Tuesday, 12th September, 2023

Tuesday, 12^thSeptember, 2023

The House met at 1430 hours

[MADAM SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

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ANNOUNCEMENTS BY MADAM SPEAKER

ACTING LEADER OF GOVERNMENT BUSINESS IN THE HOUSE

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, I have received communication to the effect that in the absence of Her Honour the Vice-President, who is attending to other Government Business, the Minister of Defence, Hon. Ambrose L. Lufuma, has been appointed Acting Leader of Government Business in the House from today, 12^th September, 2023, until further notice.

I thank you.

PRESENCE OF PUPILS AND TEACHERS FROM MACHA GIRLS SECONDARY SCHOOL IN THE PUBLIC GALLERY

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, I wish to recognise the presence in the Public Gallery of pupils as well as teachers from Macha Girls Secondary School of Choma District.

Pupils and teachers rose.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Madam Speaker: May I, on behalf of the National Assembly of Zambia, warmly welcome our visitors into our midst. You may resume your seats.

I thank you.

NOMINATION OF ANNUAL AWARDS FOR OUTSTANDING PARLIAMENTARIANS AWARDED

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, you will recall that on Wednesday, 26^th July, 2023, I announced to the House the introduction of Annual Awards for Outstanding Parliamentarians of the National Assembly of Zambia. Consequently, nominations were received in the three categories, namely:

the Robinson Nabulyato Award, Overall Best Member of Parliament of the Year;

the Nelly Mutti Award, Outstanding Woman Member of Parliament of the Year; and

the Wesley Nyirenda Award, Outstanding Youth Member of Parliament of the Year.

To this effect, all nominations received were compiled, counted, verified and validated. Following this process, the top three nominees in each category were identified. The deserving nominees will be recognised and awarded at a ceremony to be held on Thursday, 14^th September, 2023, at 0900 hours in the Amphitheatre. The awards ceremony will be in commemoration of the International Day of Democracy, which falls on Friday, 15^th September, 2023. The important day is commemorated by both the Inter-Parliamentary Union (IPU) and the Commonwealth Parliamentary Association (CPA). You are, therefore, invited to attend the inaugural awards ceremony.

Hon. Members, you may wish to note that this event will be treated as a sitting of the House, owing to its importance.

I thank you.

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BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE

The Minister of Defence and Acting Leader of Government Business in the House (Mr Lufuma): Thank you, Madam Speaker, for giving me this opportunity to render the business statement for the period 12^th September, 2023, to 15^th September, 2023.

Madam Speaker, I wish to inform the House that the House Business Committee met on Wednesday, 6^th September, 2023, to determine and schedule the Business of the House for the first week of this Meeting, which is from 12^th September, 2023, to 15^th September, 2023.

Madam Speaker, before I go into the details, let me take this opportunity to welcome all hon. Members to the First Meeting of the Third Session of the Thirteenth National Assembly. I am glad that we are all back safely and in good health. I also note that hon. Members look eager to proceed with the Business of the House. I am, therefore, hopeful that the House, as usual, will work diligently and harmoniously in the performance of its functions despite hon. Members’ divergent views on various matters, as it should be.

Madam Speaker, let me now get back to the business the House is expected to transact this week. The business is as follows:

Announcements

The Hon. Madam Speaker will make announcements to the House on any day when it is necessary to do so.

Rulings

The Hon. Speaker will render rulings, if there will be any.

Ministerial Statements

Hon. Ministers will issue ministerial statements, if there will be any.

Bills

The Bills listed hereunder will be presented:

The Criminal Procedure Code (Amendment) Bill, 2023. The stage will be First Reading and the date of presentation will be 13^th September, 2023, which is tomorrow;

The Penal Code (Amendment) Bill, 2023. First Reading will be the stage and date of presentation will be tomorrow, 13^th September, 2023; and

The Constituency Development Fund Bill, 2023. The stage will be First Reading and it will be considered tomorrow, 13^th September, 2023;

Reports on International Conferences

Reports on international conferences will be considered, if there will be any.

Parliamentary Committee Reports

The House will consider the Report of the Parliamentary Select Committee Appointed to Scrutinise the Presidential Appointment of Mr Roy Ngulube to Serve as Clerk of the National Assembly; Dr Pamela Towela Sambo, Dr Felicity Kayumba Kalunga, Mrs Panic Malawo Chilufya and respectively, Joseph Komakoma, to Serve as Chairperson, Vice-Chairperson and Commissioners, of the Human Rights Commission, respectively, and Dr Tommy Susiku Namitondo to Serve as Commissioner of the Anti-Corruption Commission (ACC).

Questions

Hon. Ministers will respond to about thirty-five Questions for Oral Answer. The questions are mostly those that were carried forward from the last Session and are contained in the Notice of Questions that was circulated to all hon. Members on Friday, 8^th September, 2023.

Madam Speaker, let me quickly go through the questions, and the portfolio hon. Ministers responsible should prepare themselves. The questions are as follows:

Tuesday, 12^th September, 2023

Question No. Sector

Tourism

5 Fisheries

15 Energy

24 Agriculture

26 Home Affairs

50 Tourism

68 Lands

58 Infrastructure

78 Transport

77 Local Government

105 Water Development

133 Education

170 Lands

176 Energy

233 Water Development

Wednesday, 13^th September, 2023

Question No. Sector

Transport and Logistics

31 Agriculture

187 Energy

75 Infrastructure

81 Local Government

97 Health

128 Water Development

160 Local Government

173 Infrastructure

178 Home Affairs

Thursday, 14^th September, 2023

Question No. Sector

Local Government

241 Mines

189 Small and Medium Enterprise

244 Youth and Sport

223 Technology

Friday, 15^th September, 2023

Question No. Sector

Home Affairs

256 Local Government

239 Education

11 Energy

41 Community Development

Madam Speaker, on behalf of the House Business Committee and in accordance with Order No. 189 (5) of the National Assembly of Zambia Standing Orders, 2021, I have the pleasure to present the business of this week to this august House.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

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MATTERS OF URGENT PUBLIC IMPORTANCE

MS NAKAPONDA, HON. MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT FOR ISOKA, ON THE HON. MINISTER OF TOURISM, MR SIKUMBA, ON HUMAN/ANIMAL CONFLICTS IN ISOKA

Ms Nakaponda (Isoka): On a matter of urgent public importance, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: A matter of urgent public importance is raised.

Ms Nakaponda: Madam Speaker, my matter of urgent public importance is directed to the hon. Minister of Tourism.

Madam Speaker, in Isoka, we also experience human/animal conflicts. One life has been lost, but the Government is quiet. The hon. Minister has not said anything to the bereaved family, yet the family members want to hear from the Government on how it will handle this matter in terms of compensation.

Madam Speaker, I need your guidance.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Isoka, the issue of human/animal conflicts has graced the Floor of this House on several occasions. Further, the hon. Minister of Tourism has on various occasions come on the Floor of this House to issue various ministerial statements. I believe, this problem is still ongoing. Just recently, I watched a video clip of elephants that had gone into a village in Sioma. Therefore, I believe, this issue needs more than just ministerial statements. I think, the hon. Minister of Tourism needs to do more, together with all of us. I believe this is now not a matter for the hon. Minister alone. I think, it is for all of us, as hon. Members of Parliament, members of the community and the Government. Let us find means and ways of resolving this issue because it is ongoing. The animals are in our communities. As human beings, we are also in the passage of these animals. So, we just have to find a lasting solution. Otherwise, this issue will keep coming up on and off. There was the idea that we form a special committee, but the issue was funding. So, maybe, we can explore other ways and means.

Thank you very much for bringing this matter up again. I will have a chat with the hon. Minister of Tourism to see how best it can be resolved when he comes back.

MR J. CHIBUYE, HON. MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT FOR ROAN, ON THE HON. MINISTER OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS AND INTERNATIONAL CO-OPERATION, MR KAKUBO, ON THE EARTHQUAKE IN MOROCCO

Mr J. Chibuye (Roan): On a matter of urgent public importance, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: A matter of urgent public importance is raised.

Mr J. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, before I raise my matter of urgent public importance, allow me to sincerely wish the Government Chief Whip a quick recovery, who was involved in a road traffic accident, the people of Roan Constituency wish him a quick recovery, too.

Madam Speaker, allow me to also congratulate our brother, Hon. Njavwa Simutowe, on his appointment, and his move from the Backbench to the Frontbench.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr J. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, the matter of urgent public importance I wish to raise is directed to the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs and International Co-operation whom, I believe, is not here. As such, I will direct it to the Acting Leader of Government Business in the House.

Madam Speaker, two weeks ago, there was a terrible earthquake in Morocco, and Morocco and Zambia enjoy good bilateral relations, whereby Zambia sends quite a number of students on bursary to Morocco. Over 2,000 people are feared dead in Marrakesh.

Madam Speaker, can the Acting hon. Leader of Government Business in the House inform this august House and the nation at large whether there are any Zambian students who have been caught up in this earthquake.

I seek your guidance, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, as we raise matters of urgent public importance, we should familiarise ourselves with our Standing Orders so that whatever matter we raise is in accordance with the Standing Orders. The earthquake in Morocco occurred two weeks ago. Of course, it is not a recent occurrence. We were on recess, anyway but, I believe that the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs and International Co-operation can have an opportunity to brief the House and, through it, the nation on whether or not there were any Zambians who were affected in that earthquake. I know that the hon. Minister is not here but, when he comes back, which is sometime next week, the Office of the Clerk will liaise with him so he can render a statement on the earthquake in Morocco.

MR KAMPYONGO, HON. MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT FOR SHIWANG’ANDU, ON THE HON. MINISTER OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS AND INTERNATIONAL CO-OPERATION, MR KAKUBO, ON FRANCE’S AMBASSADOR DESIGNATE TO ZAMBIA

Mr Kampyongo (Shiwang’andu): On a matter of urgent public importance, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: A matter of urgent public importance is raised.

Mr Kampyongo: Madam Speaker, the matter of urgent public importance I am raising is directed to the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs and International Co-operation and, in his absence, the Acting hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs and International Co-operation. However, before I raise the matter, allow me to wish our dear colleague, Hon. Mulusa, a quick recovery. I also wish to congratulate the Minister for Luapula Province, Hon. Njavwa Simutowe. We can only wish him all the best. Our colleagues who were queuing up for the same job should know that God’s time is the best.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kampyongo: I encourage him to make sure that natural resources like sugilite are taken care of.

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear.

Mr Kampyongo: Madam Speaker, the matter of urgent public importance I am raising, as I earlier stated, is directed to the Acting hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs and International Co-operation, and it relates to an issue that borders on Zambia being a sovereign State and a Christian nation, as indicated in the preamble of the Constitution.

Madam Speaker, the country is privy to some information which, if not managed, will result in innocent nationals of the French Republic being pitted against the Zambian people.

Madam Speaker, the information that has come through to the people is that the Republic of France has decided to nominate an ambassador designate to Zambia.

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member for Shiwang’andu! I believe that issue touches on diplomatic relations between Zambia and France.

Mr Kampyongo remained upstanding.

Madam Speaker: May you resume your seat so that I guide.

Mr Kampyongo resumed his seat.

Madam Speaker: So, it is not a matter that is fit to be raised on the Floor of the House. We can find other ways of dealing with it because it touches on foreign and diplomatic relations between Zambia and France. I think, let us leave it or, maybe, file in a question that can be addressed by the hon. Minister when he comes because it does not qualify to be raised as a matter of urgent public importance.

MR SIMUMBA, HON. MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT FOR NAKONDE, ON THE HON. MINISTER OF AGRICULTURE, MR MTOLO, ON THE FARMER INPUT SUPPORT PROGRAMME

Mr Simumba (Nakonde): On a matter of urgent public importance, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: A matter of urgent public importance is raised.

Mr Simumba: Thank you very much, Madam Speaker, for giving me this chance to raise a matter of urgent public importance directed to the hon. Minister of Agriculture.

Madam Speaker, farmers out there, especially the ones who benefit from the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP), are in a dilemma because the hon. Minister made two contradictory statements.

Madam Speaker, you will recall that on the Floor of this House, the hon. Minister stated that the Government would phase out FISP, and we were told to inform our people that. Again, the hon. Minister of Agriculture is on record saying that the Government would continue with FISP.

Madam Speaker, we would like to know the Government’s position on this matter. Will it continue with FISP or will the programme be replaced with loans?

Madam Speaker, I seek your guidance.

Madam Speaker: I believe, when the hon. Minister of Agriculture returns, he will deliver a ministerial statement to clarify whether the Government will continue with the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) or not in view of the hon. Member for Nakonde stating that there is a contradiction. I think, the people of Zambia need to know the truth so that when we speak, we speak with one voice. So, when the hon. Minister returns, he will liaise with the Clerk’s Office to see when the ministerial statement can be rendered, just to give clarity.

That concludes the matters of urgent public importance.

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MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

SHUTDOWN OF IOLANDA (1) WATER TREATMENT PLANT

The Minister of Water Development and Sanitation (Mr Mposha): Madam Speaker, I would like to thank you most sincerely for giving me this opportunity to inform the nation, through this august House, in response to the matter of urgent public importance on the planned shutdown of Iolanda (1) Water Treatment Plant situated in Kafue District. That is meant to facilitate major repair works on the main transmission pipeline to Lusaka.

Madam Speaker, as you may be aware, my ministry is implementing the National Rural Water Supply and Sanitation Programme and the National Urban Water Supply and Sanitation Programme in order to improve the livelihoods and public health of the people of Zambia. In doing so, we are, from time to time, faced with challenges, which we are determined to resolve.

Madam Speaker, allow me to address the imminent shutdown of Iolanda (1) Water Treatment Plant in Kafue District to facilitate repair works on the main transmission pipeline to Lusaka, which has been necessitated by the failure of the pipeline due to its age.

Madam Speaker, the House may wish to note that 55 per cent of the water supplied to Lusaka City is from Kafue River through pipelines over a distance of 65 km. One of the pipelines was constructed in 1970 and has outlived its useful life. It is that pipeline that has developed a serious leakage at one critical joint, which is the first bend from the treatment plant in Kafue District. To avoid a catastrophic failure of the pipeline, Lusaka Water Supply and Sanitation Company (LWSC), with the support of my ministry, would like to carry out emergency major repairs to it and fix the leaking point. The works have been planned to be carried out in-house by LWSC with support from my ministry.

Madam Speaker, the repair of the leakage is a short-term solution for the sustainable supply of water to the City of Lusaka. The long-term plan is to develop an additional water treatment plant at Iolanda in Kafue District to meet the growing daily demand for water supply to the City of Lusaka. In view of the above, my ministry will mobilise resources to finance the development of the new treatment plant, which will comprise of new booster stations and a new pipeline.

Madam Speaker, my ministry would like to inform this august House that in order for LWSC to successfully carry out the emergency repair works on the pipeline, the treatment plant and the pipeline will have to be shut down for a period not exceeding sixty days, beginning 14^th September, 2023. That time is required for the concrete that will be cast as part of the repair works to cure and reach its full strength so as to avoid premature failure.

Madam Speaker, my ministry will ensure that LWSC puts in place measures to reduce the stress of water supply for the parts of the city that will be affected. Some of the measures will be rationing of supply and delivery of water by bowsers to some parts of the city. However, the residents of Lusaka are advised to make arrangements for storing adequate water during the period. I repeat: The residents of Lusaka are advised to make adequate arrangements for storing water during the period.

Madam Speaker, I would like to assure this House that critical facilities, such as hospitals, will be prioritised for continuous water supply. My ministry will also closely monitor the works and provide all the necessary support to ensure that the works are completed on time and normal supply resumes.

Madam Speaker, allow me to request that the effort of LWSC to carry out the works be supported by hon. Members of this House. In particular, the hon. Members from Lusaka District should accompany me to visit the Naboye leak site in order to not only appreciate the nature and magnitude of the problem being resolved that will give rise to reduced water supply to some constituencies within Lusaka District for the next sixty days, but also assist with dissemination of information regarding the problem.

Madam Speaker, as I conclude, let me assure our citizens, through this House, that the United Party for National Development (UPND) or New Dawn Government remains committed to providing universal access to clean and safe water in line with Sustainable Development Goal (SDG) No. 6 and the Vision 2030, considering the critical role that water continues to play in ensuring public health, improved livelihoods and promotion of human dignity.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, you are now free to ask questions on points of clarification on the ministerial statement issued by the hon. Minister of Water Development and Sanitation.

Mr Munsanje (Mbabala): Thank you so much, Madam Speaker, for giving me an opportunity, on behalf of the good people of Mbabala, to ask a follow-up question. May I also follow the protocols by congratulating Hon. Njavwa Simutowe on being appointed Minister for Luapula Province. I also wish our brother, Hon. Mulusa, and Permanent Secretary (PS) Tetamashimba a quick recovery. I also recognise the team of teachers and students from Mbabala Constituency seated up there (looking up to the Public Gallery).

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Munsanje: Welcome, Macha Girls Secondary School.

Madam Speaker, how many hours will there be no water in the affected areas? Our communities need to know that in a day, they will have water for two hours or one hour or they will not have any water at all. Further, I would like to know whether water bowsers will supply water to the affected areas. Can the hon. Minister clarify on that.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Mbabala for this question.

Madam Speaker, I am not able to give the specific hours there will not be water, but let me confirm that there will be a drastic reduction in the hours of supply. However, like I said in the statement, the people of Lusaka must note that there is a big leakage through which we are losing thousands of litres of water and, because we have to undertake repair works, it will be necessary during that period that they store enough water to take them through the periods we will not supply water.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kang’ombe (Kamfinsa): Allow me, Madam Speaker, to thank you most sincerely for the opportunity to ask a very important follow-up question. As I do that, I sympathise with the hon. Minister of Water Development and Sanitation on the challenges in his ministry.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has informed this august House that the City of Lusaka will be affected for sixty days and, obviously, that raises the issue of planning. Did the ministry not foresee this challenge in order to prevent it way before we could have this situation of not having water for sixty days in a city that has a population of 3.6 million people?

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Kamfinsa for this very important question.

Madam Speaker, the problem hinges on legacy issues. The leakage has been there for years and it has been growing, and my ministry has decided to work on this big problem. You would not believe that the leakage is 2 km from our treatment plant, but it has even formed a stream now where we are losing close to 10,000 litres of water per day. This has been going on not for a week, a month or two years, but for many years. So, my ministry is working with LWSC to fix this problem. We have acted promptly to ensure that the problem is resolved, but as to whether it was not foreseen, my colleagues could have prevented it from getting bigger. Suffice to say, we have acted to resolve it.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mutale (Chitambo): Madam Speaker, I appreciate you.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has informed the House that it will take sixty days for the water leakage at Naboye to be fixed and that the pipes were laid in the 1960s, meaning that the whole system is almost getting tired, and sixty days is a long time. Has the ministry conducted adequate investigations on the pipeline so that once it mends the damage, we will not have another occurrence of it reopening? We do not need to suffer because of another leakage at some other point.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank my brother, Hon. Mutale, the Member of Parliament for Chitambo, for this question. I wish to start by correcting him by saying that in my statement, I said that the pipeline was constructed in 1970, not 1960. As to whether we have conducted investigations, our members of staff, from time to time, inspect the networks, including the one in question. The problem on the network is at the point I mentioned, which is a bend in some mountains of Kafue. The rest of the pipeline is fairly okay, for now. However, as I have said, the network was constructed in the1970s. S, from time to time, we are likely to face these challenges. As I indicated in my statement, this is only a short-term measure. In the long term, we desire, as a ministry, to mobilise resources and set up another treatment plant, an additional pipeline to replace the old one, and attend to the ever-growing population in Lusaka.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chitotela (Pambashe): Madam Speaker, let me also send a message of sympathy to the people of Solwezi and wish the area hon. Member of Parliament, who is also the Government Chief Whip, a quick recovery. In the same tone, let me congratulate my brother, Hon. Njavwa Simutowe, who was a member of our Committee, on being appointed Minister for Luapula Province.

Welcome home, eku calo ca busaka.

Mr Munsanje: Meaning?

Mr Chitotela: Luapula Province, icalo ca busaka. Takufuma aba tumpa, iyo.

Laughter

Mr Munsanje interjected.

Mr Chitotela: Madam Speaker, –

Madam Speaker: Order, hon. Member for Pambashe!

Please, hon. Member, what were you saying? We do not understand the language.

Mr Chitotela: Madam Speaker, that is a saying for the people of Luapula Province. I do not know how it can be explained. Obviously, there are some good attributions to the people of the Western Province, the Southern Province and the North-Western Province. For Luapula Province, we say, ni ku calo ca busaka, ukushifuma uwa tumpa.

Madam Speaker: Meaning?

Mr Chitotela: Madam Speaker, it means the cleanest province where –

Laughter

Madam Speaker: You see.

Mr Chitotela: Madam Speaker, spare me. I am a national leader.

Laughter

Madam Speaker: You may proceed. However, please, let us avoid using words that we cannot translate in English.

Mr Chitotela: Madam Speaker, I listened attentively to the hon. Minister responsible for water as he attributed the issue to the old network. However, three or four years ago, the American Government invested in the water system from Kafue to Lusaka under the Millennium Challenge Corporation Compact Programme, and I remember that very well because I was the Minister responsible for infrastructure. We successfully installed a new network from Kafue to Lusaka. We also applied for additional funding, and His Excellency the President referred to it. The additional funding will be used to implement the second phase to improve the water system. So, listening to the hon. Minister lament that the network was constructed in the early 1970s, I was at sea. Which network was he talking about, the first pipe or the one we invested in four years ago under the Millennium Challenge Corporation Compact Programme? I need him to clarify that for the benefit of the people of Zambia, particularly the people of Lusaka, who were listening to the ministerial statement.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank Hon. Chitotela, the Member of Parliament for Pambashe, for this follow-up question.

Madam Speaker, if I was referring to a pipeline that was set up four years ago, I was going to mention that. I am talking about the pipeline that was constructed in 1970, which has developed a fault, and I was very specific in my statement.

It is true, Madam Speaker, that an additional pipeline called the Kafue Bulk Pipeline was commissioned last year. That one is intact. The one that has developed a fault was constructed some years back.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chisopa (Mkushi South): Madam Speaker, let me join my hon. Colleagues who have been congratulating our former fellow Committee member, Hon. Njavwa Simutowe, on having been elevated to the position of Provincial Minister.

Congratulations, honourable.

Mr B. Mpundu: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisopa: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister talked about the old pipeline, but there is a new one that has been installed. What is the maximum output of the new pipeline? Is it not able to supply water to Lusaka?

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank Hon. Chisopa for this follow-up question.

Madam Speaker, the population of Lusaka has been growing. Not too long, it was around 2 million, but there has been a jump, and we are now attending to over 4 million people. Obviously, there is a need for us to continue putting up pipelines for the supply of water. Recently, we commissioned the pipeline that Hon. Chisopa and Hon. Chitotela referred to. If I am not wrong, the capacity of that pipeline is about 50,000m³ litres per day, and it has added 50,000m³ litres to the daily supply, though I stand to be corrected. However, on its own, it is not sufficient to supply water to the whole of Lusaka. In fact, even the two pipelines are not giving us sufficient quantities to meet the demand for water in Lusaka. So, the new pipeline will continue supplying water to the various parts of Lusaka during the period we will be repairing the old one.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chisopa conversed with Mr Kafwaya.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, let us listen to the answers. When you ask a question, you need to listen to the answer.

Mr Kasandwe (Bangweulu): Madam Speaker, it is supposed to be 50 million litres, not 50,000m³ litres. That is how the pipeline was designed. Just a point of correction.

Madam Speaker, the Patriotic Front (PF) Government realised that the old pipeline had outlived its usefulness, hence, the new bulk supply project. So, I just want to know whom the new pipeline is supplying water to because it appears the hon. Minister is giving us the impression that the entire Lusaka will have no water supply for the next sixty days.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank Hon. Kasandwe for this follow-up question and the correction. It is 50 million litres of water supply per day that has been added.

Madam Speaker, the new pipeline will mainly supply water to the eastern part and some western parts of Lusaka but, during the repair works, like I indicated, we will put various measures in place to ensure that the inconvenience is minimised. It is necessary that we undertake the works. Like I said, we are losing water that is produced at a high cost. Water is pumped from 2 km away, but we are losing more than 10,000 litres, which is a lot of water, and it is treated.

Madam Speaker, once you allow us to visit the site with the hon. Members of Parliament from Lusaka, they will be able to appreciate the magnitude of the problem and why it is necessary that we put in place these measures. With your permission, we are ready, as early as tomorrow, to take the hon. Members of Parliament from Lusaka District to the site to see the problem. So, whilst the Kafue Bulk Pipeline will be able to assist with supplying water to areas in Lusaka East and Lusaka West, we will provide water bowsers to other peri-urban areas, and this was emphasised.

We will do everything possible, Madam Speaker, to ensure that the inconvenience is minimised. We will also work round the clock to reduce the time the works will take. We have asked for sixty days as the maximum period to allow the concrete that will be cast at the cliff to cure because the 50 inch pipeline is highly pressured. However, we hope, the works can be done in less than sixty days.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mwila (Mufulira): Madam Speaker, I take note of the question that the hon. Member for Mkushi South asked, which is in line with my question. I also take note of the hon. Minister’s response. However, in simple terms, I would like the hon. Minister to be more specific. Which areas of Lusaka will be affected by the disruption of water supply in the coming sixty days?

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Mufulira for this question.

Madam Speaker, the entire Lusaka will be affected in terms of the reduction of hours of water supply. The other question was: Which areas will benefit the most from the new pipeline, the Kafue Bulk Pipeline, the one we commissioned recently? I said that it will supply water to areas in Lusaka East and the western part.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Tayengwa (Kabwata): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister and I understand that the population of Lusaka is now close to 4 million and that some people in Chawama, Jack Compound in Kabwata and Mandevu may resort to drawing water from shallow wells. In the end, there may be an outbreak of diseases like dysentery and typhoid. Is the Ministry of Water Development and Sanitation going to work hand in hand with the Ministry of Health to avoid that challenge that we foresee?

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Kabwata for this question.

Madam Speaker, I would like to indicate that we are going to work hand in hand with various sectors, including the Ministry of Health and hon. Members of Parliament, to ensure that the correct information is given out to the people.

Madam Speaker, this is a non-political matter. So, I hope, all hon. Members of Parliament will use this information correctly to inform our people. I issued this ministerial statement so that people do not begin to use the situation we are going to face for political gain. We have been losing 10,000 litres of water but, once this problem is fixed in the next sixty days, that water will be pumped to various parts of the city and people will benefit from more supply. So, we are going to work hand in hand with other ministries and the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU) to ensure that the inconvenience is minimised, and to prevent people from accessing water from unreliable sources.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mukosa (Chinsali): Madam Speaker, there is just a day or two before the rehabilitation works commence. Today is 12^th September and, after tomorrow, it will be 14^th September, which is the day on which the works will commence. This is a very big issue that requires people to prepare. In the statement, the hon. Minister advised people to make arrangements for storing sufficient water for their use. Why did the ministry leave it until the last minute to inform the people? I expected it to inform the people about the repair works two or three weeks ago and to give them a schedule for the rationing of water.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank my brother, Hon. Mukosa, who is from a constituency with a very rich history, Chinsali.

Madam Speaker, first of all, I want to confirm that we have been considering this issue for some time now. In the background, we have been undertaking preparatory works to create access to the leakage point. To get to that point, we had to walk for many metres, and we now need to take equipment there. As to why we left it until the last minute to inform the people about the repair works, the couplings and other accessories that will be used to fix the leakage had to be imported from South Africa. So, we had to undertake a lot of preparatory work and allow LWSC to procure all the materials that will be required. We also needed to create an access road to where the leakage is, and all that has been done. We are now ready to undertake the works.

Madam Speaker, as regards the announcement, we were on recess. So, I thought of using this opportunity to inform the House and request for you to allow the hon. Members of Parliament whose constituencies are affected to accompany me to the site so that we can see and appreciate that problem. So, it is not like we left it to the last minute. We are managing the situation, but we did not want to undertake the works during the rainy season, which is mainly associated with diarrhoeal cases. If we undertook the works during the rainy season, people would have accessed water from unreliable sources and that would have created a problem. So, we decided to undertake the works in the dry season, and we will ensure that water is still supplied to the areas that will be affected. Within sixty days, we will have much more reliable supply of water.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Thank you very much.

Hon. Members from Lusaka are being invited to visit the site with the hon. Minister of Water Development and Sanitation. I am sure, the hon. Minister can liaise with the Clerk’s Office to see when that can be done. There is a suggestion that they do it even tomorrow. I do not know, in terms of availability, whether tomorrow is possible, but I am sure the Office of the Clerk will be able to advise.

We make progress.

_______

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

Madam Speaker: The hon. Member for Mongu Central.

Mr Amutike was not in the House.

Mr Anakoka indicated to ask on behalf of Mr Amutike.

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Luena, it has to be by prior arrangement. So, since the hon. Member for Mongu Central is not available, the question lapses. We make progress.

PROVISION OF ARTIFICIAL INSEMINATION SERVICES TO SMALL-SCALE FARMERS

2. Mr Chanda (Kanchibiya) asked the Minister of Fisheries and Livestock:

whether the Government has any plans to provide artificial insemination (AI) services to small-scale farmers countrywide;

if so, when the plans will be implemented; and

(c) if there are no such plans, why.

The Minister of Fisheries and Livestock (Mr Chikote): Madam Speaker, in order to promote and enhance livestock production and productivity of dairy and beef cattle as well as pigs in the country, my ministry has been providing artificial insemination (AI) services to small-scale farmers countrywide on demand. This service is provided at an affordable cost of between K100 and K150 per straw of semen. AI services in pigs are provided at Keembe Piggery while those for dairy and beef cattle are provided through the National Artificial Insemination Services (NAIS) Centre based in Mazabuka, Southern Province. We have also established fifteen AI satellite centres in Kalomo, Pemba, Chisamba, Namwala, Nalolo, Kalabo, Ndola, Shiwang’andu, Katete, Chipata, Lundazi, Kalumbila, Kabwe, Chibombo and Mbala districts.

Madam Speaker, to increase access to AI services for small-scale farmers, my ministry has endeavoured to increase the capacity of the liquid nitrogen plant at NAIS from 40 litres per hour to 150 litres per hour. Unfortunately, my ministry is in a dispute with the contractor and the issue has been referred to the Ministry of Justice for arbitration.

Madam Speaker, so far, the ministry has improved the water supply, procured and installed the liquid nitrogen processing plant and is in the process of rehabilitating the laboratory at NAIS, and procuring fifteen motor cycles and equipment for the fifteen centres. The equipment to be procured includes AI nitrogen flasks, nitrogen canisters, AI kits, AI guns and straws. Additionally, the ministry has trained seventy staff in AI to support AI services across the country.

Madam Speaker, the provision of AI services is an on-going exercise.

Madam Speaker, in view of the response to parts (a) and (b), part (c) falls off.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Chanda: Madam Speaker, I thank you for this opportunity to ask the hon. Minister a follow-up question.

Madam Speaker, the Zambian Government received support from the Czech Republic for a semen processing factory. My first question is: What is the status of that laboratory?

Mr Chikote: Madam Speaker, indeed, the Czech Republic is one of the co-operating partners supporting the Artificial Insemination Programme of this country. Like I stated in my answer, we have, so far, managed to put a plant in place that will be producing 150 litres per hour unlike the previous one, which was producing only 40 litres per hour. However, the House may wish to note that we have challenges with the contractor who is putting up this plant and the issue has been referred to the Ministry of Justice for arbitration. Otherwise, there is progress. As soon as we settle the differences, the contractor will complete the remaining parts that are required at the plant.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr C. Mpundu (Chembe): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has stated that only the personnel in his ministry were trained. Is he going to extend the training to small-scale farmers so that they can carry out AI activities by themselves?

Mr Chikote: Madam Speaker, I stated that the ministry trained an additional seventy staff. The essence of training them is to make sure that extension services are rendered to the small-scale farmers whom we are talking about. Small-scale farmers will be able to receive the right information from the experts whom we have trained. So, I can assure you that the small-scale farmers will receive the information they require to use AI services.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Shakafuswa (Mandevu): Madam Speaker, I am grateful to you for giving me this opportunity, on behalf of the people of Mandevu, to ask the hon. Minister a supplementary question.

Madam Speaker, I wish to know whether the ministry has plans to decentralise these services to the 116 districts of Zambia, considering that for pigs, the services are only offered in Keembe, while for cattle, they are offered in Mazabuka. I note that the hon. Minister spoke about the sixteen satellite locations, but farmers, especially small-scale farmers, in all the 116 districts of Zambia would like to improve their breeds. Does the ministry have any plans to take these services to all the districts, considering that the semen has to be transported in certain conditions to be effective?

Mr Chikote: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for this question. Indeed, the intention of the ministry is to make sure that the services are rendered to all our small-scale farmers, more especially the livestock farmers. We intend to make sure that this service reaches our dear farmers to increase production. As the Government, we look forward to increasing the number of livestock in this country. This is the more reason we decided that this plant produces the liquid at a high rate to facilitate the movement of the semen to the satellite centres that we have established. Of course, as the New Dawn Administration, we look forward to decentralising most services to all the districts.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Malambo (Magoye): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister might be aware that artificial insemination (AI) is the best way that many of us have used to improve the breeds of our animals. How much sensitisation has the ministry done to ensure that our people are aware of this very important exercise?

Mr Chikote: Madam Speaker, first of all, the reason we are increasing the number of staff is to provide the necessary information to our farmers. The more we increase our staff, the more we will be able to capacity build our farmers. So, as a ministry, we are committed to making sure that all our farmers have the right information. That way, we are going to increase the production of livestock in our country. So, making sure that a farmer gets the right information is one of our priorities in the Ministry of Fisheries and Livestock.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chanda: Madam Speaker, the livestock sector that we are talking about is estimated to be over US$1.5 billion, and it accounts for around 35 per cent of the contribution of agriculture to the national gross domestic product (GDP). Regarding the numbers presented versus the need, I do not understand why the ministry still moves with the demand-driven approach as opposed to a need-driven approach because when you contrast and compare with the population of livestock in this country, you will realise that we must be pushing towards a need-driven approach. If we are to unlock this sector, and if the country is to benefit in terms of the GDP, we need to move away from the demand-driven approach. For example, if a livestock farmer in Kanchibiya, such as me, wants to procure these services, he has to look for someone who is in Shiwang’andu. Now, that is a long distance. What is the Government doing to ensure that these services are taken closer to the people and that there is incremental value coming into the national economy?

Mr Chikote: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for this question. Indeed, the hon. Member is very right in saying that the system that is there is based on demand. It is one of the systems that has been there for some time. As the New Dawn Administration, we are working round the clock to make sure that services are taken closer to where our livestock farmers are. That is the more reason we are establishing that plant; to increase the production of the liquid that facilitates the movement of semen. So, going forward, we will not depend on demand because our target is to increase the production of livestock in the country.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mapani (Namwala): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that there are a couple of centres across the country. May I know the total cost the ministry will incur to complete the insemination centre in Namwala. He mentioned that it is among the centres in the country.

Mr Chikote: Madam Speaker, I am not in a position to give the total cost of the equipment that we are going to buy in order to equip all the centres I have just mentioned. If the hon. Member wishes, he can come to the office so that we can look at how much it will cost to buy the equipment.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Nyirenda (Lundazi): Thank you, Madam Speaker, and good afternoon. Greetings from the people of Lundazi.

Madam Speaker, the people of Lundazi are grateful that the ministry has considered them for the provision of the very important artificial insemination (AI) centre. How consistent is the ministry going to be in ensuring that the centres always have the liquid, especially given that Lundazi is in the middle of Chasefu, Chama and Lumezi constituencies?

Mr Chikote: Madam Speaker, indeed, I can see the concern from the hon. Member. We are going to equip the fifteen centres I mentioned, and the process of procuring the equipment is on. So, when we equip the centres and the contractor completes the plant, they will have semen throughout the year. That is the commitment of the ministry. I can assure you that things will not be like they used to be in the past.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chala (Chipili): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister mentioned some centres throughout this country but, in some areas, to be specific, Luapula Province, there are no such centres. When are we going to have the centres so that our people can –

Hon. Member: There is no livestock there.

Mr Chala: No, we are doing it.

Laughter

Mr Chala: When are we going to have livestock centres so that we can also access this kind of service?

Mr Chikote: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for this question. Indeed, amongst the fifteen centres that I have mentioned, there is none for Luapula Province. However, the ministry is committed to increasing livestock production across the country. One way we are going to change Luapula Province is by encouraging the people in the province to invest in livestock. So, we have prioritised making sure that the people in Luapula Province also start rearing cattle. I think, hon. Members have seen me go to the province on a number of occasions to encourage would-be farmers to invest in livestock. So far, the number of farmers there cannot justify our establishing a centre. However, in the areas where the fifteen centres are placed, there is potential. Otherwise, going forward, our target is to invest in livestock production in Luapula.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Menyani Zulu indicated.

Madam Speaker: I had closed with the hon. Member for Masaiti.

Hon. Member for Nyimba, you can get in touch with the hon. Minister later.

Mr Katambo (Masaiti): Madam Speaker, in order for smallholder farmers to increase milk production, there is a need to enhance on breeding and improve on genetics. The hon. Minister talked about four types of artificial insemination (AI). Which one among the four is he encouraging small-scale farmers to use for them to increase their milk production and improve their breed of cattle?

Mr Chikote: Madam Speaker, indeed, there are areas that we need to concentrate on in providing AI services to small-scale farmers, and we are encouraging small-scale farmers to invest in daily insemination services. We are disseminating this information to them to help them to start thinking about investing in that area. Yes, we have beef cattle and pigs, but if we are to improve the livelihood of small-scale farmers, we should encourage them to invest in dairy insemination services and to make that a priority.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Interruptions

Madam Speaker: Can we have order! I think, some hon. Members believe that we are still on recess.

Laughter

CONSTRUCTION OF KALUNGWISHI HYDRO POWER STATION

3. Mr Chibombwe (Bahati) asked the Minister of Energy:

(a) when construction of the Kalungwishi Hydro Power Station will commence;

(b) who the contractor for the project is;

(c) which company legally owns the site;

(d) which company owns Kalungwishi River water rights;

(e) who will build the transmission lines to link Kalungwishi to the National Electricity Grid; and

(f) how many entities have expressed interest in developing the project.

The Minister of Energy (Mr Kapala): Madam Speaker, the construction of the Kalungwishi Hydro Power Station will commence once the project achieves financial closure. Currently, ZESCO Limited is procuring a strategic equity partner.

Madam Speaker, there is no contractor for the project yet, as the engagement of the contractor for power stations will be done after financial closure is reached.

Madam Speaker, no company legally owns the site. However, the Government has permitted ZESCO Limited to implement the project.

Madam Speaker, there is no company that has water rights for the Kalungwishi Hydro Power Project.

Madam Speaker, the Government has offered the construction of the transmission line from the Kalungwishi Hydro Power Project to the grid to a private developer, Luapula Hydropower Corporation Limited.

Madam Speaker, during the procurement of a strategic equity partner, seven companies expressed interest in developing the project, out of which four have been shortlisted.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Chibombwe: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for the responses.

Madam Speaker, Luapula Province is not attracting investors, especially in the mining sector, because of insufficient levels of electricity supply, and we thought that the Kalungwishi Hydro Power Station was going to be the solution.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister mentioned that the Government has offered the construction of the transmission line to a company called Luapula Hydropower Corporation Limited, but that company has been at the site for the last twelve years, trying to get permission from ZESCO Limited so that it can go ahead and implement the project. I am made to understand at some point, it even reached financial closure with some companies from China. So, the question is: What is the Government going to do to protect the interest of the local communities and the chiefdoms that entered into partnerships with Luapula Hydropower Corporation Limited?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, I think, the hon. Member has posed two questions.

The Government is not going to take interest in Luapula Hydropower Corporation Limited because it is a private entity. The Government is interested in ZESCO Limited. So, if there will be any development that will be done in that area, the local community will be taken care of.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chitotela (Pambashe): Madam Speaker, let me declare interest. Kalungwishi River passes in my constituency and I have special interest in that project, which I have been monitoring since 2006, when it was being implemented by Lunzua Power Authority. Luapula Power Authority came in, and it has been back and forth. During the official opening of Parliament, His Excellency the President stated that the Kalungwishi Power Project would come to fruition, but it has now been three years. The President spoke about the project in 2021 and last year, but he did speak about it this year. We are interested in the project because the river is wholly within the boundaries of Zambia. We do not share it with any country, and it has the capacity to produce up to 345 MW of power.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister said that ZESCO Limited has the water rights while Lunzua Power Authority does not have the water rights, and we were told that the matter is in court. Further, Luapula River Authority has no water rights. The people of Pambashe, Mporokoso, Nsama, Mununga and Chienge were told that the project could not take off and that the matter had been taken to court because some civil servants erroneously gave the water rights to Luapula Power Authority without the approval of the board and the Minister. Can the hon. Minister confirm that the water rights that were purported to have been given to Luapula River Authority have been cancelled by the Government so that the people of Luapula Province can begin preparing for ZESCO Limited to implement that project.

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, point of correction: The designed capacity is not 345 MW; it is 247 MW. That is the correct position.

Madam Speaker, I stated that ZESCO Limited is going to develop the project. So, all the issues surrounding the Kalungwishi Hydro Power Station are almost resolved. That is why we are confident that this year, we will get an equity partner and move forward.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kang’ombe: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has announced today that ZESCO Limited will develop the project and that it is looking for an equity partner. An equity partner simply means putting money into a project. What will be the shareholding of ZESCO Limited, on behalf of the people of Zambia, and that of the equity partner?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, we are at the stage of shortlisting companies and are yet to have commercial discussions. After we have had the discussion, I will come back to the House and inform it on the Government’s stake in the project.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chibombwe: Madam Speaker, one of the Directors of Luapula Hydro, a consortium of local people from Luapula is from Bahati Constituency, and his name is Mr Mumena. The company has been at the site for twelve years and undertaken some works. Is the Government going to compensate it for the works that it has done so far? Remember that it had title to the site initially and owned the water rights at Kalungwishi.

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, in principle, I would say ‘yes’, but that is subject to the evaluation of the work they have done and the resources that were used in the work they carried out.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mutale (Chitambo): Madam Speaker, is it that Luapula Hydro Power Corporation does not have the capacity to develop and manage the hydropower station? Is it the reason ZESCO Limited is looking for an equity partner?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, we had protracted negotiations, and we mutually agreed with Luapula Hydro Power Corporation that it takes up the component of the project that involved the construction of a transmission line from Kalungwishi to Mporokoso, a distance of approximately 100 km.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Mabonga (Mfuwe): Madam Speaker, is ZESCO Limited going to electrify the surrounding communities as part of corporate social responsibility, like it is doing in places like Siavonga?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, I should state that electrifying surrounding communities in project areas is one of the corporate social responsibility activities that ZESCO Limited will undertake.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: I am sure, we have asked all the questions. This is a constituency-based question, and I suggest that the hon. Members from that area engage the hon. Minister so that they can discuss in detail what the issues are. I will have two more questions from the hon. Members from that area.

Mr Emmanuel M. Musonda (Lupososhi): Madam Speaker, I am concerned because the source of Kalungwishi is in Lupososhi. So, I am an interested party.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister’s response to part (a) of the question is that four companies have been shortlisted and that they have taken interest in developing the Kalungwishi Hydro Power Station. Are those local companies? Further, what are their names?

Madam Speaker: I think, now, we are going into the nitty-gritty of the project. The question did not go to that extent. I do not know whether the hon. Minister has that information at hand. If he has, he can name the companies.

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, the project was advertised in the national newspapers and seven companies responded. Out of the seven, four were shortlisted, none of which are Zambian.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: The last question will be from the hon. Member for Bangweulu.

Mr Kasandwe (Bangweulu): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister is aware that Lunzua Power Authority took possession of that site in 2006 and that it was given mineral and water rights. So, I would like to know what has happened to Lunzua Power Authority? What is its role in the new transaction?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, Lunzua Power Authority was removed from the project because it failed to implement it. That is the main reason.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Like earlier said, I think, the hon. Members can engage the hon. Minister to get clearer answers, because what we are hearing here is – I am not following the story. They can discuss elsewhere because they know the area better and what happened.

INADEQUATE FERTILISER FOR FARMERS IN MKUSHI NORTH CONSTITUENCY DURING THE 2022/2023 FARMING SEASON

4. Mr C. Chibuye (Mkushi North) asked the Minister of Agriculture:

whether the Government is aware that farmers in Mkushi North Parliamentary Constituency did not receive enough fertiliser during the 2022/2023 Farming Season; and

if so, what measures are being taken to ensure that adequate fertiliser is supplied to the constituency during the 2023/2024 Farming Season.

The Minister of Labour and Social Security (Ms Tambatamba) (on behalf of the Minister of Agriculture (Mr Mtolo)): Madam Speaker, fertiliser distribution in the 2022/2023 Farming Season was based on the Farmer Input Support Programme (FISP) beneficiary list of 16,101 eligible farmers who were registered in Mkushi Parliamentary Constituency. Accordingly, 2,415.15 metric tonnes of D Compound and 2,415.15 metric tonnes of Urea were distributed in the parliamentary constituency to cover all the registered and eligible farmers. Therefore, all registered and eligible farmers received adequate supply of fertiliser as planned.

Madam Speaker, as stated above, all eligible farmers received their inputs.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr C. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, it is unfortunate that the substantive hon. Minister is not around to answer. However, I appreciate that the Acting hon. Minister is there, and I know that she has all the information.

Madam Speaker, the reason this question arose is that we have a history. Previously, the allocation for Mkushi North was 19,800, but it was reduced to 16,101. Where did the other allocation go?

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, all eligible farmers, first and foremost, actually fit in the allocation that was given of 16,000 metric tonnes. So, the eligible registered farmers who were in the records of the Government were covered. So, we did not have deficits regarding the farmers who were in the records of the constituency.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Menyani Zulu (Nyimba): Madam Speaker, I have interest in this issue because my constituency shares a boundary with Mkushi North. The problems in Mkushi are the same as those in my constituency.

Where I come from, – I will not the saying because Madam Speaker told us not to, but let us call a spade a spade. We have a problem across this country pertaining to fertiliser. If I am not mistaken, there are over 70,000 farmers in Mkushi North and Mkushi South, but the allocation is for 16,000. Now, if you look at the figures, the registered farmers who should benefit are more than that. We are saying that we should fight hunger, but there is a contrast. It is not really possible.

Madam Speaker, my question to the hon. Minister is: When does she think we are going to sort out this issue of giving less fertiliser to farmers?

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, we are all aware that in any context and situation, needs always outstrip the resources available for responding to the issues at hand. We know that we have come a long way with FISP, which is implemented across the country and had a plan of, graduating, farmers, if I may use that term, who would have participated for a number of years and become sound farmers capable of accessing other resources. That would give a chance to other upcoming farmers and new co-operatives to also participate.

I do not think, Madam Speaker, that we had a programme that could cater for every farmer on the list because we know the resource base that we have. So, the plan of farmers moving on to give room to others who would not have participated was what was going to assist us to get to a place where we gave everybody to get a chance to benefit from the resources. The allocation has been maintained for the past seasons due to budgetary constraints that we all know have always been with us. It would be good if we started graduating farmers who have been on the programme say, for three or four years. We know that some farmers have been on the programme for twenty years, but have not moved on. Until we get to a point where capacity is built in the farmers for them to move on and be able to access resources from elsewhere and expand their agri-businesses, we will not be able to cover everyone. Hence, this Government is focusing on this aspect of graduating farmers to ensure that we can develop and move with the times, and that we do not keep a pond that never gets to flow because, then, we will end up being starved of oxygen.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr C. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, my question was not fully answered. Maybe, let me put it in another way. We came up with the figure of 16,101 because the Government thought there were farmers who were not genuine on the initial list, which had over 19,000 farmers. However, after cleaning up the system, there are currently 72,000 farmers in the register for Mkushi North, and we expected the ministry to not take away our packs and to instead bring in new genuine farmers to meet our allocation of over 19,000. To our surprise, it cut the number of farmers and took away our packs. So, my question is: Where is the allocation, the difference over the more than 19,000? I ask because the ministry cleaned up the system, but there are still farmers who are considered to be genuine.

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, I have just stated that we consume within our means. So, everything that we plan for, including in agriculture, should be within the availed budget. The New Dawn Government appreciates that there are many more farmers who can benefit from resources if available. Of course, we will not stop referring to the legacy issues. We have been in a pond without moving and those rigidities have stopped us from making progress towards being able to cover all the farmers in Mkushi North, like elsewhere in the different parts of the country. We will move in a methodical manner, stage by stage, and remove those obstacles and bottlenecks that have stopped us, for many years, from covering comprehensively all our farmers. This Government is focusing on that, and His Excellency the President has been saying that we have to work methodically. We will crash if we move, just for the sake of moving, to cover even those we are not able to cover in relation to the resources available.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: This is a constituency-based question. So, let us make progress.

SHARING OF NATIONAL REGISTRATION CARD NUMBERS

5. Mr J. Chibuye (Roan) asked the Minister of Home Affairs and Internal Security:

what the Government, position is on the revelation that more than 83,343 members of the National Pension Scheme Authority (NAPSA) share over 39,730 National Registration Card (NRC) numbers, thereby preventing them from accessing their 20 per cent pre-retirement benefits;

what measures are being taken to assist the affected individuals to access their money at NAPSA; and

what measures are being taken, going forward, to ensure that no NRC number is shared.

The Minister of Home Affairs and Internal Security (Mr Mwiimbu): Madam Speaker, the Government is aware of the revelation that more than 83,343 members of the National Pension Scheme Authority (NAPSA) share over 39,730 National Registration Card (NRC) numbers and is addressing the situation.

Madam Speaker, the House may wish to note that the issuance of NRCs is governed by the National Registration Act Chapter 126 of the Laws of Zambia, and that the Government, through the Department of National Registration, Passport and Citizenship, has been issuing NRCs since 1965 in a credible manner in spite of the system being paper-based and manual.

As you may all be aware, Madam, the law does not allow any registered person to have two numbers and the registration process to issue one number to more than one person. All cases in which a registration number is reported to be shared are thoroughly investigated and the situation urgently remedied. Some cases have been as a result of fraudulent activities, which include forgery, and the culprits have been arrested accordingly. The other cases are due to clerical errors and are also being addressed appropriately.

Madam Speaker, all individuals referred by NAPSA to have concerns relating to their NRCs addressed and others referred by other institutions are being attended to and the issues are being resolved. Most of the individuals attended to, so far, in person are true holders of the NRC numbers that they present. What had to be addressed, in many instances, is the order of their names.

Madam Speaker, the Government is currently implementing the Integrated National Registration Information System (INRIS) to address matters like the one faced by NAPSA and its beneficiaries. INRIS leaves no room for any NRC number to be shared due to clerical errors or fraud. The system also provides a platform for interoperability …

Laughter

Mr Mwiimbu: … between systems, hence making real time verification possible. In addition, the establishment was reviewed in 2019 to put in place an appropriate structure to resolve low staffing levels in the department.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr J. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has acknowledged that, indeed, the Government is aware that 83,343 members of NAPSA, share 39,730 NRC numbers. Could he be in a position to state as to whether this has been a build up from the time that he mentioned, when we started having NRCs in 1964? If so, what has the ministry been doing about the problem? Instead of correcting this anomaly, why has the ministry allowed it to keep building up?

Mr Mwiimbu: Madam Speaker, most of the clerical errors that have been identified that led to different individuals sharing identity numbers were made in the period between 1980 and 2010. This is largely due to the period when Mobile Registration Forms A and the log books were being printed in large numbers using a manual logging system. As a result, problems occurred, and we have been correcting the same.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kang’ombe: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has indicated that there are two pieces of legislation and, I think, a third one, that governs the issuance of National Registration Cards (NRCs). Does he intend to bring any amendment to the current law as we facilitate the migration to a digital identification card (ID)?

Mr Mwiimbu: Madam Speaker, I specifically mentioned that there is only one law that relates to the registration of people in this country, and that is Cap 126 of the Laws of Zambia. I did not mention any other law.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: The hon. Member wanted to know if there will be any amendments introduced.

Mr Mwiimbu: Madam Speaker, we will look at the current law. If there will be a need to make amendments, we shall do so and move the same amendments for enactment in this House.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Anakoka (Luena): Madam Speaker, this issue of people sharing the same National Registration Card (NRC) number is not only affecting National Pension Scheme Authority (NAPSA) beneficiaries, but also Social Cash Transfer beneficiaries. The people who were seeking to get NRCs in the most recent field exercise were finding that they were sharing numbers with other people. Now, my question is, as we wait to migrate to the digital system, is the ministry going to provide, for lack of a better term, a template for resolving these issues? It appears that whenever two people share a number, the officer uses his discretion to decide who is not the genuine owner. Sometimes, you will find a sixty-year-old lady sharing a number with a twenty-five-year-old man and the registration officer says that the old lady is not the genuine owner of the number. Is there a standard template so our people can be guided whenever they find themselves in this situation to either be given new numbers or the decision resolved one way or the other as quickly as possible?

Mr Mwiimbu: Madam Speaker, there is a template for officers that guides them on how to solve such issues. That template is not for members of the public.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr J. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, the 20 per cent partial payment is a well-intended move by the New Dawn Government, and National Pensions Scheme Authority (NAPSA) beneficiaries welcomed it. Could the hon. Minister be in a position to give comfort that with regard to the 83,343 members, the number stands has reduced because some issues have been resolved and some members are now able to access their 20 per cent partial payment from NAPSA?

Mr Mwiimbu: Madam Speaker, I can confirm that most issues that had been raised pertaining to double registration have been resolved. In most centres where members of the public are accessing their 20 per cent NAPSA partial withdrawal, our offices are working together with NAPSA officials with a view to resolving problems, if they arise, pertaining to double registration.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mabeta (Kankoyo): Madam Speaker, I am one of the people sharing a National Registration Card (NRC) number with other people, and I am inconvenienced most of the time when replacing my driving licence and other public documents. I want to know from the hon. Minister whether the digitalisation of NRCs is going to sort out this challenge that I have been facing since 2000 when I got my NRC?

Mr Mwiimbu: Madam Speaker, it will definitely resolve the issues that are being raised by my hon. Colleagues because INRIS will be using a biometric system in which there will be no identical fingerprints that will be accessed by the system. Once the system identifies that a particular number has been given to a different person, it will reject the registration.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: The last question will be from the hon. Member for Solwezi East.

Mr Katakwe (Solwezi East): Thank you very much, Madam Speaker, for recognising the good people of Solwezi East in Mushindamo District and allowing me to ask a supplementary question on their behalf.

Madam Speaker, as regards the migration to the new biometric National Registration Card (NRC) system, is it possible that the ministry can start with the Members of Parliament so that we familiarise ourselves with the features and, when we are in our constituencies, we are able to respond to the questions that our constituents will ask regarding the features, security and all that. If we are not aware, we cannot respond. We need to respond from an informed point of view. Is it possible that the hon. Minister can come back to this House and orient us?

Mr Mwiimbu: Madam Speaker, I would like to remind my hon. Colleagues that early last year, I issued a ministerial statement on the Floor of this House pertaining to INRIS. If there will be a need for me to issue a similar statement, with your blessings, I can still do that.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Thank you very much.

That concludes that question.

NUMBER OF RHINOS THAT DIED COUNTRYWIDE FROM 2015 TO 2022

6. Ms Halwiindi (Kabwe Central) asked the Minister of Tourism:

how many rhinos died countrywide from 2015 to 2022, year by year;

whether the horns of the rhinos above were preserved;

if so, whether the Government has any plans to sell the horns; and

if there are no such plans, why.

The Minister of Energy (Mr Kapala) (on behalf of the Minister of Tourism (Mr Sikumba)): Madam Speaker, –

Hon. Opposition Members: Question yakosa iyo!

Mr Kapala: Sana.

Madam Speaker, during the period under review, thirteen rhinos died countrywide, nine from natural mortalities, two from poaching and two from a road kill (upon being hit by a speeding truck). Eight white rhinos died in Mosi-oa-Tunya National Park, two white rhinos died in Lusaka National Park and three black rhinos died in North Luangwa National Park.

Madam Speaker, all the horns from the above mortalities were secured and are currently preserved in the national strong room. The combined weight of the national stockpile of rhino horn is currently 165 kg.

Madam Speaker, the Government has no plans to sell the horns.

Madam Speaker, the Government is committed to conserving Zambia’s biodiversity and its protected areas, and has ratified key international agreements that support those principles. One such agreement is the Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and Flora (CITES). CITES is a multilateral environmental agreement organisation that was established as a response to growing concerns that over-exploitation of wildlife through international trade was contributing to the rapid decline of many species of plants and animals around the world. Zambia assented to the convention on 24^th November 1980 and the convention came into force on 22^nd February 1981.

Madam Speaker, a ban was imposed on international trade in rhino horns in 1977 after a drastic reduction of the rhino population worldwide. Zambia, which once had a thriving rhino population of 12,000 in the Luangwa Valley in the 1970s, declared its black rhino population extinct in 1998. In 2003, the process of reintroducing the black rhino commenced in the North Luangwa National Park, where an initial twenty black rhinos from South Africa were reintroduced. The number has since grown to fifty-nine. The white rhino population in the Mosi-oa-Tunya National Park remains at ten. As such, the Ministry of Tourism, through the Department of National Parks and Wildlife (DNPW), is focused on increasing the rhino population by expanding its range in other parks, and it is not ready to resume domestic or international trade in rhino horns due to the prevailing trade restrictions imposed.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Halwiindi: Madam Speaker, I thank the Acting hon. Minister for that response.

Madam Speaker, you may wish to note that I am a Member of the Zambia Parliamentary Caucus on the Environment and Climate Change, and a commissioned honorary game ranger, …

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Halwiindi: … hence my interest.

Madam Speaker, I took time to go to the Lusaka National Park just to appreciate nature, and I was surprised to find that the white rhinos were no more; they died. The hon. Minister, in his response, indicated that eight rhinos in the Mosi-oa-Tunya National Park and the Lusaka National Park died from natural mortality. What disease could be killing the rhinos? Further, how does the Government intend to contend the problem?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, the information I have at hand is that there is no disease that has been mentioned. What has been mentioned are just natural mortalities. That is the information I was given.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Tayengwa (Kabwata): Madam Speaker, I just want to know whether the ministry intends to place animal identification chips in the surviving rhinos so that we can try to stop them from being extinct through poaching.

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, I do not have that information. I will get back to the hon. Member of Parliament to clarify whether all the rhinos that are currently in Zambia have identification chips.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Menyani Zulu: Madam Speaker, the number of rhinos in Livingstone is not growing while the number of rhinos in the North Luangwa National Park is. Does the Government have any plans to introduce more rhinos in the South Luangwa National Park?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, though I cannot confirm, I am sure, it is the Government’s policy that we get back to the rhino population of 12,000 that we had in the 1970s. I am sure, the Government is looking into that problem.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Anakoka: Madam Speaker, –

Madam Speaker: Order!

Business was suspended from 1640 hours until 1700 hours.

[MADAM FIRST DEPUTY SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Anakoka: Madam Speaker, before business was suspended, I was about to ask a question in reference to what the hon. Minister said in his statement which was that, currently, all the horns that were harvested from dead rhinos are locked up in a strong room. Since we are talking about horns, I thought I might as well refer to elephant tusks. My question, in relation to the horns and elephant tusks, if applicable, is: What exactly is our policy regarding them? Is it to lock them up in a strong room forever, or do we occasionally seek exemptions so that we can dispose of them on the international market or also adopt the policy of burning and destroying them at certain intervals?

Mr Kapala delayed to respond to the question because he was trying to log into the communication system.

Mr Kapala: Sorry about that.

Madam Speaker, the answer to that question is that because the disposal of rhino horns and elephant tusks is usually governed by international regulations, at one time or another, the country applies for permission to auction these trophies. I am sure, when such a time comes, the country will be able to benefit from what it has harvested.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Halwiindi: Madam Speaker, my question is similar to the one my hon. Colleague asked. In any case, I just want to make a comment.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister said that there is an international law that determines the disposal of such Government trophies and that it was formulated in 1977. Has there been any attempt to review that law so that, as a country, we can have our own direction on how we can dispose of Government trophies? I can imagine the quantities being kept in the strong room, yet they cannot even be put in museums so that the country can collect revenue. So, what is the benefit of even keeping them?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, allow me to read a written statement from the technical people in the ministry.

Madam Speaker, the Government has also a stockpile of ivory amounting to about 75 tonnes that has not been disposed of due to the trade restrictions imposed by CITES. The Government of the Republic of Zambia has, on a number of occasions, tried to dispose of the stockpile through the CITES process, but has failed to obtain support from parties to the convention. Zambia has not considered pulling out of CITES due to possible implications of further trade restrictions in CITES-listed specimens, such as hunting of trophies, which would affect Zambia’s conservation efforts. However, the Government still intends to legally dispose of the ivory stockpile within the framework of CITES.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Katambo (Masaiti): Madam Speaker, dehorning of rhinos is one measure of curbing poaching. Of the two species of rhinos, the white and the black rhinos, how many has the ministry or the Government dehorned?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, I do not have information indicating that we dehorn rhinos. However, I can get back to the House and issue a proper statement regarding this question.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

NUMBER OF SETTLERS IN KATOKAMEMA FARM BLOCK

7. Mr Kang’ombe asked the Minister of Lands and Natural Resources:

how many settlers there were in Katokamema Farming Block in Kamfinsa Parliamentary Constituency, as of April, 2023;

whether the Government has any plans to issue title deeds to the settlers;

if so, when the plans will be implemented;

how many hectares of land will be allocated to each settler; and

if there are no plans to issue title deeds, why.

The Minister of Lands and Natural Resources (Mr Muchima): Madam Speaker, according to the Farming Block Model, Katokamema is not one of the farming blocks. There is only one farming block in Lufwanyama District on the Copperbelt called Luswishi. It is not easy to establish the number of settlers in Katokamema, as the ministry has not conducted any social survey to establish the number.

Madam Speaker, at the moment, the Government has no plans to issue title deeds to settlers in Katokamema, as it is still consulting the line ministries and other stakeholders on the availability of land.

Madam Speaker, there is no implementation plan for issuing title deeds in the area.

Madam Speaker, the number of hectares settled upon is not yet established, as no social and cadastral survey have been done.

Madam Speaker, there are no plans to issue title deeds because the land is not planned for resettlement, as it falls within Mwekera Forest Reserves Nos.6 and 84. Unless the forest is degazetted by the Ministry of Green Economy and Environment, will people be allowed to settle there. However, it is important to note here that in 2015, 6,348 ha were excised from Mwekera Forest Reserve under Statutory Instrument (SI) No. 90 of 2015 to resettle settlers around Mwekera Resettlement Scheme. The office of the Principal Land Resettlement Officer was engaged to handle that exercise in collaboration with all the relevant stakeholders. The exercise is ongoing. It has been learnt that settlers who are within the forest reserve have been resisting being relocated to the excised part of the land.

Madam Speaker, the ministry has neither conducted a social survey nor numbered any properties in the area in question. Therefore, it is not in a position to state how many settlers there were by April, 2023. Consultations with the Ministry of Agriculture, the Ministry of Green Economy and Environment and the Department of Resettlement in the Office of the Vice-President have revealed that Katokamema is part of the Mwekera Forest Reserve.

Madam Speaker, the Ministry of Lands and Natural Resources has no intention to issue title deeds, as the area is a forest reserve.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kang’ombe: Madam Speaker, once again, I am grateful for this privilege to speak on behalf of the farmers in Katokamema.

Madam Speaker, the people whom we are calling settlers are actually farmers in that farming block, and they receive farming inputs from the Government. There are two polling stations in Katokamema, and it is a well-established area. The hon. Minister, in his response, indicated that the farmers cannot be given ownership documents because the area is part of a forest reserve. Given the social dynamics in that area, could the Government consider beginning the process of degazetting the area, given the fact that there are people who have settled and social amenities are currently being provided?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, I am aware of this issue. According to the information in the register of the headmen in the area, there are about 17,000 people, and that is not peculiar to the Copperbelt. As you know, most of the areas on the Copperbelt are either mining areas or forests. Discussions have been going on, and we are aware of this issue, as even Government institutions are in those areas. So, as I have mentioned, discussions are going on within the Government circles with the stakeholders so that the Government can decide the best way of dealing with this issue of our people. The area is not a farming block but, of course the people there are farming. As you know, they cannot be removed because they need to have something to eat. However, in terms of legality, the area is not a farming block. Maybe, the Government will consider degazetting the area because the population is increasing for sure. However, we need to discuss and agree with the stakeholders. Until such a time that the area is degazetted, such issues will not be resolved.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kang’ombe: Madam Speaker, I take note of the hon. Minister’s response, but I have a question, and this is for the benefit of our people, who are, obviously, excited that this conversation has reached his office as well as Parliament.

Madam Speaker, money has been invested in that area and close to K4 million is being pumped into it using the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) to enhance connectivity for our farmers there to receive farming inputs on time and be able to produce farm produce and take it to the market. Given that serious investment of resources, how soon can the Government conclude the consultative process so that we can match what is happening in that area with the Integrated Development Plan for Kitwe District?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, I appreciate the hon. Member’s concerns about our people. However, 6,348 ha was excised for them, but they are reluctant to occupy that piece of land, which is available. First of all, something has been done. Let us wait and see what will happen. We have to be very careful, according to our colleagues, with climate change. We have to be mindful of the waterhead that feeds into the Kafue River. Otherwise, Zambia will be a desert. A number of things have been done, and we shall see what else we can do. However, let us advice our friends, colleagues, brothers and sisters to occupy the land they are being offered. I know that there are many Lundas, Luvales, and Kaondes from the North-Western Province in Kitwe. Let us advise them to exhaust the 6,348 ha then we can consider other ways of dealing with the issue. This issue is not only in Kamfinsa, but in Kalulushi and even in Kitwe. I am aware of what is happening on the Copperbelt, particularly in Luanshya, and I sympathise with the people, but the Government is not sitting idle. It shall come to their aid.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr B. Mpundu (Nkana): Madam Speaker, I sympathise with Hon. Kang’ombe, and I have a little history with the land in question, particularly the decision that was made to degazette about 6,000 ha out of Mwekera. When I was the District Commissioner (DC) for Kitwe, I worked hand in hand with the Provincial Resettlement Office to handle that problem.

Madam Speaker, what is true to state here on the Floor of the House is that the people of Katokamema are a different case. The 6,000 ha of land that the hon. Minister is referring to was already consumed as of 2019, when we were handling this problem. I think that what is important now is to have this conversation. There are many people in Katokamema who require assurance from the hon. Minister. Let me remind the hon. Minister that even when we degazetted the 6,000 ha of land, there was a provision that we could degazette a little more to settle the people of Katokamema because they were a separate case.

Madam Speaker, can the hon. Minister assure the people of Katokamema on the Floor of the House that the Government will be very considerate so that they do not panic that it will throw them out, but that it will be an issue of exhausting the channels of communication and engagements.

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Nkana for this question.

Madam Speaker, we need to take stock of what has been said, that the 6,348 ha has already been exhausted. We also need to ignite the process of degazetting the area but, if the area is the waterhead that feeds into the Kafue River, it will be difficult to do that. My colleague, the hon. Minister of Green Economy and Environment, should be invited to the area because the report only comes to me to allocate land to people after he is satisfied that settling on the land in question will not disturb the natural movement of the water. If that is done, why not? We are here, as the Government, for the people. This Government is very particular and passionate about the welfare of its people.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister for Copperbelt Province is always knocking on my door, but we need to balance up the equation. We want to be very sober in the way we handle issues. Do we want to disturb the climate and then have disasters to appease our people? We need to balance all these things and, once we do that, we shall give our people a satisfactory answer. We shall take stock of whatever is happening on the Copperbelt. The Minister for Copperbelt Province, Hon. Matambo, and I are very concerned.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kolala (Lufubu): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has emphasised that he is concerned, but his ministry has not undertaken a study to know how many people are in the area and what the challenges are. He has also told us that the area is a forest reserve. What is so difficult about the ministry being proactive, looking at these issues and finding solutions before it is too late?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, I mentioned that we have not done a social survey, but I have also said that according to the register of the village headmen, there are about 17,000 people in the area. However, the area is a forest reserve and the people are there illegally. So, there is nothing we can do at the moment. We have not legalised the area. If we were to legalise it, we would need to go on the ground and apportion the land, but that is against certain principles. Why should I go and take stock of what is happening in the area when it is not degazetted and the people are there illegally? So, they have to start the process. That is what I said.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chewe (Lubansenshi): Madam Speaker, thank you for the opportunity, on behalf of the good people of Lubansenshi Constituency, to ask a supplementary question.

Madam Speaker, the people of Katokamema are worried, and Hon. Christopher Kang’ombe wanted to know when the ministry is going to resolve this issue. In my understanding, the hon. Minister is not assuring them.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister stated that the area occupied by the people of Mwekera is part of a forest reserve and that over 6,000 have been given offer letters by the Resettlement Office in Ndola. Is he able to assure the people of Mwekera that the 6,000 who have been given offer letters will be issued with title deeds, so that they can be aware of the Government’s position?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, I appreciate the question though it raises another matter. If the area has already been degazetted, then there is no problem. We are on the ground, and I said that I will take stock of what is happening in the area, following what Hon. Kang’ombe, or the other hon. Member’s statement to the effect that the land has already been exhausted. I want to confirm. So, I will go there, but I do not want to delve into land that is not degazetted. So, if it is not gazetted, we have to start the process because this is a Government of laws. That has to be made very clear. However, if people are occupying degazetted land, why not? In fact, I can instruct Medici Land Governance on the Copperbelt to finish the process. People can start the process of getting title deeds using their cellular phones. We are there on the Copperbelt.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

CONSTRUCTION OF STAFF HOUSES AND AN OFFICE BLOCK IN PEMBA DISTRICT

8. Mr Hamwaata (Pemba) asked the Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development:

(a) when the construction of the following infrastructure in Pemba District will be completed:

(i) staff houses for Pemba Town Council; and

(ii) an office block for the Department of Agriculture;

(b) when the works will resume;

(c) what the timeframe for the completion of the outstanding works is; and

(d) what the cost of each project is.

The Minister of Small and Medium Enterprise Development (Mr Mubanga) (on behalf of the Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development (Eng. Milupi)): Madam Speaker, the construction of staff houses for Pemba Town Council will be completed by the third quarter of 2024. The construction of an office block for the Department of Agriculture will be completed once funds are secured.

Madam Speaker, the construction of staff houses for Pemba Town Council will resume in the fourth quarter of 2023, while the construction of an office block for the Department of Agriculture will resume once funds are made available.

Madam Speaker, the timeframe for the completion of the outstanding works on the staff houses for Pemba Town Council will be nine months and while that for an office block for the Department of Agriculture will be ten months.

Madam Speaker, the cost of each project is as follows:

the cost of the construction of staff houses for Pemba Town Council is K4,276,675.15; and

the construction of an office block for the Department of Agriculture was initially contracted at the sum of K377,971, but was revised to a contract sum of K690,467 before the contract expired.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Hamwaata: Madam Speaker, any delay in the completion of a project has a negative effect on the beneficiaries and the Government. My question to the hon. Minister is: What measures are being put in place in the ministry to ensure that projects are completed on time, unlike what the trend was under the previous Government, the Patriotic Front (PF)?

Mr Mubanga: Madam Speaker, the ministry is also concerned about this project. I wish to indicate that the contractor who was given the contract was Cabman Limited, and he was paid an initial amount of K2,171,366.56 and the balance to be paid was almost half. When there are no funds and the contract expires, it is difficult for any project to proceed. So, the ministry is looking into these factors to see what can be done and when the funds will be available.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Malambo (Magoye): Madam Speaker, Pemba is a rural district and it is purely dependent on agriculture. So, once agriculture is not prioritised in Pemba, the lives of the people there will be negatively affected. The hon. Minister has indicated that the works will resume as soon as the money is made available. How soon will the money be made available to ensure that the offices are constructed and the people in Pemba are well catered for?

Mr Mubanga: Madam Speaker, let me give more information.

Madam Speaker, I said that the progress or the status of that contract is at 85 per cent. Then I said that in the fourth quarter of this year, the works will be completed. We are just about to enter the fourth quarter; So, we will look into that within the fourth quarter. It will be done.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Anakoka: Madam Speaker, I am sure, the project in Pemba falls in the same category as the many other projects that were started but later abandoned due to financial constraints by the previous regime, which include many administration centres, especially in the new districts. Luena and Limulunga districts are equally affected. May I know whether it is possible for the hon. Minister to provide a list of the incomplete administration centres and indicate which ones are going to be dealt with at what stage so that the local authorities that are located very far away from the areas where they should be delivering services to the people plan how quickly they can get closer to the masses.

Mr Mubanga: Madam Speaker, there are many infrastructure projects, especially under Local Government that were left unattended to throughout the country due to a lack of funds. When you visit Shiwang’andu, you will find that there are many projects that were not attended to. I have talked about Shiwang’andu just to give more information. Even when you go to Katete, you will find the same situation.

Interruptions

Mr Mubanga: Madam Speaker, it is difficult to indicate now how many projects were left and when we are going to complete them. I think, they were started under the previous Government. So many infrastructure projects were started, especially in the new districts. So, as a ministry, we just have to come up with plans on how to tackle them when funds are available.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Thank you. I think, the hon. Member requested you to come back to this House with a list of the uncompleted projects under Local Government, the new districts. So, maybe, you can say something when answering the next question. Of course, you cannot give the information now but, in future, maybe, you can come back to this House with the list of all the unfinished projects throughout the country.

Mr Hamwaata: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister indicated that the contract sum for the office block under the Ministry of Agriculture was K377,971 and was adjusted to K690,467. My question was: What is the actual cost of the remaining works? I believe, that was my question.

Mr Mubanga: Madam Speaker, the initial contract sum was K377,977, for sure, and then it was revised to K690,467. So, K203,497 was paid and the outstanding amount is K486,960. Once those funds are available, we will continue with the project. At the moment, there is nothing happening on site. The progress is at 55 per cent.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Will you come back with the list of the uncompleted council projects or buildings at a later stage?

Mr Mubanga: Madam Speaker, yes, we will come back to the House and give you the list.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mapani (Namwala): Madam Speaker, going by the calculus that the hon. Minister has given to this House, may I know whether it is possible that the remaining amounts can be included in excess budgets?

Mr Mubanga: Madam Speaker, we are yet to approve the Budget. We will indicate in the coming Budget.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Sialubalo (Sinazongwe): Madam Speaker, the people of Pemba want to get a categorical answer from the hon. Minister on whether the ministry will not start any new projects similar in nature to those in Pemba before he completes their projects and others dotted within the country. They want an assurance from him that there shall be no new projects before he completes theirs.

Mr Mubanga: Madam Speaker, this does not stop us from starting a new project. If we acquire some donor funding, we can start other projects. However, for the Pemba project, we will stick to what has already been mentioned.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

PROGRESS ON SIGNING THE MEMORAMDUM OF UNDERSTANDING BETWEEN ZAMBIA AND THE DEMOCRATIC REPUBLIC OF THE CONGO ON THE LUANO RAILWAY DEVELOPMENT PROJECT

9. Mr Katakwe (Solwezi East) asked the Minister of Transport and Logistics:

what the progress on the signing of a memorandum of understanding (MoU) between Zambia and the Democratic Republic of Congo, on the Luano Railway Development Project was as of March, 2023;

what the cause of the delay in signing the MoU is considering that the financiers have been ready to fund the project since 2017; and

when the project will commence.

The Minister of Education (Mr Syakalima) (on behalf of the Minister of Transport and Logistics (Mr Tayali)): Madam Speaker, no progress has been made towards signing a memorandum of understanding (MoU) between Zambia and the Democratic Republic of Congo (DRC) on the Luano Railway Development Project. This House may wish to note that between 2017 and 2018, the Government received an unsolicited proposal for construction of the Luano Railway Development Project from the project co-ordinator of Luano Railways Development Project Limited. Since the project is not a government-to-government project but a private sector driven initiative, it is imperative for the promoter to get buy-in from Zambia and the DRC before the two countries can engage.

Madam Speaker, the delay in signing the MoU has been due to the lack of a detailed project proposal and indication of source of project financing from the promoter, making it difficult to secure the buy-in of the two countries, the DRC and Zambia. The absence of a detailed project proposal has made it difficult to determine the project viability as well as to ascertain the promoter’s technical and financial capabilities.

Madam Speaker, the House may also wish to note that the Government is not opposed to signing the MoU on the development of the railway line once buy-in is obtained from our counterparts in the DRC.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Katakwe: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has just stated that the Government cannot actually commit. Now, since we are looking at infrastructure, the development of the railway line system and the carnage that has been going on on our roads, is it possible for me to ask the people who were actually moving this agenda to get back to the Government and see if they can get Government buy-in?

Mr Syakalima: Madam Speaker, I think, it is possible. We can try to do that.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

NUMBER OF CONSTITUENCIES THAT DID NOT RECEIVE THE CONSTITUENCY DEVELOPMENT FUND

10. Mr Kasandwe asked the Minister of Local Government and Rural Development:

(a) how many constituencies countrywide did not receive the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) in:

2017; and

2020;

(b) how many constituencies in the following provinces did not receive the CDF in 2018:

Western;

Eastern; and

Luapula; and

(c) why the constituencies in (a) and (b) did not receive the CDF in the years in question.

The Minister of Water Development and Sanitation (Mr Mposha) (on behalf of the Minister of Local Government and Rural Development (Mr Nkombo)): Madam Speaker, out of the 156 constituencies, 126 were funded part of the 2017 Constituency Development Fund (CDF) allocation while the 2020 CDF allocation was disbursed to all the 156 constituencies.

Madam Speaker, in 2018, all constituencies in the Western Province received the CDF while five in the Eastern Province and four in Luapula Province did not receive it.

Madam Speaker, the Government did not fully fund the constituencies mentioned in (a) and (b) above because it prioritised disbursement of the CDF to constituencies whose Members of Parliament were not Cabinet Ministers.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kasandwe: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for the answers he has provided.

Madam Speaker, I asked the hon. Minister this question because some hon. Members, especially those from the Western Province, were saying that there were some years in which they did not receive the CDF. The hon. Minister has just confirmed the constituencies that received the CDF in 2017 and 2018, and I have with me the disbursement of the CDF from 2010 to 2020 that the substantive hon. Minister of Local Government and Rural Development shared with me. So, this question was asked to dispel rumor-mongering and lies.

Interruptions

Mr Kasandwe: I just want to –

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Let us give the hon. Member the chance to ask the question.

Hon. Member for Bangweulu, please, ask your question.

Mr Kasandwe: Madam Speaker, thank you for the guidance, but there is a tendency in this House …

Interruptions

Mr Kasandwe: … to mislead the House that the Patriotic Front (PF) Government concentrated on other provinces when it comes to the CDF. The hon. Minister has just confirmed that there was no such a thing. So, I do not have a question, and I thank the hon. Minister for confirming that.

Laughter

Madam First Deputy Speaker: I do not know whether the hon. Minister has any response to that. It was not a question.

Interruptions

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, it is true that in 2017, the constituencies in the Western Province received the CDF. However, this question has not stopped the so-called speculation. To me, it has confirmed one thing that in the past, the disbursement of the CDF was not only inadequate, but the funds were being given out like in medas in the markets where people ration.

Laughter

Mr Mposha: That is what was happening.

Interruptions

Mr Mukosa rose.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Can we, please, give chance to the hon. Minister to respond.

Interruptions

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

As for the point of order, you just indicate. Hon. Member for Chinsali, you are actually disturbing the House. You rose on a point of order and I was trying to guide you that you are just supposed to indicate, not to stop the hon. Minister on the Floor because it is my duty to tell the hon. Minister that a point of order is being raised and ask him to resume his seat. So, please, can we observe the rules so that we do not disturb the Business of the House.

May the hon. Minister continue.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, from the answer, hon. Members can see that in certain constituencies, the paltry K1.6 million per year per constituency was actually being given piecemeal in certain years. I want to assure this House that never again are we going to go back to those days of failing to disburse money for development. This Government will steadily continue increasing the allocation of funds because the CDF is a game changer and it will take development to our people. We want to take development to all the constituencies, and I am happy that this Government is giving even the hon. Members on your left enough money for them to take development to their constituencies.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Ms Sefulo (Mwandi): Madam Speaker, thank you so much for giving me an opportunity, on behalf of the people of Mwandi, to ask a supplementary question. However, before I do that, let me recognise the hon. Member for Bangweulu for asking this very intelligent question as regards the Constituency Development Fund (CDF), as it has also brought out information in relation to the CDF being given in medas. We have heard that people were getting the CDF piecemeal.

Madam Speaker, with regard to what was happening in the past, whereby people were being given the CDF in medas, for instance, K700,000 out of the K1.6 million, like the hon. Minister has indicated, could the hon. Minister assure the Zambian people out there who are listening, particularly the people of Mwandi, that they will not get the CDF, which is now K28.3 million, in half and that they will be given every year and in full.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I want to thank the hon. Member of Parliament for Mwandi for that very good supplementary question.

Madam Speaker, I want to assure the people of Mwandi that this Government will continue to steadily increase the CDF because it wants to have an even distribution of development to all the 156 constituencies. I also want to assure the hon. Members that following the system the Government and the ministry have put in place, we shall continue to disburse the funds quarterly and ensuring that the money gets to the constituencies in good time. This will be done without discrimination. We will ensure that in all the 156 constituencies, whether there is an Opposition Member; a Patriotic Front (PF) Member, or an Independent Member, we provide the money.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Kasandwe: Madam Speaker, now, I have a question …

Laughter

Mr Kasandwe: ... necessitated by the hon. Minister, who is trying to move away from a very straight forward question.

Madam Speaker, I just want the hon. Minister to confirm something. According to the 2022 CDF Guidelines, the CDF is supposed to be given to constituencies quarterly, four times in a year. I want the hon. Minister to confirm whether it is true that in the current CDF Guidelines, the CDF is supposed to be disbursed quarterly, four times in a year. Is that not a meda type of distribution?

Hon. Government Members: Question!

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kasandwe: This is actually September and we are in the last quarter. Is that not a meda type of arrangement?

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Hon. Members, please, let us not move away from the question.

The Acting hon. Minister of Local Government and Rural Development, do you have an answer to that question?

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, we will continue disbursing the CDF based on the system we have put in place. Clearly, the hon. Member of Parliament wants me to compare with what happened in the past, whereby our colleagues completely failed to provide the money.

Ms Sefulo: Imagine.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, there cannot be another reasonable logical explanation. From my answer, it is very clear that certain constituencies, for example, constituencies whose Members of Parliament were not Cabinet Ministers, were not fully funded because the Government then was broke and decided to leave out –

Mr Mukosa: On a point of order, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mposha: Am I protected, Madam Speaker?

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I indicated in my statement that there were constituencies that were completely left out –

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Minister! There is an indication for a point of order.

Hon. Member for Chinsali, what is the point of order?

A point of order is raised.

Mr Mukosa: Madam Speaker, I rise on a very serious point of order pursuant to Standing Order No. 65, which is about factuality of what we say and providing evidence to support our assertions.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister on the Floor, in his response to the substantive question, indicated that in 2017 and in 2018, which are the years that were asked about, the Patriotic Front (PF) Government gave out the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) according to the money that was there at the time. Is he in order to now change and say that the PF Government failed to give out the CDF? When you have a target of raising 1,000, and you raise it, it means that you have achieved your target. It is as good as a person who has a target of raising 20,000 and achieves it.

Hon. Government Members: Question!

Mr Mukosa: Keep quiet. Do not debate while seated. What is your problem?

Hon. Government Members: Question!

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Member!

I was listening to your point of order, except that, now, you are involving other hon. Members. You are not supposed to involve other hon. Members when you are debating on the Floor. You just have to ignore them because you have the Floor. I was attentively listening to your point of order –

Mr Mukosa: They were disturbing me.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Yes, but you do not have to react in such a way. Otherwise, there will be chaos in the House. Can you, please, wind up your point of order.

Interruptions

Mr Mukosa: I have been guided that I should not engage you, my hon. Colleagues. So, I will follow what my able Speaker has guided. We will finish the rest outside.

Laughter

Mr Mukosa: Madam Speaker, is the hon. Minister on the Floor in order to misguide and mislead himself, mislead the whole nation, the hon. Members here and the sub-region into believing that the PF Government failed to provide the CDF allocation when in the actual sense, it did provide? The only difference is that the amount was just less.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Thank you for that point of order. From what I got, the hon. Minister said that the previous Government provided the Constituency Development Fund (CDF), but not in full. I am sure, that was the situation on the ground. However, hon. Members, that is why I guided that let us not move away from the question on the Floor. The moment you move away from the question on the Floor, you bring in many other things that are not related to the question. So, please, for the sake of progress, the question is straight forward. Can we concentrate on this question so that we make progress. We have a Motion before us that is supposed to be covered today. Now, it seems we are going to spend the whole day looking at questions. Can we, please, be specific to the question on the Floor and avoid bringing in issues that are not part of this question. That way, we shall make progress.

Was it the hon. Minister who was responding?

Hon. Minister, you may continue with your response.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, thank you for your guidance.

Madam Speaker, as Members of the Executive, we have a duty to provide very clear answers and ensure that our people are not misled by the information coming from the hon. Members on your left side.

Madam Speaker, in my response, I made it very clear that out of 156 constituencies, 126 were given part of the 2017 CDF. What this means is that other constituencies did not receive the money. So, in answering the question my dear brother asked, I am confirming here that the CDF was not being disbursed in that particular year to all the 156 constituencies. Contrary to that system, this Government will disburse the money to all the 156 constituencies timely.

Madam Speaker, I am not moving away from the question, but I needed to be clear and to confirm this. Our hon. Colleagues were saying that they had enough money in the Treasury for development, but we took over empty coffers. This confirms –

Hon. PF Members: Question!

Interruptions

Mr Mposha: I am giving more information. You wanted answers.

Madam Speaker, this confirms that there was not sufficient money to go –

Interruptions

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Hon. Minister, are you through?

Interruptions

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Hon. Minister, may you wind up your response.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, in winding up, let me say that this confirms that there was not sufficient money to take development to all the 156 constituencies; that is why the Government then was partially disbursing the CDF to selected constituencies. Going forward, we want to remedy this problem and ensure that all the constituencies receive money according to the laid-out system under Local Government and on time.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Hon. Members, I think, we are now spending a lot of time arguing on this simple question asked by the hon. Member for Bangweulu, who had a motive for asking it.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Like he said –

Mr Kasandwe interjected.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: No!

Order, hon. Member!

You said the aim of asking that question was that you had an agenda. Is it not so?

Mr Kasandwe indicated assent.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Yes, and that is what I am saying.

Hon. Members, in order for us to not waste time, we make progress.

CONSTRUCTION OF WATER RETICULATION SYSTEMS IN MULOBEZI DISTRICT

11. Mr Mabenga (Mulobezi) asked the Minister of Water Development and Sanitation:

whether the Government has any plans to construct water reticulation systems in the following areas in Mulobezi District:

Machile;

Kwemba Malo;

Kamanga; and

Nawinda;

if so, when the plans will be implemented; and

if there are no such plans, why.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, yes, the Government has plans to construct water reticulation systems at Machile, Kamanga, Nawinda and Kwemba Malo areas.

Madam Speaker, the upgrading of the existing boreholes to piped water reticulation systems in Nawinda, Kamanga and Machile areas will be implemented in the fourth quarter of 2023, as per the Mulobezi Town Council Workplan. However, the reticulation system for Kwemba Malo will be constructed in 2024.

Madam Speaker, the cost of the project will be determined at the point of procurement.

Madam Speaker, as indicated in (a) above, the Government has plans to construct water reticulation systems at Machile, Kamanga, Nawinda and Kwemba Malo areas.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

EXPIRY OF GRADES 7 AND 9 EXAMINATION NUMBERS

12. Mr Miyutu (Kalabo Central) asked the Minister of Education:

why Grades 7 and 9 examination numbers expire after two years of issuance;

what the positive effects of the numbers expiring are;

what the negative effects are;

whether the Government has any plans to abolish the expiration of examination numbers; and

if so, when the plans will be implemented.

Mr Syakalima: Madam Speaker, I wish to inform the House that the Grades 7 and 9 examination numbers expire to maintain data integrity in accordance with the structure of the education system as explained below.

Madam Speaker, the Grade 7 examination number is allocated in the year of the examination and expires in the same year if not used. If a learner did not sit for the examination and wishes to register again, he/she is allocated a new examination number for that particular year. Therefore, the expiry of the Grade 7 examination number does not disadvantage any learner.

Madam Speaker, Junior Secondary School Leaving (Grade 9 internal) Examination candidates use the examination number allocated at Grade 7. The number matures for use at this level after two years of junior secondary education, as per the education structure. If the number is not used, it remains valid for another two years. Therefore, the number is valid for a period of four years before it expires. At the point of expiry, the learner is no longer in school and, therefore, cannot sit for a school leaving examination. However, candidates who fail to make a certificate at Grade 9 or are out of school and wish to sit for the Grade 9 examination can register for the Grade 9 External Examination. In this case, they are allocated an external examination number.

Madam Speaker, the Junior Secondary External Examination Number expires the same year if it is not used in order to maintain data integrity. The expiry does not disadvantage any learner because if he/she wishes to write the following year, he/she is issued another external examination number. If used and the learner makes a full certificate, the learner is allowed to rejoin the mainstream and the external examination number will be used at Grade 12 as an internal number.

Madam Speaker, School Certificate (Grade 12) Internal Candidates use either the number issued at Grade 7 and used during the Grade 9 Internal Examination or the Junior Secondary External Examination Number, whichever of the two applies. The number matures for use after three years of senior secondary education. If not used, the number remains valid for another two years, after which it expires to maintain data integrity. At the point of expiry, the learner is expected to be out of school. If he/she wishes to sit for the examination, he/she can enter for the General Certificate of Education (GCE) examination. The GCE number is issued in the examination year and expires in the same year. The expiry of the School Certificate and GCE examination numbers does not, therefore, disadvantage any learners.

Madam Speaker, the allocation of examination numbers and their validity and expiration are in sync with the schooling structure and completion of the course of instruction for each particular level. The two additional years that are given at each level if the number is not used are in accordance with the Re-entry Policy of the Ministry of Education. Therefore, the benefits of the examination number expiring are as follows:

it ensures internal candidates presented for the examinations have completed the required period of instruction;

the candidates’ personal results records are safeguarded with unique identifiers for the purposes of maintaining data integrity; and

it provides an opportunity to account for different categories of candidates in accordance with the system for provision of education.

Madam Speaker, from the systems management point of view, there are no negative effects, as all types of learners are catered for. Once an internal examination number expires, the learner can still write the examination as an external candidate. From a cost point of view, external candidates have to contribute, as the fees charged are not cost reflective, because most of them already had an opportunity to write a free examination before. Additionally, the Government has provided education support through the Constituency Development Fund (CDF), which returning vulnerable learners can benefit from. Therefore, the net effect is that the expiration of examination numbers does not conflict with the Free Education Policy.

Madam Speaker, the Government has no intentions to abolish the expiration of examination numbers because it is a good records management system. The expiration of examination numbers is a control and security measure to protect the personal examination record and is linked to the number of years a learner is expected to have completed the course of instruction. A unique identifier without any accompanying results record cannot be kept active on the database in perpetuity.

Madam Speaker, in view of the response to part (d), part (e) falls off.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

LAND OWNERS WHO OBTAINED CERTIFICATES OF TITLE IN CHINSALI DISTRICT

13. Mr Mukosa (Chinsali) asked the Minister of Lands and Natural Resources:

how many land owners obtained Certificates of Title in Chinsali District from 2016 to 2021, year by year; and

what measures are being taken to encourage more people in the district to obtain Certificates of Title.

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, in Chinsali District, we issued seventy-nine Certificates of Title from 2016 to 2021, as follows:

YEAR Certificates of Title Issued

2016 5

2017 7

2018 5

2019 15

2020 20

2021 27

Total 79

Madam Speaker, the following are the measures being taken to encourage more people in the district to obtain title deeds:

surveyors are on the ground, beaconing areas in order to facilitate title acquisition. The work is being done in partnership with the local authority;

seven townships, namely FTC/Skills, Rural, Mayard, Location, Chinunda, Old Central Business District and Mishishi, have been identified for verification of how many properties each has in order to produce layout plans, number the layout plans, approve them and process the title deeds as the ultimate goal. This process is under the National Land Titling Programme. The implementation of the activities under the National Land Titling Programme leading to the issuance of titles began in the first quarter of 2023; and

in the spirit of decentralisation, once the structure is approved, officers from Lands and Deeds will register properties at the provincial centre, unlike the current practice in which titles are issued from the Copperbelt Province and Lusaka Province only.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mukosa: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister, Dr Muchima, for the answer.

Madam Speaker, I just want to seek clarification; I think, I did not hear properly. Did the hon. Minister say the verification being done under the National Land Titling Programme will be completed before the end of 2023?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, I thank my former classmate, whom I was in the same class with at the University of Zambia (UNZA), studying for a Doctorate of Philosophy degree (PhD).

Madam Speaker, I said that the verification exercise started in 2023 and that it is an on-going programme.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chisanga (Lukashya): Madam Speaker, when does the Government intend to decentralise the land titling office to the Provincial Headquarters for Muchinga Province?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Lukashya for the question.

Madam Speaker, we are rolling out the programme in Lusaka, Ndola, Chipata and Choma. We intend to roll it out to all provincial headquarters through Medici Land Governance that has offices in unplanned settlements. There are shanty compounds in every district or constituency, and we shall go to those areas and give out title deeds. We are already doing that here in Lusaka, Livingstone, Choma and Kitwe. We shall do that throughout the whole country.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Halwiindi: Madam Speaker, I commend the hon. Minister because he is trying by all means to make sure that records are being followed properly, unlike how it was in the past. There were many issues, such as properties bearing two or three numbers, which made it difficult to follow the system.

Madam Speaker, I am aware that the Government has now developed an online system, the Zambia Integrated Land Administration System (ZILAS), and it wants to correct everything. However, when a client pays and discovers that he/she was given a wrong number, the system has no window for the right number to be given and for the money that was paid to be transferred. Therefore, some people are losing money and the people of Chinsali may find themselves in such a situation. How is the Government going to help the people so that they do not pay twice or three times for the same property?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for Kabwe Central for the question.

Madam Speaker, when you have a new system, there are small gaps and teething issues, but nobody will lose any money. If at all one is faced with such a situation, we encourage that person to go and report that to our nearest office, then we can track the problem. We are still developing the system to the fullest, and we are aware of whatever is happening.

Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning. Let me mention to this august House that we had a situation in which the registry was compacted with files and it was difficult to work, and some officers were taking advantage of that to hide files. Now, we are building a new and modern registry. By April, next year, there will be a new registry building and everything will be transparent. We want people, especially the poorest, to be served in a manner that they deserve. We also want them to get the best service from the Ministry of Lands and Natural Resources.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: The last question will be asked by the hon. Member for Mkushi South.

Mr Chisopa (Mkushi South): Madam Speaker, if all the documentation is okay, what is the maximum period, using the new system, in which a title deed is supposed to be issued?

Mr Muchima: Madam Speaker, I thank my colleague, my good friend from Mkushi South, for that question.

Madam Speaker, the new system has eliminated corruption. In the old days, those who had an appetite for money could produce a title deed in a day when they had interest. When they had no interest, it took even five or six years. The reason was simple, nchekelako, nipaseko. With the new system, you cannot –

Mr J. Chibuye: Meaning?

Mr Muchima: Nchekelako means give me something in order for me to give you – Some people were even hiding files. There were also many so-called consultants, and there used to be many people at the Ministry of Lands and Natural Resources, but they are no longer there. The system is –

Interruptions

Mr Muchima: No! I have to protect the interests of our people. Today, even an ordinary person can go to the ministry. In the past, all of us used to fear going there because things were too complicated. One had to pay somebody to get a service. Today, that is not the case, and one can even use one’s cellular phone to access a service. So, in short, one cannot get a title deed in a day because the due process has to be followed. No matter how quickly one would want to get aka ka drop, one will not get it because one has to follow the stages for the title deed to be approved, and that takes, at least, seven days. However, the process is efficient, and when everything is done, we shall be very happy. A person from Chinsali or Mkushi will not need to come to Lusaka to get his/her title deed, as everything will be done using cellular phones, and we shall send officers to rural parts to educate and sensitise our people on how to go about it.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

SALE OF HOUSES TO SITTING TENANTS IN MITCHELL COMPOUND

14. Mr Mulunda (Siavonga) asked the Minister of Energy:

whether the Government has any plans to sell the houses in Mitchell Compound, which were constructed for Kariba North Bank Power Station employees in Siavonga District, to sitting tenants;

if so, when the plans will be implemented; and

if there are no such plans, why.

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, the Government, through ZESCO Limited, currently has no plans of selling the houses in Mitchell Compound. As you may be aware, ZESCO Limited owns the 213 housing units in Mitchell Compound. The units were constructed in the 1970s for the workers who were constructing the Kariba North Bank Power Station. The units are currently being rented out at a cost ranging from K5 to K50. ZESCO Limited has conducted a conditional assessment, verification, investment and insurance analysis of the housing units and is in the process of securing funds to renovate them.

Madam Speaker, the housing units will not be sold, and this decision was made by ZESCO Limited.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mulunda: Madam Speaker, I want clarification from the hon. Minister. I have got the response that the Government has no intention of selling those houses and that the houses are being rented out at a cost ranging from K5 and K50. Does ZESCO Limited have any documentation that clearly states that it owns those housing units?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, sorry, I do not have the documentation to prove the ownership by ZESCO Limited. However, the hon. Member is encouraged to come to our office so that we can produce the information required.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mulunda: Madam Speaker, as far as I am concerned, those were structures put up temporary by the contractor in the early 1970s. Kariba Dam was constructed and, after that, the Kariba North Bank Power Station was constructed between 1969 and 1972. In 1979, the tests were conducted and the power station commissioned. Between 1970 and 1975, the contractor, Mitchell Construction, who was actually working at the power station, built those structures with no foundations. Upon completion of the construction of the power station, the housing units were supposed to be handed over to the council because ZESCO Limited had no ownership. There was no transfer of ownership and, to date, ZESCO Limited has not done anything to those houses; it is not maintaining them. When a house is leaking, it is the occupant who fixes it. To me, ZESCO Limited is collecting that money illegally.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Hon. Member, what is your question?

Mr Mulunda: Madam Speaker, ZESCO Limited has no legal basis for collecting rentals. If it does not have documentation to that effect, then, it should not be collecting anything from there.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: That does not sound like a question. I do not know whether the hon. Minister of Energy –

Mr Mulunda: Madam Speaker, let me put it this way: Why is ZESCO Limited collecting rentals when it does not have ownership documentation, as proved by the hon. Minister of Energy?

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Hon. Minister of Energy, do we have documentation?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, I indicated to the House a few minutes ago that the hon. Member of Parliament for Siavonga is free to come to the office so that we can prove whether ZESCO Limited has the title for the property or not. So, that will be proved. ZESCO Limited is not doing anything illegal and, I do not think that it is in a position to do illegal things in this country.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Simuzingili (Gwembe): Madam Speaker, thank you so much for giving me this opportunity –

Interruptions

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order, hon. Members!

Mr Simuzingili: Madam Speaker, ZESCO Limited is renting out the houses at a cost ranging from K5 and K50? What is it really that ZESCO Limited is looking for? Can the Government not make a decision to sell the houses to the sitting tenants. Basically, it is more costly for ZESCO Limited to own those houses. Does the Government have any plans of doing that?

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, the assets are still on the books of ZESCO Limited. As to whether ZESCO Limited will sell them or not, the decision has to be made by the board. The board has to evaluate whether it is worth keeping the houses or not. When that is done, I will come and inform the House on whether ZESCO Limited would have decided to either renovate them or sell them to the sitting tenants.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Malambo: Madam Speaker, surely, how can a house be rented out at K5 and K50? Is ZESCO Limited maintaining those houses or is it the tenants maintaining them? Looking at the value that is being got from those houses, it does not come anywhere near making them perfect for human habitation.

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, the written statement that I have here in response to that question is that ZESCO Limited is conducting a conditional assessment from which a decision will be made either to renovate the houses or hand them over to the local council.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mumba (Kantanshi): Madam Speaker, right now, in Zambia, insofar, as road contracts are concerned, when a contractor goes on site and completes the works, that site is handed over to the relevant institution. So, in this case, with regard to those houses, of course, ZESCO Limited was involved in the project but it could have implemented the project using a loan, maybe, from the Africa Development Bank (AfDB), and the houses were supposed to be handed over to the community. That explains why the rentals are low.

Madam Speaker, my concern is that so many properties have been taken over by contractors, who buy the pieces of land, and a good example is Ibis Gardens. When Phoenix Contractors was constructing, that area was used for mobilisation and as a camp site, and it was supposed to be handed over to the Road Development Agency (RDA) or the Government after the project was completed. This is the current status and we have seen this happen when airports are being constructed and other big projects are being implemented. Contractors have taken possession of some sites after being given mobilisation funds. It is about time that the Government audited the books and made sure that those properties are given to either the relevant local communities or particular institutions take over.

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, I take that advice, and we will look into the matter.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Mulunda: Madam Speaker, I want to make it crystal clear that I will follow the advice of the hon. Minister, and I will go to his office so that this matter is put to rest.

NUMBER OF BOREHOLES TO BE SUNK IN MILANZI CONSTITUENCY

15. Ms Phiri (Milanzi) asked the Minister of Water Development and Sanitation:

(a) how many boreholes are earmarked for sinking in Milanzi Parliamentary Constituency in 2023;

(b) when the project will commence;

(c) what the estimated cost of the project is; and

(d) what the timeframe for the completion of the project, is.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, the Government has plans to sink fourteen boreholes in Milanzi Parliamentary Constituency this year, 2023.

Madam Speaker, the project will commence during the fourth quarter of 2023.

Madam Speaker, the estimated cost of the project will be determined after the procurement process is completed.

Madam Speaker the timeframe for the project is twelve months from commencement.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Phiri: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for the response.

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister said that the Government intends to implement the project in the fourth quarter. When, exactly, will that be?

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for this question. This project will commence in the fourth quarter of this year.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Rev. Katuta (Chienge): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister talked about the sinking of boreholes in Milanzi Constituency. Is the ministry going to use Government money or will they look for donors like it has done in Chienge?

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for Chienge for this question.

Madam Speaker, we will use Government money. In fact, the council is also using the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) to sink some boreholes in Milanzi Consistency.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Ms Phiri: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister said that some of the money that will be used to sink the boreholes will come from the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) and that the council is implementing this project. May the hon. Minister be categorical. Maybe, let me just bring the hon. Minister up to speed with the water situation in Milanzi Constituency.

Madam Speaker, the lack of clean drinking water in Milanzi Constituency is a serious challenge. Our people, especially mothers and children, walk very long distances in search of water from streams. So, it is a serious challenge. The hon. Minister said that some of the money is from the CDF and that fourteen boreholes will be drilled. That is a very insignificant number. May he kindly clarify that.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for this question.

Madam Speaker, according to the information I have, Katete District Council plans to sink fourteen boreholes in Milanzi Constituency using the CDF, and these works will start in the fourth quarter of the year.

Interruptions

Mr Mposha: I hope, the hon. Member of Parliament is listening because she has asked a question.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: You may continue, hon. Minister.

Mr Mposha: Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker, like I said, under Katete District Council, plans have been put in place to procure services for the drilling of fourteen boreholes in Milanzi Constituency. Now, the hon. Member says that number is insignificant. I want to say that Milanzi Constituency was not born yesterday; it has been there for a long time. Under this Government, within this year, we will sink fourteen boreholes. I understand the challenges of water in the constituency but, again, I think, I have said on the Floor of this House that there has been low investment in the water sector in the past years. That is what is bringing about these challenges. However, this year alone, we will sink fourteen boreholes, and we are still planning for 2024.

Madam Speaker, this is why I asked each hon. Member of Parliament to give us the top five priorities for water-related issues in their constituencies. We have received some submissions but, I think, quite a good number of hon. Members of Parliament did not submit. That information is very important for us because it is going to help us to carry the views of hon. Members of Parliament as we plan for 2024. So, these are not the last boreholes. I understand. We have been talking about the challenges of water in Milanzi, and I want to assure the hon. Member that some boreholes will be sunk in 2023, but we are also planning for 2024. So, we should be able to sink more boreholes and put more water interventions in the constituency, just like we are doing in other constituencies.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Chisopa: Madam Speaker, can the hon. Minister be categorical. Will the fourteen boreholes be sunk by the Ministry of Local Government and Rural Development using the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) or by the Ministry of Water Development and Sanitation?

Madam First Deputy Speaker: I think, this question has been answered, but the hon. Minister may respond.

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, as you have said, I think, it is only right that when hon. Members of Parliament ask questions, they pay attention to the answers. I answered this question but, I think, my brother was chatting there. So, he can check with the Hansard.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr E. Daka (Msanzala): Madam Speaker, does the hon. Minister not think of upgrading the boreholes? We have been sinking boreholes for quite long now. Does he not think we can migrate to other means of providing water for our people in rural constituencies?

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I want to thank my brother for this good question.

Madam Speaker, we make various water interventions depending on the needs. It is desirable to migrate to the reticulated piped water system in an area where there are bigger settlements, for example, a big village or a chiefdom. However, in areas where the population is sparsely spread, it is desirable to put a communal borehole so that people can just congregate and draw water. So, yes, as a ministry, we are graduating to piped water schemes according to the setup of a chiefdom or a village.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam First Deputy Speaker: Order!

(Debate adjourned)

_______

The House adjourned at 1841 hours until 1430 hours on Wednesday, 13^th September, 2023.

____________

WRITTEN REPLY TO QUESTION

PRESERVATION OF REMAINS OF LADY LIUWA

1. Mr Amutike (Mongu Central) asked the Minister of Tourism:

whether the remains of the lioness fondly known as Lady Liuwa that lived in the Liuwa National Park in Kalabo District were preserved;

(b) if so, where the remains are; and

(c) whether the Government has any plans to take the remains to the Nayuma Museum at Limulunga Royal Village in Limulunga District.

The Minister of Tourism (Mr Sikumba): Madam Speaker, the remains of the lioness fondly known as Lady Liuwa that lived in the Liuwa Plains National Park were not preserved. This is because the lioness died in 2017 and its carcass was eaten by hyenas, leaving behind just a piece of the lower jaw bone and parts of its collar. Lady Liuwa was fitted with a satellite collar for monitoring its movement. So, when the signal of the lioness was seen to be static, a follow-up was made to establish the status quo.

Madam Speaker, the remains of Lady Liuwa were not fit for preservation as a trophy and were, therefore, disposed of by being buried in the Liuwa National Park.

Madam Speaker, the Government has no plans to take the remains to Nayuma Museum, as they were disposed of.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

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Tuesday, 12th September, 2023

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