DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE FIFTH SESSION OF THE TENTH ASSEMBLY

Wednesday, 10th November, 2010

The House met at 1430 hours

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

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ANNOUNCEMENT BY MR SPEAKER

DELEGATION FROM THE NATIONAL ASSEMBLY OF UGANDA

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members, I wish to acquaint the House with the presence, in the Speaker’s Gallery, of the following guests who are hon. Members of the Committee on the Human Immuno Virus and Acquired Immuno Deficiency Syndrome (HIV/AIDS) and the Committee on Social Services from the Parliament of Uganda:

(i) Hon. Beatrice Rwakimari – Chairperson, Committee on HIV/AIDS;

(ii) Hon. Brian Asimwe – Chairperson, Committee on Social Services;

(iii) Hon. Professor Willy Anokbonngo;

(iv) Hon. Jane Alisemera Babiha;

(v) Hon. Margaret Aleper;

(vi) Hon. Lulume Bayiga;

(vii) Ms Martha Mandha Kaganzi – Clerk to the Committee on HIV/AIDS; and

(viii) Mr James Mukaga – Clerk to the Committee on Social Services.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: The distinguished Members of the delegation are on a working visit to our Parliament to share experiences on best practices, procedures, skills and knowledge on the role of Parliament in the fight against HIV/AIDS.

I wish, on behalf of the National Assembly, to receive the guests and warmly welcome them in our midst.

I thank you.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

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MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

INLAND WATER TRANSPORT IN ZAMBIA

The Minister of Communications and Transport (Professor Lungwangwa): Mr Speaker, I wish to express my sincere gratitude for the opportunity that I have been accorded to make a ministerial statement on the state of inland water transport in Zambia in the light of the procured dredging machines.

Mr Speaker, in its continued effort to improve the conditions of canals and waterways in the country, the Government, under the leadership of His Excellency, Mr Rupiah Bwezani Banda …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: … made available about K7 billion for the procurement of two dredging machines and accessories from Aquamec of Finland for the rehabilitation and maintenance of canals and waterways in the country. I am pleased to inform this august House and, through it, the nation that these machines were procured by my ministry and have since arrived in the country. The equipment will be positioned in the most vulnerable areas that require constant dredging in the Western and Luapula provinces.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Professor Lungwangwa: These machines are able to clear weeds and deepen the canals up to five metres. The machines have a provision for a buck hole bucket, a suction pump for operation in the muddy or sandy areas, a cutter pump and pole erector for putting poles.

Mr Speaker, once the dredgers are operational, the following benefits will be realised:

(i) canals and waterways will be cleared and become navigable;

(ii) remote rural areas that depend on water transport will be easily accessible;

(iii) the areas will become arable for agriculture as the canals will provide drainage for the areas and also prevent or minimise flooding;

(iv) there will be improvement in the provision of water transport services;

(v) farming inputs and outputs will be easily transported to and from the markets;

(vi) the living standards of the people in these areas will be improved;

(vii) the canals and waterways in navigable conditions throughout the year will accelerate economic growth in the areas;

(viii) the community will be able to access the health, education and administrative centres; and

(ix) canals and waterways will promote tourism, mining and agriculture.

Mr Speaker, inland water transport plays an important role in the trnasportation of people and goods, especially in those areas where the movement depends entirely on water transport such as on Lake Bangweulu and the surrounding Bangweulu Swamp area, Lake Mweru, Tanganyika, Kariba, the Lukanga Swamp area, the Zambezi Flood Plains and many others. Inland waterways are also important in the generation of hydro power such as on Lake Kariba, on the Zambezi River and on Kafue River at the Kafue Gorge.

Mr Speaker, inland waterways have traditionally been used to provide cheap transport of bulk commodities with large volumes at low value to and from the hinterland harbours. They have the inherent advantages of low cost, low adverse environmental impact and high energy efficiency.

Mr Speaker, the Government is aware of the potential to be tapped by using these natural resources and the savings which may be brought about by investments in the inland water transport scheme.

Mr Speaker, my ministry established the Department of Maritime and Inland Waters in mid 1994 as an overall authority on all matters relating to maritime external affairs (ocean-going shipping and international ports) and inland water transportation, maintenance and development of canals and waterways.

Mr Speaker, let me give an overview of the inland water transport sub-sector in Zambia. The inland water transport system in Zambia comprises the following:

Lake Tanganyika is the only inland waterway for Zambia that connects it with the Great Lakes Region (Burundi, Tanzania, the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) and beyond to Rwanda, Uganda and Kenya) which is currently used for commercial shipping. Shipping on Lake Tanganyika serves the ports of Bujumbura in Burundi, Kigoma and Kasanga in Tanzania, Kalemie in the eastern part of the DRC and other numerous small ports on the shores of the lake in Tanzania and the DRC. Land access to Mpulungu Harbour is by road and there are plans to connect the port to the Tanzania-Zambia Railway Authority (TAZARA) line at Nseluka near Kasama.

Mr Speaker, in the Bangweulu Swamps, there are many islands and the only means of transportation is by canals and channels. The islands of Bwalya Mponda, Matongo, Kasomalunga, Kalimankonde, Nsalushi and Mutwamina are densely populated and the virtual absence of an alternative transport mode leaves the inhabitants exclusively dependent on water transport.

Mr Speaker, in the Lake Mweru/Luapula River Delta area, canals are what link the mainland and Lake Mweru. The Government has continued to provide funds for maintenance to ensure that these canals are navigable and provide accessibility to schools and health centres on the islands of Kilwa on Lake Mweru.

Mr Speaker, other navigable waterways include the Zambezi River Waterway which is navigable on the stretches of Chavuma, Zambezi, Lukulu, Senanga, Mongu and Kalabo. It is also navigable between Kalongola, Sesheke and Mambova. Thus, the Zambezi River provides these intermittent navigable stretches which are separated by rapids, sand banks and outcrops. The Chavuma/Lukulu stretch is also navigable during the high water level period. Non-navigable stretches, therefore, will require heavy investments in the construction of weirs and dams and procurement of dredging equipment.

The Sesheke/Mambova stretch is also navigable. Below Mambova, the Zambezi River is, again, not navigable. This stretch of the river will require periodic dredging due to shallow waters during the dry season.

Mr Speaker, the Lower Zambezi is navigable from the Kariba Dam Wall all the way to Luangwa. This waterway is characterised by low water levels during the dry season and compounded by sand banks. In order to maintain the navigability throughout the year, there is a need to position dredging equipment on this stretch of the waterway. There are a number of lodges along this stretch of the river which provide tourism activities in the area.

Mr Speaker, the Kafue River is of great importance to Zambia as it supports agriculture, tourism, energy and manufacturing industries. This waterway is navigable from Namwala downstream to the Kafue Gorge Dam, a distance of nearly 200 kilometres. It is also navigable from the Kafue Dam to the confluence of the Zambezi River. The waterway is clogged by the Kafue weed or water hyacinth which has made navigation impossible. The weed is also exerting pressure on the railway and road bridges infrastructure and poses a great danger to the hydro power station in Kafue.

Mr Speaker, since this waterway is of great importance to the economy of Zambia, the Government’s strategy is to ensure that dredging equipment is positioned at every strategic area such as the rail and road bridges and at the Kafue Gorge in order to remove the weeds that are a danger to the infrastructure. The Government will also encourage and invite the private sector to provide water transport to the community living along the Kafue River.

Mr Speaker, in the Lukanga Swamps, the inhabitants also depend on water transportation. Funds have been made available to ensure that canals and fairways are navigable in order to provide water transport to and from the islands. The Government’s plan is to ensure that dredging machines are procured for this area when funds are made available.

Mr Speaker, this Government has widely recognised inland water transport as a sub-sector of the Zambian transport system and also as an integral part of the entire national transport network. In this regard, the Government is making every effort possible to ensure that this transport mode receives much support as that of other modes in terms of infrastructure development. 

Mr Speaker, in order to ensure that canals and waterways are worked on and given periodic maintenance, my ministry will liaise with the Ministry of Finance and National Planning to ensure that adequate funding is made available to carry out maintenance works and procure the necessary dredging equipment and tools. These efforts, therefore, will make canals and waterways in the swamps and flood plains navigable and passable by boats and make health, education and administrative centres easily accessible and, hence, improve the living standards of the people.

Mr Speaker, the Government is committed to the improvement of water transport services, particularly in areas where the movement of people and goods is by means of canals and waterways, especially in some stretches of the Zambezi and Kafue Rivers, Bangweulu Swamps, Luapula, the river delta on Lake Mweru and Lukanga Swamps.

Mr Speaker, the Government will not relent it its efforts to ensure that this momentum to improve the waterways of our country is sustained. These efforts, thus far demonstrated, will go a long way in enhancing the commercial and social welfare of our people.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members are now free to ask questions on points of clarification on the ministerial statement given by the hon. Minister of Communications and Transport.

Mr C. K. B. Banda, SC. (Chasefu): Mr Speaker, in view of the fact that there are many areas that will require dredging machines, may I know what the Government has identified as priority areas that require the services of these dredging machines at the earliest opportunity.

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, the ministerial statement has indicated, to a large extent, the areas that are vulnerable and require dredging machines on our lakes and river waterways and swamps. We have identified and outlined these places in our ministerial statement.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.
 
Dr Machungwa (Luapula): Mr Speaker, I would like to commend the Government and the hon. Minister for the acquisition of the two dredging machines. However, is the operation going to be funded, considering that in this year’s Budget only K500 million has been allocated for this exercise whereas last year, there was K1 billion, and yet it was not enough. How will you manage to run these machines with an allocation of K500 million?

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, indeed, the dredging machines will be part of the operational costs of the ministry as well as the provinces where they will be used.

I thank you, Sir.

Major Chizhyuka (Namwala): Mr Speaker, the main economic activity on the Kafue Plains is not dependent on the bridges and railway lines as stated by the hon. Minister. The main activity …

Mr Speaker: Order!

You are now debating. May you ask your question.

Major Chizhyuka: How is the hon. Minister going to dredge the main body of the Kafue Plains on the rivers, canals and ravines in order to enhance the developments, which have been elaborated, considering that you have not put any dredging equipment on the main body of the Kafue Plains?

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, the dredging machines that have been procured by the Government are state-of-the-art machines that can float on water at any point. Therefore, dredging will not be difficult on any water surface along the rivers or lakes.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chisala (Chilubi): Mr Speaker, let me begin by paying tribute to the hon. Minister and his team for making a frantic effort to buy this vessel which is very important for the people.

Mr Speaker, in light of the procurement of the equipment, which I understand is more advanced than the one which was bought during the Chiluba era, I would like to know what corrective measures the hon. Minister has put in place to prevent constant breakdowns.

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, we appreciate the need to ensure that the machines are operational. Efforts will be made to ensure that the machines are repaired and maintained constantly so that they serve the people well.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Imenda (Lukulu East): Mr Speaker, much as we appreciate the importance of the equipment, will these machines not end up like the Chinese equipment for road construction which have turned out to be white elephants due to poor management by the provincial authorities?

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, I do not agree that the road equipment has become white elephants because a lot of commendable work is being done in various parts of the country, using this equipment. Clearly, we should appreciate the services the equipment is providing.

As far as the water equipment is concerned, every effort will be made to ensure that it does the required work in the designated areas.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwenya (Nkana): Mr Speaker, the weeds have been a nuisance on most of our lakes. I would like to find out from the hon. Minister how the dredging machines will be managed to make sure that they do not spread weeds from one lake to the other, knowing very well that one dredging machine which was removed from Luapula …

Mr Speaker: Order!

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, the role of the machines will be to clear the weeds and not to spread them.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kambwili (Roan): Mr Speaker, I would like to know if there has been any technical training for the operators and also whether there is a maintenance crew provided by the manufacturers to prevent constant breakdowns of the machines.

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, there is a technical team from Finland that will arrive in the country at the weekend to provide some training although we already have people who are technically qualified to operate the machines.

I thank you, Sir.

Ms Kapata (Mandevu): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister how the dredgers will be monitored, considering that the Ministry of Communications and Transport does not have offices countrywide and the Maritime Department is only at the headquarters.

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member does not know what is happening countrywide because she is in Lusaka.

Interruptions

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, the Maritime Department is in different parts of the country. Therefore, our officers will ensure that they monitor the equipment.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwiimbu (Monze Central): Mr Speaker, the notorious Kariba weed is known to be endemic in the Kafubu Stream in Ndola. Is the hon. Minister considering clearing the Kariba weed along the Kafubu River, bearing in mind that it is the source of contamination in most of the major rivers in Zambia?

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, if the hon. Member paid attention to the ministerial statement, he would have noticed that it made reference to the clearing of weeds, including the most notorious one on the Kafue and Kafubu rivers.

I thank you, Sir.
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QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

EMPLOYMENT LOSS AT ZAMTEL

155. Mr Imenda (Lukulu East) asked the Minister of Labour and Social Security:

(a) how many people lost employment as a result of the privatisation of Zambia Telecommunications Company (ZAMTEL); and

(b) how much money was paid to the former workers as retrenchment benefits.

The Deputy Minister of Labour and Social Security (Mr Kachimba): Mr Speaker, when ZAMTEL was privatised, all former workers totaling 2,510, including 210 retirees, were paid their terminal benefits based on an agreement reached between the ZAMTEL management and the union. The new owners have embarked on a restructuring exercise where, initially, a workforce of 796 of the former employees has been retained. The restructuring will entail fresh recruitment where all the jobs will be advertised on the open market.

Mr Speaker, a total of K509.4 billion was paid to the former workers as retrenchment benefits.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Imenda (Lukulu East): Mr Speaker, is that not a contradiction in the management of our economy when 2,000 workers leave employment and 2,000 are employed elsewhere?

The Minister of Labour and Social Security (Mr Liato): Mr Speaker, although I have not fully understood that question, I will attempt to answer the little that I have understood. The process of privatisation is taken as a policy to enable create efficiency and enhance recapitalisation in organisations that could be ailing as a result of the burden on the Government running business in that particular industry or company. In this case, if the Government had not moved in good time to privatise ZAMTEL, we would actually have ended up with a disaster where all the workers in ZAMTEL would have risked going away empty-handed.

In other words, if the Government had not taken steps in good time to privatise this institution, we would have ended up with a disaster where the whole infrastructure would have collapsed. Therefore, I think the decision which was taken was timely, as it has not only created a new lease of life to the institution, but also helped those who have worked in the institution not to go away empty-handed. I think that is a positive step.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi): Mr Speaker, what measures is the ministry putting in place to ensure that every time there is privatisation, workers do not lose their jobs?

Mr Liato: Mr Speaker, I think that question will give me an opportunity, perhaps, to explain one important issue. In the process of privatisation, this Government has made it clear that we shall try as much as we can to protect and sustain jobs which already exist. This is our policy. However, that will not be done at the expense of the survival of the institutions, themselves, because unless the institutions are there, there will not be a single job for anyone at all. Therefore, while we are cognisant of the fact that people’s jobs must be protected, it is, however, difficult and impossible to force employers to over employ. In other words, we can only agree that employers absorb the number of jobs that are relevant and will enable them to operate efficiently. However, you cannot ask an employer to overload a company, in other words, making them pay excesses. Therefore, I think that we have to maintain a balance so that both the employee and the chicken that lays the egg are able to survive.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Phiri (Munali): Mr Speaker, when ZAMTEL was privatised, this Government is on record as having said that the employees who were going to lose employment were going to be given land as an alternative. How many former employees have been given land and how can this land be accessed?

Mr Liato: Mr Speaker, obviously, the ministry has never made that commitment to everyone and so, that question is totally misdirected.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Simuusa (Nchanga): Mr Speaker, more than 60 per cent of the workers lost their jobs, but it is the Government’s policy to create jobs from foreign investment. What benefits are we going to realise as a nation from the ZAMTEL deal?

Mr Liato: Mr Speaker, that question was earlier explained and covered. The idea behind privatisation is, basically, to create efficiency in organisations. In the process, naturally, excesses are discarded. In other words, if there is a parastatal which has over employed, this process will clean up that burden.

As a caring Government, we want to ensure that this process is done as painlessly as possible. This is where the intervention of the ministry and Government, as a whole, comes in. Obviously, you cannot stop excesses from being cleansed. One other good point is that whilst jobs are being lost in institutions such as ZAMTEL, we are also creating jobs in many sectors. Very soon, we will come to the House to show how we are creating jobs in other areas.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kambwili (Roan): Mr Speaker, the hon. Member for Lukulu East wanted to know how much money was paid to the former employees as benefits. What was the figure? Secondly, what is the status of the pension scheme for ZAMTEL employees?

Mr Speaker: The hon. Minister will deal with either of the two questions.

Mr Liato: Mr Speaker, the company is undergoing restructuring. As was read out in the answer, this means that in restructuring issues of pension schemes will be included. All these programmes will fall in place as the company restructures.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chisala (Chilubi): Mr Speaker, we have been informed that the company is undergoing restructuring. What will be the total establishment in the aftermath of the restructuring programme?

Mr Speaker:  I believe the answer was given.

Mr Liato: Mr Speaker, Hon. Kambwili was disturbing me and I did not concentrate on the question.

Mr Kambwili: Aah!

Mr Liato: Is the question about how many employees will be employed at the end of the exercise?

Mr Chisala: Yes.

Mr Liato: Mr Speaker, the programme is ongoing. We will know the ultimate numbers when the programme is completed.

I thank you, Sir.

ZCCM-IH GEMSTONE DEPARTMENT

156. Mr Kambwili asked the Minister of mines and minerals Development:

(a) how far the Zambia Consolidated Copper Mines-Investment Holdings (ZCCM-IH) had gone in developing a gemstone department; and

(b) how many mines had been or would be opened under this project.

The Deputy Minister of Mines and Minerals Development (Mr Nkhata): Mr Speaker, ZCCM-IH has not developed a gemstone department. However, the company has been carrying out exploration on its large-scale gemstone licence under Prospecting Licence No. PLLS 244 in Lufwanyama District since 2005. The area covered by the licence is 95 km square. Though no gemstones of commercial value have, so far, been found, prospecting work is continuing to ensure that all parts of the licence area are covered before making the final conclusions.

No mine has been developed yet. The number of mines that could be opened under this project will depend on the final results of the exploration programme.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, the ZCCM-IH has been carrying out explorations for the past six years. May I know how much has been spent on this project, so far, and whether the prospects are positive? This is in view of the fact that the ZCCM-IH holds shares on behalf of the Government and the money it handles is public money.

Mr Nkhata: Mr Speaker, there have been no positive results yet. However, the company is still prospecting and K1.9 billion has been spent on the emerald explorations so far.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Simuusa: Mr Speaker, the explorations have been going on for six years when they were supposed to take two years. I would like to find out from the hon. Minister when the exploration will be concluded. When will we get the final results?

Mr Nkhata: Mr Speaker, exploration is not an easy task. It involves the companies trying to discover the presence of minerals in the areas they have undertaken to prospect. They still have a number of years to conclude their job. That is why they are still exploring.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, I am sure there are a number of mines that are operating on the Copperbelt. I would like to find out what protection is offered to the miners to prevent death from falling rocks or being trapped underground.

Mr Nkhata: Mr Speaker, under exploration, there are no mining activities that take place. The companies are merely exploring. Any company that is using the exploring licence to mine is violating the Laws of Zambia. When mining companies are exploring, they are not allowed to conduct any mining activities. If such activities are actually taking place, then they are happening unlawfully.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

CHIPATA/CHADIZA AND MWAMI/VUBWI ROADS

157. Mr V. Mwale (Chipangali) asked the Minister of Works and Supply when the following roads would be tarred:

 (i) Chipata/Chadiza; and

 (ii) Mwami/Vubwi.

The Minister of Works and Supply (Mr Mulongoti): Mr Speaker, due to the limitation of the national resource envelope, the two roads have not been included in the Sixth National Development Plan for tarring. It is, however, hoped that these priority roads will be considered in the Seventh National Development Plan.

Mr V. Mwale: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that these roads are important to the development of agricultural activities in these areas?

Mr Mulongoti: Mr Speaker, the ministry is aware of that fact. It is just that it is not possible to work on those roads at the moment.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Opposition Member: Aah!

___________

BILL

THIRD READING

The following Bill was read the third time and passed:

The Citizens Economic Empowerment (Amendment) Bill, 2010

__________

COMMITTEE OF SUPPLY

[THE CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES in the
 Chair]

VOTE 37/01 – (Ministry of Finance and National Planning – Human Resources and Administration – K359 264 877 757).

The Minister of Finance and National Planning (Dr Musokotwane): Madam Chairperson, I beg to move the following amendments:

(i) under Unit 1, Programme 1, Activity 01 – Salaries Division I, by the deletion of the figure K1,843,974,649 and substitution therefor of K1,570,434,062;

(ii) under Unit 1, Programme 1, Activity 02 – Salaries Division II, by the deletion of the figure K3,152,015,537 and substitution therefor of K2,411,515,474;

(iii) under Unit 1, Programme 1, Activity 03 – Salaries Division III, the deletion of the figure K640,157,694 and substitution therefor of K566,485,372;

(iv) under Unit 1, Programme 1, Activity 04 – Wages, by the deletion of the figure K2,411,823,208 and substitution therefor of K1,375,310,091; and

(v) under Unit 1, Programme 1, Activity 06 – Contract Gratuity, by the deletion of the figure K24,963,155,647 and the substitution therefor of K27,087,380,926.

Amendments agreed to. Vote amended accordingly.

Vote 37/01, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/02 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/04 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/06 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/07 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/08 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/09 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/10 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/11 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/12 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/13 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 37/14 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

VOTE 12 – (Commission for Investigations – Office of the President – K4,565,682,060.00).

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice (Mr Kunda, SC.): Madam Chairperson, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to debate the Motion on Floor of House.

Madam Chairperson, the Commission for Investigations was established in 1973, but became functional in 1974. It operates under the ambit of the Commission for Investigations Act, Cap 39 of the Laws of Zambia. The Act provides for the Commission’s powers, privileges and immunities in the pursuance of its mandate.

Madam Chairperson, the function of the commission is to protect the rights of the citizens of Zambia and, indeed, non-citizens, against the potential or actual violations that may result from either defective administrative systems or abuse of office or authority, inefficiency or in short maladministration in the Government ministries and departments as well as local authorities and parastatal organisations. This covers the entire Public Service delivery system.

The commission offers free and confidential services to complainants regarding the Public Service as mandated under the Act. In effect, the commission serves as a Public Service watchdog and acts as a conduit for both enforcement of standards and promotion of the upholding of ethnics, the rule of law and principles of fair play in the Public Service.

Planned Activities, 2011

Madam Chairperson, in 2011, my Government intends to implement the following measures with respect to improving the performance of the Commission for Investigations.

 (i) Strengthening of the Institutional Framework

In order to achieve greater efficiency and accessibility of the service of the commission for the majority of Zambians in the nine provinces, the Government has approved the restructuring of the Commission for Investigations which shall enable it to decentralise initially to, at least, three provinces which are Lusaka, Southern and Copperbelt. This shall result in the creation of three regional offices in Ndola, Lusaka and Livingstone. The Government expects that the restructuring programme shall improve the commission’s current staff structure by enabling the institution to recruit more staff and re-assign some of the regional offices.

(ii) Strengthening of Legal Framework

The Commission for Investigations has long remained in the shadow of other institutions of good governance, in terms of both performance and visibility. This may be attributed to lack of legal provisions for the administrative and operational autonomy of the commission from the Civil Service. The Government, therefore, intends to carry out a review of the Commission for Investigations Act in order for major institutional reforms to be carried out in this very important institution.

(iii) Programme for Co-operation with the Danish Government for the Improvement of the Performance of the Commission for Investigations

Madam Chairperson, I am pleased to inform this august House that the MMD Government has signed a co-operation agreement with the Danish Government to provide support to the Commission for Investigations. The Danish financial and technical support to the commission will enable the commission to improve its case management system.

Madam Chairperson, in summary, it is my belief and sincere hope that the implementation of the aforementioned measures for the improvement of the performance of the Commission for Investigations shall greatly contribute to the Government’s poverty reduction programme. I, therefore, urge this august House to support the commission’s estimates as presented.

Madam Chairperson, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Mr Mukanga (Kantanshi): Madam Chairperson, thank you for giving me an opportunity to, also, add my voice to the debate on this important Vote. The office of the National Ombudsman is very important. I believe that if any democratic dispensation is to have an effective and transparent Civil Service, this office has to be empowered. It is for this reason that I am saying that this commission, although it has been in existence for the past thirty-six years, has not had its presence felt by the public. This is because the public does not even appreciate what it does and what it is able to execute. According to what I have heard from the Leader of Government Business in the House, I have seen that this office requires to be decentralised further.

Madam Chairperson, currently, its presence can be felt in Lusaka and we are, now, told that it will be on the Copperbelt and Livingstone as well. However, it has to be noted that it takes long for the civil servants to come to Lusaka. Even if it goes to the Copperbelt, the people in the rural areas will still have to spend a lot of money to go to the Copperbelt or Livingstone. It is for this reason that I am saying that, although it will be decentralised, it requires further decentralisation in order for the civil servants to have access to it. Without that being done, it will be very difficult for it to operate.

Mr Chairperson, although this institution is legally supported, it faces a lot of challenges. One of the challenges, as already been mentioned, is understaffing. If this commission only operates in Lusaka, it will be very difficult for it to execute expeditiously and make recommendations efficiently on the cases that will be brought before it from other parts of the country. While the commission always makes recommendations, it is very difficult for all of them to be carried out.

Mr Chairperson, it is for this reason that I am proposing that this commission should not just end at making recommendations, but should also be allowed to prosecute so that, at the end of the day, it will be able to give out a court order for the recommendations to be executed. If that is not done, it will be very difficult for the Civil Service to appreciate its presence.

Mr Chairperson, in trying to make its presence felt, I would also suggest that this commission goes flat out to trying and sensitise the community because the people, out there, do not understand the work of the ombudsman in this country. They do not even know where to find them. Therefore, I believe that with the funding levels that have been provided, the print and electronic media will offer this commission relaxed rates of advertising so that this exercise is executed successfully. If it is not given that incentive, it will be reduced to a toothless organisation that will not execute its work properly. Therefore, I am calling for increased funding, staffing, and decentralisation so that the people may also know about the existence of this commission.

Madam Chairperson, when I was looking at the figures, I noticed that we have done well in increasing the Office Administration allocation from K454 million to K664 million this year. However, there has been a serious reduction on Human Resource Development and Management from K360,110,000 to K72,050,000. This allocation is not sufficient to ease the operations of the commission. Therefore, we need to support it fully and fund it so that it performs to our expectations. 

Madam Chairperson, on the Human Immuno-Deficiency Virus/ Acquired Immuno-Deficiency Syndrome (HIV/AIDS) Support, I have seen a reduction from K20 million to K12 million. HIV/AIDS is a very serious issue in this country and we cannot be seen to be going in the opposite direction of everybody else in the Diaspora. Therefore, the funding levels on issues that relate to HIV/AIDS need to be increased unlike what the case is at the moment.

Madam Chairperson, on Programme 8, Activity 01 – Own Initiative Investigations − K90, 580,000, we seem to have reduced this allocation from K641,600,000 last year. How do you expect this commission to execute issues that will be visible to the nation with such an amount? It is, therefore, important that you walk the talk. Otherwise, it will be very difficult for people to appreciate this commission with this reduced funding.

Madam Chairperson, last year, I spoke about increased funding for provincial tours and I am glad that, this year, the funds have been increased. I have also seen some increase on Sensitisation Seminars to K160,178,141. However, we need to increase the funding for sensitisation on radio, workshops and all types of media so that we reach out to the people, out there, for them to appreciate the work of the ombudsman. Since people do not appreciate the work of the ombudsman in this country, hence it will be very difficult for us to debate these issues and also support the commission.

Madam Chairperson, on Programme 4, Activity 01 − International ombudsman − K15,000,000, there is a reduction from K28 million. I would, therefore, urge the Executive to ensure that the Commission for Investigations is funded adequately. As a result, while I support this Vote, I also call for increased funding.

I thank you, Madam Chairperson.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Madam Chairperson, I wish to thank the House for the overwhelming support.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Vote 12/01 – (Commission for Investigations – Office of the President – Headquarters – K4, 565,682,060).

Mr Mukanga: Madam Chairperson, I seek clarification on Programme 2, Activity 02 – Human Resource Development and Management − K72, 050,000. There is a reduction from K360,110,000. On the same Programme, Activity 05 − HIV/AIDS Support − K12,000,000, there is a reduction from K20 million. On Programme 11, Activity 02 – Electronic Media (TV and Radio) − K176,000,000, there has been a reduction from K200 million. I would like to find out why there are these reductions.

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice: Madam Chairperson, on Programme 2, Activity 02 − Human Resource Development and Management − K72,050,000, the provision will be used to cover costs of State functions and staff development courses. The adverse variance is due to the reduced activities.

Sir, on Activity 05 – HIV/AIDS Support − K12,000,000, this provision will be required to procure food supplements. The variance is due to the reduction of HIV/AIDS activities in the office as most activities were carried out in the previous years. We should also bear in mind that this is also covered under the Ministry of Health.

Sir, on Programme 11, Activity 02 – Electronic Media (TV and Radio) − K176,000,000, this provision will be used to cover the costs of advertisements. The variance is due to the anticipated economies of scale. This was also undertaken last year, hence the reduction of the activities.

I thank you, Madam Chairperson.

Vote 12/01 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

VOTE 13 – (Ministry of Energy and Water Development – K386,718,658,099).

The Minister of Energy and Water Development (Mr Konga): Madam Chairperson, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to present the 2011 Budget Estimates for the Ministry of Energy and Water Development to this august House.

The Ministry of Energy and Water Development is mandated to ensure the availability of adequate and quality energy and water resources for socio-economic development.

The Ministry of Energy and Water Development is equally responsible for the following statutory bodies:

(i) National Water Supply and Sanitation Council (NWASCO), which regulates the water sector;

(ii) the Energy Regulation Board (ERB), which regulates the energy sector;

(iii) Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (ZESCO) Limited, the national electricity utility;

(iv) the Office for Promoting Private Power Investment (OPPI);

(v) the Rural Electrification Authority (REA);

(vi) Indeni, which is responsible for refining petroleum products in the country; and

(vii) the Tanzania Zambia Mafuta Pipelines (TAZAMA), which is responsible for transportation of petroleum products from the port of Dar-es-Salaam to Ndola.

Madam Chairperson, the Ministry of Energy and Water Development has the following departments for execution and implementation of Government policy:

(i) Human Resource and Administration;

(ii) Planning and Information;

(iii) Department of Energy; and

(iv) Department of Water Affairs.

Madam Chairperson, the proposed budget estimates for 2011 are based on identified activities in the proposed Sixth National Development Plan (SNDP) and the Vision 2030, which endeavours to make Zambia a middle income prosperous nation. The proposed activities have a direct impact on wealth creation, especially in rural areas. 

 Energy

Madam Chairperson, the role of the energy sector is to provide energy options that will meet the socio-economic development demands of the country. To this effect, the Ministry of Energy and Water Development has focused on the development of electric power generation capacity, transmission and distribution.

Madam Chairperson, in the coming year, the ministry will embark on the construction of the Kafue Gorge Lower and Itezhi-tezhi Hydro Power Projects. Rehabilitation and upgrading works are equally planned at the Lunzua and Lusiwasi Hydro sites. In order to diversify the energy mix of the sector, the ministry plans to support the construction of the Heavy Fuel Oil Power Plant in Ndola as well as produce thermal electricity from coal in Maamba.

The ministry intends to increase the rural electricity access rate which currently stands at about 3 per cent by embarking on various rural electrification projects as contained in the Rural Electrification Master Plan (REMP), whose copies have been provided to hon. Members.

Madam Chairperson, in its quest to promote the use of alternative sources of energy, the Ministry of Energy and Water Development will undertake a review as well as facilitate the implementation of various programmes regarding the use of alternative sources of energy.

Madam Chairperson, in the petroleum sub-sector, the Government, in 2010, achieved significant progress in stabilising the national fuel supply, especially during the time of the Indeni Refinery shut down which was due to the annual maintenance which is currently going on.

During the same period, the ministry undertook rehabilitation of various storage facilities at the Ndola Fuel Terminal. In 2011, the Government will continue with the rehabilitation and construction of fuel storage depots countrywide to mitigate fuel shortages as well as consolidate the implementation of the uniform petroleum pricing mechanism that was initiated in 2010.

Madam Chairperson, the Government is cognisant of the fact that all fossil fuels in the country are imported and that this poses a huge strain on the country’s meagre foreign exchange resources. Therefore, in 2011, the Ministry of Energy and Water Development plans to undertake various awareness campaigns on the production and use of bio-fuels in the country. The Government also intends to announce the bio-fuels blending ratios, in the industry soon.

Energy Management

Madam Chairperson, energy management is a more effective use of energy resources. It allows energy to be freed and made available for other uses without any further investments. Energy efficient practices seek to reduce energy consumption without sacrificing productivity or, indeed, increasing costs. Therefore, in 2011, the Government will continue to raise public awareness on the need to use energy efficiently and also on alternative energy sources and saving technologies and techniques.

 Water Sector

Madam Chairperson, the role of the water sector is to optimally harness and manage water resources for the efficient, equitable and sustainable utilisation of this natural resource to enhance economic productivity and wealth creation.

In order to facilitate best practices in the management and development of the county’s water resources, the Government approved the National Water Policy in February, 2010. The policy has further provided a platform for the enactment of the Water Resources Management Bill that aims at repealing the Water Act of 1949. Once enacted, the Bill will provide for the equitable utilisation of water resources as well as sustainable protection, preservation, conservation, management and development of the resource and its ecosystems.

In 2010, the Ministry of Energy and Water Development carried out the following programmes:

(i) water resource infrastructure development;

(ii) ground water resource development; and

(iii) ground water development for trachoma.

Management of the water resources shall take into account catchment management of water resources, stakeholder consultation and involvement, assessment, monitoring, water conservation and preservation for its acceptable quality and quantity and efficient and equitable water allocation to all users and disaster preparedness, including climate change in 2011.

Madam Chairperson, the key priority projects that will be undertaken in 2011 in the water sector will take into account adaptation to climate change for effective water resources management. Major programmes under water resources infrastructure development will include:

 Construction and Rehabilitation of Dams

The Ministry of Energy and Water Development, through the Department of Water Affairs, will construct five small multi-purpose dams in the Luena Farm Block in Kawambwa, Chongwe, Choma, Nakonde and Chipata to increase access to water for irrigation. Sixty-two dams are earmarked for maintenance in various parts of the country for improved safety and efficient operation. This will contribute to increased access to water for irrigation, fisheries, water supply and consumption, conservation, tourism and any other users.

Ground Water Development for Mitigation against Drought or Floods, Cholera and Trachoma

The Ministry of Energy and Water Development will construct ninety boreholes in drought, flood and trachoma-prone areas in the Eastern, Lusaka, Central, Luapula, Northern and North-Western provinces. Further, additional boreholes will be drilled to address emergency situations.

Construction of Ground Water Monitoring Boreholes

Madam Chairperson, this programme will be aimed at facilitating the assessment of ground water potential as well as water resources mapping in order to provide information for sustainable ground water management and development.

Ground Water Development for Strategic Institutions

This programme will seek to address water demand in strategic institutions, including schools, rural health centres and chiefs’ palaces, in order to increase access to safe drinking water. Under this programme, a total of eighty boreholes will be drilled countrywide.

Climate Change

The ministry will implement climate change initiatives meant for the development of practical options for adaptation to climate change in water resources.

Water Resources Management

Under this programme, the Ministry of Energy and Water Development will undertake, among others, the following activities:

(i) water resources management and information systems;

(ii) water resources quality assessment and monitoring;

(iii) rehabilitation; and

(iv) maintenance of hydrological stations as well as issuance of water rights.

Madam Chairperson, I, therefore, wish to appeal to this august House to support my ministry’s 2011 estimates which amount to K386,718,658,099.

 I thank you, Madam Chairperson.

 Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chongo (Mwense): Madam Chairperson, I would like to thank you for giving me this opportunity to debate on this Vote.

Madam Chairperson, from the outset, I would like to thank the hon. Minister of Energy and Water Development for answering the call of the people of Mwense Constituency and Chief Lubunda’s area in particular, where a bus station and market were recently electrified under the Rural Electrification Authority (REA). I would like to thank the hon. Minister in person because of his input as well as the staff at theREA. May I be allowed to express my gratitude to one person from theREA by the name of Mr Serenje who is the head at that institution.

Madam Chairperson, this is a densely populated area which, for many years, has remained without electricity except one school. It is for this reason that the Chief organised people to, at least, celebrate this achievement.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chongo: They also wanted me to officiate at this celebration but, unfortunately, because of the equally important assignments that I have here, I was unable to go. Anyhow, I said that I was so grateful that they had shown that gesture to me. I also said I did not want to receive the credit of this development alone, but to indicate to them that this is the work of the Government …

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chongo:… because it has realised that  people need development.
 
Mr Chongo: It is not only the bus station and market that have been electrified, but also the local court which is nearby, a cottage which is under the Ministry of Tourism, Environment and Natural Resources and the surrounding houses. Therefore, I would like to say thank you to this Government.

 Hon Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chongo: Madam Chairperson, I have to say thank you because it has answered the call of development. Of course, it is its responsibility, but it has answered the people’s call. I need to thank the Government because it is not only this area that requires this facility, but many other areas and some of them may rank higher in priority than these ones. This is the reason for which I would like to thank this Government.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chongo: Madam Chairperson, I appreciate what the ministry and the REA has done in distributing REMP to all Members of Parliament. However, I personally wish to indicate that this master plan is a very difficult booklet to comprehend. I would have loved the issues in the booklet to be simplified so that we know which areas should be electrified at what time. The way it stands in this plan, at the moment, indicating which project takes priority, may not give a proper meaning. This is all I can say about the REA.

Madam Chairperson, the other point I wish to talk about is the fact that Luapula Province has the potential to grow. This province has a lot of natural resources which include minerals. However, to exploit these minerals, the people in this province need power. It is an undeniable fact that Luapula does not have sufficient power to enable it to exploit these resources.

The people of Luapula Province appreciate the many projects that this Government is undertaking such as upgrading the stretch from some point in Serenje to Kasama and the intention to connect the power line into Luapula. However, we, the people of Luapula, feel that this will take longer than if the ministry connected Luapula through the Pedicle stretch from Luano Power Station in Chingola. I, therefore, appeal to the ministry to reconsider and take this route. People in Luapula Province also want to develop and come to the level where other provinces have reached. This is what I can say about this issue.

Madam Chairperson, on water development, hon. Minister, I wish to say that the people of Luapula Province appreciate the efforts that this ministry is making in this area by sinking a number of boreholes and carrying out other water-related activities. Luapula Province has been disadvantaged on access to clean drinking water. If you see the large water bodies, you would think that is clean water available for people to drink. However, that is dirty water that the people drink.

For this reason, we are calling on your ministry to consider sinking boreholes in Luapula. The people of Luapula Province have been denied this facility. Therefore, I wish to appeal to the hon. Minister to consider sinking boreholes for the people of Luapula Province in the 2011 Budget. We have seen areas where this Government has sunk about 6,000 in a province. However, we are not asking for that much but, at least, to start from somewhere.

In general, Luapula Province appreciates the efforts that this Government is making. However, we still have situations where people are complaining that they do not have clean drinking water and this will be an issue that they will be ‘hammering’ on to indicate that this Government is not working. At least, let the people understand that this Government can respond in that aspect.

With these few words, Madam Chairperson, I wish to support the Vote on the Ministry of Energy and Water Development.

I thank you, Madam.

Mr Milupi (Luena): Madam Chairperson, thank you for giving me an opportunity to contribute to this Vote on the Floor.

From the outset, I wish to say that I am in support of this budgetary allocation for this ministry and I note that it has risen from K297 billion, last year, 2010, to a proposed K387 billion for 2011.

Madam Chairperson, any form of energy is the power that drives industrial development and develops the country. Therefore, it is absolutely vital that the right level of planning goes into the development of power and energy systems.

In the recent past, that is, ten to fifteen years back, Zambia has suffered greatly, when those who were mandated to look at the electrical power system went to sleep. Zambia has come from a time where it had electric energy surplus.

I recall, in 1986, this surplus propelled the Government of the day to consider setting up an aluminium smelting plant in co-operation with India. This was on account of the fact that Zambia had excess electricity supply. However, as we liberalised our economy, and there were a lot more industrial outputs, those that should have planned for increased generation capacity went to sleep, and the result was, from an excess situation, we very quickly went into a deficit situation. I hope, hon. Minister, this situation will not recur in future. I hope that the planning of the electricity network will always be ahead of our industrial expansion. I think that is absolutely vital.

Indeed, you saw what was happening and you see what is happening in the country. There are blackouts that generally constrain industrial production in the country. We ought to have known that, as we privatise the mining sector, there would be a need for a lot more power.

Madam Chairperson, in addition to what the ministry is doing and I recognise what you are doing, hon. Minister, in setting up hydro stations all over the country, especially in Itezhi-tezhi and Kafue Lower, as well as increasing the generating capacity at both Kafue Gorge and Kariba North Bank. This is commendable. I only hope that you will quicken this process so that we can get on top of this electrical power deficit that we have.

However, I wish to advise you that in addition to that, there is a need to increase the efficiency of our electricity network. I would like to refer to technical efficiency in the running of the power systems. On operations, the ministry should make sure that we have no interruptions in supply. In order to do that, the technical people need to ensure that the protection systems on our electricity networks are always properly set.

In addition to that, hon. Minister, we need to make sure that the maintenance of our electrical systems from the generation, transmission and distribution sides, is also up to international standards to ensure that we do not have unplanned failure of equipment.

Madam Chairperson, we need more generating capacity in addition to the ones that the ministry is already working on. This country has many sites. It is one area where Zambia can have competitive advantage. It is often said that 60 per cent of the surface water in the Southern African Development Community (SADC) region is in Zambia. Most of that water or a good proportion of that water is in fast-flowing rivers. Since they are fast-flowing, they have potential to have generating sites.

Hon. Minister, as you may be aware, Luapula River alone, has a capacity of 2,000 MW generating capacity. In addition to that, there are many other sites throughout the country that have electricity generating capacity. The ministry must do what is necessary to ensure that these sites are developed. Zambia should be a major exporter of electricity in this region and elsewhere in Africa. This is a competitive advantage that God gave us in addition to the other areas.

The other areas which, hon. Minister, you need to focus on, is our geographical location that has given us a competitive advantage. We are in the centre of Africa and to the north, we have surplus generating countries and to the south and to the east, we have electricity deficit countries. This presents an opportunity for us to engage in setting up international inter-connections between the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) and us to beef up the inter-connection that is there and the one into Zimbabwe, Namibia and Botswana. For example, in East Africa, Tanzania, Kenya, Uganda, Rwanda and Burundi are deficit countries and you know that they are increasing their mining and industrial activities. Therefore, Zambia ought to take advantage of this. The quickest way to do this is to have interconnections between the countries of surplus such as the DRC and Mozambique and the deficit areas. For merely providing those interconnections, Zambia stands to gain a lot of revenue. A lot of calculations have been made and we are talking about substantial amounts of hundreds of millions of dollars and I hope that this will be considered.

Madam Chairperson, in addition to generating revenue, the interconnections will also provide the necessary backup for our electrical system. In case of failure in the generating capacity, we will be able to tap into the resources of the other countries.

Let me now touch on the Rural Electrification Programme which we have often talked about. There is a blueprint from 2006 which your predecessor brought to this House with a proposal that your Government was going to secure a loan of US$500 million in order to fund the Rural Electrification Programme. This is a brilliant idea to efficiently tackle the issue of taking electricity to the people in the rural areas. This project needs substantial amounts of money. It can benefit the poor people in the rural areas in particular.

Madam Chairperson, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what has happened to this plan because that is the surest way of quickly taking electricity to many parts of the country. This would cut down on the very fast deforestation that is taking place in the country and also encourage development in the rural areas. Where there is electricity, the potential to set up factories and other industrial activities increases.

Madam Chairperson, I now come to the petroleum sub-sector of the ministry which is very important. It is time we, as a country, even as our economy is improving – I would like to agree with you so that you do not question me because it is that side of the House that keeps talking about the improvement in the economy. The economy is, indeed, improving and I would like to thank the Government for this.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Milupi: But do not just sit there and say, “Hear, hear”. We should look at what we can do to further improve the economy. We should look at areas from which we can generate high revenue. Taxes rose highly because the economy was not booming. The time has come for this Government to reduce those taxes so that the cost of petroleum products can come down to competitive levels. If we do that, we shall be able to reduce the cost of production in the rest of the sectors and also promote efficiency in our agriculture sector. Zambia needs to be competitive. Further, in order to improve the efficiency of our petroleum sector, we need to improve our procurement process to ensure that we procure transparently because there have been a lot of questions on the procurement of our oil.

Madam Chairperson, there must also be a serious review of the usage and efficacy of the Indeni Petroleum Refinery. It was put up for a specific purpose, but we must ask ourselves, as a country, whether it is still fit for that purpose. Quite clearly, it is probably adding to the cost of production in this country and so, we must review that. Other countries which do not have oil refineries are able to land petroleum products cheaper than we are able to.

Madam Chairperson, we must also look at the oil giant at our doorsteps, Angola, which is producing large amounts …

The Chairperson: Order!

Business was suspended from 1615 hours until 1630 hours.

[THE DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES in the 
Chair]

Mr Milupi: When business was suspended, I was advancing a point on whether using Indeni was the most efficient way of getting petroleum products into the country. In its place, we should consider tapping into the vast oil reserves in Angola. This is a neighbouring country which produces vast quantities of crude oil. When considering this matter, we must think of putting up an oil refinery for the crude oil to come from Angola in Kalabo or Chavuma districts or another part of the North-Western Province so that the product can be refined in the areas which are bordering with Angola. It can then be transported either by pipeline or whatever means to the rest of the country. It is for this reason that I think that those who are questioning the cost involved in constructing the Mongu/Kalabo Road are misguided because that is a national highway.

Before I run out of time, I must commend the Ministry of Energy and Water Development for two things which I do not know whether are happening accidentally or are planned.

Laughter

Mr Milupi: If they are happening by accident, the ministry should nonetheless take the credit. However, if they are planned, I urge the ministry to continue planning in the fashion it has been planning. The first issue relates to the introduction of the uniform pricing of petroleum products. I think that is commendable. We were worried at the time it was being introduced.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Milupi: We thought that it was going to cause fuel shortages in rural areas.

Mr Muchima: Come back, my brother.

Mr Milupi: So far, it is has been running well and there have been no shortages. I am sure people in rural areas are benefiting from this particular measure. The second point relates to the shutdown of the Indeni Oil Refinery. I was one of those who were worried about this and raised a question when the hon. Minister made a ministerial statement in this House. I was worried because if it were in the past, we would have been experiencing shortages. However, this ministry has done a commendable job, so far, and there have not been shortages anywhere in the country.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!{mospagebreak}

Mr Milupi: That is the kind of operation that we want, especially for a very important economic ministry such as the Ministry of Energy and Water Development. Inefficiency in a ministry such as this one impacts negatively on the rest of the economy. I, therefore, think this efficiency must continue.

Finally, let me comment on the ministry’s total budget allocation of over K300 billion. As I said, this is an economic ministry and, therefore, we want it to operate in a manner that contributes directly to non-tax revenues in excess of what it costs to run it. This can be done through some of the things I mentioned in the electrical and petroleum sub-sectors. Doing this will make this ministry a net contributor to the revenues of this country.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Lieutenant-General Shikapwasha: Very good. That is maturity.

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Chairperson, I thank you very much for allowing me an opportunity to discuss the Vote of the Ministry of Energy and Water Development. I want to take some of the words of Hon. Milupi as my own, except for one little concern regarding the uniform pricing of fuel.  While I do subscribe to the fact that this is, indeed, a very good initiative and the hon. Minister must be congratulated because many hon. Members of Parliament who have interest in the energy sector have, for a long time, been talking about trying to standardise the price of fuel, I have a few statistics here which I will lay on the Table once I finish my short debate regarding what I see as the effects of a uniform fuel pricing in this country. I have figures of what is consumed along the line of rail in a period of one month. About 53.6 million litres of fuel worth K4,741,372,736.11 is consumed in one month. The cost of transportation of this fuel to far flung areas stands at more than K1.3 billion per month.

Mr Chairperson, what this means is that there is a surplus of K3.3 billion per month, which will translate into about K36 billion per annum. I would like the hon. Minister to explain to me whether this money is actually recorded in the ministry’s books as profit or used for some other activities in the ministry.

Mr Chairperson, I know that the Government is supposed to implement the Uniform Petroleum Pricing (UPP) mechanism. In the recent past, one of our colleagues asked His Honour the Vice-President and Minister of Justice a question on Friday on whether he was aware about the engagement of the UPP manager and he indicated that he was not aware. I would like the hon. Minister to kindly help me to understand the stage at which we are with regard to the engagement of a UPP manager in this arrangement.

Mr Chairperson, let me move on to other utilities under this ministry and I will start with the REA. I think that we are all in agreement that the REA was also a very good initiative. In 2006, we were given copies of REMP. This master plan has been in existence for four years now. What I would be happy to see from the ministry is, maybe, a bi-annual report on the progress of the REA because  a quarterly one would be asking for too much, so that we can actually appreciate the use, for instance, of the K12 billion that was allocated in the Yellow Book last year.

Mr Chairperson, we have not increased our generation capacity substantially. Against this background, I would like to find out how the ministry is balancing the limited electricity generation capacity against the new areas that have been put on the national grid because they draw from the existing infrastructure and power generated from the Kariba North Bank Power Company (KNBC), Kafue Gorge, Livingstone, Itezhi-tezhi and if you like, the 30 MW power station in Kabwe whose name I have forgotten.

Mr Chairperson, I have a concern regarding the comparison between service delivery and electricity tariffs. We have been told, many times, in this House that the current tariffs that the Zambia Electricity Supply Corporation (ZESCO) charges its consumers are still not cost reflective. While appreciating that fact, I would like to see what plan of action the hon. Minister and his team have in place to balance the two opposing issues. It is a very well-known fact that in the midst of ZESCO trying to put its house in order, we still see a lot of cases of illegal connections or connections of infrastructure that does not qualify or has illegally been built. We raised this question when we were dealing with the issue of sanitation dams in Garden Compound and how ZESCO manages to actually open legal accounts for illegal structures.

Mr Chairperson, I would like to speak a little on Programme 3, Activity 04 – Office for Promoting Private Power Investment – K2,063,200,000 on page 117. Year after year, there have been allocation of monies to this office which is under the Ministry of Energy and Water Development. While appreciating the existence of this office,

I am very interested in knowing from the hon. Minister what, exactly, is happening at the Itezhi-tezhi Hydro Power Station because, in 2006, the late President Mr Levy Mwanawasa, SC. officiated at a signing ceremony of an engagement between Tata Power Company and ZESCO. At this ceremony, we were told that works to construct the Itezhi-tezhi Power Station were going to begin. As things stand now, we all know that the Itezhi-tezhi Power Station to-be has had its dam since, probably, mid 1973, I stand to be corrected. Why have four years gone by without works taking place? What is the actual status of the relationship between Tata and ZESCO? Why has it taken so long for the works to begin? Even if you took a trip to Itezhi-tezhi now, you would see that there is no activity taking place on site. If at all there is any activity taking place on site, then it should have begun a month and a half ago. I was there not so long ago and there was nothing to indicate that some machines were going to start working on that site. There is nothing to show that some works will be carried out on that site. It is just still a very attractive place to go to.

Mr Chairperson, I would also like to submit that as the hon. Minister said, energy is a catalyst and engine of …

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Hon. Members, I think the House is becoming a little noisier and it is difficult for me to listen to the person who is debating. You may consult, but do so quietly.

The hon. Member may continue.

Mr Nkombo: Mr Chairperson, I agree with what the hon. Minister said that energy is a driver to socio-economic development. In agreeing with him, I would also want to say that it is of utmost importance that the issue of coming up with alternative energy resources is seriously looked into. I would like to say that we appreciate the Government’s stance of eliminating import duty on all alternative sources of energy such as solar systems, liquefied industrial cooking gases and diesel generators.

I would like the hon. Minister to go a mile further by considering the removal of Value Added Tax (VAT) on all alternative sources of energy. My argument is supported by what the hon. Minister said in his statement regarding the effects of climate change which, as we discuss on a daily basis, is partly caused by the heavy dependence on firewood by the rural population. It is true that now that we have entered the rainy season, the arbitrary cutting down of trees is going to escalate. I must also mention here that the cutting down of trees is one of the drivers of the negative effects of climate change. I hope that I am making sense to the hon. Minister. The Government should agree to zero rate the tax on gas stoves with regard to its inland revenue collection measures so that if I go into Radian Stores, I should be able to buy a solar geyser without paying VAT. In this way, the Government would, in the long run, be mitigating the effects of climate change directly.

Mr Chairperson, I have a lot of respect for the hon. Minister and he is somebody who is very close to me outside this House. I treat him with respect because he is older than me. To drive my next point home, let me use an illustration. If you are in a boxing ring with a teenager and you are, for instance, the age of my uncle, Lieutenant-General Shikapwasha, you do not hold back when fighting. You fight by the boxing rules. If you are a bantamweight, you are only supposed to fight with people in that category regardless of your age. The same rules apply to a heavyweight boxer. Once you are given advice, Hon. Konga, you should not stand up and say that you deserve to be respected on account of age. The reason the people of Mazabuka Central gave me a vote to come here is that they want to see this country develop. They gave me a vote …

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Hon. Member, you are now quarrelling with the hon. Minister who is seated silently listening to you. Will you just continue with the way you have been debating.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hammer!

Mr Nkombo: Mr Chairperson, I appreciate your guidance. What I would like to put across is that when we, on your left hand side, are giving advice to those on the right hand side, it should not, even for a second, dawn upon them that on account of age, they cannot be advised. You must check in the Bible what happened to Goliath when he had an encounter with David.

Hon. Opposition Members: Correct!

Mr Nkombo: In Tonga, we have a saying that maanu alazwa mukasuumbwa. This means that even from an anthill, you can pick something. This is not time to outdo one another. I would like the hon. Minister to understand that I still take issue with the decision to give a potential power station to a milling company by the name of Olympic Milling. I think that is a matter that needs to be explained to this House. We need to know how far Olympic Milling has gone in its efforts to develop this power station that was given to them against all odds, that is, despite an established power company from Kabwe North having also pushed in its bid. I will not rest until you give us the reason the power company with a history in power generation failed to win the bid to run the power station. I am sure the hon. Minister knows what I am talking about.

Mr Chairperson, I would like to thank you more sincerely for having given me the opportunity to contribute to the debate on the Floor of this House. Before I conclude, let me emphasise that, if you are in a wrestling game, you must play by the rules. If you are in a boxing game, you must also play by the rules. You cannot expect someone to apply rugby rules when playing netball. Being in this House is all about the game of advising one another. When the people on your right are being advised, they must not, even for a second, start saying that elders must be respected.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Nkombo laid the paper on the Table.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu (Monze Central): Mr Chairperson, I rise to reluctantly support the Vote for the Ministry of Energy and Water Development. I say so taking into account what has transpired in the Southern Province in terms of water development and rural electrification.

Mr Chairperson, I have been in this House for the last nine years and I will be coming back for another five years and then another five years, which will make it twenty. Maybe, at that time, I will decide to retire.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Chairperson, we had been informed by the MMD Government that we are going to embark on a programme to construct dams in drought-prone areas such as the Southern, parts of the Eastern and Lusaka provinces. Alas, to date, no dams have been built to mitigate the effects of the droughts that have been ravaging those parts of the country. It is also on record that the former President of the Republic of Zambia, His Excellency Levy Patrick Mwanawasa, SC. announced to this House that the Government was going to undertake massive irrigation projects in Zambia. Those projects were supposed to come up as a result of the development of water bodies in these drought-prone areas.

Unfortunately, as I speak right now on behalf of Monze Central Constituency, there is no dam that has been constructed that can be used for irrigation. You are all aware that the people of the Southern Province thrive on ranching and to undertake it, you need water. In most of these areas, there is no adequate water that can support ranching to date. We are appealing to the Government to positively discriminate in our favour, considering that we are living in a drought-prone area. We are aware of provinces where more than 6,000 boreholes have been drilled. One of my colleagues, at one time, said that they were even drilling boreholes in dams and lakes to the detriment of people who are living in drought-prone areas.

Mr Chairperson, we, the people of Southern Province, are appealing to the Government to consider allocating a large number of boreholes to that area. The House is aware that most of the people, especially in the lower parts or valleys of the Southern Province, were displaced from areas where they could easily access water and are now living in upper lands where there is virtually no water. They are suffering and being inconvenienced after having paved way for the construction of the Kariba Dam. I appeal to the Government to give priority to those areas with regard to the provision of water.

Apart from the issue of the provision of water, Mr Chairperson, I would like to talk about rural electrification. I appreciate and take note that my friends have been praising the Ministry of Energy and Water Development for providing electricity in various constituencies, but I would like to speak on behalf of Monze Central Constituency. As far as I am concerned, in the last ten years, there has been no project undertaken by the REA in Monze Central Constituency. I can also safely speak for my colleagues representing Moomba Constituency on the eastern part of Monze and ...

Mr Mooya: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: ... Bweengwa Constituency. There has not been any electricity projects in any of those areas for a long time now. Why are we being discriminated against when we know that most of the people in our areas were displaced in order to give way for the construction of the Kariba and Itezhi-tezhi dams? The people who were displaced in order to give way for those projects are not benefiting much in terms of electricity. Therefore, I appeal to the Government to consider these people because they also want electricity in these areas.

Mr Chairperson, I would also like to talk about the issue of charcoal burning in this country. I know that a number of people condemn charcoal burning in this country. I appreciate that, but those who condemn charcoal burning should also appreciate the fact that people have no alternative, but to burn logs and use charcoal. Therefore, I appeal to the Government to ensure that it provides alternative means of generating power in their homes. I know that in other countries, they manufacture coal briquettes in order for them to be used in homes for cooking. I think this is one measure that can be undertaken by the Government if it wants to mitigate against the deforestation and bad weather patterns that affect this country. I have no doubt in my mind that if the Government undertook this project, all of us would be in a position to support it. Unfortunately, time is running out for it to undertake this project.

Hon. UPND Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: It will be done when we come into Government. Since they will be in the Opposition, next time, we will appeal to them to support the noble project of making coal briquettes in this country.

Mr Chairperson, I would also like to appeal to the hon. Minister of Energy and Water Development to ensure that incentives are given to those who would like to establish filling stations in rural areas. I know that you have decided to have uniform prices in both rural and urban areas. However, even if that has been done, very few filling stations will be springing up in the rural areas because it is difficult to establish a filling station in the rural area. I have in mind places such as Liuwa where I know one colleague is aspiring to be an hon. Member of Parliament. It will be difficult to establish a filling station there without any incentives. It is advisable that we give incentives to these people who will be establishing filling stations in those areas.

Finally, Mr Chairperson, I would like to appeal to the hon. Minister of Energy and Water Development to consider rural areas in Zambia in terms of electricity provision. We are all aware that in the rural areas, there are a number of public workers who are living in conditions of squalor which are not suitable for the type of work they are doing. If we provided electricity in these rural areas, the rural-urban migration would be reduced. The complaints from Mpulungu where civil servants have been rising against the Government and condemning those who voted for MMD would be a thing of the past if all the good services were provided to those people.

Hon. UPND Member: Correct.

Mr Mwiimbu: Sir, I would like to appeal to the Government to learn a lesson from what has transpired in Mpulungu. The Zambian workers are in need of the services from the Government. If services are not provided, you will be in the Public Gallery next year and not this side.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: This is a timely warning.

With these few remarks, Mr Chairperson, I thank you.

Mrs Masebo (Chongwe): Mr Chairperson, thank you very much for giving me this opportunity to contribute to the debate on the Floor of the House. I will be brief. I have three issues which I shall look at.

Mr Chairperson, first of all, I would like to support the budget for the Ministry of Energy and Water Development. I want to agree with all those who have spoken before me that this is a very important ministry. Apart from the fact that it is an economic ministry, it is also a social ministry because of the services that it is giving to our people.

Mr Chairperson, I would also like to thank the hon. Minister for the dam that shall be constructed in Chongwe. I would like to state that although Chongwe has a number of rivers and streams, we still have difficulties of water and so the construction of a dam is a welcome move.

Sir, let me also join those who have spoken before me in commending this ministry in terms of progress with regard to its projects. I think we all agree that in the last ten years, we have seen a lot of projects in this ministry. We have also seen policy changes that have actually brought about investments that have made the development agenda of this country go in the right direction. However, I just want to say one thing.

The hon. Minister talked about a policy that was recently adopted by the Government. I notice in the budget that there will be some dissemination of information regarding the policy. This is very important because, many a time, we come up with good policies, but  find out that the people who are supposed to benefit from these policies, normally, do not understand what the policies are all about. Therefore, I would like tell the hon. Minister that there is an urgent need for his ministry and the Ministry of Local Government and Housing to harmonise their roles in as far as the function of water supply and sanitation is concerned. The Ministry of Energy and Water Development is the one responsible for implementing the Water Policy, but there are other sub-sectors that deal with issues to do with water supply and sanitation. The hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing informed the House during the policy debate regarding his ministry that the Government has come up with a national approach to deal with issues of water supply and sanitation in the rural and urban areas.

I am aware that the Government has already developed the policy on the national rural water supply and sanitation. The K555 billion in the budget is co-funded by donors and the Zambian Government. I stand to be corrected but, probably, only K55 billion of that amount is from the Government while the rest is from donors. That money is based on agreed programmes in the sub-sector of water supply and sanitation.

Sir, I notice, in the Budget, that the Ministry of Energy and Water Development is earmarked to carry out certain functions that it should not. For example, there is a vote on the Water Supply Department where the ministry plans to drill boreholes in institutions such as schools and chiefs’ palaces. There are actually two votes under that department.

Mr Chairperson, in fact, that department is only supposed to drill boreholes for issues relating to water resource management. If it digresses from its major function and begin to carry out functions of another department, it will just create confusion.

Mr Chairperson, I would also like to draw the hon. Minister’s attention to the issue of the regulator. Under the policy, the regulator is supposed to be in the line ministry. For example, you have the Energy Regulation Board (ERB) in the Ministry of Energy and Water Development, which regulates issues of fuel. In the same way, there is the Technical Education, Vocational and Entrepreneurship Training Authority (TEVETA) in the Ministry of Science, Technology and Vocational Training, which regulates technical and vocational training. According to the policy that we have adopted, there is supposed to be harmonisation of functions under the ministries of Energy and Water Development and Local Government and Housing. If we do not do that, the people who are supporting our country programmes will think that we are not focused and, therefore, not serious because we say one thing and do another.

I know that the hon. Minister is cognisant of these issues and this is just a mere reminder to him in the hope that something can be done about this. This is because, simple as it may seem, it creates a lot of confusion when it comes to the implementation of programmes that the Government has developed.

Mr Chairperson, another important point regards the issue of damming in my constituency. Chongwe has a number of rivers which used to be filled with water throughout year, but when you go downstream, today, you discover that it is no longer the case. The villagers have no access to water from the main rivers such as the Chalimbana and Chongwe because the rivers have been dammed.

Mr Chairperson, we acknowledge that damming is a good thing, but the regulator, which is under the Ministry of Energy and Water Development, needs to be given capacity to ensure that the people who have constructed dams, at some point, let the water flow so that the villagers can continue to enjoy the water that God gave them.

 In the years past, there was so much water in the rivers, all the time, such that even if there were no boreholes, the people were able to survive on water from the rivers. Currently, we do not have enough boreholes and the natural sources are drying up not because there is no water, but because certain people hold on to the water throughout the year at the expense of the villagers.

I would like the hon. Minister to help us in Chongwe as this is a very serious matter. You will be shocked by the amount of water held by some of these farms if you were to visit them. The amount of water is like that of the Zambezi River. You will not believe that you are in Chongwe, and yet when you go to the end of the stream, there is no water. The rivers are dry.

Mr Chairperson, the other point related to the first issue I raised regards the supervision of the water utility companies. At the moment, there is a problem of lack of efficient supervision by the relevant ministry because the information is not housed under that ministry, but another one.

Whilst I acknowledge that the National Water Supply and Sanitation Council (NWASCO) is doing a commendable job, I hasten to say that the commendable job is not being efficiently utilised by the relevant ministry which is the Ministry of Local Government and Housing because of this structural problem which I have asked the hon. Minister to look into.

Mr Chairperson, lastly, I would like to address the issue of electricity bills. I noticed that most of the sector ministries have budgeted for electricity and water bills. That is a positive step. You may recall that, in the past, we had no budget line for utility companies. At the moment, all the institutions actually budget for electricity and water bills which is good indeed.

However, there is still a problem between the water utility companies and ZESCO as regards electricity bills. I know that there is an issue whereby the water utility companies still fail to pay electricity bills to ZESCO. Therefore, again, the hon. Minister must come in and work with his colleague in the Ministry of Local Government and Housing because this is a serious problem regarding the water utility companies and it is affecting the provision of water to the communities.

Mr Chairperson, if Hon. Hachipuka, who is an accountant, was to audit some of these institutions, he would recommend their closure. However, because they are all Government institutions, we turn a blind eye to some of these issues. If we were to ask water utility companies to pay water bills, they would not afford it because there is also the …

Hon. Shakafuswa: Electricity bills.

Mrs Masebo: If we were to ask them to pay electricity bills, they would not afford to because the bills are very high. This is in addition to the high cost of chemicals which they import as there is no tax rebate on chemical importation.

Sir, again, these are the issues that the hon. Ministers of Finance and National Planning, Energy and Water Development and Local Government and Housing must seriously look into if we have to improve the delivery of water and electricity.

 Sir, if all Government institutions paid their electricity bills, ZESCO would have enough resources. This is why I commend the fact that most Government institutions have budgeted for utility bills.

Mr Chairperson, the point I was trying to bring out is that there is a relationship problem that needs to be addressed by the relevant hon. Ministers in order for all these companies to be efficient. Zambian companies fail to be efficient because of the way they are administered. We, as a Government, actually make our own institutions suffer. That is why, for example, the Zambia Telecommunications Company (ZAMTEL) was in trouble. It was mainly because we were not paying the bills.

Mr Chairperson, there is a need to ensure that ZESCO is paid its bills by the water utility companies and the other relevant institutions of the Government must help the utility companies by paying their water bills. The importation of chemicals and import duties  must also be looked at to make water affordable.

I thank you, Sir

Mr Kambwili: Naumona umunobe namfyenga.

Laughter

Mr Konga: Mr Chairperson, I thank all the hon. Members who have overwhelmingly supported the Vote for the Ministry of Energy and Water Development, except for Hon. Jack Mwiimbu, whom I have observed is not in the House, but should have been in the House so that I can respond to his queries.

Lieutenant-General Shikapwasha: Shame!

Mr Konga: Hon. Chongo, I am grateful and take note that REMP is very technical. We will find ways of simplifying it to enable people to understand it.

Mr Chairperson, I would also like to assure him and the people of the Luapula Province, on whose behalf he is speaking, that the Government is committed to facilitating the development of the energy infrastructure in the Luapula Province to enable the natural resources, which are abundant  in that area, to be exploited.

To that effect, I mentioned earlier and the Hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning complemented what I said that the Government, through the private-public partnership (PPP), is working on a programme to connect Mansa to Luano at 330 KV from which lower voltages can be distributed in the province.

Mr Chairperson, despite the huge water volumes in the province, they have not been exploited. This is primarily because of the constrained resource envelope, but we will endeavour to ensure that the water in the area is fully utilised for national development, especially in the development of agriculture.

I am also grateful for the comments that were made by Hon. Milupi. Indeed, it is correct to say that Zambia is sitting at the centre of various energy potentials. As we indicated in our statement, we have embarked on a programme to exploit these resources. It is important that we support the development of interconnectors because this will provide routes through which energy can be exported to regions such as Eastern and Southern Africa that are energy-deficit areas. In the process, we will earn the country the much-needed foreign exchange. These are programmes that are already in the Government’s plan to be implemented.

Mr Chairperson, with regard to the issue of the US$500,000,000 to fund the REA, the Government has repeatedly said that it needs about US$50,000,000, annually, to undertake various rural electrification projects. As witnessed in the 2011 Budget, already, the REA has in excess of US$50,000,000. Therefore, the Government is on course with this programme because even if it were to make US$500,000,000 available, at this stage, there is no capacity to absorb it in the REA. I think US$50,000,000 is what the Government is working at. It will significantly contribute to electrifying the rural areas so that people there can also improve their livelihoods and create wealth in the process.

Sir, petroleum procurement was done in a very transparent manner because bids were publicly advertised and the whole due process of procurement was complied with.

As regards the use and relevance of Indeni vis-à-vis the refining of fuel from Angola, you will recall that the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning advertised in the public and foreign media for expression of interest to undertake studies on which mode of petroleum supply the Government should be involved in. This is the programme which the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning, through the public-private procurement process, is undertaking. Therefore, this programme has already been embarked upon by the Government.

Mr Chairperson, I am very grateful to Hon. Milupi for his very positive observations on thisadministration’s positive contribution to improving the lives of the Zambian people through the Uniform Petroleum Pricing (UPP) Mechanism and …

Mr Milupi: Question!

Laughter

Mr Konga: … the benefits that have accrued to them.

Further, I am also grateful to him for his positive remarks that, for the first time in the recent history of this country, despite the refinery going on an annual maintenance shutdown, there have been petroleum products throughout the country at the same price. Hon. Milupi, I am very grateful for your words.

Mr Chairperson, Hon. Nkombo talked about the effects of the decentralisation of the UPP and the extra monies that are accruing to it. This money will not be used by the ministry. As I indicated in the ministerial statement earlier, these monies are collected by the ERB and go to the Strategic Reserve Fund. It is the money from this fund that could be used to mitigate price changes because, as you may be aware, all the fuels in this country are imported and, often times, the prices on the international market do change while those on the Zambian market remain the same. Therefore, whatever money is raised is not used by the Government, but it goes into the Strategic Reserve Fund to be used for mitigation of price movements and, in future, maybe, even on transport costs.

I have taken note of Hon. Nkombo’s request to have a REA biannual report published and availed to hon. Members. I think this is something that is positive and will be considered by my ministry. Of course, I admit that the delivery of services, especially by ZESCO, are still not up to standard and the Government has directed the board to ensure that ZESCO lives up to the public’s expectations and benchmarks that were set upon by the ERB.

Mr Chairperson, I do not think the relationship between Tata Power Company and ZESCO is in the budget, but let me take this opportunity to talk about it. Indeed, it has taken almost four years for the joint venture to commence works at Itezhi-tezhi and, of course, the Government is concerned about this delay because of the obtaining deficit situation of electrical energy. Therefore, the Government has urged the two parties to conclude their negotiations.

Mr Chairperson, recently, you will recall that the hon. Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry signed an Investment Promotion and Protection Agreement between the Government and the joint venture company that is undertaking the project at Itezhi-tezhi. The project will soon commence and what is remaining now is to have the implementation agreement for the project approved by the Attorney-General and the power purchase agreement whose negotiations are still on-going. Definitely, in the coming year, the project will kick off because the Government is concerned about the need for more energy in the country.

Sir, with regard to awarding the contract to the Olympic Milling, I must, hasten to say that, again, if you go back to the records, you will find that the development of that power station was publicly advertised and, through the bidding process, Olympic Milling was awarded the contract. Therefore, there was nothing underhand about it.

Hon. Mwiimbu was reluctant to support this Vote, but I would like to indicate to him that I mentioned, in my statement, that one of the areas which is going to benefit from dam construction is the Southern Province. In fact, I mentioned a town called Choma and I am sure that it is located in the Southern Province and not in Lusaka Province. Therefore, if it is in the Southern Province, I would like to believe that the province has benefited from the Government’s programme of constructing dams.

Hon. Opposition Members: Where are the dams?

Mr Konga: I am grateful for the observations and note that the people, especially the public servants in the rural areas need to be provided with electrical energy of one form or another. The Government has seriously embarked on a programme to provide electricity either in the form of solar or, indeed, connection to the national grid so that the public officers’ lives are not negatively affected.

Mr Chairperson, I am grateful for Hon. Masebo’s contribution and I have taken note of the concern that some of the activities relating to dams in the constituency are affecting the people. We will take this up with the Water Board to ensure that this matter is rectified. All in all, I am very grateful that all the hon. Members who have spoken on this Vote have supported the estimates of the ministry.

I thank you, Sir. {mospagebreak}

VOTE 13/01 – (Ministry of Energy and Water Development – Headquarters – K344,844,721,607).

Mr Mukanga: Mr Chairperson, on Programme 3, Activity 04 – Office for Promoting Private Power Investment, there has been an increase from K1,267,347,440 to K2,063,200,000. Which private company were they trying to support or what is this amount for?

The Deputy Minister of Energy and Water Development (Mr Imasiku): Mr Chairperson, this provision is required to cater for expenses related to operations of the secretariat of the Office for Promotion of Private Power Investment. The increase is due to the expansion of the structure of the organisation.

Mr Chairperson, I thank you.

Vote 13/01 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

VOTE 13/02 – (Ministry of Energy and Water Development – Energy Department – K7,569,898,271).

Mr D. Mwila (Chipili): Mr Chairperson, I seek clarification on Programme 15, Activity 04 – Promotion of Electricity Generation from Alternative Sources – K531,271,260. Last year, we had K129,800,000 and this year, there is K531,271,260. Would the hon. Minister explain why there is that huge increase in the funding.

Mr Imasiku: Mr Chairperson, this provision will be used to upscale the solar water project being piloted in the public institutions. The provision will also be used to pilot a project that will use solar energy to pump water. The increment is due to the up-scaling of the activity and the need to purchase equipment required for the project.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Vote 13/02 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 13/03 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 13/04 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

VOTE 88 – (Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development – K261,748,495,587).

The Minister of Livestock and Fisheries Development (Mr Machila): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for according me this opportunity to deliver a policy statement on the 2011 Budget for the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development.

Mr Chairperson, the mission of the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development is to facilitate and support the development of a sustainable and viable agriculture sector in order to ensure food security and income generation at household and national levels and to maximise the sector’s contribution to Gross Domestic Product (GDP).

Mr Chairperson, my ministry initiated the implementation of a number of programmes aimed at improving the livestock and fisheries sub-sectors this year. Measures aimed at reducing incidences of livestock diseases such as vaccination campaigns against Foot and Mouth Disease (FMD), Contagious Bovine Pleural Pneumonia (CBPP) and East Coast Fever (ECF) continued in 2010. A total of 27,571 calves were vaccinated against East Coast Fever in the Eastern and Southern provinces. The next round of vaccination will be carried out before the end of this year. The target is to vaccinate, at least, 86,500 calves between the ages of three to eighteen months this year.

Mr Chairperson, on FMD and CBPP, a total of 345,324 cattle have, so far, been vaccinated against FMD whilst vaccination campaigns against CBPP commenced in the Western and North-Western provinces after the ministry received the CBPP vaccine consignment of 500,000 doses from the Botswana vaccine institute respectively. Due to the measures that were put in place by the Government, I am glad to report to the hon. Members of this House that there is a reduction in the number of cases of disease outbreaks reported this year.

Mr Chairperson, the Government has also made progress in establishing livestock disease-free zones. Some of the milestones they have achieved, so far, include, among others, the following:

(i) construction and rehabilitation of four livestock checkpoints at Nkalamabwe, Lusaka West Wood Police Station and at Luangwa and Kafue bridges;

(ii) the upgrading of the Central Veterinary Research Station, through construction and rehabilitation of the office block and laboratories, and the grading of the 10 kilometres stretch of gravel road to the institute;

(iii) purchase of 150 motorcycles, three motor vehicles, spray hoses, solar fridges, post mortem and veterinary kits, mobile crush panes; and

(iv) procurement of two liquid nitrogen processing plants that are being installed at the Central Veterinary Research Institute at Balmoral and also at the National Artificial Insemination Services in Mazabuka which will improve artificial insemination services as well as vaccine transportation.

Mr Chairperson, on tsetse control activities, tsetse and trypanosomiasis surveys were conducted in the 5,000 square km area that was aerial sprayed last year in Shangombo and Senanga districts. The results of these surveys revealed no presence of tsetse flies and no new cases of trypanosomiasis, about one year after the first spray cycle. A tsetse barrier to prevent re-invasion of tsetse flies into this cleared area is being deployed and will be in place before the end of this year.

Further, the servicing of the tsetse barrier in Muyombe, Isoka District, was done twice this year. As you know, this barrier was put in the area when there was an increase in the reported number of sleeping sickness cases in human beings.

Mr Chairperson, the ministry has embarked on revamping livestock breeding centres in order to provide appropriate breeding stock of all livestock species at affordable prices to our needy farmers, especially the smallholders. The ministry has also embarked on a very challenging programme of establishing livestock extension service centres countrywide. This year, the Western, Eastern and Southern provinces received resources for construction of these centres and construction works have since been commenced.

Mr Chairperson, in the fisheries sub-sector, the ministry is mandated to ensure sustainable utilisation of capture fisheries resources and promotion of aquaculture development in Zambia. With funds allocated in the 2010 Budget, my ministry was able to construct staff houses at Itezhi-tezhi, rehabilitate staff houses and market shades at Kazungula and Mambova and rehabilitate staff houses and office blocks at Chiyabi, Siatwinda, Sinazongwe Fisheries Training Centre, Gwembe, Namwala, Mpulungu, Nchelenge, Kaputa and Zambezi. The ministry also managed to procure marine engines for Itezhi-tezhi and Lake Tanganyika.

Mr Chairperson, the ministry’s focus in the 2011 Budget is in line with the strategic focus of the SNDP, which puts emphasis on infrastructure development aimed at enhancing productivity in the livestock and fisheries sub-sectors.

In order to enhance extension service delivery and improve productivity among smallholder farmers in the livestock and fisheries sub-sectors, the ministry has allocated K4.5 billion for the purchase of 150 motorcycles. Resources for livestock production and veterinary services and other related activities have been allocated in all the provinces and districts.

The ministry has also allocated a total of K3.5 billion for tsetse fly eradication. The plan for 2011 is for an aerial spraying operation to be undertaken, covering an area of between 5,000 to 10,000 square km block of the remaining 17,000 square km tsetse-infested area of the Kwando/Zambezi Region, which lies adjacent to the area that was cleared of tsetse flies in 2010.

Mr Chairperson, the establishment of livestock disease-free zones remains one of the key priorities of the ministry. To upscale the activities towards creation of the zone, the ministry has allocated a total of K17.5 billion for disease surveillance, FMD control, stocking of breeding centres, regulation and quality control, establishment of livestock traceability systems and the construction of check points, quarantine centres, a National Artificial Insemination Centre and a Vector Control Centre in the disease-free zones.

To complement these activities, the ministry has allocated the following:

(i) K1.3 billion for construction of breeding centres in the Luapula, Western, Southern, Eastern, North-Western and Copperbelt provinces;

(ii) K9.6 billion for construction and completion of livestock extension service centres in the Southern, Northern, Western, Eastern and North-Western provinces;

(iii) K3 billion for construction and rehabilitation of livestock regional laboratories in Choma, Mongu and Chipata and a fish disease laboratory in Lusaka;

(iv) K3.3 billion for rehabilitation of rundown infrastructure at our fisheries and livestock stations in Chilanga, Mochipapa, Kakumbi, Mongu, Chipata, Ndola, Lukanga, Katete, Misamfu and Mwekera;

(v) K6.3 billion has been allocated to support various research activities in fisheries and livestock at the research stations.

Mr Chairperson, the non-availability of reliable and updated livestock statistics is one of the challenges that the ministry intends to address in 2011. An allocation of K3 billion has been made to facilitate the carrying out of a pilot livestock census to cover a few provinces.

Mr Chairperson, in the fisheries sub-sector, concerns to be addressed in 2011 include, among others, the following:

(i) construction of fish seed centres in Kaoma, Kasempa and Katete;

(ii) rehabilitation and upgrading of Sinazongwe Fisheries Training Centre to college status so that it can handle certificate courses currently offered at Kasaka Fisheries Training Institute;

(iii) rehabilitation of spillway and research/demonstration fish ponds at Mwekera in Kitwe to strengthen investigations and provision of fish seed to fish farmers countrywide;
 
(iv) procurement of 50 motorbikes to enhance extension delivery, monitoring, control and surveillance; and

(v) K1.5 billion has been allocated towards the final payment for purchase of a specialised research vessel.

Mr Chairperson, the long-awaited and anticipated Treasury authority of the Ministry of Finance and National Planning will facilitate employment of extension workers in the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development, thereby improving extension service delivery in the sector.

The ministry appreciates and commends efforts made by its co-operating partners towards the development of the livestock and fisheries sectors. A total of K64.9 billion from our co-operating partners has been allocated in the budget to support fisheries development, animal disease control, livestock infrastructure development, artificial insemination, development of feeding strategies and the performance enhancement activities under the ministry.

Mr Chairperson, with all these measures in place, the livestock and fisheries sub-sectors are poised to contribute directly to poverty reduction through job creation, increased income and food security at household and national levels and, subsequently, increase the sector’s contribution to the GDP.

Mr Chairperson, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to debate this Vote. I will be very brief because I have very few issues to raise.

Mr Chairperson, my first comment is on the Department of Livestock Services in the show grounds. This department is sinking.

Mr Milupi: Hear, hear!

Mr Sing’ombe: It is sinking and the hon. Minister should do something to help the farmers who are being serviced by this department. I am aware that he is doing something, but I would like to emphasise that serious measures be taken to save this department. If you go there now, you will find that most of the shelves are empty, signifying that it is on the verge of collapse.

Secondly, Sir, I would like to comment on branding marks. I am appealing to the hon. Minister to try and decentralise the issuance of the certificates for branding marks. Farmers, especially in my constituency, are suffering. They have to travel all the way to Lusaka just to pick up a form costing K10,000, then go back to village to have the forms signed by the police and the headmen. They then have to bring these forms back to Lusaka for processing. This is a very cumbersome and lengthy procedure. Therefore, I am asking the ministry to consider decentralising the issuance of branding marks and documents. Documents could be obtained from the livestock offices in the districts and then be approved by the headquarters if it is not possible to approve them at the district level.

 Mr Milupi: Hear, hear!

Mr Sing’ombe: Lastly, but not the least, this ministry has concentrated a lot on cattle. What I have observed is that, at the moment, the goat business in Lusaka is very lucrative. I would like to know what the ministry is doing to ensure that they also improve the breed of goats in villages. The breed of local goats is too small and cannot fetch enough money for farmers to sort out their problems. Therefore, we need to find a formula to improve the breed of goats. If you look around the region, our goats are the smallest in size. If you went across to Botswana, you would really admire the breed of goats and wish we had a similar breed and not the one that we have in Zambia. Therefore, let us find a formula to improve the breed because animals are also a beauty. Small goats do not look appealing.

The other issue I would like to talk about is the size of the brand marks.

 Interruptions

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

 Hon. Members, you are consulting too loudly. I can hardly hear the hon. Member who is debating. Please, consult quietly.

The hon. Member may continue.

Mr Sing’ombe: The other concern is also on the issue of branding marks. Currently, there are two sets of brands for animals. The first one is the district branding mark which has been introduced by the Government. It has two letters and something like a number which is not too good. The personalised one carries about two letters and two numbers. It is very difficult to go into the business of hides because the brand marks are too big and occupy a large part of the animal’s skin. Therefore, they should find a formula for reducing the marks. Normally, brand marks are supposed to be put just on the leg, but because of the size, farmers are unable to do that. Instead, they are put right on the front, destroying the skin in the process. Therefore, you cannot deal in hides after having branded your animals. So, they should consider reducing the size of brand marks. Two or one figure or letter is enough for the district rather than giving us big branding marks for both the district and individuals.

 I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

 Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Captain Moono (Chilanga): Mr Chairperson, I would like to thank you for according me this opportunity to debate the Vote on the Floor.

Mr Chairperson, I would like to thank the hon. Minister of Livestock and Fisheries Development for elaborating the activities in his ministry. However, I would like to emphasise that livestock business is more profitable than crop production. This is the reason you find the economies of countries such as Botswana, which has put a lot of emphasis on livestock production, doing better than those of countries such as ours.

 Mr D. Mwila: Hear, hear!

Captain Moono: There is a need to ensure that we embark on a vigorous disease prevention programme in the livestock industry.

Mr Chairperson, most of the diseases in Zambia are tick borne. I am aware that there are airborne diseases that affect animals, but the majority of diseases are tick borne and these have a telling effecting on the economy of this enterprise.

Sir, the method of prevention is very simple because it is all about dipping. Therefore, dipping regularly with chemicals that have the right strength can go a long way in preventing tick-borne diseases.

Interruptions
 
Captain Moono: Unfortunately, worms are not part of the disease that I am talking about. I am talking about tick borne diseases.

Dipping animals with chemicals that have the right strength reduces on the burden of the vaccines you are trying to introduce. In addition, the disease prevention programme will be more effective. I am very disappointed that in your elaborate overview of your programmes, there is no provision for dipping animals which is a very important part of animal disease prevention.

Mr Chairperson, I would also like to bemoan the lack of recapitalisation of the Balmoral Central Veterinary Research Institute which was supposed to produce most of the vaccines in this country. As a farmer, I have been following your disease prevention programme and acquiring of vaccines but, these days, you are importing them. I want to indicate to you that, at one time, in Zambia, the Balmoral Central Veterinary Research Institute used to produce all the vaccines this country required. Therefore, there is a need to recapitalise the research institute so that we can produce the vaccines locally. We have the expertise, but we do not have advanced laboratory technology to produce the vaccines locally.

Mr Chairperson, I would also like to urge the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries and Development to empower the veterinary officers who are in the field. Currently, there is a lot of conflict between the farmers and officers in the sense that when they visit a farm, most often, they are ill-equipped and may not even have basic tools such as a burdizzo castrator veterinary equipment, syringe and nozzle. All this equipment is supposed to be in the kit for officers. Giving them motorbikes is not enough if they do not have drugs and equipment to assist farmers on the spot. Otherwise, the motorbikes are just moving about when there is nothing happening on the ground.

 Mr D. Mwila: Shame!

Captain Moono: Mr Chairperson, I would also like to talk about fish production in Zambia which is another unexploited industry. Actually, this industry can empower a lot of farmers, especially peasant farmers.

 Mr D. Mwila: Hear, hear!

Captain Moono: Mr Chairperson, if you go to the Game and Fisheries departments in Chilanga during the dry season, you will find that most of the fish ponds are dry, and yet fish cannot live on dry land. All you need to do, as a Government, is sink a few boreholes, fill the ponds with water and start breeding fingerlings that can then be planted in fish ponds for farmers to improve them nutritionally and economically. It is very simple and basic.

Mr D. Mwila: Hear, hear!

Captain Moono: Mr Chairperson, I would like the hon. Minister of Livestock and Fisheries Development to seriously look into these issues. When we are debating, here, we sound like we are making public relations arguments, but if one went on site he/she would find that there is actually nothing happening.

Mr D. Mwila: Shame!

Captain Moono: Sir, farming must be taken seriously in Zambia. There will come a time when we will not be able to depend on copper. Hon. Members, are all aware that copper is a wasting asset and the only sustainable and alternative industry is agriculture, livestock and fisheries. It is a very lucrative business if it is properly developed.

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Interruptions

Captain Moono: Mr Chairperson, the other issue I would like to talk about is on the identification of animals. I would like the ministry to consider modern methods of animal identification. Branding is one of them, but I think it is not proper in this era to restrict farmers to branding. There are latest methods of identifying animals such as the transponder.

Mr Lumba: Hear, hear! Mwa imvela iyo!

Captain Moono: Identification of animals can be computerised. In countries such as Botswana, farmers have stopped using this backward and a little primitive method of branding.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Captain Moono: The hon. Minister is privileged to visit that country and see for himself.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Captain Moono: As my colleague has already mentioned, this outdated method injures the animal and reduces the value of the hide.

Mr Lumba: Captain!

Captain Moono: For this reason, I wish to urge the hon. Minister to move away from the branding method and consider new methods such as computerising the livestock industry. This way, it will help control the movement of animals. If an animal has been taken to an abattoir, its origin can easily be traced and the people in charge of this system will know whether the farmers have used illegal methods or not.

Currently, the roadblocks that are set up to control the movement of livestock, particularly cattle, are at points that everyone knows. Sometimes, farmers want to fetch a higher price for their animals. So, they deviate and avoid these roadblocks. Animals are ferried and slaughtered in Lusaka, spreading diseases in the process.

Mr Lumba: You see now!

Captain Moono: These problems can be minimised if the identification of livestock was computerised.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Lumba: Ya, this Captain!

Captain Moono: Mr Chairperson, with regard to the fish ban, I would like to appeal to the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development to seriously lift the fishing ban. In Zambia, the fishing ban is mostly from December to January. However, we should be cognisant of the fact that most of this fish and the waters are not only in Zambia, but are shared with countries such as the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC), Tanzania, Burundi and Zimbabwe. Now, if you enforce a fishing ban in Zambia while the other countries have not, what you are doing is just depriving your own citizens of income and allowing other countries to benefit and exploit the resources.

Hon. Opposition members: Hear, hear!

Captain Moono: As you may be aware, Sir, fish is not stagnant, it moves and swims in water. Therefore, there is no fish in Lake Tanganyika that has a P. O. Box Zambian number. It moves from Zambia to Burundi. Unless we are able to …

Interruptions

Hon. Member: P. O. Box Zambia!

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Hon. Members, do not do that. There is only one person debating. Please, allow him to debate.

You can continue, please.

Mr D. Mwila: Hammer!

Captain Moono: Mr Chairperson, similarly, the Zambezi River passes through many other countries.

Mr D. Mwila: Hear, hear!

Captain Moono: If there is no effective fishing ban in other countries, it is meaningless to impose a fishing ban in Zambia. You are just depriving your citizens of a good nutrition, economy and life.

Interruptions

Captain Moono: Maybe, we enjoy seeing our people suffering during the period of Christmas, especially those who depend on fishing for their livelihood.

However, I wish to urge the hon. Minister to take a proactive approach and engage other countries that we share these water resources with so that when there is a fishing ban here, it extends to all the other countries that we share the common water resources with.

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Captain Moono: Mr Chairperson, I thank you.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chimbaka (Bahati): Mr Chairperson, thank you for affording me an opportunity to contribute to the debate on the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development.

From the outset, I wish to support the Vote. I just wish to emphasise a few points, especially that I am one of the fish people and the Chairperson knows that.

Laughter

Mr Chimbaka: We are the fish people just like Hon. Mabenga.

Laughter

Mr Chimbaka: Sir, we are happy that the Government thought well to separate the Ministry of Agriculture and Co-operatives from the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development. We have noted that there is a slight increase in the appropriation which, to some extent, will go some way towards realising the objectives of the ministry and Government in general.

As someone who grew up in a fishing province, I wish to emphasise that the fishing ban must be seriously addressed. The people living along the Luapula River appreciate the ban to allow the fish to breed.

Hon. Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Chimbaka: December to March is the period when fish breeds. Once the fish is disturbed, it will deplete and will not have time to lay eggs, fertilise them and have new species. Therefore, it is very important that the fish ban is emphasised to allow fish to breed and restock.

Mr Chairperson, I wish to say that the Government has been very categorical in pronouncing that it has, on its cards, a programme to restock the water bodies such as …

Hon. Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Chimbaka: … lakes Bangweulu and Mweru. It is a fact that fish has depleted in these water bodies and, therefore, we are looking forward to a time when the hon. Minister of Livestock and Fisheries Development will come to Luapula Province and ensure that the water bodies are restocked with fish to allow the people of Luapula Province sustain their livelihoods.

Mr Chongo: Hear, hear!

Mr Chimbaka: It is very important.

Mr Chairperson, the Luapula River stretches from Mpika through Serenje to Lake Mweru and Lualaba River. In all these areas, people are fish mongers and have solely depended on fish for ages. Therefore, on behalf of the people of Luapula, I wish to say that we are waiting for a time when the hon. Minister of Livestock and Fisheries Development will come with us to Luapula and celebrate the fish restocking exercise. The people of Luapula are looking forward to that day. They know that you are a Government that fulfils its promises.

Hon. Government Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Chimbaka: In Chipili Constituency, there is the Mwenda Fish Camp, which is a fisheries nursery that has been there for a long time. The fish camp in Mwenda needs to be expanded because that is where the fish fingerlings that are distributed to the farmers in Luapula Province come from.

Sir, I am one of the people who have seen this camp develop since I worked as head teacher in Mwenda. We tried to develop it, to some extent, because I have a passion for fishing.

Hon. Minister of Livestock and Fisheries Development, I wish to appeal to you that you will never go wrong in Luapula if you expand the Mwenda Fish Camp Nursery because the people from Luwingu, Kaputa and Mporokoso depend on that nursery to get fish for restocking their ponds. The other nursery is in my constituency at Fiongoli. I would like the hon. Minister to expand that nursery so that the people of Luapula, who are diversifying at present in terms of fish breeding, can easily access fish. That will not be a wrong move.

Mr Chairperson, I would now like to look at something that is equally important. There once used to be Chishinga State Ranch. When Hon. Muntanga was there, he worked hard in the field of breeding and grooming. The people want the ministry to address the issues of breeding and grooming. The allocation for Kawambwa and Mansa for the two issues to be addressed is small and I hope that the ministry will prioritise the fact that it needs to move in and help them in that regard. Just as Mbesuma Ranch is being restocked, the people would also like to see Chishinga State Ranch become alive through restocking it as a starting point. The people of the Luapula Province are pastoralists because they have the best savannah grasslands stretching from Serenje.

Mr Chairperson, those who have driven from Serenje to Luapula, have seen very good plains with very good grass, comparable only to those found in Namwala. The Government should go an extra mile in stocking the plain with animals because it is a disease-free zone and stock theft is unheard of in that area because the people there have realised that once they have these animals, they will have a dependable source of livelihood. Long gone are the days when people believed that we are just interested in eating the animals and not taking care of them. When you go to Chifunabuli, you will see the beauty of the plain in Kafungo area and animals freely walk around. Nobody goes there to steal animals because we do not have a history of stock theft in Luapula Province. People from that province are generally not thieves.

Mr Chairperson, in the Kashikishi area, you will find green grass as well as fertile lagoons and animals grazing freely without anybody disturbing them. The things I have asked for are what the people of Luapula want you to do for them and I know that you shall do them.

Mr Chairperson, animals are a big source of hides. In Zambia, if we are to grow the shoe industry, we need to develop the hide production industry. I have conducted research regarding the production of hides because I have a small company which manufactures boots and sandals. I have interacted with a lot of people who deal in hides, including those from South Africa. Those from South Africa asked me what we were doing, as a country, with the fact that we produce the best hides in Africa. Hon. Minister, together with your colleague in the Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry, you should know that there are people who are exporting our valuable hides without the Government getting any tax from them because we have done very little to recognise the fact that we have the best hides in Africa.

Mr Chairperson, I would now like to talk about animal hooves. I urge the Government to help people who keep animals to diversify their product range. Hooves are a very good source of fertiliser. If you go to the Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia (NCZ) in Kafue, the experts will confirm to you that hooves are a very good ingredient in fertiliser manufacturing. The use of hooves in the manufacturing of fertiliser would lead to a reduction in the cost of production.

Mr Chairperson, with these few remarks, I want to say that I welcome and support the budget but, next week, I want to see animal restocking in Luapula Province. I even wrote to you, hon. Minister, to inform you that I was planning to use the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) to buy livestock because I want to lead by example. I know you will assist me in this venture by helping me to look for the animals.

I want to spend part of the K600 million from the CDF to procure animals for the people in Luapula Province because they are ready for the project.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Matongo (Pemba): Mr Chairperson, I would like to congratulate the Government on creating the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development. I hope that the zones that have been created by the ministry for export purposes will soon be operational.

Secondly, I would like to state that livestock and fisheries are a source of good food for the people. The people of Pemba would like to eat fish even though they do not have a big river in their area. I am also sure that the people of Luapula would like to eat beef which we have in abundance. I happen to know Samfya and Pemba extremely well because a marriage had taken place between the people of the two places.

Mr Chongo: Yes, bamulamu.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Matongo: Having stated that, I would like the hon. Minister to understand that if he really means to increase the number of cattle in cattle-rearing areas and to rejuvenate the fish industry, he needs to invest in both areas. It is not reasonable, in the name of cattle restocking, to give one cow to a group of so many people or to many villagers. We have been advising this Government to implement the restocking exercise properly. The people of Pemba would be happy to be provided with a loan arrangement of about three to five cows, depending on the recommendations of the local people, especially, the village headmen and chiefs because they know which people are really involved in cattle rearing. A particular area can be zoned off and the people in that area can be given up to fifteen cows.

When you have twenty heifers, you only need one bull and when you have forty heifers, you need two bulls. Therefore, you can zone the villages in such a way that the bull which is the seed among the cows is well taken care of. That is how cattle financing programmes succeeded in the Southern Province.  

Mr Chairperson, it does not help to think that when this cow reproduces, after an eighteen months gestation period, the offspring should be given to so and so and that when it next produces another group should be given that offspring. Let me advise that this is a longer process of cattle restocking. What we are saying is that we should pick villages and give them reasonable numbers and in those numbers, there should be bulls. After three to five years, you could even charge the people for the animals that you gave them and the end result will be that the sale of one animal will be paying for three. That is how these things work. I do not have the formula for fish production and restocking, but I have the one for cattle restocking which is the one I am prescribing to the hon. Minister.

Mr Chairperson, let me now move to disease control. If Botswana and Zimbabwe have controlled animal diseases, what is making it difficult for the hon. Minister and my good Government there to control diseases in the Western and Southern provinces …

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

Business was suspended from 1815 hours until 1830 hours.

[THE DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON in the
 Chair]

Mr Matongo: Sir, let me explain the gestation period because I think there is considerable misunderstanding of what it means. The gestation period for a heifer, which gets pregnant when it is about fifteen to eighteen months, is nine months. This means that if it produces a calf, which is weaned off immediately, within twenty to twenty-one months, it could have two calves. However, if a farmer uses the traditional or Keembe method, a herd takes longer to increase because the calves have to suck from their mothers for some time.

Mr Chairperson, there is also what I call the ‘financial gestation’ period. For example, a neighbour would give me a heifer on condition that when it reproduces, I have to give the calf to my neighbour. This kind of restocking is indefinite and extremely difficult to make viable because in five years, I would even be lucky to have three or four calves, depending on which method of weaning I am using. That is the logic I am trying to put across regarding how this system works.

Therefore, I am saying to the hon. Minister that the cattle restocking which is taking place in my district, Choma, or in the entire Southern Province is not effective or sustainable. Hence, it is better that some sort of cattle financing system is put in place whereby a young person, for example, could get twenty heifers and a bull as a loan. These heifers should be around fifteen to eighteen months old and the bull must be ready for reproduction. The farmer can be guaranteed that within a year, these twenty heifers will all have calves. Within two to three years, there will be a herd of cattle and the farmer will be capable of paying back the loan. By the time the bull is removed to stop – what is that they do?

Mr Sejani: Incest.

Mr Matongo: That is not correct. Incest is for human beings.

Laughter

Mr Matongo: The correct word is inbreeding. When these calves reach eighteen months old, the bull is removed and another one is introduced in order to avoid inbreeding. This kind of arrangement would be very helpful to our people, particularly those of the Western and Southern provinces because they understand cattle rearing.

Mr Hachipuka: They want a bull like Liato.

Laughter {mospagebreak}

Mr Matongo: Sir, I will not be involved in that discussion. Under such an arrangement, even if the programme is funded by a private funding agency, the Government or a bank, it will be able to get its money back. Heifer International has a similar project in Kasiya and Nachibanga Ward. Another one is, currently, being put in place in Kauba. They are implementing this programme because they have seen how beneficial it is to the people.

Mr Chairperson, it is totally unreasonable for my hon. Friends in the Government to restock where there are diseases. If they want to restock animals in areas that are disease prone, the first thing they should do is ensure that diseases are eliminated first. If the next village is dipping animals and the other one is not, and yet they go to the same dam, it will be difficult to eliminate denkete. We are, therefore, appealing to you, hon. Minister, to help, particularly the people of Pemba, with dip tanks because they are very passionate about them. We are prepared to spend the CDF on dip tanks as long as you can help us with veterinary personnel. We have five veterinary stations in Pemba and out of these, only three are manned. The remaining stations have no offices and houses. You can help us a lot if you made making the remaining ones operational. We have done a lot in dipping our cows. We have also done a lot in trying to help each other in cattle restocking, but we need the Government support by providing us with veterinary officers in all these stations.

Mr Chairperson, the sense that I am pumping into the people of Pemba is that it does not make any sense at all for people who have only thirty animals to go to the Government to ask it to treat their animals for free. I tell them that they can sell one of their animals in order to treat the rest of their animals so that they can progress. However, as for those in rural areas, as is the case in Liuwa where they are now eating mangoes, they need to be helped, hon. Minister, to have medicines and dip tanks. In Pemba, all we need is technical advice.

Mr Chairperson, I will not speak at length on fisheries because I think my brothers who are experts in that field will do so, but I would like to state, very clearly, that we do not have any other type fish in Pemba except the small dark ones which we do not enjoy. Therefore, we will be very happy if you can help us, hon. Minister, to have fish ponds in Pemba because we also want to eat fish just like the other people are eating our beef through the cattle that we transfer …

Mr Imasiku: On a point of order, Sir.

The Deputy Chairperson: A point of order is raised.

Mr Imasiku: Mr Chairperson, I rise on a very serious point of order on that short man who is debating so badly.

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

You cannot use that phrase when referring to an hon. Member. 

Laughter

Mr Imasiku: Mr Chairperson, is he in order to allege that the people in Liuwa are eating mangoes when he has never been there? Is he serious with his debate?  I need your serious ruling.

The Deputy Chairperson: The Chair is very reluctant to involve himself in this debate between two cousins. I will allow Hon. Matongo to continue, but I urge him to avoid  talking about Liuwa.

Laughter

Mr Matongo: I am appealing to the hon. Minister to, please, help Choma District as well with regard to fish. We do not have fish there, we have to go down to the valley or flats to eat fish at a very high cost. When our cattle stocks improve, we can go into a deal with my brothers in Luapula where there is plenty of water and give them animals while they teach us how to look after fish ponds.

Sir, with these few remarks, I hope the hon. Minister will take my debate seriously and consider what has been suggested for future implementation so that the people in the Southern Province and, particularly, the Western Province can get their cattle stock up and running. For those who like chickens, I can only refer them to the hon. Minister of Labour and Social Security and my friend, Hon. Hachipuka, because they are experts in this area.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

Mrs Musokotwane (Katombola): Mr Chairperson, thank you for giving me this opportunity to contribute to the debate on the Floor. I will be brief.

Mr Chairperson, when the hon. Minister talked about mobile crush panes in his policy debate, he lost me a little. As such, he needs to explain how these are going to work. I cannot imagine a mobile crush pane, especially one that will cost K500 million. The reason behind this is that each community can have a permanent crush pane with either each village having its own or one being shared among three or four villages. What are these crush panes worth K500 million going to be used for anyway because the ones in villages, at the moment, cost not more than K100,000? Therefore, there is no need to procure mobile crush panes when better and permanent ones can be made at a much lower cost.

Hon. UPND Member: Yes.

Mrs Musokotwane: If Kazungula District was to be given K500 million, it would make permanent crush panes too numerous to measure. However, I stand to be corrected, it could be that these mobile crush panes are special in the sense that they may be treated and would cure animals of diseases once they step onto them.

Interruptions

Mrs Musokotwane: Therefore, I urge the hon. Minister to explain how these mobile crush panes differ from the permanent ones. I thought the hon. Minister was going to talk about barriers or grids because those can be mobile. However, I am not too sure about crush panes.

Mr Chairperson, as regards branding marks, each district has only one brand mark. We have a problem in Kazungula because, at the moment, I do not know where the brand marker is, and yet so many people of Kazungula need to use that specific brand mark so that the cattle are identified when they go into other districts. As a result of the many people who need to use this one brand mark, some of us have not yet branded our cattle. Where is the brand mark? Can the ministry allow us to have more than one brand mark per district, provided it is the same number so that more animals are branded in a short time? At the moment, the brand mark in Kazungula has been in use for more than five years, but not all farmers have branded their animals.

The last issue, Mr Chairperson, is that of the cattle barriers. Is it possible for the ministry to give Kazungula District cattle barriers at all entry points? Cattle barriers are needed at the entry point between Kasaya and Sesheke District and at Simwami where Kalomo District borders with Kazungula District. This is the only way diseases will be reduced in the district. Kazungula District has suffered in as far as cattle rearing is concerned. In fact, it is the only district in the Southern Province, if not in Zambia, which still has a ban on livestock movement. As a result of this, farmers cannot sell their cattle unless they are carcasses. Until a few months ago, cattle could not be even allowed into the district. This is a very serious issue for Kazungula District.

Mr Chairperson, the people of Sikanzwe area use their hands to cultivate their fields because their animals are depleted. We, therefore, ask the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development to consider Kazungula District as a priority area for the pilot plans because that is where the animal diseases are. It is fine to go to other districts, but the ministry has to show us its commitment and knowledge to eradicate animal diseases quickly in Kazungula District because that is where the problem is.

Mr Chairperson, I thank you.

Mr Chisala (Chilubi): Mr Chairperson, I thank you for allowing me to contribute to the debate on this important Vote.

Sir, before I say anything, I would like to register my disappointment over the meagre allocation to the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development. Last year, the allocation to the ministry was only K258,236,015,213. This year, it is only K261,748,495,587, which translates into an increase of K3 billion. I can only conclude that this is next to nothing.

Hon. Opposition Member: Yes!

Mr Chisala: Mr Chairperson, I would like to state, from the outset, that I come from a fishing family and fishing is close to my heart.

Dr Musonda: Ba tubulu.

Mr D. Mwila: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: In this regard, I have been totally disappointed with this allocation.

Mr D. Mwila: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Chairperson, if I were to ask how many livestock and fisheries officers were in each district, it would be discovered that, in most districts, there has been a lamentable failure to recruit the manpower required to man the offices.

Mr Kapeya: You hear that?

Mr Chisala: That being the case, why did the ministry not make a reasonable increment to the 2011 allocationso that, upon getting authority from the Public Service Management Division, it recruits the required manpower? The ministry should have had a reasonable increment so that, in due course, it should have employed secretaries and office orderlies at district level. In the case of Chilubi, at least, three fisheries officers have to be recruited because the area is too vast to be manned by one man.

Mr D. Mwila: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Chairperson, in the same vein, I would like to appeal to the Government to consider fish restocking.

Sir, when I came to Parliament in 2006, …

Hon. Members: Eeh!

Mr Chisala: … there was an hon. Minister by the name of Mr Mundia Sikatana who promised the people of the Bangweulu region to ensure fish restocking was done in 2008. Unfortunately, up to December, 2008, we did not see this programme commencing.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: Mr Chairperson, my conclusion with regard to the K6,737,727,923 given to the Bangweulu Fisheries Department is that it cannot do anything with this amount.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: I wonder if that was taken into consideration. My humble request, on behalf of the people of the Bangweulu region, is that the Government must ensure that fish restocking …

Hon. Members: On behalf.

Mr Chisala: … takes shape this year.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: The fish species in that area have completely depleted and the people in the Government are there looking with their naked eyes without taking any action about it.

Laughter

Hon. Members: Naked eyes.

Mr Chisala: Mr Chairperson, now is the time for us to act.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: This is the time for us to act. If we do not act this year, it will be difficult for the Government to even get a single vote from that area …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: … because people are not happy that fish is being depleted. The cause of fish depletion, to a great extent, is that most of the people in the area have resorted to bad fishing methods.

  Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: They are using mosquito nets which are not supposed to be used for fishing.

Mr Kapeya: They are supposed to protect them from mosquitoes.

Mr Chisala: These nets are supposed to be used to protect people from mosquitoes, especially that the area has a lot of mosquitoes.

  I am requesting the hon. Minister to ensure that before the year ends, at least, a reasonable amount of money is sent to the officers in the districts, particularly, in Chilubi, Samfya and Mpika, to reinforce the fishing ban and strengthen the fishing ban law which is observed annually.

Mr Chairperson, last year, we did not receive the allocation to enable us monitor the fishing ban. As a result, a number of fishermen broke the law by fishing during the fishing ban and that was bad. In this regard, I am making a humble suggestion that it would be prudent for the Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development to release the money well in advance so that by 1st December, at the beginning of the fishing ban, it is utilised to with a view to strengthening the ban. Otherwise, failure to release this money to the relevant offices in good time, means that the fishing ban shall not be observed this year.

Sir, with these few words, I thank you.

Mr Machila: Mr Chairperson, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to wind up debate on the Vote for Livestock and Fisheries Development.

Sir, I wish to thank all hon. Members that have contributed to the debate on this Vote. Briefly, the Member for Dundumwezi, Hon Sing’ombe, lamented the livestock services, the branding marks as well as the focus on cattle as opposed to other animals such as goats. I wish to state that, in fact, tomorrow we have arranged a visit to the Livestock Services Department.

Mr Sing’ombe: Hear, hear!

Mr Machila: With regard to the issue of decentralising the branding marks, certainly, this is a matter that we can look into because we do not want to continue inconveniencing the farmers by making them come to Lusaka.

Sir, as regards the perception that there is too much focus on cattle, we are undertaking bidding programmes and have imported some bull goats from Namibia that will help diversify and, generally, improve the nature and quality of goats that we currently have.

The hon. Member for Chilanga spoke on the need for us to upscale programmes on livestock disease prevention. He particularly made reference to dipping on account of the majority of the diseases being tick borne. This is very true. In fact, this year, prior to his return to Parliament, we introduced the Animal Health Act which gives us avenues to better enforce matters pertaining to the dipping of animals in particular. With regards to the proposal that we have a package or provision for dipping of animals, we would not have the liberty to make a commitment thereon because this will cost us but, certainly, it is a matter that we can consider when we discuss with our colleagues at the Ministry of Finance and National Planning.
 
Mr Chairperson, as regards the Balmoral Central Veterinary Research Institute and the production of vaccines, we are upgrading the laboratory facilities there at a great cost. I think close to K15 billion will be spent there and we expect that we will be able to improve the vaccines that are being produced locally, although there are some vaccines that we shall continue to import.

Sir, on the issue of adequately equipping veterinary officers, I wish to inform the hon. Minister that 300 kits have been bought for veterinary assistants. Therefore, in addition to having motorcycles, they will be adequately equipped so that they are more effective in the field.

Mr Chairperson, the hon. Member for Chilanga also mentioned the issue of branding as a means of animal identification. We believe this will be captured through the Animal Identification Act that came through Parliament earlier this year. The issues raised are very valid and are certainly going to be addressed.

Sir, with regard to the last issue that was raised by the hon. Member for Chilanga on the fishing ban and the inconsistencies vis-à-vis neighbouring states, I would like to state that Lakes Tanganyika and Kariba are not closed during the annual fishing ban period because these are shared trans-boundary fishing areas. We do, however, close Lake Mweru and Luapula fisheries. We are having discussions with the DRC with regard to harmonising the fishing ban and this is being done through the DRC/Zambia Joint Permanent Commission. Similarly, we also close the Upper Zambezi and are discussing with our Namibian counterparts to harmonise the fishing ban. This, again, is also being done through the Namibia/Zambia Joint Permanent Commission.

Sir, the hon. Member for Bahati also spoke about the fishing ban and the need for us to strengthen it. This is an issue that is ongoing and under implementation. We have noted the request for a fishery in Mwenda to improve the fingerlings to be distributed in the area. That is a reasonable and tangible request. We shall look into this, taking into consideration the resource base. 

Mr Chairperson, the Chishinga State Ranch, again, is an issue that we have noted and can be looked into. We acknowledge that there was a need to upscale the livestock status not only in the Luapula Province but also the Northern Province. We note that the people of Luapula have stopped ‘eating the animals’.

Laughter

Mr Machila: Mr Chairperson, the last matter that was mentioned relates to who is in charge of animals and fertiliser. This is the issue that we have taken note of and felt would be for my colleague here at the Ministry of Agriculture and Co-operatives who oversees the operations of the Nitrogen Chemicals of Zambia.

Sir, the hon. Member for Pemba spoke about the need to introduce aquaculture in his area so that they can diversify from beef. Aquaculture is a priority area for us and is certainly something we shall look into.

The issue of a credit facility or credit financing is an initiative that we would want to encourage some players in the private sector to pursue. It is not something that we, as a ministry, would be at liberty, at this stage, to undertake.

We have noted the concerns about the shortage of veterinary officers not just in Pemba but elsewhere too.

Sir, the hon. Member for Katombola requested an explanation on mobile crush panes as opposed to fixed ones. We have the figures at hand and exactly what the cost is. The intention is that as we pursue the programme of disease control, there may be a need to have mobile crush panes available in certain areas for vaccination programmes, but that is not at the expense or the exclusion of the fixed ones.

Likewise, the request for a branding mark per district is a matter that the ministry can look at in view of the recently introduced Animal Identification Bill, 2010. The use of Kazungula as a pilot for dealing with livestock diseases is certainly something that the ministry can take up.

Lastly, the hon. Member for Chilubi lamented the poor fishing practices and the non-reinforcement of the fishing ban in the area. This is a matter that we discussed, as recently as this morning, at the ministry during a management meeting because we are aware that 1st December is around the corner and we shall, again, implement the annual fishing ban at that stage.

With these few remarks, I wish to thank the hon. Members for their comments and support with regard to this Vote.

Mr Chairperson, I thank you.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Vote 88/01 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 88/02 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 88/03 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

VOTE 88/04 – (Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development – Veterinary Services Department – (K31,654,558,675).

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on Unit 2, Programme 8, Activity 02 – Monitoring of Livestock Disease Outbreaks – Nil, Activity 03 – Livestock Movement Controls – Nil, Activity 04 – Livestock Disease Awareness Campaigns – Nil. Could the hon. Minister explain why these three activities have no allocations? 

The Deputy Minister of Livestock and Fisheries Development (Mr Mulonga): Mr Chairperson, Unit 2, Programme 8, Activity 02 – Monitoring of Livestock Disease Outbreaks – Nil, Activity 03 – Livestock Movement Controls – Nil, Activity 04 – Livestock Disease Awareness Campaigns – Nil, are for the prevention, control and eradication of livestock diseases, which are of economic importance both in commercial and traditional sectors to increase livestock productivity. These provisions have, therefore, been consolidated under Activity 07 – Control of Livestock Diseases – K378,343,515, Activity 08 – Procurement of FMD Vaccine – K4,056,327,120, and Activity 09 – Stock Register Updates – K198,062,848.

I thank you, Sir.

Mrs Musokotwane: Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on Programme 8, Activity 11 – CBPP Control and Vaccine Procurement – Nil. I would like to know why there is no allocation, this year, when there is still an outbreak of this disease.

Mr Mulonga: Mr Chairperson, on Programme 8, Activity 11 – CBPP Control and Vaccine Procurement – Nil, this provision has been transferred to disease-free zones because we are undertaking the activities under the disease-free zones not only in these three provinces, but in other provinces as well. That is why this activity has been removed.

 I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Vote 88/04 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

VOTE 88/05 – (Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development – Livestock Department (Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development – K12,316,132,793).

Mr Mukanga:  Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on Unit 9, Programme 9, Activity 01 – Training in Quality Control (Meat, Hides/Skins Graders/Inspectors – K97,573,637. I would like to find out why this has been reduced because we are talking about quality. Then, on Programme 14, Activity 01 – Stocking/Restocking in Identified Areas – Nil. I would like to know why there is no allocation this year. The last one is on Programme 15, Activity 04 – Establishment of an Artificial Insemination Centre – K3,000,000,000. I would like to find out what this amount is for, which centre is going to be established and where.

Mr Mulonga: Mr Chairperson, on Unit 9, Programme 9, Activity 01 – Training in Quality Control (Meat, Hides/Skins Graders/Inspectors) – K97,573,637, we have already done the training for this activity. Therefore, we have down-scaled the activity since some things have already been done.

Mr Chairperson, on Programme 14, Activity 01 – Stocking/Restocking in Identified Areas – Nil, there is no allocation for this activity because the ministry has set breeding centres in provincial headquarters. Therefore, in 2011, the ministry will concentrate on stocking the breeding centres. This will be a base for the restocking in the farming communities.

Mr Chairperson, on Programme 15, Activity 04 – Establishment of an Artificial Insemination Center – K3,000,000,000, the provision is for building a new artificial insemination facility. This will cater for all livestock species and the private sector can use the facility as well. The increase is due to the up-scaling of the establishment of this artificial insemination. As for the other details, we will let the House know at a later stage.

 I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Vote 88/05 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.  
 
VOTE 88/06 – (Ministry of Livestock and Fisheries Development – Fisheries Department – K6,737,727,923).

Mr Mukanga: Mr Chairperson, may I have clarification on Unit 6, Programme 8, Activity 01 – Monitoring of Field Training Centres – K20,000,000. Last year, there was a provision of K165,160,000 but, this year, there is only an allocation of K20,000,000. May I find out how many centres will be monitored from the K20,000,000 and why there is this reduction?

Mr Mulonga: Mr Chairperson, the reduction is due to the fact that we bought a vehicle for monitoring the centres from this amount. Therefore, we are going to monitor as many centres as possible, now that we have a vehicle.

I thank you, Mr Chairperson.

Vote 88/06 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 88/07 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 88/10 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 88/11 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 88/16 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

Vote 88/17 ordered to stand part of the Estimates.

The Deputy Chairperson: Order!

(Debate adjourned)

_________

HOUSE RESUMED

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

(Progress reported)

_________

MOTION

ADJOURNMENT

The Vice-President and Minister of Justice (Mr Kunda, SC.): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

Question put and agreed to.

________

The House adjourned at 1918 hours until 1430 hours on Thursday, 11th November, 2010.