that people have not been paid, we have not been given the list of those who have been paid. Is His Honour the Vice-President in order not to tell this House, in no uncertain terms, whether or not the exercise of paying the poor farmers, whom we know have not been paid, has been completed? Is he in order to keep telling us that this House can talk anyhow. While we are saying that the farmers have not been paid, you are saying that they have been paid. This impedes the decorum of this House.
Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Speaker: Order!
I note that we have not disposed of the Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock. We are still continuing and my direction is that before the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Livestock concludes, he should actually respond to that question.
May the hon. Member for Kasempa continue, please.
Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, I would like to know what the good reason, in 2012, …
Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir.
Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.
Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I just want your guidance on the ruling you have made. At what point will the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Livestock respond to a specific issue that has been raised, considering that the procedures of this House are that when the House debates the actual figures of the Vote, the hon. Minister only responds to issues that have been raised in relation to the figures. I would like to find out what guidance you are going to give to the Chairperson of Committees to make him make a statement on the issue that has been raised by the hon. Member for Mazabuka Central because it will be difficult for him to make a statement on the Floor, arising from the figures. We just need your guidance on how we are going to proceed on this matter.
Mr Speaker: Order!
The Chairperson of Committees will allow the hon. Minister to do so. It is on record.
May the hon. Member for Kasempa continue, please.
Interruptions
Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, I would like to know what good reason there is for omitting Kasempa in the distribution of boreholes when other areas had boreholes sunk in 2012.
Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, it is true that there was no allocation for this in 2012, hence the allocation for 2013.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Muchima (Ikeleng’i): Mr Speaker, the boreholes earmarked for 2013 …
Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir.
Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.
Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I rise, with a heavy heart, on a very serious point of order. Patients in various hospitals of this country have been denied the requisite medical care as a result of the strikes by the medical personnel. I am aware that the hon. Minister of Health, on the Floor of this House, assured us that the problems pertaining to the health sector were being addressed and that there would not be any recurrence of strikes pertaining to health personnel. However, nurses and other medical personnel at the University Teaching Hospital (UTH), Livingstone General Hospital, Levy Mwanawasa Hospital and other health institutions are on strike. A number of people have died as a result of the strike.
Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister of Health in order not to come back and update this House on the happenings, particularly after having assured us that all was well and that the issues were being addressed? This matter is of a very urgent national interest.
I need your serious ruling on this matter, Sir.
Mr Speaker: My ruling is that the hon. Minister of Health is scheduled to issue a ministerial statement on Tuesday, next week.
May the hon. Member for Ikeleng’i continue, please.
Mr Muchima: Mr Speaker, I was saying that out of the forty-five boreholes which were budgeted for in 2013, thirty have been sunk and fifteen are yet to be sunk, and yet this is almost the end of November. Can the hon. Minister assure us that the remaining fifteen will be sunk before the end of the year.
Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, this is an on-going exercise and the contractor is still on site, sinking boreholes.
I thank you, Sir.
Dr Kalila (Lukulu East): Mr Speaker, the answer to the question posed by the hon. Member for Kasempa was that the district had been left out because there was no budgetary provision for it. Is the hon. Minister aware that this House has consistently appropriated money for boreholes and that there is evidence to that effect? There have been billions of kwacha for boreholes in the Yellow Books for the past three years. Why has Kasempa been left out?
Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, it is not only Kasempa that was left out, but also other districts such as Nalolo because of budgetary constraints.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mbewe (Chadiza) Mr Speaker, water is very important. When this House allocated money for sinking boreholes in the various districts and constituencies, the Government asked the poor people in villages to contribute K1,500 …
Lt-Gen. Rev. Shikapwasha: On a point of order, Sir.
Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.
Lt-Gen. Rev. Shikapwasha: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister in order to say Kasempa, Nalolo and other districts did not benefit from the sinking of boreholes because of budgetary constraints, when this House passes the Budget for the Government to implement projects that have been budgeted for? Therefore, he cannot come back here and tell us about budgetary constraints.
Is he in order, Sir?
Mr Speaker: Hon. Minister, as you continue responding, please, clarify that issue.
Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out the position of the Government on the sinking of boreholes. The House is about to rise and so we would like to go and tell our people whether the Government will still enforce the K1,500 contribution.
Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, time and time again, we have answered this question on the Floor of this House. We are going to consider that as a ministry. We need to sit down and look at the issue at hand.
Sir, coming to Hon. Lt-Gen. Rev. Shikapwasha’s concern, that is the reason we have been urging the hon. Members to support the Budget, especially for the water sector, so that there is enough money to cover the entire Zambia.
Interruptions
Mr Tembo: The non-allocation of boreholes in certain districts is because of the budget ceilings. The funding for boreholes is not enough to cater for all the constituencies at once.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Simbao (Senga Hill): Mr Speaker, what has happened to Kasempa reminds me of what happened with the first release of the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) where only PF constituencies were given.
Sir, why is this trend of segregation against the Opposition being encouraged by the PF?
Mr Tembo: Mr Speaker, I do not see any segregation because the hon. Member for Kasempa does not belong to the Ruling Party. I am at a loss because I do not see any segregation.
I thank you, Sir.
ZAMBEZI WEST BANK SECONDARY SCHOOL
203. Mr Sianga (Sesheke) asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education:
(a) when the construction of Zambezi West Bank Secondary School in Sesheke would commence;
(b) when the construction works would satrt; and
(c) what the cost of the project was.
The Deputy Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Mr Mabumba): Mr Speaker, the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education has no immediate plans to construct a secondary school in the Zambezi West Bank of Sesheke.
Sir, some of the reasons are that Sesheke had two secondary schools that were constructed before Mwandi and Mulobezi were split. These are Mwandi Boarding Secondary School and Mulobezi Day Secondary School which is nearing completion. As a result of this, we are of the view that the two secondary schools will help in decongesting Sesheke Secondary School.
Mr Speaker, as for when the construction works will start, it is not easy for us to tell at the moment because we do not have any immediate plans to start the works.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Sianga: Mr Speaker, if I recall, in 2012 there was a provision for the construction of a secondary school. What has happened for the hon. Minister to say that Sesheke should be considered under the newly-created districts?
Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member for Sesheke may be referring to the identification of the sites. If a site is identified, but the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education has not made a decision to construct a secondary school, then, there is nothing we can do about it.
Sir, although a site may have been identified by the people of Sesheke District, the ministry has not made a decision to construct a secondary school. Out of the sites that were identified in 2013, thirty-five were selected as areas where the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education would construct secondary schools. Some of the construction works have since started.
Mr Speaker, like we have said consistently on the Floor of this House, the only appeal I can make to the hon. Member is for him to take advantage of our investment in 2014 when some basic schools will be upgraded to day secondary schools. That is an immediate opportunity that the hon. Member for Sesheke can take advantage of.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Miyutu (Kalabo Central): Mr Speaker, in line with the answer given by the hon. Minister about the selection of the site for the construction of a secondary school, at what point is a site selected? Is it after or before the plan is made?
Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, that is twofold. Each year, when Parliament appropriates money, we ask the respective Provincial Education Offices to submit the sites that the ministry could consider in terms of infrastructure development. It is after the Budget has been approved that the ministry requests provincial and district offices to submit annual work plans for infrastructure development.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Speaker, since there are no immediate plans, what are the long-term plans for this school? Although you contradicted yourself when you said that the immediate plan …
Mr Speaker: Put your question.
Mr Mutelo: What are the long-term plans for this school?
Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, the long-term plan is that we will consider it just like any other area that does not have secondary schools.
Dr Kalila: The hon. Deputy Minister has said that some basic schools will be upgraded to secondary schools. In view of this, we should take advantage of this by informing him which ones should be upgraded. I would have thought that, at this late stage, good planning entails that the ministry already knows which basic schools will be transformed into secondary schools. Are you saying that you do not know and you are waiting for us to tell you?
Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, my hon. Colleagues, here, should commend us for giving them an opportunity to participate in this process. We do not want hon. Members of Parliament to start saying that they are not aware when the provinces send lists of schools to be upgraded to the ministry for the final decision-making process and, then, to this House. The ministry is giving an opportunity to the hon. Members of Parliament, especially as the House goes on recess, to go and participate in the consultation process with the respective provincial education offices so that the final list will have the input of all the stakeholders. I, therefore, want to appeal to Hon. Kalila to go and influence the Provincial Education Officer (PEO) so that Philip Moshe is included on the list for the upgrading of basic schools to day secondary schools.
I thank you, Mr Speaker.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Mufalali (Senanga): Mr Speaker, I know that in Sesheke District and part of the West Bank, there is no structure that can support the conversion of a basic school into a secondary school. What are you planning to do about that situation?
The Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Dr Phiri): Mr Speaker, the plight of our people in Sesheke in the education sector is well known by the ministry. We will undertake to provide the services that are necessary in that area. I would say that 2015 would be the earliest we can do something about Sesheke.
I thank you, Sir.
BRIDGES IN LUKULU AND MITETE
204. Mr Mutelo asked the Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication:
(a) when the Government would construct bridges across the following rivers in Lukulu and Mitete districts:
(i) Lungwebungu; and
(ii) Zambezi;
(b) if the Government had no plans to construct bridges at (a), why is this so; and
(c) when the Government would provide a pontoon on the Lungwebungu River in Mitete District.
The Deputy Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication (Mr M. H. Malama): Mr Speaker, the Government will carry out techno-economic studies and come up with detailed engineering designs for the Lukulu/Mitete Road under the 2014 Road Sector Annual Work Plan. It is expected that the feasibility studies will provide solutions to the optimal and cost-effective route to take, and hence provide the alternatives for the construction of the Lungwebungu River and Zambezi River bridges
Sir, the Government has plans to construct bridges. It also sees it prudent to ensure that adequate designs are in place prior to engaging contractors for the works discussed above in order to run the project cost effectively.
Currently, Mr Speaker, there are no immediate plans to provide a pontoon on the Lungwebungu River in Mitete District. However, the Government will soon be sending engineers to go and assess the situation on the ground.
Mr Speaker, I thank you.
Mr Mutelo: Mr Speaker, are you aware that providing a pontoon on the Lungwebungu River would be the immediate solution to enable the District Commissioner (DC) to patrol Mitete District and also connect to Zambezi District?
Mr M. H. Malama: Sir, we actually believe that all crossing points are supposed to be worked on. This is the reason I have indicated that we are soon sending engineers to go and assess the situation.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mulusa (Solwezi Central): Mr Speaker, about this time yesterday, my family lost someone very special on the Chingola/Solwezi Road and I will be travelling for the funeral. What message will I give the mourners regarding the status of the Chingola/Solwezi Road?
Interruptions
Mr Speaker: What is your question?
Mr Mulusa: Mr Speaker, I am taking advantage of the response of the hon. Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication to the question regarding transport. I am saying that this time yesterday, …
Mr Speaker: Order!
Before you proceed, are you supplementing the question from the hon. Member from Lukulu West?
Mr Mulusa: Mr Speaker, yes.
Laughter
Mr Speaker: I have failed to see how. Can we have the next question, please.
Mr Mufalali: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that for one to access Mitete District, he/she has to go round Zambezi District because of the Lungwebungu River?
Mr M. H. Malama: Mr Speaker, I am not aware about that. I have indicated that we shall soon send engineers to go and assess the situation on the ground. This problem has been brought to the Government’s attention. Therefore, it is our duty to go and work on that crossing point.
I thank you, Sir.{mospagebreak}
Mr Speaker: I think honest responses should be encouraged even when they appear to be embarrassing. That is the way it is supposed to be.
Dr Kalila: Mr Speaker, quite clearly, the pronouncement of Mitete as a district appears to have posed many infrastructural challenges. Hon. Minister, as Mr Speaker said, an honest answer is necessary. I think what my colleague wants to know is whether you think that a bridge to connect Mitete to mainland Lukulu is necessary. Yes or no.
Mr Speaker: Order!
I think the hon. Minister has already belaboured a point.
Mr Muntanga (Kalomo Central): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister said that there are no plans of putting a pontoon at that crossing point. Now, he is acknowledging that it takes time to put up a bridge. He has been very honest to say that he was not aware that to access Mitete District, one has to go round Zambezi District. Now that he is aware that one has to cross the Lungwebungu River, does he not think that the immediate action would be to look for a pontoon to enable people to cross at that point while the engineers are still making assessments?
Mr M. H. Malama: Mr Speaker, I have just informed this House and the people of Mitete that we can only depend on the information we are going to receive from the engineers whom I said we shall soon send there. I can confirm, here, that we shall send a pontoon which may not work. So, since we do not know the situation on the ground, we need to send experts there who can bring us a report. We are then going to act based on that report.
I thank you, Sir.
Hon. Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Livune: That is good.
____________
COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY
[THE CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES in the
Chair]
VOTE 89/29 – (Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock – North-Western District Agriculture Co-ordinating Office – K24,386,537).
The Chairperson: Before we continue, you will recall, hon. Members, that the Hon. Mr Speaker had said that I should allow the hon. Minister of Agriculture and Livestock to answer a question that was raised by Hon. Mwiimbu through a point of order on what Hon. Nkombo had said in terms of the procedure for paying farmers. So, the hon. Minister can answer that question.
The Minister of Agriculture and Livestock (Mr Sichinga): Mr Chairperson, I would like to thank you very much for the opportunity to respond to the question. I will not go back to the figures that I had given. The question that is before us is: How much is owed to the farmers who have supplied maize to the FRA and the manner in which they are being paid.
Mr Chairperson, I announced, in this House, that our desire was to ensure that all the farmers received payment for the supply of maize fourteen days after delivery to the FRA depots. I also want to mention that in the first month, this seemed to work well. However, as hon. Members of the House may be aware, the Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock is dependent on the Government and the Treasury to superintend over the FRA …
Interruptions
The Chairperson: Can I have order on my right, please. I dislike people making noise when the House is considering serious matters.
Continue, hon. Minister.
Mr Sichinga: Mr Chairperson, on the basis of the understanding that the funds would be made available on the fourteenth day after delivery to the FRA, we proceeded to make the announcement. However, the Ministry of Finance also has challenges pertaining to cash flows. In other words, revenues that are made available to it to meet all the commitments that this House approves obviously place a great demand on the Ministry of Finance. So, we have worked very closely in collaboration with the Ministry of Finance and they have been very generous in ensuring that we get as reasonable an amount of the funds that are also made available to them as possible in order not to shut down the rest of the Government. So, on that basis, I made a ministerial statement in this House the previous week in which I reported that we had experienced delays in paying the farmers and that, at the time that I was making the statement, there was an outstanding amount of K138 million to the farmers.
Since then, Mr Chairperson, we have received two more payments from the Treasury towards that. The first one was K50 million, which came in last week, and the other one was K20 million that came in at the beginning of this week. However, I understand there were some technical delays and the funds will only be made available to the FRA today. So, out of the K138 million, K70 million has been released, leaving a balance of K68 million. The total amount that was due to the farmers is K553 million. Once the K70 million that I have just mentioned has been released, we should have a balance of K68 million. We have been promised that this will be made available to us next week. That is why I had come to this House and indicated that in spite of our best efforts at the time , we could only complete paying the farmers by the end of November this year. Let me be the first to acknowledge that this is a great inconvenience to the farmers because it does not allow them to pay for their inputs and other requirements.
Hon. Opposition Members: You apologise.
Mr Sichinga: Yes, that is what I am saying. I am making an apology to the House that despite our best efforts, we could not fulfil the promises that we made.
Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Sichinga: This is why we have continued to inform this House about the progress.
Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Sichinga: Mr Chairperson, despite all the efforts we have made, we get remarks from the Opposition that we speak too much. This is unfortunate because one would have thought that we could have been appreciated for clarifying the position so that hon. Members are informed accordingly. That is the first item, Mr Chairperson, that I wanted to clarify.
Sir, secondly, there were queries yesterday of …
The Chairperson: Order!
Before you move to the second clarification, let us first finish the first one. With that explanation, is there any point of clarification from Hon. Nkombo.
Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Chairperson, it is, indeed, gratifying that, finally, we are able to decipher exactly the differences between the statements that have been coming from this end and those from the Government. I will simply take my hat off for the hon. Minister for being candid because that is how things ought to be.
Hon. Opposition Members: Yes.
Mr Nkombo: Mr Chairperson, in future, Cap (12) of the Laws of Zambia, which is a guiding principle of this House, should always be adhered to, especially at the enclave of the Government. When we get statements from the Leader of Government Business in the House, they become Government assurances. Therefore, they ought to be truthful.
Sir, I thank Hon. Sichinga very much for being candid and for biting the bullet.
The Chairperson: You can then proceed to another explanation that arises from the clarifications that were sought yesterday on certain Votes on the Eastern Province. I think that, maybe, the explanation the hon. Minister wants to make might assist us to be fast on the individual items.
Continue, hon. Minister.
Mr Sichinga: I thank you, once again, Mr Chairperson.
Sir, what I will explain will be consequential to all the other items. Let me say that, as everybody knows, the Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock is a combination of two former ministries, that is, Agriculture and Co-operatives, and Livestock and Fisheries. After the merger of the two ministries, it became necessary to align the expenditures. Therefore, the lack of allocations from Units 10-15 under the Eastern Province, on pages 1396 to 1401 of the Yellow Book, does not mean that the provisions are not there. They have been merged. I will explain where they are. They have been renumbered and budgeted for under the current Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock.
Sir, question of the provisions for 2014 for all the programmes in the original districts of the Eastern Province, namely Chipata, Petauke, Chadiza, Lundazi, which was raised yesterday, Katete, Mambwe and Nyimba have been budgeted for on pages 1373 to 1395 of the Yellow Book.
Mr Chairperson, the new districts of Vubwi and Sinda have been budgeted for on pages 1402 to 1407 of the Yellow Book. As a result of this, Unit 10, Chadiza District, Unit 11, Petauke District, Unit 12, Lundazi District, Unit 13, Nyimba District, Unit 14, Katete District and Unit 15, Mambwe District, which are appearing on pages 1396 to 1401, were previously budgeted for under the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries then and were eventually be erased from the Yellow Book after two consecutive years of having no allocations.
Sir, this situation is, in fact, not unique to the Eastern Province. It affects other provinces whose programmes have also been renumbered to re-align them to the programmes under the merged ministry. Therefore, during the debate on the Estimates of Expenditure for Head 89, we need to make these cross-references and bear this alignment in mind. It is a house-keeping exercise meant to help us. If you go to the individual districts, you will note that all these provisions have been made.
Mr Chairperson, I would like to thank you and I hope that this explanation will help us move faster.
I thank you, Sir.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
The Chairperson: Thank you, hon. Minister.
With that clarification, Hon. Lufuma, you may seek your clarification.
Mr Lufuma (Kabompo West): Mr Chairperson, that clarification was needed because we were a bit worried that, maybe, agriculture, in the North-Western Province, was being sabotaged.
Lt-Gen. Rev. Shikapwasha: On a point of order, Sir.
Mr Lufuma: Mr Chairperson, …
The Chairperson: A point of order is raised.
Lt-Gen. Rev. Shikapwasha: Mr Chairperson, first and foremost, I would like to commend the hon. Minister for coming out very clearly on the amount of money owed to farmers and how he intends to unbundle the debt.
Sir, His Honour the Vice-President clearly said that all the farmers had been paid. According to Cap 12 of the Laws of Zambia that govern this House, is it not possible for us to take His Honour the Vice-President to the Committee on Privileges, Absences and Support Services to deal with this issue?
I need your serious ruling, Sir.
Laughter
The Chairperson: I think that we should leave it at the clarification which was sought and which has been provided.
Hon. Lufuma, you may proceed.
Interruptions
Mr Lufuma: Mr Chairperson, I would like clarification on Programme …
Interruptions
The Chairperson: Order!
Please, let us follow the clarifications.
Mr Lufuma: … 1182, Activity 004 – Procurement of Motor vehicles – K20,000. What type of vehicle, let alone vehicles, do we hope to buy with K20,000? Are these secondhand vehicles or what?
Mr Mufalali: A corolla.
The Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Livestock (Mr Kazabu): Mr Chairperson, on Programme 1182, Activity 004 – Procurement of Motor vehicles – K20,000, what is not correct on this line is the description. The provision of K20,000 is for the maintenance of motor vehicles to enable the province carry out its operations effectively. The allocation is, therefore, for maintenance and not purchase of motor vehicles.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mufalali (Senanga): Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on Programme 1012, Activity 034 – Construction of Dip Tank (Rehabilitation) – K330,000. Why is there an allocation of K330,000 because I can see that the allocations for other constructions are above K330,000?
The Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Livestock (Mr Monde): Mr Chairperson, on Programme 1012, Activity 034 – Construction of Dip Tank (Rehabilitation) – K330,000, the provision is to enable the construction and rehabilitation of dip tanks and livestock service centres in the district to strengthen production and productivity in order to ensure sustainable household and national food and nutrition security. This is a newly-created programme in the district.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Lufuma: Mr Chairperson, I would like clarification on Programme 1012, Activity 019 – Construction and Rehabilitation of Camp Houses – Nil. The situation in Kabompo District is unacceptable. Can the hon. Minister explain why the funding for the construction of camp houses has been discontinued in the 2014 Budget.
Mr Monde: Mr Chairperson, on Programme 1012, Activity 019 – Construction and Rehabilitation of Camp Houses – Nil, there is no allocation because rehabilitation was completed in 2013.
I thank you, Sir.
Vote 89/29 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.
VOTE 89/30 – (Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock – Luapula Province – Provincial Agriculture Co-ordinating Office – K24,638,688).
Mr Mbulakulima (Chembe): Mr Chairperson, I have three questions and I need your guidance on how to go about seeking clarification.
The Chairperson: You should probably ask one question at a time.
Mr Mbulakulima: Thank you, Sir. I will follow your instruction.
Mr Chairperson, I would like clarification on Programme 1096, Activity 013 – JICA COBSI Project Support – K215,000. There has been an increase in this allocation from K20,000 to K215,000. My question is not on the definition. I would like to know which projects these are and where Milenge stands in this allocation.
The Deputy Minister of Agriculture and Livestock (Mr Mwewa): Mr Chairperson, the increment is meant to scale-up irrigation activities in the province.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mbulakulima: Sir, I said that I am aware of the definition. What I want to know is which projects these are and whether Milenge has been included in this amount.
Mr Mwewa: Mr Chairperson, on Programme 1096, Activity 013 – JICA COBSI Project Support – K215,000, these are irrigation development projects in the province and Milenge has been included in this figure.
Thank you, Sir.
Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Chairperson, I seek clarification on Programme 1013, Activity 008 – Nutrition and Education – K58,145. What has necessitated this increase?
Mr Mwewa: Mr Chairperson, on Programme 1013, Activity 008 – Nutrition and Education – K58,145, what has necessitated the increase is that we would like to expand our extension services so that we can service our people effectively.
I thank you, Sir.
Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Chairperson, I seek clarification on Programme 1001, Activity 070 – Monitoring, Back-stopping and Evaluation – K6,250. How do you relate this reduction in allocation to the increase in the number of districts in the province?
Mr Kazabu: Mr Chairperson, on Programme 1001, Activity 070 – Monitoring, Back-stopping and Evaluation – K6,250, the decrease in allocation is due to the introduction of pre-paid land phones which will, in turn, lead to a reduction in utility bills such as telephone bills and the fact that Activity 070 will be undertaken by various units in the province.
I thank you, Sir.
Vote 89/30 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.
Vote 89/31 – (Ministry of Agriculture and Livestock – Luapula Province – District Agriculture Co-ordinating Office – K26,068,945).
Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Chairperson, it is true that consultation was done, but this is compelling. On page 1467, there is Kawambwa and then on page 1482, there is also Kawambwa. In his policy statement, the hon. Minister said that the programmes would be merged. Why is Kawambwa appearing twice when the other districts are appearing only once?
The Chairperson: Maybe, you can repeat the question because I can see the hon. Minister is trying to find the pages.
Can you repeat the question.
Mr Mutelo: Mr Chairperson, on page 1467, there is Kawambwa.
The Chairperson: Under what programme?
Mr Mutelo: Then, on page 1482, there is Kawambwa, again, and yet we have been told that the programmes have been re-aligned, hence the other districts are not appearing twice. Why is Kawambwa appearing twice?
Mr Sichinga: Mr Chairperson, I said that some programmes would fall away in due course. These are the ones that are appearing twice. This is what I was explaining when I talked about blocks of pages which, at the moment, will show no allocation while others might be duplicated. As we align the programmes, you will find that some of them will fall away. It is just a clean-up exercise which will be concluded as we go past the second year.
I thank you, Sir.
Vote 89/31 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.
Vote 89/32 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.
Vote 89/33 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.
Vote 89/34 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.
Vote 89/36 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.
Vote 89/37 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.
VOTE 80/01 – (Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education – K8,599,147,755).
The Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Dr Phiri): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for according me this opportunity …
Interruptions
The Chairperson: Order, in the House!
Dr Phiri: … to present the Estimates of Revenue and Expenditure for the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education for the financial year 2014.
The PF Government recognises that all the Zambian children have a right to quality education regardless of the wealth of their family or their place of residence. It also recognises the paramount responsibility of the Government to provide this education and skills training in collaboration with parents and communities as may be appropriate.
Sir, I join the hon. Ministers who have already done so, in congratulating the Hon. Minister of Finance and his staff on a well-packaged Budget under the theme, “Moving Forward to Consolidate Growth and Social Justice in Peace and Unity”.
The national agenda for education and skills training continues to be guided by the following policy documents:
(a) The Revised Sixth National Development Plan;
(b) The National Education Policy;
(c) The National TEVET Policy; and
(d) The Patriotic Front 2011/2016 Manifesto.
Sir, the successes scored in 2013 will serve to spar the ministry to consider 2014 as a year of consolidating these gains and optimising the use of the available resources. The 2014 Budget builds on key activities from the previous years that are aimed at enhancing access, quality and effectiveness of the ministry.
Mr Chairperson, my ministry intends to increase access to all institutions, provide quality education, improve quality assurance, strengthen partnerships as well as empower and motivate staff in the science and education sectors. In 2014, the ministry will continue to implement policies and programmes in the framework of the Revised Sixth National Development Plan (SNDP), which have been realigned to ensure that the aspirations of our people are met. The focus, therefore, will be on ensuring that we continue to strive at achieving the provision of quality education at all levels, with seamless learning experiences for the learner from early childhood education, primary, secondary, technical and vocational education and training, adult literacy up to higher education.
Mr Chairperson, the 2014 Budget provision for the ministry is K8.599 billion compared to the K5.619 billion for the 2013 Financial Year. This year’s allocation, therefore, represents 53 per cent increment in funding to my ministry with an overall allocation of non-personal emoluments of K2.225 billion compared to the K1.630 billion for 2013. This signifies a 38.3 per cent increase in the allocation for non-personal emoluments. The figure for this year is K2.225 billion out of the K8.599 billion allocated.
Sir, my ministry has been given a total of 20.2 per cent of the 2014 National Budget as compared to the 17.44 per cent for 2013, representing a 2.71 per cent increment in the 2014 Budget.
Mr Chairperson, on behalf of the ministry, its staff, learners and stakeholders, allow me to thank the Government for continuing to treat education and skills training as a core sector. Although the increase in funding is appreciable, I am the first to say it is inadequate, in many respects, to address the many challenges in this sector. However, it will go a long way in advancing the ministry’s drive towards the provision of quality education and skills training for all.
Mr Chairperson, since the 2014 Budget builds on the key activities from the previous year which are aimed at enhancing access, quality and effectiveness of the ministry, I will briefly review the ministry’s performance in 2013 and, at the same time, project the activities in 2014 in each subsector.
Sir, I will begin with the new National Education Curriculum Framework. The highlight of the 2013 activities was, no doubt, the introduction of the National Education Curriculum Framework. 2013 saw the completion, piloting and evaluation of the National Education Curriculum Framework which is ready to be rolled out in phases in 2014. The framework has been developed to provide guidance on the preferred type of education for the nation. It is a product of a consultative and participatory process with all stakeholders.
Mr Chairperson, the framework provides curriculum guidelines as well as structures at all levels of the education system from early childhood education, tertiary education and adult literacy. It provides for the necessary career paths for learners at the secondary-school level and accords learners an opportunity to progress according to their abilities and interests. It is envisaged that the curriculum will equip …
The Chairperson: Order!
Business was suspended from 1045 hours until 1100 hours.
[THE DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES in the
Chair]
Dr Phiri: Mr Chairperson, when business was suspended, I was saying that it is envisaged that the new curriculum framework will equip learners at all levels of the education system with the vital knowledge, skills, attitudes and values which they need to effectively contribute to Zambia’s achievement of the Vision 2030.
In 2014, the ministry will consolidate the gains it has made in this major curriculum reform by implementing the reform in phases nationwide. K113,413,772 has been allocated to roll out the new curriculum at various levels of the education system. The budget line caters mainly for the procurement of education materials and equipment for early childhood, primary, secondary, college and adult education levels.
Mr Chairperson, let me now talk about early childhood education. In 2013, the ministry embarked on the process of creating a regulatory framework within which the delivery of early childhood education services would be extended, focusing on the development and application of standards and quality control mechanisms. In this regard, the Early Childhood Education Minimum Standards of Operation and Early Childhood Education Policy Framework were developed. Even though the policy is yet to be ratified, the ministry has since operationalised some of its components by establishing centres countrywide.
Sir, in this regard, the ministry has been complemented by the work of co-operating partners such as United Nations International Children’s Fund (UNICEF) and Plan International, to mention but a few, who have invested heavily in this subsector. We pay tribute to them.
In addition, Mr Chairperson, the ministry has developed curriculum guidelines and teaching materials. A total of 171 classrooms in existing primary schools have been rehabilitated for use in early childhood education, this far, targeting a total of 6,840 children.
Sir, it should also be noted that for the first time since 1964, my ministry has recruited and deployed 1,000 early childhood education teachers countrywide.
In 2014, the ministry has planned to build early childhood centres across the country at a total cost of K4.8 million, targeting disadvantaged, rural and poor children in urban areas.
Mr Chairperson, Zambia has continued to make steady progress in primary school enrolment as well as completion rates. However, concerns remain on the quality of education that learners receive. While steady progress has been made to expand the existing primary school infrastructure, the Government recognises the need to accelerate construction of more schools so as to increase access at the primary school level to meet the growing demand. In 2013, the Government continued to implement the expansion policy using, among other methods, the community mode of construction, which is a low-cost method of constructing schools. My ministry will continue to engage the communities in the development of education infrastructure, as this, in addition to being cost effective, also helps in cultivating a sense of ownership in the communities and reduces vandalism as well as empowers Zambians.
Sir, for the primary education sector, my ministry has recruited 1,500 teachers this year to improve the teacher-pupil ratio. In 2014, there is a total allocation of K36 million for the rehabilitation of 150 mud, pole and thatched primary school classrooms in rural areas and building a corresponding 150 teachers’ houses using the community mode.
Mr Chairperson, in 2013, the secondary school education subsector continued to be a major challenge because it had been neglected for many years since emphasis was placed on primary school education. The increased enrolment at primary school level demanded that the Government expands the secondary school level as well. However, the Government’s attempts to increase space at secondary school level was not only planned properly, but was also executed haphazardly. The construction of eighty-three secondary schools, with an inadequate budget allocation, meant that many of the projects stalled. In 2013, a budget allocation of K339,100,000 went a long way in completing some of the projects. However, we still fall short of completing all of them.
Sir, for the newly-opened secondary schools and others to follow in the coming year, the ministry recruited and deployed 2,000 secondary school teachers. In 2014, the ministry will continue to work on the completion of this huge backlog of secondary school projects. Let me inform this House that the statistics that are before us inform us that we need to work out something out of the ordinary. The 2012 statistics show that the net enrolment rate at primary school level stands at 94.5 per cent. This is highly commendable. However, the net enrolment rate at secondary school level stands at 23 per cent. Further, the transition rate from Grade 7 to Grade 8 stands at 60 per cent and the transition rate for Grade 9 to Grade 10 stands at 45. 5 per cent. This is where the real challenge is, and where we need to take urgent out-of-the-box interventions which would increase enrolment at secondary school level. To this effect, two interventions will be deployed.
The first one will be the upgrading of 220 strategically-located basic schools to secondary school countrywide under Phase I. We want to repeat this next year at the same sites. A total of K320.2 million has been allocated for this activity. It is hoped that this strategy will, in the short term, significantly increase enrolment at secondary school level without disturbing the primary school structure. The provinces and districts in each province will utilise this allocation. Local contractors at provincial and district levels will be contracted where necessary.
Mr Chairperson, the second intervention is that in addition to the teachers being upgraded by UNZA, University of Lusaka and the Zambian Open University, through the Fast Track Teacher Education Programme, which is an on-going programme, the ministry will upgrade more teachers, especially in science and mathematics in collaboration with the Daughters of Mary Immaculate (DMI) St Eugene University. In 2014, 2,000 primary and secondary school teachers will be selected for upgrading. A sum of K21 million has been allocated for this programme in 2014.
Mr Chairperson, let me turn my attention to the higher education subsector. My ministry, in line with the Revised SNDP, continued to expand access at tertiary level, with special focus on universities, colleges of education and skills training in 2013. In 2013, the Chalimbana National In-Service Teachers’ College, Kwame Nkrumah College of Education and Copperbelt College of Education have finally been transformed into universities. Statutory Instruments for the dissolution of the Kwame Nkrumah, Copperbelt College of Education and Chalimbana In-Service Teachers College Boards have been gazetted and Kwame Nkrumah, Mukuba and Chalimbana Colleges have been declared universities. This is in accordance with Statutory Instruments No. 106, 107, 108, 109, 110 and 113 of 2013, dully signed by the hon. Minister on 15th November, 2013 using the authority vested in him by the Higher Education Act No. 4 of 2013.
Sir, this means that the university councils in these universities will be constituted according to the Higher Education Act No. 4 of 2013. However, Phase II of the construction works will continue at Kwame Nkrumah University and Mukuba University, while Phase I of the construction works will continue at Chalimbana University.
Mr Chairperson, the construction of the Robert Kapasa Makasa University for Science and Technology has entered Phase II and will continue. Construction of Phase I of Palabana University for Livestock Sciences started in 2013 and will also continue. Phase I of the construction of the Paul Mushindo University has commenced. Let me, at this stage, commend and take notice of Hon. Hamududu’s very insightful comments on the universities. However, let me hasten to say that the construction of Paul Mushindo University is in honour of the First Republican President by His Excellency the President, Mr Michael Chilufya Sata. In 2014, there is an allocation of K89.5 million for the university’s infrastructure.
Further, Sir, I wish to inform this House that the procurement process has began to engage contractors to design and build Sir King Lewanika University at Namushakende in the Western Province and Luapula University in Mansa. The construction of these two universities will start in 2014. A total of K13 million has been allocated for the two universities.
Hon. Back Benchers: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}
Dr Phiri: Sir, the construction of universities is a major achievement for the nation which, once completed, will broaden the opportunities of access to university education and help decongest the three existing public universities. It should be noted that my Government’s ultimate aim is to build a university in each province. This includes the proposed David Livingstone University in Livingstone.
Mr Chairperson, the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education is aware of the pronouncement, in His Excellency the President’s Speech for the 2013 Official Opening of Parliament, that the construction of three universities, namely Luapula, King Lewanika and David Livingstone, will commence in 2014. However, due to budgetary limitations, the ministry will embark on the construction of two of these three universities during 2014. The construction of universities is an on-going process.
Sir, I can only ask the hon. Members of this august House to understand that the three provinces without universities have not been forgotten at all. We want to move systematically. Let me also say that building universities is not as simple as building primary schools. Otherwise, we would be glorifying ordinary structures as universities. Let me emphasise that we have broken away from the traditional way of constructing universities. This time, we want to advertise for contractors to give us a design-and-build proposal.
Mr Chairperson, it is also worth highlighting that in the allocation to the ministry’s infrastructure budget of K404.3 million for universities and other tertiary infrastructure is the allocation of K250 million to kick-start the construction of student hostels at the public universities. We are starting this activity while waiting for additional funding from the Ministry of Finance. Let me also note that a sum of K395.3 million has been provided for operational grants for universities, student tuition and bursaries.
Mr Chairperson, my Government is not only concerned with improving access to Technical Education, Vocational and Entrepreneurship Training (TEVET), but also the quality of training in order to produce graduates that are relevant to industry and possess entrepreneurial skills necessary for self-employment. To this effect, my Government has commenced the transformation of the three Luanshya-based trades training institutes into a polytechnic institution and upgrading of Kabwe Trades to an institute of technology. These two institutions will help in the training of lecturers at higher levels of qualification such as degree for the various trades training institutes countrywide.
Mr Chairperson, the Government places high priority on the skills development of youths. This is evident in the investments and attention accorded to the construction of trades training institutes countrywide. In 2013, construction works at Kalabo and Isoka Trades Training Institutes progressed very well and are now nearing completion. Additionally, preparatory work and tender procurement procedures have been completed for the construction of Mwense and Lundazi Trades Training Institutes. Work for the two trades training institutes will commence in early 2014.
Sir, in 2014, the Government will begin constructing trades training institutes in Mporokoso, Sesheke and Mumbwa. With the help of the Kuwait Fund, we will also commence the long-awaited construction of teacher training colleges of mathematics and science in Senanga, Kabompo and Katete districts. The delay has been caused by not signing the agreement between the Kuwait Fund and the Government. This will take place shortly.
The rehabilitation and expansion of the existing facilities at the Northern Technical College (NORTEC), Zambia Air Services Training Institute (ZASTI), Choma and Chipata trades training institutes, Kabwe Institute of Technology, Kasiya Secretarial and Business College, Lusaka Business and Technical College as well as the three Luanshya-based institutes will continue in 2014. A total of K24 million has been allocated for these activities.
Mr Chairperson, during the 2013 Financial Year, my ministry recorded important milestones in science, technology and innovation. One of the most important milestones was the inauguration of the National Bio-Safety Authority Board which will ensure that effective regulation of modern biotechnology is achieved. In addition, the PF Manifesto emphasises the revamping of the National Institute for Scientific and Industrial Research (NISIR). To this end, the improvement of conditions of service for NISIR employees was another milestone that will ensure that the institute attracts qualified researchers. Coupled with the on-going recapitalisation of NISIR’s research centres and the planned decentralisation of NISIR, this will enable my ministry to revamp research and development in this country.
Sir, in fostering research and development and promoting synergies between research, training and industry in science, technology and innovation, my ministry is promoting the collaboration of universities, science research institutions and industry through the Strategic Research Fund (SRF), Youth Inventors Fund (YIF) and Business Development Fund (BDF). My ministry wishes to promote strategic research and youth innovation in collaboration with research and development institutions in line ministries, academia and industry. The total allocation for 2014 to these three funds is K4.2 million.
In addition, Mr Chairperson, my ministry will facilitate training in order to enhance skills, for instance, in validation of herbal medicines, biotechnology, fisheries and livestock and other areas of priority.
In order to enhance research and technological services, my ministry will continue with its Recapitalisation Programme and, in 2014, procurement of ground receiving station equipment for the National Remote Sensing Centre has been budgeted for at K20 million and equipment for NISIR at K3 million.
Mr Chairperson, in terms of research and technology development, my ministry has facilitated research collaboration, whereby research and development institutions are participating in various research and capacity development programmes both at national, regional and international levels through initiatives such as the SRF, Technology Business Development Fund (TBDF) and YIF. We have made large strides towards enhancing research technology development. Zambian research and development institutions, including the youth, academia and civil society have been able to conduct research and innovation in various sectors cutting across health, mining, environment, climate change, water, forestry, biodiversity and agriculture.
In addition, Sir, collaboration at regional and international levels under various frameworks such as the International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA), Southern Africa Science Service Centre for Climate Change and Adaptive Land Management (SASSCAL), Southern Africa Network of Bio-Sciences (SANBIO) and Southern Africa Innovations Support (SAIS) continue to bring great benefits to Zambia.
As hon. Members of this august House might know, the IAEA continues to support the Cancer Diseases Hospital through consolidating the delivery of cancer treatment services and nuclear safety medicines. The IAEA also supports nuclear safety by assessing radioactive contamination of surface and ground water and other resources in mining areas.
Mr Chairperson, in conclusion, allow me to state that quality education and skills training are pre-requisites for the development of our nation. My ministry will, therefore, continue to respond positively to the education and skills training of our people so that, together, we can celebrate the development arising from it.
Sir, notwithstanding the numerous challenges facing us in the education and skills training sector, my ministry sees hope in the provision of education and skills training as well as the programmes and policies to be implemented in 2014 and beyond.
The ministry seeks your support. That is why I now call upon all the hon. Members to support the 2014 budget for the ministry as presented. In the name of the children that demand a better future, this support must be forthcoming.
I thank you, Sir.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
Mr I. Banda (Lumezi): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me this chance to be the first to debate the policy statement, especially that this is a key ministry among all the ministries in the country.
Mr Chairperson, I would like to thank the hon. Minister for giving us a very good policy statement for his ministry. From the outset, let me congratulate the newly-elected hon. Member of Parliament for Mansa Central, Dr Chilufya, on scooping the seat. In the same vein, I would like to thank the President who has appointed him Deputy Minister of Health because he deserves it.
Hon. Members: Hear, hear!
Mr I. Banda: Congratulations, Hon. Dr Chilufya, on that achievement.
Mr Chairperson, in supporting the Vote, I would like to say to the hon. Minister of Finance that it is his duty to make sure that most of the pronouncements that have been made by the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education are realised.
Mr Speaker, we have a problem of coming to Parliament year in and year out to pass budgets, and yet, at the end of the year, there are no projects in our constituencies. Most of the time, when we ask the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education on the Floor of this House why a particular project has not taken off, the hon. Minister’s response is always that the funds have not been remitted to the ministry. On that note, I would like to urge the hon. Minister of Finance, when he asks us to approve the Budget which he brings to Parliament, to make sure that the funds that we approve are given to the line ministries so that projects can take off and people enjoy their share of the national cake.
Mr Chairperson, I have a few concerns relating to the ministry that I would like to talk about. These are the two huge undertakings that the ministry is making. When the PF Government came into power, it promised us that it would convert all the community schools into Government schools. There are many community schools in this country. In some places, they outnumber Government schools. For example, in my constituency, in Diba Ward in Mwasempangwe Chiefdom, there are nineteen community schools against six Government schools.
Hon. Members: Aah!
Mr I. Banda: Hon. Minister, the standard of education at community schools is not the same as that at Government schools because community schools have ramshackle classrooms made of mud and pole and thatched roofs. During the rainy season, they are not conducive for learning because the roofs leak. In addition, there are no trained teachers, teaching aids or teaching materials at community schools.
So, Mr Chairperson, I am urging the hon. Minister to honour the pronouncements that he made in this House of turning community schools into Government schools so that the children who attend these schools can also enjoy the national cake because they are also Zambians and should not be subjected to poor education.
Mr Chairperson, the other issue that I would like to talk about is that of the projects that are in the Infrastructure Development Plan each year. These projects do not take off. However, the hon. Minister has said that funding was poor because, sometimes, there was no donor funding. In view of this, I would like to suggest to the hon. Minister of Finance that if donors give an assurance that they will support our Budget, they should be put to task to give us the money. If they are unable to do so, they have to find other means of meeting their pledges.
Mr Chairperson, in the Infrastructure Development Plan for 2012/13, the people of Mwasempangwe were promised a day secondary school and you budgeted for K13.146 billion for this secondary school. Your staff went to Chief Mwasempangwe and were given a very small piece of land to put up a school. To date, nobody has gone there even to tell the Chief why the construction of the school has not taken off, and yet it is in your plan. The people of Mwasempangwe are waiting for the school that they were promised.
Mr Chairperson, construction of some schools had started, but the projects have been abandoned. I cannot attribute this to the change of Government because ministries and technocrats do not change. It is us, the politicians, that change. As a Government, you promised that you would adopt all the projects that the MMD left. There are also certain projects that you started. In Lumezi Constituency, for example, there is a 1 x 4 classroom block at Lumimba Day High School in Chitungulu Chiefdom whose construction you started in 2010 which is now a sorry sight. I hope that you will visit that place one day. We want the construction of the classroom block to be completed. People in my constituency expect a share of this budget so that the construction of the classroom block can be completed.
Mr Chairperson, I am not only talking about my constituency, but also Lundazi District as a whole. I have cited examples of what is taking place in your ministry. I know that these problems do not only exist in Lundazi, but also many other places in Zambia.
Hon. Opposition Members: Yes.
Mr I. Banda: Mr Chairperson, I have a school in mind called Kapekesa in Chasefu. The plan for this school was that it was going to be a fully-fledged basic school so that pupils from all the neigbouring primary schools could have access to Grade 8 and 9 education. Its construction started way back in 2010. I do not know whether it is the contractor called Gabman Zambia Limited who has failed us or the hon. Minister. Only you, hon. Minister, can give an answer to this. I would like to ask the hon. Minister to make sure that the part of the budget for the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education that we are discussing today goes to finish this basic school.
Mr Chairperson, in Lundazi Central, there is a school called Wumi which was supposed to be constructed by the same contractor, Gabman Zambia Limited. I do not know what kind of a contractor this is. This school was also supposed to be a fully-fledged basic school. The contractor started the work just like he did at Kapekesa Basic School. To date, this school has not been finished, and yet this is the school the nephews and nieces of the hon. Minister are supposed to go to.
Interruptions
Mr I. Banda: Therefore, Mr Chairperson, the hon. Minister is supposed to take a keen interest in this school. Hon. Minister, when you go home after this session of Parliament, I think that I will invite you to my constituency for Christmas so that you see these projects. People are not getting any services from them. The Government has spent a lot of money on these projects but, to date, people are not benefiting from them.
Mr Chairperson, we have many difficulties, especially concerning the learning environment in the constituency because there is a shortage of teachers in most of the schools. Nonetheless, let me thank the hon. Minister because whenever there is a recruitment exercise for teachers, he sends teachers to the constituency. I give him a pat on the back for that. However, we still need more teachers. The other thing I should thank him for is the Schools Promoting Learning Achievement through Sanitation and Hygiene (SPLASH) Project which is aimed at improving sanitation. Many Ventilated Improved Pit Latrines (VIPs) have been constructed. I would like this programme to continue and be extended to other schools.
Mr Chairperson, I would also like to talk about the manpower in the community schools. It is difficult to get trained teachers in community schools because the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education claims that it cannot post a trained teacher to a community school, because nobody will supervise that teacher. The ministry says that it can only send a teacher who is nearing retirement because he/she needs no supervision. I urge the hon. Minister to give us teachers for most of the community schools because the communities have come up with many initiatives such as building staff houses for the community schools. However, you will find that we only have untrained teachers living in these houses. What we want are trained teachers. Even community schools deserve trained teachers because there are Zambian children in those schools who need the services of trained teachers.
Mr Chairperson, I do not have much more to say and I thank you.
Interruptions
Mr Bwalya (Lupososhi): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to contribute to the debate on the policy statement for the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education.
Mr Chairperson, the people of Lupososhi Constituency support the Vote for the ministry.
Mr Chairperson, I am glad that the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education referred to curriculum development. For a long time in this country, the education environment has not evolved. As a result of this, some graduate teachers are failing to fit into the employment industry. The simple reason for this is that the equipment they were exposed to during training does not match with what is in the education sector. The education sector has developed technologically, but we are still using outdated equipment in universities and colleges. This issue needs to be looked at seriously so that we are abreast of new trends globally and the education sector is relevant to the Zambian situation.
Mr Chairperson, I would also like to talk about Information Technology (IT). This country has not taken advantage of IT. As we implement the 2014 budget for the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education, it is important that we look at the issue of IT and how best we can enhance the provision of IT equipment in various schools. This should start from early education so that pupils are exposed to computers early enough to be able to fit into modern society.
Mr Chairperson, we are moving towards a paperless world where most of the things will not be done using paper and ink but IT. Therefore, it is just right that, as a country, we recognise that and very quickly embrace IT. Otherwise, we will end up spending money on the education sector and producingmisfits who will not be able to cope with the changing world.
Mr Chairperson, like Hon. Isaac Banda said, the infrastructure in this country is dilapidated, especially at primary school level. Most of the infrastructure was built in 1935. Some schools in Lupososhi, Chifunabuli, Pambashe and many schools in other constituencies, for instance, were built way back in 1935. These schools have never had a facelift since they were constructed. It is true that the resource envelope is very small and, therefore, the resources are spread thinly to an extent where we fail to see the impact of the application of the resources. However thinly the resources may be spread, we need to pay attention to the existing infrastructure. We need new infrastructure, but let us not neglect what we already have which has contributed to the wellbeing of the Zambian people.
Mr Chairperson, the other concern that the people of Lupososhi Constituency have is the cost of education. The Government is spending a lot of money in educating the population. It is pouring a lot of resources into ensuring that the infrastructure is good and there is quality education. However, the question is: For how long?
Sir, my prayer is that we have a situation where education is able to pay for itself. What I mean is that we take some measures that will enable us to generate revenue that can be ploughed back into the education sector for infrastructure development. For instance, we can introduce a training levy. Every organisation which comes in this country finds an already educated and trained manpower. All that they do is employ them, pay them a salary and give nothing to the Government which worked very hard to train them.
Mr Chairperson, we need to come up with a policy which will compel companies and organisations to contribute towards the education sector. In the same vein, we should mention that we have trained human resource that has gone across the borders and is providing quality services there. The question is: What is the Government getting from that service that is provided by the Zambian who was trained at Government expense? What are we benefitting as a country?
Sir, these are some of the ideas that the technocrats in the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education should look at critically and see how best we can earn revenue from the human capital that is rendering services to other countries. Cuba does that. We have Cuban doctors here in Zambia. I want to believe that the bulk of the money that they earn is sent back to develop Cuba.
So, if we want the infrastructure in education to be up to standard, we need to find a way of getting money out of the human capital that we have. This is the same idea as the toll gates that the Ministry of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication has introduced. Every motorist who will be using certain roads will be paying tool fees that will be ploughed back into the maintenance of the roads. In the same vein, we need to find a way of earning money from the big companies that employ trained Zambians to refurbish and build more student hostels. We will need to construct more student hostels because the population keeps growing and we do not want to have problems of accommodation for students.
Mr Chairperson, the other solution to the problem of student accommodation is to ensure that people who have gone through the education system contribute towards the construction of hostels. So, my appeal to the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education is that we should think outside the box and see how best we can maintain the education standards in this country because the Government cannot do this alone.
Sir, there was a discussion on the Floor of this House regarding the introduction of a scheme loan for students. This is something that we need to work on so that the poor people in rural areas can also access higher education.
Mr Chairperson, we all know the saying that goes, “The higher you go, the cooler it becomes,” but in the education sector, especially for the poor man, the higher you go in education, the more expensive it becomes. The people of Lupososhi Constituency are failing to send their children to college because they cannot afford the fees. We also need to broaden the Bursary Scheme so that students in trades training institutes and small colleges can also access bursaries. In any case, not every pupil will end up at UNZA or any of the new universities that we are putting up.
Sir, reverting to the secondary school system is a good idea, especially now that we are constructing a number of secondary schools. However, we must ensure that the schools that are being constructed have the qualified human resource at the time when they are opening. I am pretty sure that in two years’ time, most of them will have been completed. So, now is the time to ensure that we prepare for the many secondary schools that are being constructed. This is because two years from now, they will be ready for opening and we may end up with white elephants if there are no teachers.
Mr Chairperson, we should also move away from putting up incomplete infrastructure. Constructing classroom blocks without teacher’s houses is as good as investing money in projects that are of no benefit. So, my appeal to the hon. Minister is that when we construct a school, we also construct teachers’ houses. We should build houses according to the establishment at a particular school. There is a lot of school infrastructure that is lying idly because it cannot be used.
Sir, the situation is the same in the health sector. The construction of health posts has been completed, but they are not operating because there are no staff houses. So, that is money down the drain and, after one or two years, the infrastructure will have been vandalised and we shall have to start looking for more money to have it repaired.
With those very few words, I thank you, Sir.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Mufalali (Senanga): Mr Chairperson, I want to thank the hon. Minister for the manner in which he has presented his policy statement.
Sir, I know very well that the hon. Minister and his team are good friends of mine, and I would not want to turn the heat on them. However, I want to remind them that on the Floor of this House, the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education promised us that the Gabman Projects were going to be completed this year, which is now coming to an end. These projects are in Shekela, Nalolo, Senanga, Lasika, Ka Kenge, Namikuta and Mumbula. Unfortunately, nothing has been done so far.
Mr Chairperson, this reminds me of one of the former Presidents of America, Mr Abraham Lincoln. When one of his friends visited him, he promised Abraham Lincoln’s daughter that he would give her a watch once she passed the examinations. Unfortunately or fortunately, the girl passed and the next time the friend was visiting, Mr Lincoln’s daughter told him that she had passed and reminded him of the promise he had made, but the friend to the father dillydallied. However, Mr Lincoln told the friend that he did not want him to show his daughter that he had friends who mislead people and ordered his friend to remove the watch from his wrist and give it to his daughter.
Mr Chairperson, we need those schools under the Gabman Project to be completed. It will be very difficult to have access to quality education if those projects are not completed.
Sir, I am in receipt of the men that have been guarding the schools in Nalolo, Senanga and probably even in Lundazi because it is also under the Gabman Project. They want to sue the contractor but, unfortunately, they are unable to locate him. They have not been paid for the past two years, and yet the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education is not doing anything about it. It is about time the ministry started to work on the Gabman Projects. The ministry should realise that our friendship might come to an end if this is not done.
Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Mufalali: Mr Chairperson, there are several buildings in the Western Province and many other places that are at slab level whose construction has stalled. These are projects under the Poverty Reduction Programme (PRP) that were meant to be used to reduce the poverty levels in districts. Funds for these projects were disbursed through the provinces, but the projects have stalled ever since the disbursements stopped. In Senanga, for example, there are projects at Namayenya, Kakengemwalye, Mumbula and others too numerous to mention. There seems to be no co-ordination in how these projects are going to be completed.
Sir, I am reluctant to say that there is an unco-ordinated approach to infrastructure development in this ministry, but look at how many projects there are that are at slab level. There are materials heaped all over that are not being utilised. If the structures are completed, then, I think, you can make a grade.
Mr Chairperson, when I asked how many houses would be built in Liangati last year, the hon. Minister assured me, on the Floor of this House, that, at least, nine houses would be put up in 2013/2014. However, that has not been done. The people of Liangati are still waiting for the construction of the nine houses that were promised.
Sir, on the same day, the hon. Minister assured me that all the schools that were built by the Franciscan Fathers in 1930, 1933 and 1935 were going to be refurbished. I would like to remind him that he promised that Sibukali Basic School would be refurbished in 2013/2014, but this has not been done and the school is falling apart. The other schools are Songa and Sikumbi.
Mr Chairperson, I would like to remind the hon. Minister, because he is my friend, that he promised, on the Floor of this House, to work on these schools. However, I have learnt not to use friendship to lobby for infrastructure development.
Laughter {mospagebreak}
Mr Mufalali: I would also like to remind the hon. Minister that the promise still stands and I do not want to raise a point of order to remind him to fulfil it.
Mr Chairperson, there can be no quality education in the absence of teachers. In Senanga, other than the poor infrastructure in the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education, there are no proper roads and teachers still walk 60 km to go and draw their salaries. I do not blame the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education for this, but the entire system whose priorities do not support the rural setup. It is, therefore, very difficult for a teacher to work in the interior of Senanga. Many of the schools that have Grades 1-9 classes only have one teacher and that is not good.
Sir, how can you provide quality education when a school is managed by one teacher; how can you have quality education if teachers still walk 60 km to go and draw their salaries; and how can you have quality education when teachers live in houses without power and communication facilities, television or radio? We, as a country, expect the quality of education to be improved, but how can we achieve this in the absence of proper infrastructure? It is not possible to achieve this unless the hon. Minister of Finance provides enough resources for the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education to implement the projects that are in the Infrastructure Development Plan. In the absence of this, we shall see no results.
Mr Chairperson, some projects have been removed from the Infrastructure Development Plan for the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education because the Ministry of Finance has not given the ministry enough resources. Therefore, it becomes difficult to improve the education system because the ministry does not get the budget allocation that this House approves. This negates the entire Infrastructure Development Plan.
Sir, if primary education is not properly supported and there is no proper infrastructure, then, the university that is being built in Namushakende will be of no value because the pupils from our schools will not make the grade for university. Why should we rush to up universities when there is poor infrastructure at the lower level of the education system? That is a challenge. You can put up the university at Namushakende, but the students who will fill up the places at the university are those from places which have proper infrastructure at the primary and secondary level.
Sir, at the moment, most of the school infrastructure in Senanga and Nalolo is made of mud and pole and many of the roofs have been blown off. The entire Western Province has a problem of blown-off roofs. K551 million was approved in 2013 for the repair of blown-off roofs, but they have not been repaired to date. I have reported four schools that have had their roofs blown off to the ministry, but nothing has been done to date. One of the schools is for underprivileged children. The roofs to their classrooms were blown off and, with the onset of the rains, they are being soaked while in class.
Mr Antonio: Just like in Kaoma.
Mr Mufalali: The DMMU has been to the school, but the roof still has not been repaired, and yet the budget for this was approved. What is the ministry doing about it? We are not going to tolerate a situation where roofs are blown off, money is provided for their repair and nothing is done about it. That is a very serious matter. There are many schools in Kaoma and Lukulu with a similar problem. I even have pictures of schools in Lukulu whose roofs were blown off two years ago, but nothing has been done about them. I would like to appeal to the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education to ensure that the funds that are approved here get to the affected schools.
Mr Chairperson, the ministry promised us that Matauka High School would be built in 2013/2014, but this has not been done. I am wondering why Matauka High School has not been mentioned in the policy tatement, and yet the hon. Minister has been promising that it will be built. That school was in the Infrastructure Development Plan, but the hon. Minister is quiet about it. That is why I am saying that it is difficult to say that there is co-ordination in infrastructure development because some projects are coming up and the following year, they will not be mentioned. There seems to be no consistency. I am, therefore, wondering what is happening because Matauka High School should be built as per your promise in the 2013 Budget.
Mr Chairperson, the United Church of Zambia has a mission in Senanga. There is a structure there that can be used by the ministry for skills training. Since the mission does not receive support from the ministry, the structure is now a white elephant today. Someone used to support this project, but it has stalled ever since he pulled out and there is no training going on there. However, part of the equipment is still there. I, therefore, urge the ministry to resuscitate the project in order to help the many youths that are failing to find jobs in Senanga.
Sir, with those few words, I want to urge the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education to ensure that he keeps his word. Otherwise, it will be very difficult for us to move forward.
I thank you, Mr Chairperson.
Mr Mucheleka (Lubansenshi): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for the opportunity to debate. I was getting a little bit concerned about the Lundazi connection.
Sir, it is very true that this is a very important ministry with regard to human development and poverty reduction. When people are educated, it becomes easier to deal with the challenges of life. I know that the resource envelope may not be sufficient to meet all the requirements of the ministry. I also know that there are a lot of international protocols in the education sector. For example, there are the Dakar and Cairo Declarations on Education. These are protocols that we signed, but are unable to fulfil.
Sir, I welcome the construction of universities in various provinces. However, we also have to look at how best we can improve the existing universities, namely UNZA, the CBU and …
Mr Mbulu crossed the Floor.
Hon. Members: Order!
Interruptions
The Deputy Chairperson: Order!
Laughter
Mr Mucheleka: … Mulungushi University. The conditions at these institutions of learning for students, lecturers and staff are deplorable. So, as we talk about constructing new universities, we must first of all, deal with the challenges that we have. I have heard about the construction of new universities in certain provinces that have been mentioned and I welcome that. The Northern Province has ‘given birth’ to two provinces, namely Luapula and Muchinga. I have heard about the universities being opened in the other two provinces, but what about the Northern Province? Who says that the Northern Province does not need a university?
Laughter
Mr Mucheleka: Mr Chairperson, the Northern Province needs a university just like the other two provinces. You want to confine the people of the Northern Province to perpetual underdevelopment and poverty because you are leaving it out. We are seeing all these things.
Mr Chairperson, the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education is an important ministry with regard to human development and poverty reduction. However, I do not think it is well positioned to deliver in its current form. It is like a huge dinosaur which does not know what is happening in the other areas. The relevance of some of the ministries that have been created is questionable. Why can we not break up the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education instead of increasing the number of Deputy Ministers and put the money where it matters? The MMD Government knew what it was doing when it had the Ministry of Higher Education, Science and Technology which concentrated on tertiary education. They also focused on primary and secondary education. There was a reason for that and I think that is something that can still be looked at. We are talking about reducing the number of ministries, and yet we are increasing the number of Deputy Ministers. Part of the money we are using for this can be taken to the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education to help meet some of the challenges.
Mr Chairperson, we need to link the labour market requirements to education delivery. We face the danger of producing graduates from various tertiary institutions who cannot be absorbed by the labour market because the curriculum and skills that are acquired may not be relevant to the labour market. We should focus on vocational training so that the graduates from the vocational training institutes are not only employable, but can also be self employed with the support of start-up capital.
Mr Chairperson, in the rural areas, teachers are working very hard under very difficult conditions. Hon. Members of Parliament have used the CDF to construct teachers’ houses and classroom blocks because the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education is not able to do everything on its own. Despite our efforts, teachers have continued to work under very difficult conditions. There are no teaching aids and the quality of education is very poor. Although we are likely to attain Millennium Development Goal No. 2 on primary education, of what relevance is primary education when pupils are not able to read or write?
Sir, when pupils leave school in Grade 7, where do they go? They cannot go beyond Grade 7 so they end up doing nothing. Like I said earlier, teachers work under very difficult conditions. In my district, Luwingu, teachers have become victims. Sometimes, they want to work with their Member of Parliament but, because he is not from the Ruling Party, they are victimised by being transferred to other schools. It is not easy for a teacher to be transferred from one district to the other unless there is a very good reason for that, such as a promotion. In my constituency, I have seen teachers being moved from my constituency or district to another constituency. The reason has been that they are perceived to be close to me. That is unacceptable.
Mr Nkombo: Hear, hear!
Mr Mucheleka: Mr Chairperson, I have written letters to the ministry, but no action has been taken. We must help teachers who are working very hard under very difficult conditions. So, instead of looking for funding, the ministry is victimising teachers?
Mr Chairperson, in Luwingu, and I know it is the same with Lundazi, Chasefu, …
Mr Ng’onga: Are you sure?
Mr Mucheleka: … Chadiza and other districts, there is a need for the ministry to create linkages with other ministries so that the meagre resources can be utilised to sort out issues of access to electricity, feeder roads, housing, security and other infrastructure. That can only happen if the ministries are working together and not in isolation.
Sir, the problems in the ministry do not only affect the teachers, but also the communities and learners. For instance, in the Northern, Luapula, Muchinga and Western provinces, most of the students in the tertiary institutions are from other provinces. This is because the pupils in the mentioned areas cannot make the grade. This is why we have been calling for a quota system to enable pupils from rural provinces to access tertiary institutions because they cannot compete favourably with those from urban provinces.
Mr Chairperson, in conclusion, I would like to call upon the hon. Ministers of Finance and Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education to sit together and see how we can increase funding to the education sector to enable it to meet some of the challenges, with particular attention to rural education where most of the rural people are disadvantaged. It is not acceptable to subject a section of society to perpetual poverty because it is not able to access quality education.
Mr Chairperson, I want to thank you and I support the budget.
Mr Hamududu (Bweengwa): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to debate. I think we all agree that the importance of education cannot be over emphasised. This is not a social ministry, but a socio-economic one. Through this ministry, we are investing in the most important resource which is not the minerals, land, waters, but the people. This is evident in countries that have not invested in human capital because they have failed to develop even when they have mineral resources. This is a problem that Zambia has found itself in.
Sir, let me give an example of Botswana. Most people think Botswana is a developed country because it has diamonds. That is not the case. By the late 1980s, Botswana realised that it had to invest in human capital. You will remember that in the early 1990s, a lot of teachers were recruited from this country to go and work in Botswana
Mr Livune: Hear, hear!
Mr Hamududu: This is because Botswana had to invest in human capital.
I was in Botswana two months ago, by courtesy of Hon. Mr Speaker. I was impressed with the young Batswana. I met this young man who works for the Lands Board in the hotel where I was staying. That country’s administration of land is excellent and the young graduate understands it very well. Botswana is one of the best land administrators because of educating its people. The next day, I was picked up by a young businessman who took me round Gaborone. I was also very impressed to see that Botswana had invested in its people.
Mr Nkombo interjected.
Mr Hamududu: Mr Chairperson, we must never make a mistake of missing that point. This ministry is so critical that all the other ministries must rally behind it in support. All the Zambian boys and girls must be in school without exception. In this country, where over 70 per cent of the population is below thirty, we have what we call the youth barge. If that army of young people is not educated, it will be a danger to this country. You can easily walk in town and have a rally there because the young people are available to do anything. That is a danger and we need to do something about the young people. One of the tools we can use to combat this problem is education. We are not doing enough to solve this problem.
Sir, let me give examples because we must use evidence in our arguments. Countries like Singapore, South Korea and Finland are educating their people. Finland’s economic mainstay was forestry. All it did was invest in its people. When the Information Communication Technology (ICT) came on the world market, Nokia was a leader in the market and it was the number one mobile seller for twelve years. When I went to Finland, I was told how Nokia alone transformed the Finish economy. And who took over after that? It was Apple and then Samsung from South Korea. Again, this had to do with education. This country is making a mistake by not investing in education. The 20 per cent of the Budget that we have given to education is not enough because we have a big backlog. Once we deal with the backlog, we can go back to allocating the 20 per cent only. We need to increase the allocation to 25 per cent to deal with the backlog.
Mr Chairperson, I have travelled around this country on Parliamentary Committee business and politics. When I went to the islands on Lake Tanganyika, I could not believe that my fellow brothers and sisters do not know what a school looks like. That time, Lake Tanganyika was a bit rough and we were making stoppages on the way to Kamba Bay Lodge. When we stopped at some point, we found children who were consigned to poverty and it was apparent that they were not going anywhere in life. We found them in the fishing camps where there are no schools. There are many children in other areas of this country who do not go to school. Even in my constituency, on the islands on the Kafue South Bank, children do not go to school. This is a big liability for the future. As a country, we must agree that education is the most important tool that we can use to fight social ills such as poverty, improve productivity in agriculture and fight disease and other problems. We must allocate enough money to deal with the backlog firstly.
Sir, for a very long time, we have had very little investment in classroom space because most of the budget for the ministry is consumed by emoluments. The CDF has helped us do more to change our areas than the budget of the ministry. This is evident in my constituency. In the first five years as Member of Parliament, I dedicated the CDF to two things, namely education and health. If you go to Monzwe, Nakansangwe, Makamba and Hamwimbu, you will find infrastructure that was put up using the CDF. There has been very little investment from the budget of the ministry.
Sir, I agree with what Hon. Prof. Lungwangwa said the other time about segregating this budget and safeguarding the investment budget from the ministry. Let it be separated at the ministry level so that we can pick it up from where he left it to have a clear infrastructure development plan which, I think, we need to go back to.
Mr Chairperson, I also want to talk about equity. I was very impressed when officials from the ministry called to inform me that the hon. Deputy Minister was going to Kemba. I later found out that it was my good friend, Hon. Mabumba, who was going to see the people right in the village. We want to see equity. So, it is important that you know all the four corners of the country in order to distribute infrastructure fairly nationwide. Let the distribution not be based on whom you like or who comes to your office.
Sir, my constituency, which the hon. Deputy Minister visited, has no secondary school. In the whole of Kafue South Bank, people are confined to looking after cattle and fishing. They need to have an education so that they can look after their cattle and conduct their fishing activities better instead of fishing from breeding grounds. You cannot fight anything without education. We must agree to lift our people out of ignorance in the next ten to fifteen years. All our children must be able to read, write and work with numbers. This country now only has theorists who just speak good English for nothing.
Laughter
Mr Hamududu: They cannot add figures. That is why productivity is very low. The importance of investing in science and mathematics cannot be overemphasised.
Mr Chairperson, there is a lot of indiscipline among teachers. I do not understand how a teacher can impregnate a pupil. This sort of indiscipline should not be tolerated. We must bring back the lost glory to the teaching profession. When I was in school, a teacher was respected. If we met a teacher on the road, we knelt until the teacher passed.
Interruptions
Mr Hamududu: Today, teachers are found in bars. On one occasion during the campaigns, I was somewhere east of Kabwe, near Kapiri Mposhi, where I found a teacher in a bar and I asked him to leave.
Laughter
Mr Hamududu: He was very drunk and was asking for money like a party cadre. In my constituency, I also chased a teacher in a similar manner. Teachers must lead by example so that we can restore discipline among pupils.
Sir, if the teachers are indisciplined, how can they discipline the pupils? I hope this is very clear. You should raise the bar of discipline in the teaching profession. Those that are not fit for this profession must not dare to venture into it simply because there are no jobs. We cannot employ everyone as a teacher even when they are not suitable for the job. This is a serious matter. We must test people to determine their capability to provide leadership. This is important because the leaders of tomorrow are trained by teachers. I was taught by disciplined teachers. This is why I am not in a village somewhere married to several women and with many children.
Mr Chairperson, let me conclude by talking about something very important. At the moment, the critical issue is having universal primary, secondary and post-secondary skills for every child. I am happy that the private sector is helping. There are many Zambians who can afford to take their children to private schools.
However, Sir, there are those that cannot afford and it is the responsibility of the Government to provide this education. We must continue to encourage the private sector to participate in the provision of education because we have a significant middle class here. I am sure that all your children are in private schools, meaning that we have left space for those who cannot afford. We should, therefore, monitor the quality of education in the private and post-secondary schools.
Mr Chairperson, there are many universities that are coming up now at every corner. Some are just shops operating as universities.
Laughter
Mr Hamududu: We might end up with degree holders all over the country that do not add value to the country and eventually earn a bad name for the universities that trained them.
Sir, can the National Qualification Authority monitor these universities so that they have the prerequisites such as space, materials and a high calibre of lecturers for them to offer degree courses? If not monitored, everyone everywhere, be it in a shop or church, will run a university. We must be very careful. People are desperate for degrees and so they will enroll in these universities. What we want are skills that can help our people get jobs and transform themselves and the economy.
Sir, I would like to conclude by saying that this issue must be emphasised. The danger we face now is the youth barge. Zambia has one of the highest fertility rates in the world. Unfortunately, we cannot tell our people to have two children only because we would be trampling on their human rights. The best tool of contraception is education. Let us put our children in school so that we can harness what is now called the Demographic Dividend. I hope that hon. Members of Parliament can have a workshop to learn more on this new concept. One of the best interventions is to keep our children, both girls and girls, in school for a long time to delay pregnancies and marriages so that their earning potential is higher. In the long run, the dependency ratio will reduce. At the moment, we are supporting other people’s children whom we did not father. If we educated our people in the mid and long term, the dependency ratio would reduce because people who stay longer in school, like most of us did, delay in having children.
Mr Chairperson, my mother keeps telling me that I should have a son, but I have told her that I have beautiful daughters and that is enough. So, if she wants a son, I am already there.
Laughter
Mr Hamududu: It is important to have this level of understanding. Sometimes, people will tell you that you need a son to carry your name. Carry what name wnen I am carrying it myself.
Laughter
Mr Hamududu: I do not want anyone to carry my name. What if that child turns out to be a thief?
Laughter
Mr Hamududu: A friend of mine wanted a son and he continued having children. Eventually, after three girls, he had a boy. When my friend died, the boy became a thief.
Laughter
Mr Kambwili interjected.
Mr Hamududu: I am not trying to console myself. By the way, my children are geniuses. My daughter, who was at Lwengu Primary School, got 840 marks in Grade 7. These were one of the best results in the country.
Mr Kambwili: Question.
Mr Hamududu: Yes, she is a genius.
Laughter
Mr Hamududu: Her name is Ellen.
Interruptions
The Deputy Chairperson: Order!
Debate through the Chair, hon. Member.
Mr Hamududu: I refer to my daughters as my princesses. They are brilliant and I consult them at every point. Let us put our children in school.
Finally, Sir, if we invest in our children’s education, they will earn better and begin to save. Many Zambians are not saving because of the high dependency ratio. Zambia is now ready to begin to work towards the attainment of the Vision 2030. We must harness the dividend. Let us be balanced in our budgeting.
Yes, we need roads and railways, but the most important investment we can ever make is in human capital. We are not against the construction of roads, but let us not put too much money in the construction of roads at the expense of what is most important, and that is the people. When we do this, our people will be more resilient to any shocks that will come in the future. The Asian Tigers achieved this demographic dividend and, today, they are reaping the fruits. They are saving at personal, household and national levels. This is why they are developing. They took deliberate steps to invest in human capital and we can do it too. If we miss this opportunity, we will continue talking about windfall tax. We must do the right thing with our taxes and education is the right way to go.
Mr Chairperson, I thank you. {mospagebreak}
Prof. Lungwangwa (Nalikwanda): Mr Chairperson, thank you for the opportunity to make my comments on the budget for the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education.
Interruptions
The Deputy Chairperson: Order!
Let us consult less loudly.
Prof. Lungwangwa: Sir, let me commend the hon. Minister for a brief and clear policy statement on education. However, let me begin by stating that education is closely linked to what happens in the economy of the country. In Zambia, the 1980s and 1990s were our lost decades in education development simply because our economy was not performing well. We had a negative economic growth in the 1980s and 1990s. Consequently, investment in education was almost non-existent.
In the 1980s and 1990s we never saw any expansion in the secondary school sector even at primary school level. We saw a lot of reductions in money going to tertiary education. In the universities, for instance, we saw money for capital investment, staff development and research being cut. The only money that was going into the universities was for operations. We saw a lot of push for cost sharing in education at all levels. The last secondary schools were constructed in the 1980s in Lumezi and Kafumbwe in Milanzi, and left at slab level. From then on, there was no construction because of the state of the economy. Therefore, as a nation, we have to reflect on our history when we look at issues of policy, especially in a sector like education.
Clearly, Mr Chairperson, since the beginning of this century, we have seen some improvements in our economy. The economy has been registering positive growth. Therefore, those who are managing education have a grand opportunity to transform the education sector, especially to enhance its fundamentals, that is the quality of education at all levels and also ensuring that education is equitably accessible to all the children at various levels of the education sector.
Mr Chairperson, where are we now in terms of the challenge in education? At the level of quality, our biggest challenge, especially at basic school level, is the time our learners spend in school. On average, many of our children spend three hours in class per day. Three times five days in a week, is fifteen hours per week. You multiply that by four weeks, and that is sixty hours per month. You multiply that by three months in a term, it gives you 180 hours per term. When you multiply that by three terms, that is 540 hours in a year. Now, when you divide 540 hours in a year by twenty-four hours in a day, it gives you twenty-two days in a year. On average, most of our children are spending twenty-two days per year learning. If you subtract sickness, either of a teacher or pupil and holidays, you will find that most of our children spend probably, on average, two weeks of learning in a year. If you take that as your premise, …
Mr Sikazwe: Professor.
Prof. Lungwangwa: … would you be surprised when children are not performing well compared to other children elsewhere in mathematics, communication ability, writing skills and so on and so forth? We are not investing enough to enable children to learn more. If we take that as a premise, and then we want to improve the quality of education, we must double or treble the hours our children spend in school. Instead of 540 hours per year, we must double that or even treble it. Which means that we need more classrooms, more qualified and motivated teachers, more education materials and so on and so forth. That, of course, requires resources. This is where the hon. Minister of Finance must be sympathetic to the education sector because we have to invest in that sector in order to develop the human capital that is needed for our economic development. That is a challenge.
Mr Chairperson, for example, the allocation of 22 per cent this year to the education sector is not adequate, hon. Minister of Finance. You have two ministries. On one hand, you have science and technology and, on the other hand, you have education in general. These are two ministries. In the past, we had about 17 per cent going to general education and 4 per cent going to technical education. Put together, that was about 21 or 22 per cent. That is not enough. Let us increase that to a higher level. Other countries are spending about 30 per cent of their national budgets on education. We ought to challenge ourselves to do more in terms of allocations so that we can improve the quality of learning in our education system at all levels.
Mr Chairperson, another important area of concern in the education system has to do with what is happening at tertiary level. Clearly, if efforts are not made to control and monitor what is happening in the tertiary education sector, Zambia will soon end up being a country with frustrated, educated and unemployed people. We are slowly going to end up being a country that is suffering from the diploma disease.
Hon. Simfukwe: What?
Prof. Lungwangwa: I said the diploma disease. Many of our children will be waving certificates which mean nothing and which cannot enable them to operate effectively in the labour market. There are many universities now, especially private universities, which are being established. Some of them are in markets and others in private homes. You cannot run a university like that. A university ought to be an institution with its own mystic because that is the apex of learning. It is the institution which ought to be at the frontier of knowledge in terms of research, scholarship, publications and excellent teaching and public service. That is what a university ought to be.
Mr Chairperson, what are all these universities, which have mushroomed all over, doing? They are simply creating frustrated people. The generation that is learning in most of these institutions will end up being a frustrated generation. That is unacceptable. There is a need to quickly put in place people to manage the Higher Education Authority so that it can set the benchmarks of who, for example, can teach in a university, what qualifications should they have and whether these institutions are following a curriculum which is acceptable at university level? Do they have the facilities befitting of a university? Is there any research or publication taking place?
Sir, a university ought to be like any other university in the world for it to qualify to be a university. That is why universities require a lot of monitoring. Therefore, the Higher Education Authority, which has been given K1 million, should be put in place quickly to save the nation from a looming disaster. If not, we are increasingly becoming a nation at risk of mediocrity and people who are waving certificates that are meaningless. This is not what Zambia ought to be.
Mr Chairperson, in addition to that, civil servants should be monitored very closely. Some of the resources going to the education sector end up in administrative routines. Hon. Minister, I would urge you to check on your staff because some of the money which ought to go towards the enhancement of quality is being pocketed by the civil servants through administrative work. This is unacceptable. It is your duty to check on how much money is going into administration. For example, why has the allocation to Integrated Financial Management Information Systems (IFMIS) has been doubled from K652,900, this year to K1,745,000 in the 2014 Budget? Clearly, something must have been done.
So, hon. Minister, I would urge you to check on your members of staff and the departments because some of the delays in infrastructure development, like the construction of schools, could be deliberate because the civil servants are not monitoring the projects and interacting effectively and efficiently with the contractors. The longer a project takes, the more money they make in terms of visitations to the various project sites. That is unacceptable. We should not allow that.
It is, therefore, your task, as hon. Minister, to check on your members of staff like we used to in our time. We used to have meetings over the budget and would sometimes go up to 0300 or 0400 hours in the morning, tasking them on why they were putting money on some activities. We asked them to justify the use of that money because we needed to build schools for our children. We wanted to see to it that classrooms were constructed and there were educational materials in schools. We asked them to justify why money should be allocated to a particular activity. So, it is your task, as hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education, to ensure that the money that we approve here, as an allocation to the education budget, goes towards ensuring accessibility in the education system, equitable access to education and motivating the teachers to teach effectively for the good of our children. That is important.
Mr Chairperson, I have noted that the allocation to the Southern African Consortium for Measurement of Education Quality (SACMEQ) for next year has been reduced. Why have we reduced the allocation to SACMEQ, and yet we are a member of the SACMEQ Group? We are supposed to participate in the SACMEQ activities since it is the one that oversees our performance in the education sector in terms of quality. Why have we reduced the allocation to this activity?
The same applies to NISIR. Why is the allocation to NISIR static, at K22 million, and yet we need research in our country? We need to ensure that research is effective and is going on for the good of our country. These are the challenges for the hon. Minister as we look to 2014 and beyond.
I thank you, Mr Chairperson.
Mr Ng’onga (Kaputa): Mr Chairperson, on behalf of the people of Kaputa, I wish to thank you for giving me this opportunity to debate in support of this important Vote for the education sector.
Sir, like those who have debated before me have said, I would also like to say that education is an equaliser. Without education, one is nowhere.
Ms Kapata crossed the Floor.
Hon. Members: Order!
The Deputy Chairperson: Order!
Mr Ng’onga: It is education, Sir …
The Deputy Chairperson: Order!
Hon. Members, let us remind each other of the rules. Members are not allowed to cross the Floor when the House is sitting. That is, they should not pass between the Chair and the Member on the Floor. This has occurred twice today and it also occurred yesterday, and the other day. It is now becoming prevalent. Let us, please, take time to read the Members’ Hand Book.
You may continue, please.
Mr Ng’onga: Thank you, Mr Chairperson, for your guidance. I was actually saying that education is an equaliser. Regardless of whether one is a son of a rich man or poor man, if he/she has been given the opportunity to go through education, there comes a time when they are both equal. They are at the same level. They speak, interact and do business together. Therefore, this is a very important ministry that should ensure that even the remotest areas such as Mataka, near the border with the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), has access to education. Unfortunately, the people of Mataka have had no school for forty-nine years. It means that the people in Mataka area have been destined to fend for themselves. They can do anything and do not even fear the law because they do not know that there is law. This is the more reason the funds that have been allocated to the education sector must be put to good use.
We thank the PF Government for increasing the allocation to this sector for the first time. I am sure that nobody has indicated that the budget is below the regional requirements. This sector is ‘on-the-spot’, thanks to this Government.
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!
Mr Ng’onga: Sir, we hope that the people who are managing this sector will make a difference.
Sir, the people of Kaputa have continued to lament the poor standards in the education sector. We do not have a proper secondary school. However, we have infrastructure of a modern secondary school that we hope will be opened for the first time in 2014. I am very hopeful that the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education will do whatever it takes for Kaputa to have a secondary school.
I went to school in Kaputa and went to Mbala Secondary School later. That time, my parents could afford to send me to school in Mbala but, today, it is very difficult for some parents to send their children to school in Kaputa. Therefore, we hope that Kaputa will soon have a modern secondary school worth talking about.
I would also like to talk about the issue of teachers, deployment and transfers …
Mr Mwamba and Mr Kapeya entered the Assembly Chamber whilst the Deputy Chairperson was on the Floor.
Hon. Members: Order, order!
The Deputy Chairperson: Order, order!
(Debate adjourned)
__________
HOUSE RESUMED
[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]
(Progress reported)
____________
The House adjourned at 1257 hours until 1430 hours on Tuesday, 3rd December, 2013.