DAILY PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES FOR THE ELEVENTH ASSEMBLY

 

 

 Tuesday, 26th June, 2012

The House met at 1430 hours

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

NATIONAL ANTHEM

PRAYER

___________

QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

MEDICAL STAFF FOR SIKONGO

350. Mr Ndalamei (Sikongo) asked the Minister of Health when qualified medical staff would be posted to the following rural health centres in Sikongo Parliamentary Constituency which are run by unqualified personnel:

(a)    Tuuwa;
(b)    Mwenyi;
(c)    Kaluwe; and 
(d)    Nyengo.

The Deputy Minister of Health (Dr Chikusu): Mr Speaker, the House may wish to note that the country continues to face a critical shortage of professional health workers due to a number of reasons such as low output from training institutions and increased demand for health services.

However, Sir, the Ministry of Health is in the process of recruiting health workers based on the K77,800,000,000 allocated for the net recruitment of health workers in the 2012 National Budget. The recruitment process has already commenced and the Government intends to recruit 2,303 health workers this year. The Ministry of Health will post, at least, one qualified staff each to Tuuwa, Mwenyi, Kaluwe and Nyengo health posts in Sikongo Parliamentary Constituency within the course of this year.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Miyutu (Kalabo Central): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has talked about the recruitment and allocation of funds. However, we have been hearing the same story of the Government going to recruit and deploy from time immemorial. When, in particular, will this be because this is June? When is the Government going to deploy the workers in the rural health centres where people are attended to by unskilled workers?

The Minister of Health (Dr Kasonde): Mr Speaker, I would have some difficulty going back to time immemorial. 

Laughter

Dr Kasonde: However, with regard to this year, I have two comments. First of all, the hon. Member may have seen our notices for recruitment of staff. Indeed, following those recruitments earlier this year, we have, in fact, started sending out staff not specifically to the institutions about which he was asking, which is certainly correct for the country as a whole. We will continue this process to its logical conclusion which, I hope, will be satisfactory for both the hon. Member and ourselves. 

I can add that this morning, I had the privilege of having a discussion with the hon. Provincial Minister for Western Province. Specifically with regard to the case of Kalabo, there is a need to post a doctor there as soon as possible. I think we can resolve this matter very quickly.

I thank you, Sir 

Professor Lungwangwa (Nalikwanda): Mr Speaker, in his response to the question, the hon. Minister has indicated that there is a disproportion in the ratio between the output of trained staff and the demand for health services in the country. Could the hon. Minister of Health inform the nation whether there is a long-term training policy for health that will eventually address this disproportion between trained personnel and the demand for health services in the country.

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, indeed, there is a plan. We have published a Health Human Resources Plan, but, specifically, we have addressed the discrepancy which the hon. Member referred to between production and deployment. I have stated before this august Assembly before that I did hold meetings with deans of the four medical schools and that we agreed upon the output of those medical schools to conform to our desire to fulfill our need. 

Sir, I did indicate before the House that, similarly, we have been in agreement with those who are producing nurses and other health workers to also co-ordinate our efforts. This is a continuing effort. It is the kind of effort that the hon. Member will be particularly good at monitoring taking into account his background in university circles. I hope that he will be sympathetic with our intentions and, above all, acquaint himself with the documentation which we have produced in this regard.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Chituwo (Mumbwa): Mr Speaker, in his response, the hon. Minister was not very clear when he talked about the issue of sympathy. Can he, please, categorically state whether his ministry has any plans to partner with other training institutions for health workers to augment the effort being made by the Government.  

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, we have more than a partnership with training institutions. Some of them are Ministry of Health institutions while others, particularly universities, are not and these are universities. There are also other producers of other professionals outside the universities and the ministry. 

This is the kind of programme that the hon. Member undertook. It is also a programme that we have pursued with even more relentless action, beyond his efforts. I have no reason to believe that we are deviating from the appropriate line of action and that the least we can expect of the hon. Member is support. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

Mr Chipungu (Rufunsa): Mr Speaker, the issue of medical personnel will continue to haunt this country for a long to come. Is it not possible to fast-track the training programme for medical personnel so that, perhaps, instead of them studying for three years, they do it in a year …

Hon. Members: Aah!

Hon. Government Member: No!

Mr Chipungu: What? You are not a Minister. I am not asking you, I am asking Mr Speaker. 

Mr Speaker: Order!

Address the Chair.

Mr Chipungu: Mr Speaker, is it not possible to fast-track the programme so that, instead of the medical personnel studying for three years, the period is reduced to two years or even less so that we have as many of them as possible going out to serve the people unlike what the situation is like at the moment? 

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member has raised a very important issue concerning the duration of training professionals. In the case of clinical officers, I agree with the hon. Member that there is a possibility of reducing their period of training from three years to two. However, our consultations with the Health Professions Council and the teachers have so far led us to believe that, for the time being, we risk compromising the quality of the product. 

Similarly, in the case of doctors, the Health Professions Council remains our guide to the kind of training we should provide, the curricula and duration for them to be registered as qualified personnel. 

The General Nursing Council remains the advisor on the duration of training for nurses. We must keep these options in mind all the time. In our pursuit of quantity, however, we would be doing the nation a disservice if we sacrificed quality for quantity.

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

Mr Mutelo (Lukulu West): Mr Speaker, out of the six health personnel sent to Lukulu West, probably only one will be there for a whole month because the rest would have returned to Lusaka. I would like to find out from the hon. Minister what incentives will be put in place to retain staff in these areas.  

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member not only raises a question, but also calls for me to advise hon. Members in the House to decide what they would like us to address. If we are going to go district by district, outside the district in question, and begin answering questions on staff allocations, we might find that we are working against our own programme. However, I will say of the particular question that he raised that there is an arrangement in place by which we shall determine the problems that will arise and solve them as quickly as possible.  

In some cases, this may need us to go out of the country and recruit. We already have arrangements in place to do this. However, I would like to assure the hon. Member that we have as much interest in Lukulu as he does and that we shall deal with the matter appropriately.

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

KAPALALA PONTOON IN MILENGE

351. Mr Mbulakulima (Chembe) asked the Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication:

(a)    when construction of the embankment at Kapalala Pontoon in Milenge District would commence to enable the newly-installed pontoon to start operating;

(b)    when the Government would construct staff houses at Kapalala Pontoon; and

(c)    what the cost of the project at (a) and (b) was.

The Deputy Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication (Dr Mwali): Mr Speaker, a team of engineers from the Road Development Agency (RDA) has just completed its site inspection of the pontoon at Milenge/Kapalala. It has had consultations with the provincial administration and is now working on the estimates on the proposed construction works. Thereafter, the ministry will source funds to enable the construction.

Mr Speaker, the Government has no plans to construct staff houses for workers at Kapalala Pontoon. Currently, workers enjoy an all-inclusive allowance to enable them rent accommodation. 

Lastly, we await the cost estimates being worked out by our engineers at the RDA. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

Mr Mbulakulima: Hon. Minister, knowing that you are different from Andeleki, who deregisters parties, …

Laughter

Mr Mbulakulima: Hon. Minister, taking into account your answer on site visitation, which has taken so long, are you aware that the Engineering Services Corporation Limited (ESCO) has given the end of June as the deadline and intend to withdraw the machinery that has been worked on? If so, will you be able to prevail over ESCO until you source the money you mentioned?

The Minister of Transport, Works, Supply and Communication (Mr Mukanga): Mr Speaker, ESCO reports to the ministry. Therefore, we will prevail over it to ensure that the work is done according to plan. 

I thank you, Sir. 
    
Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr M. B. Mwale (Malambo): Mr Speaker, considering that this is a rural setup and the huts are generally made of mud and pole, would the Government not consider making the workers proud there by constructing houses for them.

Mr Mukanga: Mr Speaker, as much as I appreciate that question, the Government is not going to change policies depending on the locality. Of course, the policy has been that it will not construct houses for workers when they are getting housing allowance. For this reason, we will follow what is on the ground and not change the policy for the sake of changing.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

MANSA BATTERY FACTORY

352. Mr Chisala (Chilubi) asked the Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry whether the Government had any plans to resuscitate the Mansa Battery Factory, which became defunct shortly after being privatised and, if so, what the plans were.

The Deputy Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry (Mr Mukata): Mr Speaker, Mansa Battery Factory was placed under receivership in 1995 due to its indebtedness to the Development Bank of Zambia (DBZ) and the Zambia National Commercial Bank (ZANACO).

Sir, in 1997, Amanita Zambiana Limited, which is now called Zamanita, purchased the factory buildings, plants and machinery from the Development Bank of Zambia (DBZ). In 1998, Amanita Batteries Limited revitalised production, but soon shut down as it could not be run economically. The equipment and machinery at the factory has since become obsolete.

Sir, although the factory is in private hands, the Government is very interested in the future of this factory and industrial growth in Luapula Province, particularly with regard to the resource endowment of the province. In this regard, my ministry, through the Zambia Development Agency (ZDA), has commissioned a comprehensive feasibility study of the process of adding value to the manganese, which forms a major input in the manufacturing of batteries. Once completed, the study will guide on how we can facilitate investment in manganese value addition; that is, establishing manganese smelting plants that would, in turn, attract major private investments in battery manufacturing.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, I want to thank the hon. Deputy Minister for that eloquent answer.

Hon. Opposition Members: Yah!

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, do we, as a Government, have some mechanisms in place that will show our commitment to the process of resuscitating this company?

Mr Mukata: Mr Speaker, as I indicated earlier, soon after it was taken over by Amanita, the company had to shut down because it was not economically viable. One of the contributing factors, for example, is the infrastructure. Luapula Province has problems in terms of power. So, that is a challenge for industries of the size of Mansa Battery Factory which require a minimum of 10 megawatts of power.

Sir, in addition, this company was set up in 1977. As a result, the plant equipment has, over the years, become obsolete because the technology has changed. Further, the absence of a value addition mechanism and cost effective processes where manganese raw material could be processed into electrolyte manganese dioxide, which is an active cathode material used in alkaline batteries, made it a little expensive to run such a business because of the scale of production. So, it had to shut down.

Sir, what we are looking at now are the value addition processes as well as infrastructure development. The Sixth National Development Plan (SNDP) and the Commerce, Trade and Industry Policy Framework target these issues. Firstly, we need to get power there which can be easily accessed by industry. Secondly, we need to develop the road infrastructure. This will be the basis for attracting investment in smelting the product which, at the moment, is finding itself on the markets in the East. We are losing about 5,000 per cent of what we would have been earning if we were processing it locally.

So, Mr Speaker, basically, that is what we are doing under that study.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Chilangwa (Kawambwa): Mr Speaker, could the hon. Minister shed more light on the issues he has just touched on in his reply when he talked about the endowment of Luapula Province. What are the timeframes? When should the people of Luapula begin to think that Mansa Battery Factory or the Alloy Factory, which is going to process the manganese will start operating or, better still, when would the bigger picture for Luapula Province, which has been bleak over twenty years be restored? The bigger picture does not only include Mansa Battery Factory, which is just a tip of the iceberg, …

Mr Speaker: Ask your question, please.

Mr Chilangwa: When will this happen?

Mr Mukata: Mr Speaker, I agree with the observations that the hon. Member has made. Even as a Government, we have recognised that dependency on mining, especially on manganese, is not sustainable. This is why we have repeatedly said that we have identified core products and endowments in that particular province. For instance, it has potential in the area of sugarcane because of the water. There is also the Mununshi Banana Plantation and a coffee plantation. Those are the areas that we want to target, as a Government, as means of igniting industry or, at least, moving away a little from the dependency on mining.

Sir, as regards the timeframe, I can safely tell you that we will have, at least, the infrastructure in place before the end of five years.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kalaba (Bahati): Mr Speaker, Mansa Battery Factory has been closed and the turning of that industry into a Ferro plant for value addition will obviously create wealth and employment for our people. Can the hon. Minister indicate whether his ministry has already started making headways in electrifying Mansa, which is a cardinal component in the operation of the Ferro plant.

Mr Mukata: Mr Speaker, in terms of rolling out these initiatives, yes, that is being done. However, it is an inter-ministerial activity. The ministry responsible for energy is dealing with that aspect. However, under the feasibility study, what I would like to say, basically, is that these issues have been identified and, as a Government, we are tackling the respective issues that have been identified as bottlenecks in the different units of ministries.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Mbulakulima: Mr Speaker, the question asked by the hon. Member for Chilubi is very clear. It is specifically on Mansa Battery Factory. Is the feasibility study that the hon. Minister has talked about on Mansa Battery Factory or some other project so that the people of Mansa can know clearly what the Government’s plans are? Is it a different project or you are just creating hope in the people of Mansa that Mansa Battery Factory might be resuscitated?

Mr Mukata: Mr Speaker, first and foremost, we have to accept that Mansa Battery Factory is in a particular state. It went under and could not be resuscitated. The reasons that were given were that it was not economically viable and that the machinery was obsolete.

Sir, the important thing to do is identify the reasons the company has been placed in that environment, and these are the problems that we have identified in terms of infrastructure.

Sir, a company might have the best state -of-the-art equipment but, in terms of production, the economies of scale, dictate that, to produce profitably, it has to be at a certain scale. However, if a company does not have the required supply of power, how do you expect it to run profitably or effectively? So, we have identified that quite aside from the issues of batteries, in the processes, there are other products that, perhaps, once we create a conducive environment, investors could be interested in. For example, the electrolyte manganese dioxide is also used as cathode in arc furnaces. So, business people could invest in making that product. If we limit our scope to batteries alone, we will limit ourselves in terms of the market. 

Sir, in terms of directly intervening to resuscitate Mansa Battery Factory, which is privately owned, I cannot commit myself to a timeframe. I cannot tell you that, next week, we will help Zamanita to re-open the factory. What we want to do is create the material preconditions so that any investor who goes there is able to hit the ground running and operate the industry.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

2012 AFRICA CUP OF NATIONS

353. Mr Chisala asked the Minister of Youth and Sport:

(a)    how much money was spent on the preparations for the 2012 Africa Cup of Nations (AFCON 2012) tournament; and

(b)    how much money the Government spent on the upkeep and winning bonuses for the players during the AFCON 2012 tournament.

The Deputy Minister of Youth and Sport (Mr Mubukwanu): Mr Speaker, the Government spent K1,233,170,000 on the preparations for the AFCON 2012.

Sir, K1,228,683,100 was spent on players’ upkeep while K10,279,800,150 was spent on winning bonuses, bringing the total to K11,508,483,250.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Chisala: Mr Speaker, I am happy that, for the first time in the history of this country, the PF Government made it possible for the national team players to bring the AFCON trophy to this country. This is a great achievement.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chisala: However, what was the source of the funds that were paid to the national team players as bonuses when they won the AFCON?

The Minister of Youth and Sport (Mr Kambwili): Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for those accolades because, indeed, for the first time in forty-seven years, the team has managed to bring glory to the nation with the assistance of the PF Government.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kambwili: Sir, I want to take this opportunity to thank the players. I also thank the supporters for the support that the team received. 

Sir, the money came from the Treasury as budgeted for in this year’s Budget.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kalila (Lukulu East): Mr Speaker, I want to congratulate our national team for bringing the AFCON trophy to Zambia even though I know that floating an enterprise transcends politics.

Sir, as far as I remember, there was no K11 billion provided in the Budget for this tournament. So, where is this information by the hon. Minister coming from?

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament must know that, when you prepare a Budget, there is a contingency vote from which you get money for emergencies. In the 2012 Budget, there is a contingency vote from which we got money to pay the players.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Namulambe (Mpongwe): Mr Speaker, it is true that the AFCON trophy came to Zambia after the PF Government assumed office. However, can the hon. Minister confirm that the preparations actually started under the Movement for Multi-party Democracy (MMD) Government.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for that question and want to take this opportunity to inform the nation that had the people of Zambia not given the mandate to the PF Government, the AFCON trophy would not have come to Zambia.

Laughter

Mr Kambwili: Sir, I have justification for that statement. Everybody knows that under the MMD Government, we saw, first and foremost, a coach by the name of Dario Bonetti being brought by the President without consultations with the Football Association of Zambia (FAZ). We also saw perpetual fighting between the Permanent Secretary in the Ministry of Youth and Sport and FAZ. There was no sanity whatsoever in the running of football. At the time we took over, there was no allocation in the Budget for the preparations of the team because of the in-fighting. The ministry wanted to make sure that FAZ failed so that it could prove its point. It refused to camp the team in South Africa and said it should camp in Ndola. When we came in, we provided the money from the contingency fund and prepared the team, including camping it in South Africa where the climatic conditions are the same as those in Equatorial Guinea and Gabon. As a result, the AFCON trophy came to Zambia. So, I want to tell my brother and friend that whatever preparations he made, did not contribute to the winning of the AFCON.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kambwili: Sir, in any case, you left more confusion than what everybody expected.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

MORTUARY AT YETA HOSPITAL

354. Mr Sianga (Sesheke) asked the Minister of Health:

(a)    whether the Government had any plans to expand the mortuary at Yeta Hospital in Sesheke District; and 

(b)    when the Hospital would be upgraded to the level of a general hospital.

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, the mortuary unit at Yeta Hospital in Sesheke has a capacity of four bodies. Generally, it has been operating without any problems.

Sir, the Government, through the Ministry of Health, has plans to expand the capacity of the mortuary at the hospital from the current capacity of four bodies to six bodies by 2013.

Mr Speaker, the Government has no immediate plans to upgrade Yeta Hospital in Sesheke District from the first-level (district) hospital it is to a second-level (general) hospital because the population it serves is far below the population required for a second-level hospital.

Mr Speaker, the House may wish to note that Sesheke district has a population of 95,937, according to extrapolation from the preliminary Central Statistical Office (CSO) Report of 2010. It is one of the eight districts in the Western Province. Sesheke District has three first level hospitals, namely Yeta District Hospital and Mwandi and Sichili mission hospitals. Yeta District Hospital services 41 per cent of the population (about 35,789), while 59 per cent (60,148) of the population is serviced by Mwandi and Sichili mission hospitals. 

According to the criteria that the Ministry of Health currently uses to upgrade a health facility to a first-level district hospital, the population should be in the range of 80,000 to 200,000. To upgrade a health facility from a first-level hospital to a second-level general hospital, the population should be in the range of 200,000 to 800,000. As mentioned earlier, Yeta District Hospital is servicing a population of 35,789, which is less than the required population for upgrading a health facility from a first-level hospital to a second-level general hospital. The three first-level hospitals, Yeta, Sichili and Mwandi, are more than adequate to service the population of Sesheke District at the moment.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

Mr Sianga: Mr Speaker, may I take this opportunity to thank the hon. Minister of Health for the work well done in giving the people of Sesheke a brand new cooler unit. However, I wish to find out if the hon. Minister has any plan of constructing an anti-retroviral therapy (ART) clinic in Sesheke District to reduce congestion.

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member may wish to know that the determination of what services shall be provided takes into account several factors, particularly the capacity to deliver the service. Therefore, in this case, we are not able to provide that service, but it does not mean that there are no plans for doing so in the future. Let us agree to keep reviewing our plans. Let us also agree that, first and foremost, our priority will be towards improving quality and capacity.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister mentioned that space at the Yeta District Hospital mortuary is more than adequate. May I know why the Government wants to increase the mortuary capacity in 2013? The hon. Deputy Minister said that, at the moment, the mortuary has a capacity of four bodies, but the ministry wants to increase it to six despite indicating that the current capacity is more than adequate.  

Dr Kasonde: Sir, it is, indeed, a happy occasion when what we are trying to increase becomes a problem.

Laughter

Dr Kasonde: Most of the problems I have been used to are due to poor supply. I can only, therefore, commend the hon. Member for raising the issue and promise to examine whether we should, in fact, proceed with increasing the mortuary capacity or, otherwise, revise our plans.

Thank you, Sir.

Professor Lungwangwa: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister of Health has indicated that the capacity of Yeta District Hospital is sufficient and, therefore, it cannot be upgraded from a first level to a second-level hospital at the moment. Could the hon. Minister enlighten us on the parameters which make Yeta Hospital sufficient, for now, to service 35,000 people in Sesheke District.

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, I commend the hon. Member for Nalikwanda for being so enlightened. Whether my ministry will come up to equal his level of enlightenment …

Laughter

Dr Kasonde: … is not entirely up to me to say. 

In his response, the hon. Deputy Minister mentioned that our current criterion is guided by the population in the area. It is of course true that above population, there are issues of epidemiological change and other demands. However, for now, the main guiding factor we use is that of the population in the area. The hon. Deputy Minister, therefore, was correct in mentioning that criterion when answering the question.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Speaker gave the Floor to Dr Kazonga.

Dr Kazonga (Vubwi): Mr Speaker, my question has already been raised by Professor Lungwangwa.

MULOBEZI HIGH SCHOOL

355. Mr Sililo (Mulobezi) asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education:

(a)    when the construction of Mulobezi High School would be completed;

(b)    what the total cost of the project, on completion, would be;

(c)    what the initial estimated time frame for completing the project, as contained in the contract, was; and

(d)    who the contractors for the project were.

The Deputy Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education (Mr Mabumba): Mr Speaker, the construction of Mulobezi High School is expected to be completed in August, 2013. The total cost of the project upon completion is K15,623,700,262. The initial estimated time frame for completing the project is August 2013, and the contractor is Zhengtai Group.

Thank you, Mr Speaker.

TYPHOID CASES

356. Mr Mwanza (Solwezi West) asked the Minister of Health:

(a)    how many cases of typhoid were recorded in Lusaka and Chingola from September, 2011 to February, 2012;

(b)    how many complicated cases of typhoid were dealt with at:

(i)    Levy Mwanawasa General Hospital in Lusaka; and
(ii)    Nchanga North Hospital in Chingola;

(c)    how many cases resulted in deaths at the two hospitals at (b) above;

(d)    which parts of Lusaka and Chingola most cases of typhoid were reported from; and

(e)    what measures had been taken to prevent the outbreak of the disease in future.

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, the number of typhoid cases recorded in Lusaka and Chingola between September, 2011 and February, 2012 were 171 and five, respectively.

The number of complicated cases dealt with were as follows:

(i)    Levy Mwanawasa General Hospital handled twenty-one complicated cases of typhoid, of which four had intestine perforations and seventeen suffered septic shock due to typhoid fever; and

(ii)    Nchanga North Hospital handled only one complicated case of typhoid where a patient underwent a surgical operation called laparotomy.

Chingola recorded one death due to typhoid while Lusaka recorded two deaths in the period under review.

Sir, most of the cases in Lusaka were from Mtendere, Chawama and Kanyama while in Chingola, most of the reported cases of typhoid were from Nchanga North Township, Kapisha Compound and Chiwempala Township.

The following are the measures taken to prevent disease outbreaks I future:

(i)    disease surveillance, that is identification, notification and treatment of cases. This also involves contact tracing of all cases, chemoprophylaxis of all contacts and disinfection of all houses of patients and contacts;

(ii)    water sampling;

(iii)    distribution and promotion of bottled chlorine and aqua tabs to all households of patients and contacts;

(iv)    promotion of good hygiene practices, that is hand washing and the use of toilets;

(v)    liming of pit latrines;

(vi)    identification of blocked sewer lines and notifying water and sewerage companies of this;

(vii)    medical check-ups for food handlers;

(viii)    food inspection;

(ix)    inspection of food premises;

(x)    collection of waste in the district; and

(xi)    holding monthly district epidemic preparedness meetings or whenever the need arises.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwanza: Mr Speaker, I want to thank the hon. Deputy for the good answer that has been given to the House. What were the root causes of all those disease problems which the House has been informed about?

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, I think that is an important question which the hon. Member has raised. Notwithstanding my earlier statement on this subject in this august House, typhoid should, perhaps, by now, become a well-known story of contamination of water. We are dealing with a straightforward case of where water for people to drink is contaminated. In this regard, the ultimate action in the controlling of typhoid is the control of the quality of water. I am proud to say, on behalf of the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing that serious discussions, which have been held recently, resulted in significant external funding for complete reconstruction of our water reticulation system. We have a major crisis in this country whereby the water supply to our houses across the country has been at risk. I wish to request the hon. Member to help us to use the funds which have been sourced. However, at the same time, perhaps, I will request the hon. Member to look back to the history of this problem of typhoid contamination and read up the story again. This story will be with us until we deal with our water supply system.

Thank you, Sir.

Dr Kalila: Mr Speaker, if I heard the hon. Deputy Minister correctly,  I think he said that four were cases of perforated intestines and seventeen septic shock, I think, from Levy Mwanawasa General Hospital, but I have not heard exactly what the complication was for that one case in Chingola.

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, I do not have the details for the case which is reported to have needed a laparotomy. My understanding and, indeed, the understanding of the hon. Member who is a learned doctor is that laparotomy is an investigation tool. In this case, we have not been given the findings of the investigation. I do not have them.

Thank you, Sir.

Dr Kazonga: Mr Speaker, the hon. Deputy Minister informed the House that as one of the measures, there are monthly meetings of the district epidemic preparedness committees held. How often does the National Epidemic Preparedness Committee meet so that its operations can be linked to the district epidemic preparedness committee meetings that are held monthly?

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, there is a meeting every two weeks on surveillance for the Ministry of Health which I chair. However, the hon. Member should note that we may, on other occasions, deal with relevant issues without necessarily holding meetings. I think that the hon. Member is very much aware of this having always urged us to take more action and do less talking.

I thank you, Sir.

2001 AND 2006 PRESIDENTIAL AND GENERAL ELECTIONS

357. Mr Chilangwa asked the Vice-President:

(a)    whether the Government had any plans to investigate the credibility of the 2001 and 2006 presidential and general elections as well as the 2008 Presidential By-Election in order to identify possible weaknesses and remedies in the electoral process; and

(b)    if so, when the investigations would commence.

The Vice-President (Dr Scott): Mr Speaker, hon. Members may wish to know that this Government has no plans to investigate the credibility of the 2001 and 2006 Tripartite Elections nor the 2008 Presidential By-Election. The law provides for the election petitions which allow any party that is dissatisfied to challenge the elections within thirty days of the declaration of the election results. Additionally, there is sufficient material in the form of reports by election monitors, both internal and external, who have identified possible weaknesses and recommended remedies to our electoral process.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Chilangwa: Mr Speaker, I would like His Honour the Vice-President to let the nation know how certain questions that are still hanging in people’s minds are going to be answered because people are still not satisfied with the way elections were conducted in the past. For us to forge a better future, we need to understand the past.

Mr Speaker: That question has been answered.

Mr Ntundu (Gwembe): Mr Speaker, His Honour the Vice-President disputed the results of the 2008 Elections. Does he now agree that the PF lost the 2008 Elections? 

The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, we have considerable information from the contents of petitions, including the petition that we took against the 2008 Election, if I am not mistaken, in order to be able to make an assessment. We cannot go into microscopic detail for every election that has ever been held in this country. I do not know whether we lost or won the election in reality. However, we may be able to form a slightly more accurate view when we review the evidence at hand. It is impossible with a 35,000 nominal majority. What do you make of that? That is 2 per cent. What about the United Party for National Development (UPND) in 2001? Are you accepting that you lost or won the elections?

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

Mucheleka (Lubansenshi): Mr Speaker, as regards forging ahead and enhancing credibility in elections, I would like to find out from His Honour the Vice-President whether the Patriotic Front (PF) will provide funds in the 2013 Budget for the continuous registration of voters, as the law provides.

The Vice-President: Mr Speaker, ideally, yes.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

LUANGWA DISTRICT HOSPITAL

358.    Mr P. Ngoma (Feira) asked the Minister of Health:

(a)    when the newly-constructed hospital in Luangwa District would be officially opened to the public; and

(b)    when staff houses would be constructed.

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, the construction of Luangwa District Hospital is in three phases. Phase I was done by African Brothers and is 98 per cent complete. This phase of the hospital comprised the X-ray and theatre blocks, service block and maternity block. Phase II of the hospital will comprise the male ward, outpatient department, mortuary, incinerator and four medium cost staff houses. Phase III of the hospital will comprise female and children’s wards, six staff houses, walkways and all related external works. 

Mr Speaker, Luangwa District Hospital shall be officially opened to the public after phase III of the hospital has been completed.

Mr Speaker, the estimated construction for phase II and III is twelve months, each within an estimated six months procurement process. If the works are undertaken on schedule, Luangwa District Hospital is expected to be completed in the next two-and-half years.

Mr Speaker, as indicated earlier, the construction of the district hospital is done in a phased approach. The Government intends to construct ten staff houses at Luangwa District Hospital. Four staff houses will be constructed in phase II and the remaining six will be constructed in phase III. The Procurement process for Phase II is expected to commence in the second quarter of 2012. 

I thank you, Sir.

Mr P. Ngoma: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Minister aware that the delay in opening Luangwa District Hospital is causing a problem because the hospital is built along the animal corridors and far from the community, hence it has been turned into a station for elephants because …

Mr Speaker: What is your question?

Mr P. Ngoma: Mr Speaker, my question is whether the hon. Minister is aware.

Hon. Members: Aware of what?

Mr P. Ngoma: I have just been talking about the place being deserted …

Hon. MMD Member: Abandoned.

Mr P. Ngoma: Yes, it has been abandoned. As a result, elephants have turned the hospital premises into some sort of a station.

Interruptions

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, I was pausing to just see whether elephants came under the Ministry of Health.

Laughter

Dr Kasonde: However, I do recognise that any delay in the construction of a hospital is bound to cause inconvenience. Anything we can do to speed up that process will be done.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mbewe (Chadiza): Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister said that phase III is the last stage of construction before the hospital can be opened. However, there are some hospitals such as Chadiza General Hospital, whose construction level is qualified as phase III, but have not been opened to date and ‘vandalisation’ is taking place. 

Hon. Government Members: ‘Vandalisation’?

Laughter

Mr Mbewe:  I would like to find out what measures the ministry is taking to open the hospital.

Mr Speaker: That is a new question.

Mr Chipungu: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out from the hon. Minister whether he has personally been to Luangwa to appreciate the problems that the hon. Member of Parliament for Feira is highlighting.

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, I have not personally been to the place that has been talked about. I have been to the province and have intentions to visit as many institutions as I can. However, my colleagues in the ministry have definitely been there, but the mandate they were given when they went to visit just happens not to have included the activities of species other than human beings.

I thank you, Sir.

Laughter

DISTRIBUTION OF SCHOOL DESKS IN KALABO

359. Mr Miyutu asked the Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education:

(a)    when the school desks that were offloaded at the District Education Board Secretary’s (DEBS) office in Kalabo would be distributed to the beneficiary schools; and

(b)    why the distribution exercise had delayed.

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, before I answer the question, let me provide the context of the procurement and distribution of desks.

Mr Speaker, when desks are procured, there are two modalities engaged in their distribution. The single-sitter desks are distributed directly to the high schools. The double-sitter desks, which are meant for primary schools, are distributed to the various DEBS offices, which subsequently distribute them to beneficiary schools.

Mr Speaker, 6,107 desks were offloaded at the DEBS’ office in Kalabo. Out of those, 3,577 have since been collected by the beneficiary schools, leaving a balance of 2,530 school desks not collected. The 2,530 school desks will be delivered once the funds are released to the DEBS office to enable it distribute the desks to beneficiary schools.

Mr Speaker, the distribution exercise has been delayed because of limited funding to the DEBS’ office. However, the ministry has requested all the DEBS offices – because I am sure that it is not only in Kalabo where desks are lying idly at the DEBS offices – to send their cost estimates for the transportation of the desks to the respective schools. I also take this opportunity to appeal to hon. Members of Parliament here present, who are facing this challenge of desk distribution in their constituencies, to urge the DEBS offices in their districts to write to the ministry so that funds are allocated to them for this purpose.

Thank you, Sir. 

Mr Miyutu: Mr Speaker, can the hon. Minister confirm that the Government has contributed to the poor provision of education in Kalabo due to the non-delivery of desks.

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, I cannot confirm that. The hon. Member for Kalabo Central should recognise that this is a historical issue which the PF Government inherited. However, we are doing our best to ensure that those desks in Kalabo reach the beneficiary schools as soon as possible. I would like to ask the hon. Member of Parliament for Kalabo Central to ask the DEBS  office in his area to write to the ministry based on the information we have given, if it has not done so, so that we can give it the money for this programme.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Zimba (Kapiri Mposhi): Mr Speaker, there are some desks that have been stationed at the DEBS office for one year. Does the hon. Minister know about this?

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, I do not know about that. However, I thank the hon. Member of Parliament for bringing it to my attention. This is why I said that all the districts in this country which have desks stationed at the DEBS’ offices should write to the Ministry of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education so that they inform us the cost required to transport them to the beneficiary schools. The hon. Member of Parliament for Kapiri Mposhi should find out from the DEBS Office whether it has communicated to us so that we can provide the funding.

Ms Imenda (Luena): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out whether the hon. Minister is aware that some desks are sometimes rendered unusable because the nuts and screws are missing by the time they reach the beneficiary schools.

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, we are aware about that. When that information is brought to our attention, we liaise with the respective suppliers to ensure that they correct the shortcoming.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Namulambe: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister has acknowledged that he is aware of the challenge of funding that the DEBS are faced with. Since the ministry is aware of this, why does it wait for information on how much is required to carry out the delivery of desks to beneficiary schools instead of sending the money in advance?

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, as I said in my preamble in response to the question by the hon. Member of Parliament for Kalabo Central, there are two ways of distributing desks to the schools. Some of the desks intended for high schools are distributed directly to the schools while desks meant for primary schools are delivered to the DEBS’ office before they are sent to the beneficiary schools. As regards the desks taken to the DEBS’ offices, we, as a ministry, do not know the distances between the offices and the various schools. This is why we request them, since they have information at the grassroots, to write to the ministry, informing it on how much is needed to transport the desks.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mufalali (Senanga): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out whether the hon. Minister is aware that the procedure he is talking about has been followed by the DEBS for Senanga. We gave the ministry the bill. However, it has not yet responded, and it is one ministry that is known not to respond to issues. Is he aware about this?

Mr Mabumba: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Senanga should realise that I am a person who likes to follow up issues. Before I answer his question, let me say that during the indabas we have been having in different provinces, certain issues have been brought to our attention. For example, in Central Province, we were informed that there is one high school in Mukande which did not have water. When I came back to Lusaka, I told the hon. Minister of Education, Science, Vocational Training and Early Education about this. We went there a week ago to see what was on the ground. As I speak, there is some work being done to provide water to that School. Furthermore, I was informed by Hon. Sakeni that Mabumba Secondary School had no teachers’ houses. I had to go there to check what was happening on the ground. 

Sir, since the hon. Member for Senanga has brought to the attention of the ministry the fact that Senanga, through its DEBS Office, provided the adequate information to have its desk distribution funded, I am going to make a follow up on his behalf. 

I thank you, Sir.   

{mospagebreak}

HEALTH CENTRES IN KWACHA

360. Mr Mutale (Kwacha) asked the Minister of Health:

(a)    when health centres in Kwacha Parliamentary Constituency  would start operating for twenty-four hours a day;

(b)    when the ambulance service would be introduced in the constituency; and

(c)    when a clinic would be built in Chantete.

Dr Chikusu: Mr Speaker, the challenge that the health facilities in Kwacha are faced with is that of staffing. The shortage of staff has hindered the facilities from operating for twenty-four hours everyday. Kitwe District has about thirty operational health facilities and only those with maternity facilities are currently operating twenty-four hours everyday. 

Sir, the Government is in the process of creating more positions for nurses, clinical officers and other staff to boost the existing staff levels to enable more facilities to operate twenty-four hours everyday.

Mr Speaker, the Kitwe District Office has one ambulance, which caters for the thirty health facilities in the district. This ambulance has been allocated to ferry complicated maternal cases from all health facilities, including those in Kwacha Constituency that are referred to Kitwe Central Hospital. The ministry has commenced the procurement process of additional ambulances and the Government will allocate more ambulances to Kitwe in order to enhance the service.

Mr Speaker, the Government has plans to construct health posts around the country and Chantete is one of the areas were a health post is earmarked for construction in 2012.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mutale: Mr Speaker, there is a community-based clinic in Chantete which was constructed by the community. Is the Government going to consider upgrading or completing it so that people can be using it while plans to build the new clinic are underway?

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, I think the hon. Member should raise this as a separate question. However, we do not think that it is appropriate to have temporary structures when we know that we are in the process of creating a completely new structure. Perhaps, the hon. Member and I can further discuss this matter when I visit the Copperbelt at the weekend.

I thank you, Sir.

Dr Kalila: Mr Speaker, I would like to find out whether one ambulance for thirty health facilities does not negate the principle of equity and, obviously, access to health facilities by the people of this area and whether he considers the provision of an additional two ambulances as an emergency. 

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, as a ministry, we are definitely committed to universal coverage. In this process, it is clear that that cannot be achieved all at once. In this process, it is also clear that unless we start now, we shall never achieve our objective.

Sir, for this reason, I would submit that our intention to provide, at least, one ambulance to each district hospital this year, is a good start.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Ndalamei (Sikongo): Mr Speaker, I would like to find out why health workers in towns are not allowed to work for twenty-four hours while those in rural areas attend to maternity cases, screening and so on and so forth for twenty-four hours.

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, the ministry is fully aware that in the rural areas, more demand may be made on the time of work for those officers we have posted there. Indeed, that is why it is necessary to provide specific incentives to ensure that people stay there. 

Sir, I think that those incentives should not only be what can be provided by the Ministry of Health, but also what the local community can provide in terms of support to those who we send to rural areas.

Mr Speaker, to this end, I would hope that the hon. Member could spearhead this movement of ensuring that communities are supportive to their health workers in order to retain them.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Sing’ombe: Mr Speaker, may I know whether the ministry does not qualify to use contingency funds as the Ministry of Youth and Sport did to avert problems. One ambulance against thirty health posts is not acceptable.

Dr Kasonde: Mr Speaker, I think that we took a risk in stating that from time to time, we are obliged to use contingency funds. I think it is inappropriate for details of the way we use contingency funds to become a matter for moment to moment analysis.

Sir, we certainly appreciate access to that fund, specifically in the case of ambulances. We have not, so far, found it appropriate to do so. However, I agree only to the extent that we have access to those funds.

I thank you, Sir.

KAOMA TOWNSHIP WATER RETICULATION SYSTEM

361. Mr Antonio (Kaoma Central) asked the hon. Minister of Local Government and Housing when the water reticulation system in Kaoma Township would be upgraded to cater for the growing population.

The Deputy Minister of Local Government and Housing (Mr Masumba): Mr Speaker, I wish to inform this august House that the Ministry of Local Government and Housing and the Danish Development Agency (DANIDA) have been providing financial support to the Western Water and Sewerage Company (WWSC) for improvement of water supply in company-serviced areas.

Sir, in Kaoma, the WWSC will carry out the following works to improve water supply:

(a)    rehabilitation of the backbone of the existing water reticulation system and extension of water supply to unserviced areas. The contract for the works was signed on 1st May, 2012, and the cost of works is approximately K3.2 billion. The contractor (Logical Systems Limited) moved on site on 21st May, 2012. The scope of works for this activity is as follows:

(i)    rehabilitation of existing boreholes and replacement of pumps;

(ii)     drilling and equipping of three new boreholes;

(iii)    replacement of high lift pumps at the water treatment plant and installation of a new chlorination system;

(iv)    replacement of 1,430m of treated water raising main pipelines; and 

(v)    extension of water distribution network to unserviced areas.

(b)    metering of 1,200 domestic customers. The cost of this activity is approximately K1 billion.

(c)    location and repairing of leakages in the existing water distribution. The repair works are also estimated at a total cost of K640 million.

I thank you, Sir.

2012 AFRICA CUP OF NATIONS AWARD

362.    Mr Bwalya (Lupososhi) asked the hon. Minister of Youth and Sport:

(a)    how much money, in addition to the trophy, the Zambia National Football Team was given for winning the AFCON 2012 Tournament;

(b)    of the amount at (a), how much was given to each player;

(c)    what benefits, in monetary terms, accrued to the nation for winning the 2012 AFCON Tournament;

(d)    whether the Government had any plans of using the proceeds of the 2012 AFCON towards the development of football in the country and, if so, what the plans were; and

(e)    what plans the ministry had to develop football in Lupososhi Parliamentary Constituency.

Mr Kambwili: Mr Speaker, to avoid the risk of giving inconclusive information, with leave of the House, we request that we come up with a ministerial statement on Thursday so that we can comprehensively deal with this issue.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Speaker: Order!

Leave granted.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

COPPER, COBALT AND GOLD EXPORT

363. Mr Siamunene (Sinazongwe) asked the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning:
    
(a)    how much money the country earned from the export of copper, cobalt and gold from March, 2009, to February, 2012;

(b)    how much of this amount was repatriated back to Zambia; and

(c)    what measures the Government had taken to ensure that earnings from mineral exports were utilised on the development of the local economy.

The Minister of Finance and National Planning (Mr Chikwanda): Mr Speaker, available statistics indicate that between the first quarter of 2009 and the first quarter of 2012, a total of US$18,241.3 million was earned from the export of copper, cobalt and gold. 

Sir, the total earnings from copper exports amounted to US$17,175.9 million while those from cobalt exports amounted to US$768.6 million.

Mr Speaker, during the same period, a total of US$296.8 million was earned from gold exports.

Mr Speaker, the Government has no specific information on the amounts of foreign exchange earnings that were repatriated to Zambia during the period March, 2009 to February, 2012. This is because Zambia has a liberalised foreign exchange system. In this regard, exporting companies are not obliged to repatriate their foreign exchange earnings back to Zambia. These companies spend their earnings based on their export and investment plan requirements. However, the Government is giving consideration for legislation to make it mandatory for all exporters to bring back export earnings to the country. This will not entail exchange controls, as exporting companies will be allowed to source all their foreign exchange requirements from the commercial banks without recourse to the Bank of Zambia.

Mr Speaker, in order to address this matter, the Government increased mineral royalty tax from 3 per cent to 6 per cent. This has resulted in the doubling of mineral tax revenue compared to what the Government obtained last year. 

Sir, the Government is in the process of strengthening the capacities of key institutions in the monitoring of minerals produced, exports and ensuring that appropriate declaration and payment of royalty and corporate taxes are made. Tax revenues from the mining sector have been spent on among other things, financing infrastructure development such as construction and maintenance of roads, building of schools and hospitals and provision of social services. The Government will also dedicate a considerable portion of mining tax revenues to economic diversification. In this case, priority will be given to sectors such as agro-processing and tourism, which highly contribute to the job creation and poverty reduction.

Mr Speaker, I thank you.

Mr Siamunene: Mr Speaker, will the hon. Minister agree or disagree with me that this is a huge amount of money and, if repatriated, it would also contribute to the reduction of interest rates in Zambia which are currently unbearable.

Mr Chikwanda: Mr Speaker, I want to express my profound gratitude to the hon. Member for reinforcing what we are just about to do to require all exporters of either minerals or those in the agro-sector to bring back their export earnings to Zambia.

I thank you, Sir.

Ms Imenda: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister mentioned that because of the liberalised economy, the Government could not keep track or rather the money that was earned could not benefit Zambia. Is Zambia the only liberalised economy in the world? I believe that other liberalised economies compel that export earnings first pass through the country before they can be channeled to other investments abroad.

Mr Chikwanda: Mr Speaker, in perspective, we have just recently supplanted a Government which was an absentee landlord, …

Laughter

Mr Chikwanda: …which did not think it was their primary duty to superintend the interest of the Zambians. That era has come to an end. I can only thank the hon. Member for Luena for reinforcing us because that liberalisation went a little bit too far. In any case, these questions were asked a long time ago and, by the time they are answered, they would have been overtaken by events. I can assure the hon. Member for Luena that her concerns are fully taken on board and that she will soon see a different situation.

I thank you, Sir.

Ms Kalima (Kasenengwa): Mr Speaker, following the failure by the PF Government to deliver their promises, especially on the windfall tax, …

Interruptions

Ms Kalima: … to the extent of saying that those advocating for it are lunatics, what measures has the Government put in place to ensure that the mines declare all the minerals? For example, where deposits of gold are found where copper is mined, what measures are in place to ensure that the gold which is mined is declared and not exported secretly?

Mr Chikwanda: Mr Speaker, again, the very legitimate and profound concerns of the hon. Member for Kasenengwa are being taken care of. Gold used to be sneaked out without the knowledge of the Government. At the moment, before the gold is flown out of the country, the Zambia Revenue Authority (ZRA) officials inspect the amounts of gold and verify that the gold being exported is what has been declared. Again, I am very grateful to the hon. Members for raising issues which are of concern to the country. I think, as I said, without any intention to be derisory, in the past, the party which we have since supplanted, did not mind about these things. Primacy was assigned to personal interests other than to national interests. Now, we have corrected that course.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Kalila: Mr Speaker, the issue of windfall tax has been laid to rest by the Patriotic Front Government through the able explanations of the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning. However, we still continue to hear some voices that advocate for this very important policy measure such as the Jesuit Centre for Theological Reflection (JCTR) and the Civil Society for Poverty Reduction (CSPR). Is there any chance of, perhaps, a rethink with regard to this policy measure?

Mr Chikwanda: Mr Speaker, sometimes, our civil society and churches, including the Zambia Episcopal Conference (ZEC), who are my bishops because I am very much in that theater, make assertions which are not based on adequate facts. I would like to invite them for a discussion. I think the hon. Member should not wait until we come to Parliament to raise questions. If the hon. Member has some concerns and proposals about such measures, he should come over to the ministry. Those are public institutions and not for the PF alone. This question of just bringing slogans on windfall tax and other things can be very misleading sometimes. Currently, there is a dip in the price of commodities. Prices for all commodities, including copper, have a downward slide. I would hope that they would not slide very much below US$7,000 per metric tonne so that some of the mines take draconian measures like reducing staff levels in order to cut the cost. The real world is not like that. We should not take immutable positions on economic issues. We should not take theological stances. We should always examine the situation and adjust as circumstances require. 

The current tax structure of enhanced royalty tax which, at 6 per cent and, if need be, can go up, brings about enough money in the public confers. Whether you call it windfall tax or whatever name, is immaterial. The hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning should use common sense, not be bound by slogans or stances that are unsustainable. The hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning will treat companies as cows. When he wants to get milk from those cows, what he does is to create a good environment for the cows to grow and feed them well, in the hope that he can extend both the lactation period and even the yields from those cows. It is foolish for the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning to do things that shall precipitate and can kill the cows because, then, he will not get any milk.

Laughter

Mr Chikwanda: As a Government, we are open to any suggestions. Therefore, I warmly invite the hon. Member to come over to the office so that we can discuss these issues. We are quite prepared to benefit from his reflections and change our stance if we find that the hon. Member’s approach is better than ours. These are national issues over which nobody has a monopoly of wisdom and this Government is prepared to listen to you, hon. Members, on whatever proposals you have but, perhaps, we cannot fix such issues in Parliament. We can make some suggestions, but they are a bit intricate in fixing this arrangement.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, Hear!

Mr Lufuma: Mr Speaker, my concerns have been well articulated by Hon. Kalila.

Mr Hamudulu (Siavonga): Mr Speaker, I would like to appreciate some of the answers given by the hon. Minister who is taking a lot of time in answering questions. He has assured us that all the mineral deposits, for example, the gold present in the copper that is mined, will be accounted for. However, can he outline the measures that he has put in place to make sure that these minerals are accounted for.

Mr Chikwanda: Mr Speaker, there are many measures we are putting in place which may even include putting weigh bridges at the mine gates for us to know what is going on. However, again, if there are hon. Members of Parliament whose task is to be custodians of the interest of this country and think that they  have useful proposals, I insist that we are quite prepared to discuss them when we have a little more time to listen to them. So, we will listen to hon. Members if they have any proposals, but we are taking adequate steps to monitor what goes on. This is why, of course, apart from monitoring, we are also going to come up with an arrangement whereby all the export proceeds are brought back to Zambia.

Mr Speaker, we want to do everything possible that is in the interest of the country and strengthens the economy of this country, which has since been turned into a niche for outsiders to benefit from. We kept talking about an enabling environment. Yes, there was an enabling environment for foreigners, but there was an irreversibly disenabling environment for Zambians. Now, we want to change the rules and make it enabling for Zambians as well. 

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

{mospagebreak}

ISLAMIC BANKING IN ZAMBIA

364. Mr Matafwali (Bangweulu) asked the Minister of Finance and National Planning whether the Government had any plans to encourage Islamic banking in Zambia.

Mr Chikwanda: Mr Speaker, I want to put the question into context so that hon. Members of this august House and, indeed, the general public may understand the concept better. Islamic banking simply refers to a banking system that is based on Sharia …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! 

Business was suspended from 1615 hours until 1630 hours.

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mr Chikwanda: Mr Speaker, before business was suspended, I was saying Islamic banking simply refers to a banking system that is based on Sharia principles or Islamic Law. It is guided by underlined economic fundamentals. The basic principles which are behind Islamic banking are also the distinguishing factors to conventional banking and these are:

(i)    the sharing of profit and loss; and
(ii)    the prohibition of the collection and payment of interest.

Mr Speaker, under Islamic banking, activities must be underpinned by underlined economic activity. This means that the bank will support ventures to acquire assets to be used in productive activities such that there is a direct link between the ultimate profit and the actual productivity of such ventures.

Sir, given that the Islamic community in Zambia makes a significant contribution to the economy in various sectors, the absence of ethically Sharia-compliant banking services and products result in financial exclusion. This implies that huge sums of moneys collected by businesses run by the Muslims may end up in homes and will not enter the financial system. The net effect of this is that, the ultimate liquidity available for intermediation in the financial markets is low, thereby putting upward pressures on the interest rates in the financial markets.

Sir, in this regard, the Government, through the Bank of Zambia, has finalised the development of regulations to guide the operations of Islamic banking in Zambia. The objectives of these regulations are to:

(i)     expand financial inclusion to the Muslim community in Zambia; and

(ii)    provide cost effective alternative banking products and services, particularly in the light of high cost of borrowing since Islamic banking relies on profit sharing and not interest.
Mr Speaker, the Islamic banking regulations are expected to come into effect later this year, once the final approval processes have been completed. Further, it is worth noting that Islamic banking products and services are not restricted to the Moslem community. Rather, any economic unit is free to access them. It is, therefore, expected that competition in the banking sector as well as productivity in the economy will be enhanced. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Mr Mwiimbu (Monze Central): Mr Speaker, I think that I heard the hon. Minister of Finance and National Planning loud and clear when he indicated that Islamic banking is based on Sharia Law. Will Zambia, a Christian nation that does not support Sharia Law, adapt the law to allow Islamic banking?

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Chikwanda: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member for Monze Central is always combative. 

Laughter 

Mr Chikwanda: However, if one listens to him very carefully, he/she realises that he raises issues that are quite …

Hon. Government Member: Irrelevant.

Laughter 

Mr Chikwanda: No, not irrelevant. He raises issues that are quite profound. 

Islamic banking will operate on Islamic principles, but this country does not operate on Sharia Law. Muslims, on the other hand, operate on the basis of Islamic principles. By Sharia Law, we mean Islamic principles such as not charging interest. Do not think that allowing Hindus, Moslems or Buddhists to operate their banks will mean adopting their laws. As long as their operations are within the confines of the Zambian legal system, they will be allowed to operate their banks. If this answer is not satisfactory to Hon. Mwiimbu or his conscience is still rattled, we are quite prepared to dialogue. 

Mr Speaker, I thank you. 

______

MOTION

REPORT OF THE COMMITTEE ON TOURISM, INFORMATION AND BROADCASTING SERVICES 

Mr Pande (Kasempa): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do adopt the Report of the Committee on Tourism, Information and Broadcasting Services for the First Session of the Eleventh National Assembly, laid on the Table of the House on 15th June, 2012. 

Mr Speaker: Is the Motion seconded?

Mr Chungu (Luanshya): Mr Speaker, I beg to second the Motion. 

Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, with your permission, and before I come to the Motion, I would like to sincerely thank you and the members of staff of the National Assembly, as well as hon. Members of Parliament on both sides of the House, for the support given to me when I lost my wife. I sincerely appreciate the support. 

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, in accordance with Standing Order No. 157 (2) and the programme of work for the First Session of the Eleventh National Assembly, your Committee considered the topical issue “Media Coverage of Elections in Zambia”.

Mr Speaker, the background and objective of this inquiry is that, during elections, media houses are faced with serious professional challenges in providing the public with accurate, fair, impartial and balanced information about their electoral processes and political contestants. As you may already be aware, the role of the media is to ensure that the electorate is empowered to make an informed decision. Therefore, in order to effectively fulfill its role during elections, the media is guided by the Electoral Code of Conduct. 

Mr Speaker, although this might be the case, there are always allegations of unfair and partial coverage of political players during election periods. It is in this regard that your Committee sought to undertake an in-depth study on media adherence to the Electoral Code of Conduct in ensuring accurate, impartial and balanced reporting.    

Sir, premised on the above, your Committee interacted with several stakeholders, who tendered both written and oral submissions before it. In the quest to familiarise itself with the operations of the media, your Committee toured selected public, commercial, faith-based and community media houses in Lusaka, Central, Copperbelt and the North-Western provinces. Your Committee also toured the Zambia News and Information Services (ZANIS) offices in Mkushi, Solwezi and Kasempa districts in order to appreciate its operational challenges. In addition, your Committee held a public hearing during the tour. 

Mr Speaker, considering that hon. Members have read the report, I  will only highlight a few pertinent issues that arose from your Committee’s interactions with the stakeholders, outstanding issues from the Action-Taken Report as well as your Committee’s findings during its tour. 

Sir, you may wish to note that during your Committee’s deliberations on the topical issue, almost all the stakeholders submitted that the Electoral Commission of Zambia (ECZ) was toothless. They complained that, while the Electoral Code of Conduct was adequate in its current form, the ECZ lacked the strength to implement it. The stakeholders submitted that the ECZ was, indeed, aware that almost all media houses abrogated the Electoral Code of Conduct, but did little or nothing to censure, reprimand, charge or publicly penalise anyone for failure to abide by the electoral rules. 

Mr Speaker, true to the stakeholders concerns, some programmes that started airing, even before the campaign period was officially announced, were perceived to be disadvantaging some political contestants. However, the commission did not publicly condemn or stop the programmes. The stakeholders further argued that the ECZ was not visible in stemming any breach of the code. This seemed to have indirectly aided and abetted other political players to ignore the regulations because no one was punished in accordance with the provisions of the rules. In this regard, your Committee is of the view that the ECZ should be strengthened by way of giving it power to impose sanctions on media houses, journalists and political players who abrogate the Electoral Code of Conduct. 

Mr Speaker, your Committee was appalled to learn that there was a highly polarised media environment, which resulted in selective coverage of political parties and their campaigns. The stakeholders observed that, during elections, the media became increasingly polarised to an extent of blatantly being pro-Government or Opposition sympathisers. They were concerned that the media abandoned their core role, which is to inform, educate and entertain the people on issues that affected them. As a result, irresponsible and partial reporting of events openly sought to mislead viewers, listeners and readers, and also contributed to the increased suspicion of the electoral process. Ultimately, the voters were denied access to a broad range of imperial news.

Your Committee, therefore, urges the media to maintain its objectivity and enhance diversity in the manner of reporting in order to avail the electorate with adequate information from which they could make an informed decision.

Your Committee further proposes that the Zambia Media Council (ZAMEC), which is in the offing, be operationalised so that it helps to monitor the conduct of media houses as well as media practitioners.

Sir, the House may wish to note that your Committee observes that the appointment of media heads and absence of boards compromised the operations of the public media because media heads were scared to operate professionally for fear of losing employment. The stakeholders argued that media heads were answerable to the appointing authority in the absence of the board which made them vulnerable to political manipulation.

Mr Speaker, in this regard, your Committee is of the view that it was imprudent on the part of the Government to delay the composition of boards for the public media houses. Further, your Committee suggests that board members be chosen from a cross section of society and should be answerable to the public as opposed to being answerable to the Executive.

Sir, further, your Committee notes that the ownership structure for both public and private media houses affected content. This also contributed to the polarisation of the media during the just-ended elections. It was submitted that owners of media houses, whether public or private, controlled what was to be published as they openly supported political parties of their choice.

In view of the foregoing, your Committee recommends that the public media be partially privatised to reduce Government control of its operation. Further, while your Committee is aware that the private media is private business and that those who put money in private media are the ones who, in the long run, drive the agenda, unlike the public media which is funded by the public, the private media is also being encouraged to remain professional and to offer public service because they operate in a public environment.

Mr Speaker, your Committee also observes that the seeming inadequate resources by some media houses, forced reporters to become involved in political party programmes and entourages, hence compromising their objectivity. It was further observed that during election periods, politicians had a tendency of taking reporters on their tours and paying for their up-keep and even giving them tips when their employers paid for their expenses while away on duty. The stakeholders wondered whether this was meant to enhance objectivity or was an act of bribery.

It is in this regard, Mr Speaker, that your Committee recommends that a media fund that would enhance coverage of elections be put in place. If implemented, the fund would ease some of the logistical problems faced by media houses during election periods. Your Committee, further recommends that the fund should also provide resources to private media houses with smaller revenue bases to enable them cover elections competitively and help to address issues of transport and allowances for their reporters.

Mr Speaker, concerns were raised by some stakeholders regarding the Government’s failure to implement the Independent Broadcasting Authority (IBA) legislation and the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) (Amendment) Act, which were enacted by Parliament and assented to by the late President Levy Patrick Mwanawasa, SC, may his soul rest in peace. Unfortunately, these issues were also found in the action-taken reports for the Fourth and Fifth Sessions of the Tenth National Assembly. Regrettably, the Government submitted that it was still consulting the stakeholders. 

Sir, the stakeholders argued that if the two pieces of legislation were enacted, they would bring an end to political interference in the operations of the ZNBC because the Ministry of Information, Broadcasting and Labour will not be appointing board members for public media houses. Further, contentious issues regarding the issuance of radio and televisions licences will not arise because the issuance of licences will then not be the monopoly of the ministry.

Mr Speaker, while your Committee is aware that the Government has made verbal assurances that it would enhance media freedom, it is of the view that these assurances should be in policy form because this will show the seriousness of the Government on the issue of press freedom. It further recommends that the Freedom of Information Bill be tabled in order to augment journalists’ access to information. Your Committee observes that if the FOI is implemented, it will enable journalists and members of the public to access information from any Government institution and end speculation.

Sir, may I conclude by taking this opportunity to thank you, Mr Speaker, for the guidance provided to your Committee during the session. I also wish to thank all the stakeholders who appeared before it and facilitated the tours. Lastly, but not the least, let me thank the Clerk of the National Assembly and her staff for the unwavering support they rendered to your Committee.

Mr Speaker, I beg to move.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: Does the seconder wish to speak now or later?

Mr Chungu: Now, Mr Speaker.

I wish to thank you for affording me the opportunity to second this important Motion to adopt the report on the Committee on Tourism, Information and Broadcasting Services which is on the Floor of the House. Sir, allow me also to thank the mover of the Motion for the able manner in which he has highlighted the salient issues raised in your report.

Mr Speaker, from the outset, let me state that my speech will focus on your Committee’s findings regarding the operations of ZANIS during the local tour and also comment on one of the outstanding issues in the Action-Taken Report for the Fifth Session of the Tenth National Assembly. 

However, before I talk about your Committee’s findings during its local tour, let me comment on the digital migration process because I feel that it is an important issue which should not be ignored as it needs urgent attention.

Sir, as the House may be aware, the International Telecommunications Union (ITU) set 2015 as the global deadline for digital migration from analogue to digital television broadcasting. Further, the Southern African Development Community (SADC) Region also set 31st December, 2013 as the SADC deadline to switch over to the digital service ahead of the global switch over date to ensure that all related challenges are overcome before the 2015 global deadline. The stakeholders further submitted that in the SADC Region, South Africa and Tanzania, for example, have already started test transmissions and were more than halfway in the implementation stage. 

Mr Speaker, sadly, however, Zambia is still at seminar stage and the Digital Migration Consultative Committee has not reached an advanced stage in its work. As a result, the Zambia Information and Communication Technology Authority (ZICTA) has not allocated the broadcaster digital frequencies required to enable the industry to prepare itself with the change over in the next few months. The Committee is also concerned that stakeholders like Multi-Choice and ZNBC had been allocated digital frequencies and wondered why the rest were left out. This concern was also raised by some stakeholders during your Committee’s local tour.

Your Committee, therefore, requests the hon. Minister of Information, Broadcasting and Labour to apprise the House on issues raised, as it promised to deal with them in the Action-Taken Report for the Fifth Session of the Tenth National Assembly during the first quarter of 2012.

Allow me to also comment on some issues that have been raised in the report. While it is true that the public media operated under the influence of the Ruling Party, it is also important to note that the public media naturally skewed itself towards covering the Ruling Party whichever it might be.

Mr Speaker, your Committee observes that after the September, 2011 Tripartite Elections, the Ruling Party (PF), which never enjoyed coverage from the public media, suddenly received favourable coverage after the results were announced.

Sir, your Committee notes that after the election results were announced, the former Ruling Party, whose coverage by the public media was at 61 per cent, dropped to 19 per cent. 

Mr Speaker, your Committee also notes, with concern, the seeming misunderstanding between journalists and police officers. The stakeholders submitted that the relationship between journalists and police officers was not good enough as they viewed each other as opponents in the field and that some police officers openly supported the Ruling Party.

Sir, they argued that lack of understanding of civic duties between journalists and police officers created a hostile environment for reporters to discharge their duties effectively, especially during elections.

Mr Speaker, it is in view of the foregoing that your Committee recommends that the ECZ includes police officers in its sensitisation programmes to enable them understand the role of the media during elections.

Sir, let me now comment on your Committee’s findings regarding the operational challenges which ZANIS is facing. It is disheartening to note that while ZANIS supplies stories to most media houses in the country, the department is heavily understaffed, poorly funded and lacks transport facilities.

Mr Speaker, your Committee also learnt that only three districts out of eight, in the North-Western Province, for instance, had trained reporters. Further, it was reported that some offices in the province did not always receive their monthly allocations.

Sir, your Committee observes that lack of adequate human and financial resources coupled with poor infrastructure causes ZANIS to fail to cover far-flung areas in the province. Further, during the public hearing in Kasempa, the stakeholders were concerned that a lot of things that happened in the province during election times went unreported.

They wondered why stories that happened in other provinces were either talked about in the print or electronic media while nothing was reported about the North-Western Province. In this regard, the Committee recommends that the Government increases funding to ZANIS so that the office can function effectively. Further, the Committee should ensure that ZANIS offices in all districts have an input in budgeting for the institution because they know what is obtaining on the ground. The Government should also ensure that monthly allocations reach the districts in time. 

Mr Speaker, your Committee further recommends that the Government recruits more reporters in order to make the office effective. Your Committee also proposes that ZANIS endeavours to transfer reporters every five years to other areas because they have a propensity to relax once they overstay in an area.

Sir, in conclusion, let me take this opportunity to thank you for your guidance. I further wish to thank the Clerk of the National Assembly of Zambia and her staff for the invaluable support they rendered to your Committee during its deliberations.

Mr Speaker, I beg to second.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo (Mazabuka Central): Mr Speaker, I wish to thank the Chairperson of your Committee on Tourism, Information and Broadcasting Services for a well-delivered report and also my colleague the hon. Member of Parliament for Luanshya for seconding it.

Sir, the report brings out many critical issues which relate to the governance of our country. It is true that the media is commonly known as the fourth estate and, because of that, it does have a bearing on which direction the country goes in terms of meeting the worldwide accepted democratic benchmarks. Democracy is commonly referred to as the right to choose and, normally, the will of the majority takes precedence.

Mr Speaker, it is also true that one man called Confucius indicated that knowing what is right and failure to do it is the worst form of cowardice. It is also true that what is good for the goose is good for the gander. Now, I want, to address the Government on your right through you so that it can consider my views regarding this particular subject.

Sir, they themselves have been victims before of lack of media coverage, at least, from the public media. They cannot argue with that point. Sometimes, facts must be laid bare. What I said is that what is good for the gander is good for the goose. Those in Government today must not forget that when you have undue influence on the public media, you can enjoy it for only but a certain time.

Sir, the determination of that time is a function of people knowing that you are actually manipulating them. We have seen it happen in the past. I am one of the people who try by all means not to make reference to the past but, I think, in this particular circumstance, it is important that I remind my colleagues on the right hand side that there is no value in suppressing other people’s views. 

Sir, there is absolutely no value because no matter how hard the ground may be, the truth will always germinate. You cannot disguise the truth. You can try to cover it as much as you can, but it will still sprout and become public one day.

Mr Speaker, this report, in my view, is emphasising the importance of developing an elaborate code of conduct for the media so as to ensure that there are peaceful, free and fair elections for all. By all, I mean for everybody.

Sir, I was listening, with sadness, how one of your colleagues from your right hand side was ululating and jubilating when the seconder of the Motion indicated that what was happening back in the days of the MMD is now starting to pop up in the PF reign.

I want to congratulate Hon. Chungu on being brave enough to read that statement because he is duty-bound to read it even if he belongs to the PF. As though someone did not understand the English, they started saying, “hear, hear” when it was clear that the report was saying it is business as usual, nothing has changed. That is what the report he is holding in his hands said. It said that now the public media has swung towards giving more prominence to the PF.

You can have things that way, but bear in mind that oppressed people can be oppressed only for some time. You cannot oppress people through the media all the time. They can be oppressed only for some time. We saw it with our colleagues who are now our new friends here.

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, they used the media very effectively to promote their own agenda. In this report, there is a reference to ‘Stand up for Zambia’, which was a perfect example of a bad programme. Zambians deserve better. For today, I want to urge my colleagues on the right hand side that they still have time to redeem themselves by meeting the benchmarks of democracy. For once, we should not be known to be simply a talk show where we just say “Hear, hear!” even when we are castigating ourselves. Now that the PF is getting more prominence, “Hear, hear!” 

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, I think that there is sufficient reason for soul searching and for our colleagues on your right to know that the only thing that is permanent is change. Enjoy those seats. As you know, we were making the same noises not long ago from this end. It was not magic that they are on the right side of Mr Speaker. People needed change because that is the only thing that is constant. 

Mr Speaker, today, it is true that the media continues to be abused and ethics in the media circles are not being adhered to.

Hon. UPND Member: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo: Today, it is true that the media in Zambia can promote despondency. For instance, one fellow called Hakainde Hichilema once said that when you do not follow a clear path of what you want to do, the Bemba speaking – I am not Bemba speaking – say, “Chimbwi no plan.” In this same era, on 28th March, 2012, His Honour the Vice-President, Dr Scott, was asked a question by the hon. Member of Parliament for Liuwa, Hon. Dr Musokotwane, about the off-cuff pronouncements made by the Head of State wherever he went. His Honour the Vice-President said that, “You cannot teach an old dog new tricks.” It is just that one saying is in Bemba and the other one in English.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, those are adages. They are simply metaphors, but one decided to over amplify ‘Chimbwi no plan.’ We all know that a hyena has no plan as it goes to look for its prey. We also know that if a dog goes beyond the age of eight months, you cannot teach it new tricks. We all know that.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Let us conduct ourselves with appropriate decorum. We are all hon. Members. It is too obvious to be reminded. There is serious debate going on and we will all have an opportunity to contribute, but not in the fashion in which it is being proposed.

You may continue.

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, I thank you for your protection. It is true that the public media has what it takes to regulate its language when reporting. It is incumbent upon the media to tone down because we are all human beings. As I speak now, whatever I utter, I cannot swallow immediately. I can only swallow it, maybe, by way of an apology, but I would have said it anyway. Similarly, electronic media requires to be regulated, whether private or public, because it is the fourth estate. It determines, whether one likes it or not, the course of a nation. We have seen the figures. They are written in this report at page 4 as follows:

“The director submitted that the commission also noted that there was less coverage of issues that affected the voters and, indeed, the electoral process. She said more coverage was devoted to personalities and triviality about participating candidates and political parties. Most inflammatory and negative reports originated from a number of MMD and PF rallies.” 

These fellows here (pointing at the MMD).

Mr Speaker: No, they are not fellows. They are hon. Members. Please, withdraw that remark.

Mr Nkombo: Sir, I withdraw the remark with a lot of anxiety.

Mr Speaker, these inflammatory statements during elections were made by the MMD, the hon. Members on this side, our new friends, and the PF on your right hand side

Hon. Members: Your old friends.

Mr Nkombo: This is a loaded statement and because it is so, we all need to take heed. We all need to meet the benchmarks that have been set for us by SADC because we are a member State. 

It is true that a normal society should only do what this report is saying. We can talk and agree, but act differently once we go in the field. For example, there are elections in Serenje and Livingstone. Sir, if you read the papers, today, especially the ones from the Government of our old colleagues and ZNBC, they will show you that they are not reporting anything about what the Opposition is doing. It is as though the Opposition does not exist. To me, it is a sign to prove that, during this last election, there were two groups of people that were shocked. One group was that of the hon. Members of the MMD. They did not believe they could lose the elections.

Mr Muntanga: Our new friends.

Mr Nkombo: They did not believe. Up to now, they are still thinking that they are still on the right side of Mr Speaker. The second group is that of those hon. Members, …

Mr Muntanga: Our old friends.

Mr Nkombo: … our old friends, who still think they are in the Opposition.

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: It is time for them to start reading these reports. Hon. Shamenda, through you, Mr Speaker, the contents of this report are so cardinal to the existence of mother Zambia. Let us exit from these small pocket agendas of saying that I am an hon. Minister and must, therefore, protect this corner of being an hon. Minister. You are only an hon. Minister by virtue of the fact that the Zambian people saw the need to grant you that favour to meet their interests and aspirations. The moment you start showing the reasons they removed the MMD from power, they will kick you out, too. 

Hon. Muntanga: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo: They will kick you out and you will go away from Lusaka …

Mr Muntanga: Faster than you came.

Mr Nkombo: … back to where you came from …

Mr Muntanga: Where?

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: … and you will be saying, “Tenze ma Minister,” meaning that we were once hon. Ministers.

Mr Muntanga: Tenze tenze. 

Mr Nkombo: A change of regime happens when you do not listen. One person said that when you are having honey, do not forget that while you enjoying the sweet honey up there in the beehive, someone can put some heat under the beehive so that you can fail to descend. 

Mr Speaker, I want the hon. Minister of Information, Broadcasting and Labour to take heed of these very serious comments. The few that I will discuss now have made us fail to meet the benchmarks of being called a democratic State. 

Sir, the first point is that of political interference of the media. Leave Chibamba Kanyama alone to run the show. If I go to the ZNBC, I should be heard because there are men and women who woke up one day to cast a ballot paper in favour of the UPND and myself. So, when I want to speak so that I am heard, do not bar me. Whether I am saying things that are not pleasurable to your ears, it is only decent to let me go and do what they sent me to do. 

Mr Speaker, secondly, the report says that the people who work in public media institutions are frightened. They are scared all the time to report objectively because they fear for their jobs.

Mr Ntundu interjected.

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member for Gwembe, …

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: They fear that their jobs will be on the line.

Mr Speaker: … you have the freedom of expression, but you are expressing yourself wrongly. 

The hon. Member for Mazabuka Central may continue.

Mr Nkombo:  Mr Speaker, the other item that the hon. Minister of – chitwabuti eci? Labour? Baicinca, they have changed it – Information, Broadcasting and Labour should understand that the public media requires unbundling in terms of shareholding. Get some other people to own shares in these public media institutions so that this strong and invisible arm of the Government can depart from these institutions and everybody can be heard.

Sir, I see that Hon. Kapeya is holding his chin. He was an advocate of the idea of unbundling the public media when he was in the Opposition, but now he is looking quiet and surprised.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo: Sir, in this country, journalists have been harassed − those colleagues up there (pointing at the Press Gallery). When they go to cover events, if they report …

Mr Mukanga: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Nkombo: It is in this report. What point of order? It is written here.

Mr Speaker: Order! 

The hon. Member for Mazabuka Central should, please, address the Chair.

Mr Nkombo: Thank you, Sir. I need to be protected from hon. Members who are coquetting for nothing.

Laughter

Mr Nkombo: This matter is written here in this report. One of the issues that is affecting the subject at hand is that journalists are being harassed left, right and centre. Just a while ago, Hon. Victoria Kalima raised a point of order about journalists who were bundled and some still have their cameras confiscated in police cells. It is not acceptable. This is 2012 and welcome. So, any hon. Member coquetting must understand that this is the English language.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Nkombo: Sir, there is also a concern that there are no sufficient constitutional provisions that will
 protect the fourth estate, the journalists.

With those few remarks, I am very thankful dear colleagues that you listened. In Tonga, we say, “Ahulamabii” meaning that when you say too much, sometimes, you may miss the point. For now, I will say that, “Atwaambotunji, mulabwezakongaye, one?” This means that among all these things I have said, you pick, at least, one. Maybe, this society will be a better place to live in.

I thank you, Sir.

{mospagebreak}

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kampyongo (Shiwang’andu): Mr Speaker, thank you for affording me this opportunity …

Hon. Opposition Members: Order!

Dr Kasonde crossed the Floor.

Hon. Opposition Members: Question!

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Speaker, I have not even started debating and I am being disturbed.

Interruptions

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Speaker, as a member of your Committee, I would like to start by thanking the Chairperson for allowing your Committee to conduct its business in a very conducive environment. He was brave enough, especially during tours, to take the bullets as a member of the Executive, and still allowed the truth to come out. 

Sir, during our tours, we heard a lot of confessions and revelations from different stakeholders. I must say that I was comforted when I heard the hon. Minister of Information, Broadcasting and Labour make an announcement here stating that the Freedom of Information Bill would be tabled during this sitting of the House. 

Mr Speaker, the issue of the media covering the elections is a critical component in any democratic dispensation. We interacted with the ECZ, which briefed us on the measures it has put in place to ensure that the media institutions conducted themselves professionally and fairly during this critical time. The commission has also put in place the Electoral Code of Conduct, which is quite sufficient. However, unfortunately, it has been a challenge for the media institutions to abide by some of the provisions in this code of conduct. Indeed, to agree with the Chairperson, it is very important that we strengthen the ECZ to ensure that it enforces some of the provisions in the Electoral Code of Conduct. 

Sir, like it has been stated, the polarisation of the media that characterised the run-up to the elections left much to be desired. So, there is a need for the media to get to work in harmony with the ECZ to avoid the unfairness that was seen in the coverage of political players.

Mr Speaker, public media institutions are there, indeed, to serve the public. Before we talk about the private media, we should start by focusing on the public media. It is evident that the public media institutions were extremely abused during the run up to the elections of 2011. My colleague, Hon. Nkombo, gave an example, but he should have gone further to shed more light on what transpired. He mentioned one gentleman whose name appears in this report.

Mr Nkombo: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Nkombo: Mr Speaker, I never rise on points of order unless it is absolutely necessary. Is the hon. Member in order to insinuate that I should have been thinking like he is when I was debating? He wanted me to have said the things that he desired me to say?

 Sir, I need your serious ruling.

Mr Speaker: My ruling is that, and I have said this before, let us avoid debating each other. Express your viewpoint independently, freely and confidently. You will be heard. 

You may continue.

Mr Kampyongo: Sir, I thank you for that guidance. However, what I am trying to say is that this report …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order! 

The ruling of the Speaker should not be qualified. It should be abided by, nothing more and nothing less.

You may continue.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Speaker, I have taken note of your ruling. 

Mr Speaker, this report has cited two individuals. One of them has a problem of identity because of his name. Bemba names are straightforward. For example, Hon. Mwansa Kapeya, Hon. Stephen Kampyongo and Mr Nevers Mumba. We do not add Roman numerals to names. There is a name, here, which ends with some Roman numerals.

Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Member in order to start disputing the content of your Committees’ report when it was submitted by your Committee which he is a member of? His duty is to defend the report of your Committee.

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member is not in order. Furthermore, I would like to stress that this report has been moved and seconded. I think those of you who are members of this Committee could do well to give others a chance to debate your report.

The hon. Member may continue.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kampyongo: Thank you, Mr Speaker. I understand, but in defending the report, I have to defend the facts as well as they are reflected in the report. So, what I am just saying is that what we discovered, and this is an appeal to the hon. Minister of Information, Broadcasting and Labour to make sure that …

Mr Muntanga: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Member for Shiwang’andu in order to disregard your advice and instead tell you that he wants to defend your Committee’s report when, in fact, it is your report and does not need any defence?

Mr Speaker: I think I have made my point. The report has been moved and seconded. I would like to reiterate that Members of the Committee, please, allow your colleagues to debate this report. I think that is loud and clear. 

You may continue.

Mr Kampyongo: Mr Speaker, I will be very brief. I will start by urging the hon. Minister of this important ministry to ensure that media personnel in all the public media are made to understand that they are there to serve the masses and not only those of us who are in Government at the moment.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kampyongo: Their job is to ensure that they serve everyone across the board without fear or favour.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kampyongo: They should avoid being abused and used like what we have learnt from this report. It is very important to, also, make sure that media institutions operate like businesses. We have this challenge. We had media institutions that were used to print certain publications at Government cost. This report has brought out all those issues.

Mr Speaker, I would like to request the hon. Minister, as he takes into consideration the Action-Taken-Report, to make sure that all the money that is owed to the media institutions through activities which were not their own are paid for. The culprits are out there and are well known.

Hon. Government Members: They are here!

Mr Kampyongo: It is important that the hon. Minister follows this up and makes sure that the money is collected. I am talking about the Times of Zambia and especially the Zambia Daily Mail which was made to print publications which were not in the public taste. Please, make sure that the money is recovered for those publications because they were produced at a great cost.

Mr Speaker, let me give a chance to other hon. Members to contribute to the debate.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Mwiimbu (Monze Central): Mr Speaker, I thank you for according me the opportunity to debate the Motion that has been ably moved by the hon. Member for Kasempa and seconded by the hon. Member for Luanshya.

Mr Speaker, I would like to tag on what my colleague, the hon. Member of Parliament for Mazabuka Central, said. As I do that, I would like to read the last paragraph as it appears on page 18 of your report that reads:

“Your Committee also learnt that no single media house or media practitioner was censured, reprimanded, charged or publicly penalised for failure to comply with any section of the code. Had this been done, it would have served as a deterrent to others. In this regard, one only needed to recall the broadcasts “Stand up for Zambia” programmes by Chanda Chimba III on Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation Television, Muvi TV and Mobi TV. These broadcasts were blatantly slanted against such persons as Mr Michael Sata as an aspiring presidential candidate then of the PF and even Mr Fred M’membe of The Post newspaper and, sometimes, the Catholic Church in Zambia.” 

Mr Speaker, as a result of this particular clause, your Committee, on page 27, has made pertinent recommendations. The recommendation that I would like to refer to is the one that talks about the need to have professional journalists in this country.

Mr Speaker, as all the other people who were unamused with this particular statement I quoted on page 18, some people in this country are also not happy with some editorials in particular newspapers which are being published along the same lines.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

The hon. Member for Monze Central does not require assistance in order to debate.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Let him represent the people of Monze Central freely.

Laughter

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I am much obliged. I was saying that much as it was annoying to my colleagues on the right, who are members of the Patriotic Front and myself, as a Catholic, it is also annoying to read editorials in particular newspapers where particular individuals are being referred to as jackals, hyenas, liars and all sorts of abusive language being used.

Hon. Government Members: Chimbwi.

Mr Mwiimbu: Some people were referred to by the same people as Chanda Chimbwi. Similarly, those who were referred to by the derogatory and abusive terms are not happy. This is arising from the fact that we have gutter journalism in this country.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, yellow journalism is at its peak in this country. We have noted, with concern, that due to the failure by the Government to put up measures to ensure that there is professionalism in this country in the journalism arena, people who are not journalists have abused the journalism profession.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: I do recall the gallant son of Muchinga, the late George Kunda, SC. 

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: Whenever he stood up, he used to remind us, in this House, of the danger of yellow and gutter journalism. Those words, Mr Speaker, are still ringing in our heads and are reminding us to have responsible journalism in this country.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: We are also aware that some editorials by certain private media also reminded us of what happened in Rwanda. These journalists are doing things that are similar to what transpired in Rwanda; hate journalism.

Mr Speaker, I am not going to defend any particular publication, but I am merely highlighting the dangers of gutter and yellow journalism. If we allow it to thrive, we will be sowing seeds of discontent in the country. If we do not nip it in the bud, we are endangering this country. 

 Mr Speaker, my appeal to the hon. Minister of Information, Broadcasting and Labour is that there is a need to ensure that journalists in this country regulate themselves. Once they regulate themselves professionally, gutter journalism will be a thing of the past. Those who practise yellow journalism will be punished by their peers. 

Mr Speaker, unfortunately, it is only in this country where journalists insult others and go scot-free.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, this does not happen in developed countries. I am aware that the former Minister of Information, Broadcasting and Labour, Hon. Lubinda, knows that insulting others is not journalism. 

Mr Lubinda: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: Order!

A point of order is raised.

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, thank you for allowing me to raise this point of order. Is my colleague, the hon. Member of Parliament representing the people of Monze Central, in order to bring me into his debate which, to a very large extent, is calling for the regulation of the media which, on the other hand, he is entirely against? Is he in order to bring me into his very strange debate?

Mr Speaker: Order!
    
Whether his views about self regulation are consistent or contradictory, he is certainly out of order to draw you into his debate. I have said this before and repeat that do not debate each other.

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, I apologise for having praised Hon. Lubinda.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order!

Whether you praise or criticise him, you were still out of order.

Laughter

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, the point I am making is that every profession in the world has a set of rules and regulations meant to regulate it. I am not asking the Government to regulate the media, but requesting it to create a forum were professional journalists will regulate themselves and those found wanting should be disciplined by their peers.

Mr Speaker, I have noted, with regret, that the ZNBC, which had started well immediately after the PF Government was favoured by the people of Zambia to form Government, has u-turned. The programming and content has suddenly changed. If you tune to the ZNBC today, you will find that the party that is being projected in the light that they are going to win the elections in Livingstone, Serenje and Chama, when they are not, is the Government in power. The same things my colleagues who are on your right and I side used to condemn, are the things they are doing now, even worse.

Interruptions

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, a donation of toilets by one individual with a view to getting a big contract is given priority on the ZNBC. The point I am driving at is that the things the PF and I used to condemn should be condemned today, tomorrow and forever if they are wrong. Nothing has changed from the time the PF took office. The only thing that has changed is that you are now the party in Government. Do not make me think that you were envious of the wrong things our colleagues used to do when they were in Government.

Mr Speaker, I do not want to speak for a long time. However, I am appealing to the PF Government to strictly implement the good recommendations that have been made by your Committee. These recommendations are nonpartisan. They have been made with a view to improving the governance system of this country for the benefit of everyone in this House and members of the public. With these few remarks, I wholly support the recommendations contained in the Report of your Committee.

I thank you, Sir.

Mr Kakoma (Zambezi West): Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to contribute to debate on this good report. I also commend your Committee for coming up with this report and thank the hon. Members who ably moved and seconded it.

Mr Speaker, the debate by my two colleagues who debated this report already, that is the hon. Member for Mazabuka Central and the hon. Member for Monze Central, reflect my thoughts exactly. Therefore, I will be very brief on this matter.

Mr Speaker, let me refer you to the fourth and fifth paragraphs on Page 4 of your report that say, 

“your Committee learnt that the commission observed, however, that during the run-up to the 2011 Elections, there was a highly polarised media environment which denied voters access to balanced news.  In some extreme situations, media reports about election events deliberately misled the public, thus increasing suspicion of the electoral process. The Director submitted that the commission also noted that there was less coverage of issues that affected the voters and the electoral process. She said more coverage was devoted to personalities and triviality about the participating candidates and political parties. Most of the inflammatory and negative reports originated from a number of MMD and PF rallies.” 

Mr Speaker, I wish to note that the polarisation of the media has continued and actually worsened after the elections. The polarisation, at that time, pitted the public media against the private media, in particular The Post Newspaper. This time, it is the public media, that is, the ZNBC, The Zambia Daily Mail and The Times of Zambia that have been joined by The Post newspaper in singing and praising the PF Government even when it is doing wrong things.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, the public is being denied alternative views. This development in the media in Zambia is sad because people are denied true information. The people need to hear divergent views and both sides of the story. The situation where all the biggest media organisations are supporting the Government in power is not only disastrous, but will also end up in a situation where people are denied the right to information.

Mr Speaker, during last year’s elections, I had personal experiences about the misconduct of the media. I wish to let you know that apart from being Member of Parliament, I am also the Chairperson for Information and Publicity in the UPND and I interacted with the media …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Please, give the hon. Member for Zambezi West a chance to articulate his views.

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, the hon. Minister of Foreign Affairs and Tourism is envious of my position ...
    
Laughter

Mr Kakoma: … as Chairperson for Information in the UPND because he once held that position and he still wants it.

Laughter

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, I will give you two scenarios to demonstrate my point. 

Firstly, I would like to talk about the public media regarding the coverage of political parties, such as the UPND during the election period. We had a rough time trying to place our paid-for programmes on the ZNBC because they used to refuse. Sometimes, they demanded letters for us to get permission from the Censorship Committee at the ZNBC. Sometimes, they would deliberately give us quotations that would make us fail. For example, they would ask for K80 million to cover a rally for thirty or forty-five minutes. I do not know how the then Ruling Party was paying. Maybe, they were not paying at all. That was a deliberate move which was meant for us to fail.

Sir, secondly, we also had incidences where the private media misbehaved. In particular, The Post which did not only deny us coverage, in terms of editorial news, but also went to the extent of refusing to accept money or cheques for advertisements from the UPND.

Interruptions

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, I have experience in the media industry, having been an editor at the Zambia Daily Mail. I know that the only situation in which, as an editor, you can refuse to accept an advertisement is when it is libelous. However, if the content of the advertisement is not libelous, you have no reason whatsoever to refuse to carry it.

Sir, I have personally written to the Editor of The Post newspaper to find out why he does not cover the UPND but, one year down the line, he has not even responded. I do not know whether he is ignoring me or just being arrogant. However, as a media organisation, when you receive a query from members of the public, you should be able to respond.

Hon. UPND Member: If you are normal.

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, I have gone to the extent of visiting the Editor of The Post, then, Mr Amos Malupenga, …

Mr Speaker: Order!

I will be very slow to allow the debate to continue along these lines because you are now debating events linked to personalities who are not here and may not be able to defend themselves.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: We know that these proceedings are privileged, but they should not be at the expense of those who are not able to defend themselves. I think, let us confine ourselves, as far as possible, to policy issues that have been addressed in this report. Many of the views that have been expressed have been well-presented and well written. They are apolitical. So, I hope that the debate can also be apolitical.

Could the hon. Member continue, please.

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, on Page 10 of your report, your Committee has highlighted some of the hindrances to accurate, fair, impartial and balanced media coverage during the elections. One of them was bribery and corruption cited in (iv). I read this with shock because I could not believe that the media can fail to provide fair and balanced coverage because of bribery and corruption. The questions are: Who was bribing them? Who was corrupting them? Did the journalist accept the bribes? Did they accept to be corrupted? This is a serious indictment on the media in Zambia. It is making people wonder whether the media practitioners were not offering coverage fairly to everybody because they were being corrupted and bribed. That makes one wonder whether, as a result of that bribery and corruption, some journalists are now being rewarded with Government appointments. Some are diplomats while others are top civil servants and so on and so forth. Obviously, …

Mr Lubinda: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Lubinda: Mr Speaker, I rise on a very serious point of order. Is my colleague in order to ignore your very serious guidance, in so far as he is making insinuations against people who are not here to defend themselves, and for him to go to the extent of saying that there are some people from the media fraternity who are appointed on the basis of their having been bribed? Is he in order to say that when he knows that those people are not able to come here to defend themselves?

I seek your serious ruling, Sir.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order, order!

I would like to reiterate that we should avoid debating people who are outside this House, whether expressly, implicitly or technically through innuendos. Some of the insinuations, obviously, are very serious. I think, as much as we enjoy this privilege in the House to debate freely, and immunity from judicial proceedings, we should, nonetheless, be fair to those who cannot counter the express or implicit accusations that are being floated on the Floor of the House. That is my ruling. 

Further, I would like to urge the House, as far as possible, to confine itself to the policy issues that are contained in the report. I do not see why we should have difficulties debating this report without referring to personalities and individuals. Let us debate the report. It contains issues, some of which, if you go through the report carefully, go back to the report of 1996 and the media reforms of 1993, and I do not want to say how many Governments have been in office since then.

Could the hon. Member for Zambezi West, please continue.

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, I thank you for your guidance.

Sir, this report is straightforward. It highlights important issues that we need to adopt, as the House, so that they go to the Government for action.

Mr Speaker, all the witnesses who appeared before your Committee were very frank. They stated that the media did a bad job during the 2011 Elections. The media personnel who were called to appear before your Committee also admitted that they did a bad job. However, they said that they did this bad job because they were being bribed, corrupted, had no transport and other things. They gave all sorts of explanations. That is a serious indictment which, I believe, should be addressed so that we stop these things from happening in future.

Sir, with those few remarks, I thank you.

Hon. UPND Members: Hear, hear!

{mospagebreak}

Mrs Masebo (Chongwe): Mr Speaker, I thank you very much for affording me this opportunity to add my voice to this very important report by your Committee on Tourism, Information and Broadcasting Services.

Mr Speaker, from the outset, I want to commend your Committee for doing a very good job. Clearly, many issues, which are very correct, came out. I also want to support the recommendations that it has made. In so doing, I just want to take the part of the report that gives the reasons the media in Zambia could not be professional. In my view, the reasons are not justifiable for the actions or the kind of conduct or misconduct during the last elections. I quote:

“Your Committee learnt that the hindrances in ensuring accurate, fair, impartial and balanced media coverage included the following:

(i)    inclination to a political party or party affiliation;

(ii)    lack of access to political party functions, programmes and manifestos;

(iii)    lack of resources, e.g. transport or human; 

(iv)    political interference;

(v)    influence from owners of media houses; 

(vi)    lack of in-house editorial guidance on election coverage; 

(vii)    sheer disregard for ethical election coverage on the part of journalists; 

(viii)    bribery and corruption; 

(ix)    influence and pressure from civil society organisations; and

(x)    violence and harassment of media practitioners by party cadres.”

Sir, your report further contains the following point submitted by stakeholders: 

“Your Committee was informed that management at the Zambia Daily Mail identified certain journalists whose role was to destroy Patriotic Front (PF) President Michael Sata’s character. Their job, everyday entailed working with individuals masquerading as leaders of non-governmental organisations who were, in fact, hired by the ruling party to scandalise Mr Sata. It was submitted that stories that emanated from the Zambia Daily Mail newsroom included claims that Mr Sata supported homosexuality in Zambia, that he had collapsed while on campaign and that the first President, Kenneth Kaunda suffered from dementia, a mental illness, just because the former President agreed with Mr Sata on many issues. 

“Your Committee was further informed that the Zambia Daily Mail also printed two publications - The Zambian and Stand Up for Zambia; which were published by Mr Chanda Chimba III and Mr Ngande Mwananjiti, both of whom were sponsored by the Government through the Ministry of Information and Broadcasting Services.”

Sir, it is in this report that our own journalists were making these submissions. I want to say that, really, at the end of the day, when you look at the ethics that a journalist is taught, you will find that this cannot be an excuse. These things shall always be there. If somebody gives you money to do something, you cannot use that as an excuse. I think it was just right for the PF Government to try and clean up the mess. My only disappointment was that when they started cleaning up, some of our colleagues on your left, who are talking today, started defending the people who were doing things unprofessionally.  

As Mr Speaker has guided, the truth is that for many years, our newspapers and television stations have not been professional. However, I think that the last election was the worst since the independence of Zambia. Not even under Dr Kaunda or Dr Chiluba, who said he was a dribbler, did we see what we saw during the 2008 and 2011 elections. I do not believe that any political party can make the media profession sink to the levels that it sank.

Mr Speaker, many of us were culprits. During elections, the public media was never interested in covering women candidates. No wonder, there are no women here. You cannot even hear the voice of women in this House. 

Interruptions 

Mr Speaker: Order!

I am sure you meant ‘victims’ instead of ‘culprits’.

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, yes. 

Laughter 

Mrs Masebo: Sir, this is why you see that, today, in this Parliament, there are very few women. You cannot say that the few women who are here, such as Hon. Mazoka, Hon. Namugala and I are representing women. We are very few. This is as a result of the misconduct of the public media, especially in the last election.

Ms Kalima: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Ms Kalima: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Member for Chongwe in order to insinuate that we are men?

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order! 

I think these are challenges that are associated with the Queen’s language. I am sure she did not mean the word, ‘men’. She meant, “many”.

Laughter

Ms Masebo: Mr Speaker, you are right.

Laughter

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, because of the way the media was scandalising women, there are few of us in here. Even the few that are here, you will see it in what my sister is saying.

Laughter

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, if we had a good media in Zambia, we would have many credible women in this House today.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: Sir, unfortunately, we are so few that we cannot even be heard or seen.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Continue.

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, ZANIS …

Ms Imenda: On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Ms Imenda: Mr Speaker, I have not raised a point of order in this House. Therefore, I am rising on a very serious point of order. The hon. Member who is debating on the Floor first mentioned a few women in this House, Hon. Mazoka, Hon. Namugala and herself. Now, she is saying that there are no credible women in this House. Is she insinuating that the hon. Member of Parliament for Luena is not credible?

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Order! 

I must state that I was equally anxious when that statement was made. In my opinion, all hon. Members of Parliament belonging to the fairer sex in this House are credible. I was very anxious about that statement as well.

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, in fact, the female hon. Members of Parliament in this House are very credible. My point is that they are too few that they cannot be seen or heard because of the way our media was portraying and scandalising women. This unprofessional conduct scared many credible women from participating. The women who took the trouble to be here are actually very courageous.

Mr Speaker, before the point of order, I was getting to the issue of ZANIS. I want to support your Committee in that there is a need for the Government to strengthen ZANIS, especially now that the Independent Broadcasting Bill will be coming through and institutions like the ZNBC and the Zambia Daily Mail will end up being almost independent in one way or the other. I think that it is important that ZANIS is equipped because it is supposed to be a mouthpiece for the Government in terms of articulating Government policies. If we commercialise the Zambia Daily Mail and Times of Zambia, then there will be no voice for Government programmes. 

Mr Speaker, if we partially privatise the Zambia Daily Mail, Times of Zambia and other public media institutions, as we are trying to move forward, there will be no voice for Government programmes. It is timely that this report has recommended that the Government employs more journalists, especially for the ZANIS district offices. The Government should also capacitate the offices so that even when the other public media houses are partially privatised, the Government can still depend on ZANIS. At the moment, ZANIS is not doing well because it does not have the capacity to do a good job. My experience is that ZANIS can be a very effective tool for articulating Government policy.

Mr Speaker, I think the colleagues who spoke before me were unfair when they tried to condemn this administration in as far as the management of the public media is concerned. I think we need to give a pat on the back of the PF Government because from the time it took office, we have only seen improvements.

Hon Members: Hear, Hear!

Mrs Masebo: Yes, improvements only.

Dr Chituwo: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, surely, you have guided, time and again, that when we debate in this House, we must be factual. Is the hon. Member of Chongwe being factual when the report is suggesting that what is being done by the Government is a mirror image of our misdeeds when we were in the Government? How can she say something which is contrary to the report? Is she in order?

Mr Speaker: The Hon. Member will take into account the contents of the report as she debates.

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, the report is indicating that according to the understanding of your Committee, the PF Government is doing exactly what the MMD was doing. According to me, in fact, the PF has made tremendous improvements in the management of the public media institutions. I think I would like to refer to the PF Government in relation to what has been written in this report …

Mr Mulusa: On point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised.

Mr Mulusa: Mr Speaker, I rise on an important point of order. The notice for the Motion I will move tomorrow has just been circulated. I saw His Honour the Vice-President waving his hand as an indication to everybody that the Motion should be shot down. I have also seen the Whip going round telling everybody that they should shoot it down. 

Hon Members: Raise a point of order.

Mr Mulusa: Hon. Mwila has confirmed that what I am saying is true by writing me a note in which he says “Sir, this time we will not support this Motion, Hon. Mwila.” 

Mr Speaker, why are we here? One of our duties is to move Motions. For heaven’s sake, they need to listen to us speak first. Is the hon. Member in order, before he even listens to my Motion, to actually shoot it down? I wish to lay the note on the Table.

Mr Mulusa laid the paper on the Table.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: These notes which go round the House every single day are private in nature and are part of the enjoyment of the freedom of expression for hon. Members. As usual, you are at liberty to constantly consult each other on many issues that are happening in the House. Thus, as a believer in the freedom of expression, I will be very slow to issue a ‘blanket ban’ to the expression of views in support or against ideas. I think we should leave this Motion to be freely considered and debated tomorrow when it is presented. That is my ruling.

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, before I was interrupted, I was saying that according to my understanding, the PF Government is doing better than the previous regime in as far as the management of the public media is concerned. We should encourage it to do even better. For it to even quickly begin thinking of bringing the Independent Broadcasting Authority Bill before Parliament means that it is committed to the promises it made during the elections. We must acknowledge that fact. The number of viewers who are watching ZNB Television has increased. We have also been told that the Times of Zambia and Zambia Daily Mail are now enjoying an increased circulation such that they are competing with The Post. Before the change of Government, nobody was interested in reading the Zambia Daily Mail and Times of Zambia or in watching ZNB Television. However, these days, evidence is there that many people, including those on your left and right, are watching ZNB Television. 

Sir, the recommendations that have been made are mainly covering the period before the elections. The new Government can learn from the mistakes of the previous regime because …

Mr Kapeya: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised:

Mr Kapeya: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Member of Parliament for Chongwe in order not to mention that even the Opposition is being covered by the public broadcaster?

Hon. Members: Hear, Hear!

Mr Speaker: Well the hon. Member is not out of order. I think that the hon. Minister, at an appropriate juncture, will be at liberty to make contributions as to how the ministry perceives the coverage of the ZNBC. I do not think we should be putting words in the mouth of the hon. Member.

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, I was saying that there is generally an improvement in the way the public media is being managed. However, I wish to state that there is room for improvement. Only yesterday, there was a programme on the ZNBC on the election campaigns of the Vice-President. I think Ms Effie Mpande was reporting about the meeting which His Honour the Vice-President had with the business community. I can safely say that the report was factual because I was part of that meeting. In fact, the report was not singing praises of the Government. In the report, the business community in Livingstone was complaining about certain things they were not happy about. The report was not censored. The information was sent out there despite this being an election time. Under the previous regime, you could never hear of any report criticising the Government being aired on the ZNBC, never. Now you can see the Zambia Daily Mail and Times of Zambia and even the ZNBC criticising the Executive or bringing out the wrongs which the reporters see on the ground. That is an improvement. We should not let things get to the level at which they were in the previous administration of the former President Rupiah Banda because that was the worst manner of managing the media.

Mr Speaker, my last point concerns the complaints by certain people that the private media is not covering them. I think that this report was looking mainly at the public media. The private media institutions have the right to choose whom to give coverage to. They have their own policies. I remember that at one point, the PF did not want to be covered by The Post because they felt that it was not covering them fairly. The Post stopped covering during that time. How does the UPND expect the reporters to give them coverage when its members almost beat up a reporter some time back?

Mr Muntanga: Which one?

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Hon. Muntanga, you do not enjoy that liberty.

Mrs Masebo: Taking into account their policy, the private media has the right to decide who to give coverage to. I, personally, think that they have the right to do so.

Mr Muntanga: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised,

Mr Muntanga: Mr Speaker, is the debater on the Floor in order to state that members of the UPND almost beat up a reporter without giving the specifics such as the name of the reporter and which members of the party were responsible for what happened. Is she order?

Mr Speaker: Well, I will repeat what I said earlier. When we begin debating personalities, the debate will, unfortunately, degenerate into something else. I would also like to urge all of you to make assertions which are factual. It is very difficult for the Chair to engage in any inquiry about the veracity of certain assertions. All I can do is to urge all of you to pitch your debates at the policy level.

Business was suspended from 1815 hours until 1830 hours.

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, before business was suspended, I was making reference to the private sector and I mentioned that the PF had an encounter with a private media institution. The party took a position that they did not want to be covered by the media institution in question. That private media institution stopped covering the PF until it went back and asked that the two of them bury the hatchet and move forward. This is how this private media, The Post, started covering the PF.  

I was also stating a fact when I said that when one George Chellah of The Post went to cover the UPND at its secretariat, he was harassed. Following that press conference, we read in the paper that the UPND had declared the PF …

Mr Kakoma: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised. 

Mr Kakoma: Mr Speaker, earlier on, when I was contributing to the Motion on the Floor, you guided the House that we should not discuss individuals who have not been mentioned in this report. Is the hon. Member for Chongwe in order to ignore that ruling and start talking about a Mr George Chellah? Is she in order? 

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member is not in order. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: I have deprecated this trend of debating individuals. In my opinion, apart from being unfair to those who cannot come before us and explain their position, it also lowers the dignity of the House. As far as possible, let us discuss policy issues. 

I know that when we are dealing with media issues, they tend to be very explosive and emotive as well as in some respects personal. As legislators, we should rise above these events, some of which may be controversial and very difficult to prove. Everybody will insist that they are substantiating their assertions even when people have contrary views. The Chair would not like to engage in an inquisition as to who is telling the truth. I think that there is sufficient fodder …

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: … in this material for us to debate. 

These are very serious issues. The issues contained in this report reflect an unfortunate state of affairs which we have failed to resolve. I think that we should move on collectively whether we are in Opposition or in, indeed, have the privilege to have the reins of Government ...

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: … so that we can bring the matters before us to rest. This is where the debate should be pitched. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: I think that it would be very inefficient if I am constantly drawn to repeat my rulings on an issue which I believe I have made myself abundantly clear. 

Hon. Opposition Member: Yes!

The hon. Member for Chongwe may proceed. 

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, I thank you for your able guidance. I will try as much as possible to stick to the contents of the report. 

Mr Speaker, I would like to refer you to page 16 of the report. Your Committee was informed that the safety of journalists was not guaranteed during political campaigns because most of them were victims of harassment and intimidation by political party cadres at times. It is unfortunate that journalists were harassed even when they were doing community work. For instance, journalists were attacked by cadres in Lusaka West when they went to cover a land wrangle in the area. The equipment which the journalists had in this instance was exposed to danger. 

In some cases, the report says some reporters who covered the presidential nominations were also physically manhandled, just like at a press briefing at some political office. 

Mr Muntanga: Wayamba futi?

Hon. Opposition Member: Question!

Mrs Masebo:  Mr Speaker, it is against this background that I state that it is important that if political parties want coverage from the private or public media, they should assure the safety of the journalists. The ultimatums we give at press conferences can also affect the journalists to the extent of blacking you out. This, however, is not to say that the journalists should not be accurate in their coverage. I think that the report brings out all these issues that actually hinder the media from covering fairly sometimes. For example, if I am a journalist and I am beaten up or insulted, naturally, I will not do justice to a story of the person who did that to me. 

Mr Speaker, the last point I would like to emphasise is that the Government, in as far as media reforms are concerned, has been doing a good job, especially starting with the time when Hon. Lubinda took over office. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: Even when he was moved to another ministry, people protested because they still wanted him in that position. Nevertheless, we have another gallant soldier there and people are very happy with his work. 

Hon. Opposition Members: Question!

Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir. 

Mr Speaker: A point of order is raised. 

Hon. Member: Jealousy!

Mr Mwiimbu: Mr Speaker, is the hon. Member for Chongwe Constituency not aware that there are some heads of media institutions who served less than two months and were removed from office because they could not toll the line of the PF. 

Hon. Government Members: Aah!

Mr Speaker: There is really no point of order raised here. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Speaker: The hon. Member can only debate within the confines of her knowledge and opinions. Therefore, if she does not take into account particular facts of events, she is certainly not out of order. 

The hon. Member for Chongwe may proceed. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, I thank you for declaring it a point of jealousy. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mrs Masebo: Mr Speaker, there is improvement in the way the public media is being managed. However, I would like to urge my colleagues on your right to learn from the past. We should never ever in this country do what was done in the previous regime where individuals were scandalised in the media. 

My election campaign was difficult because there were headlines which were not substantiated. I was not even given a chance to speak. They published headlines such as “You have stolen”, “You are a thief” and nothing was done to protect the individuals who were being scandalised. I have so much confidence that the PF Government will never make such a mistake because they experienced what it feels like to be scandalised. 

I would like to commend the Government and the hon. Minister of Information, Broadcasting and Labour, in particular, for the good job he is doing. They must keep it up and never do what the others before them did. 

I thank you, Sir. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Chituwo (Mumbwa): Mr Speaker, I thank you for giving me the opportunity to debate the Motion on the Floor. I stand to support this very well-articulated report and thank your Committee for a job well done.

Sir, I would like to make a few observations. The first one is that once a society agrees that one set of action is wrong, I strongly believe that it must remain wrong. It does not matter who the players were or how they carried out that work. What I mean is that, this report received evidence from the witnesses about the bad things which impeded the objectivity of the media, particularly journalists. However, when one looks at the percentages of the post-election coverage, it clearly shows that not much has changed. All of a sudden, the post-election coverage has risen from 6 per cent coverage to 41 per cent with that of the MMD falling from 61 per cent to 19 per cent. These figures speak volumes. The report speaks about intimidation and also what one can do if the employer determines their fate.

Sir, it is clearly stated that the pen is mightier than the sword. Although my background is from the latter, …

Mr Muntanga: He is a soldier!

Laughter

Dr Chituwo: … even though I am also an academician, this point has been propounded specifically by the Whip, Hon. Professor Lungwangwa, who has been an academician all his life.

Professor Lungwangwa: Hear, hear!

Dr Chituwo: When you write down something on paper, it lasts forever. If it is negative, it will remain that way and you cannot change it the following day or year. Therefore, the media is an important ingredient in influencing the perception of the community, particularly when it comes to elections because this is the time when the people of Zambia have to determine who governs them. 

I see, Sir, that what this report is saying is that, wrong things are wrong things. It is not time for us to continue pointing fingers at each other. For example, by saying that, “In the past three years, I did this.” That is gone and it is finished.

Interruptions

Dr Chituwo: What can we learn from that bad episode? Mr Speaker, I am suggesting the following: Here we have …

Mr Ng’onga: Apologise!

Mr Speaker: Hon. Member, continue. Do not be distracted.

Laughter

Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, I am suggesting that we have only one …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

The hon. Member is speaking.

Dr Chituwo: … nation and our people look up to us to provide that effective leadership. The PF Government, now, …

Interruptions

Dr Chituwo: That is the problem with people who have not even managed themselves.

Laughter

Dr Chituwo: Sir, I am suggesting that this must be a time for healing. There is an opportunity for our colleagues to learn from our mistakes. They must heal those ills they were talking about because a wrong is just that regardless of who committed it.

Hon. Opposition Member: Hear, hear!

Dr Chituwo: This should be the time to start afresh, having drawn lessons from the past.

Mr Muntanga: Ooh!

Dr Chituwo: We can, therefore, set rules and laws that are important in the conduct of the nation or a community. However, there is one important ingredient which is the values we hold. What is it that sets us apart as a nation? Professionalism is one of the ingredients. Therefore, let us allow journalists to be professionals and reinstate those young men and women who were sacked.

Interruptions

Mrs Masebo: How?

Dr Chituwo: They are Zambians.

Mr Sikazwe: Question!

Dr Chituwo: Please, hon. Minister, let us not intimidate those who are perceived to have been pro-MMD or pro-UPND. This is why your Committee is recommending a professional body that will oversee the conduct of journalists.

Mr Ng’onga: Question!

Dr Chituwo: Mr Speaker, I stand here as a proud hon. Member of Parliament who contributed, with my friends here, to getting the country where it is today.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

Dr Chituwo: It is not true to say that we did not do anything. If we did not, you would not have found what the country is now.

Hon. MMD Members: Hear, hear!

Hon. Government Members: Awe!

Dr Chituwo: Sir, please, as a nation, let us put aside the partisan way of thinking. The time for elections is in those by-elections. The time for us to go back to our people again to politick is in 2016. Hopefully, you will still be there.

Let us take this opportunity, therefore, in governing ourselves, by allowing this healing process because we have an opportunity to succeed. I want the Government to succeed. However, please, it must also learn. As you can see, at sixty-five years, I have gathered something out of life. So, listen to us. You can make a choice whether to listen or not. All I am saying is that this is a healing process. Please, let us mend our nation.

The observations and recommendations of your Committee are cardinal to the good governance of our country because the media is an important ingredient for good governance.

I thank you, Mr Speaker.

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

The Minister of Information, Broadcasting and Labour (Mr Shamenda): Mr Speaker, I wish to thank you and your Committee for a job well done. It is, indeed, gratifying to have a well-documented healing session. We all appreciate that you can only heal if there were diseases, some of which could have been septic.

Laughter

Mr Livune: Question!

{mospagebreak}

Mr Shamenda: Sir, your Committee raised issues that are cardinal to a professional media and the electoral process. As the Government in power, we are cognisant of the fact that there was pronounced unprofessionalism on the part of the media, especially the public media. Your Committee has highlighted all those issues very clearly.

Mr Speaker, before I comment generally on the report, on parts two and three and then the very important issues which have been raised by the hon. Members of Parliament, I would like to make it very clear that we have got to be fair and honest with ourselves if we are going to make a change. By accepting the wrongs and appreciating to move a step a little better will take us a long way in changing our society.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Shamenda: Let us not scare those young men and women who were, just yesterday, harassed.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Can we avoid those running commentaries. I can see you making those comments and I am restraining myself from picking you out. Please, desist from making them.

Mr Shamenda: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Monze Central indicated that change is permanent but, at the same time, very difficult. To change the mindset of human beings can be very difficult. In that vein, we had a perception of the way my colleagues a little further on left ran the media because of what they believed in. 

Sir, even the change which has happened, as far as they are concerned, is not change. You can see this from the statements made by some of the leaders of various institutions. These statements which they are making make some of us wonder whether they were in the country during the period 2008 to 2011. Unless someone lived on Mars, they cannot honestly say that there is no improvement in the way the public media is run.

Mr Speaker, I would like to make it very clear and put it on record that we agree with the recommendations on all the issues which have been raised.

Sir, on increasing funding to private and public media institutions, this Government is on record as having indicated to enter into a private-public partnership (PPP) in this regard. We recognise the fact that he who pays the piper calls the tune. However, sometimes, particularly if he is a dangerous character, then, we have serious problems. However, we have indicated that we are going to offload some of the shares in some of the public media institutions.

Mr Speaker, we think that we have a lot to do together as we look for an independent media. If we had no intentions whatsoever to liberalise and make the media independent, we would not have been in a hurry to present the Freedom of Information Bill, even if we know very well that it will definitely not be possible to present it during this sitting of Parliament. 

Mr Speaker, the task force, which was purely independent and was looking at this Bill independently so that we have independent views without interference from the Government, thought it would publicise a draft Bill without the signatory looking at it. The Attorney General had not looked at the Bill which was being drafted by the task force, hence its being withdrawn. I have no doubt in my mind that this Bill will be debated by the public most likely before the end of next week and we are not going back on that.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Shamenda: Mr Speaker, on many issues which have been raised, such as regulation of the media, it is very sad to note that while some people on one hand are saying that there should be self-regulation, they are, on the other hand, trying to encourage the regulation of the media by the Government. This Government will never even think about regulating the media. The Zambia Media Ethical Council has been given the leeway and encouraged by the Government, if not directed by it, to speed up the launch of its regulations. It is only when the media fails to regulate itself, that people can think of regulating it. The PF Government will not and will never think of taking that course of action.

Mr Speaker, in your report, there are issues that have been raised, but due to the time factor, I may not be able to comment on all of them. I will just say that we mainly agree with most of them.

Sir, on the education and training of journalists, we agree with the recommendation and we will discuss with the relevant institutions so that what happened during the run-up to the elections in 2011 does not repeat itself. 

As regards ZANIS, input into budget process at the district level is being encouraged with a view to manning the offices in various districts. 

Mr Speaker, allow me touch on just a few outstanding issues from your previous Committee’s Report for the Fifth Session of the Tenth National Assembly. The Government agrees with the recommendation on the need to increase funding for the media. The Government has made it very clear and it is on record as having encouraged the public media to run its institutions as business entities. We have directed the media institutions that at no time whatsoever should they be directed by anybody outside their houses.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Shamenda: Mr Speaker, I would like to make it very clear that if anybody has information on any official in my ministry, including myself, moving around with an invisible hand and trying to control the media, you can bring it to my attention and I will deal with it.

Sir, we are not as careless as to set a trap which we shall be entangled in ourselves. We would not have been in the forefront of advocating for surcharging of people who were directing or writing editorials and are now crying foul, if we also wanted to go the same way. The directive that we should surcharge those who were responsible for those reports, which were written in bad faith, means that we realise that should we do the same, tomorrow, when we step out, the same thing will happen to us. So, we will be extremely foolish to start advocating for something that might get us entangled in the same web if we also abuse the media. So, I would like to assure this House …

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Hon. Members, I have not abrogated the seat.

Laughter

Mr Speaker: Hon. Minister, the word ‘foolish’ is, unfortunately, not parliamentary.

Mr Shamenda: Mr Speaker, I withdraw it.

Hon Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Shamenda: Mr Speaker, on the issue of liquidation of money owed by Government institutions, we are trying our best to make sure that this is done. We have requested the media houses to send proposals on the taxation, as far as the input is concerned, for consideration on reducing or waiving tax on some of the materials which are being used by the media. 

Sir, with regard to providing funds for streamlining the structure of the ZNBC, I would like to assure you that the process of digital migration has reached an advanced stage. Cabinet has approved the implementation of the migration of the second generation Digital Video Broadcasting (DVBT2) which has been accepted by Europe and countries within the SADC Region. This will be used together with the other developments which the ZNBC is using in order to improve the coverage and quality of service we are providing to the public. 

Mr Speaker, under the 2012 Budget, provisions have been made for transport by road as well as by water for those who will be involved in the monitoring or coverage of various elections or by-elections.

Interruptions

Mr Shamenda: Mr Speaker, allow me to quickly look at the issues raised by the hon. Members of Parliament.

Interruptions

Mr Speaker: Order!

Mr Shamenda: Mr Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Mazabuka Central raised the issue of ‘Stand Up for Zambia’ and the abuse of the media regarding what happened before the change of Government, and is asking the current Government to redeem itself. At the expense of repeating myself, all you need to do is read the statements coming from Government officials. Some of our media practitioners are not professionals, and those we can forgive. If the Government changed in the morning and, by afternoon, the statistics show otherwise, honestly, it is very difficult for you to blame those who have just come into office. 

The reason these things happened is that the minds of the journalists and reporters were polluted and used to singing praises of those who were in Government. We have made it very clear, and I would still like to make it very clear to the nation, that we have given instructions to all the public media houses that they should never at any particular time be influenced by anybody, be it an hon. Minister or any other political leader. The facts are there to show for themselves. As my sister from Chongwe said, there are more people who are reading the public media publications now than before.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Hon. Opposition Members: It is just the same!

Mr Shamenda: The hon. Member of Parliament for Shiwang’andu talked about the Freedom of Information Bill. As I have indicated, this Bill will definitely be presented in the next sitting of Parliament. Very shortly, the public will be able to study and contribute to the proposed draft before it goes to Cabinet.

The hon. Member of Parliament for Monze Central talked about professional reporting and the editorials of today. I do not know whether we read the same newspapers. For anybody to say that the editorials of today can be compared to the editorials of yesterday is an insult to the editors who are now practising professional reporting.

Mr Mwiimbu: On a point of order, Sir.

Mr Shamenda paused.

Mr Lubinda: The hon. Minister is responding. Go ahead, hon. Minister.

Mr Shamenda: Mr Speaker, as I indicated earlier, …

Mr Mwiimbu: Whom have I insulted?

Mr Speaker: Hon. Mwiimbu, you have not been given the Floor to speak. 

Mr Shamenda: Mr Speaker, when I say that to doubt and challenge the integrity of our editorial staff is tantamount to an insult, I am not saying that anybody has insulted them.

Mr Speaker, at the moment, the ZNBC does not even cover the hon. Minister of Information, Broadcasting and Labour in some instances if it believes that what he/she has said is not newsworthy compared to what other people have said.

Mr Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament for Zambezi West talked about the fact that politicians should not interfere in the running of the media. I would like to request that we should not be provocative to our colleagues who are in the media because this can cause serious problems. 

Mr Speaker, I do not see how paid-up adverts not being accepted by the private media can be connected to the Government. This is an issue that relates to a private newspaper. At the same time, I would also like to make it very clear that the public media has been directed to operate independently and in a business manner. So, do not expect to appeal to the hon. Minister so that he can reduce a quotation because this is tantamount to interfering and the Government will not participate in such issues.

Sir, I would also like to pay tribute to the hon. Member for Chongwe. I concur with her that we will definitely avoid making the same mistakes our colleagues on the left made. Never again should the media be controlled by those who are in power. 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Shamenda: Mr Speaker, at one time, just before the elections, I had the privilege of meeting some of the media heads. We complained about the coverage and I stated to them that the media would contribute to the removal of the MMD from power, and it came to pass. This is because the media was portraying the picture that the Government in power then was doing the right thing. They were thinking that what they were reading was what was on the ground. We have now asked the media to be professional and criticise us when necessary. We have advised the media to point out the shortcomings so that we are able to correct them. Obviously, we shall make mistakes, but it is important to have an independent media that will remind us of the issues that led to our friends moving from the right to left. 

Sir, on the issue of those who have been fired because of having views that are different from the Government’s, I would like to make it very clear that the retiring or firing of some people had nothing to do with the Government. Those who lost their jobs, maybe, were unprofessional in their approach. We would like to have a professional media, which will serve the interests of Zambians; a media that will help this Government to govern, remain in office and not to be on the left after 2016. That is the media we shall cherish and look forward to working with. 

Mr Speaker, the public media is for Zambians. We must be helped to build the media, which was completely destroyed. If mistakes are made and there are some overzealous police officers who are harassing innocent journalists, it should be brought to the attention of the authorities. Sometimes, changing the mindset is very difficult. Most of these officials that we have in very sensitive offices, including those who are civil servants, and are holding high positions in Government, may say, do something or give instructions in the name of the Government that maybe contrary to the principles of the platform on which the PF was elected into Government. The doors of the Ministry of Information, Broadcasting and Labour are open to all Zambians. Letters to the editor, including those that criticise the Government, can now be published in the public media, which never used to be the case.

Finally, Sir, I would like to thank your Committee for bringing these issues to the attention of the Government. I assure the House that a different picture will be painted the next time this report is presented to this House.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

Mr Pande: Mr Speaker, I am so grateful to the hon. Members who have debated the report. Your report highlighted issues that have been quite problematic during elections and their solution requires the concerted effort of hon. Members on both your right and left, including all Zambians so that we move to a higher level.

Mr Speaker, I am grateful that the hon. Minister has assured the House that something will be done about the recommendations made in the report.

I thank you, Sir.

Hon. Members: Hear, hear!

Question put and agreed to.

________________________

HOUSE IN COMMITTEE

[THE CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES in the Chair]

THE PERSONS WITH DISABILITIES BILL, 2012

Clause 1 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

CLAUSE 2 – (Interpretation)

The Minister of Community Development, Mother and Child Health (Dr Katema): Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 2, on page 10, after line 6 by the insertion of the following definition:

“Register” means, in relation to –

(a)    persons with disabilities, the Register of Persons with Disabilities; and 

(b)    organisation of, and for, persons with disabilities, the Register of Organisations of, and for, Persons with Disabilities;.

Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.

Clause 2, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clauses 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11 and 12 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

CLAUSE 13 – (Composition of Board of Agency)

Dr Katema: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 13, on page 13:

(a)    in line 10, by the insertion, immediately after the semi-colon, of the word “and”;

(b)    in line 11,

(i)    by the insertion, immediately after the word “youth’, of the word “disability’; and 

(ii)    by the deletion, immediately after the word “organisation”, of the semi-colon and the word “and” and the substitution therefor of a full stop; and 

(c)    by the deletion of paragraph (1).

Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.

Clause 13, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

CLAUSE 14 – (Functions of Agency)

Dr Katema: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 14:

(a)    on page 14, in line 10, by the deletion of the word “provide” and the substitution therefor of the word “facilitate”; and

(b)    on page 15

(i)    after line 28 by the insertion, immediately after the paragraph (a), of the following new paragraph:

“(b) maintain a Disability Management Information System for persons with disabilities;”;

(ii)    in line 29 by the re-numbering of paragraph (b) as paragraph (c); and 

(iii)    in line 35 by the renumbering of paragraph (c) as paragraph (d)

Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.

Clause 14, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clauses 15 and 16 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

CLAUSE 17 – (Provision of information and Raising of Public Awareness)

Dr Katema: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 17, on page 16, in line 25 by the deletion, immediately after the word “Agency”, of the word “may” and the substitution therefor of the word “shall”.

Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.

Clause 17, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clause 18 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

CLAUSE 19 – (Director-General and Other Staff)

Dr Katema: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 19, on page 17:

(a)    in lines 26 and 27, by the deletion of sub-clause (1) and the substitution therefor of the following new sub-clause:

    “(1)    the Board shall, with the approval of the Minister, appoint the Director-General on such terms and conditions as it may determine.” and

(b)    in line 33, by the deletion, immediately after the words “to the”, of the word “Agency” and the substitution therefor of the word “Board”.

Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.

Clause 19, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clause 20 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

CLAUSE 21 – (National Strategies and Plans)

Dr Katema: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 12, on page 19:

(a)    in line 23 by the insertion, immediately after the word “parents”, of a comma and the words “guardians and custodians”; and

(b)    in line 27 by the deletion of the words “development disabilities” and the substitution therefor of the words “the development of disabilities”.

Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.

Clause 21, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clause 22 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

CLAUSE 23 – (Special Education and Facilities and Equipment in Educational Institutions)

Dr Katema: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 23, on page 21:

(a)    in line 24 by the deletion of the word “formal” and the substitution therefor of the word “inclusive”; and

(b)    in line 26 by the deletion of the word “integrated” and the substitution therefor of the word “inclusive”

Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.

Clause 23, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clauses 24, 25, 26, and 27 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

CLAUSE 28 – (Health Programmes)

Dr Katema: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 28, on page 23 in line 11 by the deletion of the word “severe”.

Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.

Clause 28, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clauses 29, 30, 31 and 32 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

CLAUSE 33 – (Habilitation and Rehabilitation Centres)

Dr Katema: Mr Chairperson, I beg to move an amendment in Clause 33, on page 24, in line 13 by the insertion, immediately after the word “district”, of the words “habilitation and”.

Amendment agreed to. Clause amended accordingly.

Clause 33, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill.

Clauses 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66 and 67 ordered to stand part of the Bill.

First and Second Schedules ordered to stand part of the Bill.
    
Title agreed to.

__________

HOUSE RESUMED

[MR SPEAKER in the Chair]

The following Bill was reported to the House as having passed through Committee with amendments:

The Persons with Disabilities Bill, 2012.

Report Stage on Wednesday, 27th June, 2012.

__________

MOTION

ADJOURNMENT

The Vice-President (Dr Scott): Mr Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

Question put and agreed to.

The House adjourned at 1935 hours until 1430 hours on Wednesday, 27th June, 2012.

__________