Debates - Thursday, 26th November, 2015

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Thursday, 26th November, 2015

The House met at 1430 hours

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]






The Minister of Home Affairs (Mr Mwila): Mr Speaker, on 24th November, 2015, you directed my office to present to the House a statement on the efforts the police were putting in place to curb the violence, especially attacks on politicians, that had been experienced in the country. The directive came as a result of a point of order raised by Hon. Eddie Musonda, the Member of Parliament for Kapiri Mposhi, on the matter. Hon. Musonda’s point of order resulted from the political violence perpetrated by United Party for National Development (UPND) cadres, who were conducting political activities in Mongu, Moyo and Senanga Districts in the Western Province from 20th to 22nd November, 2015. 

Sir, on 21st November, 2015, between 1200 hours and 1500 hours, the UPND President visited Moyo Royal Village. Whilst he was in the area, some UPND cadres attacked the family of Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning, Mrs Inonge Wina, and assaulted a boy aged eighteen years and a woman aged thirty-two. The eighteen year-old boy sustained a deep cut on the back of his head while the woman complained of chest, back and general body pains. The UPND cadres also broke window panes on Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning’s House. A forty-two-year old man of Nalolo was also assaulted and sustained a swollen face. 

Hon. Government Members: Shame!

Mr Mwila: They also damaged a thatched fence valued at K400; looted K5,000, some beers and Super Maheu valued at K1,500 from a shop at the market; and stole an undisclosed amount of money from a Bonanza Machine. Police dockets have been opened on these cases.

Sir, I have given a comprehensive account of the political activities of the UPND in the Western Province in order to expose the unlawful behaviour of its members. It is essential for the House to appreciate the magnitude of the problem. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwila: Sir, it is important for me to state that the political situation in all areas is calm and that the police is monitoring and maintaining its presence in sensitive areas while investigations into these acts of lawlessness have intensified and one twenty-five-year old man of Senanga District has been apprehended to help with investigations after he was positively identified on an identification parade by the victims in the assault case. 
Sir, my Government remains committed to preserving the rule of the law and upholding the fundamental freedoms of all citizens. I, therefore, call upon all political leaders to work within the law because all the police are interested in is to maintain law and order, and safeguard peace in our country at all times. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members are now free to ask questions on points of clarification on the statement made by the hon. Minister of Home Affairs. 

Mr Mutale (Kwacha): Mr Speaker, what measures is the ministry putting in place to stop unscrupulous people from attacking the homes of innocent people, such as that of Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning? 

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, we have intensified patrols to apprehend all those who are perpetrating violence. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Speaker: Hon. Minister, an aspect of the question by the hon. Member for Kwacha referred to the security of Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning. 

Mr Mwila: Sir, we have deployed officers to patrol the area and ensure that everyone is safe. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Mbewe (Chadiza): Mr Speaker, it is unfortunate that such an incident occurred. That said, what proof does the hon. Minister have that the perpetrators of the violence were United Party for National Development (UPND) cadres?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the culprits wore red T-shirts and berets written “UPND.” Additionally, they jumped from a UPND vehicle that was taking them to Moyo to pay a courtesy call on the Chieftainess of the area and attacked the people in Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning’s home. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Muteteka (Chisamba): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister should shed more light on this issue. 

Sir, yesterday, he issued a statement in which he said that the violence that occurred on the Copperbelt was perpetrated by suspected Patriotic Front (PF) cadres. I emphasise the word ‘suspected’. However, in the Nalolo incident, he has concluded straightaway that the violence was perpetrated by the United Party for National Development (UPND)? What makes him so sure that the UPND is to blame for the latest incident?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Livune: That’s right!

Mr Speaker: I will reluctantly allow the hon. Minister to repeat his answer.

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, when the UPND cadres were attacked in Chachacha on the Copperbelt, there were no police officers on the scene. In fact, the police got there thirty minutes after the people who had attacked the UPND members had gone. However, in the Nalolo issue, the UPND cadres jumped from a vehicle that was being used by UPND members. Additionally, the people in Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning’s house and the surrounding area saw the cadres stone the house and attack innocent people. One of the cadres who committed the crime was arrested immediately because they were able to identify him in the UPND attire.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Mazoka (Pemba): Mr Speaker, when Patriotic Front (PF) cadres commit crimes, the people involved are always referred to as ‘suspected PF cadres’. Is it fair that only party is blamed for perpetrating violence? Can we be truthful here and call a spade a spade. When something wrong has been done, the Government should condemn it even if the perpetrators are members of the Ruling Party.

Mr Speaker: What is the question, hon. Member?

Mrs Mazoka: Sir, why is it that when it is the PF perpetrating violence on the United Party for National Development (UPND), those involved are always ‘suspected PF cadres’? Why does the Government not acknowledge the violence that is perpetrated by cadres of the Ruling Party? 


Mr Speaker: Order!

Mr Mbewe: Boko Haram.

Mr Mwila: Bapongoshi, you ...


Mr Speaker: Hon. Minister, ...

Mr Mwila: I am sorry, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker: Just address her properly.

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, Hon. Mazoka will recall that there was an incident that the UPND President and his entourage were once attacked by PF cadres on the Copperbelt, but they were protected by the police. Further, the culprits, including our Provincial Chairperson, were arrested and put on their defence on the Copperbelt. So, when the UPND follow the laid-down procedures and obey the law, the police protects them. That must be put on record. We are not segregating anyone. 

Sir, it is important for the hon. Member to inform the top leadership of her party to educate their cadres to refrain from violent activities. Otherwise, they will be arrested by the police. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kasonso (Solwezi West): Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister confirm that the police is biased in its enforcement of the law. As regards the incident that occurred on the Copperbelt two weeks ago, the police is still investigating. However, the violence in Nalolo in the Western Province took place just a few days ago, but the police have already made arrests. Is it not clear that the Zambia Police Force is showing bias?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the police is not biased. As I stated, investigations are been carried out on the Kitwe incident and we will inform the House when the investigations have been concluded. On the Nalolo issue, the police made quick progress because the UPND cadre jumped from a UPND vehicle and wore UPND attire.

Mr Kasonso indicated dissent.

Mr Mwila: I do not know if the hon. Member is not happy with that arrest.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Speaker, Senanga and Nalolo are separate districts, and the hon. Minister said that the suspect in the violence in Nalolo was arrested in Senanga, not Nalolo. Further, he was not arrested on the material day.

Mr Speaker: What is your question?

Mr Mutelo: Has the hon. Minister carried out proper investigations? The twenty-five-year-old male was arrested in Senanga and transferred to Mongu. So, the case is compromised.

Mr Lubinda interjected.

Mr Mutelo: Nalolo and Senanga are separate districts ...

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member, you are now addressing somebody else.


Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the suspect in the stoning of Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning’s house and assaulting of the people I have mentioned had committed another offence in Senanga. He actually already had a criminal record, and that is why it was easy for the police to arrest him. He was easily identified. The other suspects are on the run, but they will be arrested once they are found.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mooya (Moomba): Mr Speaker, the suspect is said to have worn United Party for National Development (UPND) attire and jumped out of a vehicle. Is that enough evidence to warrant his arrest? Furthermore, what if he was a plant?


Mr Speaker: What is your question?

Mr Mooya: Sir, is someone’s wearing of given attire and jumping from a vehicle enough evidence for the police to arrest him?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, I said that the suspect was positively identified on an identification parade. It should be shameful for a person in the entourage of a party president to involve oneself in such activities. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Livune (Katombola): Mr Speaker, can the hon. Minister of Home Affairs confirm that the residence of Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning is guarded by both State and private security personnel? If he can do that, then, where was the security detail at the time of the incident?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, of course, there were no police officers there. That is why the UPND ...

Hon. Opposition Members: Where were the security people?

 Mr Speaker: Please, let him respond.

Continue, hon. Minister.

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, when the UPND cadres attacked Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning’s family, there were no police officers present. However, the house is now under police guard.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Musonda (Kapiri Mposhi): Mr Speaker, very soon, there will be a hive of political activity in all parts of the country. Has the hon. Minister made adequate preparations to curb any political violence that might break out anywhere in the country?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, firstly, we recruited about 1,500 police officers who will graduate in the next three months. So, the number of police officers will increase. Secondly, we intend to buy vehicles and have purchased 180 motorcycles to give our police officers mobility as we head towards the elections. Political violence affects all of us. So, we should educate our cadres to refrain from it.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Chilangwa (Kawambwa): Mr Speaker, a named political party is known to have devised the Mapatizya Formula, which has been the springboard of political violence. Could the hon. Minister of Home Affairs categorically identify that party and state whether its leaders have denounced political hooliganism?

Mr Speaker: I think that question departs from the ministerial statement.

Mr Mufalali (Senanga): Mr Speaker, I respect the hon. Minister of Home Affairs. However, he is misleading this House by saying that the suspect was arrested after he jumped out of the car when he was apprehended in Senanga by Patriotic Front (PF) cadres who, then, took him to the police where he was charged for breaking a window pane at the PF Office in Senanga, He was detained at the police station, and I talked to the District Commander (DC) …

Mr Speaker: What is your question?

Mr Mufalali: Mr Speaker, why is the hon. Minister misleading this House by indicating that the suspect was wearing UPND attire and arrested in Nalolo when he was arrested in Senanga for breaking a window pane at the PF Office?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the cadre was a Senanga resident. I think that the hon. Member was not here when I stated that. When he jumped out of the vehicle and attacked Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning’s family, he was followed and arrested in Senanga. 

I think that is now clear.

Mr Mufalali: What was the charge?

Mr Mwila: He was charged for assault and malicious damage, and will appear in court soon.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Speaker: You cannot ask whilst seated, hon. Member.

Mr Hamusonde (Nangoma): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has stated that Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning’s house was not guarded by security officers when her family was attacked. What will be done to the officers who were supposed to guard her house?

Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, the house in question is a private home in a constituency. So, the police does not guard it. I would also like to take this opportunity to appeal to all of us to condemn the violence perpetrated by our cadres. It is unfortunate that the UPND has not come out clearly to condemn the violence in Moyo.


Mr Mwila: Mr Speaker, during Her Honour the Vice-President’s Question Time, Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning condemned the violence that erupted in Kitwe. So, it is important for our colleagues to also condemn political violence.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.




187. Mr Livune (Katombola) asked the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning:

(a)    on what date the civil servants are paid their salaries each month;

(b)    why the salaries for November, 2015, had not been paid, as of 24th November, 2015;

(c)    when the November, 2015, salaries would be paid; and

(d)    what the wage bill for the Civil Service for November, 2015, was.

The Deputy Minister in the Vice-President’s Office (Mr Bwalya): Mr Speaker, according to the Terms and Conditions of Service for the Public Service, Section 89 of Chapter 5:

“The salary shall be payable on the last working day of the month in which it is earned or on any earlier date which the Secretary to the Treasury, Ministry of Finance, may from time to time approve”.

Sir, the Secretary to the Treasury has used this provision to pay Public Service Salaries earlier than the monthend in the recent past due to the significant improvements made in various payment systems of the Public Service, such as the use of the Treasury Single Account (TSA) and Direct Debit and Credit Clearing (DDACC). The two systems have made it possible for Public Service salaries to be credited directly to the bank accounts of the beneficiaries within twenty-four hours of the Treasury releasing the funds. As such, even civil servants stationed in remote areas receive their salaries much earlier than before.

Sir, as I stated earlier, 24th November is not the last working day of November. Therefore, the Secretary to the Treasury is still within the provisions of the Terms and Conditions of Service for the Public Service. The Treasury has had to facilitate payments for other priority expenditures, such as the procurement of drugs and medical supplies, and the importation of emergency electricity. 

Sir, the salaries for November, 2016, have been paid today, Thursday, 26th November, 2015, through the new DDACC and TSA systems. Some civil servants are already receiving their salaries as I speak and all of them will be paid by the end of tomorrow.

Sir, the total Civil Service wage bill for November, 2015, is K1.3 billion.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Livune: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that a salary is a right and that when there are inconsistencies in terms of when it is paid, that becomes an infringement of a fundamental human right because workers’ rights are human rights?

 Mr Bwalya: Mr Speaker, every employee in the Civil Service is afforded an opportunity to read his or her terms and conditions of service which, as I have just stated, clearly state that a civil servant is supposed to be paid on the last day of the month. Therefore, I believe that the Government is within the law and the terms and condition of service agreed to with the civil servants.

 I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister of Information has said that hon. Ministers have not been paid. When will they be paid?

 Mr Speaker: First of all, on what occasion did the hon. Minister say what the hon. Member is referring to?


Mr Speaker: Anyway, maybe, you need to repeat your question. Are you asking the hon. Deputy Minister in the Office of the Vice-President a question on a statement made by the hon. Ministry of Information and Broadcasting? Maybe, I am not following you.

Mr Sing’ombe: Sir, on the day the hon. Member for Katombola raised that issue, the hon. Minister of Information and Broadcasting said that the Government had not paid hon. Ministers their salaries. So, my question is: When will the hon. Ministers be paid?

Mr Speaker: That question is unrelated to the principal question.


Mr Speaker: In any case, let us bear in mind that we are not supposed to debate ourselves. At the rate we are going, I fear that a similar question may be directed at me.

Mr Mbewe (Chadiza): Mr Speaker, …

Mr Mwiimbu: On a pint of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister of Home Affairs in order to tell the nation that the United Party for National Development (UPND) has never condemned acts of political violence in this country and, in particular, the violence that occurred in Nalolo, if at all it did occur?


Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, our party President, Mr Hakainde Hichilema, is on record condemning the violence that took place in Nalolo and calling on the police to arrest its perpetrators. His statement condemning the violence was captured by the media.

Mr Speaker: The problem with this point of order is that it carries a contradiction in the sense that, in one breath, the hon. Member is questioning whether the violence reported in Nalolo actually occurred, which I find extremely strange given the publicity that surrounded that incident, and, in another breath, he is acknowledging that the President of his party condemned the same act whose occurrence he is questioning, and he is saying that in response to what the hon. Minister of Home Affairs has said. I do not think that I can carry this any further.

Mr Mbewe: Mr Speaker, Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning has said that it is a favour when civil servants are paid their salaries before the 30th of each month. Could the hon. Deputy Minister confirm that there was enough money in the Treasury to pay the civil servants and that an error in the system is what caused the delay in paying the salaries.

 Mr Bwalya: Mr Speaker, basically, there is nothing to confirm. Secondly, I did not say it is a favour. What I said is that the salaries are expected to be paid before or right at the end of the month in which the salary is earned. I also said that every civil servant is afforded an opportunity to read those terms and conditions of service. So, whether there was enough revenue in the Treasury is not important. The fact is that the payment of salary to civil servants is done within the confines of the terms and conditions  of service of workers and within the laws, and that is exactly what we are doing.

 I thank you, Mr Speaker.

 Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister mentioned that the most affected in terms of delayed salaries are the civil servants in rural areas. For example, a teacher from Washishi takes about seven days to go to Lukulu for his salary. If the salary is delayed, that particular teacher will have to take another seven-day trip, which disadvantages the pupils. Could the hon. Deputy Minister confirm that such inconsistencies will not be repeated. Otherwise, the Government is disadvantaging the rural population.

Mr Speaker: Order!

That question has nothing to do with the question on the Floor.


188. Mr Musonda (Kapiri Mposhi) asked the Minister of Information and Broadcasting:

(a)    when the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation would be provided with modern equipment for news coverage; and

(b)    when the Zambia News and Information Services would be provided with cameras and public address systems in all districts countrywide.

The Minister of Information and Broadcasting (Mr Kambwili): Mr Speaker, the Government is committed to ensuring that the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) is adequately capacitated to fulfil its mandate. In that regard, the Government has already started providing some equipment to the corporation as follows:

(a)    under the Digital Migration Project, K9.5 million has been spent on the installation and commissioning of a brand-new digital television transmission system from Chililabombwe to Livingstone in Phase I of the project. This project started in September, 2014, and was completed in May, 2015;

(b)    under the capitalisation of State-owned companies, K6.5 million has been released to the ZNBC for it to purchase new content production equipment, such as cameras and editing suites, and the procurement process is under way; and

(c)    under Phases II and III of the Digital Migration Project, transmission and production equipment will be provided. In addition to the rehabilitation of existing studios, new ones will be built in all the provinces. The projected cost is US $273 million.

Sir, the Government is, therefore, on course to transforming the capacity of the public broadcaster by enhancing its effectiveness.

Mr Speaker, the provision of cameras, public address systems and other communication facilities to all Zambia News and Information Services (ZANIS) offices countrywide is an on-going phased exercise in the ministry. For example, between 2012 and 2013, the ministry procured kits that included computers, printers, indoor and outdoor public address systems, video projectors, Compact Disc/Digital Video Disc (CD/DVD) players, office furniture and Internet modems for selected districts in all the provinces. There is a schedule of how the equipment is being distributed to the districts, but I will not read the schedule because doing so will take me hours. During the same period, the ministry provided motor vehicles to provincial ZANIS offices. In 2013, Mongu, Mansa and Chinsali received a vehicle each while, in 2014, six more vehicles were provided to Lusaka, Chipata, Kasama, Kabwe, Solwezi and Ndola, respectively. Under Phase II and III of the Digital Migration Project, the ministry will rehabilitate the ZANIS Studio and provide equipment for the production of news and documentaries. In addition, the project will provide eight professional cameras.

I thank you, Sir.


189. Mr Mbulakulima (Chembe) asked the Minister of Defence:

(a)    whether the Government had any plans of establishing a Marine Department in Milenge District;

(b)    if so, when the plans would be implemented; and

(c)    if there were no such plans, why.

The Deputy Minister of Defence (Mr Mulenga): Mr Speaker, the Government has no immediate plans of establishing a Marine Department in Milenge District. 

Sir, since there are no immediate plans to establish the department in Milenge District, part (b) does not apply. 

Sir, the Marine Department in Kawambwa will cover Milenge District and the water bodies within the area when need arises.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, the marine concept is new to Zambia and Luapula, in particular. However, its purposes are known. Sir, we have put the Marine Department in the interior of the province, yet the border areas are the most vulnerable. Being a border town with a lot of water, does the hon. Deputy Minister not think that Milenge should have a Marine Department to cover it? 

Mr Mulenga: Mr Speaker, as the hon. Member has rightly put it, the marines are a branch of the nation’s armed forces or special forces principally designated for naval and amphibious warfare. They are mandated to control the water bodies and ensure that any aggression on the water bodies is curbed. We have, therefore, put the barrack at the Kala Camp in Kawambwa, although the marines conduct operations on all the water bodies in Luapula Province. This is why, in my earlier response, I stated that Chembe will be catered for by the same camp that has been established in Luapula Province.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Simfukwe (Mbala): Mr Speaker, I commend, ...

Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I rise on a very serious procedural point of order, which concerns the integrity of this House and that of the members of your Committee. 

Sir, yesterday, when we voted for the Constitution Bill No. 16 and the Constitution Amendment Bill No. 17, members of the Committee on Legal Affairs, Governance, Human Rights, Gender Matters and Child Affairs who recommended to this House that the Motion be withdrawn voted against their report.

Sir, we are aware that you and your predecessors have censured and sanctioned members of a Committee who vote against their report. Therefore, are the members of your Committee, in particular, Hon. Kapeya, Hon. Kalima, Hon. Kunda, Hon. Mushili Malama and Hon. Masumba, in order to vote against your report? You constituted that Committee and gave it an assignment, and its members presented their report to this august House. They, then, decided to vote against you and their report. Are they in order, Sir?

Mr Speaker: I will reserve my ruling.

Mr Simfukwe: Mr Speaker, before the point of order was raised, I was about to commend the Government for establishing a Marine Department. Coming from a constituency that borders a large water body, namely, Lake Tanganyika, I gratefully welcome the introduction of the department by the Ministry of Defence. However, the hon. Deputy Minister has told this House that the department is focused on Luapula Province. Given the fact that Lake Tanganyika borders some very strategic countries, some of which have a history of troubles, when does the ministry intend to establish a marine unit on Lake Tanganyika on either a permanent or rotational basis?

Mr Mulenga: Mr Speaker, I appreciate the question from the hon. Member. 

Sir, we are aware of the situation on Lake Tanganyika. Like I said, we will take care of all the water bodies in that area. We have taken that lake into consideration. Very soon, you will see our marine commandoes patrol Lake Tanganyika.

I thank you, Sir. 




The Lands (Amendment) Bill, 2015

Report adopted.

Third Reading on Friday, 27th November, 2015. 


The following Bills were read the third time and passed:

The Property Transfer Tax (Amendment) Bill, 2015

The Value Added Tax (Amendment) Bill, 2015

The Customs and Excise (Amendment) Bill, 2015

The Income Tax (Amendment) Bill, 2015

The Insurance Premium Levy Bill, 2015




Clauses 35, 36, 37 and 38 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

CLAUSE 39 – (Prohibition of Sexual Harassment)

The Minister of Justice (Dr Simbyakula) (on behalf of the Minister of Gender (Prof Luo)): Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 39, on page 33, in lines 24 to 27, by the deletion of sub-Clause (3) and the insertion therefor of the following:

“(3) A person who contravenes subsection (1) commits an offence and is liable, on conviction, to imprisonment for a period of not less than three years and not exceeding fifteen years.”

Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.

Clause 39, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clauses 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56 and 57 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Schedule ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Title agreed to.


[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

The following Bill was reported to the House as having passed through Committee with an amendment:

The Gender Equity and Equality Bill, 2015

Report Stage on Thursday, 27th November, 2015.




Vote 18/01 – (The Judiciary – Headquarters – K350,552,482) and Vote 31/01 – (Ministry of Justice – Headquarters – K244,264,167).

(Consideration resumed)

Brig. Gen. Dr Chituwo (Mumbwa): Mr Chairperson, I thank the hon. Minister for that very clear statement. However, I have a few things to say regarding the Judiciary, which the Executive might wish to take into consideration.

Sir, the hon. Minister stated very clearly that the Judiciary is the third arm of Government and that, therefore, it must have administrative and financial autonomy. I note, from the Act, that the Judicial Service Commission (JSC) reports to the President but, when we come to this House, the hon. Minister of Justice presents the budget of the Judiciary. This reminds me that the hon. Minister of Justice has held on to the Judiciary for many years, either by commission or omission, and that the autonomy of the Judiciary has been incomplete to date. My suggestion is that since the JSC reports to the President, the Vice-President, the Leader of Government Business in the House, should be the one to present the budget for the Judiciary. That will be tidier, and I urge the Executive to consider this issue. 

Mr Chairperson, administratively, yes, the Judiciary is autonomous, but that cannot be complete without financial autonomy. The payroll of the Judiciary is still managed by the Executive. So, what do we really mean when we say that the Judiciary is the third arm of the Government? I note that the Legislature manages its own payroll. So, why should the Judiciary be an exception? Surely, this is a matter that must be dealt with quickly so that truly we abide by Article 92 of the Constitution, which provides for the separation of powers. 

Mr Chairperson, there has been a reduction in the amounts of money requested across the ministries and spending agencies. That, for the Judiciary, means that its mission, the effective and efficient administration of justice, cannot be attained. The hon. Minister of Justice read to this House a list of cases carried over from previous years. That shows that our judges are not able to hold court sessions. For instance, we do not have permanent High Courts in all the provinces. We meet the need for the dispensation of justice through circuit court sessions. It is important, therefore, that we establish permanent courts in earnest so that justice is dispensed speedily. As everyone knows, justice delayed is justice denied. This goes with infrastructure development, such as the building of offices and living accommodation. Equally important to look at are the provision of transport and recruitment of adequate numbers of staff. So, it is necessary for the Executive to review this budget. Over the years, there have been many Judges appointed yet, for instance, at the Supreme Court, secretaries have been displaced from their offices by hon. Justices. So, we need to budget for infrastructure development. As if that was not enough, there are problems with the local courts. There was a justifiable concerted effort to build local courts in many places in our country. However, many of the local courts have no accommodation for officers. So, how can they discharge their duties effectively and efficiently? This is the level of our justice system at which a large numbers of cases pend. Therefore, it needs to be looked at urgently.

Mr Chairperson, I note that a cadre of officers called research advocates were recruited in the quest to improve the efficiency of the Judiciary, which has assisted the Supreme Court and High Court Judges in the execution of their duties. This has gone a long way in speeding up the handling of cases in those courts. However, we need more of the research advocates. 

Mr Chairperson, there is a need for the Government to improve the conditions of service for magistrates. I can say with authority that Judges’ conditions are currently acceptable. However, the gap between the magistrates and Judges is too wide. We are likely to run into a crisis at the magistrates’ level if positive consideration is not given to that cadre of officers.

Mr Chairperson, issues of governance are very important, and the Judiciary carries the burden of ensuring that there is good governance. The politicians deal with issues of governance, but the apex of governance is in the Judiciary. Therefore, if this wing of the Government does not work effectively, we will infringe on other people’s human rights. For example, the numbers of people who have been remanded without their cases being heard are filling our prisons when they are not supposed to be in prison. There is a huge number of cases waiting to be heard regardless of how much the officers try to clear them because there is a limit to which human beings can stretch themselves. So, I hope that the hon. Minister of Justice will look at these few issues in earnest. When there is a well-oiled and functional Judiciary to which everybody goes for the interpretation of the law and resolution of disputes, it contributes to peace in the country. Justice is a human right.

Mr Chairperson, lastly, the training at the Zambia Institute of Advanced Legal Education (ZIALE), which is prerequisite to one being called to the Bar is quite rigorous. Granted, there has been a marginal increase in the pass rate. However, I still feel that the curriculum should be reviewed. I am not a lawyer, but we all read books, and listen to people’s observations and complaints. A lot can be achieved at ZIALE by linking it to training institutions so that we can have a cadre of lawyers at various levels that will contribute to the effective dispensation of justice in our country. 

Mr Chairperson, the foregoing are my thoughts, and the hon. Minister might do well to consider them.

Mr Chairperson, I thank you.

Mr Muchima (Ikeleng’i): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for allowing me to contribute to this important Vote, which is for the Judiciary. Let me state, from the outset, that I support it wholeheartedly.

Mr Chairperson, the Judiciary is like a hospital. We are all potentially its clients in one way or another.

Sir, I agree with Hon. Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo that the Judiciary staff is not motivated. The hon. Minister of Justice is a learned counsel, and I ask him to change the situation. The Judiciary contributes a lot to the revenue of this country by generating non-tax revenue through fines and fees and handles large sums of money despite its terrible conditions of service. The remuneration of Judiciary staff should be comparable to that of Zambia Revenue Authority (ZRA) staff. There is a lot of corruption in the Judiciary because the staff is not motivated. No wonder files go missing and most lawyers have turned to politics. Today, it is not impossible for people to pre-determine the way a case will be concluded. We know that certain Judges or magistrates are, for example, Patriotic Front (PF) or United Party for National Development (UPND) sympathisers through the way they handle cases taken before them.

Mr Kampyongo: On a point of order, Sir.

The Chairperson: A point of order is raised.

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Chairperson, I thank you for allowing me to rise on this very important point of order. 

Sir, I am struggling to follow the hon. Member on the Floor. It is only fair that we do not debate people who are not here to defend themselves. However, the hon. Member is making allegations that he cannot even substantiate about people who are not here to defend themselves. He cannot lay proof of their alleged corruption on the Floor. I have stated before that we should not use the Floor of the House to attack another arm of the Government. Is he, therefore, in order to continue with that manner of debate? 

Sir, I seek your serious ruling.

The Chairperson: The serious ruling is that we are debating the Judiciary, and I listened attentively, but I did not hear him name any individual. He spoke generally about what is happening in the Judiciary. He is, therefore, in order.

Continue, Hon. Muchima.

Mr Muchima: Viva Chair!


Mr Muchima: Mr Chairperson, I was saying that a lack of motivation causes corruption in the Judiciary. So, the Government needs to motivate the personnel in the Judiciary because they handle cash and sensitive cases involving people in desperate situations. As we know, a desperate person can do anything. So, the only cure for corruption in the Judiciary is motivation of its personnel. Some officers in the Judiciary do not even have office space. They even share courtrooms and look so miserable because of a lack of money. Their salaries are inadequate. 

Sir, when the Judiciary staff is motivated, justice will be delivered speedily. People are currently not happy because the personnel in the Judiciary want people to languish at their offices until they get so fed up of the process that they finally offer bribes for their cases to be heard. So, we need to study what is happening in the Judiciary, a very critical arm of the Government. All those who have gone through the court process understand what I am talking about here. If the workers in the Judiciary were better paid, they would be more interested in carrying out their duties. Currently, no one seems to pay attention to the matter of files getting lost in the courts, which is the order of the day. The Judiciary is run in a laissez-faire manner despite being very critical to the lives of the many people who need it. 

Sir, we should also keep politics away from the Judiciary so that justice can be dispensed fairly to the people. We need fair play in this country. When one commits an offence, he should be judged accordingly regardless of his political alignment or who the Judge handling his case is. The fairness of the people in the Judiciary should be closer to that of Biblical saints so that we can run to them when we need justice. In Zambia, the justice system is slowly degenerating to a point where we have kangaroo courts in which law and order are sacrificed for political expediency. 

Sir, the Judiciary should be fully autonomous. In that regard, I am against the way the Chief Justice is appointed. I think that he should not be appointed by the President, but by fellow lawyers through the Law Association of Zambia (LAZ) because they know themselves better. Lawyers should appoint the Chief Justice the same way they appoint the LAZ President. They should recommend the names of people who can be appointed Chief Justice to Parliament, as that will be a sure way of ensuring a fairer dispensation of justice in this country. Our Chief Justice should not be answerable to only one person. Otherwise, the person who holds the office will have only his appointing authority in mind when presiding over the Judiciary. We want society to appoint officers to dispense justice ...

The Chairperson: Order, Hon. Muchima!

As you continue with your debate, please, bear in mind the fact that this House ratifies the appointment of the Chief Justice. 

Mr Muchima: Mr Chairperson, I have seen that there has been an improvement in the training of local court officials. The Government no longer picks villagers to serve as local court officials, as it is now a requirement that local court officials have a minimum of a Grade 12 Certificate. However, the Government should go further and induct these officials, maybe, through the National Institute of Public Administration (NIPA) so that they can understand how to handle certain matters and avoid going beyond their mandate, as I have seen some local court officials do. 

Sir, justice delayed is justice denied. What is the cause of delays in the administration of justice? Is it the Judiciary that is slow or the kind of laws we have? This is an issue that we should review, especially given the dynamic nature of our society. 

Mr Chairperson, let me get back to the issue of appointments in the Judiciary. Although some appointments are ratified by Parliament, I think that legal practitioners should be the ones recommending names for appointment to important positions in the Judiciary. The person appointed Chief Justice is not one who is imposed on Parliament by the arrogance of numbers, but one who is acceptable from all angles, as that will ensure an unbiased justice system. In short, the Executive must take this arm of the Government to be as critical as the ministries instead of neglecting it.  

Sir, magistrates are qualified lawyers, but they are not looked at in the same way as Judges are. Look at the Legal Aid Board. It is supposed to have offices everywhere in the country in order to help the poor, but it is confined to Lusaka and, even in Lusaka, it does not have proper offices. It is housed in one office with broken furniture, yet the people working there are qualified lawyers. How does the Government expect them to perform their work in such conditions? Even before going to represent a people in courts, they look miserable. 

Sir, the Government needs to look at the issues I have raised in order to ensure a fair justice system. I also urge the hon. Minister of Justice to review the conditions of service for the staff in the Judiciary.

Mr Chairperson, with these few words, I thank you. 

Mr Mwiimbu (Monze Central): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to debate this Vote. In my discourse, I will concentrate on the Ministry of Justice, specifically, the Office of the Attorney-General, created under Article 54 of the Constitution of Zambia, and the Director of Public Prosecutions (DPP), created under Article 56 of the Laws of Zambia. 

Mr Chairperson, according to Article 54 1(b) of the Constitution of Zambia, the Attorney-General is the principal legal adviser to the Government, and we are all aware that the Government has three arms, namely, the Executive, the Judiciary and the Legislature. 

Sir, as principal legal adviser to the Government, I would like the Attorney-General to know that the breakdown of law and order in this country is a result of his failure to properly advise the Government. 

The Chairperson: Order, Hon. Mwiimbu!

I am a bit uncomfortable with your debating the holder of the office, as that takes us back to the point of order that was raised by someone about debating individuals. I would rather you talked about the Office of the Attorney-General, not the office-holder. I am sure, Hon. Mwiimbu, that, as a lawyer, you understand that saying that the Attorney-General is failing is an indictment on him, as an individual. Unfortunately, he may not be able to defend himself here. So, I would rather you talked about the Office of the Attorney-General rather than the Attorney-General. 

You may continue.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Chairperson, there is no provision in the Constitution of Zambia that talks of the Attorney-General as an individual. The Attorney-General is an office that is conferred on an individual, and I am talking about the present Office of the Attorney-General. That office has what is called Attorney-General’s Chambers, which has many officers. So, I am not referring to the Attorney-General, as a person. 

I was saying, Sir, that the current breakdown of law and order in the country is a result of the failure of the Office of the Attorney-General, which is the adviser to the hon. Minister of Home Affairs and the Inspector-General of Police. We are all aware that various statements pertaining to the breakdown of law and order have been made on the Floor of this House. That breakdown of law and order, which has led to violence, is a result of the failure to advise the police to correctly administer the provisions of the Public Order Act.  

Mr Chairperson, the law pertaining to the management of public order is very clear. If an individual or group of people want to hold a procession, assemble or meet in public, they merely have to notify the police, which has no authority to reject the holding of the proposed event. The police is merely supposed to advise on the security implications of holding such an event on the chosen day. If the chosen day is not suitable, another day should be proposed for the event. If the police is not able to provide security, according to the law, it is supposed to ask the organisers of the event to provide their own security personnel called marshals. If the organisers comply with that requirement, the event should be allowed to go ahead. Unfortunately, in Zambia, the police has taken it that it has the authority to permit citizens to hold assemblies, rallies and processions, which is contrary to the law. 

Mr Chairperson, the point I am making is that the Office of the Attorney-General is failing in its duties to advise the police properly and, if that failure continues, there will be a progressive breakdown of law and order in this country and violence will continue. When that happens, the institution that will be held responsible is that office because all Government institutions are its clients. The Attorney-General should not wait to be sued in courts of law. In this country, if one wants to sue the Government, he or she does not sue the Government of the Republic of Zambia directly, but indirectly by suing the Attorney-General.

Sir, today, I listened to the President’s press conference in which he praised the Public Order Act, saying that it is very good and that it should stay in the statute books. However, I recall him telling us on the Floor of this House that we needed to reform that law because it had caused many problems. Everybody knows that the Act is causing many problems. The violence that occurred on the Copperbelt and in Nalolo, where Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning’s house was damaged, is a result of our failure to properly administer the Act and, as I said, the responsibility to advise the Government properly lies with the Attorney-General. 

Sir, the Attorney-General should advise all the three arms of the Government, not just the Executive. The office has the responsibility to advise even Parliament on legal issues, including when hon. Members of Parliament complain over certain issues or when this institution is out of order before it is sued. The Attorney-General is the chief legal adviser to the Judiciary as well.

Mr Chairperson, my second issue is that Zambians have complained about selective justice and prosecution in this country. Those who are perceived to be from the ‘royal family’ get away with lawlessness while those who are perceived to be enemies of the Ruling Party have been targeted for prosecution. The Office of the DDP is used to prosecute political opponents of the Ruling Party, and selective prosecution amounts to persecution. The DPP’s Office, as a Constitutional Office, has the responsibility to administer criminal justice fairly for the sake of everybody in the country, not to be used to target individual citizens of this country. We have noticed that some people who are appearing before the courts of law are being appointed to certain positions and, immediately they are appointed to some positions of authority in the Government, ...


The Chairperson: Order, on the right!

Mr Mwiimbu: ... the DPP goes to sleep on their cases, thereby giving the impression that those in positions of authority are insulated from prosecution. Ordinary Zambians are wondering why the poor are always the ones being prosecuted by the DPP’s Chambers. It is not fair. The DPP’s Office is there to serve every Zambian. So, it must be seen to be performing its duties in a fair manner. 

Mr Chairperson, I am aware that there is no statute of limitation in criminal cases in this country. So, even if a particular DPP chooses not to prosecute some cases, another DPP will prosecute them. Unfortunately, the people being prosecuted would seem to be persecuted.

Sir, the offices of the Attorney-General and the DPP should manage the affairs of the country fairly and be seen to dispense justice in the interest of every Zambian.

Sir, let me briefly talk about the Judiciary. 

Sir, of late, I have noted, with concern, situations in which some members of society who are aggrieved with decisions made by the Judiciary cast aspersions on the institution, and insult, threaten and harass its officials. A Judge was even made to reverse his ruling after party cadres threatened to sort him out.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: That is very unfortunate and it should not be allowed to continue. Last year, when some members of the Patriotic Front (PF) were appearing at the Magistrates Court Complex, PF cadres in party regalia met and threatened the presiding magistrates while brandishing pangas, but got away with it. We are intimidating the Judiciary, which is not fair. We, the hon. Members of Parliament and members of the general public, must protect that institution.

Sir, the men and women in the Judiciary perform their duties under very difficult conditions because their lives are always under threat. Instead of protecting them, we, the leaders, are threatening them. As a responsible Government, we must defend the officers of the Judiciary when we see or hear threats against them because they have been appointed to perform functions under the Constitution of Zambia for the sake of every citizen of this country. If we do not do that, they will not dispense justice accordingly because they have children and relatives to look after.

I thank you, Sir.

The Chairperson: Order!

Business was suspended from 1615 hours until 1630 hours. 


Mr Mbulakulima (Chembe): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me this rare opportunity to make a few remarks on this important topic. As you know, I am a man of neither many nor few words. I am in between.

Sir, I would like to make some remarks on the Judiciary. I recall that the appointment of the current Chief Justice was almost unanimously supported by this House, which I have never seen happen before. In the terminology of the legal fraternity, she is called ‘Her Lordship’, but I prefer to call her ‘My Lady’. 

Sir, My Lady the Chief Justice is under intense pressure to satisfy the expectations of that office. I wrote a few notes on the topic that I want to share with the House. Her job comes with a lot of pressure and responsibility, and the nation expects her to rise to the occasion. 

Mr Chairperson, there are some issues that I feel the Chief Justice must look at, one of which is that of the lack of infrastructure in the Judiciary. The issue of delayed justice that my colleagues mentioned partly has to do with the lack of space in the higher courts. I believe that we have done relatively well at the local court level, but we need to enhance the capacity of the High Court to handle larger volumes of cases. If I am not mistaken, there are only eight offices at the High Court in Lusaka, which means that only eight cases can be heard at any given time. So, the rest of the cases delay. I am also aware that, in Kabwe, the subordinate court shares office space with the local court, which raises the question of which of the courts should take precedence over the other. So, that matter does not augur well. I believe that Her Ladyship the Chief Justice has the responsibility to address this issue and make the Judiciary a better institution than she found it by increasing office space so that more cases can be heard.

Mr Chairperson, the other issue I want to talk about is that of petitions of election results. You may recall that after the 2011 General Elections, there were many petitions whose verdicts were delayed. I believe that some cases are still pending to date, which is not good. I hope that the Chief Justice will make that a thing of the past. 

Sir, someone talked about the unfairness of some cases taking too long while others take a short time. Indeed, one wonders what formula is used in deciding which cases to hear first, and I think that these are some of the issues that worry our people. So, the Judiciary must be on top of things and instil confidence in the general public. In some cases, the rulings are made in time, but the determination of compensation for the person who won the case takes a long time. Therefore, there is delayed justice when there is limited space because it takes too long for cases to be heard. On average, it takes about four years for criminal cases to be disposed of, which is a long time for one to be remanded. So, there is a need for the Ministry of Justice to find a solution to this problem.

Sir, with regard to the independence of the Judiciary, there is a need for us to look at how it is funded. In the current situation, whereby it is funded by another arm of Government, very few people will believe that it is independent. So, a formula must be found for funding the Judiciary without compromising its independence.

Mr Chairperson, another issue that worries me is the computerisation of the Judiciary. For a long time now, we have been hearing about the computerisation of the Judiciary, but that has not been done. If you went to the High Court today, you would find that the Judges simply write notes on their cases by hand. When things are done manually, it has a bearing on the Judiciary’s efficiency. I believe time has come for us to computerise the system so as to deliver justice to the people.

Sir, another issue that needs to be addressed involves the dual roles that some people have to perform. We are laymen, but we see, for example, that the Deputy Registrar is also part of the court, which leads to a delay in the dispensation of justice. So, I think that some of these issues must be attended to administratively in order for us to make the Judiciary efficient.

Finally, Mr Chairperson, somebody debated the pass rate at the Zambia Institute of Advanced Legal Education (ZIALE). Let me also talk about it from a layman’s perspective. There is a need for the nation to look at why most students fail. I wonder why most students fail at ZIALE. For example, out of 200 candidates, you will find only eighteen being admitted to the Bar. Just like we need accountants, engineers and doctors, we also need lawyers to graduate from that institution and serve the nation. What makes it difficult for students to pass at ZIALE? Is it the students or examiners who are incompetent? Let me cite a relevant example to elaborate my point. On one of the trunk roads, there is a signpost written “Black Spot” but, year in and year out, we lose lives on that spot. However, as a nation, we still have not done anything about it, just like we have done nothing about the high failure rates at ZIALE. So, when the hon. Minister of Justice winds up this debate, he should clearly indicate what the solution will be.

Mr Chairperson, I stated that I am a man of neither many nor few words. So, I end here.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Mufalali (Senanga): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to say a few words on the Motion of the Floor of the House, which I support.

Sir, the hon. Member of Parliament for Chembe stated that about eighteen students pass their examinations at the Zambia Institute of Advanced Legal Education (ZIALE). However, in some cases, only four students have passed, and one wonders what type of school it is …


Mr Mufalali: … where the majority of students fail. Even when they pass on the second attempt, one still questions their intelligence, considering that they failed on their first attempt. We also wonder whether it is the lecturers who are not good enough, as the hon. Member indicated. This has been a thorny issue for a long time, and I think that the earlier the hon. Minister addresses it, the better because we cannot understand why students pass at the University of Zambia (UNZA), yet most of them fail at ZIALE.

Mr Chairperson, the justice system in Zambia has collapsed and we need to revamp it to ensure that our people, whose interests it exists to serve, are protected because the sovereignty of any nation lies in its people. What we are currently seeing in the Judiciary is not good. If you read on Rwanda’s justice system prior to the genocide, you will discover how it started failing the people of that country and how the police contributed to that in some way. Further, hon. Members will realise that the justice system in any nation is at the centre of ensuring that there is peace in the nation and that all the activities are balanced. For example, the Director of Public Prosecution (DPP’s) Office has ended up entering nolle prosequis in many of the cases it has handled a week or two after initiating proceedings, and we wonder why this has been the case. We also wonder whether the lawyers in the DPP’s Office are competent because they a competent lawyer is supposed to know whether a case can stand in court or not and, if a case lacks merit, the lawyers should stop it from going to court. Some laws have been repealed, but the DPP’s Office continues applying them until they realise when it is too late. I suppose, that is an indictment on the DPP’s Office and the Ministry of Justice. Much as we appreciate that the entering of nolle prosequis is part of the justice system, if it is done too often, people will start questioning what is happening in the justice system of our nation because competent lawyers are supposed to present competent cases before the courts law and be able to argue them out. The current practice of entering nolle prosequis and re-arresting people is inconveniencing.  

Mr Chairperson, there was a classic case in Senanga in which a Local Court Judge fined parents who had taken their daughter from her so-called husband so that she could continue with her education. The Judge ruled that the parents were wrong to act in such a way and fined them, yet they had acted to protect their girl child’s right to education and dissolved a child marriage. Unfortunately, in our rotten system, such cases are common. The Judge could not feel pity for a poor child, but instead encourage the parents to marry the girl off, which is very unfair and must be stopped.

Mr Chairperson, another example is the well-known case of the third highest ranking member of the Patriotic Front (PF) who took advantage of his position to threaten a Judge. It is unfortunate that a senior member of the Ruling Party could behave in such a manner because that is not supposed to happen. We are tipping over to the Rwandan method of trying to dominate others using political power and patronage. Some political figures think they are so powerful that they can even command a Judge to withdraw a case. This actually happened. In fact, it was the Secretary-General of the PF who threatened a Judge. We do not have to beat about the bush. Where is our justice system headed where a Secretary-General of a party has the audacity to threaten a Judge with dismissal? That is the collapse of the justice system we are talking about. Therefore, it must not be considered a small issue or condoned. 

Sir, all of the sudden, we have seen people who had court cases stop going to court. What is happening with our system? What has happened to the cases? We want to see the cases continued because the discontinuing of the cases hinges on the credibility of the justice system. If the courts fail to continue with the cases, then, we will obviously know that there is corruption in the system; the same corruption that other hon. Members have talked about. In short, what we are saying is that there is corruption in the Judiciary and the entire justice system. That should not be allowed to continue. Otherwise, the powerful will always get away with lawlessness. If a Permanent Secretary is found to have stolen some public resources and is charged, he must continue appearing in the courts of law because he is a thief. However, if another DPP is appointed and he or she discontinues the case, then, the justice system will lose its direction, a situation we should not allow to continue in this country. If we really want this country to remain the way it has been, we must uphold the justice system and respect the Judiciary. What we are seeing currently should not be allowed by right-thinking citizens of this country because there should be no sacred cows in the administration of justice.

Mr Chairperson, those who feel that they are very powerful are not being truthful to themselves because there is no individual who is more powerful than all the people of this country. So, everyone must respect the people. 

Sir, some of the statements that we hear from the PF leadership are unfortunate. Those who know that they are the seat of justice, the President included, as he also dispenses justice through the prerogative of mercy, should not tell us that they are so powerful as to do this or that. Such a statement must not come from the Head of State because we have the courts of law, and it is the President who appoints the Chief Justice. So, when he portrays himself as being able to do anything because he is the Commander-in-Chief of the Armed Forces, that is unfortunate. We do not want to hear that because he must be neutral, being the source of justice. Much as he is a political leader, that kind of statement must not be heard from him.

Mr Chairperson, the other issue I want to talk about is the lack of infrastructure in the Judiciary. We cannot continue to hear court cases under trees in Senanga rural. Hon. Sing’ombe and I found court cases being heard under a mango tree in Mambolomoka and the Judge told us that he was a retiree who had not been paid his pension. He said that he was in shock and had just resorted to heavy beer-drinking. We asked him which courtroom he was working from and he pointed at a mango tree.



The Deputy Chairperson: Order, Hon. Mufalali!

Avoid discussions with somebody who has not been authorised to debate. Address the Chairperson.

Mr Mufalali: Mr Chairperson, fifty-one years after Independence, we were shown a tree for a courtroom. We should not be proud of that. If you go to Senanga; Sibukali; Bbilili in Dundumwezi; Namwala and Mbabala, you will find the same situation, yet we are here proudly saying that we are moving forward, as a nation.

Ms Lubezhi: That is right. Zyilamana zyikwati mu zyisamu.

Mr Mufalali: Sir, we cannot be proud of a situation in which the Ministry of Justice is denied sufficient resources. Once, I heard the hon. Deputy Minister of Justice say that the Government would construct more courtrooms when funds became available, yet there is congestion in Senanga, Kaoma and Kalabo ...

Mr Sing’ombe: Congestion under trees.

Mr Mufalali: Yes, under trees. That should not be the case. Fifty-one years after Independence, that record should have been scrapped off. We should have constructed courtrooms everywhere, including in the rural areas.

Ms Lubezhi: Even in Chasefu.

Mr Mufalali: It would not matter whether the structures are small or not. What is important is for them to be constructed. Unfortunately, we have had occasions in which the hon. Minister of Justice has come here and told us that the Government would build courtrooms when funds became available. That is not fair to our people. So, let us all support the Ministry of Justice. The Ministry of Finance, too, should support the Ministry of Justice. That is the only way that justice will be better served. The local courts cannot continue operating in the manner they are operating.

With those few words, I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Chairperson, thank you for giving me the opportunity to debate. I will be brief.

Sir, the Judiciary had more than 6,700 cases, of which it only managed to dispose of 1,000. That record is very bad and, if the Judiciary was to be rated on the basis of this performance, it would be rated very low. It had about 1,800 criminal cases, of which only 700 were disposed of. In a way, that is a bit okay because it is about half of the cases. The local courts, on the other hand, had 54,134 cases, of which 29,000 are still pending. To make matters worse, the courts are so far apart that people have to cover very long distances to attend proceedings. That being the case with criminal cases, I shudder to think what the situation is regarding civil cases, and my biggest concern is whether justice will be dispensed.

Mr Sing’ombe: On a point of order, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Chairperson, is the hon. Member of Parliament for Senanga Constituency in order to conclude his debate without asking the Patriotic Front (PF) Government to provide more resources to the Ministry of Justice? He has not asked the Government to, at least, provide umbrellas to the people attending court sessions under tress?

Sir, I need your serious ruling.

The Deputy Chairperson: The hon. Member is definitely in order because he did not want to talk about what he did not know.


Mr Mutelo: Mr Chairperson, when you go to either the Supreme Court or High Court, you will see the symbols of justice in front of the two buildings. Unfortunately, those are mere symbols or figurative representations. In practice, the application of justice is not balanced, and will never be. If what is depicted by the symbols of justice was practised inside the courtrooms, then, justice would be served. What normally happens is that when one of the parties to a court case has some kind of social privilege, the balance of the justice system is tilted in his or her favour. So, you end up having a situation in which there is 2 kg of justice on one side and 500 grammes on the other, which is not justice. That is not true justice and, sooner rather than later, there is a true form of justice that catches up with the perpetrators of injustice, namely, natural justice. True justice soon catches up with injustice, and the former always triumphs. 

Sir, politically, during the United National Independence Party (UNIP) rule, the Government was dispensing justice in an unfair manner. So, when the Movement for Multi-Party Democracy (MMD) came into power, the injustices of UNIP caught up with those who had perpetrated them. Similarly, when the MMD was in power, it disregarded the rule of law and when the PF came into power, the law or justice caught up with members of the MMD, and this trend will continue. Injustice is not permanent. The only form of justice that is permanent is natural justice. So, either the Government dispenses justice in the right way and at the right time or justice will catch up with it at some point in time. Life is the best teacher. I recall my parents telling me not to do some things and how I would defy them only to end up realising that life is the best teacher because of the consequences of my actions. Justice is also like that.

Mr Chairperson, let us give our Judges, magistrates and local court justices what is due to them. The local courts should be given more funds because they face more challenges. For instance, there are one or two courts in Mitete, the district I am most conversant with. I do not know whether there are some in Chasefu, Kaputa and Shiwang’andu, among other places. However, the presiding officers in those courts are also human and, for them to dispense justice fairly, they need resources. If the fair administration of justice starts at the grassroots, this country will have order and our justice system will improve because if we empower the local courts with the needed resources, they will perform to the best of their abilities and instil discipline in our people. 

Sir, I appreciate the idea of holding circuit courts because Lukulu and Mitete have had no magistrates for quite a long time. So, circuiting is a good thing, especially in places where there are no magistrates. Otherwise, we will continue having people remanded in custody for unnecessarily long periods of time without being tried. In such cases, it is better for those who are found guilty because they would have served part of their sentence before being sentenced. However, those who are not guilty would have been unfairly imprisoned for a long time just because there was no Judge to hear their cases.

Mr Chairperson, justice only prevails in a peaceful environment, and peace starts in the mind. We must have peace in our minds and hearts for it to flow outwards in our homes, neighbourhoods and the country at large. In an environment where there is no peace, there is fear and, out of fear, there will be intimidation and injustice. So, if we want to have justice, let us ensure that we have peace first. 

Sir, I hope my colleagues have heard my advice because if they have not, then, we will have to wait for natural justice, which will visit each one of us at some point in time.

Thank you very much, Sir.

The Minister of Justice (Dr Simbyakula): Mr Chairperson, thank you for giving me the opportunity to wind up debate on this Vote. 

Sir, I must say I am very impressed by Hon. Mutelo’s exposition of the judicial calculus. It reminded me of Prof. Hart of the realist school in jurisprudence. Therefore, let me express my profound gratitude to all the hon. Members who have debated in support of the two Votes. I will be very brief in winding up this debate.

Mr Chairperson, the justice delivery system consists of many facets, including the personnel and court infrastructure. Therefore, we do not just build court infrastructure without other infrastructure like accommodation for the personnel that will man the courts, just like we said, when discussing the construction of police posts using the Constituency Development Fund (CDF), that the construction of police posts must be accompanied by the construction of accommodation for police officers. That is the principle we are using when constructing court infrastructure. It must go hand in hand with accommodation for officers. Otherwise, we will have many court premises that will not be used because of a lack of court staff.

Mr Chairperson, we are doing our utmost in the face of our current financial constraints to use the available funds judiciously to build infrastructure and recruit more personnel. I have already stated that there are many players involved in the justice delivery system, not just the Judiciary. In every court case, there are the prosecution and the defence, such as the Legal Aid Board, all of which have to be in place in order for our people to access justice. Where we do not have courts, we will use the system of court circuiting, and that will be with us until we construct adequate court infrastructure. In the Patriotic Front (PF) Manifesto, we have stated that we aim to have resident High Courts in all the provincial centres. That is what we are trying to do, and we will try as much as possible to secure the requisite funds. 

Mr Chairperson, I agree with Hon. Mbulakulima that we live in an era of computerisation. In this regard, we are exploring a new concept called e-Judiciary, which is similar to the e-Voucher and e-Commerce that we have all heard about before. Recently, some technocrats from the Judiciary and Ministry of Justice travelled to Singapore and the United Kingdom (UK) to learn more about the e-Judiciary concept, which we hope to introduce in our jurisdiction shortly.

Mr Chairperson, for all of us to enjoy our freedoms, the Judiciary, which is a mirror of our society, must remain independent. I think that Zambia is one of the few countries in the Commonwealth that are praised for having an independent Judiciary. Our Judges have been truly independent since Independence. Therefore, let us keep it that way. 

Sir, judiciaries all over the world, including in the Western democracies, are financed by the central government. Equally, the Chief Justice of the United States of America (USA) is nominated by the President and ratified by the Congress. Even the Indian judicial system is the same as ours, and things are that way for purposes of providing checks and balances. The executive makes the appointment and, then, the legislature participates in the appointment by ratifying the person. This has been going on for the last fifty-one years of Zambia’s existence.

Mr Chairperson, as I conclude, I, once again, thank all the hon. Members for their active debate and support.

I thank you, Sir.

Vote 18/01 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 18/02 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 18/03 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 18/04 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 18/05 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 18/06 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 18/07 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 18/08 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 18/10 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/11 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/12 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/13 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/14 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/15 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/16 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/17 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/18 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/19 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/20 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/21 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/22 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/23 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/24 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/25 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/26 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/27 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/28 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/29 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/30 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/31 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/32 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/33 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/34 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/35 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

VOTE 18/35 – (Judiciary – Subordinate Court – Muchinga Province – K4,061,732).

Mr Milambo (Mwembeshi): Mr Chairperson, I seek clarification on Programme 4002, Activity 010 – Nil, Activity 012 – Nil, Activity 023 – Nil and Activity 047 – Nil. Why are all these activities not funded?

The Deputy Minister of Justice (Mr Mukata): Mr Chairperson, the activities are not provided for on account of a rationalisation of funds in the Budget due to a scarcity of funds.

I thank you, Sir.

Vote 18/35 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 18/36 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 31/01 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 31/02 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 31/03 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 31/08 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

VOTE 21 – (Loans and Investments – Ministry of Finance – K9,961,276,235) and VOTE 37 – (Ministry of Finance – K1,777,092,584).

The Minister of Finance (Mr Chikwanda): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to present my policy statement on the 2016 Estimates of Expenditure for the Ministry of Finance. My statement will cover Votes 21 and 37. 

Sir, before I proceed, I wish to remind this august House that some of the functions related to national development planning, which were previously in the Ministry of Finance, were transferred to the newly-created Ministry of Development Planning under the very able leadership of Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning. Consequently, the Ministry of Finance has remained with the mandate to perform statutory functions that include the preparation of the National Budget, economic management, resource mobilisation and financial management. Further, the ministry is responsible for managing public resources in a transparent and accountable manner for sustainable national development. In this regard, the ministry seeks to attain the following objectives:

(a)    to achieve sustainable macro-economic growth stability and well-co-ordinated social-economic development;

(b)    to be transparent and accountable in  the mobilisation and management of public resources; 

(c)    to strengthen internal audits;

(d)    to enhance financial and fiscal prudence in the management of public resources;

(e)    to co-ordinate and enhance stakeholder participation in the preparation of the national Budget; and 

(f)    to enhance investment and debt management.

Sir, the 2016 estimates of expenditure being presented before you reflect the core functions and mandates of the ministry. 

Mr Chairperson, Vote 21 will cover contributions and subscriptions to international organisations, funding to special and donor-funded projects, financial restructuring, recapitalisation of State-owned enterprises and financing of the road infrastructure development. In this regard, the ministry proposes to spend K9,961,276,235. Under projects, the proposed expenditure is K533,766,832, the major expenditures of which will be K187,500,000 for the Citizen’s Economic Empowerment Fund (CEEC) and K150,000,000 for the Action Plan on Youth Employment and Empowerment Projects. These are in line with the Government’s policy of empowering its people. 

Mr Chairperson, with regard to recapitalisation and investments, the proposed expenditure is K2,671,774,191, of which the notable expenditures will include K1,155,600,000 for fuel arrears, K536,237,121 for the sinking fund account, K458,388,000 million for the Kenneth Kaunda International Airport (KKIA) and K146,000,003 for the establishment of provinces and districts.

Sir, the proposed expenditure on road infrastructure is K6,629, 938,774, of which the major expenditures will include K1,833,615,116 for the Road Infrastructure Maintenance Programme Road Fund, K674,175,000 for the upgrading of the Nakonde/Mbala Road, K311.17 million for the rehabilitation the Great North Road from Mpika to Nakonde, K300,000,000 for the rehabilitation of roads under the Lusaka 400 Kilometres (L400) Road Project in Lusaka, K272.2 million for rehabilitation of the Nacala Corridor Road, K220,849,890 for the upgrading of Mansa/Luwingu/Chipili Road, K187,500,000 for the rehabilitation and construction of  rural roads, K103,296,932 for the upgrading of the Mongu/Kalabo Road, K100,000,000 for the Mpika Urban Roads Project, K90,000,000 for the Lusaka/Chirundu Road and K35,000,000 for the Pave Zambia Project. 

Mr Chairperson, let me now bring out the salient features of Vote 37 – Ministry of Finance. 

Sir, my ministry has budgeted K1,777,092,584 for accelerating the development of the country. Notable expenditures under this Vote will include K511,825,480 million as grants to institutions like the Zambia Revenue Authority (ZRA), Zambia Public Procurement Authority (ZPPA), Financial Intelligence Centre (FIC), National Road Fund Agency (NRFA) and the Revenue Appeals Tribunal (RAT); K792,000,000 for the employer’s share statutory obligation for all civil servants, which is centrally budgeted for under the Ministry of Finance; K116,000,000 personal emoluments for Constitutional Office holders; and K44,000,000 for dismantling the arrears accumulated by Government ministries over the years. 

Mr Chairperson, in line with its commitment to strengthening financial management in the Public Service, the Government has reached a number of milestones, including the development of the Planning and Budgeting Policy, which is the basis for developing the Planning and Budgeting Bill. In addition, the Finance Act is being reviewed to improve accountability and transparency in the management of public resources.

Mr Chairperson, the Integrated Financial Management Information System (IFMIS) has been rolled out to 88 per cent of the line ministries, provinces and other spending agencies funded by the Government, and is expected to improve financial accounting and reporting in those institutions.

Sir, the Government has also started implementing a Single Treasury Account (STA) to improve the disbursement and management of cash balances, and prevent abuses. To consolidate the STA and improve the execution of public projects, the Government has also embarked on the computerisation of the procurement process. These reforms are expected to address the weaknesses in public financial management. To this effect, the ministry proposes to spend K102,484,211 for the Public Financial Management Reforms Programme in 2016.  One of the major reforms to be implemented under this programme will be in revenue administration, in which support will be channelled to the Zambia Revenue Authority (ZRA) to enable it to continue to fulfil its regulatory requirements of verifying the accuracy of mining tax returns by improving its monitoring capabilities. The programme will also bring all the reporting obligations of mining companies under one system to enhance Government oversight. Other areas of support will be in the strengthening of the Integrated Financial Management Information System (IFMIS) and cash management.   

Mr Chairperson, I hope that my statement and explanations have been detailed enough to assuage all the hon. Members’ concerns. 

Sir, I now recommend Head 21 – Loans and Investments, and Head 37 – Ministry of Finance, for the favourable consideration and approval of this august House. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chairperson, I am eternally indebted to my colleagues for the unanimous support of my ministry’s budget. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Vote 21/01 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/01 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 37/02 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 37/04 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/06 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 37/07 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 37/08 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 37/10 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

Vote 37/11 ordered to stand part of the Estimates. 

VOTE 88 – (Muchinga Province – K50,625,853), VOTE 90 – (Lusaka Province – K60,533,931), VOTE 91 – (Copperbelt Province – K68,773,031), VOTE 92 – (Central Province – K64,656,749), VOTE 93 – (Northern Province – K63,924,668), VOTE 94 – (Western Province – K69,401,741), VOTE 95 – (Eastern Province – K61,063,176), VOTE 96 – (Luapula Province – K60,771,073), VOTE 97 – (North-Western Province – K59,303,719) and VOTE 98 – (Southern Province – K80,642,037).

The Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning (Mrs Wina): Mr Chairperson, it is my honour to issue the policy statement in support of the 2016 Estimates of Expenditure for the Office of the President, Provincial Administration, to this august House. This statement covers all the ten provinces of the country. 

Sir, Provincial Administration is an extension of the Central Government at the regional level. It is responsible for civil administration, and effective co-ordination and implementation of national policies and programmes in each of the provinces. To achieve its mandate, Provincial Administration is guided by the following mission statement:

“To co-ordinate and administer implementation of national policies and programmes in the province in order to enhance service delivery and promote sustainable development.”

Mr Chairperson, given its proximity to the people, Provincial Administration remains a viable vehicle for administering and co-ordinating the implementation of developmental programmes on behalf of the sector ministries. The 2016 budget is, therefore, aimed at providing Provincial Administration with the requisite resources for the effective and efficient implementation of developmental programmes in our quest to promote sustainable development and ensure the equitable provision of quality services to our people. 

Sir, in 2016, Provincial Administration will continue paying special attention to the following core priority areas of social and economic development:

(a)    infrastructure development;

(b)    poverty reduction;

(c)    human development;

(d)    environmental sustainability; and 

(e)    decentralisation.

Sir, these programmes will be implemented pursuant to the provisions of the Revised Sixth National Development Plan (R-SNDP), which comes to an end in December, 2016. 

Mr Chairperson, significant progress has been registered in the implementation of programmes in the five key focus areas in 2015. 

Infrastructure Development 

Mr Chairperson, infrastructure development remains the key driver of meaningful and sustainable socio-economic development. In this regard, we accelerated the construction, rehabilitation or improvement of roads, railway lines and other communications infrastructure across the country. This is aimed at opening up productive areas and improving the transportation of goods and services. Further, progress has been made in the construction and upgrading of other social infrastructure outlays in the education and health sectors. This has seen an increase in the number of facilities completed across the country. Furthermore, administration blocks, staff houses, police stations, post offices and civic centres are at different stages of construction in all the newly-created districts. Additionally, the building of chiefs’ palaces has commenced and the projects are at various levels of completion. These projects have created some job opportunities for the young people in the local communities. 

Poverty Reduction

Mr Chairperson, in a country where over 70 per cent of the population still derives its livelihood directly or indirectly from the agricultural sector, the sector’s viability is critical in the fight against poverty. Hence, improving the sector’s productivity has the potential to leave an indelible mark on the poverty levels in the country. So, agriculture was given the attention it deserves in 2015. This was done with full consideration of each province’s agricultural potential and dynamic comparative advantage. The Government increased resource allocation to the sectors through interventions like:

(a)    the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP);

(b)    the Food Security Pack (FSP);

(c)    construction of livestock service centres and provincial livestock laboratories; and

(d)    up-scaling of aquaculture and capture fisheries activities. 

Sir, notwithstanding the increased resource allocations, the unfavourable weather pattern experienced during the 2014/2015 Agricultural Season negatively affected crop yields in many parts of the country. This has necessitated the distribution of food relief in forty-eight districts of the country, where household food security has been threatened. 

Sir, in 2015, the livestock sub-sector, on average, registered an improvement, and there was no record of any large-scale livestock disease outbreak. It would appear that the interventions aimed at curbing livestock diseases that we have been implementing over the years are yielding dividends. Additionally, interventions such as the Women Economic Empowerment Fund (WEEF), Youth Empowerment Fund (YEF) and the Social Cash Transfer (SCT) have been enhanced. 

Human Development 

Mr Chairperson, to accelerate human development, a number of health and education facilities have been completed, and some have been commissioned. There is also significant progress in the on-going projects in both the health and education sectors, including in the construction of 650 health posts countrywide. We are, therefore, taking health services closer to the people, which will positively impact on access to health facilities by our people. With regard to education, the Government has just completed recruiting 5,000 teachers. Again, we are positively impacting on the education of our people. Additionally, to increase the number of people with access to safe and clean drinking water, the number of safe water points across the country has been increased in 2015.  

Environmental Sustainability 

Mr Chairperson, in our quest to attain sustainable development, environmental sustainability is an indispensible ingredient. Therefore, the Government continued to escalate measures aimed at stemming environmental degradation, such as afforestation and reforestation. In this regard, trees have been planted on approximately 590 ha countrywide in 2015, translating into 59 ha per province. 


Mr Chairperson, in order to accelerate equitable development and move services closer to the people, the Government up-scaled the implementation of the Decentralisation Policy. The creation of the Provincial Devolution and Decentralisation Task Forces on the implementation of the policy has led to significant progress being made in that regard. 

Mr Chairperson, the combined 2016 Estimates of Expenditure for the Office of the President, Provincial Administration, has been reduced to K639,695,976 from the K826,033,153 allocated in 2015. This represents a reduction of 22.6 per cent. Of the money allocated in 2016, about 45 per cent will go towards personal emoluments while the remaining 55 per cent will go to various programmes and developmental projects to be implemented under the poverty reduction programmes (PRPs), capital projects and some recurrent expenditure programmes. 

Mr Chairperson, the reduction in the budget for Provincial Administration in 2016 is mainly due to the re-alignment of the Rural Roads Unit (RRU) to the Zambia National Service (ZNS) and the relocation of some resources to more priority areas. The allocations to the provinces are mainly based on each province’s comparative advantage. The comparative allocations to each of the province is as follows:

Head    Province    2015    2016    Variance    %Decrease    

88    Muchinga    59,680767    50,625,853    9,054,914    15.2    

90    Lusaka    78,223,842    60,533,931    17,689,991    23.6    

91    Copperbelt    89,346,969    68, 773,031    20,573,939    22.6

92    Central    82,583,724    64,656,749    17,926,749    21.7    

93    Northern    88,892,707    63,924,668    24,968,039    28.0

94    Western    85,478,130    69,401,741    16,076,389    18.8    

95    Eastern    81,928,248    61,063,176    20,862,072    25.4

96    Luapula    79,732,554    60,771,073    18,961,483    23.8

97    North-Western    78,353,309    59,303,719    18,546,460    23.8

98    Southern Province    101,815,912    80,642,037    21,173,875    20.8

Total    826,033,153    639,695,975    185,833,831    22.6        
Mr Chairperson, from the foregoing, the House will note that all provinces have experienced a reduction in their allocations. As I stated earlier, this is attributed to the re-alignment of the resources for the RRU to the ZNS. 

Sir, the 2016 budget was prepared in line with the R-SNDP and built on the successes and benefited from the lessons learnt during the implementation of the 2015 budget. In 2016, Provincial Administration will continue to co-ordinate, plan, monitor, implement and evaluate developmental programmes aimed at attaining broad-based economic growth, poverty reduction, employment creation and human development. The strategic focus for Provincial Administration will remain on the following areas:

(a)    infrastructure development;

(b)    human development;

(c)    poverty reduction;

(d)    tourism development;

(e)    water and sanitation; and 

(f)    environmental sustainability.

Mr Chairperson, while the rural parts of our country are still faced with transport and communication challenges, the Link Zambia 8,000 Kilometre and Pave Zambia 2,000 Kilometre road projects, which are our flagship projects in the development of road network infrastructure, are progressing well. The country is slowly being connected and opened up. In 2016, we will also pay particular attention to the dredging of canals in areas where water transport is significant. Apart from improving the road network and other communications infrastructure, the construction of requisite infrastructure in the newly-established districts across the country will continue in 2016. We will also strengthen the monitoring and evaluation of the on-going infrastructure development projects to ensure that our people get value for their money.

Mr Chairperson, activities and measures aimed at raising awareness and strengthening the protection of our citizens’ right to education, health and other socio-economic rights will be intensified in 2016. The Government has, therefore, re-aligned the Budget to respond to social challenges by tackling issues of employment creation and poverty reduction. This has been done by increasing the allocations to empowerment programmes in the key social economic sectors, namely, youth, child and sports development, tourism, social welfare and community development. Furthermore, the Government will enhance the fight against the human immunodeficiency virus/acquired immune deficiency syndrome (HIV/AIDS), sexually transmitted infections (STIs), and malaria and other non-communicable diseases by up-scaling preventive and curative interventions. The Government will also increase the number of health facilities across the country through the construction of 650 health posts, among other infrastructure development projects.

Mr Chairperson, as I earlier indicated, over 70 per cent of our people earn their livelihood directly or indirectly from the agricultural sector. Consequently, the sector’s viability remains critical in the fight against poverty, as it is a major driver of sustainable economic growth. To this end, the crop, livestock and fisheries’ sub-sectors will retain their prominence as priority areas in 2016. With regard to environmental sustainability, afforestation and reforestation activities will be continued and accelerated in 2016. Apart from halting environmental degradation, the measures are also aimed at sustaining bio-diversity, which has a direct correlation with most of our tourism development activities. This will be augmented by citizens’ social awareness campaigns and education programmes. 

Sir, pursuant to what I have stated above, I urge the hon. Members of this august House to support the 2016 Estimates of Expenditure for the Office of the President, Provincial Administration, as presented.

Mr Chairperson, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Chairperson: Before we proceed, I want to remind the House that I will allow only three hon. Members of Parliament to debate on each province.

Mr Kapeya (Mpika): Mr Chairperson, thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to debate the budget for Muchinga Province.

Sir, it has been said that Rome was not built in a day. It took many years to build that beautiful city, and I am referring to this fact in relation to the development projects being implemented in Muchinga Province since the Patriotic Front (PF) Government came into power.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: Mr Chairperson, the people of Muchinga are very grateful to the PF Government for the projects in the province. Let me specifically talk about road infrastructure ...

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: … and let my colleagues dwell on the other areas. 

Sir, Muchinga Province has, indeed, been opened up in as far as road infrastructure is concerned. Most of the roads that have been built lead to other provinces. So, the people of Muchinga are grateful for being connected to other provinces by a good road network. As though that was not enough, even the township roads in the district have been worked on. So, the people of the province are saying, “Well done, PF Government.”

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: Sir, those who have been to Chama recently will agree with me that the town has been modernised.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: The township roads have been worked on, which makes the town to look like heaven has descended on earth.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: Mr Chairperson, Chama District will be opened up by a road that will link it to Shiwang’andu District. The road from Matumbo to Chama District is almost getting over the Luangwa River, and the contractor to build a bridge over the river has already been identified.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: Sir, the road from Chama District to the Luangwa River has been worked on, and we are grateful that a contractor has been found to work on the road from Chama Turnoff to Muyombe and Mafinga. Further, the road from Isoka to Mafinga is being rehabilitated.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: Mr Chairperson, if we refreshed our minds, we would recall that, fifty years ago, the people who travelled from Nakonde to Mbala had to pass through Isoka, Chinsali, Mpika and Kasama before finally reaching Mbala. That will no longer be the case, as the road from Nakonde to Mbala is 75 per cent complete. Three weeks ago, I travelled on that road and can only be thankful to the PF Government for what it is doing.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: Sir, the people from East Africa travelling to Mpulungu and Mbala will no longer have to go through Mpika, but will travel directly from Nakonde to Mbala. That is, indeed, a great achievement, and I am sure that other road networks will soon be worked on. In the past, people who travelled from Mpika to Chipata had to pass through Serenje, Mkushi, Kapiri Mposhi, Lusaka, Luangwa and Nyimba. However, that will soon be a thing of the past, as a new road is being constructed from Mpika through Nabwalya, Mfuwe and Malambo to Chipata, and this is the kind of development that the people of Muchinga have been crying for. So, …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: … they are grateful to the PF Government.

Dr Lungu: Mukalete ama vote.

Mr Kapeya: Mukwai tukaleta ama vote.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: Mr Chairperson, let me now talk about feeder roads. 

Sir, the Zambia National Service (ZNS), which has been tasked to work on the feeder roads, is on the ground rehabilitating the roads. The people are seeing what this Government is doing. So, all I can say is that it should continue …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kapeya: … providing these services to the people. 

Sir, those were my words of gratitude to the PF Government.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo: Sir, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to contribute to the debate on the allocation to Central Province.

Mr Chairperson, it was very interesting to listen to the hon. Member for Mpika talk about the development in Muchinga Province, which he likened to heaven on earth. In Central Province, on the other hand, it is all lamentation.


Mr Mbulakulima: Hear, hear!

Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo: Sir, I think that the Rural Roads Unit (RRU) …

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Business was suspended from 1815 hours until 1830 hours.


Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo: Mr Chairperson, before business was suspended, I had started my debate by reflecting on the rosy picture that my hon. Colleague from Mpika had painted on the projects that are being implemented in Muchinga Province and failing to imagine how there could be so much disparity between the Government’s road infrastructure development efforts in Central Province and Muchinga Province. I almost said to myself that it was okay because I thought the hon. Member was only talking about the Link-Zambia 8,000 Kilometre Road Project, whose implementation is phased. However, he soon said that even the township roads in Chama had been worked on. What is worrisome is the fact that the rural roads in our constituencies have not seen a grader in many years. I tried to ask my colleagues from Serenje, Chitambo and Mkushi South whether the roads in their constituencies have been graded. What I am saying is that the national cake should be shared equitably. So, I appeal to Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning to ensure that we see efficiency in the utilisation of the funds that she has mentioned. We have a ray of hope that the re-alignment of the Rural Roads Unit (RRU) with the Zambia National Service (ZNS) will improve things because the ZNS is a disciplined organisation. However, if not properly monitored, it can be more expensive than private contractors. For instance, why should the ZNS officers get allowances when they get paid every month? Perhaps, that is one area to which a lot of money will go. So, we will wait to hear whether the construction of roads will be cheaper, as that is what we look forward to. 

Sir, the Mukobeko/Ngabwe Road needs to be worked on. I also hope to see a new bridge across the Kafue River to the newly-created Ngabwe District. I would also like to see the Landless Corner/Mumbwa Road completed. Why has it taken two years to work on a 14 km stretch when my colleague from Mpika is saying that all is rosy? What is going on? Yes, I agree that the works in Chama were well done. However, there are only a handful of vehicles there and, obviously, the roads there will last a very long time. Unfortunately, there are no roads in areas where there are many vehicles. That is my lamentation. 

Sir, let me also talk about water and sanitation. When will we have the very expensive boreholes that the Ministry of Local Government and Housing, and the Provincial hon. Ministers embarked on drilling? There have been explanations to the House, but I still wonder why Government-procured services are more expensive. There must be something sinister. The economics of scale dictate that the bigger the volume, the less the unit cost. So, I hope that we will hear something on that from the hon.  Provincial Minister. Our people need water. This is November, yet the boreholes promised by this Government have not been sunk. Worse still, we have not received the Constituency Development Fund (CDF). Maybe, the constituencies in Muchinga Province have received their CDF.

 Mr Kapeya: Not yet, iwe!


Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo: Sir, I did not hear anything.

The Deputy Chairperson: Ignore the people who are debating while seated.

Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo: Mr Chairperson, let me say something on environmental degradation.

Sir, a lot of efforts must be put in environmental protection. Each time I drive from Mumbwa/Kaoma and Lusaka/Kabwe roads, I see huge trucks laden with charcoal. Even the protection of forests that the hon. Minster of Lands, Environment and Natural Resources was talking about is a myth because she is protecting trees along the main roads but, just 500 m into the forest, the trees are nowhere to be seen. That is the worry. Why is the hon. Minister protecting ‘forests’ that do not have trees instead of de-gazetting them? What is she protecting? These are realities. So, let us do something about it in earnest. The technology to help our people to reduce deforestation is available.

Mr Chairperson, there is tourism potential in Central Province. So, we have to capacitate our councils because there are lovely places like Chitambo, David Livingstone’s death place, and Mkushi East, Kapiri Mposhi and Mumbwa where there are caves with Bushmen paintings and hot springs. So, I truly hope that we can make tourism take off, which will create jobs. However, for us, what must really be enhanced is agriculture. How do our people get their produce from their farms when there are no roads? I hope these will be the priorities. I must emphasise that the Monitoring Unit must be on the road to ensure that projects take off.

Sir, we have heard about the 650 health posts that are supposed to be built in every district. The other week, I saw a semblance of a pre-fabricated structure by the road in Mumbwa. It was one of three sides. We were assured that the health posts would be completed by April, 2016. So, the Government must expedite their construction so that health services can be accessed by our people.

Hon. Government Member interjected.

Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo: Mr Chairperson, there is a big heckler here. 

Young man, keep quiet!

The Deputy Chairperson: Ignore the big heckler, notwithstanding his closeness to you.

Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo: Mr Chairperson, let me also address the human resource situation in Central Province. 

Sir, I have seen platoons of young men who are just thrust onto our councils and we have been told that they are our firefighters, yet our council only has one limping fire water tender with no reliable water source. When we ask where the firefighters are from, we are told that they are from Lusaka. What are we doing? Why can the Government not recruit from the local men and women in the towns? Why does it have to export people from Lusaka? It is not fair, and it is not only happening in councils, but also in the Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (ZESCO). In fact, I will see the company’s Managing Director over that. Why does ZESCO export men and women from Lusaka to work in other towns when there are qualified people in those towns? If the Government wants to reduce poverty, it should recruit locally.

Mr Chairperson, I am happy that the Government has implemented the famous industrial clusters in Mumbwa. For example, the Mumbwa Farmers Ginnery has created hope. However, I am concerned about Mumbwa Day Secondary School, whose construction has taken four years. Again, I refer to my friend from Mpika, who is very happy with the infrastructure development in his area. What is the difference between Mpika and Mumbwa? This House allocates funds for projects like the construction of schools. Unfortunately, at the end of the year, we find that the money has not produced anything. I have a small road in the middle of Mumbwa ‒ and I am happy that the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing used his initiative to go and see what was happening ‒ which is 4 km away from the hospital, a facility that is used by the majority of the residents. Instead of working on the road that goes to the hospital, the Government worked on one that goes into a village. Now, who will use that road, which leads to a village? I earnestly wish we could re-prioritise and quickly work on the road leading to the hospital because everybody has the potential to go to the hospital at one time or another.

Sir, lastly, we have a very naughty hon. Minister, ...


Brig-Gen Dr Chituwo: ... who should rise and debate. Tourism is in shambles because of a lack of leadership.


Hon. Government Members: Question!

Brig-Gen Dr Chituwo: Mr Chairperson, what development has there been in the Kafue National Park, three-quarters of which is in Mumbwa Parliamentary Constituency?

Ms Kapata interjected.

Brig-Gen Dr Chituwo: Sir, that is the problem I referred to. There is a lack of leadership. Tourism, ...

Ms Kapata: On a point of order, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.

Ms Kapata: Mr Chairperson, I rarely rise on points of order, but I am compelled to do so on this occasion. 

Sir, is the hon. Member on the Floor in order to say that tourism in this country is in shambles when it has really developed since the Patriotic Front (PF) came into power?

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Kapata: Sir, this Government has done more than his party did when it was in power. The hon. Member is also complaining about the road leading to the hospital in his constituency not having been worked on. Additionally, on my way here, I heard him talk about boreholes. Since he is a former Minister of Local Government and Housing, if he really felt that his people needed those things, why did he not provide them to the people when he was in Government. I personally wrote to him, but he did not even acknowledge receiving my letter.

The Deputy Chairperson: What is your point of order?

Ms Kapata: Sir, is he in order to drag me into his debate? 

Sir, I need your serious ruling.

The Deputy Chairperson: The most considered and serious ruling is that, to the extent that the hon. Member was debating about tourism development in the Central Province, he was in order.

Hon. Opposition Members: Her, hear!

Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo: Mr Chairperson, I am grateful. 

Sir, I am talking about issues that we must look at collectively.

Ms Kapata interjected.

Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo: Please, do not disturb me. Just shut up!

Sir, it does not matter which side of the House I am because I am talking about the real issues on the ground; the same issues that Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning has brought out in her policy statement. She has indicated that these are the areas of thrust for the Provincial Administration in Central Province. There is a lot of potential in Central Province and I do not believe that there will be any Government that will complete all the projects and make people live like they are in heaven. Each administration can only do so much because of limited resources. When another group gets into power, it takes over everything. So, the fact that we were once in Government is a non-issue here. Such statements just show the kind of difficulties we encounter. People do not want to leave a legacy of their own. 

Sir, there is a lot of work that needs to be done in Central Province, which has a lot of potential for agriculture. So, we must harness the potential and private sector investments in agriculture in the province must be supported so that it assists in job creation and poverty alleviation.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mufalali: Mr Chairperson, thank you for giving me the opportunity to debate the Vote on the Floor and Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning’s policy statement. 

Sir, we hear that the kingdom has come in Muchinga Province and that it is heaven on earth for the people living there. Whatever the case might actually be, I come from a province or nation that has existed for over 300 years and it will be strange if heaven is created in recently-created provinces before it is created in my province. When that happens, we feel marginalised.

Mr Chairperson, we have heard about good road networks from our friends. However, in the Western Province, we have no roads. The only road that we can talk about, the one that people have been singing about, was left by the Movement for Multi-Party Democracy (MMD), and that is the Mongu/Kalabo Road, which the Patriotic Front (PF) Government is still struggling to complete. Apart from that, there are no road works in the Western Province. For example, the Luampa/Machile/Simungoma Road needs to be worked on, but that is not happening. When we had the recent by-election in Mulobezi Parliamentary Constituency, the people there were promised that the road would be worked on. To date, however, nothing has been done. There is also the Katunda/Lukulu/Watopa Road, which has not been worked on since 2013, yet our friends are enjoying heaven on earth. The Namushakende/Nalikwanda Road is also in a deplorable state. The Sioma/Shang’ombo Road is also very bad, and the hon. Deputy Minister for the Western Province is aware of that. The road from Sioma to Kalabo, through Matebele, Kalongola, Nasilimwe and Sinungu also needs to be worked on. 

Mr Chairperson, the people of the Western Province are actually worried after hearing the President say that the Government will cut down on infrastructure projects because they do not know whether the projects in the province will even take off. I am talking about projects like the Kalabo/Sikongo Road, which we have been hearing stories about the Government working on for four years now. We are actually getting into the fifth year without roads that are very critical to the province being constructed. So, the earlier the Government attends to, at least, one of them, the better because …

Mr Kambwili: On a point of order, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.

Mr Kambwili: Mr Chairperson, I rise on a very serious point of order. 

Sir, is the hon. Member on the Floor in order to debate with his hands in his pockets? Is he not being disrespectful to the Chair?

I need your serious ruling, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: When I noticed his left hand going into his pocket, I thought he was reacting to an irritation. Now that the irritation is over, he can remove his hand from his pocket as he continues debating.


Mr Mufalali: Mr Chairperson, …

Mr Kambwili interjected.

Mr Mufalali: I am tucking in my shirt. What are you talking about?


Mr Mufalali: Do you not know that in the Western Province is where you find the most handsome men?

Mr Chairperson, I thank you for your guidance and hope that Hon. Kambwili is very happy now. 

Sir, I was talking about roads that need to be attended to in the Western Province and said that it will not augur well if none of them will be worked on because no other projects have been started in the province other than those that began during the time of the MMD Government.  The roads from Matebele, Sinungu and Nasilimwe to Nalolo and all the way to Kalabo need attention.

Hon. Government Members: In Nalolo?

Mr Mufalali: Yes, in Nalolo.

Mr Chairperson, the Western Province is big and has many feeder roads. However, under the province’s budget for next year, only 200 km feeder roads will be graded. What difference will that make? It will be a drop in the ocean. Coupled with the President’s directive that the Government does not start any new projects, we know that there will be absolutely nothing for us in the Western Province. People have been calling me to find out what is happening. They are shocked to hear the President say that the projects that have not been started will not be embarked upon. Why should resources only be limited to projects that have already been started? In the Western Province, there is totally nothing that we can point to as having been started by the Patriotic Front (PF) Government. Even the construction of the stadium that we were promised has not commenced. So, when I look at the 2016 Budget, it seems to be out of the equation. The building of the King Lewanika University will also not take off because of the financial situation in which we are. We accept that the country’s fiscal position is bad, but we blame the PF for it. 

Mr Chairperson, Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning talked about decentralisation. We cannot continue with the current public administration structure. Therefore, the decentralisation process really needs to be expedited. Currently, 80 per cent of all projects in the country are in urban areas, which is unacceptable. In some places, such as the Western Province, there is really nothing happening. For a long time, including during the PF’s reign, we have seen a lot of construction going on in urban townships. Why are the rural areas being left out when there is so much money being spent on building township roads in cities? Fifty-one years after Independence, people in the rural areas still carry loads on their backs or shoulders on dusty roads. Why is my constituency even called Senanga Central when there is nothing central about it? We do not even have a road that connects us to Luampa. We can only get there by ox-cart. Therefore, decentralisation should be implemented to help in the fair distribution of resources. Maybe, some rural places like Muchinga are getting a lot of development and the people there are happy. In the Western Province, however, we are not happy and we have to indicate it. School infrastructure in the province is a sore sight. We still have pole-and-mud structures for classrooms and grass-thatched teachers’ houses. No wonder, the late President was shocked when he saw that there were still such structures in Lukulu. So, we want our infrastructure needs to be addressed. 

Mr Chairperson, I think that the 18 per cent reduction in the budget for the Western Province will seriously affect us. The Ruling Party must start paying attention to rural areas. Otherwise, it should not expect any votes from there.

Mr Chairperson, let me now talk about the hunger situation in the Western Province. 

Sir, due to …


The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

The consultations on my right should be moderated.

Mr Mufalali: Mr Chairperson, the hunger situation in the Western Province requires urgent attention because the people there are starving. If this Government will just watch while our people starve, it will be very unfortunate. We are in serious need of food relief in the province, and the distribution should be done properly, not what happened a few months ago. The Western Province is a sandy area. Therefore, it requires a lot of rainfall to avoid crop failure. In the last farming season, people’s crops dried up because of insufficient rainfall. Currently, even mealie meal is very difficult to come by in some areas and places like Shang’ombo, Senanga and Nalolo are experiencing serious starvation. People have resorted to eating wild fruits that some of us have never even heard of. So, I emphasise that we need relief food to be distributed as soon as possible.

Mr Chairperson, let me move on to livestock diseases in the Western Province. 

Mr Chairperson, recently, the province had an outbreak of foot and mouth disease (FMD) because of a shortage of vaccines, and that problem needs urgent attention because our people depend on livestock. The poor rainfall, coupled with animal diseases, has created a very bad situation in the province. People cannot sell their animals because of the outbreak of FMD, there is no maize and hunger is everywhere, and I think that the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning is aware of the situation obtaining in the province. Therefore, her Government needs to act quickly. 

Mr Chairperson, in Senanga, in particular, and the Western Province, as a whole, the national recruitment of 5,000 teachers has been a disaster. Many trained teachers were not recruited while the majority of those recruited are from other places. Why should that be the case when there were many applicants from Senanga? When I visited the Permanent Secretary (PS) at the Ministry of General Education, he told me that the recruitment was done in a bottom-up approach. I want to put it on record that the teacher recruitment exercise was a disaster because we have seen people with no teaching certificates on the list of recruited teachers. Some are still in colleges. So, how did they find themselves on that list? That has to be corrected. I saw the list personally and I have over 200 unsuccessful applications from trained teachers from Senanga in my car. That is not fair.

Mr Chairperson, if we are to develop, we have to distribute our resources evenly. Even in recruitments, we should recruit evenly instead of sending lists of people to be recruited from Lusaka and even including people who are not Senanga residents. The people who applied to be recruited as teachers in Senanga have been teaching for one year without pay just to offer a service to the community so that the District Education Board Secretary (DEBS) could recommend them for recruitment on the basis of their willingness to work in rural parts of the country. We have no teachers in Senanga. What do we do with the sub-standard graduates from our schools? It is not fair because, very soon, the Western Province will be far behind other provinces in development because of a lack of teachers. A teacher cannot run a school that goes up to Grade 7 alone. This makes a mockery of our ‘One Zambia, One Nation’ slogan. So, let us look into the challenges facing the education sector on the ground. The applications I have in my car are proof that these things are real. As a representative of the people, I do not want to be swayed from the reality of these things.

Mr Chairperson, the councils in the country had employed people whom the Ministry of Local Government and Housing now thinks are not qualified to hold their positions in a decentralised structure, and the people are crying because they are being demoted. The Government should handle that situation carefully because, much as it desires to bring in qualified people, it should still think about the under-qualified people it employed as directors and gave high salaries to. This is what will matter now, for it needs to take care of the people it will demote. They should not come out empty-handed.

Mr Kambwili: Which people are not qualified, naimwe?

Mr Mufalali: There is no need for you to debate while seated. You are exposing your ignorance.


Mr Mufalali: Mr Chairperson, we are talking about the realities on the ground. If someone thinks those things I have talked about do not exist, it is unfortunate. They do not rise to debate on the Floor because they represent a vacuum. So, instead of standing up to speak for the people, some people feel they should sit and say things that do not even add up. 

Mr Kambwili interjected.

The Deputy Chairperson: It is not part of your job to debate while seated.

Mr Mufalali: Mr Chairperson, I thank Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning, who happens to be my aunt, for moving the Motion …

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

Mr Mufalali: Yes, she is my aunt if you did not know.

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

Mr Mufalali: Thank you very much, Mr Chairperson.

Mr Mutale (Kwacha): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to contribute on the debate on the Vote for the Copperbelt Province. 

Mr Chairperson, from the outset, I would like to thank His Excellency the President, Mr Edgar Chagwa Lungu, and his entire Government for the work they have done on the Copperbelt. 

Mr Mwenya: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: Mr Chairperson, people have been calling to tell me that the value of their properties has appreciated because of the developments on the Copperbelt.

Mr Chilangwa: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: Mr Chairperson, those who have not visited Kitwe and the rest of the Copperbelt recently will probably get lost because of the province has been given a complete facelift. If somebody has lived out of the Copperbelt for, say, five years and goes back to visit, they will probably end up at the wrong house …


Mr Mutale: … because of the way things have changed now.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: Mr Chairperson, we are thankful to His Excellency and the entire Cabinet.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kambwili: PF.

Mr Mutale: Mr Chairperson, if you look at the infrastructure that has been developed on the Copperbelt, you will be impressed. For example, the Ndola/Kitwe Dual Carriageway, which was in a very poor state, is now 95 per cent complete and road traffic accidents have drastically reduced. We were losing many lives on that road due to people hitting potholes and overturning. So, we are very happy that the Government has put money into road infrastructure development.

Mr Muntanga: Aah!

Mr Mutale: I encourage it to continue with the work it is doing.

Sir, the Kitwe/Chingola Dual Carriageway was a death trap and there was no day that passed without an accident on it. However, with the work that is being done on it, the carnage in that area has reduced and everybody is now appreciating. Next year, the road will be commissioned.

Mr Chilangwa: Imagine!

Mr Mutale: We even pray that the road users will not be tempted into over-speeding because of the good roads that are being built.

Mr Chilangwa: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: Mr Chairperson, the only thing that I am disappointed with is that the reflective paint that is being used on the newly-constructed roads is not of good quality, as it does not last. Within a month or so, you cannot see the road markings as you drive at night. Those road markings guide motorists while on the road so that they know exactly where they are driving. So, if they are not reflective, then, there is a danger to the road users. Therefore, I implore the relevant hon. Minister to ensure that the roads have quality reflective markings that can be seen in the night to protect lives.

Mr Chairperson, the construction of the Mufuchani Bridge was important for the people of the province …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: … and it was very close to my heart. In fact, when I came to this House …

Mr Chilangwa: Bebeni!

Mr Mutale: … it was one of the projects I spoke about and I am happy that it has taken off.

Dr Mwali: It was your cry.

Mr Mutale: It was my cry and that of the people of Kwacha Constituency.

Mr Chilangwa: Chachine!

Mr Mutale: As a listening Government, the PF has …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: … heard the cries of our people, …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: ... including mine.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: Hon. Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo, we were all crying and the Government has heard our cry, and mobilised the resources to start the construction of the bridge.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chilangwa: Walilila sana mwe!

Mr Muntanga: Why were you crying?

Mr Mutale: I know our friends will say that they had already planned for the project before they were voted out of power.

Mr Mwenya: Which ones?

Mr Mutale: However, like I said last time on the Floor of this House, starting without starting is not starting at all.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: What is that?

Mr Mutale: This is the more reason the PF Government …


Mr Muntanga: Can you answer. What did you say?

Mr Mutale: I will repeat what I said for the sake of Hon. Muntanga.


Mr Mutale: Starting to plan for a project without starting the project …

Mr Muntanga: Aah!

Mr Mutale: … is not starting.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwenya: Waumfwa!

Mr Mutale: One cannot say one has started a project if there is no activity to show for it.

Mr Kambwili: Yes!

Mr Mutale: Sir, the bridge is almost 95 per cent complete. His Excellency …

Mr Mwenya: Edgar!

Mr Mutale: … Mr Edgar Chagwa Lungu, …

Mr Chilangwa: Eeh!

Mr Mutale: … went to inspect the project. He saw the works for himself and was very happy. He is interested in that bridge because he knows its background.

Mr Chilangwa: Yes!

Mr Mutale: In 1976, many people died while crossing from the Mufuchani side, Chatente area, to the Riverside area. That was in 1976, but nothing was done since then until the PF came into power. Now, the benefits that will be realised from the construction of the bridge will be many because Kitwe will be opened up. Kitwe Town does not have adequate land. That is why people were building small houses in play parks. They may have wanted to build across the Kafue River, where there is enough land, but that would not be possible, as they would not be able to transport their building materials. So, that bridge, which is a costly and major project on the Copperbelt, has come with a lot of benefits. For example, the fifty-three households that were displaced by the project have been given houses at no cost to them, and two churches and a 1.2 km road have been constructed for them. 

Mr Kapeya: Jobs have been created.

Mr Mutale: Jobs have also been created for the people who live in that area. Works are still ongoing and we are very happy with this situation.

Mr Kapeya: Very good.

Mr Chilangwa: Bushe abantu babomba shani?

Mr Mutale: Mr Chairperson, what more can we say?

Mr Mwamba: Eh! Imwe, please!

Mr Mutale: Sir, some people have said that the Government is not doing anything when it is actually doing a lot. Some people just cannot show gratitude. So, let me do it for them: “Thank you, Your Excellency, ...

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: ... for the work that you have done in our constituencies, especially on the Copperbelt.” 

Mr Chairperson, the Kalulushi/Kitwe Road was a nightmare and getting to Kalulushi used to take hours. That is now a thing of the past. The road from Kalulushi to Lufwanyama has also been worked on. The trucks that used to take weeks to get to St. Mary’s due to potholes and bumps now get there in an hour. Motorists who used to have breakdowns on the road would spend a lot of time on the roads because of potholes. When, for instance, you broke your springs, you had to send for help from very far away.

Mr Mwamba: Nangu tautasha.

Mr Mutale: Now that this Government has put up roads and bridges, people are able to move comfortably and are happy. No wonder we won a ward by-election in Lufwanyama. It is the development that has been taken to that area that the people are appreciating. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: They have seen what the PF Government is doing. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: This is why they are saying that this is the Government they want to work with and support.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: Mr Chairperson, congestion on the Chingola Road has reduced because trucks have re-routed to the Kalulushi/Sabina Road through the Kitwe/Kalulushi Road. The achievements are many. 

Sir, in my constituency, I have seen that a lot has been done regarding the township roads. The same is true of the Copperbelt generally. The only thing I ask in this regard is that the hon. Minister shows us the list of the imminent Copperbelt 400 Kilometre (C 400) Road Project so that we can go and tell our people about it.

Hon. UPND Members: Aah, again?

Mr Mutale: We need to look at the plan for the C 400 Road Project to know our share of it.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: We want to strike a balance so that there will be no complaints of some areas getting more out of it than others. If we share equally,  ...

Mr Chilangwa: Like others are smiling about the Bottom Road.

Mr Mutale: ... we will also smile like the others are smiling about the Bottom Road. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: On a point of order, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Chairperson, is the hon. Member debating in order to talk about some people being happy about the Bottom Road when only about 20 km of the road have been worked on while the rest of the road ...

Mr Chilangwa: It is a road still.

Mr Muntanga paused.

The Deputy Chairperson: Proceed and remain focused.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Muntanga: Is he in order to say that we are happy when we have been complaining that no road has been worked on, including the Kafue/Mazabuka Road, which is in a very bad condition? Is he in order to talk about everything else that has been done to make his constituency heaven on earth and mislead the House that the development is equally distributed? 


The Deputy Chairperson: Order! 

I will not make any ruling. 

The hon. Member on the Floor may continue.


Mr Mutale: Mr Chairperson, sometimes, the truth hurts.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: It is a bitter pill to swallow, but let us learn to appreciate. What is done is done and what is not done is not done. However, I know that many roads have been worked on in many areas countrywide.

Mr Mufalali: Aah!

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutale: Mr Chairperson, when the programme on sanitation starts, the Copperbelt Province also needs to benefit. Kwacha Township, in my constituency, for example, has lacked sanitation facilities for years and many people use pit latrines. So, I appeal that when the Government begins distributing funds for sanitation projects, Kwacha Township be considered. We need to improve the lives of the people in that area and put a smile on their faces. As I speak, all the yards are full of pit latrines. So, if you try to dig a pit latrine, you will find that there was already a latrine on the spot. It is a difficult situation. Therefore, this request is genuine. We need a share of the water and sanitation programme. 

Sir, although the water situation has been worked on and has improved, there is still a little more to be done so that there is no interruption in supply. As water is life, its uninterrupted supply will help us to reduce the risk of disease. So, we appreciate the expansion of the water works that the Government embarked on, especially in my constituency, which houses the water works, both at Bulangililo and Nkana East. Both plants have been expanded and are functioning. The only challenge is that the pipelines in the townships are bursting due to high pressure. It will be another cost, but I am sure that, in time, the old lines will be replaced so that we stop losing water that is treated at a high cost, which pushes up the cost of doing business. Another problem is vandalism. In this regard, the council should embark on civic education campaigns to discourage our people from vandalising public property because it is their property. Huge amounts of public money are spent on such infrastructure. Therefore, people should guard them jealously. 

Mr Chairman, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutati (Lunte): Mr Speaker, I thank you for the opportunity to debate. 

Sir, following up on the debate of Hon. Mutale from the Copperbelt, who outlined the various development projects that have been implemented on the Copperbelt, I thought he would raise the concern that, whilst the Dual Carriageway is 95 per cent complete, it already requires repairs in many sections.

Mr Muntanga: You see?

Mr Mutati: So, it is not completion when you begin to repair before you complete. 

Hon. UPND Members: Oh!

Mr Mutati: Mr Chairperson, in the Northern Province, we are double victims. We are victims of austerity and incompleteness. We are victims of austerity because, this year alone, the dispatch of resources that were budgeted for development has not been anywhere near 22 per cent. Our agenda is to develop the Northern Province, but we have received less than 22 per cent of the resources allocated to the province. All the money that was budgeted for the construction of feeder roads in the province has not been disbursed to date. 

Mr Chairperson, the Northern Province continues to stand on the periphery of development. I was told that the province was included in the Link Zambia 8,000 Kilometre Road Project. However, last year, there were no activities related to that project in the province because the Government had said that the construction of roads there would commence under Phase II of the project. So, I had hoped that the project would be implemented in the province in 2016. However, I have checked the Yellow Book and found that there is no allocation for that. So, perhaps, it has been delayed for one more year. That is why I am saying that we, the people of the Northern Province, are victims of austerity. 

Sir, there are critical roads on which feasibility studies have been undertaken and plans made, such as the Mporokoso/Kawambwa Road, but nothing has been done on it. The Government has promised to work on that road many times, but it has not delivered on that promise. On the Mbesuma Bridge, Mr Chair, ...

The Deputy Chairperson: It would sound better if you added “man” to “Chair.”

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutati: Thank you, Mr Chairman.


Mr Mutati: Mr Chairperson, on the Mbesuma Bridge, the Government has only managed to secure sand and gravel for the project in the last three years, and that was interpreted as commencement of the construction of the bridge. That is the incompleteness of which I am saying we, the people of the Northern Province, are victims. 

Sir, Hon. Brig-Gen. Dr Chituwo spoke about tourism. There is Kasaba Bay in my province, but the infrastructure in the area is incomplete. The construction of the Kasaba Bay International Airport, in particular, has not been completed over the last couple of years.

Mr Muntanga: It has been abandoned. 

Mr Mutati: Mr Chair, ...

Mr Muntanga: Man!

Mr Mutati: ... that is why I am saying that we are victims of incompleteness.

Mr Chairperson, the Government promised to build 650 health posts in the country. However, no health post has been built in the Northern Province. Maybe, they have been built in other provinces. Maybe, others are celebrating the construction of the health posts in their provinces. Hon. Sikazwe is always walking around the offices in the province, but what has he delivered to the province? No matter how much he speaks on behalf of the province, he will continue to stand on the periphery of development.


Mr Mutati: Sir, I am quite sure that if my colleague from the Northern Province, the hon. Member of Parliament for Kaputa, stood to speak, he would say that his constituency is also on the periphery of development because Kaputa Secondary School remains incomplete, just like Lunte Technical High School. So, the Northern Province is an incomplete ...

Hon. Opposition Members: Province.

Mr Mutati: ... province because the resources disbursed to the province are inadequate. In the last few years, we have been talking about the construction of health posts, and I know that Hon. Sikazwe has been very committed to the province. However, commitment without delivery equals incompleteness. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sikazwe: On a point of order, Sir. 

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised. 

Mr Sikazwe: Mr Chairperson, I have been seated here listening to my hon. Colleague debating very well. However, he has dragged me into his debate and said negative things about the province. Is he in order not to mention some of the good things that the Patriotic Front (PF) Government has done in the Northern Province?  A lot of work has been done in the province. For example, the runway at Kasama Airport is under construction. The airport, which is being built will link ...

The Deputy Chairperson: What is your point of order?

Mr Sikazwe: Sir, my point of order is: Is he in order not to mention some of the good things that the PF has done in the Northern Province?

Sir, I need your serious ruling. 

The Deputy Chairperson: The serious ruling is that this debate, by its nature, is a contestation of facts and ideas. I noticed that you were very busy taking down notes, hon. Minister, and you know that you will be given a chance to respond.

Continue, hon. Member for Lunte.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutati: Mr Chairperson, I acknowledge that some work is being done at the Kasama Airport, but all I am asking for is a rational approach to the process of development. On one hand, the Government has not completed Kasaba Bay International Airport but, on the other, it has begun a new project involving the airport in Kasama. The Government should have proper planning so that we have a full circle in our development path. In addition, the hon. Minister is the headman for the province and, as such, he should focus on delivering on the things we do not have in the province.

Mr Muntanga: Is that the headman? He is not even listening. 


The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Let me have order on my right, especially on the hon. Deputy Ministers’ Bench. I think that this is your time to take down notes so that you can come up with appropriate responses. However, if you spend your time in endless consultations that end up in laughter, one wonders how much notes you will record. 

You may continue, Hon. Mutati.

Mr Mutati: Mr Chairperson, we have received some equipment for infrastructure development, but it has not been accompanied by the necessary resources to help us use it. Over the last four years, the level of dispatch of resources from the Budget to the province has not exceeded 22 per cent. Even the K1.4 million for the 2015 Constituency Development Fund (CDF) was not disbursed to my constituency, Lunte, where we had chosen to use it on building a 1 x 3 classroom block and laboratory at Lubushi Secondary School. To date, we keep being told that the money will be disbursed, yet we had been promised that the school would be opened for students by 1st January, 2016. Obviously, come 1st January, 2016, we will still be in our status quo to which we are accustomed, which is marked by an incomplete province and projects. 

Mr Chairperson, as a province, we are looking to the hon. Minister for transformation. We are a big province that should transcend incompleteness and walk the development path. We are tired of looking into Muchinga from the outside and wishing we were like that province. 

Mr Mbewe: Aah!

Mr Mutati: We are tired of wishing we could say the things that were being said about the Copperbelt Province.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutati: We are a collection of people who are not accustomed to dreams. We are more accustomed to tangible things that can transform our living conditions. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mutati: Sir, the people of Northern Province have not only been double victims of austerity and incompleteness, but also of the high cost of living. With inflation approaching 20 per cent, it is pushing the levels of poverty to higher heights and draining out the little hope that the people of the province had. I know that this is a national problem, but the hon. Minister should realise that the average costing in the Northern Province is hitting the people too hard. 

Mr Chairperson, I hope that 2016 will be different from 2015 for the people and that their status will change from being incomplete to standing at the centre of development. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Chairperson: If I may go out of my way, I will say that was an example of a good debate which, naturally, calls for good answers. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mooya (Moomba): Mr Chairperson, thank you for giving me the opportunity to debate the allocation to the Southern Province.

Sir, it is very interesting to note that there is the Lusaka 400 (L 400) Road Project for Lusaka Province and Copperbelt 400 (C 400) Road Project for the Copperbelt Province, but no such project for the Southern Province. I would have loved to hear about S 400. 


Mr Mooya:  Let us share the cake equally. 

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mooya: Mr Chairperson, speaking of road projects, and riding on what I pointed out earlier in my debate, I have a few details to add on the feeder roads in the Southern Province. Previous speakers have already talked about how the Zambia National Service (ZNS) is working on roads, but I would like to bring in the element of the scope of works. 

Mr Chairperson, we want the ZNS in the Southern Province to do a good job on the feeder roads. I think that it firstly has to concentrate on the drainage systems. For a good number of years, I have watched the Rural Roads Unit (RRU), which has been re-aligned with the ZNS, do some really bad work on our roads.  

Mr Chairperson, a road’s worst enemy is water. If you construct a road without a good drainage system, you are just wasting money. I have seen the feeder roads being worked on, especially in my constituency, and in my travels all over Zambia, and I have noticed something wrong in the way they are being constructed. A lot of money is pumped into roads with side drains, but not the most important drains, the mighty drains, which are supposed to throw water away from the side drains. So, I appeal to the ZNS to improve the drainage system by including the mighty drains. Otherwise, the drains running along the road will get deeper and deeper because there is no outlet for the water that collects in them. Normally, there is a specification of about 150 m spacing for the mighty drains where it is flat and much less where it is steep. The idea is to get rid of water. 

Sir, the Government has targeted to work on 10,000 km of road in four years, which is 2,500 km per year and is the equivalent of the distance from Dar-es-Salaam to Rundu in Namibia. That is a very huge task. In other words, the Government intends to work on roughly 200 km a month, which is the equivalent of the distance between Lusaka and Monze or Lusaka and Kapiri Mposhi. That translates into roughly 7 km a day. We want durable feeder roads. When Hon. Muntanga raised a point of order, he mentioned the Kafue/Mazabuka Road. We need it to be worked on as soon as possible

Mr Chairperson, let me move onto the issue of chiefs’ palaces. 

Sir, I am happy that there is a longer list of chiefs for whom palaces will be built. The first one had only two chiefs for whom palaces would be built in the Southern Province, namely, Chief Chona and Chieftainess Mwenda. However, the construction works are very slow. So, I do not know how long it will take us to build all the palaces throughout Zambia. We must double our efforts so that the chiefs can benefit.

Mr Chairperson, I do not want to talk about too many issues because two more hon. Members from the province are yet to debate, but let me talk about the drying up of dams in the province, especially in Moomba Constituency. I sent a distress signal to the Provincial hon. Minster, who is not here, and copied it to Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning on this crisis, but nothing was done. The animals have had no water since September, 2015. As you may be aware, cattle are a form of wealth and a source of pride to us in the Southern Province. Some people talk about those who herd cattle in a sarcastic manner, but I am very proud to state that I once herded cattle and that I can still do it today. To get back to my main point, since we have less rainfall in the Southern Province, we need dams. As I pointed out earlier, we do not have water for our animals because about fifteen dams have dried up, and most require full rehabilitation while others need silting. We also need to build more dams. So, I appeal to Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development to look into this issue because we need more dams.

With those few words, I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kasonso (Solwezi West): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to debate the allocation to the North-Western Province and the statement made by Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister for Development Planning.

Sir, from the outset, let me say that, as far as development is concerned, there is hell on earth for the North-Western Province, and I say this because the Patriotic Front (PF) Government is discriminating against the province.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasonso: Mr Chairperson, I will cite an example to prove that there is no development that the PF Government can talk about having taken to the North-Western Province.


Mr Kasonso: Sir, let me talk about the roads. The famous Chingola/Solwezi Road is being worked on without proper designs and piecemeal to hoodwink the people of the North-Western Province while ...

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasonso: ... the Kalulushi/Kasempa Road has not been worked on although it is a feeder road. Promises have been made on the Floor of this House that the Government would construct a road from Mwinilunga to Jimbe, but that has not been done. Similarly, the Solwezi/Mushidamo, Kasempa/Mumbwa and Kaoma/Kasempa road have not been worked on. There are attempts to work on roads in Solwezi, the provincial headquarters, but they are meant to hoodwink the people of the province into believing that something is being done.

Hon. Government Members: Question!

Mr Kasonso: Your job is to listen.

The Deputy Chairperson: Order! 

The hon. Member was very clear and I do not know why you are disturbing his debate, hon. Minister.

Mr Kasonso: Mr Chairperson, I thank you for your protection.

Sir, the truth is that the PF Government is discriminating against the North-Western Province, as far as development is concerned, and that cannot be denied.

Sir, the Provincial Administration Offices, where the PF Government’s borrowed hon. Minister operates from, were built in 1958. When compared with the offices for other provincial administrations, it looks like a chicken run. Can someone be proud of that? For example, if we compare Solwezi General Hospital with hospitals in some provinces, including the newly-created one, Muchinga Province, it is nothing to talk about if we overlook the extensions that Kansanshi Mine did to it. I said that the North-Western Province is hell on earth in as far as development by this Government is concerned ...

 Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasonso: … and what I am presenting are facts, nothing else.

Mr Chairperson, let me now talk about education. If it was not for Lumwana Mine, which has added two classrooms to almost every school, the classroom space in most schools would have been pathetic. I must, therefore, appreciate and commend Lumwana Mine’s efforts.

Sir, we have heard about the 650 health posts that are supposed to be distributed among all the districts. For the North-Western Province, again, it is just stories. The other day, I engaged the hon. Deputy Minister on what was happening to the newly-build Lumwana hospital, which the Government had made an attempt to open without staff and no equipment during the by-election in September, 2015. I am grateful that the hon. Deputy Minister has promised that something will be done in the next ten days.

Hon. UPND Members: Are you sure?


Mr Kasonso: Mr Chairperson, is the story of the North-Western Province not hell on earth when we compare with the heaven on earth that we have been told is in Muchinga Province? Hon. Kapeya has summarised the situation in Muchinga Province very well and I am very proud of him. He has given us the facts on what is happening in Muchinga Province. So, all I can do is urge our people in North-Western Province, wherever they are, to listen to the story of development in Muchinga Province and compare it with that of the North-Western Province. This afternoon, I listened very carefully as the hon. Minister of Finance read a long list of the roads that have been budgeted for in this country. Surprisingly, no road in the North-Western Province is on that list, and that is a fact. I was also listening very carefully to Her Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Development Planning as she was announcing the allocations to the provinces. Again, the North-Western Province got the least, with K59 million. What have we done to the PF Government to be this marginalised? 


Mr Kasonso: Sir, I want to know what we have done to the PF Government to be treated like this when the bulk of this Budget will be financed by money from the North-Western Province. 

Hon. PF Member: Who says?

Mr Kasonso: You mean you do not know? Do they want me to give you …

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Hon. Members on my right, allow the hon. Member to debate. You will be given the chance to respond.

Mr Kasonso: Mr Chairperson, developing the North-Western Province is not a priority for the PF Government. That is a fact. If it is, then, the Government should show me just one big project that it has implemented in Chavuma, Kabompo, Kasempa, Solwezi or Mwinilunga. The Chingola/Solwezi Road is being worked on in patches. The Government did not listen to what we advised because it has no capacity to listen. 


The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Mr Kasonso: You are an hon. Minister. So, you are supposed to take notes of what I am telling you instead of heckling.

Mr Mufalali: What is your problem? (Pointing at the hon. Deputy Minister for the North-Western Province).

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Let me guide the House.

Mr Mufalali: Please, send him out.

The Deputy Chairperson: You see, however distasteful the hon. Member’s comments, let us learn to listen, take notes and have the courage to respond at the right time. 

You may continue, Hon. Kasonso.

Mr Kasonso: Mr Chairperson, the PF Government is bragging about the Chingola/Solwezi Road when it does not even have the money to complete it. There is no design for it, and that is a fact. Can the hon. Deputy Minister show me where, in the Yellow Book, the allocation to the road is. So, all I can do is appeal to the people of the North-Western Province to know what to do and what not to do next year.

Mr Kambwili: You have always done that.

Mr Kasonso: Yes, and I will repeat it.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasonso: Hon. Kambwila or Kambwili.


Hon. Opposition Members: Kambwili.

Mr Kasonso: Hon. Kambwili, ... 

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Hon. Member, you know that, as hon. Members and leaders in our own right, we must learn to control our tempers. If we lose our tempers at every turn, I do not know where we will end up. So, continue debating, but bear in mind that you should control your temper.

Mr Kasonso: Sir, thank you for that protection, but I am being distracted.
The Deputy Chairperson: You may continue.

Mr Kasonso: Mr Chairperson, I am being emotional because it is hell on earth for the people of the North-Western Province, where I come from.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasonso: Sir, all I can promise the PF is that our people will do them another Don’t kubeba.

Hon. Government Members: Aah! We know.

Mr Kasonso: Mr Chairperson, ‘don’t kubeba’ means do not tell them.

Mr Mufalali: But eat their food.

Mr Kasonso: Mr Chairperson, there is no debate on the lack of development in the North-Western Province. All I have outlined are nothing else, but facts. The hon. Ministers have taken notes. So, they must respond to the issues that I have raised with facts. However, we will see if they will do that. If what I am saying about the North-Western Province is untrue, I challenge the Government to prove me wrong when it replies by telling us what projects it is implementing, district by district.

Sir, let me end by saying that the North-Western Province is hell on earth in as far as development is concerned.

With those few words, I thank you, Sir.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

(Debate adjourned)



[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

(Progress reported)


The House adjourned at 1957 hours until 0900 hours on Friday, 27th November, 2015.