Tuesday, 22^nd February, 2022

 

[MADAM SPEAKER in the Chair]

 

The House met at 1430 hours

 

NATIONAL ANTHEM

 

PRAYER

 

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MATTERS OF URGENT PUBLIC IMPORTANCE

 

MR MTAYACHALO, MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT FOR CHAMA NORTH, ON THE HON. MINISTER OF ENERGY, ON THE INCREASE OF CONNECTION FEES BY ZESCO LIMITED

 

Mr Mtayachalo (Chama North): Madam Speaker, thank you for according me an opportunity to raise this matter.  

 

Madam Speaker, the matter I wish to raise is directed at the hon. Minister of Energy. The country has been subjected to a lot of drama in the last few days, following the decision by ZESCO Limited to increase electricity charges. The new meter separation and connection fees have been increased from K750 to K6,000 and K1,700 to K6,930,  respectively. This has generated a lot of public interest.

 

Madam Speaker, following this announcement, the Energy Regulation Board (ERB), issued a statement urging the people of Zambia to ignore the statement from ZESCO Limited. There was also a statement from the Ministry of Energy advising ZESCO Limited to follow the right procedures in increasing electricity charges. Again, there was another statement from the hon. Minister of Energy which contradicted his earlier statement.

 

Madam Speaker, electricity is a very critical component in the economic development of this country because it drives the wheels of production. As such, the people of Zambia deserve to know who is telling the truth and who is on firm ground amongst ZESCO Limited, the hon. Minister of Energy and the ERB.

 

Madam Speaker, I seek your guidance.

 

MR KAPYANGA, HON. MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT FOR MPIKA, ON THE HON. MINISTER OF DEFENCE, REGARDING THE GOVERNMENT MILLING PLANT IN MPIKA NOT EMPLOYING LOCALS

 

Mr Kapyanga (Mpika): Madam Speaker, I must state that I am very fortunate to be given this opportunity, under your skilful leadership, to raise a matter of urgent public importance directed at the hon. Minister of Defence.

 

Madam Speaker, during the previous regime, the Government constructed a milling plant in Mpika, which should be run by the Zambia National Service (ZNS). This Government, in its wisdom, has launched the plant. However, it is sad to note that a facility that is supposed to give jobs to the people of Mpika is now giving the jobs to only those coming from outside Mpika. I came back from Mpika today, where I held a meeting with Their Royal Highnesses in which they expressed the same concern. Further, yesterday, we foiled what was supposed to be a demonstration against this scourge.

 

Madam Speaker, the wisdom in His Royal Highness the late Chief Chikwanda giving land to the Government was that he anticipated that his people would get employment from the facility.

 

Madam Speaker, I seek your serious guidance.

MR E. BANDA, HON. MEMBER OF PARLIAMENT FOR MUCHINGA, ON THE DISASTER MANAGEMENT AND MITIGATION UNIT REGARDING THE FLOODS IN SERENJE DISTRICT

 

Mr E. Banda (Muchinga): Madam Speaker, my matter of urgent public importance is directed at the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU).

 

Madam Speaker, the matter I am raising is of great concern, as Serenje District has been receiving rainfall non-stop for the past nine days. The rainfall caused many houses to fall and, in some cases, killed people. Today, we were burying a child and one lady who was swept away by water while trying to cross a bridge. The rainfall has also damaged many bridges, and people have lost food. In the valley, people have lost whatever they had planted, expecting to have food in the next season, because everything has been flooded and washed away.

 

Madam Speaker, can the DMMU declare the situation a disaster so that officers can be sent to provide help to the people, who have been suffering and sleeping in the cold after many houses were damaged by the rains.

 

Madam Speaker: I will respond to each one of the issues that have been raised.

 

Hon. Member for Chama North, the matter that you have raised as a matter of urgent public importance does not meet the criteria stated in Standing Order No. 134, and I remind hon. Members to read the Standing Orders and the various rulings that have been delivered on this issue.

 

Hon. Member for Chama North, what catastrophe, if I may ask, would occur if your matter was not attended to here and now? You may wish to file in a question directed to the hon. Minister of Energy on that matter, then the hon. Minister will be able to address the issue.

 

Hon. Member for Mpika, on the issue that jobs at the milling plant are not being accorded to the locals, again, this matter does not meet the criteria. If you want to learn more about how the milling plant operates, I advise that you get in touch with the hon. Minister of Defence to seek clarification and raise your concerns, if any, on how the jobs are being given. In any event, there is no catastrophe that will occur if jobs are not given, now, to the people you have referred to. However, I think it is a matter that needs to be discussed with the respective ministry in order to address the concern. So, I am not saying that the issue you have raised is not important; it is. However, the manner in which you have raised it is wrong, and that is what makes it to not qualify to be raised under Standing Order No. 134.

 

As regards the matter raised by the hon. Member for Muchinga, we know that we are in the rainy season, and there have been floods all over. So, the issue of the rain that has been falling in Muchinga Constituency is not peculiar to that area. We have seen homes and animals get washed away by rainfall in other provinces too. So, this matter relates to the general state of affairs, and we cannot isolate the issue that you have raised. That said, Her Honour the Vice-President is in the House and, I am sure she has heard the issues that have been raised and will deal with them through the Disaster Management and Mitigation Unit (DMMU). However, all the three matters that have been raised have not been allowed.

 

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MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

 

DISTRIBUTION OF QUARANTINED HONEYBEE PHARMACY MEDICINES

 

The Minister of Health (Mrs Masebo): Madam Speaker, I wish to start by thanking you for according me this opportunity to update this august House, and through it, the nation at large, on the circumstances that led to the distribution of the quarantined Honeybee Pharmacy medicines to health facilities in the country. This is in response to the hon. Member for Mufulira, who on Wednesday, 16^th February, 2022, raised a concern on the Floor of the House, and I was instructed to issue a ministerial statement on the matter.

 

Madam Speaker, the Zambia Medicines and Medical Supplies Agency (ZAMMSA) was established under the Zambia Medicines and Medical Supplies Agency Act No. 9 of 2019 and its mandate among other functions, is to procure, store and distribute medicines and medical supplies to all public health facilities on behalf of the Government and its cooperating partners. Among the key medical supplies managed by ZAMMSA, are health centre kits which form the backbone of our country’s supply chain. Those kits comprise approximately sixty medical products that are strategically assembled to manage the top twenty conditions of health and also, support the provision of primary health care services at health facilities.

 

Madam Speaker, the medicines and medical supplies in the health centre kits procured through Honeybee Pharmacy have been a subject of public debate on how they were procured and distributed, despite failing the quality control test. Further, the matter of these substandard medicines in question is in the courts of law and is a subject of State investigation. That has made it difficult for ZAMMSA to dispose them off, in the case where the supplier failed to collect them. Therefore, the substandard medicine continued to remain in quarantine.

 

Madam Speaker, in October 2020, the Zambia Medicines Regulatory Authority (ZAMRA) issued a product recall for paracetamol 500 mg and 100 mg tablets. The supplier then, delivered a replacement of the recalled paracetamol tablets in December, 2020. ZAMRA conducted another quality control test on the replaced consignment as per standard procedure and the product failed the quality test again. That product was recommended to be quarantined pending collection by the supplier and disposal to avoid exposing the public to substandard medicines.

 

Madam Speaker, in January, 2022, ZAMMSA distributed Honeybee Pharmacy supplied paracetamol tablets to Kabwe Central and Kasama General hospitals. The two hospitals reported receipt of these medicines to ZAMMSA on 8^th February, 2022. Those products were under quarantined and therefore, the notification of issuance was of high concern to the ministry. The Government working with cooperating partners has invested heavily in ZAMMSA and has built capacity in procurement, storage and distribution of medicines and medical supplies. However, despite investment in a robust and resilient system, human failure occurred which could be attributed to low levels of competence, among key participants. Hon. Members may wish to note that investigations are currently underway and the House will be informed accordingly.

 

Madam Speaker, on 27^th December, 2021, an annual stock-taking exercise was undertaken. A preliminary report by ZAMMSA revealed that it was during the stock-taking exercise that the status of the product in question was erroneously changed from “quality control” status to “available” status. On resumption of operations after completing the stock-taking exercise, the first facilities to be processed were Kabwe Central and Kasama General hospitals. Those orders were processed with the then available paracetamol tablets, which were previously on quarantined status and were dispatched on 12^th January, 2022. Upon receipt of the quarantined products by the two health facilities, the pharmaceutical staff, who knew the quality issues surrounding those substandard supplies informed ZAMMSA, who later retrieved the medicine. All the 198 bottles of paracetamol with 1,000 tablets per bottle issued to Kabwe Central Hospital were retained, while four bottles out of the fifty-eight bottles were consumed at Kasama General Hospital.

 

Madam Speaker, we have since appointed a board of directors which is currently looking into the operations of ZAMMSA. I am also aware that one of the decisions made by the board was to suspend the top management at ZAMMSA to facilitate investigations into the circumstances that led to the distribution of the Honeybee Pharmacy medicines. The board is also meant to strengthen the operations at ZAMMSA.

 

Madam Speaker, as I conclude, I wish to assure this House and the nation that the Government remains committed to the provision of equity in accessing quality, safe, efficacious and affordable medicines and medical supplies to all Zambians. This is in line with the National Drug Policy (NDP).

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members are now free to ask questions on points of clarification on the ministerial statement made by the hon. Minister. Please note that questions should only be on the ministerial statement.

 

Mr Kapyanga (Mpika): Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minster of Health for that aptly put statement. Will the citizens who consumed those sub-standard drugs be compensated by the Government?

 

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, as a responsible Government, we have, through relevant hospitals, been trailing all those patients who were issued with that particular Panadol. We managed find two of those patients and we are observing them to see if that drug will have a negative impact on their health. We are basically keeping the trail on the people who were given that medicine. So, for now, the hon. Member’s question does not arise.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Mundubile (Mporokoso): Madam Speaker, the Zambian citizens are obviously alarmed at the revelation that expired drugs were distributed and of course, assurances have been given. This particular exposé shows that there are very weak controls within the warehouse management systems (WMSs) at the Zambia Medicines and Medical Supplies Agency   (ZAMMSA). It is possible that there may be other drugs, other than those that were supplied by Honey Bee Pharmacy that may have been distributed whist under quarantine.

 

Madam Speaker, we know that drugs expire sometimes on account of a fraction of time and they have been stored in the same warehouse. Now that there are weaknesses in their WMSs, it is possible that other expired drugs may have been distributed previously. Is the ministry extending this investigation to ensure that we protect the lives of the Zambian people?

 

Mrs Masebo:  Madam Speaker, I thank the Leader of the Opposition for that question. In the world of public service, anything is possible, suffice it to say that that was the only consignment that was quarantined for the reasons that it had failed the quality test. Normally, when a drug has expired or it is of substandard, the regulations are that it should be destroyed. So, the possibility of distributing wrong drugs becomes nil.  In this regard, because the matter of Honey Bee Pharmacy is still in court, ZAMMSA had no choice but to quarantine that drug for a long time. In the ministerial statement, I have stated that the systems that have been developed in the ministry, with the support from donors, are quite elaborate and safe.

 

Madam Speaker, we should remember that we are dealing with issues where computers are involved. This is where human beings feed information into the computers. So, at times, even if the system is good, we can have human failure. Somebody can decide to enter wrong data deliberately or play around with the computer. We know that. That is why I am saying that in this world, anything is possible. That is why we had no choice but to fire the entire management team at ZAMMSA. The reason was that we needed to show the people that we were serious about their health. We did that because the answers that were coming from ZAMMSA were very lame ones. So, at that level, we had no choice but to do what we did. It is just that we are Africans. In a normal country, more heads would have rolled.

 

Laughter

 

Mrs Masebo:  Madam Speaker, maybe, I am using the word “Normal” wrongly. It is due to limitation of the Queen’s language. What I am trying to say is that this is a very serious matter, and anybody who is normal would show concern. That is not even a matter that can either be politicised or put as a blame game. It is a very dangerous and serious matter. We cannot have officers who are playing games with work. From my little knowledge and having gone through the system, I have seen that that problem is caused by people who are taking things for granted and also, taking work lightly. That problem was due to negligence. There was no way that could have happened because those quarantined drugs were labelled. So, even if that mistake was there, a person who was picking the box could have seen that it was labelled, “Do not pick me up.” So, at what point did people pick those boxes? So, it could be that somebody was bribed to remove evidence in order for the courts to fail to have evidence. Anything could have happened. Basically, all we can say for now is that we wait for investigations so that we know whether it was a human or machine error, corruption or negligence. What I am currently saying is what I have seen from a layman’s point of view that, that mistake was due to carelessness. Currently, as the Government, we are trailing every person who has taken that drug. We are lucky because there were only five bottles but of course, a bottle contained of a lot me tablets.

 

Thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Amb. Kalimi (Malole): Madam Speaker, thank you very much for affording the people of Malole time to air their concerns over the medicine that was issued. I am becoming very worried because I was in Kasama.  I hope I did not take that paracetamol. Is the Government considering prosecuting these criminals who did that barbaric thing? To me, suspending them is not enough. We are playing with human life. People are dying and we cannot take that as business as usual and say those people were suspended. In as much as I appreciate the hon. Minister of Health, I think suspending them is not enough. Let us prosecute these people so that they can face the law, if this is the Government of law. Firing them is not enough.

 

Madam Speaker: Order!

 

Madam speaker: Hon. Member for Malole, it is not time to debate but to ask – May you resume your seat.

 

Amb. Kalimi: Madam Speaker, my question –

 

Madam Speaker: Please, resume your seat. This is not the time to debate but for points of clarification. We have a lot of business before us and we want to accommodate as many members as possible to ask questions.  So, when you stand up hon. Members, just ask the questions directly without debating. Proceed and ask your question.

 

Amb. Kalimi: Madam Speaker, thank you very much for your guidance. I was just getting concerned and emotional over that issue because it concerns human life. Does the Government consider prosecuting these criminals who did that?

 

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, I understand the concern raised by the hon. Member, and I know that this is a serious matter. Like I have said, this matter is under investigation. I therefore, request that we waiting for investigations to be concluded so that we can make a decisive decision.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Mr Mtayachalo (Chama North): Madam Speaker, my question has already been asked by Hon. Kapyanga.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Michelo (Bweengwa): Madam Speaker, I know very well that these drugs were ordered under the Patriotic Front (PF) Government and it is very shocking. 

 

Madam Speaker, does the person who took the matter to court want the Zambian people to consume these drugs or he wants the Government to be charged for procuring expired drugs? What kind of culture are we creating by allowing a criminal, who committed an offence to take the Government to court and force it to accept expired drugs?

 

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, I really do not know how to answer this question, except to say that people have the right to take any matter to court. On the issue regarding culture, I think this is a problem that we all have as a country. Time has come for all of us as Zambians to work together and serve our country, especially, for us leaders, who were elected by the people so that we can have a better country. Time has come for leaders not to be too greedy.

 

Madam Speaker, what we get here as parliamentarians is sufficient. The propensity of wanting too much and yet one is a politicians must change. The people who want too much money are in businesses. Here, our role is to serve this country. So, I will wait for the time when Zambians will all say, “No” to wrong things and say, “Yes” to the right things. It is strange to see that this is the only country where criminals are glorified.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Mr Mwila (Mufulira): Madam Speaker, I take note of the disciplinary action that has been taken against the senior management. In those corporations, my worry is that  if officers below the senior management level, who probably could have been trusted by management still remain in those offices up to now, anything can happen. The hon. Minister has said that investigations are still going on and we may lose the audit trail and we may fail to find the exact culprits who should receive the punishment. What is the time frame within which investigations will be concluded before we lose the audit trail?

 

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament’s concerns are mine as an hon. Minister responsible for health. He is right when he says that sometimes, we can chop off people from the top and yet, the real culprits are at the different level. So, even when we would think we have solved the problem, it would have not been solved.  

 

Madam Speaker, I am glad that the Chairperson of the board that is in place is the former Auditor. What is has happened is something that the Chairperson and her team know how to handle. I am aware that the board has since instituted investigations not only on the wrong drugs that were distributed but also, on other issues. The Auditor-General has also been involved. So, we have agreed that this should be done in the shortest period of time.

 

Madam Speaker, to ensure that we do justice and the very fact that ZAMMSA is a new creation, we have agreed with the board that there will be need to advertise jobs and ensure that only those who qualify will remain in ZAMMSA.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, since this matter is still active and under investigations, I will suggest we do not peruse it much here in this House by asking questions. Let us allow the investigations to be concluded and then maybe, we can follow it up later. For now, I believe we might jeopardise the investigations that are ongoing. The hon. Member for Shiwang’andu has a burning question.

 

Mr Kampyongo (Shiwang’andu): Madam Speaker, indeed, we appreciate that those are matters that are under investigations but, I thank the hon. Minister for bringing the statement to this august House. Indeed, those are matters of life and death

 

Madam Speaker, I want the hon. Minister to be categorically clear on this issue. She has stated in her own statement that there is a robust system at the Zambia Medicines and Medical Supplies Agency (ZAMSA). She has also stated that those supplies were quarantined from the normal stock, such that even when there was stock-taking, they should have focused on the normal stock.

 

Madam Speaker, further, the hon. Minister indicated that the only reason those supplies were kept was because the matter was in the court of law. If indeed, that was the reason, was that the right place to keep exhibits which are supposed to be made before the courts of law?

 

Mrs Masebo: Madam Speaker, the hon. Member wants to know if that was the right place to keep exhibits. ZAMMSA by law is the institution that has the mandate to buy, store and distribute drugs. Those drugs were already procured and stored by ZAMMSA. When the contract to supply those drugs was cancelled, the drugs were already at ZAMMSA. That is one the problems we have.  Our colleagues would receive items from the supplier even before the process finishes. We had a similar case with the procurement of tricycles. The tricycles are now in Luapula and Chipata but the story is that they were not even paid for. It was advised that the purchase of tricycles be cancelled at the time when they were already distributed.   

 

Madam Speaker, these are some of the challenges that we are grappling with. So, the hon. Member could be right. What I can say is that those goods were already delivered even after ZAMRA, the regulator, advised the ministry that those products were not good. At that stage, those drugs should have been taken back to the owner but unfortunately, they were already delivered. It is like we are now working in reverse and it is a challenge.

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Members, as I earlier guided, it is better we leave this matter for investigations to be concluded. Otherwise, we will just be speculating. When the matter is investigated, the hon. Minister of Health will come back and give clarification or statement on what the findings will be.

 

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QUESTIONS FOR ORAL ANSWER

 

PENDING ELECTRICITY CONNECTIONS IN KALABO

 

183. Mr Miyutu (Kalabo Central) asked the Minister of Energy:

 

1. why some residents who paid ZESCO Limited for electricity connections from as far back as 2018 in Kalabo District, have not had power connected to their premises;
2. how many applications were pending, as of September, 2021;
3. what the cause of the delay in connecting the premises is; and
4. when the premises will be connected.

 

The Minister of Energy (Mr Kapala): Madam Speaker, ZESCO Limited is aware of some of the clients who are not yet connected in Kalabo, and is currently preparing materials and logistics to have them connected. The major factors that impacted on the speed at which ZESCO Limited was able to connect customers include the following:

 

1. limited resources for procurement of connection materials as ZESCO Limited has been subsidising customer connections for years, since connection fees charged per client are not able to procure the full consignment of materials required to complete the connection. Subsidising of connections has resulted in the growth of the connection backlog; and
2. the impact of the outbreak of the Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19) pandemic and the subsequent suspension of work processes related to the connection backlog by ZESCO Limited Corporate Management, which meant that the rate at which pending applications were being processed slowed down considerably.

 

Madam Speaker, as at September, 2021, Kalabo had a backlog of 162 applications. The following as the causes of the delay:

 

1. the impact of the outbreak of the COVID-19 pandemic and the subsequent suspension of work processes related to the connection backlog by ZESCO Limited, Corporate Management, which meant that the rate at which pending applications were being processed slowed down, as I mentioned; and
2. the total cost of materials, labour, transport and all other logistics associated with the connection is above the current connection fee. Therefore, ZESCO Limited has to look for additional resources in order to execute each connection. Given the financial challenges at the electricity company, this situation has resulted in limited resources, and ZESCO Limited has not been able to execute the connections in a timely manner, despite clients paying the connection fee.

 

Madam Speaker, however, I should assure the House that customers whose applications for new connections were pending as at 31^st December, 2021, will be connected by the end of 2022.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Mr Miyutu: Madam Speaker, ZESCO Limited is one of the oldest companies in Zambia. It is almost as old as Zambia. Given the hon. Minister’s response, I do not see any new factor that could have led to the delay. Amongst the factors that the hon. Minister has highlighted other than the Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19), is the subsidies one, which is a long standing position, but ZESCO Limited still used to connect clients. So, I would want to be satisfied. What is the latest reason, other than COVID-19, because even before COVID-19, these clients were not connected? The issue of subsidies cannot be a matter today. What other new factors can the hon. Minister highlight so that those people in Kalabo, who have not been briefed by ZESCO Limited, can know?

 

Hon. Opposition Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Kampyongo: Chinga Miyutu!

 

Laughter

 

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament should not dwell on what happened in the past. The New Dawn Government has assured the House that by the end of this year, all the 60,000 connections that are pending will be dealt with.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr J. Chibuye (Roan): Madam Speaker, in his response, the hon. Minister has cited the lack of resources at ZESCO Limited as one of the areas that has stalled or hampered the connection of these residents. In an event that the connections resume and ZESCO Limited decides to increase the connection fees, will the residents that paid be made to pay the difference of what will be obtaining at that particular time?

 

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, I will get back to the House to confirm whether there will be any additional amounts to be added on top of what was paid, should there be an increase in the tariffs.

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Chibombwe (Bahati): Madam Speaker, I sympathise with the people of Kalabo as ZESCO Limited has been connecting clients since 1930. What assurance is the hon. Minister going to give the people of Kalabo, who paid as far back as 2018, and the people of Bahati, who paid as far back as 2012, but are not yet connected? What assurance is he going to give to these people, especially now that the connection fees have been increased by 1,000 per cent?

 

Madam Speaker: The hon. Minister will restrict himself to Kalabo District.

 

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, I have stated in front of the House that all the 60,000 pending applications for connection will be attended to by the end of this year.

 

I thank you, Madam.

 

Mr Michelo (Bweengwa): Madam Speaker, in his response to the hon. Member of Parliament for Kalabo Central, the hon. Minister did say that the area hon. Member of Parliament should not dwell on the past. Is he not sending a wrong signal to the past wrongdoers by saying that we should not look at what happened in the past?

 

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, I cannot answer for the wrongdoers. That is the duty of the law enforcement agencies to look into those allegations, if there are any. I still stand by my statement to say that all the 60,000 pending applications will be dealt with before the end of 2022.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Mtayachalo (Chama North): Madam Speaker, my question has already been asked by Hon. J. Chibuye.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Madam Speaker: Let us listen to a female voice.

 

 Ms Sefulo (Mwandi): Madam Speaker, thank you very much for giving the people of Mwandi Constituency an opportunity to ask a follow-up question.

 

Madam Speaker, in his submission, the hon. Minister indicated that the reason ZESCO Limited failed to meet the demand and connect people who had paid was that a fee that they had paid was not sufficient to carry out the works that were involved. What was paid for by the customers was sufficient for transport and logistics. The hon. Minister has also indicated that by December, 2022, he will make sure that all the 60,000 clients, whose applications are pending, will be connected. From the past, this has failed because there has not been so much resource to support the connection. With that promise, were will the funds to connect all the pending 60,000 applications for clients going to come from?  Do we see an increase from what was there prior? Why has ZESCO Limited taken so much time to make sure that –

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Mwandi, only one question.

 

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, I have even lost her question. If I may recall, the hon. Member was asking where the hon. Minister will find the resources to cover the 60,000 pending applications. I can sure the hon. Member of Parliament for Mwandi Constituency that money is being mobilised from other areas to complete the connections and concluded the exercise.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Chaatila (Moomba): Madam Speaker, some people in Kalabo have been waiting from as way back as 2018 for electricity to be connected.  

 

Mr Kampyongo: On a point of order, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Chaatila: Madam Speaker, I know that there are some individuals and companies that paid in 2020 and 2021, and electricity connections have been done. What criteria does ZESCO Limited use ensure that everyone receives electricity? 

 

Madam Speaker: Before I call on the hon. Minister to respond, we will go back to the point of order.

 

A point of order is raised.

 

Mr Kampyongo: Madam Speaker, I rise on a very serious point of order. Hon. Ministers are given questions in advance, and the whole idea of this practice is for them to do some research and come back with researched answers in order to give us clear responses.

 

Madam Speaker, is the hon. Minister in order not to respond fully to the questions, from hon. Members, such as the question that one of the hon. Members posed, which sought to know whether people who paid and are waiting for the service from ZESCO Limited, will be made to pay the variance when the increment is made? Seriously, that is a very important question for the people of Zambia, who are waiting for the service they have already paid for.

 

Madam Speaker, is the hon. Minister in order to be responding to us, his hon. Colleagues, who are asking questions on behalf of the citizens out there, in the manner he is responding?

 

Madam Speaker, I seek your serious guidance.

 

Madam Speaker: I heard the hon. Minister say that he does not have that information. He further said that he will go and establish what the facts on the ground are, and then get back to the House. I do not think we expect the hon. Minister to start guessing because he might end up giving a wrong answer. So, I think we can give the hon. Minister an opportunity to go and find out what the correct position is, whether there will be need for people who have already paid to pay more, or to maintain what they paid. Let us allow the hon. Minister to go and do some research since the issue of whether or not, the fees paid will either be increased or not, did not directly arise in the question. However, I am sure the hon. Minister has taken note. Let us make some progress.

 

Hon. Minister of Energy, I hope you still remember the question by the hon. Member of Parliament for Moomba.

 

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, can the hon. Member repeat the question?

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Moomba, please repeat the question.

 

Mr Chaatila: Madam Speaker, my question was premised on the fact that the people of Kalabo paid connection fee as far back as 2018, meanwhile we know that there are some institutions and individuals who paid in 2020 and 2021, and they have been connected. What criteria does ZESCO Limited use to ensure that everyone is connected? Where does the hon. Minister put the issue of equity?

 

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, connections depend on circumstances. It could be that ZESCO Limited evaluated some of the urgent connections that were needed. It could have been a factory or just an ordinary connection, whereby they could only cover a kilometre or 2 km to connect that particular house or institution. We also need to be mindful of the fact that some of the connections that are done could be in the vicinity of a substation. In this case, it is something that only requires them to drop a cable to that particular building and have it connected.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Miyutu: Madam Speaker, can the hon. Minister be very clear. Now that the Government is giving an assurance to the people of Kalabo and the rest of the country that the over 60,000 clients will be connected, could the hon. Minister give an affirmation whether this will not imply a responsible Government?

 

Mr Kapala: Madam Speaker, this House must be comforted in the sense that the hon. Minister of Energy has indicated that all connections will be done this year. I think we should end there and wait for ZESCO Limited to act on all the pending connections.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

CONSTRUCTION OF THE YOUTH RESOURCE CENTRE IN ROAN

 

184. Mr J. Chibuye (Roan) asked the Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts:

 

1. why the construction of the youth resource centre in Roan Parliamentary Constituency has stalled;
2. when the project will resume;
3. what the time frame for the completion of the project is; and
4. whether on completion, the centre will be provided with the following:

 

1. tools; 
2. furniture; and
3. instructors. 

 

The Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry (Mr Mulenga) (on behalf of the Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts (Mr Nkandu)): Madam Speaker, the area Member of Parliament for Roan, may wish to note that the Luanshya Youth Resource Centre located in Roan Constituency is at wall plate level. That means that other than inadequate funding in the recent past, priority has been on other projects that are at 80 per cent and above, in terms of completion rates.

 

Madam Speaker, the Government will resume construction works once there is availability of funds. The initial contract duration for the construction of the Luanshya Youth Resource Centre was fifty-two weeks from the date of commencement on 3^rd October, 2014.

 

Madam Speaker, upon completion, the centre will be provided with all necessary requirements to meet the Technical Education Vocational and Entrepreneurship Training Authority (TEVETA) standards. The centre will also offer the following courses:

 

1. cutting, design and tailoring;
2. general agriculture;
3. food processing;
4. computer studies;
5. bricklaying and plastering; and
6. carpentry and joinery.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Mr J. Chibuye: Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Acting Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts for the answers that he has rendered. Madam Speaker, I still remain worried because Roan Constituency has only one mining entity that captures many youths. As we are talking, many youths are indulging themselves into various negative activities. Could the hon. Minister state specifically as to when these funds will be found. This structure has turned into a ‘white elephant’ and it has now been vandalised, when the Government actually, spent colossal sums of money on that structure. I believe that the structure is over 80 per cent complete. Would his ministry allow the hon. Member of Parliament’s office to source funds from the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) to complete that structure?

Mr Mulenga: Madam Speaker, I need to make it very clear that the project is not at 80 per cent completion level. In my response, I said that we have given priority to projects which were at 80 per cent or more complete. This youth resource centre is at less than 80 per cent completion level. Therefore, priority is being given to projects that were at 80 per cent or more complete so that we can complete them to start regenerating resources that will be used to recapitalise the construction of the youth resource centres. In due time, as resources are found, we will give commitment to that project which was abandoned in 2014, to be completed.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Mung’andu (Chama South): Madam Speaker, clearly, the youths in Roan Constituency like many other constituencies, including Chama District, where the construction of such facilities has stalled are looking up to the Government, to ensure – If anything, the Government promised that it would fix things and the Zambians are aware that these are the things the Government should be fixing. The hon. Minister cannot say, “When funds are available” the way Hon. Chitotela, who is seated on the left used to say it. That is the reason he is on the left today.

 

Laughter

 

Mr Chitotela: What have I done now?

 

Madam Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member for Chama South, please, stop debating other hon. Members who have nothing to do with the question which is about this resource centre. Ask a specific question only in relation to the question that is being considered before this honourable House.

 

Mr Mung’andu: Madam Speaker, I am well-guided. The people of Roan and many other districts like Chama, where such projects have stalled, want to know. The hon. Minister cannot give an open ended answer that, “When funds are available.” He should give us a timeline. Is it within the sitting of this Parliament? Is it within two years or five years? He should give us hope unlike saying, “When funds are available.” When does he think they can fix this problem?

 

Mr Mulenga: Madam Speaker, I am very happy that the hon. Member who has just asked this question is an hon. Member of Parliament for the Patriotic Front (PF). He is requesting me to give a specific time frame, when this youth resource centre will be reconstructed or completed. Like I said earlier, we are committed to sourcing funds for us to complete the construction of this resource centre.

 

Madam Speaker, the PF Government abandoned this project in 2014, which should have been completed in fifty-two months.

 

Hon. UPND Member: The PF!

 

Mr Mulenga: Yes, the PF.

 

Madam Speaker, now, they have forgotten that they started the project and committed that in fifty-two months, they would complete the project but they did not. However, leadership and governance are continuous processes. As a responsible Government, we have said that once that youth resource centre is complete, it will be equipped with the resources we have mentioned and facilities.

 

So, to complete the resource centre, we need to reconstruct the economy. We need to replenish the coffers of this Government. That way, the proceeds of whatever we are doing to reconstruct the economy we be subjected to the completion of his resource centre. So, the hon. Member should be assured that as a committed and responsible New Dawn Government, we will complete the youth resource centre.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Chaatila (Moomba): Madam Speaker, can the hon. Minister indicate the number of facilities generally, which are over 80 per cent complete so that as we are waiting – Can he give us a time frame in which these projects will be completed, whether it is in the next two years’ time, so that we are comfortable that projects, such as the one in Roan will be attended to? Is he able to give us an indication of how the backlog of those projects that are over 80 per cent complete is?

 

Madam Speaker: That question is too general. I am sure it is taking the hon. Acting Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts by surprise. It is asking for more details than what the original question is asking for. So, I would advise the hon. Member for Moomba to engage the substantive hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts to find out if he is still concerned or interested in finding the exact impact of these none completed works.

 

Rev. Katuta (Chienge): Madam Speaker, will the hon. Acting Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts indicate to the people of Roan whether the Government will maintain the same contractor who was engaged or that contract has been cancelled. 

 

Mr Mulenga: Madam Speaker, what is happening is that there were reviews on many contracts that were done in the past. The Ministry of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development is working holistically on how these tenders were done, who should continue and re-engaged. So, in due time, the Ministry of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development will advise.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Shakafuswa (Mandevu): Madam Speaker, I thank you for the opportunity to engage the hon. Minister. Indeed, the hon. Minister has alluded to the fact that the Government is a going concern. In this case, we had a change of Government because some of the projects –

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Mandevu, let us not go there. Just ask your direct question.

Mr Shakafuswa: Madam Speaker, I am most obliged. I note that the hon. Minister has been avoiding giving a time frame as to when funds will be available to complete the project in Luanshya.  Now that he is saying this Government wants to reorganise the economy, could he give a time frame as to when the economy will be reorganised so that funds can be availed to the people of Luanshya to complete that project?

 

Hon. PF Members: Hear, hear!

 

Madam Speaker: Order!

 

In view of the fact that, that question has been asked several times in this House, and it continues to be asked, and the answer remains the same, I think to avoid tedious repetitions, we will move to the next hon. Member to ask a question.

 

Mr Chitotela (Pambashe): Madam Speaker, I pray that I will not be ruled out of order. Basically, I did not want to ask a question but I am compelled to because the hon. Minister opened up when he said that the Government is reconstructing the economy, bearing in mind that, he is responsible for the Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry, which is the centre for economic growth.

 

Madam Speaker, the hon. Acting Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts has rightly stated that the project stalled in 2014. This was not because of the hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts or the hon. Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development, but the Minister of Finance and National Planning, who has not been releasing funds. As hon. Members may be aware, all capital projects sit under the Loans and Investments in the Ministry of Finance and National Planning. When is the Ministry of Youth, Sport and Arts and the Ministry of Commerce, Trade and Industry going to reconstruct the economy so that this project is completed? When will the Ministry of Finance and National Planning going to have enough money to release from the Loans and Investments, for the project in Luanshya to be completed?

 

Madam Speaker: The question is similar to the one that was asked by hon. Member for Mandevu.

 

Laughter

 

Mr E. Tembo (Feira): Madam Speaker, when there was a question posed by the hon. Member for Chama South or is it Chama North, I am not too sure, the hon. Minister said that he was happy because that question came from a Patriotic Front (PF) hon. Member. 

 

Madam Speaker, I need to be guided as to whether in this House, we are PF hon. Members or the United Party for National Development (UNPD) hon. Members. What I have come to understand is that when we are in this House, we are all hon. Members of Parliament and we need answers as Parliamentarians. The people of Roan Constituency are listening. Since the completion of that project will be when the funds will be available, when will the funds be available?

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Roan!

 

Laughter

 

Mr Chibuye (Roan): Madam Speaker, could the hon. Minister be in a position to state how much money was paid to the contractor and if at all, there are any other pending Interim Payment Certificates (IPCs) that are yet to be paid to the contractor.

 

Mr Mulenga: Madam Speaker, I will quickly answer the question that has just been given by the hon. Member for Roan Constituency. The hon. Minister of Youth, Sport and Arts, will come and guide on how much was spent and who was paid. However, I have just received a note and I will read it through.

 

Madam Speaker, the hon. Member may wish to note that the project is only at 70 per cent, which is failing by 10 per cent threshold for continuation. The Luanshya Youth Resource Centre has a contract value of K9.3 million. To this effect, K3.4 million was paid to the contractor. In this regard, the ministry requires a sum of K5.8 million to facilitate completion of the project. The hon. Member may also wish to note that currently, the contractor has demobilised and he is not on site. However, as soon as resources are available, the ministry, working in collaboration with the Ministry of Finance and National Planning, after further consultations with the Office of the Attorney General, and the Ministry of Justice, it will reconsider renewing the contract in order to facilitate completion of the Luanshya Youth Resource Centre.

 

 I thank you, Madam Speaker.     

 

CONSTRUCTION OF SECONDARY SCHOOLS IN MPIKA

 

185. Mr Kapyanga (Mpika) asked the Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development:

 

1. what the progress, in percentage terms, on the construction of the following secondary schools in Mpika District was, as of October, 2021:

            i) Katibunga; and 

             ii) Kampamba

        b. what the cause of the delay in completing the works is; and

 

        c. when the projects will be completed.

 

The Minister of Education (Mr Syakalima) (on behalf of the Minister of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development (Eng. Milupi)): Madam Speaker, the process in percentage terms, on the construction of Katibunga and Kampamba secondary schools, as of October, 2021, was at 80 per cent.

 

Madam Speaker, the cause of the delay in completing the works of the two secondary schools is due to financial constraints. The time frame for the completion of the projects is twelve months subject to availability of funds.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Kapyanga: Madam Speaker, I am aware that there is a Government policy that all projects that at 80 per cent and above, regardless of financial constraints, must be completed. Let me also remind the hon. Minister that he is where he is (right side) because here (left side), we failed to complete those projects, and that is why we are here. When are they going to complete these projects so that our children in Katibunga and Kampamba are accommodated at their beautiful secondary schools? At Katibunga Secondary School, there are a few things that are remaining for it to be completed.

 

Mr Syakalima:  Madam Speaker, although this question has been directed to the Ministry of Infrastructure, Housing and Urban Development, I think it is my baby because there are secondary schools which I have painstakingly been elaborating here. This is part of the construction of 115 schools which have stalled. I hope the hon. Members can see the pain that I am going through.

 

Laughter 

 

Mr Syakalima:  Madam Speaker, the construction of Katibunga Boarding School stalled for nine years. These are the things that make our girl children get pregnant because they rent houses in the compounds. The construction of Kampamba Secondary School has stalled for ten years because it was commenced in 2011. The loss is huge in terms of time. So as I said, the Ministry of Finance and National Planning asked me to compile a list of schools whose works were stalled and we have since done that. What has remained certainly, I can assure the hon. Members, we will not take nine years to complete these school. We shall not take ten years to complete the other school like the previous Government. The lifespan of the previous Government was ten years and it never completed those projects during that period. Ours is five years and I can assure the hon. Member that we will not go beyond that period.

 

Madam Speaker, these stalled projects will have to finish regardless of what angle people look at it. This problem is widespread. In the whole country, we have 116 districts. So, on average, each distract has a stalled structure. Hon. Members, we will do it.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Mung’andu (Chama South): Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Member for his assurance that those two schools, like many other schools in the country, will be completed. However, the people of Zambia voted for the New Dawn Government on the premise ...

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Chama South.

 

Mr Mung’andu: ...that it will fix or finish –

 

Madam Speaker: Order, order!

 

Hon. Member for Chama South, we are not talking about who voted for who under this question. From my recollection, the hon. Member for Chama South, like many other hon. Members, was in this House on Friday, when a similar question was answered and the same follow-up questions were asked. So, hon. Member for Chama South, please, ask a different question and go direct to the question that you want to ask.

 

Mr Mung’andu: Madam Speaker, as politicians, we need to be reminding each other about certain things.

 

Madam Speaker, it is important that our people know the timeline in which projects which are at 80 per cent completion, which the Government has stated, will be completed. When does the hon. Minister think these projects will be completed, considering that the Government promised that it will improve the economy and it is working on that? Can we not have the timeline? I seek clarification on the timeline.

 

Madam Speaker: From what I have heard, that question has been answered.

 

Hon. Member: There is nothing!

 

Madam Speaker: The previous hon. Member of Parliament asked a similar question, otherwise, we will end up repeating the same answers and questions. Let us make some progress, please.

 

Mr Kampyongo (Shiwang’andu): Madam Speaker, we appreciate the responses that the hon. Minister is giving us. Indeed, the reason previous Governments including ours (PF), started putting up that infrastructure, was due to the desire to give to our children access to quality education.

 

Madam Speaker, these schools are at different levels of completion and the hon. Minister has said he has compiled a list. When will he come to share with us the schools he will give priority, in terms of completion? Will that include the two schools namely, Kampamba ...

 

Ms Mulenga: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Kampyongo: ... and Katibunga?

 

Madam Speaker: The hon. Member of Parliament for Shiwang’andu was not in the House on Friday, so the hon. Minister can just maybe, repeat the answers that he gave on Friday.

 

Mr Syakalima: Madam Speaker, the answer was very lengthy. We even went for tea break and came back –

 

Laughter

Madam Speaker: You can summarise, hon. Minister.

 

Mr Syakalima: Madam Speaker, I can just refer the hon. Member to read the verbatim. It is easier that way, rather than having to make me tediously repeat what I said.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Madam Speaker: Anyway, it was an emotional answer. So, as the hon. Minister has said, it is fine so that we do not go through the same emotions. The Hansard is there and the hon. Member can have a look at it. We can arrange with the Clerk’s Office to give you a copy, if that is possible.

 

Mr Kapyanga: Madam Speaker, apparently, some people just come to make empty oral speeches every day regarding development when in the end, we get literally no answers and things like ...

 

Interruptions

 

Mr Kapyanga: ... there are no funds ...

 

Hon. UPND Member: Question!

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member!

 

Mr Kapyanga: ... when people in our Constituencies –

 

Madam Speaker: Order, order!

 

Hon. Member for Mpika, you asked a question and these are supplementary questions which are being asked. It is not a time to lament, comment or complain.

Hon. Government Members: Or cry!

Madam Speaker: Or Cry or do whatever.

 

Laughter

 

Madam Speaker: Let us just ask questions and answers will be given. If you are not satisfied, you are at liberty to follow up with the hon. Minister of Education. You do not have to wait until you come to the House to make a follow up. Otherwise, the people that you represent will not be adequately represented. So, ask your supplementary question, please, without lamentations.

 

Mr Kapyanga: Madam Speaker, I appreciate your wisdom. It is only that in representing the people, we actually represent them even in crime.

 

Mr Chikote: Question!

 

Mr Kapyanga: Madam Speaker, would the hon. Minister kindly visit Mpika so that I take him to the two schools I have mentioned for him to appreciate the challenges that our children are going through in these areas?

 

Mr Syakalima: Madam Speaker, I have travelled the breadth of this country. I was in Mpika, but not particularly, in those places. It is a similar trend everywhere. So, I appreciate what he is talking about because I was there. So, all the answers that I am giving are coming from an informed point of view. It is not just a matter of coming here to read. I even have mental pictures of those places. I have been to Shiwang’andu and elsewhere. He can ask the other hon. Minister.

 

Mr Mutale: Question!

 

Mr Syakalima: So, I know were those structures are and how they have stalled.

 

Hon. Member: And why!

 

Mr Syakalima: And why!

Laughter

 

Mr Syakalima: So, I am only remaining with the Northern, Luapula and the Western provinces. However, he can still extrapolate. In this country, 70 per cent of schools are under that category. So, when I make another round, I will still go back to Mpika. After all, I have been there already. What is happening to the schools we are talking about is everywhere.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Twasa (Kasenengwa): Madam Speaker, I hope my question will not put the hon. Minister through much pain. We usually sympathise with him when he speaks so emotionally. The hon. Minister always talks about the 115 unfinished projects. Does he have plans to start fresh projects, other than just the 115 unfinished projects? I know that other constituencies do not even have unfinished projects. There is nothing at all. At least, we will appreciate, if the Hon. Minister leaves an unfinished project after ten years. We know that the other person will come and appreciate the same pain that the hon. Minister is passing through. Does the hon. Minister have such plans?

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Kasenengwa, that question is not related to Question No. 185. You can put in another question to cover that aspect. Lets us make progress.

 

SINKING OF BOREHOLES IN MILANZI

 

186. Ms Phiri (Milanzi) asked the Minister of Water Development and Sanitation:

 

(a)        how many boreholes were sunk in Milanzi Parliamentary Constituency from 2011 to 2021, year by year;

 

(b)        how many of the boreholes at (a) were functional as of September, 2021;

 

(c)        whether there are any plans to sink additional boreholes in the constituency;

 

(d)        if so, when the plans will be implemented; and

 

(e)        if there are no such plans, why.

 

The Minister of Water Development and Sanitation (Mr Mposha): Madam Speaker, 156 boreholes were sank in Milanzi Parliamentary Constituency of Katete District from 2011 to 2021.

         Year                                         Number of Boreholes

 

         2011                                                    28

         2012                                                    14

         2013                                                    10

         2014                                                    0

         2015                                                    30

         2016                                                    12

         2017                                                    14

         2018                                                    07

         2019                                                    06

         2020                                                    03

         2021                                                    32

         TOTAL                                               156

 

Madam, there were 137 functional boreholes in Milanzi Parliamentary Constituency as of September, 2021. Thirty-one additional boreholes have been planned to be sank in Milanzi Constituency in 2022 by various players and I will explain later. In addition to the thirty-one, we will also drill five boreholes in the same constituency.

 

Madam Speaker, the plans will be implemented in 2022. In view of the above answers, question (e) falls off.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker,

 

Ms Phiri: Madam Speaker, when are the works going to start?

 

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, the hon. Member of Parliament may wish to appreciate that this is not the best season to drill boreholes as we are in the rainy season. As soon as we are out of the rainy season, works should be able to commence.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Michelo (Bweengwa): Madam Speaker, the number of boreholes sank in Milanzi Constituency from 2011 to 2021 under the Patriotic Front (PF) is not pleasing. The PF introduced the borehole levy to the people of Zambia which the New Dawn Government, under the leadership of Hakainde Hichilema, scrapped off –

 

Madam Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member for Bweengwa, please ask a direct question.

 

Mr Michelo: Thank you so much, Hon. Madam Speaker.

 

Madam Speaker, has the borehole levy that was introduced by the PF Government to the people of Milanzi, contributed to the low number of boreholes sank in Milanzi Constituency?

 

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, indeed it is a possibility that the K250 that was being charged for domestic boreholes could have led to the low number of boreholes that were sank in that particular constituency. This is why, as a listening Government, we listened to the people’s cry and we have removed the domestic borehole levy.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr Chala (Chipili): Madam Speaker, does the New Dawn Government have plans to sink boreholes in constituencies in rural areas, like Chipili Parliamentary Constituency in Chipili District?

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Chitambo.

 

Mr Mutale (Chitambo): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister mentioned that various players are going to put up boreholes in Milanzi. Could he kindly tell the nation who these various players are so that we may know them?

 

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I thank my brother, the hon. Member who has raised that very good question. The Government, through my ministry, will be able to contribute five boreholes in that constituency. We will also have our cooperating partners, through the KfW Entwicklungsbank (KfW Development Bank), who will drill five boreholes. Our working partners, the Muslim Association in the Eastern Province have pledged fifteen boreholes. The United Nations Children's Fund (UNICEF) has pledged to sink eight boreholes. We have planned to liaise with the councils and the constituency to use the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) to put up three boreholes.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Menyani Zulu (Nyimba): Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister knows that when it comes to Government projects, Zambia does not have after-service maintenance for our projects. Does the ministry have any plans, as it is sinking these thirty boreholes in Milanzi, to come up with a maintenance team to maintain these boreholes? As the hon. Minister has said, very few boreholes are working. Is the ministry coming up with a maintenance plan so that the next thirty or so, boreholes that will be sunk, are not going to stop working after five or six months?

 

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, before I answer that question, let me just explain that the high number of dysfunctional boreholes is attributed to by many factors, one of which is compromised water quality, which eventually damages the borehole. We also have the effects of climate change, which affects the water table. As such, people will find that within a short time, a borehole will fail to discharge water. Indeed, another factor could be poor maintenance.

 

Madam Speaker, to answer the question as to what we are doing as a ministry, wherever we are drilling these boreholes, we are putting up community committees and empowering them with knowledge on how to maintain these boreholes. In addition, we are also coming up with community shops, where we stock up accessories for these boreholes, so that whenever there is a breakdown, one will have the skill or knowledge on how to service them in these particular communities. This will enable them to access these accessories nearby rather than having to run to Lusaka and other towns to get them. By so doing, the lifespan of these facilities will be prolonged.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Mr Kapyanga: On a point of order, Madam.

 

Madam Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Mr Kapyanga: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister has stated that he has intentions to sink three boreholes in Milanzi using the Constituency Development Fund (CDF). I am perusing the CDF guidelines and I note that the Ward Development Committee (WDC) has to recommend a project to the CDF Committee, which will then recommend it to the hon. Minister for approval.

 

Madam Speaker, is the hon. Minister of Water Development and Sanitation part of the CDF Committee in Milanzi?

 

Laughter

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member of Parliament for Mpika, you are out of order.

 

Laughter

 

Dr Mwanza (Kaumbwe): Madam Speaker, I thank you for allowing the people of Kaumbwe to ask a question on the issue of boreholes in Milanzi. There are only 137 out of 156 boreholes that are functional in Milanzi Constituency. That situation is due to the fact that at the time of undertaking borehole drilling, the cost of geophysical investigation is not normally included in these contracts.

 

Madam Speaker, does the ministry have any plan to include the cost of geophysical investigations in the contract so that the effect of having dry boreholes will not be felt by the beneficiaries? I am asking this question because this is happening everywhere. In Kaumbwe Constituency, when the borehole driller has drilled a borehole and it gets dry within short time, the cost is absorbed by the contractor and yet, the beneficiaries end up suffering. 

 

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, before a borehole is drilled, investigations are carried out. These investigations are estimate indications in terms of where water is likely to be found. No one is underground to ascertain 100 per cent that there is water at a particular place. This is what is leading to the high number of dry boreholes. However, investigations are usually carried out to just get an indicative position in terms of where water will be found. The high number of dysfunctional boreholes comprises of boreholes that were drilled, equipped and worked for some time. They then stopped working due to many factors like the ones I mentioned. Obviously, one of the factors would be that due to effects of climate change, the water table would get disturbed and then, the borehole would stop providing water.  

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Madam Speaker, what is the average cost of during a borehole in Milanzi Constituency.

 

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, I am not in a position to go into figures, in terms of what the cost of sinking boreholes is. This is a free market economy and people charge differently. However, I will engage my brother outside the House to see if we can get figures from the ministry, that is, if it is the ministry that is drilling the boreholes. However, the hon. Member may wish to understand that the players that I talked about have their own arrangements in terms of who they hire to drill their boreholes. So, because of that, I may not be in a position to state how much it would cost to sink a borehole in Milanzi.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Mr J. Daka (Chadiza): Madam Speaker, our rural women are the most burdened in our societies. The technology behind most of the water supply from boreholes is very manual. Is the ministry in a position to upgrade the mechanism through which water is supplied in the rural communities?

 

Mr Mposha: Madam Speaker, indeed, we are alive to the fact that to fetch water from a borehole, mostly, the women and the young girls who go to these facilities have to struggle to pump out the water. We are doing everything possible and resources allowing, we should be able to have the water reticulation system as opposed to the hand pump dependent boreholes. However, the hon. Member must understand that it is more costly to have the water reticulation system that is powered by solar than drilling a borehole and putting a hand pump. However, in the long term, we want to migrate from hand pump dependant boreholes to the ones that will use solar. We are working around that.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you. 

 

SENSITISATION OF ZAMBIAN WORKERS ON THEIR RIGHTS

 

187. Mr Mulebwa (Kafulafuta) asked the Minister of Labour and Social Security:

 

1. what measures the Government has taken to sensitise Zambian workers, especially in the private sector, on their rights under the Employment Code, Act No. 3 of 2019; and
2. whether the measures are yielding the desired results.

 

The Minister of Labour and Social Security (Ms Tambatamba): Madam Speaker, I beg to present a Bill entitled the Zambia Institute of Human Resource Management –

 

Madam Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Minister, we are still on questions.

 

Laughter

 

Ms Tambatamba: Could the question be repeated.

 

Madam Speaker: It is Question No. 187.

 

Ms Tambatamba: May I be given a moment to enquire.

Ms Mulenga interjected.

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Kampamba Mulenga, you want to be the hon. Minister of Labour and Social Security?

 

Laughter

 

Ms Tambatamba: Thank you very much for that moment, Madam Speaker. Sometimes we need to have such hilarious moments.

 

Madam Speaker, the Government through the Department of Labour, undertakes labour inspections during which employees in the private sector are sensitised on their rights under the Employment Code Act, No. 3 of 2019, as well as the Industrial and Labour Relations Act, Cap. 269 of the Laws of Zambia.

 

Madam Speaker, in addition, officers in the department appear regularly on various media channels, including radio, television (TV) and media interviews to articulate the rights of employees as enshrined in the law. This is coupled with sensitisation during workshops organised in collaboration with the employers and trade unions.

 

Madam Speaker, I am happy to report that the measures that the Government has put in place are effective, and therefore, are yielding the desired results following the feedback we are receiving from the industry. There is, however, room for more engagement, especially with the workers and the general public at large, using our media outreach platform.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Mulebwa: Madam Speaker, kindly allow me to give a bit of a background under twenty seconds. We have some people in Zambia who have worked for six to ten years as casual labourers when the law actually states that, anybody who works above two years should be a confirmed employee, and therefore, enjoy the rights of protection in their employment.

Madam Speaker, what measures has the Government put in place to ensure that those who  would like to stand up for their rights in places of work are not eventually victimised, so that even after standing for their rights, they will not lose their employment?

 

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, as the hon. Member would appreciate, the Government does not work in isolation to manage that industrial space that is very important to our economy and lives of our people. We operate and make decisions, a lot of them, within the social dialogue, or in partnership with our tripartite partners. So the employee and employer’s representatives are involved through the tripartite council that we hold on a quarterly basis. So, we are continuously reviewing through looking at processes and procedures, and also, correcting laws and putting policies in place, to ensure that the workers’ rights are protected.

 

Madam Speaker, in the first place, the unions are the first layer. The employee’s representative is the first point of call, if I may put it that way. If that does not work, we have the whole process and different layers within the Government procedures which processes grievances and makes sure that we are on the spot to ensure that the law is abided to by the employer.

 

Madam, some more long term measures are being contemplated and are being put in place to ensure that we seal all the loopholes. We want to ensure that we are adhering to not only the Zambian law, but also, to the international standards.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr J. Chibuye (Roan): Madam Speaker, Kafulafuta Constituency is a recipient of quite a number of investors in our country, especially in the mineral industry. Could the hon. Minister be in a position to state as to whether the ministry does receive complaints from the labour force, especially Zambians, on the many labour laws that are being flouted by our investors. Could she also state as to whether her ministry is well-staffed, starting from the provincial to district levels, in terms of personnel and equipment.

 

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, I am very thankful for that very important question. I am sure the hon. Member would recall that in some of the statements that we made on the Floor of the House, especially during the ministerial statements after passing the Budget, that is one of the things that we have belaboured. We have stated that the ministry, in its current form, is not well resourced. I think it is a historical factor that we have to deal with. If the hon. Member looks at the records of the ministry, which I am sure many people have had access to, it is one of the most underfunded, and yet it carries the backbone of the economy.

 

Secondly, in terms of personnel, out of 116 districts that we have in Zambia, only fifty-four have got a labour office. We know that from time immemorial, we have our peer ministries that are well resourced in terms of human resource and in every district, they are represented. So this ministry is actively working and focusing on this for the coming times. We will have to make sure that we begin to fill up the gaps even in the situation where we have got challenges financially as a nation.

 

Madam Speaker, in short, there is enough room for improvement. My team and I are doing everything possible to look at ways and means to ensure that we are responsive, 24/7 to our people. So my staff is making efforts time and again to respond to the issues that our people are bringing through.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Mutinta (Itezhi-tezhi): Madam Speaker, having heard that the hon. Minister is thinking of putting long term measures to ensure that the labour management crisis is managed, I also want to mention that my constituency office has been turned into a labour office. I wish to also state that most of the grievances are handled by the District Commissioners (DCs) and sometimes, the Council Secretaries (CSs). Before the ministry deploys officers to other districts where there are no officers, are there any short term measures to give the DCs and CSs basic orientation so that they can be able to manage this crisis which is slowly getting to the offices of the hon. Members of Parliament?

 

Ms Tambatamba: Madam Speaker, I can reiterate that my ministry has taken the importance of working in a multi-sectoral approach very seriously. As the New Dawn Government, we are making use of the available resources that are on the ground. Recently, I was in Kazungula, where I was told that they do not have a labour officer. The office of the District Commissioner (DC) is the one that is dealing with matters related to labour. So, that is the measure that is in place. We would like that same measure, as it has been taken too seriously in Kazungula, to be replicated in the interim, in other places where we do not have labour officers. Indeed, we are again looking at possibilities with our social partners, of how we can organise trainings so that we give orientation programmes to those who are working with us in the short term.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

EXTENSION OF RADIO SIGNAL FOR THE ZNBC TO LUANGWA DISTRICT

 

188. Mr E. Tembo (Feira) asked the Minister of Information and Media:

 

1. whether the Government has any plans to extend the radio signal for the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation to Luangwa District; and
2. if so, when the plans will be implemented.

 

The Minister of Information and Media (Ms Kasanda): Madam Speaker, the Ministry of Information and Media has plans to extend the digital frequency for both radio and television (TV) signals to reach out to all the remote parts of Zambia, and not only Luangwa District, through the Digital Migration Project, Phases II and III, and the rural Frequency Modulation (FM) project, respectively.

 

Madam Speaker, the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) installed Radios 1 and 2 transmitters at Luangwa (Feira) in 2015. The coverage radius for the transmitters is about 30 km instead of 70 km, due to the mountainous terrain of the district. The transmitters’ installation site was carefully chosen to carter for the mostly densely populated area of the district. Therefore, the entire commercial and business centre of Luangwa is catered for. However, there are certain areas within the district that are not covered because of the mountainous features of the region.

 

Further, the ministry remains committed and determined to achieve its role of promoting effective dissemination of news and information, interpretation and publicity of the Government policies, projects and programmes, as well as facilitation of the development of the media sector for a well informed citizenry and sustainable national development.

 

Madam Speaker, immediately funds for the rural FM projects are made available, the signal programme will be completed. However, the FM expansion project which commenced in 2011, was planned to cover fifty districts that included Luangwa District. So far, 35 FM sites under the rural FM have been completed.

 

Madam Speaker, in order to install the remaining fifteen sites of which ZNBC has transmitters, an estimated K7.2 million would be required. The House may wish to note that the following are the fifteen sites that are remaining: Sinazongwe, Chirundu, Kalomo, Sinazeze, Maamba, Lukulu, Mwandi, Senga Hill, Chienge, Isoka, Mporokoso, Kaputa, Samfya, Nyimba and St Carnicius.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Mung’andu (Chama South): Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for that comprehensive response. The Zambia National Broadcasting (ZNBC) Radios 1 and 2 transmissions are a serious problem especially along the Luangwa Valley and Feira. From the sites that the hon. Minister has mentioned, I have not heard anything to do with Chama, where we have a serious transmission problem. In Chama, people listen to programmes that are transmitted from Malawi instead of Zambia. Is the ministry considering receiving submissions from hon. Members of Parliament that will be forwarded to the technical staff at the ZNBC, to ensure that the entire country is knows what the Government is doing?

 

Ms Kasanda: Madam Speaker, we are installing these transmitters and frequencies in stages. The hon. Member is more than welcome to bring his submission to my office.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr E. Tembo: Madam Speaker, I want to thank the hon. Minister for a very elaborate answer and I am quite satisfied. However, I just want to find out a few things.

 

Madam Speaker, in Feira Parliamentary Constituency, we listen to the Mozambique Radio which is normally transmitted in Portuguese. Due to this, the whole district has been cut off from the information system of Zambia. It is very paramount that we have radio reception as soon as possible. So, when are the funds going to be available in order for the programme to continue?

 

Ms Kasanda: Madam Speaker, I am aware that the people of Luangwa listen to Mozambique Radio and that is a shame for us as Zambians. We had the Patriotic Front (PF) Government which should have sorted out that problem ...

 

Hon. UPND: Members: Hear, hear!

 

Ms Kasanda: ... but unfortunately, because it did not do anything, that is why the people of Zambia voted for the United Party for National Development (UPND) to come and fix that situation.

 

Mr Sing’ombe: Hear, hear!

 

Ms Kasanda: Madam Speaker, I want to assure the hon. Member that as the New Dawn Government, will definitely resolve that issue once the funds are available. I will engage my counterpart, the Minister of Finance and National Planning and see if we can bring in a Supplementary Budget.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

Madam Speaker: Order!

 

Business was suspended from 1640 hours until 1700 hours 

 

 

 

 

 [MADAM SPEAKER in the Chair]

 

Mr Menyani Zulu (Nyimba): Madam Speaker, being a victim of the poor Frequency Modulation (FM) signal in Luangwa River, I want to know if the ministry has any plans as it is installing transmitters in the mountainous areas of Zambia, to put up more set up transmitters to enhance radio signal in that areas. The hon. Minister may agree with me that the FM signal is very weak as compared to the analogue system. Does the ministry got any plans to come up with quality transmitters for FM signal like in Mozambique, Malawi and Tanzania, so that the quality of the Zambia National Broadcasting Corporation (ZNBC) radio transmission in Feira, and the entire Luangwa Valley is better? Does the ministry got any immediate plans to support the antennas and machines by buying more transmitters to boost the FM signals along the valley? The hon. Minister and I know that the FM signal is very weak in mountainous areas.

 

Ms Kasanda: Madam Speaker, the ministry has plans to do that but like I mentioned earlier, we are looking at the terrain we have in different constituencies. My team will have to do a study and once it is done, we will definitely get back to the hon. Member.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

PROCUREMENT OF FIRE TENDERS BY THE GOVERNMENT

 

189. Mr Amutike (Mongu) (on behalf of Mr Kamondo (Mufumbwe)) asked the Minister of Local Government and Rural Development:

 

1. how many fire tenders the Government procured, countrywide, between January, 2015 and August, 2021, year by year;
2. what the cost of the fire tenders was, year by year;
3. how the fire tenders were distributed;
4. how much the fire tenders were insured at, year by year; and
5. how many fire tenders were operational, as of December, 2021.

 

The Minister of Local Government and Rural Development (Mr Nkombo): Madam Speaker, only forty-two fire tenders were procured between 2015 and 2021 and this was 2017.

 

Madam Speaker, the total cost of fire tenders was US$42 million with each one of them costing US$1 million.

 

Hon. UPND Members: Ah!

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam Speaker, the distribution of the fire tenders was as follows:

 

Place                                                   No. of Fire Tenders

 

Lusaka                                                             4

Kabwe                                                             1

Fire School                                                      1

Chibombo                                                       1

Kapiri Mposhi                                                 1

Mkushi                                                            1

Serenje                                                            1

Mpika                                                              1

Chinsali                                                           1

Mansa                                                              1

Kasama                                                           1

Mbala                                                              1

Mpulungu                                                        1

Chongwe                                                         1

Luangwa                                                         1

Petauke                                                           1

Katete                                                             1

Chipata                                                            1

Lundazi                                                           1

Ndola                                                              1

Luanshya                                                         1

Kitwe                                                              1

Mufulira                                                          1

Kalulushi                                                         1

Chingola                                                          1

Chingola                                                          1

Solwezi                                                           1

Chililabombwe                                                1

Kafue                                                              1

Chirundu                                                         1

Siavonga                                                         1

Mazabuka                                                        1

Monze                                                             1

Choma                                                             1

Livingstone                                                     1

Kazungula                                                       1

Mongu                                                             1

Mumbwa                                                         1

Nakonde                                                         1

Namwala                                                         1

 

Madam Speaker, the fire tenders were insured at K230 000 each which represents 2.3 per cent of the premium of the value of the fire tender.

 

Madam Speaker, as at end of December, 2021, thirty-five fire tenders were operational.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Mr Amutike: Madam Speaker, I want to convey a message from the people of Mongu Central to the hon. Minister of Local Government and Rural Development. Due to the numerous scandals including that of the fire tenders, the people of Mongu are asking the hon. Minister to help the Patriotic Front (PF) party to liquidate itself so that it can form a co-operative …

 

Madam Speaker: Order, Hon. Member!

 

Mr Amutike: … and apply for the Constituency Development Fund (CDF) and –

 

Madam Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. PF Members: Question!

 

Laughter

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Mongu Central, you are out of order.

 

Mr J. Chibuye (Roan): Madam Speaker, I thank the hon. Minister for his cool and well elaborated answers. Towards the end of his statement, the hon. Minister mentioned that thirty-five of these fire tenders are operational. Looking at the colossal sum of US$1 million that was spent on each fire tender, what is the problem with the rest of the fire tenders that are not operational? Could the hon. Minister also state how many have been involved in road traffic accidents (RTAs) as of today?

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam Speaker, I would like to thank my colleague and friend, hon. Member of Parliament for Roan for that question. I regret to inform him that I may have lapsed to make an anticipation of that question because it requires me to give absolute figures. However, if given time, within the next course of, maybe tomorrow, I can give the hon. Member exactly what happened to the seven fire tenders, suffice it to mention that the majority of the same, were involved in road traffic accidents (RTAs). I can furnish him with accurate details tomorrow.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Sing’ombe (Dundumwezi): Madam Speaker, I know that some of these fire tenders were involved in road traffic accidents (RTAs). May I know whether the ministry is making any effort to ensure that the insurance companies replace the fire tenders which probably, were written-off as a result of accidents?

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam Speaker, fortunately, I do have an answer for two of the fire tenders which are being compensated by the Zambia State Insurance Corporation Limited (ZISC). The corporation is indemnifying the ministry because the claim was successful. For the two fire tenders, they met the benchmark for qualifying for indemnification.

 

Madam Speaker, in regard to the other five, I beg that the hon. Member allows me to come back and give the exact circumstance surrounding those two fire tenders tomorrow.

 

 I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Michelo (Bweengwa): Madam Speaker, as a Zambian citizen, I feel that the price of the fire tenders was too exorbitant, and many people of Zambia have complained about it. The people of Bweengwa would like to know if  the ministry or the United Party for National Development (UPND) Government, will continue investigating the matter where the price of a fire tender, which was suppose to be US$300,000 was increased to US$1 million. Is the Government quiet on this issue or it is still pursuing it so that the taxpayers money can be paid back to the citizens of this country?

Mr Amutike: On a point of order, Madam Speaker.

 

Madam Speaker: A point of order is raised.

 

Mr Amutike: Madam Speaker, I seeking clarification on fire tenders. I am struggling to understand what fire tenders are. Are we talking about fire engines or fire tenders? What are fire tenders?

 

Laughter

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Mongu Central, the question is referring to fire tenders. You can Google and see what it means.

 

Laughter

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam Speaker, in answering the question asked by the hon. Member for Bweengwa Constituency, who wishes to know whether the United Party for National Development (UPND) Government intends to investigate the procurement of the those forty-two fire tenders, I wish to state that, I am very much aware that some sort of investigation occurred, on the procurement of these fire tenders, whose details of conclusion, I do not have. However, if the hon. Member is interested, I could, without any sweat, ask the Anti-Corruption Commission (ACC) to give us the exact statement on the status of his question.

 

 I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Malambo (Magoye): Madam Speaker, the issue of fire tenders that we are discussing now was a very controversial one when we were almost having the 2021 General Elections.  Has the Government taken keen interest to verify if those prices were correct? I note that the fire tenders seemed to be cheaper than the price they were bought at. 

 

Madam Speaker: The question is similar to the one which was asked by the hon. Member for Roan Constituency, but the hon. Minister can attempt to answer.

 

Mr Nkombo: Madam Speaker, I will answer gladly. I am aware that the procurement of those fire tenders went through the Zambia Public Procurement Authority (ZPPA) process, whose details I do not have right on my finger tips. However, if it is the desire of the hon. Member to know, that is the information we can beckon and call at any time.

 

Madam Speaker, if the House so desires, I can go to the ZPPA to check, whether the processes were followed. I can also go the ACC, like I proceeded, whether their investigation has reviewed anything that one can call anomalous, or if the matter is still ongoing. That information can be obtained and given to the House, and through the House, to the public.

 

 I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Madam Speaker: From the answers the hon. Minister has giving, it seems there is need for a ministerial statement on the matter. So, the hon. Minister can come back to the House with a ministerial statement to shed more light on those issues.

 

Mr Wamunyima (Nalolo): Madam Speaker, since there will be a ministerial statement, the people of Nalolo will ask the hon. Minister when he makes the ministerial statement.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Madam Speaker: In view of that fact actually then we can make progress. We go to next item. The other questions can be asked when the ministerial statement is made. 

 

_______

 

BILLS

 

FIRST READING

 

THE EMOLUMENTS COMMISSION BILL, 2022

 

The Vice-President (Mrs Nalumango): Madam Speaker, I beg to present a Bill entitled the Emoluments Commission Bill, of 2022. The objects of this Bill are to:

 

1. provide for the membership, functions, operations and financial management of the Emoluments Commission;
2. provide for a harmonised framework to govern the determination and management of emoluments for chiefs and officers in a State organ and State institution;
3. enhance the capacity of a State organ and State institution to attract, retain and motivate officers and staff with requisite qualifications, skills and experience in order to improve service delivery; and
4. provide for matters connected with, or incidental to, the foregoing.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Ms Mulenga interjected.

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Kalulushi, can we have some order in that corner.

 

The Bill stands referred to the Committee on Cabinet Affairs. The Committee is required to submit its report on the Bill to the House by Thursday, 24^th March, 2022. Hon. Members who wish to make submissions on the Bill, are free to do so within the programme of work of the Committee.

 

THE ZAMBIA INSTITUTE OF MARKETING, 2022

 

The Minister of Commerce, Trade and Industry (Mr Mulenga): Madam Speaker, I beg to present a Bill entitled the Zambia Institute of Marketing Bill, 2022. The objects of this Bill are to:

 

1. continue the existence of the Zambia Institute of Marketing and redefine its powers and functions;
2. promote and enhance the marketing profession;
3. provide for the registration of marketers and regulate their practice and professional conduct;
4. repeal and replace the Zambia Institute of Marketing Act, 2003; and
5. provide for matters connected with, or incidental to, the foregoing.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Madam Speaker: The Bill stands referred to the Committee on National Economy, Trade and labour Matters. The Committee is required to submit its report on the Bill to the House by Thursday, 24^th March, 2022. Hon. Members who wish to make submissions on the Bill, are free to do so within the programme of work of the Committee.

 

THE ZAMBIA INSTITUTE OF HUMAN RESOURCE MANAGEMENT, 2022

 

The Minister of Labour and Social Security (Ms Tambatamba): Madam Speaker, I beg to present a Bill entitled the Zambia Institute of Human Resource Management Bill, 2022. The objects of this Bill are to:

 

1. continue the existence of the Zambia Institute of Human Resources Management, rename it as the Zambia Institute of Human Resource Management and redefine its functions;
2. promote and enhance the human resource management profession;
3. provide for the registration of human resource management practitioners and regulate their practice and professional conduct;
4. repeal and replace the Zambia Institute of Human Resources Management Act,1997; and
5. provide for matters connected with, or incidental to, the foregoing.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Madam Speaker: The Bill stands referred to the Committee on National Economy, Trade and labour Matters. The Committee is required to submit its report on the Bill to the House by Thursday, 24^th March, 2022. Hon. Members who wish to make submissions on the Bill, are free to do so within the programme of work of the Committee.

 

THE SOCIAL WORKERS’ ASSOCIATION OF ZAMBIA, 2022

 

The Minister of Community Development and Social Services (Ms Mwamba): Madam Speaker, I beg to present a Bill entitled the Social Workers’ Association of Zambia Bill, 2022. The objects of this Bill are to:

 

1. establish the Social Workers’ Association of Zambia;
2. provide for the registration of social work practitioners and regulate their professional conduct; and
3. provide for matters connected with, or incidental to, the foregoing.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Madam Speaker: The Bill stands referred to the Committee on Health, Community Development and Social Services. The Committee is required to submit its report on the Bill to the House by Thursday, 24^th March, 2022. Hon. Members who wish to make submissions on the Bill, are free to do so within the programme of work of the Committee.

 

­­­­­­­_______

 

MEASURES TO IMPROVE TEACHER-PUPIL RATIO IN ALL SCHOOLS IN CHAMA NORTH CONSTITUENCY

 

(Debate resumed)

 

Mr Emanuel Jay Banda (Petauke): Madam Speaker, before business was suspended last Friday, I was saying that Chama North has twenty-seven community schools. In these community schools, teachers were paid from the Parent-Teacher Association (PTA) fund. Even though there is free education, these teachers are supposed to be paid from the grant. According to the people of Chama, in these twenty-seven community schools, the minimum number of teachers that is needed per school is five. The good New Dawn Government increased the minimum wage to K1,800. So, if we multiply twenty-seven by five, it gives us 135. If we multiply 135 teachers by K1,800, it gives us K12.4 billion. All the schools in Chama have not received this grant. When is the Government going to employ teachers? How many will specifically be deployed to Chama since we were told that 30,000 teachers will be employed.

 

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister already tackled the question of when teachers would be recruited in this House. He said that they were working on modalities to look into that issue.  The Teaching Service Commission (TSC) has said that it is going to recruit from the point and that, it is now doing assessments to know exactly how many teachers are needed in each district, as the hon. Member is saying. The commission will follow that and teachers will be allocated according to the numbers.

 

Madam, from the 30,000 teachers, we may actually not be able to fill all the positions, but this is the commitment of the Government.

 

Ms Mulenga: Ah!

 

The Vice-President: Oh yes! We will recruit 30,000 teachers, but I think we will remain with a big gap of teachers who are needed, in places like Chama. That means that when we employ these teachers, we will still have gaps. That is what we have planned as the Government. However, we are aware that there are about 55,000 trained teachers roaming the streets. Therefore, this issue becomes a continuous matter for the next Budgets. The Government will do its best to ensure that Chama also gets a portion. Whether it will do it pro rata, our areas in the country will get portions of teachers that they need. We will not only say, “Let there be schools”. No! That is a foregone matter. We have to plan, but we must first find a solution to what is happening on the ground.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Hon. Government Members: Hear, hear!

 

Mr B. Mpundu (Nkana): Madam Speaker, there seems to be a Government policy that, once the population of students at a particular community school reaches a certain level, that school needs to be converted to a Government school.  What is the status quo of these particular schools in Chama, in regards to the pupil population? Can we then, agree whether they do not qualify for that conversion from being community schools to Government schools, so that they can benefit from the incentives that the Government provides for Government schools?

 

Madam Speaker: I was just checking the question. The question relates to measures that are being taken by the Government to improve the teacher/pupil ratio at all schools in Chama North Parliamentary Constituency. So, the question is about the teacher/pupil ratio in Chama.

 

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I would have said that that question is unrelated because he is asking about community schools. However, allow me to just use this minute to tell hon. Members not to be bringing tedious repetitions to the House.

 

Madam Speaker, the hon. Minister had already stated the criteria that is used to decide whether a school qualifies to become a Government school or it remains a community school. The qualification of what should be done was given in this House. The hon. Minister also talked about the issue of the land where the school is situated, if that school has the right to that land and also, how many pupils will be catered for. The number was given in this House. If I am able to remember, then, hon. Members should also remember. However, this question is about the pupil-teacher ratio.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Munir Zulu (Lumezi): Madam Speaker, I thank you for giving the good people of Lumezi a chance to pose a question to the hon. Minister of Education, through Her Honour the Vice-President. The question that originates from Chama presents an opportunity to all of us who are faced with similar challenges. I must mention that we have been receiving positive answers from the Executive Arm of Government, which I commend it for. However, the people of Lumezi are having difficulties to consume which statement to take. What –

 

Madam Speaker: Order!

 

Hon. Member for Lumezi, please ask your question.

 

Laughter

 

Mr Munir Zulu: Thank you, Madam Speaker, for your guidance. I was trying to build a better question so we are given a definite answer.

 

Hon. Government Member: Jet Li!

 

Laughter

 

Mr Munir Zulu: Madam Speaker, we have had difficulties understanding the issue of the pupil-teacher ratio in the sense that the Permanent Secretary (PS) always says that the Government is recruiting. When one asks the Government when that recruitment will be done and a definite answer is not given, what message should we tell the people out there, in Chama and Mwinilunga, with regard to the reduction in the teacher-pupil ratio? I am saying so because what we have been consistent with is the procrastination of answers.

 

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, recruitment is not an event, but a process. That means the process has already begun. This is why people have heard from the TSC that it has already laid ground as to what should happen, including identifying how many teachers are needed in Chama, as opposed to other areas because they have to look at the entire country and see where to take who.

 

Madam Speaker, when it comes to recruitment, I cannot say, “They will be there on 1^st May.” I do not think governance is known in that way. This is something that will be done and we are sure that it will definitely end, I believe, by May. I am using the phrase, “I believe” which I should not use. I should say what is happening and the process has begun.

 

Madam Speaker, let me withdraw the phrase, “I believe” because it is not what I mean. I should say that the process has begun. We must all try to push and ensure that our colleagues who are going through this process can do it quickly because we are all anxious to see teachers recruited. 

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Ms Mabonga (Mfuwe): Madam Speaker, we have talked about teacher recruitment, but the people of Chama are asking when the legally recruited teachers will be put on the payroll. There were some teachers who were recruited, but they have not been put on the payroll.

 

Madam Speaker: From the issue of the ratio, we are now going to the payroll.

 

Laughter

 

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, again, I think it would be helpful if hon. Members listened extremely careful in this House. I can actually refuse to answer because this is a different question, but it has an implication of the teacher-pupil ratio, and that is why I am even answering.

 

Madam, the hon. Minister said the ministry would start with the teachers who were legally recruited but are not on the payroll because they will definitely, be counted as part of the 30,000 teachers. That is how the Treasury will handle that.

 

I thank you, Madam Speaker.

 

Mr Nyambose (Chasefu): Madam Speaker, what guarantee is the Government giving to ensure that teachers who will be recruited will be to fill up the gaps in Chama North Constituency and other rural parts of country? In the past, we have had a situation where more teachers were recruited and deployed to certain regions only. Chasefu has suffered just as Chama North. What measures has the Government put to ensure that the rural parts of this country, including Chasefu, get a better share?

 

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, again, the hon. Member wants to ride on Chama by bringing in Chasefu. The responses are very clear. I said that we are looking at this issue district by district.

 

Interruptions

 

The Vice-President: Yes! These teachers will be recruited from the centres. So, each district will get a potion and I thought I said that, and that includes Chasefu, Chama, Kaputa and Shangombo. All these areas will get a share of the 30,000 teachers, and that will include those who are working but are not yet payroll because there will be no other money allocated. All of them will be regarded as people who have a right to become teachers.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Mr Menyani Zulu (Nyimba): Madam Speaker, I appreciate Her Honour the Vice-President’s beautiful answer that the Government will allocate a certain number of teachers to be recruited at the district level. That is very good.

 

Madam Speaker, I know she will understand my point because she has been to rural areas.  Does she know that a number of community schools were sponsored by the Parent-Teacher Association (PTA) fund which was scrapped off by the Government? Does she also understand that the teacher-pupil ratio in these schools was covered by teachers from the community? Now that parents are no longer contributing to the PTA, teachers will not be able to get their salaries, and they will stop teaching our children. What plans does the Government have for those teachers? The number of teachers who have withdrawn their service has gone up. Since I am a victim, I have taken up the responsibility of paying those teachers and it is hurting me. What plans does the Government have for the community schools in Chama, which were sponsored by the PTA fees?

 

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I will need to go back to the statement that was issued by the Government. I thought when the Government spoke of the withdrawing or stopping of the Parent-Teacher Association (PTA) – In fact, we have been using the term, “Tuition” or “User fees.” This was directed to Government schools. I am sure tomorrow I will hear private schools saying they have withdrawn. I hope that it is clear that this statement is for Government schools.

 

Madam Speaker, I am sure that is why the first question I answered in this House was, “What are you going to do with community schools, to turn them into Government schools, so that they can also become beneficiaries of what is going on?” So, I hope we are not confusing people on the ground that the Government has taken over community schools. The Government has not banned community schools, unless, I have a mix-up here, which I can come to clarify but this is what I understand.

 

Madam Speaker, whatever we are doing for now is for Government schools. We may have to move in later. So, if one has stopped contributing to whatever he calls, “PTA”, I think it is his or her initiative and he or she may have to be the one who has taken over. I think we have to be clear on where we are and where that is working.

 

Madam Speaker, this is not The Vice-President’s Question Time and I think I have spoken enough.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Laughter

 

Madam Speaker: I am sure the hon. Members missed that last Friday. We still have some time.

 

Mr Mtayachalo (Chama North): Madam Speaker, I just want to inform the Government that currently, we have a shortfall of 261 teachers in Chama North Constituency. Our appeal is that as the Government is employing, priority must be given to the people of Chama, who are indigenous, to avoid the rural-urban drift.

 

Mr Mung’andu (Chama South): Madam Speaker, I thank Her Honour the Vice-President for her good responses. The Government just announced a policy that spouses in the civil service will not be allowed to be working away from each other and most of them are teachers.  In Chama, the situation is quite bad. We have one teacher handling Grades 1 to 9. Most of the time, pupils just sit in their classes with no lessons and yet, they are expected to compete with the rest of their colleagues in the country.

 

Madam Speaker, how is the Government going to handle the possible situation where teachers are sent to the areas and on grounds of marital status, they move back into the cities? Currently, on the payroll, most of these positions are filled up, but if we go to those stations, we will not find teachers in those stations. How does the Government intend to go about this problem so that our pupils, not only in Chama but the entire country, in rural areas are able to receive quality education by reducing the pupil-teacher ratio?

 

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, I understand the issue of people drifting back to town rather than being in rural areas. There are a number of things that I can say here. The Government will send teachers to Chama and it will provide a clear policy. I do not want to start making policies on the Floor. We will need to have a consensus with people of Zambia. Definitely, if people get recruited in Chama, they must have a commitment to Chama. This is one of the reasons we are taking it to the centre. However, I will not give a full policy direction on what happens when teachers are recruited elsewhere and then they do not go because it brings distortion, I understand. I am sure the Government, one of these days, as it recruits, will come out clearly on that issue and tell us what it is going to do to handle such a situation.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.   

 

Mr Mabeta (Kankoyo): Madam Speaker, Her Honour the Vice-President must know that we are not bothering her. We missed her on Friday and we really had questions for her.

 

Madam Speaker, coming to the point of the pupil-teacher ratio, which is due to the low number of teachers, as she has explained, the Government has already put in place 30,000 teachers to start tackling that issue. What has been the challenge with the Government – We already have over 1,500 teachers who are recruited on replacements and they already have their appointment letters. Why is it taking the Government too long to put them on the payroll, so that they can start reducing the teacher-pupil ratio?

 

The Vice-President: Madam Speaker, that issue is extremely specific. I would not be able to give a very clear answer because personally, I came in contact with one teacher, who said she had not been put on the payroll. There is a lot happening on the ground and it is may be case by case. In this particular case, the person was sent to Mpatamatu, in Luanshya or something like that, but she never reported. She chose to teach somewhere in Lusaka – I have forgotten the name of the school. So, how does one want to be put on the payroll when she is somewhere else? So, some of these issues will be handled case by case. I cannot give, therefore, one full answer for the different scenarios as to why 1,500 teachers, are not yet put on the payroll. However, what I said was that if it is a matter of resources, these will be counted as we recruit the 30,000 new teachers.

 

Madam Speaker, I thank you.

 

Dr Mwanza (Kaumbwe): Madam Speaker, I seek clarification from the hon. Minister of Education through Her Honour the Vice-President. In Chama North, just like in Kaumbwe, many community schools have had volunteer teachers as well as trained teachers, who have been benefiting through the Parent Teacher Association (PTA) funding. Now that the Ministry of Education is considering closing the gap on the deficit of teachers by employing 30,000 more teachers, I can understand the matrix that it has to solve, since we have 55,000 trained teachers who are not employed. Is the Government going to consider putting those volunteer teachers who have been teaching in community schools on the Government payroll?

 

Madam Speaker: Hon. Member for Kaumbwe, I believe that question has been answered several times in so many ways. I suggest you go and see the hon. Minister of Education to just find out what the actual position is, if you are not yet clear on the answer. We have opened this question too much. I think we can close it.

 

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MOTION

 

ADJOURNMENT

 

The Vice-President (Mrs Nalumango): Madam Speaker, I beg to move that the House do now adjourn.

 

Question put and agreed to.

 

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The House adjourned at 1754 hours until 1430 hours on Wednesday, 23^rd February, 2022.

 

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